From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 1 07:44:16 2009 From: Dan DiBiase To: Glenn Schnittke , Date: Mon, 1 Jun 2009 06:43:57 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Mgs] Who'da thunk it was so easy!!! Well, it WAS a lot easier back then.....! Good video.... Dan D Central NJ USA '76 MGB Tourer '65 MGB Tourer (Project) NAMGBR #5-2328 http://dans65b.blogspot.com/ http://dans76b.blogspot.com/ http://dansautoblog.blogspot.com/ http://mywebpages.comcast.net/dibiase/Working_MG_Gallery.html http://dans-life-blog.blogspot.com/ To: NashvilleBritishCars@yahoogroups.com; mgs list Sent: Saturday, May 30, 2009 8:10:46 PM Subject: [Mgs] Who'da thunk it was so easy!!! I know it's not British, but .... Beautiful animation from the 1939 (I think) World's Fair. It brings to mind the recent Honda ad that had all the car parts set up in a Rube Goldberg device, as well as the Bimmer ad showing the engine internals. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hlurdOFTvH8 Glenn _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 1 12:31:19 2009 From: Jack Feldman To: "mgs@autox.team.net" Date: Mon, 1 Jun 2009 13:31:10 -0500 Subject: [Mgs] In Defense of Rear Shock Kits >Date: Sun, 31 May 2009 22:31:04 -0700 >From: Aaron Whiteman >Subject: Re: [Mgs] In defense of rear shock kits >To: MG Mailing List >Message-ID: <1552BAB6-16A4-4AA4-9B66-0E022F8E5AC1@panix.com> >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes On May 31, 2009, at 5:35 PM, Jack Feldman wrote: > When I first got my C, it wallowed in the corners like a drunken > sailor. The > first time I tried a sharp corner I though I was going to roll. > Since it was > released wiser heads of mine have overcome the initial objections.. > I added > Spax all round, and an uprated front roll bar. Tamed the beast, and > turned > it into an excellent road car for long trips. *>>Invalid comparison. New cheap gas struts will beat old worn expensive >>Armstrongs. But would they be better than new Armstrongs? * *I"m not sure what you mean. A gas strut is what holds my bonnet and rear deck lid open. If you mean a shock, Monroes are not gas shocks. Jim Evans, president of the Chicagaoland MG Club, who had many years experience as a muffler shop owner installing shocks, and who has experience with tube sock kits, thinks the Monroes are the better. Newer isn't necessarily better, but if I did't have one of those cube gas pumps as backup when my SU pump failed, I would still be sitting by the roadside. It is still running, but then it isn't 45 years old. * > Why not replace a shock that was developed years ago, and take > advantage of > years of shock development? I have made many changes to my BGT to > modernize > it, and will replace any part that has failed with a more modern > one if it > is available. *>>Because it's a bodge. Why bother replacing a very well (IMHO) >>designed component of the suspension with something that is designed >>rebuilt lever shocks should give you the same or better performance as >>new gas struts, and if WWAP's warranty is to be believed, the rebuilt >>Levers will last longer than a pair of Monroes too.* *Thinking a rear shock kit is a bodge is OK, but many reputable vendors sell them. As mentioned above, an experienced mechanic who has installed them thinks they are OK.* Thanks for the comment, that is what this list is about. Jack >>Newer isn't always better. Sometimes it's just cheaper. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 1 15:43:55 2009 From: Glenn Schnittke To: mgs@autox.team.net Date: Mon, 01 Jun 2009 16:40:12 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] In defense of rear shock kits > When I first got my C... ... etc. Rest deleted for brevity. Some experiential knowledge. YMMV. It's your car, etc. In fact, your car is a C and mine is a B and they have very different feels to begin with. I've been going through this on my redcar. I have to agree with Aaron. My first MG was a '74 Sabrina bumper B (yclept, the Maroon). Since that car they have all been daily drivers and I have become, if I may say so, quite familiar with the handling characteristics of the cars - drive everywhere and occasionally race. The eventual setup on the Sabrina was rebuilt shocks all round, V8 bushes in front, HD valves in the front shocks only and a 7/8" swaybar. The car handled like a dream. I would volunteer to go to the store for a loaf of bread, just so I could drive it, even though the store was right down the street. Every car now has to measure up to that one. After two more cars and several setups, I finally got the redcar ('67 roadster). When I got the redcar I decided to try the Spax kit, because a knowledgeable friend recommended it and it was cheaper. It WAS among the first things I did to the car. Since then I have completely rebuilt the body, and almost finished the suspension and brakes. (It's a rolling resto.) I always felt that the Spax in the back was a bit twitchy. I was never able to find a setting that even closely approximated the way the maroon handled. Just over the past few months, I went back to rebuilts all around. The difference is working in my favor. I'm still working out a few things, but I've come to the conclusion that they had a reason for choosing hydraulics over gas , though they were available and, even at the time, cheaper. It's a little softer but holds the road better; works with the front end better and, *I think* will last longer. Some rocket surgeon out there will give us a full accounting of the longevity of gas v. oil in shocks. But I'm sold on the original design. A friend of mine got his '67 GT set up with coil over front end a Spax rear and keeps talking about how it handles like a short wheelbased 911. I figure if I wanted a car to handle like a Porsche I'd have bought a Porsche. I like the way MG's drive. Porsche made, and still does, great cars. No one says I have to like them. I would also recommend rebuilts over new. They're made better and will last longer. Depending on source of course. Glenn _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 2 15:17:25 2009 From: David Woerpel To: Spridgets@autox.team.net, MGs Date: Tue, 02 Jun 2009 16:10:58 -0500 Subject: [Mgs] EZcarlift Anyone know anything about or have any experience with this lift? http://ezcarlift.com/ I know Moss sells it. Kelvin?? From what materials is the lift mechanism made? I'd like to compare this with the MaxJax which can be ordered from Northern. TIA, Dave 59 MGA 1500 59 :{) Burlington WI _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 2 15:29:52 2009 From: Marc To: MGs Date: Tue, 02 Jun 2009 17:24:28 -0400 Subject: Re: [Mgs] EZcarlift I don't know a thing about them, my thought was that unless maybe you just don't have room - you could buy a 4 post lift for that kind of money... David Woerpel wrote: > Anyone know anything about or have any experience with this lift? > http://ezcarlift.com/ > I know Moss sells it. Kelvin?? > From what materials is the lift mechanism made? I'd like to compare > this with the MaxJax which can be ordered from Northern. > > TIA, -- Marc _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 2 15:30:22 2009 From: macgroup@comcast.net To: David Woerpel Date: Tue, 2 Jun 2009 21:28:14 +0000 (UTC) Subject: Re: [Mgs] EZcarlift With a true four-post lift starting at $1795 or even less, I don't see that this is worth $2000, unless it's all you have room for.B I guess it's safer than jack stands!B B http://www.gregsmithequipment.com/Vehicle_4_Post_Lift_s/36.htm Stuart (been lusting for a lift for years) '65 B, 71 GT, 74 GT project car for sale ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Woerpel" To: Spridgets@autox.team.net, "MGs" Sent: Tuesday, June 2, 2009 2:10:58 PM GMT -08:00 US/Canada Pacific Subject: [Mgs] EZcarlift Anyone know anything about or have any experience with this lift? B http://ezcarlift.com/ I know Moss sells it. B Kelvin?? B From what materials is the lift mechanism made? B I'd like to compare this with the MaxJax which can be ordered from Northern. TIA, Dave 59 MGA 1500 59 :{) Burlington WI Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 2 15:43:57 2009 From: Marc To: MGs Date: Tue, 02 Jun 2009 17:35:01 -0400 Subject: Re: [Mgs] EZcarlift I use a bridge jack on my 4 post - no jack tray required! http://www.gregsmithequipment.com/Pro-Jack-3500-Rolling-Jack-p/tpprojack-3500.htm I looked at various other jacking / qwiklift /etc/ options before going with the 4 post. Nothing better! Plus you have room for an extra car... David Woerpel wrote: > Except I'm looking to get the wheels off the ground without the annoying > jack tray. > Thanks for the reply! > Dave W. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 2 21:19:34 2009 From: "David F. Darby" To: "'mgs list'" Date: Tue, 2 Jun 2009 19:20:07 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Who'da thunk it was so easy!!! Wow, this is amazing. I can't imagine the production time that must have required. And, now I get it: 1939 World Fair, New Yorker! They got a long run out of that one. Cheers, David _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 2 23:29:14 2009 From: "Stuart MacMillan" To: , Date: Tue, 2 Jun 2009 22:26:41 -0700 Subject: [Mgs] BL lost $2000 on every MG sold in the US I was remembering the Brit's efforts to bail out their auto industry now that our government will soon own a majority interest in GM. I ran across this statement in a 2008 article in the New York Times about the current US auto bail out: http://tinyurl.com/qws6rl I hope we do better. GM + MG? The yin-yang is powerful! Oh, wait a minute.. Stuart '65 B, '71 GT, '74 GT project for sale P.S.: We paid $1895 for our '65 B in 1969. That's $11,000 in today's dollars. A lot of money then and now. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 3 07:45:41 2009 From: David Breneman To: mgs@autox.team.net, MG-MGB@yahoogroups.com, Stuart MacMillan Date: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 06:43:30 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Mgs] BL lost $2000 on every MG sold in the US --- On Tue, 6/2/09, Stuart MacMillan wrote: > > P.S.: We paid $1895 for our '65 B in 1969. That's > $11,000 in today's > dollars. A lot of money then and now. That's about what I paid in November of 2007 for my 2005 Ford Focus. A very economical car, except for the $900 air filter (that's not a typo). I paid $1500 for my 1968 MGB in 1977, but it needed some work. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 3 10:00:38 2009 From: "Andrew B. Lundgren" To: David Breneman Date: Wed, 03 Jun 2009 09:50:59 -0600 Subject: Re: [Mgs] BL lost $2000 on every MG sold in the US No one said being economical/green was gonna be cheap!! How long will it take in gas savings to pay for the filter? On Wed, 3 Jun 2009 06:43:30 -0700 (PDT), David Breneman wrote: > very economical car, except for > the $900 air filter (that's not a typo). > -- Andrew Lundgren lundgren@byu.net _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 3 14:42:52 2009 From: David Breneman To: "Andrew B. Lundgren" Date: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 13:19:59 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Mgs] BL lost $2000 on every MG sold in the US --- On Wed, 6/3/09, Andrew B. Lundgren wrote: > No one said being economical/green > was gonna be cheap!! How long will it > take in gas savings to pay for the filter? Since the Focus gets twice the rush hour mileage of my Trailblazer, it will pay for itself in about nine months. It only needs to have the filter replaced every 100,000 miles (which for my driving is about every three years). It looks like a large percentage is labor. Body panels need to be removed to replace it. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 3 15:28:43 2009 From: Dan DiBiase To: David Breneman , "Andrew B. Lundgren" Date: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 13:59:05 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Mgs] BL lost $2000 on every MG sold in the US ________________________________ From: David Breneman To: Andrew B. Lundgren Cc: mgs@autox.team.net; MG-MGB@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, June 3, 2009 4:19:59 PM Subject: Re: [Mgs] BL lost $2000 on every MG sold in the US --- On Wed, 6/3/09, Andrew B. Lundgren wrote: > No one said being economical/green > was gonna be cheap!! How long will it > take in gas savings to pay for the filter? Since the Focus gets twice the rush hour mileage of my Trailblazer, it will pay for itself in about nine months. It only needs to have the filter replaced every 100,000 miles (which for my driving is about every three years). It looks like a large percentage is labor. Body panels need to be removed to replace it. _______________________________________________ Sound similar to replacing the timing belt in my Audi A4. The entire front end of the car has to be removed. Doubles the cost from a 'normal' car. Dan D Central NJ USA '76 MGB Tourer '65 MGB Tourer (Project) NAMGBR #5-2328 http://dans65b.blogspot.com/ http://dans76b.blogspot.com/ http://dansautoblog.blogspot.com/ http://mywebpages.comcast.net/dibiase/Working_MG_Gallery.html http://dans-life-blog.blogspot.com/ _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 3 15:55:50 2009 From: Steve To: Dan DiBiase Date: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 17:39:39 -0400 Subject: Re: [Mgs] BL lost $2000 on every MG sold in the US Is it the engine air filter or the cabin air filter? If its the cabin filter, just tell them to remove it. On Wed, Jun 3, 2009 at 4:59 PM, Dan DiBiase wrote: > ________________________________ > From: David Breneman > To: Andrew B. Lundgren > Cc: mgs@autox.team.net; MG-MGB@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Wednesday, June 3, 2009 4:19:59 PM > Subject: Re: [Mgs] BL lost $2000 on every MG sold in the US > > --- On Wed, 6/3/09, Andrew B. Lundgren wrote: > > >> No one > said being economical/green >> was gonna be cheap!! How long will it >> take in > gas savings to pay for the filter? > > Since the Focus gets twice the rush hour > mileage of > my Trailblazer, it will pay for itself in about > nine months. It > only needs to have the filter > replaced every 100,000 miles (which for my > driving > is about every three years). It looks like a > large percentage is > labor. Body panels need to > be removed to replace it. > _______________________________________________ > > Sound similar to replacing the timing belt in my Audi A4. The entire front end of the car has to be removed. > Doubles the cost from a 'normal' car. > > Dan D > Central NJ USA > '76 MGB Tourer > '65 MGB Tourer (Project) > NAMGBR #5-2328 > http://dans65b.blogspot.com/ > http://dans76b.blogspot.com/ > http://dansautoblog.blogspot.com/ > http://mywebpages.comcast.net/dibiase/Working_MG_Gallery.html > http://dans-life-blog.blogspot.com/ > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > You are subscribed as temporarilyoffline@gmail.com > > > Mgs@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 3 18:29:36 2009 From: David Breneman To: Dan DiBiase , Steve Date: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 17:13:29 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Mgs] BL lost $2000 on every MG sold in the US --- On Wed, 6/3/09, Steve wrote: > Is it the engine air filter or the > cabin air filter? > > If its the cabin filter, just tell them to remove it. It's the engine air filter. I looked at replacing it with a K&N aftermarket kit, but it cost almost as much and looked like a weekend project. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 3 20:58:27 2009 From: Jack Feldman To: "mgs@autox.team.net" Date: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 21:33:12 -0500 Subject: [Mgs] BL lost $2000 on every MG sold in the US The situation in England was far different then it is here. If you want to know what was wrong read a book called *The End of the Road: The Rise and Fall of the Austin-Healey, MG, and Triumph Sports Cars,* by Whisler. It was published by the University of Illinois Press. My local Public Library got it for me as an interlibrary loan. Austin and Morris were both self made men and had contempt for anyone who didn't get rich as they did. *"I made it, if you didn't you are lazy and stupid". *When the shop stewards ran the floor everything was great. When these self made men decided that the workers were too stupid to know how to do their jobs, and took over the floor there was nothing but labor strife. We don't have that in the US. We do have management that is more interested in their own benefits rather than the company. Another problem, one that we did have in Detroit was mistrust of other desighners. Being self made, A&M would not hire trained mechanical engineers. Only folks who came up through the apprentice system were accepted. Look at what they did to the MG as a result of US crash and emissions standards. In the US, those mechanical engineers who ran the show ignored the electrical engineers who said they could improve the cars. Only when they became desperate as a result of mandatory US emission standards did the electrical engineers get a hearing. Whisler tells of the arrogance of Austin in an anecdote about a model that wasn't ready to go on the market. When told of this Austin said to sell it anyway and let the customers find the problems. (Say, doesn't that sound like Microsoft?} Austin sales plummeted. Interesting factoid. Longbridge was hghly mechanised, Abingdon depended on teams of workers pushing the cars from station to station to get the job done. Whisler points out that Longbridge produced better numbers, but Abingdon better quality. In his book Geof Healey said that he was concerned when Austin Healey manufacturing moved from Longbridge to Abingdon, but he soon leaned that there was no decrease in quality standards. Jack Abingdon built 1960 Austin Healey 3000 1969 MGC 1972 MGBGT _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 3 21:45:24 2009 From: don To: mgs@autox.team.net Date: Wed, 03 Jun 2009 20:04:50 -0700 Subject: [Mgs] $47,500 B GT on eBay The owner of this "somewhat molested" MGB GT should get some kind of award for his eBay posting. Check it out, and if you don't laugh you need a lobotomy. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/MG-MGB-GT-1967-MGB-GT-Dealer-Special-Original-Somewhat-Molested_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQitemZ220425947241QQsspagenameZRSSQ3aBQ3aSRCHQ3aUSQ3a101 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 3 21:46:00 2009 From: Simon Matthews To: Jack Feldman Date: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 20:20:18 -0700 Subject: Re: [Mgs] BL lost $2000 on every MG sold in the US . *When the shop stewards ran the floor everything was great. When > these self made men decided that the workers were too stupid to know how to > do their jobs, and took over the floor there was nothing but labor strife. I'm not so convinced that the blame can be laid so much on the A & M. I think there was plenty of blame to go around and during the days of "Red Robbo", I think the unions contributed much to BL's problems. It's possible that a confrontational culture was built by A & M's styles which later resulted in worse labor problems. I haven't read Whisler's book and I tried and failed to discover what his background is. He doesn't seem to have published anything else. Simon _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 4 06:18:56 2009 From: Jack Feldman To: Simon Matthews Date: Thu, 4 Jun 2009 06:10:03 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] BL lost $2000 on every MG sold in the US Simon, Bad news, Timothy R. Whisler (where did he lose that "t"?) was an academic, and the study was part of a series of sociological studies published by the University of Illinois Press. I just checked Amazon, and there is one copy of the book, used at over $900! BTW, Amazon lists a publisher other then UIP, but that was the publisher listed in the copy I borrowed. If you Google him you will find that he has published a number of books on the British car industry. Sorry for not quoting his full name. Perhaps there were other factors, but Whisler makes it plain that the treatment of the union workers was a factor in the decline of the industry. Part of the larger arrogance of the men who started it at the turn of the 20th century. Derek Robinson, unfairly dubbed Red Robbo* *by the tabloid press, was striking to protest mismanagement, Again, the workers new their job, and aragant management wouldn't allow them a seat at the table. Glad to see someone else interested in what happened to an industry that could have been better. Jack On Wed, Jun 3, 2009 at 10:20 PM, Simon Matthews wrote: > . *When the shop stewards ran the floor everything was great. When > > these self made men decided that the workers were too stupid to know how > to > > do their jobs, and took over the floor there was nothing but labor > strife. > > I'm not so convinced that the blame can be laid so much on the A & M. > I think there was plenty of blame to go around and during the days of > "Red Robbo", I think the unions contributed much to BL's problems. > It's possible that a confrontational culture was built by A & M's > styles which later resulted in worse labor problems. > > I haven't read Whisler's book and I tried and failed to discover what > his background is. He doesn't seem to have published anything else. > > Simon _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 5 14:58:08 2009 From: "Norm 2Bs" To: "MG Digest" , , "Spridgets Date: Fri, 5 Jun 2009 16:29:45 -0400 Subject: [Mgs] Cryo-Treating Axles - Cost? Sorry to bomb the lists. But, I can't remember on which list someone asked about the cost of cryo-treating rear axles. I looked for my receipt. But, couldn't find it. So, I called the company that did my Turner axles -- Evans Performance Products in Cumming, GA. http://www.evansperformance.com/ Their price is $30 per axle plus your cost of shipping. I was quite satisfied with their work & turnaround time. Norm Sippel '59 Turner _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 5 15:29:30 2009 From: "oliver" To: Date: Fri, 5 Jun 2009 16:03:42 -0500 Subject: [Mgs] inspection sticker We have a 1952 MGTD; it has a 1977 inspection sticker which includes: Serial or Vehicle Identification number: 19958-94160. does that make any sense to anyone? we can't figure out where that comes from, unless maybe it was for another car and "accidentally" put on this one. its a TD/20609 thanks _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jun 7 03:40:04 2009 From: Bert Palte To: mgs@autox.team.net Date: Wed, 03 Jun 2009 21:28:27 +0200 Subject: Re: [Mgs] MGB Rear Shock Conversation Kit FWIW, I once converted a friend's MGB with a SPAX conversion kit, back in 1987 or 1988 or so, just briefly before I acquired an MGB myself. As simple as it was, it was an extremely poor fit. The brackets were not flat, because the heat from welding had taken its toll. needed rework to fit. I certainly do not want them on my own MGB, where the suspension works fine with new (not rebuilt) shocks. Bert At 21:51 29-5-2009, you wrote: >Time for the BGT to get rear shocks. Having done it on the C, I know how >simple the kit is. Two brackets, some bolts, and two inexpensive tube >shocks. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jun 7 03:40:59 2009 From: Bert Palte To: mgs@autox.team.net Date: Sun, 07 Jun 2009 11:24:22 +0200 Subject: Re: [Mgs] MGB Rear Shock Conversation Kit FWIW, I once converted a friend's MGB with a SPAX conversion kit, back in 1987 or 1988 or so, just briefly before I acquired an MGB myself. As simple as it was, it was an extremely poor fit. The brackets were not flat, because the heat from welding had taken its toll. needed rework to fit. I certainly do not want them on my own MGB, where the suspension works fine with new (not rebuilt) shocks. Bert At 21:51 29-5-2009, you wrote: >Time for the BGT to get rear shocks. Having done it on the C, I know how >simple the kit is. Two brackets, some bolts, and two inexpensive tube >shocks. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jun 7 21:36:01 2009 From: Jack Feldman To: mgs@autox.team.net Date: Sun, 7 Jun 2009 22:15:41 -0500 Subject: [Mgs] Tube Shock Conversion for MGB Bert, I'm puzzled. The conversion consists of bolts and two right angle brackets. Simple metal stamping. No welding required. You might have had a defective kit. BTW. The C comes with tube shocks on the front, so no kit was required, just replaced the factory shocks with Spax. I'm not sure how to apportion the better handling, the Spax shocks, the uprated roll bar, or both. I just know I was satisfied with the result. Yes, I am looking for the cost savings, but also to get more modern shocks. Too bad the front kit for a B is much more complicated and expensive. Jack Message: 1 Date: Wed, 03 Jun 2009 21:28:27 +0200 From: Bert Palte Subject: Re: [Mgs] MGB Rear Shock Conversation Kit To: mgs@autox.team.net Message-ID: <20090607092402.264E3187A6C@autox.team.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed FWIW, I once converted a friend's MGB with a SPAX conversion kit, back in 1987 or 1988 or so, just briefly before I acquired an MGB myself. As simple as it was, it was an extremely poor fit. The brackets were not flat, because the heat from welding had taken its toll. needed rework to fit. I certainly do not want them on my own MGB, where the suspension works fine with new (not rebuilt) shocks. Bert _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 8 22:16:29 2009 From: Phil Bates To: MG List Date: Mon, 08 Jun 2009 22:13:05 -0600 Subject: [Mgs] Pilot Bearing Don't know if any of you have had a pilot bearing issue, but I just installed a replacement 3 main B motor in my MGA, and at idle, in neutral with the clutch engaged it groaned. I had a lot of friends say it was the throw out bearing - but it didn't make noise shifting gears - so that didn't make sense. I decided to re- remove the engine, check the pilot bushing, and found a lot of dirt in there. Cleaned it out, and it's all better now. Phil Bates _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 10 09:38:48 2009 From: Henri Lefebvre <71mgbgt@gmail.com> To: mgs@autox.team.net Date: Wed, 10 Jun 2009 09:38:33 -0600 Subject: [Mgs] Pertronix Flame Thrower distributor I recently installed a Pertronix Flame Thrower distributor in my 71 MGB GT. http://www.mossmotors.com/SiteGraphics/Pages/flamethrower/flamethrower.html For proper ignition timing purposes, would anyone be abIe to provide the following information: 1 - Distributor mechanical advance of this distributor: 10 degrees? or 20 degrees? or other? 2 - Vacuum advance: connection to manifold? or carburettor? 3 - Recommended Ignition Timing, based on the above and engine year? All and any information and recommendations welcomed. Thank you, Henri 1971 MGB GT _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 10 10:01:08 2009 From: Rick Lindsay To: mgs@autox.team.net, Henri Lefebvre <71mgbgt@gmail.com> Date: Wed, 10 Jun 2009 09:00:59 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Mgs] Pertronix Flame Thrower distributor Morning Henri, You'll probably get lots of opinions regarding this change. Paul Hunt always offers good advice. I'd certainly lean toward his advice. Maximum advance needed has to do with the burn rate of the charge - and that changes with engine speed and compression ratio. If I remember correctly, higher pressure charges burn more slowly - so you need more advance for a high compression engine. (Someone please check me on this. Its been a while.) If it were mine, I would look up the advance curves and set the new unit to match the factory specs. This guy has done a TON of research in this area: http://www.teglerizer.com/ As for the vacuum advance, I always prefer the ported advance (on the carb) where the throttle disk covers the vacuum port in the choke until the throttle is opened. I find that it offers a smoother idle. Remember, the original purpose for the vacuum advance was to modulate the timing to compensate for engine load. The centrifugal advance is the base correction for engine speed. The later model cars tweaked with the advance to try to control emissions. Some cars even used timing-retard units in the pursuit of passing emissions tests. I view these efforts as signs of a dieing era. Personally, I tune for performance and driveability. We use our cars a tiny fraction of road-time of the tens-of-millions of Hondas. I don't think a finely tuned little MGB is going to melt much polar ice. YMMV ;-) Regards, Rick --- On Wed, 6/10/09, Henri Lefebvre <71mgbgt@gmail.com> wrote: > From: Henri Lefebvre <71mgbgt@gmail.com> > Subject: [Mgs] Pertronix Flame Thrower distributor > To: mgs@autox.team.net > Date: Wednesday, June 10, 2009, 10:38 AM > I recently installed a Pertronix > Flame Thrower distributor in my 71 MGB GT. > > http://www.mossmotors.com/SiteGraphics/Pages/flamethrower/flamethrower.html > > For proper ignition timing purposes, would anyone be abIe > to provide > the following information: > > 1 - Distributor mechanical advance of this > distributor: 10 degrees? > or 20 degrees? or other? > > 2 - Vacuum advance: connection to manifold? or > carburettor? > > 3 - Recommended Ignition Timing, based on the above and > engine year? > > All and any information and recommendations welcomed. > > Thank you, > > Henri > 1971 MGB GT _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 10 21:34:55 2009 From: "Eric Markley" To: "Henri Lefebvre" <71mgbgt@gmail.com>, Date: Wed, 10 Jun 2009 23:34:39 -0400 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Pertronix Flame Thrower distributor Hello Henri, Your '71 should have a GK series engine that used manifold vacuum. I would set the timing dynamically at 35 degrees BTDC at 3000 to 3500 rpm and then verify that the timing at idle is in the 10 to 15 degree BTDC range. Vacuum advance should be disconnected while adjusting the timing. You may need to adjust the timing a little depending on the quality of the gas you can buy to avoid detonation. I have heard anything from 31 to 38 being used to get best results; each engine is unique. Too little and too much advance are both bad. If it starts well when cold, pulls strongly to 5000 or so, and does not ping or overheat, you are close to the best timing. Hope it works out well. Eric in Florida '74 B -----Original Message----- From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net]On Behalf Of Henri Lefebvre Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2009 11:39 AM To: mgs@autox.team.net Subject: [Mgs] Pertronix Flame Thrower distributor I recently installed a Pertronix Flame Thrower distributor in my 71 MGB GT. http://www.mossmotors.com/SiteGraphics/Pages/flamethrower/flamethrower.htm l For proper ignition timing purposes, would anyone be abIe to provide the following information: 1 - Distributor mechanical advance of this distributor: 10 degrees? or 20 degrees? or other? 2 - Vacuum advance: connection to manifold? or carburettor? 