When we wrote that I think we were saying that the inset red was baked or fired
in to create a glass effectâ?? to distinguish it from paint. Someone should
take it to a jewelry maker and ask what it is rathe than guessing.
G
Gary Anderson
> On Oct 23, 2018, at 2:00 PM, healeys-request@autox.team.net wrote:
>
> Send Healeys mailing list submissions to
> healeys@autox.team.net
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
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> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
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>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of Healeys digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: Paint type (Curtis Arndt)
> 2. Re: Paint type (Michael Salter)
> 3. Re: Paint type (Roger Moment)
> 4. Re: Paint type (nconklin@sbcglobal.net)
> 5. Re: Badge on bonnet ? Hyphenated or Not [was ?Paint type and
> color?] (Ian Hey)
> 6. Paint type (simon.lachlan@alexarevel.plus.com)
> 7. Re: Paint type and color (Bob Spidell)
> 8. Re: Paint type (Andy Sneddon)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2018 22:42:23 -0700
> From: Curtis Arndt <cnaarndt@gmail.com>
> To: gary brierton <gbrierton@hotmail.com>
> Cc: Roger Moment <rmoment@comcast.net>, Healey List
> <healeys@autox.team.net>, Michael Salter <michael.salter@gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Healeys] Paint type
> Message-ID:
> <CAJKrNeSRsNDpMHL6OD7JMfxY2d2rQ7YROqh+2MJvOMxjauR+sA@mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Gary,
>
> With all due respect, sorry but you are mistaken on a number of points.
>
> *Michael Salter... Please make this my first revision for the next Concours
> Guidelines update. *
>
> First off, the badges were never Cloisonne, they are red enamel. Yes, the
> Concours Guidelines state that they are Cloisonne, the Guidelines are
> WRONG. I am officially submitting an update for the next Concours
> Guidelines revision.
>
> Copied from the Concours Guidelines...
>
> *"All cars up through the Mark I 3000s had flat Austin-Healey "wings"
> mounted on the front between the grille and bonnet opening, with red
> cloisonn? lettering inset in chrome." *
>
> Change to read* "**red enamel lettering"*
>
> This is where the confusion first arises!
>
> Secondly, all Austin Healey badges were red enamel from the very first BN1
> in 1953 through the BJ8 at chassis no. 39975. After that they were indeed
> painted red. Also copied from the Concours Guidelines...
>
> *"BJ8s produced starting around C. 39,975 (approximate date ? December
> 1966) had a similar badge that was not cloisonn? but was painted red
> instead of the cloisonn?. These later badges have a smooth background
> instead of the pebbled background of the enameled badges." *
>
> Change to read* "**was not enamel but was painted red instead of the
> enamel."*
>
> Karla Maxwell, a trained jeweler with 45+ years experience who owns Maxwell
> Enamels will tell you, as she told me 25 years ago that automotive badges
> are enamel and NOT Cloisonne. Karla is the premier automotive emblem
> restorer in the US, is in high demand for Pebble Beach participants, is a
> neighbor and personal friend of 25+ years. Karla has restored a number of
> badges personally for me, and I have done some Bakelite restoration work
> for Karla for Pebble Beach cars that she was working on. Oh, and Karla's
> business is Maxwell Enamels NOT Maxwell Cloisonne. In the UK the best
> known badge restorer is PD Enamels, NOT PD Cloisonne.
>
> I hope that this clears things up once and for all.
>
> This is from Karla's FAQ section of her website...
> http://www.maxwellenamels.com/FAQs.html
>
> *FAQ... How was my emblem created? *
>
> These enameled emblems are often, *incorrectly, referred to as cloisonn?*.
> Cloisonn? is an enamel process in which separate bands of metal are bent
> then applied to a base. These labor intensive bands encase the enamel and
> create the design. I have yet to see an automobile emblem done with
> cloisonn?. The process that is used is called *champlev?* (pronounced
> shomp?-leh-vay).
>
> The champlev? technique involves applying enamel into depressions in the
> base metal. These depressions may be etched, engraved or, in the case of
> automobile emblems, die stamped. The stamping process can also include the
> beautiful design work that shows under transparent enamels.
