Subject: Re: [Healeys] BJ8 Brakes

From: David Porter <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 2 Jul 2016 15:26:14 -0600

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This is often when the rear wheel pistons have to move too far to 
contact the drum on the first pedal push.. Check that your rear shoes 
are not worn or not properly adjusted.

daveP

On 7/2/2016 12:48 PM, Roger Grace wrote:
>
> At my wits end with this problem ...
>
> The brakes on my BJ8 have always been hard and bit well with little 
> pedal movement.
>
> Changed out the front callipers (to 4 pot) and the problems started.
>
> After repeated bleeding on first push,pedal went to the floor.
>
> After 2/3 pumps the pedal came right up and held.After about 30 secs 
> of no pressure on pedal goes to the floor again.
>
> Pistons are all in contact with pads and pads with disc; all looks 
> good at callipers.
>
> Suspecting a faulty MC changed it out.
>
> Primed the new MC with fluid prior to installing.
>
> Same story after another 1.5 pints of DOT 4 fluid focusing mainly on 
> bleeding front callipers and booster (new); also bled rear drums.
>
> Pedal still goes to the floor on first pump and comes up after pumping 
> as before.
>
> No visible leaks and inlet from reservoir shows no leaks: tapped 
> callipers with mallet to dislodge any air pockets.
>
> I am using the one man bleed system a with clear tube into a container 
> and close the bleeder valve with no visible air at nipple and full 
> tube of fluid to container. BTW also changed clutch MC at same time 
> and no problems with bleeding etc.
>
> Have now run about 1.5 pints of fluid through the new MC - perhaps am 
> being too impatient ?
>
> But no evidence of any air after about 0.5 pint. Typically how much 
> fluid is required to clear air from MC and lines ?
>
> Now sort or suspecting the inlet to MC from reservoir but for life of 
> me cannot see how air can get in with no visible fluid leaks,
>
> Any ideas from the more AH experienced listers appreciated.
>
> rg
>
>
>
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>

-- 
Dave Porter Porter Custom Bicycles 2909 Arno St. NE Albuquerque, NM 
87107 505-352-1378 Go HERE: my world www.porterbikes.com/

