Subject: [Healeys] FW: BJ8 Brakes

From: "Simon Lachlan" <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 3 Jul 2016 10:01:55 +0100 boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0019_01D1D511.EEB86FC0"

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Meant to be:

The trick is to close the bleeder 100% before the downward stroke IS
FINISHED  ie, most important, while fluid is still coming out.

Simon

From: Healeys [mailto:[email-masked]] On Behalf Of Simon
Lachlan
Sent: 03 July 2016 09:18
To: 'Healey List'; 'Roger Grace'
Subject: Re: [Healeys] BJ8 Brakes

Bleeding brakes can drive you crazy.

See the attached, from my BMC manual. It addresses the question rather
neatly, suggesting that air may be drawn in at the end of the downward push;
for example, the threads on the bleeders may be slightly worn.

The trick is to close the bleeder 100% before the downward stroke ie, most
important, while fluid is still coming out.

A device such as A Gunson's Eezibleed will mange that OK.

The pdf's first line may seem a little strange......it's a note addressed to
myself. The relevant paragraph is not in my pdf version of the manual for
some reason so I added it as a reminder.

Good luck,

Simon

From: Healeys [mailto:[email-masked]] On Behalf Of WILLIAM B
LAWRENCE
Sent: 03 July 2016 04:01
To: Healey List; Roger Grace
Subject: Re: [Healeys] BJ8 Brakes

You still have air in the system. Keep bleeding. The reason the bakes pump
up in 2 to 3 strokes is that at that point you have compressed the air
enough to transmit force to the fluid.

Bill Lawrence

  _____  

From: Healeys <[email-masked]> on behalf of Roger Grace
<[email-masked]>
Sent: Saturday, July 2, 2016 6:48 PM
To: Healey List
Subject: [Healeys] BJ8 Brakes 

At my wits end with this problem  ...

The brakes on my BJ8 have always been hard and bit well with little pedal
movement.

Changed  out the front callipers (to 4 pot) and the problems started.

After repeated bleeding on first push,  pedal went to the floor.

After 2/3 pumps the pedal came right up and held.  After about 30 secs of no
pressure on pedal  goes to the floor again.

Pistons are all in contact with pads and pads with disc; all looks good at
callipers.

Suspecting a faulty MC changed it out.

Primed the new MC with fluid prior to installing.

Same story after another 1.5 pints of DOT 4 fluid focusing mainly on
bleeding front callipers and booster (new);  also bled rear drums.

Pedal still goes to the floor on first pump and comes up after pumping as
before.

No visible leaks and inlet from reservoir shows no leaks: tapped callipers
with mallet to dislodge any air pockets.

I am using the one man bleed system a with clear tube into a container and
close the bleeder valve  with no visible air at nipple and full tube of
fluid to container. BTW also changed clutch MC at same time and no problems
with bleeding etc.

Have now run about 1.5 pints of fluid through the new MC -  perhaps am being
too impatient ?  

But no evidence of any air after about 0.5 pint. Typically how much fluid is
required to clear air from MC and lines ?

Now sort or suspecting the inlet to MC from reservoir but for life of me
cannot see how air can get in with no visible fluid leaks,

Any ideas from the more AH experienced listers appreciated.

