Subject: Re: [Healeys] 2 weber 45 questions

From: Dave Murphy <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 2013 00:50:59 -0500

Just curious as may be many others as to what all the numbers mean on a Weber
DCOE carburetor. I thought I understood them a little, but now I'm really
confused!
I thought 45 was the throat diameter in millimeters, but are we to understand
that the choke is really 36 mm? Then what is 45? And to what does the 16 or 13
refer?
-Dave Murphy, Dearborn MI, '66 BJ8

> Is there or was there ever a Weber 45 dcoe 16? "16"....not 13? I have a
> fellow on eBay who said that he had a pair of 45DCOE "15"s. I contacted
him;
> he came back and said "oops I meant "13"s". Now he's emailed me and said he
> has one "13" and one "16". Maybe there was a 40 DCOE 16 and he's got the
> wrong top cover.....

> I'm going to meet a guy tomorrow to look at some Weber stuff. We're talking
> DCOE 45s here....are all 36mm chokes the same? Yes, they may all be 36mm,
> but, if I buy 3 chokes out of his bits and bobs drawer, will I find it a
> battle to find more identical 36mm chokes?
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From: Richard Ewald <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2013 22:03:32 -0800

I'm not a super expert, but here goes
45 is the bore size. Different sized chokes are fitted depending on the
application. In general the smaller the choke the better the low end, the
bigger the better the top end.
The -XX has to do with the original equipment application for that carb.
A -XX might have been set up for Rolls Canhardly (rolls down one hill, can
hardly make it up the next) do all of the jets, chokes, emulsion tubes are
right for that engine. If you are putting a -XX on you car some or all of the
calibrated parts will need changing.
Remember high school algebra where you had trouble solving with 2 variables?
With a DCOE you have 7. Have fun.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Dec 28, 2013, at 21:50, Dave Murphy <[email-masked]> wrote:
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From: Derek Job <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 2013 11:30:43 +0000

Richard,

That is pretty much it in a nutshell.

My 45DCOE 9s came with a 'standard' package of jets and tubes that are
considered reasonable for Healeys and probably jags as well. Only one item
needed to be changed after set up on the rolling road, that was the idle Jet.
I have not yet found a source that lists all of the Weber categories and sub
categories of the models that were and are available. Nobody seems to be able
to properly explain the numbering systems. The only real 'known' is the
pre-fix number which is the choke size.

I suspect that you could probably fit any 45 DCOE to a Healey, but you would
most likely have to change a lot of the jets and tubes depending on exactly
which model 45DCOE you have acquired.

Derek

>> battle to find more identical 36mm chokes?
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From: "Simon Lachlan" <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 2013 12:43:49 -0000

A huge amount of research, questioning and resultant confusion has yielded
me a few certainties. And a lot of confusion which I happily share with you,
below....
Forget chokes....they are interchangeable within carbs of the same size as
are most of the other parts...jets, springs etc.
The only thing that seems to really put the cat among the pigeons is this
business of "progression holes". Weber installations seem to tend towards a
built in flat spot as the accelerator pushes the carb from its choke inlets
to its main flow. How and where and when this dreaded flat spot occurs is
dependent on one's type of engine (twin cam?) or one's camshaft &/or
ignition. People (often apparently with the wrong carbs in the wrong car)
seem to cure the flatspot by opening up one of the settings - I forget which
- and thus overcoming the issue with a flood of petrol. The "progression
holes", which each allow in a small amount of extra fuel, are exposed and
come into effect "progressively" (Geddit now?) as the carbs' butterflies
open. This fuel, allowed in by one, then two, then three etcetc holes, cures
the flatspot. Some peoples' triple Webers seem to yield a perfectly sensible
mpg whilst others' are pretty horrific. It's my guess that a lot of this
results from the having to overcome the flatspot area with buckets of fuel.
So, a 9 will have different holes from a 13. (Bigger, smaller, more or
less...I'm not sure). You can make all the interchangeable variable parts
inside the same, but if one of yr carbs has different holes from yr other
carbs, you're in trouble.
Vehicle manufacturers got together with Weber and chose the right carbs for
their vehicles' specs. Some of the newer 45s appear to have been just plain
wrong in the cars into which they were sold by tuners/the aftermarket. Weber
45 152s when put into Alphas and, I suppose, hot VWs had a massive flatspot
problem. (A twincam issue here). People drilled in "progression holes" until
- surprise - Weber came up with the 45 152G which had the factory's
progression holes drilled per the amateur tuners' drilling efforts etcetc.
The "G" apparently stands for "German"!?!
Enough. I'm still without any Webers but am leaning, no pun intended,
towards 9s.
Happy New Year
Simon

