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Re: [TR] Hydrogen fuel... Part One.

To: triumphs@autox.team.net
Subject: Re: [TR] Hydrogen fuel... Part One.
From: Michael Porter <mdporter@dfn.com>
Date: Sat, 02 Aug 2008 10:40:55 -0600
Looks like this message was too long for the message filter, so, I'm 
splitting it in two.


Dave1massey@cs.com wrote:
>
> ...no recognizable lost or cost?  Try leaving your alternator belt 
> loose once and see what happens.  The energy generated by the 
> alternator comes from mechanical loading on the engine.  A 100 Amp 
> alternator will requuire nearly 2 HP to turn at full load.  How much 
> current is required by the hydrogen generator?
>
> Einstein said energy is neither created or destroyed.  An alternator 
> converts mechanical energy to electrical energy.  There is no free lunch.
>   

I'll only add a couple of things to what Dave says here--2 hp is very 
generous. At full output, 100 A at 14V would be 1400 watts, or 1.88 hp. 
That would assume virtually no losses, and a polyphase alternator with 
simple rectification to DC would dissipate a fair amount of energy as 
heat, between winding resistance and diode heating, so alternator 
efficiency is more likely going to be in the range of 60% or so, taking 
the required input power to about 3.2 hp. Add in belt losses and the 
actual horsepower consumed is going to be more like 4.5-5.0 hp.


The other concern is how much power is required to produce a given 
amount of hydrogen.  If I recall my chemistry, electrolysis is a very 
predictable performer--the voltage and amperage determine the rate of 
production.  If you can get the electrolysis cell to run at a full 14V, 
the output would be about 0.25 ml (at standard temperature and pressure) 
of H2 gas per second per ampere at the cathode.  That's about 1 x 
10^(-5) gram-moles of hydrogen gas. For argument's sake, let's say that 
50A of alternator output is devoted to hydrogen production. That means 
the electrolysis unit is producing roughly 5 x 10^(-4) gram-moles of H2 
per second.  Since free hydrogen is a diatomic molecule with each atom 
an atomic weight of very slightly more than 1, that's 0.001 grams of 
hydrogen fuel produced per second, using around 2.5 hp.


Part two follows....

-- 


Michael Porter
Roswell, NM


Never let anyone drive you crazy when you know it's within walking distance....
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