David:
Each to his own. I still don't see ANY "debate" here though. Discussion,
yes - Debate - No. There is a lot of FACTUAL information posted both ways in
these messages. In your original post, you were asking for help/advice. I
gave it to you, from my actual experience.
In addition to loving MG's, I also am an old American muscle car hotrodder,
that also spent 27 years working in the automobile dealership business one
half in the back end (mechanic and service manager) and then the other half
of the time in the front end (sales, finance, leasing and management). My
opinions are formed from years of hands-on experiences.
Less than 5 percet difference in tire circumference is really "nuthin" on a
street rod, to put it in southern vernacular. My B is a "street rod" (of the
era).
I don't see you and I having much to debate here at all. We are not
comparing opinions on the same thing. This is NOT an apples to apples
discussion - and you agree with me on the hard/soft tire thing.
I also have a special interest in and have owned several various Volkswagen
products, most being equipped with Continentals. And, I totally agree with
you. They ARE quite a bit a firmer, harder rubber tire in general. THAT, in
conjunction with more rubber in contact with the road, is probably much of
what you are experiencing with your ride and handling situation, not the
other ingredients of our "discussion".
In addition to everything else I said, the BF Goodrich Radial TA tire has a
high performance name and reputation here in the US. Also, the larger
tire/wheel combo fills up the wheel-wells real good, giving the car a really
aggressive look, that fits with my "muscle car/hot rod" background. That is
the main thing that I was looking for in a set of tires when I bought the
Radial TA's. The good ride and handling and everything else positive that I
have mentioned just came as an extra bonus.
I really NEED a 60's era American hot rod to completely fill my desires!!!
However, I only have time and space for the B, and the B is even more
important to me so I guess it'll just have to do. I have started thinking
about "supercharging" the B to fill my "hot rod" needs. I've looked into it
quite a bit. Paxton made a unit for the MG (that I understand produces
approx. 180 HP on a solid engine) while it was in production. Paxton units
are still available - and would be in keeping with keeping my car "improved
of the era".
I would love nothing better than to "blow away" those pesky Miata's at the
stoplights!!!!
You're from the UK, huh? The Internet sure has made the world a lot smaller
now. The wonders of computers!!!
Nice corresponding with you!
Jerry
73 B Black Beauty
-----Original Message-----
From: David Hill [mailto:Davhill@btinternet.com]
Sent: Monday, May 14, 2001 7:16 PM
To: Jerry Erbesfield
Subject: Re: Tyres (Again) - There is NO debate!
Hello, Jerry.
> In my (not so) humble opinion, there really is NO tire size debate. Only
the
> unknowing can "debate" something like this.
I disagree. If there is a choice (5.5" rims can take from 165 to 195 in any
profile) then there must surely be room for debate, or at least discussion,
as to which tyre size has an acceptable or unacceptable mix of
charactersitics.
Here are the facts, from my personal first-hand experience:
>
> I too have the 5.5 x 14 KN Minilite replicas mounted with 60 series tires
> (Mine replaced Roystyle steel wheels, not wires). The difference is that I
> have 195/60 x 14 BF Goodrich Radial TA's mounted on my 73 Black Beauty B
> roadster and I absolutely love them!
Good.
> Yes, of course the steering is somewhat heavier, but that's the price you
> pay to have more rubber in contact with the road. The handling is improved
> many times over (when you really push it as you would in competition) and
I
> have absolutely NO more dead feeling at any point in the steering than I
had
> before I made the tire/wheel change. Though the steering IS a little
> heavier, it is not THAT bad though, and I still find my B very easy to
> steer - and to me, it has an even MORE enjoyable and more sporty feel now.
> It tracks very true and stable in a straight line, BETTER than before.
Excellent. I would point out that my car's suspension has been rebuilt at
both ends and the rack is not stiff-on the jack, the steering is free, lock
to lock. How to quantifiy 'heavy' in respect of steering is tricky-I would
call mine heavy at manoeuvering speed. At any road speed, the system lacks
feedback in a straight line-the shaft UJ is good, the track rod ends are new
and the tracking is correct so it has to be the tyres.