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    <p>This is often when the rear wheel pistons have to move too far to
      contact the drum on the first pedal push.. Check that your rear
      shoes are not worn or not properly adjusted.</p>
    <p>daveP<br>
    </p>
    <br>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 7/2/2016 12:48 PM, Roger Grace
      wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote
      cite="mid:C45997DD4B7440B4B3E0A3BEBDF34E5D@WINDOWST93OFP9"
      type="cite">
      <div dir="ltr">
        <div style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Comic Sans MS';
          COLOR: #000000">
          <p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 6pt; LINE-HEIGHT:
            13pt"><font face="Calibri"><font style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt">At
                my wits end with this problem <span
                  style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </span>...</font></font></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 6pt; LINE-HEIGHT:
            13pt"><font face="Calibri"><font style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt">The
                brakes on my BJ8 have always been hard and bit well with
                little pedal movement.</font></font></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 6pt; LINE-HEIGHT:
            13pt"><font face="Calibri"><font style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt">Changed
                <span style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </span>out the front
                callipers (to 4 pot) and the problems started.</font></font></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 6pt; LINE-HEIGHT:
            13pt"><font face="Calibri"><font style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt">After
                repeated bleeding on first push,<span
                  style="mso-spacerun: yes">  </span>pedal went to the
                floor.</font></font></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 6pt; LINE-HEIGHT:
            13pt"><font face="Calibri"><font style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt">After
                2/3 pumps the pedal came right up and held.<span
                  style="mso-spacerun: yes">  </span>After about 30
                secs of no pressure on pedal <span style="mso-spacerun:
                  yes"> </span>goes to the floor again.</font></font></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 6pt; LINE-HEIGHT:
            13pt"><font face="Calibri"><font style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt">Pistons
                are all in contact with pads and pads with disc; all
                looks good at callipers.</font></font></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 6pt; LINE-HEIGHT:
            13pt"><font face="Calibri"><font style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt">Suspecting
                a faulty MC changed it out.</font></font></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 6pt; LINE-HEIGHT:
            13pt"><font face="Calibri"><font style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt">Primed
                the new MC with fluid prior to installing.</font></font></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 6pt; LINE-HEIGHT:
            13pt"><font face="Calibri"><font style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt">Same
                story after another 1.5 pints of DOT 4 fluid focusing
                mainly on bleeding front callipers and booster (new); <span
                  style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </span>also bled rear
                drums.</font></font></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 6pt; LINE-HEIGHT:
            13pt"><font face="Calibri"><font style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt">Pedal
                still goes to the floor on first pump and comes up after
                pumping as before.</font></font></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 6pt; LINE-HEIGHT:
            13pt"><font face="Calibri"><font style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt">No
                visible leaks and inlet from reservoir shows no leaks:
                tapped callipers with mallet to dislodge any air
                pockets.</font></font></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 6pt; LINE-HEIGHT:
            13pt"><font face="Calibri"><font style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt">I
                am using the one man bleed system a with clear tube into
                a container and close the bleeder valve <span
                  style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </span>with no visible air
                at nipple and full tube of fluid to container. BTW also
                changed clutch MC at same time and no problems with
                bleeding etc.</font></font></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 6pt; LINE-HEIGHT:
            13pt"><font face="Calibri"><font style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt">Have
                now run about 1.5 pints of fluid through the new MC - <span
                  style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </span>perhaps am being <span
                  style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </span>too impatient ? </font><span
                style="mso-spacerun: yes"><font style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt"> </font></span></font></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 6pt; LINE-HEIGHT:
            13pt"><font face="Calibri"><font style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt">But
                no evidence of any air after about 0.5 pint. Typically
                how much fluid is required to clear air from MC and
                lines ?</font></font></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 6pt; LINE-HEIGHT:
            13pt"><font face="Calibri"><font style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt">Now
                sort or suspecting the inlet to MC from reservoir but
                for life of me cannot see how air can get in with no
                visible fluid leaks,</font></font></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 6pt; LINE-HEIGHT:
            13pt"><font face="Calibri"><font style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt">Any
                ideas from the more AH experienced listers appreciated.</font></font></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 6pt; LINE-HEIGHT:
            13pt"><font face="Calibri"><font style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt">rg</font></font></p>
        </div>
      </div>
      <br>
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</pre>
    </blockquote>
    <br>
    <div class="moz-signature">-- <br>
      Dave Porter
      Porter Custom Bicycles
      2909 Arno St. NE
      Albuquerque, NM 87107
      505-352-1378
      Go HERE: my world <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.porterbikes.com/">www.porterbikes.com/</a>
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From: Oudesluys <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 2 Jul 2016 23:51:46 +0200

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Use Eesybleed on MC or vacuum pump at bleed nippels.

Kees Oudesluijs

Op 2-7-2016 om 20:48 schreef Roger Grace:
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/healeys/[email-masked]
>