>
> Historically the word enamel meant glass but today it seems to refer to any
> shiny color. The correct terminology is *vitreous* [glass] enamel. It is a
> true glass that melts and fuses around 1400 degrees F. Enamel can be
> obtained as opaque, translucent or transparent. The colors are created by
> the addition of metallic oxides to the glass.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Oct 18, 2018 at 8:31 PM Gary R. Brierton <gbrierton@hotmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> OK...let's try and clear this up. As I understand it, the "flat wings
>> with the Austin-Healey script" commonly seen on BN1, BN2 and (I don't know
>> when it stopped), had red paint of unknown shade in the etched out
>> lettering. Along came the larger badges with MKII or whatever, in
>> cloisonne. THEN, to really screw us up, those badges returned to red
>> paint of unknown shade, seemingly during BJ8 production. As was true with
>> almost everything involving our cars, the exact change VIN number for all
>> of this is largely indeterminate, at least as far as trim pieces are
>> concerned...oh, and some major body parts, like wings with one or two
>> signaling lights, swag lines, whatever. Reliable reports (from D.M.H.!)
>> state that the guiding principle in assembling our cars was "use up what
>> was on hand".
>> I claim no expertise beyond owning Austin-Healeys and associating with
>> their owners for over 50 years (so, mainly the 6 cylinder cars).
>> Take it away, Curt, Randy, Steve, et. al.?
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html
>> Suggested annual donation $12.75
>>
>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/healeys
>> http://autox.team.net/archive
>>
>> Healeys@autox.team.net
>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/healeys
>>
>> Unsubscribe/Manage:
>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/healeys/cnaarndt@gmail.com
>>
>>
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Fri, 19 Oct 2018 07:35:37 -0400
> From: Michael Salter <michael.salter@gmail.com>
> To: "Curt/Nancy Arndt" <cnaarndt@gmail.com>
> Cc: healeys@autox.team.net, Roger Moment <rmoment@comcast.net>
> Subject: Re: [Healeys] Paint type
> Message-ID:
> <CAB3i7LLfSqVEa0A-9kTz5MfTZKpfydwTXqHheHSZYnp2Bb7dJg@mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Okay now I get it.
> What I have been refering to as "cliosonne" is actually "vitreous enamel"
> (also know as champlev?) and that is actually what was used in all front
> badges until the later Mk III badges that appeared with red paint.
> What is important is that the vitreous enamel IS NOT PAINT.
> Part of the terminology problem is that some paints are commonly referred
> to as "emamel" but enamel paint is not what was used in the badges prior to
> MkIII cars prior to around HBJ8L 39975.
> If this is agreed I will make the appropriate changes to the guidelines.
>
> M
>
>
>> On Fri, Oct 19, 2018, 1:42 AM Curtis Arndt, <cnaarndt@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> Gary,
>>
>> With all due respect, sorry but you are mistaken on a number of points.
>>
>> *Michael Salter... Please make this my first revision for the next
>> Concours Guidelines update. *
>>
>> First off, the badges were never Cloisonne, they are red enamel. Yes, the
>> Concours Guidelines state that they are Cloisonne, the Guidelines are
>> WRONG. I am officially submitting an update for the next Concours
>> Guidelines revision.
>>
>> Copied from the Concours Guidelines...
>>
>> *"All cars up through the Mark I 3000s had flat Austin-Healey "wings"
>> mounted on the front between the grille and bonnet opening, with red
>> cloisonn? lettering inset in chrome." *
>>
>> Change to read* "**red enamel lettering"*
>>
>> This is where the confusion first arises!
>>
>> Secondly, all Austin Healey badges were red enamel from the very first BN1
>> in 1953 through the BJ8 at chassis no. 39975. After that they were indeed
>> painted red. Also copied from the Concours Guidelines...
>>
>> *"BJ8s produced starting around C. 39,975 (approximate date ? December
>> 1966) had a similar badge that was not cloisonn? but was painted red
>> instead of the cloisonn?. These later badges have a smooth background
>> instead of the pebbled background of the enameled badges." *
>>
>> Change to read* "**was not enamel but was painted red instead of the
>> enamel."*
>>
>> Karla Maxwell, a trained jeweler with 45+ years experience who owns
>> Maxwell Enamels will tell you, as she told me 25 years ago that automotive
>> badges are enamel and NOT Cloisonne. Karla is the premier automotive
>> emblem restorer in the US, is in high demand for Pebble Beach participants,
>> is a neighbor and personal friend of 25+ years. Karla has restored a number
>> of badges personally for me, and I have done some Bakelite restoration work
>> for Karla for Pebble Beach cars that she was working on. Oh, and Karla's
>> business is Maxwell Enamels NOT Maxwell Cloisonne. In the UK the best
>> known badge restorer is PD Enamels, NOT PD Cloisonne.
