WWWedge Ezine
It's here to help you
Current readers: 187 May 15th 1998, Year 1, no. 6
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The purpose of this newsletter is to give (technical) information
about the British classic car Triumph TR7 and TR8.
To make this newsletter a success I need your HELP:
o Let me know if this newsletter contains the information you're
looking for.
o Let me know if you want to write a feature article.
o Let me know if you have suggestions, improvements, etc.
o Let me know if you find this newsletter useful and practical, and
if there is anything you would like to see covered.
You can subscribe/unsubscribe to this newsletter at
http://www.team.net/TR8/mp
For comments, articles, etc. send an e-mail to
workshop@voskotan.demon.nl
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THE WEDGE TEAM
The WWWedge website is entirely maintained by volunteers.
Johan Vorsterman van Oijen is responsible for the design and the
daily updates. Mark Elbers is fully occupied with the Registry pages.
Eric Teunissen is responsible for the TR Scale Models pages.
The WWWedge Ezine newsletter is moderated by yours truly (Johan
Vorsterman van Oijen), and my native language isn't English.
But I'll try to do my utmost best to create readable articles.
To save me from the biggest spelling mistakes, David Parnham will
check the Wedge Ezine. Great huh?
To get started the WWWedge Ezine newsletter is heavily based on
the Wedge Tips collected by Philip Johnstone from Australia.
Another source is the TR7/8 mailing list. I will extracts threads
from this list and publish them in this newsletter.
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INTRODUCTION
Hi all,
Here we are again. I know some of you are curious how I get the
information. Well, most of it comes from the TR7/8 mailing list.
I just collect threads and order them on topics. If it's interesting
or heavenly discussed at the list I'll publish it.
Second, I write articles and while doing so, I surf the Internet to
gather information, join discussion lists, etc.
Third, I was hoping to get more response from you, the Ezine reader!
Grab your wordprocessor and tell me, no tell us all, something about
your wedge.
This edition is packed with several topics which could be interesting.
Mark Tinker provided me with scanned pages from the HOTROD magazine
(March 1985) and Car & Driver (August 1980). That article will appear
in the next Ezine edition.
Have fun.
Johan Vorsterman van Oijen
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TOPICS
o Incoming mail
o Competition TR8
o Read for YOU!
o Questions
o Have you priced a Chevy aluminum small-block lately?
o TR8 oil pump mystery
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INCOMING MAIL
In the last edition I wrote about the fan belt. I quoted a company
called 'The Gates Company'. I took some quotes from their website but
I don't have any commercial strings attached to them.
A Wedge Ezine reader commented about the Gates Company:
"I'm enjoying your e-zine tremendously. I'm a 2 time TR-7 owner
located in Oregon, 15 years & 150,000 miles, & I can't imagine
anything I'd rather drive, given the cost or at twice the cost!
(I can imagine what I'd rather drive at 10 times the cost, but it's
not much better!)
I have to comment on the Gates radiator hose article, ... I feel a
lot of people might view this as commercial fluff. (and well it may
be ... but), being an old codger, I fooled around with some Chevy
Corvairs in the late 60's (for those not familiar, this was a 6
cylinder air cooled Beetle meets the worst of General Motors.)
The fan belt made 2 90 degree turns, & the engine ate them like they
were popcorn. The reputed solution was a standard Gates brand belt.
It cost no more than other belts, but was reputed to work. I was
skeptical, & tried & fried other name brand belts in an average of 2
days. Finally bought a Gates belt, & after about 2 years it got oil
soaked, & began to slip (every British car owner should own a Corvair
once! The average Corvair leaks more oil in one trip to work than all
the British cars that were ever built leak in a year! True, Corvairs
don't leak much on the garage floor, they have special holding pans
(like VW & Porsche, the engine is mostly thin gage sheet metal) that
save the oil until you brake in traffic, when it is ducted to the
exhaust headers in volume.
There's a story about the guy with the fire extinguisher, but I
digress .... I was babbling about the oil soaked Gates belt.
I bought what was available (twice) and had to replace both with the
slipping, oil coated Gates belt, which was still in one piece.