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    <div class="moz-cite-prefix"><br>
      Use Eesybleed on MC or vacuum pump at bleed nippels.<br>
      <br>
      Kees Oudesluijs<br>
      <br>
      <br>
      <br>
      Op 2-7-2016 om 20:48 schreef Roger Grace:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote
      cite="mid:C45997DD4B7440B4B3E0A3BEBDF34E5D@WINDOWST93OFP9"
      type="cite">
      <meta http-equiv="Context-Type" content="text/html;
        charset=iso-8859-1">
      <div dir="ltr">
        <div>
          <p class="MsoNormal">At my wits end with this problem <span> </span>...</p>
          <p class="MsoNormal">The brakes on my BJ8 have always been
            hard and bit well with little pedal movement.</p>
          <p class="MsoNormal">Changed <span> </span>out the front
            callipers (to 4 pot) and the problems started.</p>
          <p class="MsoNormal">After repeated bleeding on first push,<span> 
            </span>pedal went to the floor.</p>
          <p class="MsoNormal">After 2/3 pumps the pedal came right up
            and held.<span>  </span>After about 30 secs of no pressure
            on pedal <span> </span>goes to the floor again.</p>
          <p class="MsoNormal">Pistons are all in contact with pads and
            pads with disc; all looks good at callipers.</p>
          <p class="MsoNormal">Suspecting a faulty MC changed it out.</p>
          <p class="MsoNormal">Primed the new MC with fluid prior to
            installing.</p>
          <p class="MsoNormal">Same story after another 1.5 pints of DOT
            4 fluid focusing mainly on bleeding front callipers and
            booster (new); <span> </span>also bled rear drums.</p>
          <p class="MsoNormal">Pedal still goes to the floor on first
            pump and comes up after pumping as before.</p>
          <p class="MsoNormal">No visible leaks and inlet from reservoir
            shows no leaks: tapped callipers with mallet to dislodge any
            air pockets.</p>
          <p class="MsoNormal">I am using the one man bleed system a
            with clear tube into a container and close the bleeder valve
            <span> </span>with no visible air at nipple and full tube of
            fluid to container. BTW also changed clutch MC at same time
            and no problems with bleeding etc.</p>
          <p class="MsoNormal">Have now run about 1.5 pints of fluid
            through the new MC - <span> </span>perhaps am being <span> </span>too
            impatient ? <span> </span></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal">But no evidence of any air after about
            0.5 pint. Typically how much fluid is required to clear air
            from MC and lines ?</p>
          <p class="MsoNormal">Now sort or suspecting the inlet to MC
            from reservoir but for life of me cannot see how air can get
            in with no visible fluid leaks,</p>
          <p class="MsoNormal">Any ideas from the more AH experienced
            listers appreciated.</p>
          <p class="MsoNormal">rg</p>
        </div>
      </div>
      <br>
      <fieldset class="mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset>
      <br>
      <pre wrap="">_______________________________________________
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Forums: <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.team.net/forums">http://www.team.net/forums</a>

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[email-masked]

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From: "Roger Grace" <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 2 Jul 2016 15:29:45 -0700

To answer some of the suggestions - many TKX to all
Bleed nipple is at the top and only one bleed nipple.
Callipers are from AH Spares manufctured by BCC in UK; supposed to be a bolt
on conversion for AH.
Have just done another all round bleed starting LR; RR; LF; RF; booster;
still no change; ran another 12 oz of dot 4 through -  lines are getting a
good flush !
X Section area of the 4 pistons is almost exactly the same as standard 
callipers. So volume is the same for same movement.
Need to check rear brakes to see if shoes are properly adjusted; however was 
fine before and they were just dragging last time I adjusted them.
Will report back.
May change bleeding technique as have one of those vacuum pump but need to 
get it working properly.
Tkx
rg

-----Original Message----- 
From: Richard J. Hockert
Sent: Saturday, July 2, 2016 2:21 PM
To: Roger Grace
Subject: Re: [Healeys] BJ8 Brakes

Four piston disc brakes are difficult to bleed.

Your symptoms suggest that air still remains in the brake lines.

Some four caliper brakes have two bleed ports, depends on maker. You will
need traditional two person bleed technique to eliminate all air pockets.
Run lots of fluid through system.

Best regards,
Jim

-----
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2015.0.6201 / Virus Database: 4613/12543 - Release Date: 07/02/16 

[email-masked]

---

From: "John Rowe" <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 3 Jul 2016 10:07:10 +1000

Roger
Walk away for 24 hours or so and give it a chance to settle down a bit. I do
this with difficult ones and I find it helps.
 John Rowe
Qld Australia

-----Original Message-----
From: Healeys [mailto:[email-masked]] On Behalf Of Roger
Grace
Sent: Sunday, 3 July 2016 8:30 AM
To: Richard J. Hockert
Cc: Sir Micheal Long; Healey List
Subject: Re: [Healeys] BJ8 Brakes

To answer some of the suggestions - many TKX to all Bleed nipple is at the
top and only one bleed nipple.