-----Original Message-----
From: Derek Job [mailto:[email-masked]] 
Sent: 29 December 2013 11:31
To: Dave Murphy
Cc: Simon Lachlan; healeys @autox.team.net
Subject: Re: [Healeys] 2 weber 45 questions

Richard, 

My 45DCOE 9s came with a 'standard' package of jets and tubes that are
considered reasonable for Healeys and probably jags as well. Only one item
needed to be changed after set up on the rolling road, that was the idle
Jet. I have not yet found a source that lists all of the Weber categories
and sub categories of the models that were and are available. Nobody seems
to be able to properly explain the numbering systems. The only real 'known'
is the pre-fix number which is the choke size.

Derek
On 29 Dec 2013, at 05:50, Dave Murphy <[email-masked]> wrote:

> Just curious as may be many others as to what all the numbers mean on 
> a Weber DCOE carburetor. I thought I understood them a little, but now 
> I'm really confused!
> I thought 45 was the throat diameter in millimeters, but are we to 
> understand that the choke is really 36 mm? Then what is 45? And to 
> what does the 16 or 13 refer?
>> Is there or was there ever a Weber 45 dcoe 16? "16"....not 13? I have 
>> a fellow on eBay who said that he had a pair of 45DCOE "15"s. I 
>> contacted
> him;
>> he came back and said "oops I meant "13"s". Now he's emailed me and 
>> said he has one "13" and one "16". Maybe there was a 40 DCOE 16 and 
>> he's got the wrong top cover.....
> 
>> I'm going to meet a guy tomorrow to look at some Weber stuff. We're 
>> talking DCOE 45s here....are all 36mm chokes the same? Yes, they may 
>> all be 36mm, but, if I buy 3 chokes out of his bits and bobs drawer, 
>> will I find it a battle to find more identical 36mm chokes?
> Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Suggested annual 
> donation  $12.75

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From: "John Rowe" <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 2013 08:14:55 +1000

Simon
I think you've just about nailed it. I would tend to lean towards the 152G
if I was silly enough to go again but I would like to know where the
progression holes were first. If I can work out how to I would send you a
diagram but suffice to say the 4th hole is about 1/8" closer to the manifold
than the cluster of the other 3 so that it is just passed by the butterfly
as it opens. 
There is a person in Australia who trades as weberperformance.com.au who
sells genuine Weber parts for very reasonable prices (eg emulsion tubes $20
verses another importer $70-don't ask how I know).He states that he now only
sells the 152G (as well as 9's) because it seems to have overcome all the
problems.
Cheers
John Rowe
Qld Australia

-----Original Message-----
From: [email-masked] [mailto:[email-masked]]
On Behalf Of Simon Lachlan
Sent: Sunday, 29 December 2013 10:44 PM
To: 'healeys @autox.team.net'
Subject: Re: [Healeys] 2 weber 45 questions

[email-masked]

---

From: Derek Job <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 2013 09:34:16 +0000

Simon

Just to clarify. The chokes are not interchangeable, they are fixed for each
model. It is the ventures inside the chokes that can be changed to suit your
application.

Derek

[email-masked]

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From: Chris Dimmock <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 2013 21:07:35 +1100

Hi Derek,
Maybe it's a naming convention issue, but 45DCOE can have 28mm to 40mm
"chokes" or "main Venturi" See here
http://www.weberperformance.com.au/product_info.php?cPath=6_13&products_id=19
&osCsid=2pvi844ntjkpthi41u1puarho7
Best
Chris
Sent from my iPhone

> On 30 Dec 2013, at 8:34 pm, Derek Job <[email-masked]> wrote:
>
> Simon
>
>> their vehicles' spec

[email-masked]

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From: Richard Ewald <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 2013 09:04:14 -0800

Pedantic much?  If you are going to be pedantic at least get the name
right.  They are venturis not ventures.  They are commonly called chokes.

[email-masked]