3 - Recommended Ignition Timing, based on the above and engine year? All and any information and recommendations welcomed. Thank you, Henri 1971 MGB GT You are subscribed as ericemarkley@bellsouth.net Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.61/2167 - Release Date: 06/10/09 05:52:00 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 11 15:51:35 2009 From: Henri Lefebvre <71mgbgt@gmail.com> To: mgs@autox.team.net Date: Thu, 11 Jun 2009 15:45:31 -0600 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Pertronix Flame Thrower distributor I sent a query to Pertronix regarding the mechanical advance. Pertronix confirmed that the Flame Thrower distributor for MGB's has the following mechanical advance curve: Engine RPM Advance, Crank Degrees 600 2 degrees 710 4 820 6 940 8 1100 10 1300 12 1550 14 1780 16 1900 18 2300 20 2610 22 3050 24 Henri 2009/6/10 Eric Markley : > Hello Henri, > > > Your '71 should have a GK series engine that used manifold vacuum. I would > set the timing dynamically at 35 degrees BTDC at 3000 to 3500 rpm and then > verify that the timing at idle is in the 10 to 15 degree BTDC range. Vacuum > advance should be disconnected while adjusting the timing. You may need to > adjust the timing a little depending on the quality of the gas you can buy > to avoid detonation. I have heard anything from 31 to 38 being used to get > best results; each engine is unique. Too little and too much advance are > both bad. If it starts well when cold, pulls strongly to 5000 or so, and > does not ping or overheat, you are close to the best timing. > > Hope it works out well. > > Eric in Florida > '74 B > > -----Original Message----- > From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net]On > Behalf Of Henri Lefebvre > Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2009 11:39 AM > To: mgs@autox.team.net > Subject: [Mgs] Pertronix Flame Thrower distributor > > > I recently installed a Pertronix Flame Thrower distributor in my 71 MGB GT. > > http://www.mossmotors.com/SiteGraphics/Pages/flamethrower/flamethrower.htm > l > > For proper ignition timing purposes, would anyone be abIe to provide > the following information: > > 1 - Distributor mechanical advance of this distributor: 10 degrees? > or 20 degrees? or other? > > 2 - Vacuum advance: connection to manifold? or carburettor? > > 3 - Recommended Ignition Timing, based on the above and engine year? > > All and any information and recommendations welcomed. > > Thank you, > > Henri > 1971 MGB GT > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > You are subscribed as ericemarkley@bellsouth.net > > > Mgs@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs > > http://www.team.net/archive > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.61/2167 - Release Date: 06/10/09 > 05:52:00 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 12 08:33:45 2009 From: "Paul Hunt" To: "Henri Lefebvre" <71mgbgt@gmail.com>, Date: Fri, 12 Jun 2009 15:18:24 +0100 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Pertronix Flame Thrower distributor In 71 the engine changed from an 18GK with a 25D4 41339 distributor to an 18V 584/585 with a 25D4 41370 distributor, so it all depends on what you have. The characteristics of these were (all in crankshaft degrees): 41339: Static 10 degrees Strobe 15 at 1500 rpm *Additional* centrifugal advance over the static figure: 10 degrees at 1000 rpm 24 at 2800 30 at 4600 Vacuum advance started at 7 in.Hg., ended at 13 in.Hg., giving a maximum 10 degrees. 41370: Static 10 degrees Strobe 16 at 1500 Centrifugal: 20 at 1850 35 at 3600 41 at 4800 Vacuum starts at 7, ends at 13, max 6 degrees. At the end of the day without spending much time and money on a rolling-road session and tuning the springs and weights of the distributor, multiplied by a factor of several if you have vacuum advance as well, the best you can do is run the most advance without pinking at any combination of throttle, revs and load and not stalling the starter. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- I sent a query to Pertronix regarding the mechanical advance. Pertronix confirmed that the Flame Thrower distributor for MGB's has the following mechanical advance curve: Engine RPM Advance, Crank Degrees 600 2 degrees 710 4 820 6 940 8 1100 10 1300 12 1550 14 1780 16 1900 18 2300 20 2610 22 3050 24 Henri _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 12 08:34:22 2009 From: "Paul Hunt" To: "Henri Lefebvre" <71mgbgt@gmail.com>, Date: Fri, 12 Jun 2009 15:04:55 +0100 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Pertronix Flame Thrower distributor Strictly speaking the mechanical and vacuum advance characteristics of the new distributor should match the requirements of the engine. On the face of it that is the same as the original distributor, but for most MGBs designed for leaded petrol the characteristics required now can be very different from the original, and the octane of fuel used makes a huge difference. Mechanical advance varies with revs and so is expressed as a set of figures, vacuum advance varies primarily with throttle opening and is expressed as a min and max. The purpose of the curves is ideally to keep the advance just short of pinking at any combination of throttle opening, revs and load, for best performance and economy. But being mechanical they were only ever crude at the best of times. Add to that the situation from 67 on where meeting emissions limits became more of an issue than performance and economy, and you end up today where really the only thing you can do is run with the most advance you can short of pinking at the foresaid any combination of throttle, revs and load. But even then with low compression engines it is possible to put so much advance in it stalls the starter, so that is another criteria. As far as connection of the vacuum is concerned carb is better as there is no advance when cranking for easier starting, which there probably will be with manifold advance which can make starting a bit harder. Other than cranking and at idle there is no difference in the vacuum signal, you only have to open the throttle a little way for the two signals to be the same. If you have carb(s) with a vacuum advance port then use it, otherwise you will have to use a manifold port. Any unused port must be sealed to prevent vacuum leaks. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- I recently installed a Pertronix Flame Thrower distributor in my 71 MGB GT. http://www.mossmotors.com/SiteGraphics/Pages/flamethrower/flamethrower.ht ml For proper ignition timing purposes, would anyone be abIe to provide the following information: 1 - Distributor mechanical advance of this distributor: 10 degrees? or 20 degrees? or other? 2 - Vacuum advance: connection to manifold? or carburettor? 3 - Recommended Ignition Timing, based on the above and engine year? _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 12 19:10:55 2009 From: Steve To: MG List Date: Fri, 12 Jun 2009 21:10:43 -0400 Subject: [Mgs] Crank Nut Thread Direction Does anybody know the direction of the threads on the crank pulley nut? (Clockwise or Anti-Clockwise) Thanks. Pics of the engine rebuild so far: http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=2014684&id=1352274902&l=e84cbbbcaf - Steve _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 12 22:01:10 2009 From: Phil Bates To: MG List , Steve Date: Fri, 12 Jun 2009 21:00:25 -0700 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Crank Nut Thread Direction _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 13 08:46:40 2009 From: William Killeffer To: Mgs@autox.team.net Date: Sat, 13 Jun 2009 10:42:34 -0400 Subject: [Mgs] Adding relays to the headlight circuits Hey everyone, The new turn signal/dipswitch is finally here and installed, so now it's time to add the relays to the headlamp circuits. The car's a 1974 MGB with a four-way fuse block. I haven't added any supplemental fuse panels or anything like that, though I have a couple of extra 4-way fuse blocks that could be pressed into service if needed. There seem to be alot of different options for adding relays, but the part that concerns me right now is where to get the power to operate the relays. Most instructions talk about taking it off of the fuse block using a pretty heavy gauge wire, but they don't give much assistance as to which terminal to use. The Bentley manual says that if auxiliary equipment is to be added, that it should be connected to fuse terminal B. Trouble is that I can't find a terminal marked B on any of my fuse blocks. Am I missing something? Does anyone have any other suggestions that might work better? Any photos they could share? I'm trying to keep things pretty simple and low-budget, just using wire, relays, and connectors from Pep Boys. Hoping to finish before the weekend's over. Any assistance would very much be appreciated. Thank you, -Bill William Killeffer wkilleffer@comcast.net http://williamkillefferphoto.wordpress.com http://www.flickr.com/photos/williamk1974/ Made with a Mac _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 13 09:06:53 2009 From: William Killeffer To: Mgs@autox.team.net Date: Sat, 13 Jun 2009 11:06:38 -0400 Subject: [Mgs] Testing and repairing the fuel gauge Hey everyone, The fuel gauge on my 1974 MGB has not been working for awhile. After starting the car, the needle will rise up to a point between the two lowest markings on the gauge and stay there. Initially, I thought the float on the sending unit might have failed, but on a really hot day recently, the gauge came to life and gave a reading that seemed more or less accurate based on the mileage since the last fill-up. But it didn't last too long and went back to its dormant state after about 20 minutes. It did it again last weekend. It was a hot day that day as well. Once again, the reading seemed to be as accurate as those gauges ever are. Something I've noticed both times is that it seems a little balky when it does this. The needle's movement isn't smooth, whereas the temp gauge needle always moves smoothly. It's like a connection's bad or the gauge is having problems. The temp gauge works just fine. Both gauges are plugged into a voltage stabilizer that might be original to the car. I've seen a method that's used to test the operation of the gauge that involves some kind of connection to the wire that plugs into the sending unit. Any suggestions would be appreciated. Thank you, -Bill William Killeffer wkilleffer@comcast.net http://williamkillefferphoto.wordpress.com http://www.flickr.com/photos/williamk1974/ Made with a Mac _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 13 09:32:14 2009 From: Charles Hill To: William Killeffer Date: Sat, 13 Jun 2009 10:32:04 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Testing and repairing the fuel gauge Bill, Have you checked Barney Gaylord's web site (www.*mgaguru*.com)? He has a lot of good info there. It is one of the first places I look when I have a problem with LBCs - not just MGs. Charles Hill William Killeffer wrote: > Hey everyone, > > The fuel gauge on my 1974 MGB has not been working for awhile. After > starting the car, the needle will rise up to a point between the two > lowest markings on the gauge and stay there. Initially, I thought the > float on the sending unit might have failed, but on a really hot day > recently, the gauge came to life and gave a reading that seemed more > or less accurate based on the mileage since the last fill-up. But it > didn't last too long and went back to its dormant state after about 20 > minutes. > > It did it again last weekend. It was a hot day that day as well. Once > again, the reading seemed to be as accurate as those gauges ever are. > Something I've noticed both times is that it seems a little balky when > it does this. The needle's movement isn't smooth, whereas the temp > gauge needle always moves smoothly. It's like a connection's bad or > the gauge is having problems. > > The temp gauge works just fine. Both gauges are plugged into a voltage > stabilizer that might be original to the car. > > I've seen a method that's used to test the operation of the gauge that > involves some kind of connection to the wire that plugs into the > sending unit. > > Any suggestions would be appreciated. > > Thank you, > -Bill > William Killeffer > wkilleffer@comcast.net > http://williamkillefferphoto.wordpress.com > http://www.flickr.com/photos/williamk1974/ > Made with a Mac _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 13 10:55:33 2009 From: William Killeffer To: Charles Hill Date: Sat, 13 Jun 2009 12:55:22 -0400 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Testing and repairing the fuel gauge Hello Charles, Not sure how I forgot about him. Between his site and the Chicagoland tech tips, you *almost* don't need a manual lol. Here's what I've found so far: When I ground the wire that plugs into the sending unit with the engine running, the fuel gauge will go from its lowest point all the way past the F. Unground, and it goes back down. I used a small handheld multi-tester to check the resistance of the sending unit. Its scale is kind of small and hard to read below 100 ohms. But when connected and grounded, looks like the reading is between 70 and 80 ohms. The fuel tank is nearly full. The leads on the tester are too short to stay connected if I try shaking the car. My digital tester has longer leads, but seemed confused when I tried this. Guess this means that the gauge and stabilizer are both good and that the problem lies either with the sending unit or some connection between the sending unit and the gauge. Thank you, -Bill On Jun 13, 2009, at 11:32 AM, Charles Hill wrote: > Bill, > Have you checked Barney Gaylord's web site (www.*mgaguru*.com)? He > has a lot of good info there. It is one of the first places I look > when I have a problem with LBCs - not just MGs. > > Charles Hill > > William Killeffer wrote: >> Hey everyone, >> >> The fuel gauge on my 1974 MGB has not been working for awhile. >> After starting the car, the needle will rise up to a point between >> the two lowest markings on the gauge and stay there. Initially, I >> thought the float on the sending unit might have failed, but on a >> really hot day recently, the gauge came to life and gave a reading >> that seemed more or less accurate based on the mileage since the >> last fill-up. But it didn't last too long and went back to its >> dormant state after about 20 minutes. >> >> It did it again last weekend. It was a hot day that day as well. >> Once again, the reading seemed to be as accurate as those gauges >> ever are. Something I've noticed both times is that it seems a >> little balky when it does this. The needle's movement isn't >> smooth, whereas the temp gauge needle always moves smoothly. It's >> like a connection's bad or the gauge is having problems. >> >> The temp gauge works just fine. Both gauges are plugged into a >> voltage stabilizer that might be original to the car. >> >> I've seen a method that's used to test the operation of the gauge >> that involves some kind of connection to the wire that plugs into >> the sending unit. >> >> Any suggestions would be appreciated. >> >> Thank you, >> -Bill >> William Killeffer >> wkilleffer@comcast.net >> http://williamkillefferphoto.wordpress.com >> http://www.flickr.com/photos/williamk1974/ >> Made with a Mac >> > William Killeffer wkilleffer@comcast.net http://williamkillefferphoto.wordpress.com http://www.flickr.com/photos/williamk1974/ Made with a Mac _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 13 12:48:32 2009 From: Steve To: MG List Date: Sat, 13 Jun 2009 14:48:21 -0400 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Crank Nut Thread Direction Clockwise it is... and done. Thanks! On Sat, Jun 13, 2009 at 12:00 AM, Phil Bates wrote: > They are right hand thread - just like any standard nut or bolt. Turning > the head clockwise should tighten the bolt. > > > > phil Bates > > > > On Fri Jun 12 18:10 , Steve sent: > > Does anybody know the direction of the threads on the crank pulley > nut? (Clockwise or Anti-Clockwise) > > Thanks. > > Pics of the engine rebuild so far: > http://www.facebook.com/album.php\?aid=2014684&id=1352274902&l=e84cbbbcaf > > - Steve > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > You are subscribed as jello@cableone.net > > > Mgs@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs > > http://www.team.net/archive > > ________________________________ > Msg sent via CableONE.net MyMail - http://www.cableone.net _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 13 17:02:40 2009 From: "Allan Eldridge" To: Date: Sat, 13 Jun 2009 20:00:00 -0300 Subject: [Mgs] MGB CarB REbuild Who is good at rebuilding carbs i have a flooding float and overflow problems. Thanks Allan Eldridge eldridge@nbnet.nb.ca _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 13 21:09:13 2009 From: Mark J Bradakis To: mgs@autox.team.net Date: Sat, 13 Jun 2009 21:11:37 -0600 Subject: Re: [Mgs] MGB CarB REbuild Well, if you lived in Utah, specifically the Salt Lake City area, I'd say being it by Bailey's. We fix stuff like that all the time. But I'm guessing you're not that close. mjb. