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I did not realise that the tie rod was orientated front/rear. In that
case you are absolutely right.
These rods are more usually used to prevent torsional movement of the
engine to keep clutch judder (amongst others) in control. I those cases
I would go for rubber bushes.
Kees Oudesluijs
Op 23-10-2015 om 4:27 schreef WILLIAM B LAWRENCE:
> I think I disagree. The main purpose of the tie rod is to keep the
> engine from shifting forward and damaging the radiator. It has very
> little function as a shock absorber. Its orientation to the engine
> center line means there is little vibration in that direction. On the
> other hand the rubber bushings fail very quickly on exposure to oil
> and water. if the bushings fail and allow the engine to move forward
> under braking it can do some substantial damage. I think Austin
> probably would have used a more durable material in that place if one
> had been available (and economic). My car is not concours and never
> will be so my emphasis is going to be on durability. I'm definitely
> going to urethane for this application.
>
> Bill Lawrence
>
> > To: healeys@autox.team.net
> > From: coudesluijs@chello.nl
> > Date: Thu, 22 Oct 2015 12:14:23 +0200
> > Subject: Re: [Healeys] Suspension bushings - tangent
> >
> > I do not think so as this also has to work as a vibration damper and
> > rubber is better in that respect than PU. Perhaps you can fit a sleeve
> > around it to protect it from oil.
> > Kees Oudesluijs
> >
> >
> > Op 22-10-2015 om 12:04 schreef Bob Haskell:
> > > Larry and Michael,
> > >
> > > Would you use urethane bushings for the engine tie rod (lower/rear
> > > gearbox/OD mount)? Urethane doesn't deteriorate like rubber when oil
> > > soaked. But it doesn't absorb as much shock loading either.
> > >
> > > Cheers,
> > >
> > > Bob Haskell
> > > AHCA 3000 Mk I registrar
> > > http://www.ciahc.org/registry_3000mk1.php
> > >
> > > On 10/22/2015 04:04 AM, Larry Varley wrote:
> > >> Absolutely agree with Michael here, from past experience I would
> > >> completely avoid urethane for any car to replace original rubber
> bushes.
> > >> Its a pity that the correct rubber bushes are not made, but I would
> > >> still use the reproductions rather than urethane. From an engineering
> > >> standpoint urethane has a totally different way of operating to
> what the
> > >> car was originally designed for, stretching rubber fixed against
> steel
> > >> surfaces is not the same as rotating urethane on a pin. Has
> anyone ever
> > >> asked any of the urethane bush manufacturers if their products are
> > >> approved by current auto manufacturers, or if they will accept
> liability
> > >> for any damage they will cause? I would prefer to stay with a product
> > >> that is as close as possible to the original specification. In
> closing,
> > >> enlighten me, do any current auto manufacturers use urethane as their
> > >> standard suspension bush?
> > >> Cheers
> > >> Larry Varley
> > >>
> > >> On 22/10/2015 7:08 AM, Michael Salter wrote:
> > >>> Bob,
> > >>> I suspect that I'm not telling you anything that you don't already
> > >>> know here BUT:
> > >>> I think the critical point is that the original suspension
> bushes work
> > >>> in the same way that rubber engine mounts are designed to work. The
> > >>> steel mounting plates (or in the case of mounts steel tubes) are
> > >>> rigidly attached to parts that move relative to each other and that
> > >>> movement is accommodated by the flexing of the rubber medium
> bonded to
> > >>> each plate.
> > >>> The plastic bushes work more like bearings in that the rotational
> > >>> movement is accommodated by rotation of the bolt (shaft) within the
> > >>> bush (bearing). All very well while you are flying straight and
> level.
> > >>> The problem, as I see it, is that when angular displacement is
> > >>> required, as in body roll, the plastic bushes must distort and
> as the
> > >>> plastic is by necessity relatively rigid, when compared to the
> > >>> original rubber, the loads imparted to the mounting points will be
> > >>> substantially higher than that for which they were designed.
> > >>> Maybe you will get away with it, maybe you won't., I just don't want
> > >>> to be passing you in the opposite direction if you don't!!!!