>>
>> I hope that this clears things up once and for all.
>>
>> This is from Karla's FAQ section of her website...
>> http://www.maxwellenamels.com/FAQs.html
>>
>> *FAQ... How was my emblem created? *
>>
>> These enameled emblems are often, *incorrectly, referred to as cloisonn?*.
>> Cloisonn? is an enamel process in which separate bands of metal are bent
>> then applied to a base. These labor intensive bands encase the enamel and
>> create the design. I have yet to see an automobile emblem done with
>> cloisonn?. The process that is used is called *champlev?* (pronounced
>> shomp?-leh-vay).
>>
>> The champlev? technique involves applying enamel into depressions in the
>> base metal. These depressions may be etched, engraved or, in the case of
>> automobile emblems, die stamped. The stamping process can also include the
>> beautiful design work that shows under transparent enamels.
>>
>> Historically the word enamel meant glass but today it seems to refer to
>> any shiny color. The correct terminology is *vitreous* [glass] enamel. It
>> is a true glass that melts and fuses around 1400 degrees F. Enamel can be
>> obtained as opaque, translucent or transparent. The colors are created by
>> the addition of metallic oxides to the glass.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Oct 18, 2018 at 8:31 PM Gary R. Brierton <gbrierton@hotmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> OK...let's try and clear this up. As I understand it, the "flat wings
>>> with the Austin-Healey script" commonly seen on BN1, BN2 and (I don't know
>>> when it stopped), had red paint of unknown shade in the etched out
>>> lettering. Along came the larger badges with MKII or whatever, in
>>> cloisonne. THEN, to really screw us up, those badges returned to red
>>> paint of unknown shade, seemingly during BJ8 production. As was true with
>>> almost everything involving our cars, the exact change VIN number for all
>>> of this is largely indeterminate, at least as far as trim pieces are
>>> concerned...oh, and some major body parts, like wings with one or two
>>> signaling lights, swag lines, whatever. Reliable reports (from D.M.H.!)
>>> state that the guiding principle in assembling our cars was "use up what
>>> was on hand".
>>> I claim no expertise beyond owning Austin-Healeys and associating with
>>> their owners for over 50 years (so, mainly the 6 cylinder cars).
>>> Take it away, Curt, Randy, Steve, et. al.?
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html
>>> Suggested annual donation $12.75
>>>
>>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/healeys
>>> http://autox.team.net/archive
>>>
>>> Healeys@autox.team.net
>>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/healeys
>>>
>>> Unsubscribe/Manage:
>>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/healeys/cnaarndt@gmail.com
>>>
>>>
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL:
> <http://autox.team.net/pipermail/healeys/attachments/20181019/e98c54ac/attachment-0001.html>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Fri, 19 Oct 2018 06:06:25 -0600
> From: "Roger Moment" <Rmoment@comcast.net>
> To: "Curtis Arndt" <cnaarndt@gmail.com>, "gary brierton"
> <gbrierton@hotmail.com>
> Cc: Sean and Tricia Johnson <healey@communitynet.org>, Michael Salter
> <michael.salter@gmail.com>, Healey List <healeys@autox.team.net>,
> "Tom, Kaye Kovacs" <fntune@charter.net>, carol hodgman
> <carolhodgman@gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Healeys] Paint type
> Message-ID: <8D06CCAAE5FA42AD8B68682CE6AB4ECD@7RM>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> To all,
>
> I?m not clear about who wrote what, but ALL Healey wing badges WERE CLOISONN?
> (up to late BJ8s, starting in Dec. 1966, as stated in the current
> Guidelines)!!!!!!!! You can tell this because the red lettering color is
> transparent and you can see through to the backing.
>
> This is why you cannot just repair the red on a badge. The Cloisonn? process
> requires high heat and would destroy the Cr plating ? they do the lettering
> first and plate with Cr afterwards.
