fot
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RE: rod length

To: "'riverside'" <riverside@Cedar-Rapids.net>, fot <fot@autox.team.net>
Subject: RE: rod length
From: Bill Babcock <BillB@bnj.com>
Date: Tue, 14 Jun 2005 15:32:04 -0700
Yep. Most of us wouldn't recognize an F1 piston as a piston--they look more
like ashtrays, or some weird poker chip. The new hot bike engines are the
same way--my Senna has 2.1-1 rod/stroke ratio and titanium rods, crank and
piston pin. The piston looks about as thick as a waffle. Why it doesn't just
turn sideways is a mystery to me.  


Bill Babcock
Babcock & Jenkins

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-fot@autox.team.net [mailto:owner-fot@autox.team.net] On Behalf
Of riverside
Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 2:05 PM
To: fot
Subject: rod length

This topic used to cause me brain damage, but long ago, i too made peace
with it.

issue #1.  we are denied the advantage of building race motors from a clean
sheet of paper.  Our deck height is set.  New F1 engines have rod/stroke
ratios of well over 2:1.  Few street engines come that way.
V12 Jag is about 2.16.   259 Stude V8 is 2.11   Most are about 1.7 because
they were designed that way for a whole lot of reasons not related to HP
production.
the point is that we are severely limited.

#2   HRM is imho a poor source of race engine science.  I seem to remember
       a similar article about 5-6 years ago where they did get significant
       changes in HP with only rod and piston change.    above 5KRPM
       i doubt that there is much cam difference, but below 4K there would
be
       alot of diff since the one advantage of a short rod is its ability to
get a
       stopped column of fluid moving better that the long rod.   Frankly,
in
a
        race engine, I can't see this as a plus.


#3    The business with dwell time and rod angle advantage can be best
understood
        by those of us who are conceptually impaired  ( hell, it took me
years to
        understand how "caster made you faster")  by making paper dolls.
        use some stiff paper to make models of two setups.  Make one about
1.5:1
        and the other about 6:1.  an absurd example often best illustrates
the
        concept.  the change in dwell time will be noticeable.

#4     Is this "worth the time/money"?   Maybe we will find out, especially
if
someone
         really goes whole hog with modern short compression distance
pistons so
         the longest rod possible gets squeezed in.
art d

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