> > >>> Michael S
> > >>> BN1 #174 (All rubber bushes :-))
> > >>>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> _______________________________________________
> > >> Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html
> > >> Suggested annual donation $12.75
> > >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
> > >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
> > >>
> > >> Healeys@autox.team.net
> > >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/healeys
> > >>
> > >> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> > >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/healeys/rchaskell@earthlink.net
> > >>
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html
> > > Suggested annual donation $12.75
> > > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
> > > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
> > >
> > > Healeys@autox.team.net
> > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/healeys
> > >
> > > Unsubscribe/Manage:
> > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/healeys/coudesluijs@chello.nl
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > -----
> > > Geen virus gevonden in dit bericht.
> > > Gecontroleerd door AVG - www.avg.com
> > > Versie: 2015.0.6172 / Virusdatabase: 4450/10869 - datum van uitgifte:
> > > 10/22/15
> > >
> > >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html
> > Suggested annual donation $12.75
> > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
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> >
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> >
> > Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/healeys/ynotink@msn.com
> >
>
> Geen virus gevonden in dit bericht.
> Gecontroleerd door AVG - www.avg.com <http://www.avg.com>
> Versie: 2015.0.6172 / Virusdatabase: 4450/10871 - datum van uitgifte:
> 10/22/15
>
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<div class="moz-cite-prefix">I did not realise that the tie rod was
orientated front/rear. In that case you are absolutely right. <br>
These rods are more usually used to prevent torsional movement of
the engine to keep clutch judder (amongst others) in control. I
those cases I would go for rubber bushes.<br>
Kees Oudesluijs<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Op 23-10-2015 om 4:27 schreef WILLIAM B LAWRENCE:<br>
</div>
<blockquote cite="mid:SNT149-W92FE8F51BB0491279B8A79A5260@phx.gbl"
type="cite">
<meta http-equiv="Context-Type" content="text/html;
charset=iso-8859-1">
<div dir="ltr">I think I disagree. The main purpose of the tie rod
is to keep the engine from shifting forward and damaging the
radiator. It has very little function as a shock absorber. Its
orientation to the engine center line means there is little
vibration in that direction. On the other hand the rubber
bushings fail very quickly on exposure to oil and water. if the
bushings fail and allow the engine to move forward under braking
it can do some substantial damage. I think Austin probably would
have used a more durable material in that place if one had been
available (and economic). My car is not concours and never will
be so my emphasis is going to be on durability. I'm definitely
going to urethane for this application.
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Bill Lawrence<br>
<br>
<div>> To: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:healeys@autox.team.net";>healeys@autox.team.net</a><br>
> From: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:coudesluijs@chello.nl";>coudesluijs@chello.nl</a><br>
> Date: Thu, 22 Oct 2015 12:14:23 +0200<br>
> Subject: Re: [Healeys] Suspension bushings - tangent<br>
> <br>
> I do not think so as this also has to work as a
vibration damper and <br>
> rubber is better in that respect than PU. Perhaps you
can fit a sleeve <br>
> around it to protect it from oil.<br>
> Kees Oudesluijs<br>
> <br>
> <br>
> Op 22-10-2015 om 12:04 schreef Bob Haskell:<br>
> > Larry and Michael,<br>
> ><br>
> > Would you use urethane bushings for the engine tie
rod (lower/rear <br>
> > gearbox/OD mount)? Urethane doesn't deteriorate
like rubber when oil <br>
> > soaked. But it doesn't absorb as much shock
loading either.<br>
> ><br>
> > Cheers,<br>
> ><br>
> > Bob Haskell<br>
> > AHCA 3000 Mk I registrar<br>
> > <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
href="http://www.ciahc.org/registry_3000mk1.php";>http://www.ciahc.org/registry_3000mk1.php</a><br>
> ><br>
> > On 10/22/2015 04:04 AM, Larry Varley wrote:<br>
> >> Absolutely agree with Michael here, from past
experience I would<br>
> >> completely avoid urethane for any car to
replace original rubber bushes.<br>
> >> Its a pity that the correct rubber bushes are
not made, but I would<br>
> >> still use the reproductions rather than
urethane. From an engineering<br>
> >> standpoint urethane has a totally different
way of operating to what the<br>