>
> I have had manly original badges restored by P-D Enamels in England. Yes,
> their name has ?Enamels? in it, but the process they use to replicate
> original badges like the Healey winged ones is Cloisonn?. They have seen a
> very large number of these and have restored them exactly as-new. They agree
> that the red ?fill? was Cloisonn?!!! They restore them with this material.
>
> Look at old defective badges. Where the color has started to separate from
> the backing it looks darker. This is because you are looking through a glass
> and can identify separation from the backing. Where it is missing in places
> it looks exactly like chipped out glass, not paint. It is much thicker than
> paint.
>
> On the late BJ8s they went to paint. This looks totally different!!!
>
> The Guidelines as currently written are correct!! DO NOT CHANGE!!!!!!!!
>
> I?ll ?go to the mat? on this!!!!
>
>
> Roger
>
> From: Curtis Arndt
> Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2018 11:42 PM
> To: gary brierton
> Cc: Healey List ; Michael Salter ; Roland Wilhelmy ; Roger Moment
> Subject: Re: [Healeys] Paint type
>
> Gary,
>
> With all due respect, sorry but you are mistaken on a number of points.
>
> Michael Salter... Please make this my first revision for the next Concours
> Guidelines update.
>
> First off, the badges were never Cloisonne, they are red enamel. Yes, the
> Concours Guidelines state that they are Cloisonne, the Guidelines are WRONG.
> I am officially submitting an update for the next Concours Guidelines
> revision.
>
> Copied from the Concours Guidelines...
>
>
> "All cars up through the Mark I 3000s had flat Austin-Healey "wings" mounted
> on the front between the grille and bonnet opening, with red cloisonn?
> lettering inset in chrome."
>
> Change to read "red enamel lettering"
>
>
> This is where the confusion first arises!
>
> Secondly, all Austin Healey badges were red enamel from the very first BN1 in
> 1953 through the BJ8 at chassis no. 39975. After that they were indeed
> painted red. Also copied from the Concours Guidelines...
>
> "BJ8s produced starting around C. 39,975 (approximate date ? December 1966)
> had a similar badge that was not cloisonn? but was painted red instead of the
> cloisonn?. These later badges have a smooth background instead of the pebbled
> background of the enameled badges."
>
> Change to read "was not enamel but was painted red instead of the enamel."
>
> Karla Maxwell, a trained jeweler with 45+ years experience who owns Maxwell
> Enamels will tell you, as she told me 25 years ago that automotive badges are
> enamel and NOT Cloisonne. Karla is the premier automotive emblem restorer in
> the US, is in high demand for Pebble Beach participants, is a neighbor and
> personal friend of 25+ years. Karla has restored a number of badges
> personally for me, and I have done some Bakelite restoration work for Karla
> for Pebble Beach cars that she was working on. Oh, and Karla's business is
> Maxwell Enamels NOT Maxwell Cloisonne. In the UK the best known badge
> restorer is PD Enamels, NOT PD Cloisonne.
>
> I hope that this clears things up once and for all.
>
> This is from Karla's FAQ section of her website...
> http://www.maxwellenamels.com/FAQs.html
> FAQ... How was my emblem created?
>
> These enameled emblems are often, incorrectly, referred to as cloisonn?.
> Cloisonn? is an enamel process in which separate bands of metal are bent then
> applied to a base. These labor intensive bands encase the enamel and create
> the design. I have yet to see an automobile emblem done with cloisonn?. The
> process that is used is called champlev? (pronounced shomp?-leh-vay).
>
> The champlev? technique involves applying enamel into depressions in the base
> metal. These depressions may be etched, engraved or, in the case of
> automobile emblems, die stamped. The stamping process can also include the
> beautiful design work that shows under transparent enamels.
>
> Historically the word enamel meant glass but today it seems to refer to any
> shiny color. The correct terminology is vitreous [glass] enamel. It is a true
> glass that melts and fuses around 1400 degrees F. Enamel can be obtained as
> opaque, translucent or transparent. The colors are created by the addition of
> metallic oxides to the glass.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Oct 18, 2018 at 8:31 PM Gary R. Brierton <gbrierton@hotmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> OK...let's try and clear this up. As I understand it, the "flat wings with
> the Austin-Healey script" commonly seen on BN1, BN2 and (I don't know when it
> stopped), had red paint of unknown shade in the etched out lettering. Along
> came the larger badges with MKII or whatever, in cloisonne. THEN, to really
> screw us up, those badges returned to red paint of unknown shade, seemingly
> during BJ8 production. As was true with almost everything involving our
> cars, the exact change VIN number for all of this is largely indeterminate,
> at least as far as trim pieces are concerned...oh, and some major body parts,
> like wings with one or two signaling lights, swag lines, whatever. Reliable
> reports (from D.M.H.!) state that the guiding principle in assembling our
> cars was "use up what was on hand".