Now a believer, I ordered a new Gates belt, which outlived the car.
So, to make a short story long, I'm glad to hear that Gates is still
on top of things, I've always bought them in the 30 years that have
slipped away since this story, & I'm glad to hear they are still
doing the right thing.
Roncho Grande <
shaws@aracnet.com >
+0.2 Moderator
Thanks Roncho, great to have some feedback. Well it wouldn't hurt if
someone could inform at the Gates Company and ask for a fan belt for
our TR7/8.
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COMPETITION TR8
Just thought you may be interested in details of a TR8 which I
rallied in the UK about 10 years ago. The car was built in 1980, to
full factory spec eg. Safety Devices shell, 4HA disc braked axle,
works gearbox, adjustable suspension in fact just about everything
was done that only a professional outfit could do. The engine
produced around 290bhp on the rollers. Cyril Bolton built the
original car and was a fairly well known national rally driver at the
time.
When I bought the car (from Jon Vicker in 1987) the car had changed
from it's unarched state to having the ultra wide rear tarmac arches
and ran on 10" rear rims and 8" fronts and was in full tarmac
specification.
I did a number of local tarmac rallies with it and to say that it
was an animal would be an understatement. In very heavy rain it was
virtually uncontrollable even on Michelin PBs. Maybe it was my
driving style or maybe it was weight distribution. The car had the
ability to swap ends very quickly and suddenly if you were not quick
to catch it. I suspect that a lot of the TR8s problem in competition
(certainly on gravel) was poor weight distribution and I noticed an
almost "pendulum effect" on the rear end once the car got into an
unintentional slide.
However it was not all bad. It was a phenomenal beast to drive with
mind blowing acceleration (we timed about 4.5 seconds 0-60, and could
clock up nearly 135mph at 9000rpm in fifth gear on Michelin racers)
and the feeling that you were driving a man's car! Sadly due to
financial limitations (and the fact that the Miches were nearly 100
per corner, 6mpg etc etc) the TR had to go which is a shame as I was
starting to get to grips with it and controlling the urge to plant
the right boot to floor!
I have one scanned bitmap of the car which I would happily provide
(400kb) and if any technical info was required by your visitors
again I would be willing to pass on my knowledge although I am a
little out of touch with who supplies competition parts for TRs.
Maybe you could point me in the right direction here as I may start
building my own soon........
The Specs of this competition TR8:
Shell:
o Works Safety Devices competition body shell with integral rollcage.
o 15gallon bag fuel tank.
o 2 gallon dry sump & pipework.
o Kevlar seats.
o Willans aircraft harnesses.
o Sump pan skid.
o Works style instrumentation.
o Halda trip meter.
o 5.0Kg Plumbed-in Extinguisher & 2.5Kg hand held.
o Suede finishing.
o Fibre-glass bonnet and boot.
o Wide rear arch extensions.
o Smaller front arch extensions.
o Front and rear steel bumper inserts removed.
Suspension:
o Adjustable height Bilstein front struts - tarmac inserts.
o 2.25" tarmac coil springs.
o Anti-dive blocks.
o Roller top mounts.
o Rear Bilstein dampers with tarmac inserts.
o Standard diameter tarmac rear coils.
o Height adjustable by cutouts in trailing arms and alloy blocks.
o Five linked axle location - rose jointed.top links and axle link of
panhard rod.
Brakes:
o Ventilated front discs with four pot calipers.
o Balance bar pedal box assembly and dash adjuster.
o Solid rear discs with two pot calipers.
o Hydraulic flyoff handbrake.
o Non servo assisted.
Transmission:
o Works clutch assembly.
o Ken Tomlinson built close ratio gearbox.
o 4HA Axle with 4.5:1 ratio and Powrlok LSD.
Engine:
o Quad 48DCOE side draught Weber carbs.
o Fully gas flowed heads.
o Large inlet/exhaust valves.
o Solid rocker gear.
o 10.5:1 Pistons.
o Lightened, balanced rods, crank, flywheel and clutch.
o Dry sump pump.
o Oil cooler.
o 4-2-1 manifolds into 3" single box exhaust.
