>I would be interested in what you could tell us. I have a 2.8 sitting in my
>shop just waiting for a good use, and a 68 midget that could use a new
>motor. Let us know what you can find out, please.
>TIA,
Dave Miles
This list seems to be fairly swap-friendly so.......
I have a fuel injected 2.8 Chevy engine sitting in a 77 Midget on a trailer
in my driveway. I arrived in Michigan with it last night and intend to get
busy with it this winter. Photos at:
http://www.probe.net/~lmyer/midget1.jpg
http://www.probe.net/~lmyer/midget2.jpg
This engine is from a FWD 1985 Pontiac 6000 and it is a junker I bought for
trial fitting. It is mated to a junker Turbo 200 automatic that has the
case sides trimmed with a hacksaw - again for fitting purposes.
Last year I worked in a GM dealership so I had a chance to do a lot of
measuring on various engines/trannies.
The 85-89 Camaro/Firebird 5-speed overdrive (Borg Warner T-5) should fit
very well (I pick up mine in Chicago on December 14 - will know for sure
then - searched for a long time, best price was $350.00 from private party).
Shifter location (internal linkage) and tranny mount position looks to be
made for the swap. S-10 pickups use the same tranny but the shifter is
about 5 inches further forward (different tailshaft housing). The T-5 was
also used in AMC Eagle and the Chevette but I don't know about shifter/mount
position for these cases.
However the Camaro/Firebird bellhousing/clutch setup will not work due to
the slave cylinder being mounted on an engine/trans separator plate (to the
outside of the starter), pushing rearwards on a very long thowout fork.
Fortunately, the S-10/S-15 pickups use a bellhousing mounted slave cylinder
that tucks neatly along-side and pushes forward on a short throwout fork.
These area dime a dozen and a local junkyard is selling me the
flywheel/bellhousing/clutch/slave cylinder/etc for $60.00.
The hole pattern in the block for the motor mounts (on my trial fit engine)
almost perfectly line up with the stock frame mounts and are the right
distance away for a typical mount to be used. A re-drilled/re-worked Ford
mount may work with the stock frame mounts (I am hopefull). I do not know
if the motor mount holes in the RWD block are in the same place. The oil
filter ponts in a good location and the oil pan fits fine. Also, don't let
anyone tell you the RWD/FWD bellhousing patterns or flywheel bolt patterns
are different - they are exactly the same but the FWD uses slightly larger
metric bolts - not a problem with some minor drilling.
Now comes the tricky part. 2.8/3.1 liter GM engines had basically two
different length crankshafts and a kazillion different front covers, water
pumps, and pulleys - the front wheel drive motors are about 1" shorter than
the RWD due to a shorter crank and different front cover (the exception
being my particular trial-fit motor - it has the long crank and a more
conventional water pump). With the trans mount sitting on the Midget
crossmember, the back bellhousing clears the heater box by about 1/4 inch.
With the long crank, the dampener drops behind the rack above the dip in the
1500cc front crossmember (Sprites will have a problem with their straight
crossmember) but there is not enough room for a pulley. The later FWD
motors are shorter, but the water pump and alternator mount in very weird
locations. The one I have is quite conventional for water pump/alternator
and the intake plenum on this particular one points in the right direction
(as opposed to the opposite on later FWD motors). The Camaro/Firebird 2.8
has the same intake plenum as the one I have but the pulley setup is a lot
deeper. I have not looked at the serpentine setup from the S-10 yet.
Bottom line is that the steering rack will need to be moved slightly forward
(or the heater box altered) for sure if the long crank is used.
Radiator will definitely have to be custom made.
Rear axle housing has yet to be determined, but I have toyed with the idea
of a narrowed Camaro housing since it is of very lightweight tubular design
and has mounting holes for a torque arm.
The 2.8 is a 60 degree V-6 which makes it skinny but quite tall. Note that
hood clearance will definitely be a problem (personally, I like the idea of
my FI plenum sticking out of the hood) and may require serious bumps and
scoops - so much for the stealth effect! There is plenty of clearance for
stock-type exhaust manifolds but which ones have yet to be determined.
I intend to go with the port fuel injected motor with the computer - these
make serious power compared to the wimpy carbureted or throttle body
injected engines - about 145 net horsepower (think 200 brake HP) in a very
lightweight package. Even better, it should still be light enough in the
front to handle well (sans rubber bumpers - AKA Sprite imposter), it should
be well-mannered in traffic, and get great fuel mileage.
I believe that this can be pulled off with no irreversible modifications to
a rubber bumper Midget body/chassis. Will it ever be the same after
tromping the go pedal? - we will have to see about that when the time comes!
Insanely yours,
Les Myer
PDLJMPR
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