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RE: Contesting Militart Raise ABSOLUTELY NO LBC, nada, none!

To: "'spridgets@autox.team.net'" <spridgets@autox.team.net>
Subject: RE: Contesting Militart Raise ABSOLUTELY NO LBC, nada, none!
Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 12:49:12 -0600
Bob,
 
I wish I was a 34 year old Commander, but alas, I'm 41, and yes, I AM making
good money, but not quite what you quote.  As I'm sure you know, sites like
the Stay Navy one seem to tilt things considerably to encourage folks to
stay in the service.  All the advantages and whatnot they list are often
smoke and mirrors, and my friends in the civilian world have better
"advantages" than we do....and they don't have to move every couple of years
(wife's furniture turned to splinters, bank account drained), spend long
periods away from their families, make their kids change schools with every
move, barely break even each time they sell a house and worry about losing
their shirt on the next one, face deployments, etc.  Personally, I'm doing
fine, my pay is fine, though the military is losing so many people of my pay
grade, obviously many of my military peers are voting with their feet to
seek greener pastures somewhere else.  Sometimes I wonder what I would make
if I was doing my same job in the civilian world, managing 500 people
scattered in three states and running 14 cutters and 20 boats covering
thousands of square miles of ocean, not to mention three major river
systems. - I have "civilian peers" with new Porsches and Jags, while my toys
are an old 944 that isn't worth much and a Midget I've pampered for years
and am slowly restoring. 
 
My concern is the younger troops, my Seamen and Third Class Petty Officers,
the ones who are married and God forbid, have a child, are taking a beating.
In some parts of the country, the housing allowance for an E-4 will do you
pretty well, Norfolk comes to mind, but in other parts of the country, and
in many places where the Coast Guard seems to be, the housing allowance
won't buy squat.  My junior folks have to live in a Barracks too, and none
of us like it.  Everybody is entitled to their own opinion, that is what
makes this country great!!  But the military in general, and this includes
the Navy and the Coast Guard, are having a hard time keeping enlisted folks
in the Service, they are getting trained and often seeking higher paying
jobs elsewhere.  If they were living the life of luxury you describe, they
wouldn't be voting with their feet.
 
My seamen right out of bootcamp in Mobile, Alabama, don't do much cleaning
of toilets, most of them are assigned to smallboat stations or patrol boats
where they go out in miserable weather to rescue people.  Those guys that
went out on Tuesday morning were all aged 18-22, half of them Seamen, they
battled 8-15 foot seas, 20 miles offshore, rescued 20 people in the water
and came back, all from two 41 foot utility boats, both boats over 35 years
old, that ride miserably in heavy weather.  Those guys are heros, and their
environment is every bit as dangerous as a flight deck (and yes, I've seen
both), all without Seapay or Flight Deck pay.  I recently came out of the
Pentagon, where I served with the Navy, you guys have a wonderful propaganda
machine, trained professionals all doing an impressive job, but you
shouldn't really believe all of it, and you as a Journalist Second Class,
should know better.
  
BTW - I've got quite a few years serving with the Navy, including serving as
Navigator on USS HORNE (CG-30) back before AEGIS, and you should be thankful
there are real sailors to come get you when the weather gets bad.  :^)))
(joke)

If you care to debate this futher, we should go offline, I doubt most folks
here care much about this.  
 
Coastie Bob
'74 Midget
'90 944S2

-----Original Message-----
From b-evans at earthlink.net [mailto:b-evans@earthlink.net]
Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2002 6:03 PM
To: Mueller, Robert CDR
Cc: 'Larry Dickstein'; 'Bree Anna'; 'spridgets@autox.team.net'
Subject: Re: Contesting Militart Raise ABSOLUTELY NO LBC, nada, none!



The fact that our younger troops don't make much money certainly is true.

It most certainly is not!  It is just another one of those myths that has
taken on the stature of a sacred cow;  yet another urban legend.  As a
member of the military, albeit Ankle Deep Navy, you of all people should
know.   As a 34-year old  O-5, or commander, with only 10 years of service,
your basic pay of $57,762 a year would be boosted by housing and subsistence
allowances of $26,968, and tax and FICA advantages of $12,463.  That's
$97,193, and is pretty serious money.  And that is not even counting the
Special Pays (sea duty, combat pay, command responsibilty, etc.) that can
boost a commander's earnings by at least $10,000. 

But "younger" troops?  Well, let's see.  A seaman, right out of boot camp
with no specialized training, gets a basic package worth $43,746.  And that
does not include any Special Pays such as sea duty, flight deck pay, etc.
It does include the value of the seaman's apartment at $17,940.
("Apartment"?  Really a palace compared to my 80-man barracks.) 


While on the subject of military pay, it should be made clear that the
military pay scale is a "one size fits all" situation.  Although relatively
few are placed in harm's way, a commander at Great Lakes gets the same basic
salary and benefits as a commander flying combat air strikes.  The 17-year
old seaman cleaning heads (toilets) at a Coast Guard Station in Mobile,
Alabama,   gets the same bsic salary and benefits as the kid working the
flight deck where cables can whipsaw about. 


Now, for those who would like to have a better understanding of military
pay, take a look at  http://www.staynavy.navy.mil/
<http://www.staynavy.navy.mil/>   or  http://web.mit.edu/ssp/db21/GIs.html
<http://web.mit.edu/ssp/db21/GIs.html>  . 


Bob Evans 
xJO2 (E-5) USN 

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