> I claim no expertise beyond owning Austin-Healeys and associating with their
> owners for over 50 years (so, mainly the 6 cylinder cars).
> Take it away, Curt, Randy, Steve, et. al.?
>
> _______________________________________________
> Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation $12.75
>
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/healeys http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Healeys@autox.team.net
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/healeys
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/healeys/cnaarndt@gmail.com
>
> -------------- next part --------------
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> URL:
> <http://autox.team.net/pipermail/healeys/attachments/20181019/c71ccf5e/attachment-0001.html>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Fri, 19 Oct 2018 14:59:17 +0000 (UTC)
> From: "nconklin@sbcglobal.net" <nconklin@sbcglobal.net>
> To: Curtis Arndt <cnaarndt@gmail.com>, gary brierton
> <gbrierton@hotmail.com>
> Cc: Roger Moment <rmoment@comcast.net>, Healey List
> <healeys@autox.team.net>, Michael Salter <michael.salter@gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Healeys] Paint type
> Message-ID: <1851283472.13517403.1539961157512@mail.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Nice write up and documentation , Thanks Curt
>
>
> Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone
>
>
> On Thursday, October 18, 2018, 10:42 PM, Curtis Arndt <cnaarndt@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> Gary,
> With all due respect, sorry but you are mistaken on a number of points.?
> Michael Salter... Please make this my first revision for the next Concours
> Guidelines update.?
> First off, the badges were never Cloisonne, they are red enamel.? Yes, the
> Concours Guidelines state that they are Cloisonne, the Guidelines are WRONG.?
> I am officially submitting an update for the next Concours Guidelines
> revision.
> Copied from the Concours Guidelines...
> "All cars up through the Mark I 3000s had flat Austin-Healey "wings" mounted
> on the front between the grille and bonnet opening, with red cloisonn?
> lettering inset in chrome."??
> Change to read?"red enamel lettering"
>
> This is where the confusion first arises!
> Secondly, all Austin Healey badges were red enamel from the very first BN1 in
> 1953 through the BJ8 at chassis no. 39975. After that they were indeed
> painted red.? Also copied from the Concours Guidelines...
> "BJ8s produced starting around C. 39,975 (approximate date ? December 1966)
> had a similar badge that was not cloisonn? but was painted red instead of the
> cloisonn?.?These later badges have a smooth background instead of the pebbled
> background of?the enameled badges."?
> Change to read?"was not enamel but was painted red instead of the enamel."
> Karla Maxwell, a trained jeweler with 45+ years experience who owns Maxwell
> Enamels will tell you, as she told me 25 years ago that automotive badges are
> enamel and NOT Cloisonne.? Karla is the premier automotive emblem restorer in
> the US, is in high demand for Pebble Beach participants, is a neighbor and
> personal friend of 25+ years. Karla has restored a number of badges
> personally for me, and I have done some Bakelite restoration work for Karla
> for Pebble Beach cars that she was working on.? Oh, and Karla's business is
> Maxwell Enamels NOT Maxwell Cloisonne.? In the UK the best known badge
> restorer is PD Enamels, NOT PD Cloisonne.
> I hope that this clears things up once and for all.
> This is from Karla's FAQ section of her
> website...?http://www.maxwellenamels.com/FAQs.html
> FAQ... How was my emblem created??
>
> These enameled emblems are often, incorrectly, referred to as?cloisonn?.
> Cloisonn? is an enamel process in which separate bands of metal are bent then
> applied to a base. These labor intensive bands encase the enamel and create
> the design. I have yet to see an automobile emblem done with cloisonn?. The
> process that is used is called?champlev??(pronounced shomp?-leh-vay).
>
> The champlev? technique involves?applying enamel into depressions in the base
> metal. These depressions may be etched, engraved or, in the case of
> automobile emblems, die stamped. The stamping process can also include the
> beautiful design work that shows under transparent enamels.?