Performance:
(As far as I remember - The Dyno sheet went when I sold the car)
o Power output: 295bhp.
o Max torque:270lb per foot @ 5600rpm.
o Max rpm:9000 - NOT recommended for sustained periods!
0-60:Around 4.5 secs.
o Max speed: 135mph.
Keep up the good work with the website and look forward to hearing
from you.
Regards
Nick Hanham ( gemtek@email.msn.com )
Webpage: http://www.team.net/TR8/mp/html/nick_hanham.html
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READ FOR YOU!
The April edition of 'Thoroughbred & Classic Cars', contained 50
pages of Triumph's celebration. 75 years of the Triumph marque.
Well among the featured Triumphs is of course our beloved wedge.
A article by Martin Buckley, saying that our wedge has always
lived in the TR6's shadow, but Martin says; don't dismiss it lightly!
A couple of remarkable statements;
- A good TR6 is sought-after property will make three times the price
of world's mintest TR7 (nothing said about the TR8 ;-( )
- The TR7 cruises well but TR6 easily outguns it through the gears.
- TR7 broke with TR tradition by being a monoque, but it was really
a two-door Dolomite.
- Well-styled, clear dashboard, one of TR7's better points.
The article is an comparison between a red 1970 TR6 and a very nice
yellow TR7 FHC (according to the decals built in Canley).
Another article featuring Becci Hamilton, a good-looking redhead.
She's a dancer and calls herself 'the official party animal' of the
TR Register's Kent group. She owns' two TR7V8s, one of them has got
300 bhp(!) gained from a 4.6 litre Rover V8. Her license plate is:
HOT 1 SIN
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QUESTIONS
From: Ron Forse ( rforse@total.net )
Hello there Wedgeteam! From Ron here in Montreal Quebec Canada.
Spring is finally here and I just can't wait for all the snow to be
gone. By the way I'm new to this computor e-mail stuff, so please
excuse my writing..
Last fall when my dad passed away he left me his pride and joy, a
beautiful Triumph TR7 that he had purchased brand new from the
showroom floor of a local Montreal car dealer in ''1982'', I still
remember that like it was yesterday, even though, I was probably
about 14 years old at the time.
Enough with my introduction, also, just let me say how much I really
enjoy reading all about these fantastic cars and , all your info,
which really helps me get a good feeling for this car, so thanks ever
so much for sending me the newsletter.
Perhaps you can help me with a few questions? I would like to have
some info, on how to join a triumph club, as I am interested in
showing this car at local shows because it is in impeccable
condition, also perhaps a contact in Montreal, Quebec, to contact for
get togethers, and events with similar vehicles like mine... also,
perhaps somebody who can give me some productions figures, for this
vehicle.
It is a 1982 Triumph TR7 convertible #SATPL4181CA407799 this car is
99% original (with exception of the battery) with only 28,634Kms.
I would like to know if it is a rare car, and is this perhaps one of
the last cars made?
Wherever I look for info, production seems to have stopped in 1981
with the exception maybe of Canada????? Could you please tell me how
many were actually sold here, in Canada that year (the salesman told
us it was one of the last three available).
Thanks again, for the excellant web site and reports, the WWWedge is
my personal favorite Internet pages, keep up the great work!!!
The World Wide Wedge and its team are the best !!!
All for now, Ron and his silver bullet(or now "silver arrow") in
support of McLaren F-1.
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TR7 Victory edition
Attached is a picture from a dealer post card showing the TR7 Victory
addition. I just scanned it in and converted it to a 15kb jpeg.
Here is what it says on the back of the postcard:
The TR7 Victory Edition with FREE competition-type spoker wheels, FREE
black vinyl top, and FREE special striping.
Test drive it today at your local Triumph dealer!
Webpage: http://www.team.net/TR8/mp/html/tr7victoryedition.html
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Have you priced a Chevy aluminum small-block lately?
Whether procured from factory or aftermarket sources, expect to pay
somewhere in the neighborhood of $2500 to $3000. And that merely gets
you a bare block. No crank, rods, pistons, camshaft, or valvegear.