-----Original Message-----
From: Richard J. Hockert
Sent: Saturday, July 2, 2016 2:21 PM
To: Roger Grace
Subject: Re: [Healeys] BJ8 Brakes

Best regards,
Jim

-----

$12.75

[email-masked]

http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/healeys/[email-masked]

-----
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2016.0.7640 / Virus Database: 4613/12545 - Release Date: 07/02/16

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---

From: WILLIAM B LAWRENCE <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 3 Jul 2016 03:01:00 +0000

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	boundary="_000_DM3PR19MB0569DD5DD2171B374285DC6AA5270DM3PR19MB0569namp_"

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You still have air in the system. Keep bleeding. The reason the bakes pump =
up in 2 to 3 strokes is that at that point you have compressed the air enou=
gh to transmit force to the fluid.

Bill Lawrence

________________________________
From: Healeys <[email-masked]> on behalf of Roger Grace <ro=
[email-masked]>
Sent: Saturday, July 2, 2016 6:48 PM
To: Healey List
Subject: [Healeys] BJ8 Brakes

At my wits end with this problem  ...
The brakes on my BJ8 have always been hard and bit well with little pedal m=
ovement.
Changed  out the front callipers (to 4 pot) and the problems started.
After repeated bleeding on first push,  pedal went to the floor.
After 2/3 pumps the pedal came right up and held.  After about 30 secs of n=
o pressure on pedal  goes to the floor again.
Pistons are all in contact with pads and pads with disc; all looks good at =
callipers.
Suspecting a faulty MC changed it out.
Primed the new MC with fluid prior to installing.
Same story after another 1.5 pints of DOT 4 fluid focusing mainly on bleedi=
ng front callipers and booster (new);  also bled rear drums.
Pedal still goes to the floor on first pump and comes up after pumping as b=
efore.
No visible leaks and inlet from reservoir shows no leaks: tapped callipers =
with mallet to dislodge any air pockets.
I am using the one man bleed system a with clear tube into a container and =
close the bleeder valve  with no visible air at nipple and full tube of flu=
id to container. BTW also changed clutch MC at same time and no problems wi=
th bleeding etc.
Have now run about 1.5 pints of fluid through the new MC -  perhaps am bein=
g  too impatient ?
But no evidence of any air after about 0.5 pint. Typically how much fluid i=
s required to clear air from MC and lines ?
Now sort or suspecting the inlet to MC from reservoir but for life of me ca=
nnot see how air can get in with no visible fluid leaks,
Any ideas from the more AH experienced listers appreciated.
rg