> >> car was originally designed for, stretching
rubber fixed against steel<br>
> >> surfaces is not the same as rotating urethane
on a pin. Has anyone ever<br>
> >> asked any of the urethane bush manufacturers
if their products are<br>
> >> approved by current auto manufacturers, or if
they will accept liability<br>
> >> for any damage they will cause? I would prefer
to stay with a product<br>
> >> that is as close as possible to the original
specification. In closing,<br>
> >> enlighten me, do any current auto
manufacturers use urethane as their<br>
> >> standard suspension bush?<br>
> >> Cheers<br>
> >> Larry Varley<br>
> >><br>
> >> On 22/10/2015 7:08 AM, Michael Salter wrote:<br>
> >>> Bob,<br>
> >>> I suspect that I'm not telling you
anything that you don't already<br>
> >>> know here BUT:<br>
> >>> I think the critical point is that the
original suspension bushes work<br>
> >>> in the same way that rubber engine mounts
are designed to work. The<br>
> >>> steel mounting plates (or in the case of
mounts steel tubes) are<br>
> >>> rigidly attached to parts that move
relative to each other and that<br>
> >>> movement is accommodated by the flexing of
the rubber medium bonded to<br>
> >>> each plate.<br>
> >>> The plastic bushes work more like bearings
in that the rotational<br>
> >>> movement is accommodated by rotation of
the bolt (shaft) within the<br>
> >>> bush (bearing). All very well while you
are flying straight and level.<br>
> >>> The problem, as I see it, is that when
angular displacement is<br>
> >>> required, as in body roll, the plastic
bushes must distort and as the<br>
> >>> plastic is by necessity relatively rigid,
when compared to the<br>
> >>> original rubber, the loads imparted to the
mounting points will be<br>
> >>> substantially higher than that for which
they were designed.<br>
> >>> Maybe you will get away with it, maybe you
won't., I just don't want<br>
> >>> to be passing you in the opposite
direction if you don't!!!!<br>
> >>> Michael S<br>
> >>> BN1 #174 (All rubber bushes :-))<br>
> >>><br>
> >><br>
> >><br>
> >><br>
> >>
_______________________________________________<br>
> >> Support Team.Net
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
href="http://www.team.net/donate.html";>http://www.team.net/donate.html</a><br>
> >> Suggested annual donation $12.75<br>
> >> Archive: <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
href="http://www.team.net/archive";>http://www.team.net/archive</a><br>
> >> Forums: <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
href="http://www.team.net/forums";>http://www.team.net/forums</a><br>
> >><br>
> >> <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:Healeys@autox.team.net";>Healeys@autox.team.net</a><br>
> >> <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
href="http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/healeys";>http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/healeys</a><br>
> >><br>
> >> Unsubscribe/Manage: <br>
> >>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
href="http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/healeys/rchaskell@earthlink.net";>http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/healeys/rchaskell@earthlink.net</a><br>
> >><br>
> > _______________________________________________<br>
> > Support Team.Net <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
href="http://www.team.net/donate.html";>http://www.team.net/donate.html</a><br>
> > Suggested annual donation $12.75<br>
> > Archive: <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
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> > Forums: <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
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> ><br>
> > <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
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> > <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
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> ><br>
> > Unsubscribe/Manage: <br>
> >
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> ><br>
> ><br>
> ><br>
> > -----<br>
> > Geen virus gevonden in dit bericht.<br>
> > Gecontroleerd door AVG - <a
class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.avg.com";>www.avg.com</a><br>
> > Versie: 2015.0.6172 / Virusdatabase: 4450/10869 -
datum van uitgifte: <br>
> > 10/22/15<br>
> ><br>
> ><br>
> <br>
> _______________________________________________<br>
> Support Team.Net <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
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> <br>
</div>
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<p class="">Geen virus gevonden in dit bericht.<br>
Gecontroleerd door AVG - <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.avg.com";>www.avg.com</a><br>
Versie: 2015.0.6172 / Virusdatabase: 4450/10871 - datum van
uitgifte: 10/22/15</p>
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