Not to mention the aluminum cylinder heads, which'll run around
$1000, bare. No wonder most of us make do with the old "iron horses."
Well under the purchase that way for Chevy bare block, you can build
an affordable aluminum V8 with displacements up to 305 cubic inches.
Unbelievable? Not really.
We're speaking of the 1961-'63 Buick/Olds 215 aluminum motor, an
often overlooked granddaddy of the Buick V6 that unfortunately was
about 15 years ahead of its time.
With over 3/4 million built, blocks are relatively easy to locate at
the local boneyard. Since the motors had castiron cylinder liners,
corrosion is not near by the problem it was on the linerless Vegas.
While it's true that parts on the out-of-production motor are not
exactly plentiful, many parts from more modern motors can be
substituted with little or no reworking.
Two individuals -
Phil Baker (Baker's Auto Repair, 19552 40th Pl. NE, Seattle,
WA 98155, 206/363-5088)
Dan LaGirou (D&D Fabrications: P.O. Box 55, Rochester,
Ml 48063, 313/652-1359)
backyard-build retained on block by extra head strong-running
215-based motors using amalgamated parts from a variety of engines.
Both these indivuals also hoard tons of hard-to-find 215 parts.
Additionally, D&D offers a completely integrated Vega swap kit that
will be covered in detail in a future issue.
What is a 215?
Before there were Buick V6's, there was a lightweight aluminum V8
installed in many Buicks and Olds, and some Pontiacs. Designed
originally as an economy engine, it found its way into several
quasi-high-performance applications, including Olds' turbocharger
applications. Because the aluminum castings costs too much money to
produce, the cast-iron Buick V6's replaced it in the economy role,
with the 400/340 Buicks taking over in the moderate performance
category. Later, the tooling was sold to Rover, where a descendant
powers that company's products to this day.
There were two major 215 variants:
The Buick version and the Olds version. Olds engines may be
identified by their angled 5-bolt valve covers; Buicks have flatter
4-bolt covers. (Pontiacs used the Olds versions.) The late British
Rover motor is based on the Buick, and except for different accessory
mounting bosses on the cylinder heads, it is considered universally,
dimensionally, and functionally interchangeable with the Buick design.
However the imported parts are quite expensive.
Olds cylinder heads are bolted to the block using six bolts per
cylinder, while Buicks use only five bolts. The extra Olds head bolt
also retains the Olds rocker shafts. Valvetrain pieces from the
pushrods on up are not interchangeable between the two versions.
Buick blocks don't have the extra head bolt hole drilled in them, and
the casting has insufficient thickness to add it. For this reason, an
Olds head cannot be installed on a Buick block, although a Buick head
(and its associated valvetrain components) will bolt on an Olds block
using only five bolts per cylinder. (Head bolt holes are blind, so
water jacket seepage from the empty hole isn't a problem.)
Combustion chamber design also differs, with the Buick using a
slightly more open-type design. The Olds head runs better on
low-octane gas, but the Buick has only one type of cylinder head,
varying compression by changing piston design. Olds, conversely, uses
only one piston, altering compression by varying combustion chamber
volume.
Since the Olds had a unique valve-train not shared by later Olds
engines, while the Buick version gave birth to later Buick V6's and
V8's, parts for the Buicks are much more plentiful than for the Olds.
Also helping tilt the scales in the Buick's favor is its greater
production numbers, outnumbering the Olds as it did by about a 3:2 ratio.
Next time more . . . . .
Extract from Hot Rod magazine, March 1985.
Thanks to Mark Tinker for scanning the pages.
Webpage:
http://www.team.net/TR8/mp/html/buick_215.html
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WEDGE LINK
Hi Wedge Team,
I'm starting a new web page on my TR7 please feel free to link it to
your site.
Jim Barbuscia
http://www.ptinet.net/~jimbar/jbtr7.htm
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Come for a ride in mine !
I received a message from a guy Down Under asking me to look at his
website. Of course I took a peek and was impressed with the contents
and the look.
This car isn't a wedge but surely interesting to look at.
Curious? Pay this website a visit...it wouldn't hurt...!
http://www.car888.iinet.net.au
You will probably Explorer 4.X or Netscape 4.X.