--_000_DM3PR19MB0569DD5DD2171B374285DC6AA5270DM3PR19MB0569namp_
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<html>
<head>
<meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3Diso-8859-=
1">
<style type=3D"text/css" style=3D"display:none;"><!-- P {margin-top:0;margi=
n-bottom:0;} --></style>
</head>
<body dir=3D"ltr">
<div id=3D"divtagdefaultwrapper" style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:#000000;back=
ground-color:#FFFFFF;font-family:Calibri,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif;">
<p>You still have air in the system. Keep bleeding. The reason the bakes pu=
mp up in 2 to 3 strokes is that at that point you have compressed the air e=
nough to transmit force to the fluid.</p>
<p><br>
</p>
<p>Bill Lawrence</p>
<br>
<br>
<div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<hr tabindex=3D"-1" style=3D"display:inline-block; width:98%">
<div id=3D"divRplyFwdMsg" dir=3D"ltr"><font face=3D"Calibri, sans-serif" co=
lor=3D"#000000" style=3D"font-size:11pt"><b>From:</b> Healeys &lt;healeys-b=
[email-masked]&gt; on behalf of Roger Grace &lt;[email-masked]&g=
t;<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Saturday, July 2, 2016 6:48 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Healey List<br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Healeys] BJ8 Brakes</font>
<div>&nbsp;</div>
</div>
<div>
<div dir=3D"ltr">
<div style=3D"font-size:12pt; font-family:'Comic Sans MS'; color:#000000">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm 0cm 6pt; line-height:13pt"><font=
 face=3D"Calibri"><font style=3D"font-size:11pt">At my wits end with this p=
roblem
<span style=3D"">&nbsp;</span>...</font></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm 0cm 6pt; line-height:13pt"><font=
 face=3D"Calibri"><font style=3D"font-size:11pt">The brakes on my BJ8 have =
always been hard and bit well with little pedal movement.</font></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm 0cm 6pt; line-height:13pt"><font=
 face=3D"Calibri"><font style=3D"font-size:11pt">Changed
<span style=3D"">&nbsp;</span>out the front callipers (to 4 pot) and the pr=
oblems started.</font></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm 0cm 6pt; line-height:13pt"><font=
 face=3D"Calibri"><font style=3D"font-size:11pt">After repeated bleeding on=
 first push,<span style=3D"">&nbsp;
</span>pedal went to the floor.</font></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm 0cm 6pt; line-height:13pt"><font=
 face=3D"Calibri"><font style=3D"font-size:11pt">After 2/3 pumps the pedal =
came right up and held.<span style=3D"">&nbsp;
</span>After about 30 secs of no pressure on pedal <span style=3D"">&nbsp;<=
/span>goes to the floor again.</font></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm 0cm 6pt; line-height:13pt"><font=
 face=3D"Calibri"><font style=3D"font-size:11pt">Pistons are all in contact=
 with pads and pads with disc; all looks good at callipers.</font></font></=
p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm 0cm 6pt; line-height:13pt"><font=
 face=3D"Calibri"><font style=3D"font-size:11pt">Suspecting a faulty MC cha=
nged it out.</font></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm 0cm 6pt; line-height:13pt"><font=
 face=3D"Calibri"><font style=3D"font-size:11pt">Primed the new MC with flu=
id prior to installing.</font></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm 0cm 6pt; line-height:13pt"><font=
 face=3D"Calibri"><font style=3D"font-size:11pt">Same story after another 1=
.5 pints of DOT 4 fluid focusing mainly on bleeding front callipers and boo=
ster (new);
<span style=3D"">&nbsp;</span>also bled rear drums.</font></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm 0cm 6pt; line-height:13pt"><font=
 face=3D"Calibri"><font style=3D"font-size:11pt">Pedal still goes to the fl=
oor on first pump and comes up after pumping as before.</font></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm 0cm 6pt; line-height:13pt"><font=
 face=3D"Calibri"><font style=3D"font-size:11pt">No visible leaks and inlet=
 from reservoir shows no leaks: tapped callipers with mallet to dislodge an=
y air pockets.</font></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm 0cm 6pt; line-height:13pt"><font=
 face=3D"Calibri"><font style=3D"font-size:11pt">I am using the one man ble=
ed system a with clear tube into a container and close the bleeder valve
<span style=3D"">&nbsp;</span>with no visible air at nipple and full tube o=
f fluid to container. BTW also changed clutch MC at same time and no proble=
ms with bleeding etc.</font></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm 0cm 6pt; line-height:13pt"><font=
 face=3D"Calibri"><font style=3D"font-size:11pt">Have now run about 1.5 pin=
ts of fluid through the new MC -
<span style=3D"">&nbsp;</span>perhaps am being <span style=3D"">&nbsp;</spa=
n>too impatient ? </font>
<span style=3D""><font style=3D"font-size:11pt">&nbsp;</font></span></font>=
</p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm 0cm 6pt; line-height:13pt"><font=
 face=3D"Calibri"><font style=3D"font-size:11pt">But no evidence of any air=
 after about 0.5 pint. Typically how much fluid is required to clear air fr=
om MC and lines ?</font></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm 0cm 6pt; line-height:13pt"><font=
 face=3D"Calibri"><font style=3D"font-size:11pt">Now sort or suspecting the=
 inlet to MC from reservoir but for life of me cannot see how air can get i=
n with no visible fluid leaks,</font></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm 0cm 6pt; line-height:13pt"><font=
 face=3D"Calibri"><font style=3D"font-size:11pt">Any ideas from the more AH=
 experienced listers appreciated.</font></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin:0cm 0cm 6pt; line-height:13pt"><font=
 face=3D"Calibri"><font style=3D"font-size:11pt">rg</font></font></p>
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[email-masked]