>
> Historically the word enamel meant glass but today it seems to refer to any
> shiny color. The correct terminology is?vitreous?[glass] enamel. It is a true
> glass that melts and fuses around 1400 degrees F.? Enamel can be obtained as
> opaque, translucent or transparent. The colors are created by the addition of
> metallic oxides to the glass.
>
>
>
>
> ?
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Oct 18, 2018 at 8:31 PM Gary R. Brierton <gbrierton@hotmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> OK...let's try and clear this up.? As I understand it, the "flat wings with
> the Austin-Healey script" commonly seen on BN1, BN2 and (I don't know when it
> stopped), had red paint of unknown shade in the etched out lettering.? Along
> came the larger badges with MKII or whatever, incloisonne. THEN, to really
> screw us up, those badges returned to red paint of unknown shade, seemingly
> during BJ8 production.? As was true with almost everything involving our
> cars, the exact change VIN number for all of this is largely indeterminate,
> at least as far as trim pieces are concerned...oh, and some major body parts,
> like wings with one? or two signaling lights, swag lines, whatever.? Reliable
> reports (from D.M.H.!) state that the guiding principle in assembling our
> cars was "use up what was on hand".I claim no expertise beyond owning
> Austin-Healeys and associating with their owners for over 50 years (so,
> mainly the 6 cylinder cars).Take it away, Curt, Randy, Steve, et. al.?
> _______________________________________________
> Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation? $12.75
>
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/healeys http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Healeys@autox.team.net
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/healeys
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/healeys/cnaarndt@gmail.com
>
>
>
>
>
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> URL:
> <http://autox.team.net/pipermail/healeys/attachments/20181019/aad5db0c/attachment-0001.html>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Sun, 21 Oct 2018 14:53:33 +0100
> From: "Ian Hey" <rianhey@btinternet.com>
> To: "'J. Scott Morris'" <jstmorris@yahoo.com>, "'Patrick Quinn'"
> <p_cquinn@tpg.com.au>, "'Michael Oritt'" <michael.oritt@gmail.com>,
> "'Healey List'" <healeys@autox.team.net>
> Subject: Re: [Healeys] Badge on bonnet ? Hyphenated or Not [was
> ?Paint type and color?]
> Message-ID: <002701d46945$754282a0$5fc787e0$@btinternet.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> I am not sure how to reply to the whole list, but my BJ7, Chassis No 25212,
> Body number 70069, only just over 100 from the end of BJ7 production has a
> hyphen in the badge. I bought the 1963 car in 1977 and believe that the
> badge was probably original.
>
>
>
> Interestingly there are some BJ8 features on the car. Eg: the seal down the
> windscreen and on the rear of the front wing is one piece, as BJ8.
>
>
>
> Ian Hey
>
>
>
> From: Healeys <healeys-bounces@autox.team.net> On Behalf Of J. Scott Morris
> Sent: 20 October 2018 17:49
> To: Patrick Quinn <p_cquinn@tpg.com.au>; Michael Oritt
> <michael.oritt@gmail.com>; Healey List <healeys@autox.team.net>
> Subject: [Healeys] Badge on bonnet ? Hyphenated or Not [was ?Paint type and
> color?]
>
>
>
> Good Day; The issue of Austin Healey being hyphenated or not was discussed
> some time ago.
>
>
>
> Attached is my file of those discussions. Each page should be read from the
> bottom to the top since the oldest email is at the bottom and most recent at
> the top.
>
>
>
> Hope this provides some help on the topic.
>
> --Scott Morris; Simcoe, Ontario, Canada - Keep Smiling, Murphy Lives
>
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2018 14:02:54 +0100
> From: <simon.lachlan@alexarevel.plus.com>
> To: "Healeys" <healeys@autox.team.net>
> Subject: [Healeys] Paint type
> Message-ID: <000201d46ad0$b73913e0$25ab3ba0$@alexarevel.plus.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> As I said in a previous email, PamelaDavid did refer to the process as
> ?cloisonn??. (No hyphen!).
>
> Simon
>
>
>
>
>
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2018 08:01:28 -0700
> From: Bob Spidell <bspidell@comcast.net>
> To: healeys@autox.team.net
> Subject: Re: [Healeys] Paint type and color
> Message-ID: <42f07c83-3073-11b5-5dd9-658b613193ce@comcast.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; Format="flowed"
>
> "... *just buy a quality one from Moss or other vendors"*
>
> FWIW, I've bought several from different vendors--including Moss
> IIRC--and, as someone pointed out, the coloring (enamel, paint,
> whatever) doesn't last because it was applied to chrome.
