Subject: Re: [Healeys] Spark/no spark condition

From: Bob Spidell <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 9 Sep 2014 21:55:11 +0000 (UTC)

Working from (sometimes faulty) memory, the white wire with black tracer usually goes to the cutoff switch in the boot. In the 'OFF' position, the white/black wire grounds the coil on a points system; when I installed a Pertronix I switched the wire and used it to supply +VE to the Pertronix (in the off position the Ignitor gets no juice). 

Anyway, if the wire is making intermittent contact could be your problem. I don't have the workshop manual with me, but I believe it shows the white/black wire going to the cutoff switch. 

Bob 

----- Original Message -----

I am stumped. 

First the basics. 1963 BJ7. Changed to negative ground 30 years ago. 
Changed to an alternator 30 years ago. Installed Pertronix ignition many 
years ago, red wire to the + post of the coil, the black wire to the - post 
of the coil. The + coil post has the white wire from the battery cutoff 
switch and the switch is on. Plug wires are tight and the coil wire is 
firmly connected to the coil and the cap. Interior of the cap is clean of 
carbon. 

Here is the problem: on # 1 plug, sometimes I get spark but most of the 
time I do not. I checked all of the plug wires and the results are the 
same. Some times spark, usually none. 

Also, a puzzler, there is a yellow (could be originally white?) wire with a 
black tracer and the wire is just hanging loose below the distributor, the 
coil, the horn and the alternator. There are no missing connections that I 
can see. The loose wire has a black rectangular plastic push on connector 
on it. My 11" x 17" color wiring diagram does not show this wire or any 
other yellow (white?) wire with a black tracer. 

Anyone have ideas on the no spark/sometime spark issue? Where does the 
loose yellow/black wire go? What else do I need to check? 

Thanks, 

Fred 
_______________________________________________ 
_______________________________________________
Archive: http://www.team.net/archive

[email-masked]
http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/healeys

---

From: "Earl Kagna" <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 9 Sep 2014 15:23:08 -0700

Fred:

The original set up had the white / black wire from the battery master 
switch to the coil, and then a short jumper to the distributor.  It's 
purpose as Bob said was to ground the ignition with the battery master 
switch in the off position so that the engine could not continue to run on 
the generator.  (Thanks to the late Norman Nock for explaining that to me). 
If you have a white / black wire still connected to the coil, it will 
continue to perform that function with the Pertronix ignition.  In this 
case, if the hanging wire is not insulated, it can ground the ignition if it 
touches any metal surface.  It's more likely that the distributor jumper is 
gone, so there would be no effect from the hanging wire - ignore it.

First thing I would do is replace the rotor.  If no luck, the coil is 
suspect.  Pertronix is likely all the way on or all the way off, like most 
electronic things they don't seem to fail intermittently, but you never 
know.  It's also possible that the cap is bad - maybe in the area of the 
centre electrode - they can look good and still give trouble.

Let us know what happens

Earl Kagna
Victoria, B.C.
BJ8, BT7 tri-carb

-----Original Message----- 
From: Fred Wescoe
Sent: Tuesday, September 09, 2014 2:26 PM
To: healeys
Subject: [Healeys] Spark/no spark condition

I am stumped.

Thanks,

Fred

[email-masked]

---

From: Graeme Lowden <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2014 20:56:16 -0500

I had the same trouble Fred,  I have been running Petronix since 2010 
with no troubles then all of a sudden intermittent spark, fought with it 
for quite a while.  I wanted to be able to drive so I put back a set of 
points (an old set).  Problem solved but then after a bit it quit 
again.  This time it was the condenser, changed same and all has been 
fine for the last month.

Graeme Lowden
BT7 Tri-carb
near Winnipeg

[email-masked]

---

From: Michael Salter <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 9 Sep 2014 22:06:07 -0400

Before you go any further check the ignition primary circuit.
Put a test light on the coil +ve (the one that goes to the distributor) and
check that the coil is being switched off and on reliably by the Petronixs
as the engine is cranked over.
If the primary is operating as it should then look at the secondary (high
voltage) side.

Michael S
BN1 #174

On Tue, Sep 9, 2014 at 9:56 PM, Graeme Lowden <[email-masked]>
wrote:

> I had the same trouble Fred,  I have been running Petronix since 2010 with
> no troubles then all of a sudden intermittent spark, fought with it for
> quite a while.  I wanted to be able to drive so I put back a set of points
> (an old set).  Problem solved but then after a bit it quit again.  This
> time it was the condenser, changed same and all has been fine for the last
> month.
>
> Graeme Lowden
> BT7 Tri-carb
> near Winnipeg
>
> Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.75
> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
>
> [email-masked]
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/
> options/healeys/[email-masked]

[email-masked]

---

From: Richard Ewald <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 9 Sep 2014 20:37:28 -0700

I'm going to go with a combination of issues.
I doubt it is the electronic ignition unit.  I think the issue is in the
secondary ignition.
Electricity is lazy, it will always take the easiest path to ground.  I
suspect that the the #1 secondary circuit has a bit more resistance than
it  takes to fire the spark to ground.  So if it takes 10KV fire the #1
plug, but the rotor is defective (or the cap is cracked, or the wire has a
burned spot, or the plug is bad,or there is an internal engine issue) and
the ignition can fire to ground with only 9KV, you get a misfire.
It is not uncommon to have a car that idles fine, but when you open the
throttle suddenly the car drops a cylinder.  That is because when you open
the throttle the cylinder pressure goes up, way up and the ignition system
must supply more voltage to fire the plug successfully.
A typical engine takes 8-9 KV to fire a plug at idle
Bang the throttle open and it takes 14-15KV to fire the plug
If something is leaking and will fire to ground at say 11KV anytime it
takes more than 11KV to fire the plug, the system will misfire.
Band aid solution:  Replace the plug, the ignition wire, and the cap, and
the rotor this will probably fix the issue.
Permanent solution:find where it is firing to ground, if you don't find
anything put a good rotor in the car.
If I had your car and an ignition scope, I could nail this in less than 5
minutes.  This of course would be followed by a test drive of not less than
30 minutes to verify repairs.
Rick

On Tue, Sep 9, 2014 at 7:06 PM, Michael Salter <[email-masked]>
wrote:

> with
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/healeys/[email-masked]

[email-masked]