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From: "Simon Lachlan" <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 3 Jul 2016 09:17:51 +0100 boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000A_01D1D50B.C7413130"

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Bleeding brakes can drive you crazy.

See the attached, from my BMC manual. It addresses the question rather
neatly, suggesting that air may be drawn in at the end of the downward push;
for example, the threads on the bleeders may be slightly worn.

The trick is to close the bleeder 100% before the downward stroke ie, most
important, while fluid is still coming out.

A device such as A Gunson's Eezibleed will mange that OK.

The pdf's first line may seem a little strange......it's a note addressed to
myself. The relevant paragraph is not in my pdf version of the manual for
some reason so I added it as a reminder.

Good luck,

Simon

From: Healeys [mailto:[email-masked]] On Behalf Of WILLIAM B
LAWRENCE
Sent: 03 July 2016 04:01
To: Healey List; Roger Grace
Subject: Re: [Healeys] BJ8 Brakes

You still have air in the system. Keep bleeding. The reason the bakes pump
up in 2 to 3 strokes is that at that point you have compressed the air
enough to transmit force to the fluid.

Bill Lawrence

  _____  

From: Healeys <[email-masked]> on behalf of Roger Grace
<[email-masked]>
Sent: Saturday, July 2, 2016 6:48 PM
To: Healey List
Subject: [Healeys] BJ8 Brakes 

The brakes on my BJ8 have always been hard and bit well with little pedal
movement.

After 2/3 pumps the pedal came right up and held.  After about 30 secs of no
pressure on pedal  goes to the floor again.

Pistons are all in contact with pads and pads with disc; all looks good at
callipers.

Pedal still goes to the floor on first pump and comes up after pumping as
before.

No visible leaks and inlet from reservoir shows no leaks: tapped callipers
with mallet to dislodge any air pockets.

I am using the one man bleed system a with clear tube into a container and
close the bleeder valve  with no visible air at nipple and full tube of
fluid to container. BTW also changed clutch MC at same time and no problems
with bleeding etc.

Have now run about 1.5 pints of fluid through the new MC -  perhaps am being
too impatient ?  

But no evidence of any air after about 0.5 pint. Typically how much fluid is
required to clear air from MC and lines ?

Now sort or suspecting the inlet to MC from reservoir but for life of me
cannot see how air can get in with no visible fluid leaks,

