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Re: [Fot] SU oil/refurbishing race suit?

To: Rocky Entriken <rocky@spitfire4.com>
Subject: Re: [Fot] SU oil/refurbishing race suit?
From: Phil Gott via Fot <fot@autox.team.net>
Date: Tue, 24 Nov 2020 06:34:40 -0500
Cc: fot-bounces@autox.team.net, fot@autox.team.net
Delivered-to: mharc@autox.team.net
Delivered-to: fot@autox.team.net
References: <C000C15E48404DF2B033A7A87D3E9274@Rocky>
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Correct: The purpose of the oil is to retard the rise of the piston. Why do t=
hat? If you can watch the fuel flow out of the orifice, you=E2=80=99ll see t=
hat slowing the piston rise gives a temporary enrichment, similar to the acc=
elerator pump in a fixed- Venturi carburetor.=20
This is needed because opening the throttle raises the pressure in the manif=
old ( remember it is running as a vacuum) and so raising the pressure makes t=
he fuel condense onto the walls of the manifold ( like rain!) and so you tem=
porarily need more of it in the air stream  to compensate.
Unlike street engines, race engines are tuned extra-rich to begin with, so t=
hey are less sensitive to this phenomenon. You can get away with no oil in t=
he carbs sometimes.=20
I run 10 W (when I can get it) or cheap ATF. Why? I find the engine is more r=
esponsive under part throttle conditions such as when I am feathering the th=
rottle in controlled oversteer conditions (I run a welded diff so the thrott=
le is part of my steering mechanism.)
Try it both ways and see how it works in your car at the altitude you run. I=
t=E2=80=99s more about driveability than absolute power.
Phil Gott


Sent from my iPhone

> On Nov 24, 2020, at 3:20 AM, Rocky Entriken via Fot <fot@autox.team.net> w=
rote:
>=20
> =EF=BB=BF
> Re Oil:
> I once did a race at Woody Creek Raceway, Aspen, CO (8000 feet) and could n=
ot get the car to rev over 5000 rpm. A friend diagnosed the problem ... got o=
ut his wire cutters and snipped the posts off the rods in the SU caps. Never=
 had a problem again!
> =20
> He about gave me a heart attack when he did it. Thing is, the purpose of t=
he oil in the SUs is to retard the piston going up and down, mostly up. It w=
as explained to me, you don=E2=80=99t WANT to retard the carb piston on a ra=
ce engine. You hit the gas you want it WOT. RIGHT NOW! Street car, sure. Rac=
e car, no.
> =20
> But a tip: Clean the inside of the carb, piston & cylinder, regularly. Bef=
ore each race. Brakleen. Fuel residue will gum it up if you don=E2=80=99t.
> =20
> --Rocky
> =20
> From: Henry Giffin via Fot
> Sent: Tuesday, November 24, 2020 12:58 AM
> To: fot@autox.team.net ; fot-bounces@autox.team.net
> Subject: [Fot] SU oil/refurbishing race suit?
> =20
> FOTs, I have two questions for the knowledgeable ones.
>     Do you use light oil in your SUs on your racing engines?  I have heard=
 both sides of this.  I have not been using any oil, but have heard from fri=
ends I should be.=20
>      A number of years ago when my son-in-law started racing we sent my ol=
d racing suit to someone to be refurbished.  It came back in great condition=
.  My current suit could use some work.  We lost the name of the company who=
 did the work.  Can anyone recommend a source for refurbishing my suit?
>      Thanks, Hank
> =20
> Hank Giffin
> 757-375-1491
> =20
> _______________________________________________
> fot@autox.team.net
>=20
> http://www.fot-racing.com
>=20
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://autox.team.net/archive http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot
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re4.com
>=20
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> fot@autox.team.net
>=20
> http://www.fot-racing.com
>=20
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://autox.team.net/archive http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/vfracing@aol=
.com
>=20
>=20

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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"content-type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3D=
utf-8"></head><body dir=3D"auto">Correct: The purpose of the oil is to retar=
d the rise of the piston. Why do that? If you can watch the fuel flow out of=
 the orifice, you=E2=80=99ll see that slowing the piston rise gives a tempor=
ary enrichment, similar to the accelerator pump in a fixed- Venturi carburet=
or.&nbsp;<div>This is needed because opening the throttle raises the pressur=
e in the manifold ( remember it is running as a vacuum) and so raising the p=
ressure makes the fuel condense onto the walls of the manifold ( like rain!)=
 and so you temporarily need more of it in the air stream &nbsp;to compensat=
e.<br><div>Unlike street engines, race engines are tuned extra-rich to begin=
 with, so they are less sensitive to this phenomenon. You can get away with n=
o oil in the carbs sometimes.&nbsp;</div><div>I run 10 W (when I can get it)=
 or cheap ATF. Why? I find the engine is more responsive under part throttle=
 conditions such as when I am feathering the throttle in controlled overstee=
r conditions (I run a welded diff so the throttle is part of my steering mec=
hanism.)</div><div>Try it both ways and see how it works in your car at the a=
ltitude you run. It=E2=80=99s more about driveability than absolute power.</=
div><div>Phil Gott</div><div><br><div><br><div dir=3D"ltr">Sent from my iPho=
ne</div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br><blockquote type=3D"cite">On Nov 24, 2020, at 3=
:20 AM, Rocky Entriken via Fot &lt;fot@autox.team.net&gt; wrote:<br><br></bl=
ockquote></div><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div dir=3D"ltr">=EF=BB=BF
<meta content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dus-ascii" http-equiv=3D"Content-Type">=