rg

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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=3DEN-GB link=3Dblue =
vlink=3Dpurple><div class=3DWordSection1><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>Meant to be:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>The trick is to close the bleeder 100% before the downward stroke IS =
FINISHED &nbsp;ie, most important, while fluid is still coming =
out.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>Simon<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><div><div =
style=3D'border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm'><p class=3DMsoNormal><b><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span>=
</b><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> Healeys =
[mailto:[email-masked]] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Simon =
Lachlan<br><b>Sent:</b> 03 July 2016 09:18<br><b>To:</b> 'Healey List'; =
'Roger Grace'<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Healeys] BJ8 =
Brakes<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>Bleeding brakes can drive you crazy.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>See the attached, from my BMC manual. It addresses the question =
rather neatly, suggesting that air may be drawn in at the end of the =
downward push; for example, the threads on the bleeders may be slightly =
worn.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>The trick is to close the bleeder 100% before the downward stroke ie, =
most important, while fluid is still coming out.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>A device such as A Gunson&#8217;s Eezibleed will mange that =
OK.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>The pdf&#8217;s first line may seem a little strange......it&#8217;s =
a note addressed to myself. The relevant paragraph is not in my pdf =
version of the manual for some reason so I added it as a =
reminder.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>Good luck,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>Simon<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><div><div =
style=3D'border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm'><p class=3DMsoNormal><b><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span>=
</b><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> Healeys =
[<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">mailto:healeys-bounces@aut=
ox.team.net</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b>WILLIAM B LAWRENCE<br><b>Sent:</b> =
03 July 2016 04:01<br><b>To:</b> Healey List; Roger =
Grace<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Healeys] BJ8 =
Brakes<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><div id=3Ddivtagdefaultwrapper><p =
style=3D'background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>You still have =
air in the system. Keep bleeding. The reason the bakes pump up in 2 to 3 =
strokes is that at that point you have compressed the air enough to =
transmit force to the fluid.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
style=3D'background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p=
></span></p><p style=3D'background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>Bill =
Lawrence<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p=
></span></p><div><div class=3DMsoNormal align=3Dcenter =
style=3D'text-align:center;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'><hr size=3D2 =
width=3D"98%" align=3Dcenter></span></div><div id=3DdivRplyFwdMsg><p =
class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'background:white'><b><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>From:</span></b><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
> Healeys &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]=
.net</a>&gt; on behalf of Roger Grace &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt;<br><b>Sent:=
</b> Saturday, July 2, 2016 6:48 PM<br><b>To:</b> Healey =
List<br><b>Subject:</b> [Healeys] BJ8 Brakes</span><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'> =
<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p=
></span></p></div></div><div><div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:6.0pt;line-height:13.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>At my wits end with this problem &nbsp;...</span><span =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:6.0pt;line-height:13.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>The brakes on my BJ8 have always been hard and bit well with little =
pedal movement.</span><span =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:6.0pt;line-height:13.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>Changed &nbsp;out the front callipers (to 4 pot) and the problems =
started.</span><span style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:6.0pt;line-height:13.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>After repeated bleeding on first push,&nbsp; pedal went to the =
floor.</span><span style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:6.0pt;line-height:13.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>After 2/3 pumps the pedal came right up and held.&nbsp; After about 30 =
secs of no pressure on pedal &nbsp;goes to the floor again.</span><span =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:6.0pt;line-height:13.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>Pistons are all in contact with pads and pads with disc; all looks good =
at callipers.</span><span style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:6.0pt;line-height:13.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>Suspecting a faulty MC changed it out.</span><span =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:6.0pt;line-height:13.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>Primed the new MC with fluid prior to installing.</span><span =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:6.0pt;line-height:13.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>Same story after another 1.5 pints of DOT 4 fluid focusing mainly on =
bleeding front callipers and booster (new); &nbsp;also bled rear =
drums.</span><span style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:6.0pt;line-height:13.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>Pedal still goes to the floor on first pump and comes up after pumping =
as before.</span><span style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:6.0pt;line-height:13.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>No visible leaks and inlet from reservoir shows no leaks: tapped =
callipers with mallet to dislodge any air pockets.</span><span =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:6.0pt;line-height:13.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>I am using the one man bleed system a with clear tube into a container =
and close the bleeder valve &nbsp;with no visible air at nipple and full =
tube of fluid to container. BTW also changed clutch MC at same time and =
no problems with bleeding etc.</span><span =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:6.0pt;line-height:13.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>Have now run about 1.5 pints of fluid through the new MC - =
&nbsp;perhaps am being &nbsp;too impatient ? &nbsp;</span><span =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:6.0pt;line-height:13.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>But no evidence of any air after about 0.5 pint. Typically how much =
fluid is required to clear air from MC and lines ?</span><span =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:6.0pt;line-height:13.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>Now sort or suspecting the inlet to MC from reservoir but for life of =
me cannot see how air can get in with no visible fluid =
leaks,</span><span style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:6.0pt;line-height:13.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>Any ideas from the more AH experienced listers appreciated.</span><span =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:6.0pt;line-height:13.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>rg</span><span =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div=
></div></body></html>
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