rg

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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=3DEN-GB link=3Dblue =
vlink=3Dpurple><div class=3DWordSection1><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>Bleeding brakes can drive you crazy.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>See the attached, from my BMC manual. It addresses the question =
rather neatly, suggesting that air may be drawn in at the end of the =
downward push; for example, the threads on the bleeders may be slightly =
worn.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>The trick is to close the bleeder 100% before the downward stroke ie, =
most important, while fluid is still coming out.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>A device such as A Gunson&#8217;s Eezibleed will mange that =
OK.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>The pdf&#8217;s first line may seem a little strange......it&#8217;s =
a note addressed to myself. The relevant paragraph is not in my pdf =
version of the manual for some reason so I added it as a =
reminder.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>Good luck,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>Simon<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><div><div =
style=3D'border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm'><p class=3DMsoNormal><b><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span>=
</b><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> Healeys =
[mailto:[email-masked]] <b>On Behalf Of </b>WILLIAM B =
LAWRENCE<br><b>Sent:</b> 03 July 2016 04:01<br><b>To:</b> Healey List; =
Roger Grace<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Healeys] BJ8 =
Brakes<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><div id=3Ddivtagdefaultwrapper><p =
style=3D'background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>You still have =
air in the system. Keep bleeding. The reason the bakes pump up in 2 to 3 =
strokes is that at that point you have compressed the air enough to =
transmit force to the fluid.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
style=3D'background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p=
></span></p><p style=3D'background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>Bill =
Lawrence<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p=
></span></p><div><div class=3DMsoNormal align=3Dcenter =
style=3D'text-align:center;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'><hr size=3D2 =
width=3D"98%" align=3Dcenter></span></div><div id=3DdivRplyFwdMsg><p =
class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'background:white'><b><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>From:</span></b><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
> Healeys &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]=
.net</a>&gt; on behalf of Roger Grace &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt;<br><b>Sent:=
</b> Saturday, July 2, 2016 6:48 PM<br><b>To:</b> Healey =
List<br><b>Subject:</b> [Healeys] BJ8 Brakes</span><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'> =
<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p=
></span></p></div></div><div><div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:6.0pt;line-height:13.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>At my wits end with this problem &nbsp;...</span><span =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:6.0pt;line-height:13.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>The brakes on my BJ8 have always been hard and bit well with little =
pedal movement.</span><span =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:6.0pt;line-height:13.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>Changed &nbsp;out the front callipers (to 4 pot) and the problems =
started.</span><span style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:6.0pt;line-height:13.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>After repeated bleeding on first push,&nbsp; pedal went to the =
floor.</span><span style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:6.0pt;line-height:13.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>After 2/3 pumps the pedal came right up and held.&nbsp; After about 30 =
secs of no pressure on pedal &nbsp;goes to the floor again.</span><span =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:6.0pt;line-height:13.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>Pistons are all in contact with pads and pads with disc; all looks good =
at callipers.</span><span style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:6.0pt;line-height:13.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>Suspecting a faulty MC changed it out.</span><span =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:6.0pt;line-height:13.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>Primed the new MC with fluid prior to installing.</span><span =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:6.0pt;line-height:13.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>Same story after another 1.5 pints of DOT 4 fluid focusing mainly on =
bleeding front callipers and booster (new); &nbsp;also bled rear =
drums.</span><span style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:6.0pt;line-height:13.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>Pedal still goes to the floor on first pump and comes up after pumping =
as before.</span><span style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:6.0pt;line-height:13.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>No visible leaks and inlet from reservoir shows no leaks: tapped =
callipers with mallet to dislodge any air pockets.</span><span =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:6.0pt;line-height:13.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>I am using the one man bleed system a with clear tube into a container =
and close the bleeder valve &nbsp;with no visible air at nipple and full =
tube of fluid to container. BTW also changed clutch MC at same time and =
no problems with bleeding etc.</span><span =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:6.0pt;line-height:13.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>Have now run about 1.5 pints of fluid through the new MC - =
&nbsp;perhaps am being &nbsp;too impatient ? &nbsp;</span><span =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:6.0pt;line-height:13.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>But no evidence of any air after about 0.5 pint. Typically how much =
fluid is required to clear air from MC and lines ?</span><span =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:6.0pt;line-height:13.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>Now sort or suspecting the inlet to MC from reservoir but for life of =
me cannot see how air can get in with no visible fluid =
leaks,</span><span style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:6.0pt;line-height:13.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>Any ideas from the more AH experienced listers appreciated.</span><span =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:6.0pt;line-height:13.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>rg</span><span =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div=
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