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TR8 oil pump mystery
You know how to feed a stray dog tends to encourage him to
come around even more? Well, I've got another good one.
Another peculiarity of my TR8 (1980, soon-to-be-removed AC) is that
the oil pressure warning light on the dash does not light when you
start the car. No big problem, right? Just replace the bulb.
My mechanic actually discovered this when the car was in for its first
big post-acquisition service. Before he took the dash apart to get
at the bulb, he decided to check if the lead to the indicator switch
on the pump had come disconnected or something. Based on examination
of the official BL/JRT shop manual (pp 55, 308, 309) he expected to
find two switches on the pump, one for the oil pressure indicator
(when the pressure is up it pushes out a plunger that breaks the
circuit's connection; if the pump fails and pressure drops, the
plunger will go back in, close the circuit, and activate the light
on the dash), and a second one supposedly used only for cars with
PI--mine has carbs.
He was surprised to find that only the supposedly unused switch
was present, nor were there any extra connection leads for the other
switch which might indicate that some sort of modifications had been
made to the car by a previous owner (DPO ;-D), etc.
The switch that's there has 3 prongs connecting it to three wires.
Hooking up an external oil pressure gauge indicated the pump was
working OK, but if it ever fails--or starts to--well, do we really
want to talk about what will happen to my engine?
Is it possible that the sole switch on my pump is actually the one
for the warning circuit? Could it be that on the production line
a slightly different type of pump was fitted to my car? Or used as
a replacement for the original later on? This seems to be a problem
with TR8s even more than 7s: what the repair manual says you should
find does not always match what is actually on the car, even on a
fairly well-preserved, largely stock vehicle such as mine.
Lawrence Hansen
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> Lawrence Hansen wrote:
> Is it possible that the sole switch on my pump is actually the one
> for the warning circuit?
Yes - see schematic below.
My guesses would be that either the switch is not connected to the
wiring harness properly, or that you may have the wrong type of
switch installed. If you've got a continuity tester or test light,
pull the connector with the three wires off of the switch.
Check that none of the terminals are grounded, then check that the
switch terminals that connect to the White-Orange and White-Brown
wires have continuity at zero pressure. If you can get to the switch
terminals with the engine running or can simulate pressure to the
switch, check for continuity between the terminals that connect to
the White and White-Brown wires.
Note that the White-Brown terminal must be common to both continuity
paths to allow the system to work correctly. Tell me more on what
you find. Does the fuel pump appear to be wired correctly?
Remember that the ground path for the oil pressure light is through
both the inertia switch/fuel pump motor and through the starter
solenoid pull-in & hold-in coils. The oil light should go out as
soon as you engage the starter...
To view the following schematic correctly, you must use a monospaced
font like Courier.
--- Fuel pump wiring schematic follows:
Here is the way the starter, oil pressure switch, and fuel pump are
tied together in the 1980 TR8:
Battery ign switch ign switch
unfused "start" "on, start"
| (thru starter relay) |
| | W|___________________ W
| | | |
| | | Low Oil Pressure
| |_______________ | Light
| WO| WO | | W |
| ___|___ o\ o } Oil Pressure | Switch connects W
__|__ | | \ } Switch, shown | to WN at normal
_____-- -- P- -- --H o } at 0 psi | oil pressure
| | | | |
|________| | WN|_____________________| WN
| | |
| | |o }
Starter | | } inertia switch
Motor | |o }
| | |
Gnd Gnd WG|
Fuel
Pump
P = Starter Solenoid |
Pull-In Coil B|
H = Starter Solenoid Gnd
Hold-In Coil
Sorry for the crude ASCII schematic. When the ignition is on,
and engine stopped, the oil pressure light is on since the W line is
energized and the ground path is through the fuel pump motor and
through the oil pressure switch to the starter solenoid coils and
starter motor.
When the ign switch is moved to the start position, the starter relay
energizes the WO line to energize the starter solenoid. The fuel
pump starts, and the oil pressure light goes out since the WN line is
energized through the oil pressure switch.