> **
>
>> On 10/22/2018 7:11 AM, Curtis Arndt wrote:
>> Steve and Fellow Listers,
>>
>> There are two great vendors in the US.
>>
>> Maxwell Enamels, Vista, CA...
>>
>> http://www.maxwellenamels.com/Home_Page.html
>>
>> I am a friend of the owner Karla Maxwell (25 years) and she has done
>> work for me an I have done work for her (Bakelite restoration).
>>
>> *She is expensive, and for most badges just buy a quality one from
>> Moss or other vendors.*
>>
>> Moss Motors has a very nice one for $134.00, $239.99 for MKII badges
>> and $249.99 for MKIII badges... Less on sale.
>>
>> Expect to pay $250-$350 plus to have your original restored.
>>
>> https://mossmotors.com/badge-austin-healey-wings?assoc=6725
>>
>> https://mossmotors.com/badge-austin-healey-mk-ii?assoc=7568
>>
>> https://mossmotors.com/badge-austin-healey-mk-iii?assoc=7569
>>
>> The other vendor is Emblemagic in Grand River, OH...
>>
>> http://emblemagic.com/
>>
>> Ray Geschke is the owner, and also very knowledgeable.
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Curt
>>
>> On Mon, Oct 22, 2018 at 3:49 AM BJ8Healeys <sbyers@ec.rr.com
>> <mailto:sbyers@ec.rr.com>> wrote:
>>
>> There still seems to be some confusion between the _type of
>> construction_ of the badge and the _material_ that is in the
>> colored part.
>>
>> Cloisonn? and champlev? are jewelers' terms that refer to how the
>> badge is constructed, while the red material is either "vitreous
>> enamel" or paint.
>>
>> From the Merriam-Webster dictionary:
>>
>> *Definition of /cloisonn??(adjective)/*
>>
>> *: *of, relating to, or being a style of enamel decoration in
>> which the enamel is applied and fired in _raised_ cells (as of
>> soldered wires) on a usually metal background ? compare champlev?
>> <https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/champlev%C3%A9>
>>
>> *Definition of /champlev? (adjective) /*
>>
>> *: *of, relating to, or being a style of enamel decoration in
>> which the enamel is applied and fired in cells _depressed_ (as by
>> incising) into a metal background ? compare cloisonn?
>> <https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/cloisonn%C3%A9>
>>
>> *Definition of /vitreous enamel (noun) /*
>>
>> *: *a fired-on opaque glassy coating on steel or other metals
>>
>> ? called also porcelain enamel
>>
>> Based on these definitions, the BJ7/BJ8 badge _construction_ is
>> champlev?, while the red _material_ is vitreous enamel or paint.?
>> Some have claimed that their badge never had either material but
>> were plain chrome.
>>
>> Steve Byers
>>
>> HBJ8L/36666
>>
>> BJ8 Registry
>>
>> AHCA Delegate at Large
>>
>> Havelock, NC
>>
>>
>
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2018 17:56:52 +0100
> From: Andy Sneddon <sneddon@xsmail.com>
> To: <simon.lachlan@alexarevel.plus.com>, Healeys
> <healeys@autox.team.net>
> Subject: Re: [Healeys] Paint type
> Message-ID: <4F755E0A-929D-454D-B86F-897F9F3A8A7E@xsmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Just had a look at my invoice paperwork from Derron (Pamela David Enamels /
> Badgecraft.co.uk) and he has described the process carried out on my badge as
> ? stripped, re-enamelled, chrome finish ?.
>
>
>
> ? and I can only say that they did an excellent job.
>
>
>
> Andy
>
>
>
> From: Healeys <healeys-bounces@autox.team.net> on behalf of
> <simon.lachlan@alexarevel.plus.com>
> Date: Tuesday, 23 October 2018 at 14:52
> To: Healeys <healeys@autox.team.net>
> Subject: [Healeys] Paint type
>
>
>
> As I said in a previous email, PamelaDavid did refer to the process as
> ?cloisonn??. (No hyphen!).
>
> Simon
>
>
>
>
>
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> End of Healeys Digest, Vol 11, Issue 324
> ****************************************
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