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Re: [Fot] Zinc Additive. now use of BRONZE GUIDES

To: <fot@autox.team.net>, <n197tr4@cs.com>
Subject: Re: [Fot] Zinc Additive. now use of BRONZE GUIDES
From: "Greg Solow" <Gregmogdoc@surfnetusa.com>
Date: Thu, 3 Nov 2011 14:35:33 -0700
We have found that Manganese-Bronze guides have greater "lubricity"  (are 
more slippery) and last longer while causing less wear of the valve stem 
than cast or "chilled" iron guides. The issue is clearance between the valve 
guide and the stem. The bronze guide material has a much greater coefficient 
of expansion than does iron. When an bronze guide is used in an iron head, 
as the head gets hot, the material of the guide wants to expand. It cannot 
expand outward because it is "captured" by the iron head all around it. 
Consequently it grows inward, reducing the clearance between the id. of the 
guide and the valve stem. We have had valves get stuck in bronze guides in 
iron TR head and others as well. The fix is the correct amount of clearance. 
In a TR-4 iron head, in a racing application, ie hard use, high 
temperatures, 5/16" stem inlet valves need .0015" to .002" stem to guide 
clearance, exhaust valves with 5/16" diameter stems need .002" to .0025" 
clearance. We DO NOT USE VALVE STEM SEALS. It is not necessary with even 
increased oil delivery to the valve gear.  We get much longer life out of 
the Manganese-Bronze guides than with any iron guides we have used and with 
these clearances you will not have any seizure problems.
                                                                             
                                    Greg Solow
----- Original Message ----- 
From: <n197tr4@cs.com>
To: <fot@autox.team.net>
Sent: Thursday, November 03, 2011 7:12 AM
Subject: [Fot] Zinc Additive. now use of BRONZE GUIDES


> Sent: Thu, Nov 3, 2011 8:25 am
> Subject: Re: [Fot]   Zinc Additive.  now use of BRONZE GUIDES
>
>
> FROM TED SCHUMACHER:
>
> Why dont you use bronze guides?  How did you come to this decision?
>
>
> Ted,
>
> I discussed with highly regarded performance engine shop.
> Whenever they encounter bronze guides they clearance them.
> If it doesnt get done, there is a danger of seizing.....which can get very
> hard on lifters and cams.
>
> Some engineering folks tell me that cast iron guides provide superior
> performance.
> And say that bronze cause more heat/friction/wear......................
>
> This and observing various failures over the years caused me change.
> Certainly it is the right decision for me.
>
> Others may have a different conclusion and I would invite them to discuss 
> on
> this list.
>
> I have long suspected that there have been a lot of failures attributed to
> 'soft lifters', and faulty cams, when it may have been caused by seizing 
> of
> valves or severe drag in bronze guides.
>
> Thanks for asking Ted.   It seems like it is an important subject for this
> list.
>
> Joe Alexander
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: tedsimx <tedsimx@bright.net>
> To: n197tr4 <n197tr4@cs.com>
> Sent: Wed, Nov 2, 2011 8:54 pm
> Subject: Re: [Fot]   Zinc Additive.
>
>
> Why don't you use bronze guides?  How did you come to this decision?  Ted
>
>
> Connected by DROID on Verizon Wireless
>
>
> -----Original message-----
>
> From: n197tr4@cs.com
> To: lang@isis.mit.edu,  JAR7U@hscmail.mcc.virginia.edu
> Cc: fot@autox.team.net
> Sent: Wed, Nov 2, 2011 21:16:11 GMT+00:00
> Subject: [Fot]   Zinc Additive.
>
>
> Use of bronze guides is or can be an issue here.
>
> ESPECIALLY those not properly clearanced.
>
> It ALSO seems that cast iron guides are 'slippery' while bronze can create
> added friction and wear.
>
> We dont use bronze guides anymore.
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>
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