<meta name=3D"Generator" content=3D"Microsoft Word 15 (filtered medium)">
<style><!--
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<div dir=3D"ltr">
<div style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri'; COLOR: #000000">
<div>Re Oil:</div>
<div>
<div style=3D"FONT-SIZE: small; TEXT-DECORATION: none; FONT-FAMILY: &quot;Ca=
libri&quot;; FONT-WEIGHT: normal; COLOR: #000000; FONT-STYLE: normal; DISPLA=
Y: inline">I=20
once did a race at Woody Creek Raceway, Aspen, CO (8000 feet) and could not g=
et=20
the car to rev over 5000 rpm. A friend diagnosed the problem ... got out his=
=20
wire cutters and snipped the posts off the rods in the SU caps. Never had a=20=

problem again! </div></div>
<div>
<div style=3D"FONT-SIZE: small; TEXT-DECORATION: none; FONT-FAMILY: &quot;Ca=
libri&quot;; FONT-WEIGHT: normal; COLOR: #000000; FONT-STYLE: normal; DISPLA=
Y: inline">&nbsp;</div></div>
<div>
<div style=3D"FONT-SIZE: small; TEXT-DECORATION: none; FONT-FAMILY: &quot;Ca=
libri&quot;; FONT-WEIGHT: normal; COLOR: #000000; FONT-STYLE: normal; DISPLA=
Y: inline">He=20
about gave me a heart attack when he did it. Thing is, the purpose of the oi=
l in=20
the SUs is to retard the piston going up and down, mostly up. It was explain=
ed=20
to me, you don=E2=80=99t WANT to retard the carb piston on a race engine. Yo=
u hit the=20
gas you want it WOT. RIGHT NOW! Street car, sure. Race car, no. </div></div>=

<div>
<div style=3D"FONT-SIZE: small; TEXT-DECORATION: none; FONT-FAMILY: &quot;Ca=
libri&quot;; FONT-WEIGHT: normal; COLOR: #000000; FONT-STYLE: normal; DISPLA=
Y: inline">&nbsp;</div></div>
<div>
<div style=3D"FONT-SIZE: small; TEXT-DECORATION: none; FONT-FAMILY: &quot;Ca=
libri&quot;; FONT-WEIGHT: normal; COLOR: #000000; FONT-STYLE: normal; DISPLA=
Y: inline">But=20
a tip: Clean the inside of the carb, piston &amp; cylinder, regularly. Befor=
e=20
each race. Brakleen. Fuel residue will gum it up if you don=E2=80=99t. </div=
></div>
<div>
<div style=3D"FONT-SIZE: small; TEXT-DECORATION: none; FONT-FAMILY: &quot;Ca=
libri&quot;; FONT-WEIGHT: normal; COLOR: #000000; FONT-STYLE: normal; DISPLA=
Y: inline">&nbsp;</div></div>
<div>
<div style=3D"FONT-SIZE: small; TEXT-DECORATION: none; FONT-FAMILY: &quot;Ca=
libri&quot;; FONT-WEIGHT: normal; COLOR: #000000; FONT-STYLE: normal; DISPLA=
Y: inline">--Rocky</div></div>
<div>
<div style=3D"FONT-SIZE: small; TEXT-DECORATION: none; FONT-FAMILY: &quot;Ca=
libri&quot;; FONT-WEIGHT: normal; COLOR: #000000; FONT-STYLE: normal; DISPLA=
Y: inline">&nbsp;</div></div>
<div>
<div style=3D"FONT-SIZE: small; TEXT-DECORATION: none; FONT-FAMILY: &quot;Ca=
libri&quot;; FONT-WEIGHT: normal; COLOR: #000000; FONT-STYLE: normal; DISPLA=
Y: inline"></div>
<div style=3D"FONT: 10pt tahoma">
<div style=3D"BACKGROUND: #f5f5f5">
<div style=3D"font-color: black"><b>From:</b> <a title=3D"fot@autox.team.net=
">Henry=20
Giffin via Fot</a> </div>
<div><b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, November 24, 2020 12:58 AM</div>
<div><b>To:</b> <a title=3D"fot@autox.team.net">fot@autox.team.net</a> ; <a t=
itle=3D"fot-bounces@autox.team.net">fot-bounces@autox.team.net</a> </div>
<div><b>Subject:</b> [Fot] SU oil/refurbishing race suit?</div></div></div>
<div>&nbsp;</div></div>
<div style=3D"FONT-SIZE: small; TEXT-DECORATION: none; FONT-FAMILY: &quot;Ca=
libri&quot;; FONT-WEIGHT: normal; COLOR: #000000; FONT-STYLE: normal; DISPLA=
Y: inline">
<div class=3D"WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 14pt">FOTs, I have two ques=
tions for=20
the knowledgeable ones.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 14pt">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Do=
 you use=20
light oil in your SUs on your racing engines?&nbsp; I have heard both sides o=
f=20
this.&nbsp; I have not been using any oil, but have heard from friends I sho=
uld=20
be.&nbsp; <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 14pt">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nb=
sp; A=20
number of years ago when my son-in-law started racing we sent my old racing s=
uit=20
to someone to be refurbished.&nbsp; It came back in great condition.&nbsp; M=
y=20
current suit could use some work.&nbsp; We lost the name of the company who d=
id=20
the work.&nbsp; Can anyone recommend a source for refurbishing my=20
suit?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 14pt">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nb=
sp;=20
Thanks, Hank<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 14pt"><o:p></o:p></span>&nb=
sp;</p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Hank Giffin<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">757-375-1491<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p></o:p>&nbsp;</p></div>
<p>
</p><hr>
_______________________________________________<br>fot@autox.team.net<br><br=
>http://www.fot-racing.com<br><br>Donate:=20

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iv></div></div>
<span>_______________________________________________</span><br><span>fot@au=
tox.team.net</span><br><span></span><br><span>http://www.fot-racing.com</spa=
n><br><span></span><br><span>Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html</span><=
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