> There is not an especially harsh ride either (for a 28 year old B). That's
> probably because of two things; 1). These tires are actually oversized
(NOT
> in diameter) for this car AND for these 5.5" wide wheels, so I inflate
them
> slightly less than normal to keep as flat a road contact pattern as is
> possible under the (narrow wheel) conditions. I keep the pressure at 26-28
> lbs. max. hot (My other cars get 35 lbs. hot). This seems to make for a
good
> road contact pattern and a nice ride quality too. I think that the key to
> the good ride though is the rubber compound that BF Goodrich uses for
these
> tires. It is a "soft" tire, as compared to many others. BF Goodrich
offered
> these "stock", street legal tires for racing when they were first
introduced
> and they did quite well with them in competition. They are very
sticky/soft.
My Contis are pretty stiff tyres. At 30 psi, it's downright uncomfortable
except on very smooth major roads. Any lower and the steering's heavier
still. I put this down to the low sidewall height; some of the ride quality
on a B comes from sidewall flex, IMHO. *And* my car is a GT-100lbs heavier
than the Roadster.
> Another thing; BF Goodrich Radial TA's were available from BF Goodrich at
> the time when my B was manufactured new. While I'm not a stickler for
> keeping my B pure stock, and I could care less about having a perfectly
> "concours" car, I DO like to keep the car's appearance "improved of the
> era". These tires/wheels do that.
Fair point.
> At one time these used to be very expensive tires. However, I bought mine
at
> Sam's Wholesale Club last year, right off their shelf, for a price very
> competitive to normal tires. Couldn't believe it when I found them there,
> when I needed them - and at such a good price!
I don't doubt I can get BFG RTAs here in the UK-I had them on my Cobra
replica.
> Though I am not an expert at determining the final drive ratio as you
> apparently are, I would bet it is a very close match to the same as OEM.
The
> tire height was just about the same as the original tires that came on the
> car when I purchased it 14 years ago and I've checked my speed against
other
> "stock" cars with favorable results. Please let me and the list know if I
am
> correct on this.
I'm not an expert on FD ratios. All I did was use a tyre size calculator,
which you can play about with yourself at
http://pw1.netcom.com/~sgalaba/tiresize.htm
According to this, your tyres are 4.84% less in circumference as compared to
original, full profile (/80) 165s. So, when your speedo reads 52.54, you
will be doing 50 mph. According to the program, the nearest match is 185/70,
which gives a - 0.81circumference and a true 50 mph at a reading of 50.41. I
know 2.54 mph is academic, given speedo accuracy, or lack thereof.
> The one and only negative: They WERE a very tight fit - BUT they DID fit,
> with a little extra effort and minor mod. When I first put them on, when
> driving in a straight line or on normal curves, they did NOT scrape.
> However, when pushed very hard, (only) the right side DID rub some, enough
> to be concerned. I had already rebushed and tightened up everything
> previously and knew that the suspension was in good shape - so I got out
the
> old baseball bat! Rolled the bat/tire combo back and forth a few times
> between the wheel-well and the tire, (took some muscle) and no more
rubbing
> since! Ruined the bat but didn't hurt the car at all! It did bow the wheel
> well a very little, and I can tell, but nobody else can. BE CAREFUL OF THE
> BAT DIAMETER SIZE THOUGH! Don't overdo it!
> I suppose that you could also grind off enough of the wheel-well lip to
make
> the tires clear too. With a reasonably tight suspension, shouldn't take
too
> much.
This was my major beef with the 185s. Although it was only a raised moulding
that was rubbing, I was not at all happy about it so I took 2mm off the
right side wheelarch lip. Since I'm going to fit front arch liners, I'd like
a little extra space, for insurance.
> I only drive my B a very few thousand miles a year so tire wear is not an
> important consideration for me.
Mine does between 1,500 and 5,000 p.a.
> I believe that my B looks absolutely fantastic too with the wheel/tire
> combo! Wouldn't have it any other way! Check it out at my web site:
>
> http://people.atl.mediaone.net/jerbesfield/my73mgb.htm
>
> That's my nickel's worth!
Looks good.
Thanks for that. I appreciate what you're saying but am inclined to go for
175x14. According to the calculator, these should add 2.58% circumference.
48.74 mph on the speedo will be a true 50.
All I need to do is to find a decent make of tyre.
David Hill
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