(12V applied to both sides of the light turns it off.)
As the oil pressure comes up, the W and WN connection is made in the
oil pressure switch. The oil pressure light remains out since there
is 12V on both sides of the light. The fuel pump remains running as
long as the ignition is on and the oil pressure is maintained above
the switch setpoint.
Tim Buja ( 71005.1142@CompuServe.COM )
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CARB NEEDLES
I'm writing this to both the general triumph list and to the TR7/TR8
list (some early TR7 owners might benefit and folks there might be
able to help anyway).
The more I get into things and the more I hear and read from you
folks, the more it seems like I really DO have an altitude problem
with my "emission" TR6 Z-S carbs up here at 7500 feet.
For you TR7/TR8 readers, it seems I can NOT adjust the carbs lean
enough now that I've got the TR6 here to join the TR8, even though I
had no troubles doing so in Austin, TX (500 ft above sea level).
Too rich is what the colortune and plugs say. So, unless both float
valves have suddenly stuck open and are flooding the car with gas,
I must presume I don't have enough adjustment latitude on the stock
74 TR6 carb set up to adjust for the thin air up here :-)
I've been reading and talking to local folks and everything I hear
supports the theory that altitude is the problem. One local mechanic
I chatted with on the phone (seemed a bright guy too) told me that
he gave up trying to get MGs and Triumphs to run at this altitude
with the stock needles/jets and either
(1) converted the cars to Webers or
(2) refitted them with a special high altitude kit (new needles)
which he got from some place in California.
So, since I'm interested in making this car run up here with the
stock carb setup, I need to find a source for "leaner" Z-S needles
(biased, adjustable kind)! I've got a listing of all the profiles
of a lot of different needles from the Haynes book on these carbs
and can generally guess at a couple which might work.
Anyone know a source (US or UK) for these needles?? TRF only sells
the stock needles (interestingly, IPD/Volvo sell a range of needles
for similar carb set ups on early Volvos).
Roger Bolick wrote me and excerpted the following message:
>>>>>>>>>>
I'd like to draw your attention to the fact that THE experts in
Strombergs and SUs in the UK are Burlen Fuel Systems, Salisbury,
Wiltshire, England. They evidently bought all the Zenith stock,
tooling etc. upon liquidation of same and now run a worldwide parts
and remanufacturing service. My point is that they would a) be able
to advise you as to the best kit to use and b) sell you an O.E. kit!
And yes, I am biased because Salisbury happens to be my home town but
B.F.S. really are very helpful and knowledgeable. The above address
isn't complete but ought to get any mail to them - you may find their
address in an issue of Practical Classics or similar.
Andrew
>>>>>>>>>>
Does anyone have any more information about these folks (full address
or phone number?) and have you dealt with them?
Jim TenCate
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BURLEN FUEL SYSTEMS (UK)
Spitfire House, Castle Road, Salisbury, Wiltshire SP1 3SA
Tel: (+44) 1722 412500 Fax: (+44) 1722 334221
I have used them and they are the best source for SU and Zenith.
Get hold of their literature pack.
Mike Jeffreys
0.2 moderator:
I did order the literature pack. It's packed with schematics, pictures
surveys. Quite interesting. The price is 11 GBP (approx. $15 USD)
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The end is near...I managed to keep this issue under 30Kb. Why 30kb.
Well, I'm reading about 20 Ezines (all sorts of interests) and 30Kb
seems to be a magical size. So I'll stick to 30Kb for each issue.
Again, I'm asking you to provide me with information. Co-writers are
very welcome.
Cheers,
Johan Vorsterman van Oijen.
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WWWedge Ezine is a free email newsletter for anyone who is interested
in the classic car Triumph TR7 and TR8.
Please note: the list of subscribers will not be shared with anyone.
The information is used to distribute the newsletter. This newsletter
is no SPAM. It's sent to you based on your subscription.
Advice, articles and opinions are offered 'as is'. The publisher
cannot accept responsibility for any errors or omissions.
The newsletter may be freely copied and/or distributed in its
entirety.
(c) 1998, The World Wide Wedge (http://www.team.net/TR8/)
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