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 13 21:37:14 2009 From: "Ed's Shop" To: "Mark J Bradakis" , Date: Sat, 13 Jun 2009 22:38:26 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] MGB CarB REbuild <> WHAT happened to Fatchance Garage, Mark ??????????????? Ed Please visit MY site at: www.justbrits.com _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jun 14 08:05:18 2009 From: "Brits'n'Pieces \(Eric Frenken\)" To: "'Paul Hunt'" , Date: Sun, 14 Jun 2009 16:05:03 +0200 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Pertronix Flame Thrower distributor Paul, regarding the 41339, if you set a static of 10 deg and you have an *additional* centrifugal advance of 10 deg @ 1,000 rpm (which makes it all together 20 deg @ 1,000 rpm), how can you have a strobe of 15 deg @ 1,500 rpm? Eric http://brits-n-pieces.com -----Original Message----- From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Paul Hunt Sent: Friday, June 12, 2009 4:18 PM To: Henri Lefebvre; mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] Pertronix Flame Thrower distributor In 71 the engine changed from an 18GK with a 25D4 41339 distributor to an 18V 584/585 with a 25D4 41370 distributor, so it all depends on what you have. The characteristics of these were (all in crankshaft degrees): 41339: Static 10 degrees Strobe 15 at 1500 rpm *Additional* centrifugal advance over the static figure: 10 degrees at 1000 rpm 24 at 2800 30 at 4600 Vacuum advance started at 7 in.Hg., ended at 13 in.Hg., giving a maximum 10 degrees. 41370: Static 10 degrees Strobe 16 at 1500 Centrifugal: 20 at 1850 35 at 3600 41 at 4800 Vacuum starts at 7, ends at 13, max 6 degrees. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jun 14 10:20:23 2009 From: Barrie Robinson To: "Allan Eldridge" , Date: Sun, 14 Jun 2009 11:40:51 -0400 Subject: Re: [Mgs] MGB CarB REbuild Allan, Look on www.britcot.com there maybe someone there - I believe Burlen (the old SU company) still does them At 07:00 PM 6/13/2009, Allan Eldridge wrote: >Who is good at rebuilding carbs i have a flooding float and overflow >problems. > >Thanks > >Allan Eldridge > >eldridge@nbnet.nb.ca >_______________________________________________ >Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > >You are subscribed as barrie@look.ca > > >Mgs@autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs > >http://www.team.net/archive Regards Barrie (705) 721-9060 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jun 14 10:52:27 2009 From: "Rick Brown" To: , "Barrie Robinson" Date: Sun, 14 Jun 2009 12:52:07 -0400 Subject: Re: [Mgs] MGB CarB REbuild Mr. SU - Joe Curto rebuilds them http://www.joecurto.com/ Rick Webmaster for: http://www.mgcars.org.uk/namgbr - The North American MGB Register http://www.mgcars.org.uk/mgcouncil - North American Council of MG Registers http://www.mgcars.org.uk/amgcr - American MGC Register http://www.flamemini.net - Florida mini Enthusiasts http://www.britishcarclub.net - Nature Coast English Car Club and The Suncoast Classic MG Club ----- Original Message ----- From: "Barrie Robinson" To: "Allan Eldridge" ; Sent: Sunday, June 14, 2009 11:40 Subject: Re: [Mgs] MGB CarB REbuild > Allan, > > Look on www.britcot.com there maybe someone there - I believe Burlen (the > old SU company) still does them > > > At 07:00 PM 6/13/2009, Allan Eldridge wrote: >>Who is good at rebuilding carbs i have a flooding float and overflow >>problems. >> >>Thanks >> >>Allan Eldridge >> >>eldridge@nbnet.nb.ca >>_______________________________________________ >>Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> >>You are subscribed as barrie@look.ca >> >> >>Mgs@autox.team.net >>http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs >> >>http://www.team.net/archive > > Regards > > Barrie > (705) 721-9060 _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > You are subscribed as mgrick@mgcars.org.uk > > > Mgs@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jun 14 11:17:04 2009 From: Rick Lindsay To: MGS Date: Sun, 14 Jun 2009 10:13:39 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Mgs] MGB CarB REbuild Here's the pair I just rebuilt, http://www.aubard.us/tr3a/HPIM1625.JPG Yes, they're H6s from my TR3b but they're quite similar to the H4s. I would encourage anyone who doesn't have HAMS for fists, to rebuild their own carbs. The job is easy and if you follow the instructions, is pretty fool proof. Always do one at a time because many parts are machined together and therefore, cannot be interchanged. Buy the rebuild kit made by the official SU people. Read the instructions a dozen times before getting out your wrenches and screwdrivers. :-) rick _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jun 14 11:32:02 2009 From: Paul Root To: Rick Lindsay Date: Sun, 14 Jun 2009 12:31:17 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] MGB CarB REbuild Moss also sells a video of Lawrie Anderson (bay area) doing a rebuild. That was helpful. Lawrie is another one that will rebuild for you. You can even make a simple reamer tool to replace the throttle shaft bushes. Instructions on Chicagoland MG. I did that myself 5-6 years ago. Wonderful runing SUs since. On Jun 14, 2009, at 12:13 PM, Rick Lindsay wrote: > Here's the pair I just rebuilt, > http://www.aubard.us/tr3a/HPIM1625.JPG > > Yes, they're H6s from my TR3b but they're quite similar to the H4s. > I would encourage anyone who doesn't have HAMS for fists, to rebuild > their own carbs. The job is easy and if you follow the > instructions, is pretty fool proof. > > Always do one at a time because many parts are machined together and > therefore, cannot be interchanged. Buy the rebuild kit made by the > official SU people. Read the instructions a dozen times before > getting out your wrenches and screwdrivers. :-) > > rick > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > You are subscribed as ptrmgb@gmail.com > > > Mgs@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jun 14 11:46:58 2009 From: Dan DiBiase To: mg-mgb@yahoogroups.com, MG List Date: Sun, 14 Jun 2009 10:45:23 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Mgs] Fuel Pump Replacement - Now Blockage? Ok, been a while but found some time today to finish the replacement of the fuel pump in the '76 B. It buzzes away merrily but after 5 minutes, doesn't seem to push any fuel into the fuel filter. So now I am thinking that I also have a blockage somewhere in the line. What's the best way to diagnose this? I replaced a non-OEM points-type pump with a generic electric pump. It provides 3.5 PSI pressure, so that should not be the issue. Dan D Central NJ USA '76 MGB Tourer '65 MGB Tourer (Project) NAMGBR #5-2328 http://dans65b.blogspot.com/ http://dans76b.blogspot.com/ http://dansautoblog.blogspot.com/ http://mywebpages.comcast.net/dibiase/Working_MG_Gallery.html http://dans-life-blog.blogspot.com/ _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jun 14 12:11:53 2009 From: Henri Lefebvre <71mgbgt@gmail.com> To: mgs@autox.team.net Date: Sun, 14 Jun 2009 12:04:56 -0600 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Pertronix Flame Thrower distributor Additional details on my 71 MGB GT: Engine 18GK, total rebuild 1 year ago to spec. except Pistons are +40 and cam is a Piper cam #BBP270 fast road cam. Distributor: original 41339, replaced by Pertronix Flame Thrower distributor (mechanical adance listed in post above). Vacuum advance connected to manifold Current dynamic timing: 10 degrees at 1000 RPM The car runs very well with this configuration, Henri On Sun, Jun 14, 2009 at 8:05 AM, Brits'n'Pieces (Eric Frenken) wrote: > Paul, regarding the 41339, if you set a static of 10 deg and you have an > *additional* centrifugal advance of 10 deg @ 1,000 rpm (which makes it all > together 20 deg @ 1,000 rpm), how can you have a strobe of 15 deg @ 1,500 > rpm? > > Eric > http://brits-n-pieces.com > > -----Original Message----- > From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On > Behalf Of Paul Hunt > Sent: Friday, June 12, 2009 4:18 PM > To: Henri Lefebvre; mgs@autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Mgs] Pertronix Flame Thrower distributor > > In 71 the engine changed from an 18GK with a 25D4 41339 distributor to an > 18V > 584/585 with a 25D4 41370 distributor, so it all depends on what you have. > The characteristics of these were (all in crankshaft degrees): > > 41339: > Static 10 degrees > Strobe 15 at 1500 rpm > *Additional* centrifugal advance over the static figure: > 10 degrees at 1000 rpm > 24 at 2800 > 30 at 4600 > Vacuum advance started at 7 in.Hg., ended at 13 in.Hg., giving a maximum 10 > degrees. > > 41370: > Static 10 degrees > Strobe 16 at 1500 > Centrifugal: > 20 at 1850 > 35 at 3600 > 41 at 4800 > Vacuum starts at 7, ends at 13, max 6 degrees. > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > You are subscribed as 71mgbgt@gmail.com > > > Mgs@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jun 14 13:41:09 2009 From: Bob Howard To: d_dibiase@yahoo.com Date: Sun, 14 Jun 2009 15:38:23 -0400 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Fuel Pump Replacement - Now Blockage? Dan, Blow back toward the tank the hose that supplies the pump. If you hear bubbling, air is passing one way and fuel should go the other. Then blow the line from pump to carbs. If air passes, fuel should also. The pump should deliver within five seconds. If it pumps longer than that, real pumping/thumping, it is sucking air. If an SU can't deliver because the carbs are full, it stops pumping. Just this week I thought that the pump was taking too long to fill the bowls---it was loose clips on the rubber hoses of the suction side. Tightened the clamps and it is happy. Bob On Sun, 14 Jun 2009 10:45:23 -0700 (PDT) Dan DiBiase writes: > Ok, been a while but found some time today to finish the replacement > of the fuel pump in the '76 B. It buzzes away > merrily but after 5 minutes, doesn't seem to push any fuel into the > fuel filter. So now I am thinking that I also have a > blockage somewhere in the line. What's the best way to diagnose > this? > > I replaced a non-OEM points-type pump with a generic electric pump. > It provides 3.5 PSI pressure, so that should not > be the issue. > > Dan D > Central NJ USA > '76 MGB Tourer > '65 MGB Tourer (Project) > NAMGBR #5-2328 ____________________________________________________________ Make the right decisions about your inheritance. Click here for more information. http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/BLSrjpTFQPHFvWka1thAmzWjGyxiyPl9anzcLtAGEZYvgfxLJcGsGITlr9G/ _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jun 14 13:41:27 2009 From: Bob Howard To: wkilleffer@comcast.net Date: Sun, 14 Jun 2009 15:12:22 -0400 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Adding relays to the headlight circuits Hi Bill, What worked perfectly for me was Rick Asley's diagram, which is probably the way almost everyone does it anyway. I took the heavy supply wires, 12ga, from the starter terminal, up to a circuit breaker for each wire, then to terminal 30 of each relay. The control wire for the relay is the original wire from the switch high and dipped beams, blue/red for one blue/white for the other, that ran to terminal 86 on each relay. The blue/white wire and red/blue wire then go out from relay terminal 86 to the lamp, and terminal 87 is the earth terminal for the relay. My relays are well forward in the engine space, as far forward as can be easily reached, the idea being that the small supply wires to the headlamps would be as short as possible and the 12ga supply wires to the relays would be long so as to minimise voltage drop. The starter terminal where the lead from the battery connects is the connection point I used. It requires two large ring terminals, but they were hardware store items. I would not take anything from the fuse block. They are OK for what they do, but by using a circuit breaker for low beam and one for main beams, you increase the likelihood of having one set of lights or the other. From experience I can tell you that losing all lights on a dark twisty road is more excitement than one can imagine. When you buy wire and fittings, you may see that there are two kinds of the ring fittings. The cheaper, more available type, leaves some of the crimp area exposed, but there is another type (all the ones I bought had blue plastic but I don't know if that is significant or merely decorative) but these have plastic insulation over all the crimp area. You will enjoy the additional brilliance, lights that work as intended. Bob On Sat, 13 Jun 2009 10:42:34 -0400 William Killeffer writes: > Hey everyone, > > The new turn signal/dipswitch is finally here and installed, so now ____________________________________________________________ Make the most out of every dollar. Click here to find websites and services to help invest wisely. http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/BLSrjpTFOGeVngvRYCiUSSf0KVlMzv9pJCInj4HNjHI5ppBYHsXMKFYEtQs/ _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jun 14 14:27:50 2009 From: Todd Mullins To: mgs@autox.team.net Date: Sun, 14 Jun 2009 15:27:37 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] [Mgs} Adding relays to the headlight circuits > wkilleffer@comcast.net writes: > There seem to be alot of different options for adding relays, but the > part that concerns me right now is where to get the power to operate > the relays. Most instructions talk about taking it off of the fuse > block using a pretty heavy gauge wire, but they don't give much > assistance as to which terminal to use. > Bill, On my '74, I used a car audio amplifier wiring kit to pull power directly from the big terminal on the starter to my relays. This has the advantages of being cheap, readily available, and beefy, and includes inline fuses. I actually have two wires running - one for low beams, one for high beams - and each includes its own fuse. This provides fault tolerance, should one wire develop a short. I wouldn't run anything else through the (already marginal) fuse block. -todd muses@cableone.net _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jun 14 15:47:26 2009 From: "Ed's Shop" To: "Bob Howard" Date: Sun, 14 Jun 2009 16:45:46 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Fuel Pump Replacement - Now Blockage? <> Dan SAID it's aftermarket, Bob. READ mails PRIOR to responding!! <> Yep. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jun 14 15:48:38 2009 From: "Ed's Shop" To: "Dan DiBiase" , "MG List" Date: Sun, 14 Jun 2009 16:49:51 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Fuel Pump Replacement - Now Blockage? <> 1] TOO much, Dan. 2] Put an SU on (as designed & God intended)). 3] Try air thru the line to/from tank BOTH directions. Helps to have Asst. to do the 'listening' to 'hear' escaping air. 4] check ALL clamps. Ed Please visit MY site at: www.justbrits.com _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jun 14 19:12:18 2009 From: "Chad Cooper" To: "'Bob Howard'" , Date: Sun, 14 Jun 2009 20:11:52 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Adding relays to the headlight circuits Those connectors are color coded Yellow is largest, then Blue, then Red the smallest. -----Original Message----- From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Bob Howard Sent: Sunday, June 14, 2009 2:12 PM To: wkilleffer@comcast.net Cc: Mgs@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Mgs] Adding relays to the headlight circuits When you buy wire and fittings, you may see that there are two kinds of the ring fittings. The cheaper, more available type, leaves some of the crimp area exposed, but there is another type (all the ones I bought had blue plastic but I don't know if that is significant or merely decorative) but these have plastic insulation over all the crimp area. You will enjoy the additional brilliance, lights that work as intended. Bob _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 15 05:18:52 2009 From: "Frankk" To: "MG List" Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 07:06:36 -0400 Subject: [Mgs] Battery Options After almost 12 years the 60 month Interstate battery on my 1980 LE finally decided to retire. Since it has been so long since I replaced it I would like to know if anyone has replaced the battery in their RBB lately and what you would recommend? I need something that fits without modifying anything. In the past I have had to modify a battery to get it into the battery holder. The Interstate served me well and I would get another one if they still provide them for the B. Does anyone know the size, part number, etc? _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 15 05:36:43 2009 From: "Paul Hunt" To: "William Killeffer" , Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 12:30:22 +0100 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Adding relays to the headlight circuits You can use the brown at the fusebox as a source, but coming up from the solenoid will give very slightly less volt-drop if you use a heavy gauge wire. You need to be careful with fusing. If you put fuses or 'circuit breakers' in the existing blue/white and blue/red wires then they will only be protecting the wiring from the fuses to the relay windings. Unless you cut in to the wiring by the dip-switch and put them there they won't by doing anything useful if put immediately before the relays, for example, and they won't be protecting any of the circuit from the 12v supply (fusebox or solenoid brown wires) through the relay contacts and out to the headlamps themselves. You can put a large capacity fuse (fusible link) in the feed to the relay contacts to protect against shorts in the wiring to the headlights, but similarly it must be as close as possible to the supply. And then you have the situation where a fault on a single headlight will blow that fusible link and you will lose both main and dipped beams. I strongly recommend fitting individual *filament* fuses i.e. four altogether, connected to the output of the relay contacts. They will protect the wiring from there to the headlamps themselves, and also limit the loss of illumination in the event of a fault to one beam on one headlamp in all but extreme circumstances. These fuses should be double the current taken by the current of one main beam. You can fit a main fusible link as well, but this should be a minimum of four times any one filament fuse, and will only be protecting a relatively short piece of wiring, especially if you pick up the 12v supply from the fusebox. I parted the 4-way bullet connectors by the right-hand headlight and with a volt-meter (or test-lamp) determined which of the blue/white and blue/red wires came from the dip-switch, the others go to the left-hand headlamp. The two dip-switch wires I wired through two new 2-way bullet connectors back to the relays mounted in front of the existing relays, the output of the relays went to four fuses mounted just behind the radiator mounting panel, and two blue/whites and two blue/reds from the output of the fuses to four more 2-way bullet connectors by the right-hand headlight one pair feeding that and the other the left-hand. This avoids cutting into any wiring, and allows things to be restored to original if anyone wants to. Have a look at http://www.mgb-stuff.org.uk/wn_electricsframe.htm, click on 'Lighting' and 'Uprated Headlamps ...'. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- Does anyone have any other suggestions that might work better? _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 15 05:37:05 2009 From: "Paul Hunt" To: "William Killeffer" , Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 12:35:07 +0100 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Testing and repairing the fuel gauge Sounds like the float/slider are sticking. If the circuit were broken the needle would rise at all when turning on the ignition, and if there were a bad connection it would move but only over a very reduced range at the bottom. You don't have to drain the tank to deal with the sender, as long as you have less than 1/4-tank you should be able to remove it without leakage by raising the right-rear corner. have a new rubber gasket ring ready, and a new locking ring if the original looks heavily corroded (under the mud) before you start. Remember the rubber gasket goes between the sender and the tank. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- After starting the car, the needle will rise up to a point between the two lowest markings on the gauge and stay there.... _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 15 06:02:38 2009 From: Dan DiBiase To: Frankk , MG List Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 05:01:27 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Mgs] Battery Options Frank, I have always just gone to Sears and used thier batteries. Seems like the last time I went, they were able to tell me exactly what would fit. Just found the receipt from 2003 - yes, they were able to look it up. It's a Silver Group 25, with a strap across the top. This was for my '76 B. Fits fine, and the strap helps avoid knuckle-scraping! Dan D Central NJ USA '76 MGB Tourer '65 MGB Tourer (Project) NAMGBR #5-2328 http://dans65b.blogspot.com/ http://dans76b.blogspot.com/ http://dansautoblog.blogspot.com/ http://mywebpages.comcast.net/dibiase/Working_MG_Gallery.html http://dans-life-blog.blogspot.com/ ________________________________ From: Frankk To: MG List Sent: Monday, June 15, 2009 7:06:36 AM Subject: [Mgs] Battery Options After almost 12 years the 60 month Interstate battery on my 1980 LE finally decided to retire. Since it has been so long since I replaced it I would like to know if anyone has replaced the battery in their RBB lately and what you would recommend? I need something that fits without modifying anything. In the past I have had to modify a battery to get it into the battery holder. The Interstate served me well and I would get another one if they still provide them for the B. Does anyone know the size, part number, etc? You are subscribed as d_dibiase@yahoo.com Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 15 06:06:41 2009 From: "Paul Hunt" To: , Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 12:47:43 +0100 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Pertronix Flame Thrower distributor Ah well, that is a good question. If you look at the early distributor specs that statement holds true. For late distributors it seems that the centrifugal advance already includes static looking at the strobe figure, and for mid-era distributors it seems to be half-way between the two! 'Go-figure', as some say. The upshot is that these days we are probably timing for minimal pinking and not the book figure, high-compression engines even using 98 RON anyway. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- Paul, regarding the 41339, if you set a static of 10 deg and you have an *additional* centrifugal advance of 10 deg @ 1,000 rpm (which makes it all together 20 deg @ 1,000 rpm), how can you have a strobe of 15 deg @ 1,500 rpm? _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 15 06:06:49 2009 From: "Paul Hunt" To: "Allan Eldridge" , Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 12:43:10 +0100 Subject: Re: [Mgs] MGB CarB REbuild If that's all that's wrong with it just change the float and valve, it doesn't need a rebuild. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- Who is good at rebuilding carbs i have a flooding float and overflow problems. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 15 06:36:45 2009 From: "Paul Hunt" To: "Frankk" , "MG List" Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 13:11:40 +0100 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Battery Options You shouldn't have any problem finding a 12v battery for a rubber bumper, the bigger user of bandwidth by far concerns replacing the twin 6v with a single 12v in a chrome bumper car. 510CCA is fine and should fit easily, I've seen up to 750CCA suitable for the MGB but you would have to check sizes - 260mm x 175mm x 220mm. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- ...I need something that fits without modifying anything.... _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 15 06:47:47 2009 From: Jack Feldman To: mgs@autox.team.net Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 07:46:25 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Adding relays to the headlight circuits You must connect the power feed that will eventually go to the headlights to the battery terminal of the solenoid. That means the lights will be directly connected t the battery. Be sure to add a fuse or circuit breaker to the feed. Diving and fog lights should be connected to the solenoid battery terminal also. VB sells a wiring kit that I used. The best thing about it is that the connections are made with plugs, including the one that is connected to the headlight switch. The relays are also included. UNFORTUNATELY THE KIT IS A DISASTER. I used to carry the instructions around to show people for a laugh. They show a fuse in line with the hot feed, but there isn't one. Even worse, *the wires are too short to reach their destination.* I spent time cutting each one and adding enough wire to reach the lights. I did it because I changed to high powered halogen headlights. BTW, the color on the insulation of crimp on terminals indicates the wire size that they are used for. Jack _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 15 06:57:27 2009 From: Aaron Whiteman To: MG Mailing List Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 05:57:16 -0700 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Adding relays to the headlight circuits On Jun 15, 2009, at 5:46 AM, Jack Feldman wrote: > You must connect the power feed that will eventually go to the > headlights to > the battery terminal of the solenoid. I took a slightly different approach. The lights must be connected to a high-amp brown circuit; normally you'd go with the solenoid. However, in my particular case, I have a Bosch Alternator with two '+' spades plus the sense line (both plus spades are hot and run parallel brown wires to the solenoid). I spliced heavy wires for my relays at the alternator spades. Anything wrong with this approach? Like Paul, I have separate fuses for each filament. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 15 07:36:57 2009 From: "Paul Hunt" To: "Aaron Whiteman" , "MG Mailing List" Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 14:23:06 +0100 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Adding relays to the headlight circuits Nope. In fact because it will normally be the alternator that is powering the lights and not the battery it makes even more sense than the slightly better source of solenoid over brown at the fusebox. I've done the same thing myself on the V8 for the cooling fans, although in that case I have left the 'original' (as it came to me at any rate) brown supply connected as well so now I effectively have a double-capacity 'ring-main' circuit feeding everything. BTW, you would normally have two + output spades plus one *INDicator* spade, not a sense spade. Where earlier factory alternators did have a sense spade this was in addition to a single output spade and the indicator spade. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- However, in my particular case, I have a Bosch Alternator with two '+' spades plus the sense line (both plus spades are hot and run parallel brown wires to the solenoid). I spliced heavy wires for my relays at the alternator spades. Anything wrong with this approach? _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 15 07:58:30 2009 From: "Frankk" To: "MG List" , Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 09:46:51 -0400 Subject: [Mgs] Fw: Battery Options Subject: Re: [Mgs] Battery Options Pete: I leave it connected to a Battery Tender and start the car about once a month. I don't ever drive it on our roads here in Rhode Island until the salt has been washed away by the spring rain. The old Interstate that is in there now is at least 15 years old. The only reason it finally died is that it went dry. When I checked it over the weekend I noticed it was dry and immediately refilled it with distilled water but two days later and it hasn't taken the charge so I am assuming that it is dead. It served me well. At least I did finally locate and fix an oil leak that has been giving me fits! The location of the battery makes it a pain to check regularly and I know that is no excuse. I will be more vigilant in the future. Frank > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Pete Chast" > To: "Frankk" > Sent: Monday, June 15, 2009 12:37 PM > Subject: Re: [Mgs] Battery Options > > >> Frankk >> >> what do you do about the battery over the winter. >> >> Pete >> >> On Mon, 15 Jun 2009 04:06:36 -0700, Frankk wrote: >> >>> >>> After almost 12 years the 60 month Interstate battery on my 1980 LE >>> finally >>> decided to retire. Since it has been so long since I replaced it I would >>> like >>> to know if anyone has replaced the battery in their RBB lately and what >>> you >>> would recommend? I need something that fits without modifying anything. >>> In the >>> past I have had to modify a battery to get it into the battery holder. >>> The >>> Interstate served me well and I would get another one if they still >>> provide >>> them for the B. Does anyone know the size, part number, etc? >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>> >>> >>>>>> >> >> >> >> -- _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 15 08:06:28 2009 From: Dan DiBiase To: Frankk , MG List , Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 07:06:18 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Mgs] Fw: Battery Options Well, most of the batteries these days are maintenance-free, so no need to check them any longer, Frank! Dan D Central NJ USA '76 MGB Tourer '65 MGB Tourer (Project) NAMGBR #5-2328 http://dans65b.blogspot.com/ http://dans76b.blogspot.com/ http://dansautoblog.blogspot.com/ http://mywebpages.comcast.net/dibiase/Working_MG_Gallery.html http://dans-life-blog.blogspot.com/ ________________________________ From: Frankk To: MG List ; pchast@francomm.com Sent: Monday, June 15, 2009 9:46:51 AM Subject: [Mgs] Fw: Battery Options Subject: Re: [Mgs] Battery Options Pete: I leave it connected to a Battery Tender and start the car about once a month. I don't ever drive it on our roads here in Rhode Island until the salt has been washed away by the spring rain. The old Interstate that is in there now is at least 15 years old. The only reason it finally died is that it went dry. When I checked it over the weekend I noticed it was dry and immediately refilled it with distilled water but two days later and it hasn't taken the charge so I am assuming that it is dead. It served me well. At least I did finally locate and fix an oil leak that has been giving me fits! The location of the battery makes it a pain to check regularly and I know that is no excuse. I will be more vigilant in the future. Frank > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Pete Chast" > To: "Frankk" > Sent: Monday, June 15, 2009 12:37 PM > Subject: Re: [Mgs] Battery Options > > >> Frankk >> >> what do you do about the battery over the winter. >> >> Pete >> >> On Mon, 15 Jun 2009 04:06:36 -0700, Frankk wrote: >> >>> >>> After almost 12 years the 60 month Interstate battery on my 1980 LE finally >>> decided to retire. Since it has been so long since I replaced it I would like >>> to know if anyone has replaced the battery in their RBB lately and what you >>> would recommend? I need something that fits without modifying anything. In the >>> past I have had to modify a battery to get it into the battery holder. The >>> Interstate served me well and I would get another one if they still provide >>> them for the B. Does anyone know the size, part number, etc? >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>> >>> >>>>>> >> >> >> >> -- You are subscribed as d_dibiase@yahoo.com Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 15 20:28:57 2009 From: Henri Lefebvre <71mgbgt@gmail.com> To: mgs@autox.team.net Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 20:28:35 -0600 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Pertronix Flame Thrower distributor I should add, for what its worth, that the gasoline I use is 91 octane, usually Shell V-Power, the highest octane available to us in western Canada, which contains NO, or minimal, Ethanol. Henri On Mon, Jun 15, 2009 at 5:47 AM, Paul Hunt wrote: > Ah well, that is a good question. If you look at the early distributor specs > that statement holds true. For late distributors it seems that the > centrifugal advance already includes static looking at the strobe figure, and > for mid-era distributors it seems to be half-way between the two! > 'Go-figure', as some say. The upshot is that these days we are probably > timing for minimal pinking and not the book figure, high-compression engines > even using 98 RON anyway. > > PaulH. > ----- Original Message ----- > > > Paul, regarding the 41339, if you set a static of 10 deg and you have an > *additional* centrifugal advance of 10 deg @ 1,000 rpm (which makes it all > together 20 deg @ 1,000 rpm), how can you have a strobe of 15 deg @ 1,500 > rpm? > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > You are subscribed as 71mgbgt@gmail.com > > > Mgs@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 15 21:39:11 2009 From: "Councill, David" To: Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 21:38:52 -0600 Subject: [Mgs] wiper blades Any suggestions on a good US source for 10" wiper blades? I suspect this is a size I will no longer find locally (Montana). Checking Moss, the prices are running about $16 each, more than twice what I would expect and I would need three. Northwest Imports has a pack of 3 for a more reasonable $21 but listed for 73-80 MGBs. I have a 1972 which apparently uses a style for 1969-1972, assuming I have the right wiper arms (my 72B came in pieces including quite a few different wiper arms). Or is a 73 that different that I can't use them? Alternately, I could buy a larger wiper blade insert and cut it to fit, assuming width is consistent with blades. On a related note, I recall mail ordering blades from JC Whitneys 20 some years ago for my BGT and getting some ugly plastic ones that I thought to gaudy to even use. But they are also longer blades (13"?), maybe easier to find. David Councill 67 BGT 72 B 73 B (soon - have to pick it up) _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 16 02:10:46 2009 From: Richard Gosling To: "Councill, David" Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2009 09:10:35 +0100 Subject: Re: [Mgs] wiper blades I don't know if these are available in the US, but in the UK you can purchase wiper blade refills - new rubber strips that you cut to length and fit into the old frame. They come with 2 or 3 different plastic supports to fit a range of different wiper frame styles. They are also so long that one refill will do two MGB blades! Don't know if that really helps you, though... Richard & Sammy ('73 Black Tulip BGT) _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 16 02:24:12 2009 From: Mark J Bradakis To: mgs@autox.team.net Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2009 02:26:50 -0600 (MDT) Subject: [Mgs] List Issues I believe that the issue of AOL folks not getting Team.Net email has been resolved. It was a side effect of moving to a new ISP and getting a new block of addresses. On a side note, if you appreciate what you get from my efforts and have not donated in a while, you might consider clicking on http://www.team.net/donate.html mjb. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 16 07:39:35 2009 From: Paul Root To: Richard Gosling Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2009 08:39:18 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] wiper blades The US has long since abandoned anything that takes time. Instant gratification is the only thing that sells. If it's not disposable, we're not interested. And by disposable, I mean, thrown away into a landfill. As such. We can't replace wiper blades (the rubber part) by the incredibly hard and time consuming process of feeding a new rubber blade down a channel of clips. Anything more than a single latch hooking a unit on the arm, is way too much work for us. And be sure the replacement part is overly packaged. Don't forget, I can't be bothered to get a tool out to install this replacement part. Except for the tool required to open the packaging. That tool is probably a car key used to mangle the plastic to rest the item from the package. On Jun 16, 2009, at 3:10 AM, Richard Gosling wrote: > I don't know if these are available in the US, but in the UK you can > purchase wiper blade refills - new rubber strips that you cut to > length and > fit into the old frame. They come with 2 or 3 different plastic > supports to > fit a range of different wiper frame styles. They are also so long > that one > refill will do two MGB blades! > > Don't know if that really helps you, though... > > Richard & Sammy ('73 Black Tulip BGT) > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > You are subscribed as ptrmgb@gmail.com > > > Mgs@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 16 07:47:26 2009 From: "Larry Daniels" To: "Paul Root" Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2009 08:44:23 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] wiper blades Feeling somewhat dour this morning, Paul? ;-)) Did your brother run at the Sprints lkast weekend? If so, how did he do? Larry Daniels ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul Root" To: "Richard Gosling" Cc: Sent: Tuesday, June 16, 2009 8:39 AM Subject: Re: [Mgs] wiper blades The US has long since abandoned anything that takes time. Instant gratification is the only thing that sells. If it's not disposable, we're not interested. And by disposable, I mean, thrown away into a landfill. As such. We can't replace wiper blades (the rubber part) by the incredibly hard and time consuming process of feeding a new rubber blade down a channel of clips. Anything more than a single latch hooking a unit on the arm, is way too much work for us. And be sure the replacement part is overly packaged. Don't forget, I can't be bothered to get a tool out to install this replacement part. Except for the tool required to open the packaging. That tool is probably a car key used to mangle the plastic to rest the item from the package. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 16 07:47:37 2009 From: Rick Lindsay To: Paul Root , MGS Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2009 06:46:27 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Mgs] wiper blades Brilliant! And lets add; If anything goes wrong, our first and primary task will be trying to find someone else to blame - then sue them. rick --- On Tue, 6/16/09, Paul Root wrote: > From: Paul Root > Subject: Re: [Mgs] wiper blades > To: "Richard Gosling" > Cc: mgs@autox.team.net > Date: Tuesday, June 16, 2009, 8:39 AM > The US has long since abandoned > anything that takes time. Instant gratification is the only > thing that sells. > > If it's not disposable, we're not interested. And by > disposable, I mean, thrown away into a landfill. > > As such. We can't replace wiper blades (the rubber part) by > the incredibly hard and time consuming process of feeding a > new rubber blade down a channel of clips. Anything more than > a single latch hooking a unit on the arm, is way too much > work for us. > > And be sure the replacement part is overly packaged. > > Don't forget, I can't be bothered to get a tool out to > install this replacement part. Except for the tool required > to open the packaging. That tool is probably a car key used > to mangle the plastic to rest the item from the package. > > > > On Jun 16, 2009, at 3:10 AM, Richard Gosling wrote: > > > I don't know if these are available in the US, but in > the UK you can > > purchase wiper blade refills - new rubber strips that > you cut to length and > > fit into the old frame. They come with 2 or 3 > different plastic supports to > > fit a range of different wiper frame styles. > They are also so long that one > > refill will do two MGB blades! > > > > Don't know if that really helps you, though... > > > > Richard & Sammy ('73 Black Tulip BGT) > > _______________________________________________ > > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > > > You are subscribed as ptrmgb@gmail.com > > > > > > Mgs@autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs > > > > http://www.team.net/archive > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > You are subscribed as rolindsay@yahoo.com > > > Mgs@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 16 07:51:38 2009 From: Paul Root To: "Larry Daniels" Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2009 08:51:25 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] wiper blades Oh, does it show? :-) The Sprints are this weekend. It's just me and my oldest this weekend. My younger son has a baseball tournament. I'm wanting to drive the MG, but the weather looks like it's going to be wet. He's got the new car this year (Rabbit GTI), and I think he's still sorting it out. I'm sketchy on details, but seems he had engine issues, spun a bearing or something. He's got the engine back from the shop, and has it installed again. Still, I get the feeling that we wouldn't be on the podium this year. On Jun 16, 2009, at 8:44 AM, Larry Daniels wrote: > Feeling somewhat dour this morning, Paul? ;-)) > > Did your brother run at the Sprints lkast weekend? If so, how did > he do? > > > Larry Daniels > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Paul Root" > To: "Richard Gosling" > Cc: > Sent: Tuesday, June 16, 2009 8:39 AM > Subject: Re: [Mgs] wiper blades > > > The US has long since abandoned anything that takes time. Instant > gratification is the only thing that sells. > > If it's not disposable, we're not interested. And by disposable, I > mean, thrown away into a landfill. > > As such. We can't replace wiper blades (the rubber part) by the > incredibly hard and time consuming process of feeding a new rubber > blade down a channel of clips. Anything more than a single latch > hooking a unit on the arm, is way too much work for us. > > And be sure the replacement part is overly packaged. > > Don't forget, I can't be bothered to get a tool out to install this > replacement part. Except for the tool required to open the packaging. > That tool is probably a car key used to mangle the plastic to rest the > item from the package. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 16 08:06:43 2009 From: "Larry Daniels" To: , "MG List" Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2009 09:05:46 -0500 Subject: [Mgs] MGB 50th Anniversary I was reading a little yesterday about the history of MG and it reminded me that the 50th anniversary of the MGB is in 2012. If anybody watches the Spridget forums, you will know that last year the 50th of the Sprite was held in Lake of the Ozarks, MO. In 2011, the 50th of the Midget will be held at Road America and Elkhart Lake, WI. It's a bit premature to start working on the 50th for the B, but it probably wouldn't hurt to think about it, if anybody is interested. Larry Daniels _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 16 08:17:26 2009 From: Rick Lindsay To: MGS Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2009 07:15:28 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Mgs] Danger Will Robinson! TR3 content! Hello Friends, Its been pretty quiet here and that's not always a bad thing. Still, I thought I would toss in a little post seeing as how I haven't written much here since I traded away my MGB. I know this note contains Triumph content so you can delete now, if you desire. Otherwise, please share my excitement over this old gem. A couple of months ago I bought a car I have had on the radar for nine (9) years! The owner finally decided to let the car go and true to her word, she sold it to me. The car is a 1962 Triumph TR3b - the 72nd from the end of TR3 production. It is an original car, except for paint, and it is a 1-1/2 owner car. What? The original owner bought it new in 1963 and willed it to his daughter when he died. She let it set in her garage, untouched but covered, for 10 years. I bought it from her a couple of months ago. The car has about 41k original miles on it! Here's a picture from when I first visited, http://www.aubard.us/tr3a/HPIM1457.JPG It was last registered in 1998 with a tag expiring in 1999, http://www.aubard.us/tr3a/HPIM1463.JPG BTW, that scarey looking stuff hanging under the car is leaves caught in spider webs. The car has no rust. The last safety inspection was done in 1995. The blue and white sticker is from Southern Hills Country Club. It dates from 24 years ago. The wipers need a little maintenance... http://www.aubard.us/tr3a/HPIM1464.JPG Since moving the car to Houston, I have been busy preserving the car. I have chosen not to 'restore' it but rather, 'preserve' it by cleaning and maintaining it according to the book. A car can be restored as many times as the wallet will support, but it can be original only once. I want to keep this car that way. Please feel free to visit http://www.aubard.us/tr3a and thumb through the zillions of pictures. Please be advised that this is NOT a website designed for public viewing but rather, just an off-site place for me to store backups of my car pictures. Regards, Rick _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 16 10:22:18 2009 From: Max Heim To: MG List Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2009 09:14:48 -0700 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Danger Will Robinson! TR3 content! Nice car. Good story. FWIW, I agree with your approach. -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Mountain View, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires on 6/16/09 7:15 AM, Rick Lindsay at rolindsay@yahoo.com wrote: > Hello Friends, > > Its been pretty quiet here and that's not always a bad thing. > Still, I thought I would toss in a little post seeing as how I > haven't written much here since I traded away my MGB. I know > this note contains Triumph content so you can delete now, if > you desire. Otherwise, please share my excitement over this > old gem. > > A couple of months ago I bought a car I have had on the radar > for nine (9) years! The owner finally decided to let the car go > and true to her word, she sold it to me. The car is a 1962 Triumph > TR3b - the 72nd from the end of TR3 production. It is an original > car, except for paint, and it is a 1-1/2 owner car. What? The > original owner bought it new in 1963 and willed it to his daughter > when he died. She let it set in her garage, untouched but covered, > for 10 years. I bought it from her a couple of months ago. > > The car has about 41k original miles on it! Here's a picture > from when I first visited, http://www.aubard.us/tr3a/HPIM1457.JPG > > It was last registered in 1998 with a tag expiring in 1999, > http://www.aubard.us/tr3a/HPIM1463.JPG BTW, that scarey looking > stuff hanging under the car is leaves caught in spider webs. The > car has no rust. > > The last safety inspection was done in 1995. The blue and > white sticker is from Southern Hills Country Club. It dates > from 24 years ago. The wipers need a little maintenance... > http://www.aubard.us/tr3a/HPIM1464.JPG > > Since moving the car to Houston, I have been busy preserving > the car. I have chosen not to 'restore' it but rather, 'preserve' > it by cleaning and maintaining it according to the book. A car > can be restored as many times as the wallet will support, but it > can be original only once. I want to keep this car that way. > > Please feel free to visit http://www.aubard.us/tr3a and thumb > through the zillions of pictures. Please be advised that this is > NOT a website designed for public viewing but rather, just an > off-site place for me to store backups of my car pictures. > > Regards, > > Rick _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 16 11:02:33 2009 From: Mark J Bradakis To: MGS Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2009 11:03:01 -0600 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Danger Will Robinson! TR3 content! Cool! I imagine you'll be subscribing to the triumphs list soon - http://www.team.net/mailman/listinfo mjb. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 16 12:32:40 2009 From: Dan DiBiase To: Rick Lindsay , MGS Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2009 11:32:29 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Mgs] Danger Will Robinson! TR3 content! That's a great-looking car. It's great to come across survivors like that..... Dan D Central NJ USA '76 MGB Tourer '65 MGB Tourer (Project) NAMGBR #5-2328 http://dans65b.blogspot.com/ http://dans76b.blogspot.com/ http://dansautoblog.blogspot.com/ http://mywebpages.comcast.net/dibiase/Working_MG_Gallery.html http://dans-life-blog.blogspot.com/ ________________________________ From: Rick Lindsay To: MGS Sent: Tuesday, June 16, 2009 10:15:28 AM Subject: [Mgs] Danger Will Robinson! TR3 content! Hello Friends, Its been pretty quiet here and that's not always a bad thing. Still, I thought I would toss in a little post seeing as how I haven't written much here since I traded away my MGB. I know this note contains Triumph content so you can delete now, if you desire. Otherwise, please share my excitement over this old gem. A couple of months ago I bought a car I have had on the radar for nine (9) years! The owner finally decided to let the car go and true to her word, she sold it to me. The car is a 1962 Triumph TR3b - the 72nd from the end of TR3 production. It is an original car, except for paint, and it is a 1-1/2 owner car. What? The original owner bought it new in 1963 and willed it to his daughter when he died. She let it set in her garage, untouched but covered, for 10 years. I bought it from her a couple of months ago. The car has about 41k original miles on it! Here's a picture from when I first visited, http://www.aubard.us/tr3a/HPIM1457.JPG It was last registered in 1998 with a tag expiring in 1999, http://www.aubard.us/tr3a/HPIM1463.JPG BTW, that scarey looking stuff hanging under the car is leaves caught in spider webs. The car has no rust. The last safety inspection was done in 1995. The blue and white sticker is from Southern Hills Country Club. It dates from 24 years ago. The wipers need a little maintenance... http://www.aubard.us/tr3a/HPIM1464.JPG Since moving the car to Houston, I have been busy preserving the car. I have chosen not to 'restore' it but rather, 'preserve' it by cleaning and maintaining it according to the book. A car can be restored as many times as the wallet will support, but it can be original only once. I want to keep this car that way. Please feel free to visit http://www.aubard.us/tr3a and thumb through the zillions of pictures. Please be advised that this is NOT a website designed for public viewing but rather, just an off-site place for me to store backups of my car pictures. Regards, Rick You are subscribed as d_dibiase@yahoo.com Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 16 12:47:31 2009 From: Rick Lindsay To: MGS Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2009 11:44:44 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Mgs] Danger Will Robinson! TR3 content! Thanks everyone. Its a great find and I'm trying to respect it with my work. rick _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 16 19:49:27 2009 From: David Breneman To: MG-MGB@yahoogroups.com, MG List , Larry Daniels Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2009 18:49:10 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Mgs] MGB 50th Anniversary --- On Tue, 6/16/09, Larry Daniels wrote: > It's a bit > premature to start working on the 50th for the B, but it > probably wouldn't > hurt to think about it, if anybody is interested. Anyone who worked on various events related to the 50th anniversary of the MGA a few years ago would be a good resource for you "B" folks to consult. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 16 19:55:27 2009 From: Murray Arundell To: David Breneman Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 11:55:12 +1000 Subject: Re: [Mgs] MGB 50th Anniversary Thanks for volunteering David, you're hired!! Murray Arundell On 17/06/2009, at 11:49 AM, David Breneman wrote: > --- On Tue, 6/16/09, Larry Daniels wrote: > >> It's a bit >> premature to start working on the 50th for the B, but it >> probably wouldn't >> hurt to think about it, if anybody is interested. > > Anyone who worked on various events related to the 50th > anniversary of the MGA a few years ago would be a good > resource for you "B" folks to consult. > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > You are subscribed as arundell@ghs.com.au > > > Mgs@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 16 20:26:23 2009 From: Dean Crowley To: "Mgs@autox.team.net" Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2009 19:26:12 -0700 Subject: [Mgs] Check out my photos on Facebook Hi mgs@autox.team.net, I set up a Facebook profile where I can post my pictures, videos and events and I want to add you as a friend so you can see it. First, you need to join Facebook! Once you join, you can also create your own profile. Thanks, Dean To sign up for Facebook, follow the link below: http://www.facebook.com/p.php?i=1385161199&k=SVB52XPXR36M5AEAYEW5RW&r mgs@autox.team.net was invited to join Facebook by Dean Crowley. If you do not wish to receive this type of email from Facebook in the future, please click on the link below to unsubscribe. http://www.facebook.com/o.php?k=5d0414&u=1311878233&mid=a25172G4e31ac59G0G8 Facebook's offices are located at 1601 S. California Ave., Palo Alto, CA 94304. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 17 00:37:36 2009 From: Simon Matthews To: Paul Root Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2009 23:37:23 -0700 Subject: Re: [Mgs] wiper blades Paul, On Tue, Jun 16, 2009 at 6:39 AM, Paul Root wrote: > > As such. We can't replace wiper blades (the rubber part) by the incredibly > hard and time consuming process of feeding a new rubber blade down a channel > of clips. Anything more than a single latch hooking a unit on the arm, is > way too much work for us. > I don't know about where you live, but, here in California, I can buy refils for my cars' wiper blades. Simon _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 17 06:34:39 2009 From: Todd Mullins To: mgs@autox.team.net Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 07:34:26 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] wiper blades dcouncill@msubillings.edu wrote: > Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 21:38:52 -0600 > From: "Councill, David" > Subject: [Mgs] wiper blades > To: > Message-ID: > <4801E63444304342BA12869D78DB025F059FF644@EXVS01.msubillings.edu> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > Any suggestions on a good US source for 10" wiper blades? I suspect > this > is a size I will no longer find locally (Montana). Checking Moss, the > prices are running about $16 each, more than twice what I would expect > and I would need three. Northwest Imports has a pack of 3 for a more > reasonable $21 but listed for 73-80 MGBs. I have a 1972 which > apparently > uses a style for 1969-1972, assuming I have the right wiper arms (my > 72B came in pieces including quite a few different wiper arms). Or > is a > 73 that different that I can't use them? Alternately, I could buy a > larger wiper blade insert and cut it to fit, assuming width is > consistent with blades. To answer your original question, David, blades for all of the three- wiper cars are functionally identical. The only difference between the 69-72 blades and the later ones is color - the early ones were silver, with the later ones being black. The arms used that same color scheme, but again, are otherwise identical. I purchased three from Moss earlier, "Tex" brand from England, with the same reservations over price as you describe above. I was pleasantly surprised at the quality of the items, and was particularly pleased with one little feature - the rubber of the blade has little "nubs" that extend over the edges of the clips; the parts that usually wind up scraping and scratching up your windshield if the blade becomes old and brittle. Nothing worse than scratching up an MGB windshield, given the effort involved in the job! -todd muses@cableone.net '74 MGB being resurrected _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 17 10:29:41 2009 From: David Breneman To: Murray Arundell Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 09:29:27 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Mgs] MGB 50th Anniversary --- On Tue, 6/16/09, Murray Arundell wrote: > Thanks for volunteering David, you're > hired!! I think you read way too much into my simple suggestion. :-) However, I would suggest that someone get busy on a logo. The MGA 50th Anniverary logo was an international project. I believe is was designed in England (and approved by the MGCC), and a fellow in Australia made the grille badges. Our local MGCC chapter in the Puget Sound area made logo shirts. A logo may seem like a minor thing, but it's a great unifier and aid in organizing events "under one roof" even though they're taking place all over the world. There's a picture of it on a banner near the bottom of this page: http://www.tildebang.com/mg/mgadventure2.html There was also a "yearbook" published that documented activities and events around the world associated with the MGA anniversary. I just walked over to my bookshelf to get the name and ISBN, and it's missing (the book, not the shelf) but I'm sure someone here can provide more info. One thing I will say is that it was rather difficult to get very many MGB owners interested in our events, even though they were open to all MGs. This seemed strange to me in light of the fact that the MGB anniversary was "just around the corner", and the MGA activities would be a perfect "dry run" for the coming (and I assume much larger) MGB anniversary. So, you reap what you sow. :-) My first car was an MGB, so I'm interested in the MGB activities. It's just too bad more MGB owners didn't feel the same way about the MGA events. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 17 11:29:43 2009 From: "Bob Donahue" To: "mgs" Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 13:29:51 -0400 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Fitting a radio I believe most states allow an earphone in/over ONE ear. If you want to try this, be aware that you can't just connect the left and right channels directly together. That would be a short. Bob Donahue (Still Stuck in the '50s) Email - bobmgtd@comcast.net Cars: 52 MGTD - #17639 71 MGB - #GHN5UB254361 Member: NEMGTR #11470 NAMGBR # 7-3336 Hoosier MGB Club Olde Octagons of Indiana ----- Original Message ----- From: "Barrie Robinson" To: "Denise Thorpe" ; Sent: Saturday, May 23, 2009 1:16 PM Subject: Re: [Mgs] Fitting a radio > Denise, > > > AAAAGGGGHHHHH! Pushing things in your ears is definitely not the way to > go. I have had a few occasions when pedestrians have walked in front of > me with ear-plugs and totally unaware of other noises. I have also has > ear-plugged people nearly hitting me in car parks because - again - they > cannot hear. You have to be able to hear horns, ambulances, fire trucks, > other cars (some with quiet motors). I know you say you pull over but > ear plugs do a damn good job of blocking out other sounds. Please, please > do not block your ears. By the way, ear plugs are illegal in some parts > of the world - Ohio being one (that is in the USA I believe)! > > But have a great week-end - I am !! > > > > > At 12:46 AM 5/23/2009, Denise Thorpe wrote: >>Barrie Robinson said: >>> >>>I want to put in a radio in my MGB and, of course. I have the usual >>>space in the centre console, but it is the location of the speakers >>>that puzzle me. >> >>I stick the speakers in my ears. That is, when I don't feel like >>listening to the sound of the engine. This has many benefits. I don't >>have to worry about wind noise, listening to any passengers, hearing >>complaints about my taste in music, or cutting up my car. Using ear buds >>prevents the strap of headphones from interfering with the baseball cap I >>use to keep my hair out of my eyes and has probably kept me from being >>arrested in all these years. I installed a 12V socket under the passenger >>side dash so I can plug the Discman into it and not pollute the Earth with >>batteries. And this must actually help my hearing because I'm still the >>only one who pulls over for emergency vehicles. Don't mention it, happy >>to help. >> >>Denise Thorpe _______________________________________________ >>Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> >>You are subscribed as barrie@look.ca >> >> >>Mgs@autox.team.net >>http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs >> >>http://www.team.net/archive > > Regards > > Barrie > (705) 721-9060 _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > You are subscribed as bobmgtd@comcast.net > > > Mgs@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 17 12:17:11 2009 From: Max Heim To: MG List Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 11:15:49 -0700 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Is Valvoline VR1 OK for everyday use? I believe racing oil lacks detergent additives (this, to prevent foaming). So it is not recommended for longer change intervals. So you would have to change it considerably more often -- how much more often, I don't know. 500 miles? The length of a race weekend? BTW, I just used VR1 for break-in of the new cam in my MGB. But I only left it in for 100 miles. -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Mountain View, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires on 6/17/09 10:55 AM, Bob Donahue at bobmgtd@comcast.net wrote: > Valvoline is touting it's VR1 racing oil as having plenty of Zinc (ZDDP I > guess). Is there any down side to using this "racing oil" in my non-racing MGB > and TD? > > Bob Donahue (Still Stuck in the '50s) > Email - bobmgtd@comcast.net > Cars: 52 MGTD - #17639 > 71 MGB - #GHN5UB254361 > Member: NEMGTR #11470 > NAMGBR # 7-3336 > Hoosier MGB Club > Olde Octagons of Indiana _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 17 13:44:58 2009 From: "Sam Bass" To: Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 14:44:40 -0500 Subject: [Mgs] Unsubscribe.... Please remove me from your email list..Thanks. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 17 13:47:23 2009 From: The Roxter To: mgs Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 14:46:57 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Is Valvoline VR1 OK for everyday use? Carl French wrote: > The term Racing in this app is mostly a marketing term. The oil is for daily > use. I used to work in a research lab in Canada. I used the equipment there to test a number of oils, including Valvoline. According to my results, Valvoline was far better than any other oil available at that time. I approached the company and asked if I could get some support for using their oil exclusively at Mosport Track. For about four years, they gave me a case of Valvoline oil for every race I completed with their stickers on the car. As far as I know, this was the beginning of Asland Oil's participation in Motorsport. I have used the Racing Oil in my sports cars ever since. I think it's superior. -The Roxter -- _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 17 13:59:55 2009 From: Dan DiBiase To: Sam Bass , Mgs@autox.team.net Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 12:59:42 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Mgs] Unsubscribe.... No, you're OURS now, Sam!! Bwahahahahahah! Click on the second link in the bottom of the note to unsubscribe. Dan D Central NJ USA '76 MGB Tourer '65 MGB Tourer (Project) NAMGBR #5-2328 http://dans65b.blogspot.com/ http://dans76b.blogspot.com/ http://dansautoblog.blogspot.com/ http://mywebpages.comcast.net/dibiase/Working_MG_Gallery.html http://dans-life-blog.blogspot.com/ ________________________________ From: Sam Bass To: Mgs@autox.team.net Sent: Wednesday, June 17, 2009 3:44:40 PM Subject: [Mgs] Unsubscribe.... Please remove me from your email list..Thanks. You are subscribed as d_dibiase@yahoo.com Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 17 14:03:06 2009 From: Dan DiBiase To: Carl French , mgs , Bob Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 13:02:16 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Mgs] [Mg-t] Is Valvoline VR1 OK for everyday use? I'm sure it's okay for use in tractors, so it would be okay for a Triumph. ;-) Dan D Central NJ USA '76 MGB Tourer '65 MGB Tourer (Project) NAMGBR #5-2328 http://dans65b.blogspot.com/ http://dans76b.blogspot.com/ http://dansautoblog.blogspot.com/ http://mywebpages.comcast.net/dibiase/Working_MG_Gallery.html http://dans-life-blog.blogspot.com/ ________________________________ From: Carl French To: mgs ; Bob Donahue ; Karl Vacek Cc: mg-t Sent: Wednesday, June 17, 2009 3:21:51 PM Subject: Re: [Mgs] [Mg-t] Is Valvoline VR1 OK for everyday use? Let me say 'my bad' and look back into it. I think it was Hap Waldrop that I got that from. Carl --- On Wed, 6/17/09, Karl Vacek wrote: From: Karl Vacek Subject: Re: [Mg-t] [Mgs] Is Valvoline VR1 OK for everyday use? To: "Carl French" , "mgs" , "Bob Donahue" Cc: "mg-t" Date: Wednesday, June 17, 2009, 2:44 PM Are you certain about it being meant for daily use ?? There's been lots of discussion on the TRIUMPHS list about this very subject, and there's a general belief that all the Valvoline racing oils have less detergent, and thus require frequent changes because contaminants are NOT held in suspension as with normal motor oils. Particularly with an LBC that sees relatively little mileage, this would be a bad thing. Karl Vacek TC 6370 Subject: Re: [Mg-t] [Mgs] Is Valvoline VR1 OK for everyday use? > The term Racing in this app is mostly a marketing term. The oil is for daily > use. > Carl > > --- On Wed, 6/17/09, Bob Donahue wrote: > > Valvoline is touting it's VR1 racing oil as having plenty of Zinc (ZDDP I > guess). Is there any down side to using this "racing oil" in my non-racing > MGB > and TD? > > Bob Donahue (Still Stuck in the '50s) > Email - bobmgtd@comcast.net > Cars: 52 MGTD - #17639 > 71 MGB - #GHN5UB254361 > Member: NEMGTR #11470 > NAMGBR # 7-3336 > Hoosier MGB Club > Olde Octagons of Indiana > You are subscribed as leylandauto@yahoo.com You are subscribed as d_dibiase@yahoo.com Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 17 15:35:36 2009 From: "Ed's Shop" To: "mgs" , "mg-t" Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 16:36:36 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] [Mg-t] Is Valvoline VR1 OK for everyday use? <> THAT is a bit TO 'iffy' for me, Gene !!! I have BEEN using Castrol GTX 20w50 WITH the Lucas Additive in my daily driver '70 Camino AND that IS what's in the dozen or so motors I have re-built for customers for a tad OVER 2+ years with ZERO problems !!! K.I.S.S. & cheaper & with oil changes in the 3500-4000 miles. NFI & FWIW & YMMV & etc. & etc. & etc.!!!! Ed Please visit MY site at: www.justbrits.com _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 18 16:25:12 2009 From: aekell@aol.com To: mgs@autox.team.net Date: Thu, 18 Jun 2009 18:24:46 -0400 Subject: [Mgs] list have I been unsubscribed? Alan fresh from the workshop _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 18 16:33:30 2009 From: "Ed's Shop" To: Date: Thu, 18 Jun 2009 17:33:28 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] list <> Yep!!! , Alan!! Ed Please visit MY site at: www.justbrits.com _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 18 22:55:13 2009 From: Paul Root To: aekell@aol.com Date: Thu, 18 Jun 2009 23:54:28 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] list No. As Dan said yesterday, to unsubscribe, YOU have to click on the link below, and unsubscribe yourself. If you can't remember your password. YOU can ask for a reminder on that webpage. Then YOU will get an email with your password, which YOU can take to that site again, and unsubscribe. On Jun 18, 2009, at 5:24 PM, aekell@aol.com wrote: > have I been unsubscribed? > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 19 08:12:17 2009 From: To: "MG List" , "Ed's Shop" Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 10:11:51 -0400 Subject: Re: [Mgs] list Ed: Where the heck do you find the Castrol ZDDP? I went to my local Napa store and they never heard of ZDDP and tried to sell me all kinds of oil additives even though I explained the problem with the newer oils for our older British cars. Did we every resolve the issue with Valvoline racing oil? Is it ok to use in our non-racing LBC? I have always used Castrol 20-50 Frank "Swamp Yankee" _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 19 09:01:20 2009 From: "Rick Brown" To: "MG List" Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 11:01:06 -0400 Subject: Re: [Mgs] list Frank I have not been able to find the Castrol for Classic cars anywhere here in Florida - guess I should call the distributor in Tampa. I sent an email to Valvoline the other day and this is their response: The Valvoline Racing Oils do have a slightly less of a detergent package in the products, but the Valvoline VR1 Racing Oil product is still recommended for daily use vehicles that do not have a catalytic converter, which your vehicles should not, as it carries a 3 month/3,000 mile change interval. Using 5 quarts of the Valvoline VR1 Racing Oil will be perfectly fine and safe for use in your street vehicles. Rick Webmaster for: http://www.mgcars.org.uk/namgbr - The North American MGB Register http://www.mgcars.org.uk/mgcouncil - North American Council of MG Registers http://www.mgcars.org.uk/amgcr - American MGC Register http://www.flamemini.net - Florida mini Enthusiasts http://www.britishcarclub.net - Nature Coast English Car Club and The Suncoast Classic MG Club ----- Original Message ----- From: To: "MG List" ; "Ed's Shop" Sent: Friday, June 19, 2009 10:11 Subject: Re: [Mgs] list > Ed: Where the heck do you find the Castrol ZDDP? I went to my local Napa > store and they never heard of ZDDP and tried to sell me all kinds of oil > additives even though I explained the problem with the newer oils for our > older British cars. > Did we every resolve the issue with Valvoline racing oil? Is it ok to use > in our non-racing LBC? I have always used Castrol 20-50 > Frank "Swamp Yankee" _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 19 09:25:07 2009 From: "Paul Hunt" To: , "MG List" Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 15:53:20 +0100 Subject: Re: [Mgs] list You need to look at the API rating, which is an *indication* of ZDDP, but amongst the many claims from one manufacturer or another that theirs is better than anyone else's I have never seen and reliable comparisons of ZDDP content or protection. API SB and later are suitable for the MGB, but SL and SM have reduced ZDDP so SJ is the latest you should use. Valvoline VR1 is SL, claims to have 75% more ZDDP than SM, but I'd like to know how it compares with SJ. At least it is 20W/50, which isn't generally available in the UK any more. The other confusing thing is that despite the API ratings 20W/50 is said to contain more ZDDP than lower viscosities as 20W/50 isn't generally suitable for catalyst-equipped engines, the more recent ones at any rate. Royal Purple claims that its 10W/40 has 1500-1600ppm of ZDDP (again, how does that compare with other oils?) and states that even if it took all the ZDDP out it would still have 4-times the wear protection of VR1! You are best off looking at Diesel rated oils (if you can get them). Diesel engines need more anti-wear additives to protect the little ends, and those oils that quote both petrol and Diesel ratings generally have the older petrol ratings e.g. SJ along with the modern Diesel ratings e.g. CF. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- Did we every resolve the issue with Valvoline racing oil? Is it ok to use in our non-racing LBC? _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 19 09:29:40 2009 From: "Eugene Balinski" To: "Rick Brown" ,"MG List" Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 11:29:30 -0400 Subject: Re: [Mgs] list Anybody know why they have the "no catalytic converter" statement in there ? I have a cat on my 80 B, and I have been using the VR-1 Gene Balinski 80B On Fri, 19 Jun 2009 11:01:06 -0400 "Rick Brown" wrote: > Frank > > I have not been able to find the Castrol for Classic cars > anywhere here in Florida - guess I should call the > distributor in Tampa. > > I sent an email to Valvoline the other day and this is > their response: > > The Valvoline Racing Oils do have a slightly less of a > detergent package in the products, but the Valvoline VR1 > Racing Oil product is still recommended for daily use > vehicles that do not have a catalytic converter, which > your vehicles should not, as it carries a 3 month/3,000 > mile change interval. Using 5 quarts of the Valvoline VR1 > Racing Oil will be perfectly fine and safe for use in > your street vehicles. > > Rick > > Webmaster for: > http://www.mgcars.org.uk/namgbr - The North American > MGB Register > http://www.mgcars.org.uk/mgcouncil - North American > Council of MG > Registers > http://www.mgcars.org.uk/amgcr - American MGC Register > http://www.flamemini.net - Florida mini Enthusiasts > http://www.britishcarclub.net - Nature Coast English > Car Club and The > Suncoast Classic MG Club > ----- Original Message ----- From: > To: "MG List" ; "Ed's Shop" > > Sent: Friday, June 19, 2009 10:11 > Subject: Re: [Mgs] list > > > > Ed: Where the heck do you find the Castrol ZDDP? I went > to my local Napa > > store and they never heard of ZDDP and tried to sell me > all kinds of oil > > additives even though I explained the problem with the > newer oils for our > > older British cars. > > Did we every resolve the issue with Valvoline racing > oil? Is it ok to use > > in our non-racing LBC? I have always used Castrol 20-50 > > Frank "Swamp Yankee" > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > You are subscribed as eugeneb@nni.com > > > Mgs@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs > > http://www.team.net/archive --------------------------------------------------------------------- Web mail provided by NuNet, Inc. The Premier National provider. http://www.nni.com/ _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 19 10:04:08 2009 From: "Paul Hunt" To: "Eugene Balinski" , "MG List" Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 17:01:59 +0100 Subject: Re: [Mgs] list ZDDP and other metallic additives poison the catalyst and reduce their life, hence the lower level of additives in more recent formulations. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- Anybody know why they have the "no catalytic converter" statement in there ? I have a cat on my 80 B, and I have been using the VR-1 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 19 10:44:11 2009 From: "Ed's Shop" To: "MG List" Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 11:45:28 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] list <> In their Syn line, Frank. Dino DOES have the "reduced levels to 'protect' modern cats"!! <> While I CAN believe that they have never heard of "Castrol ZDDP", I do find in hard to believe they don't know about ZDDP itself?!?!? <> Did they try to sell you a Lucas Oil one?? or GM E.O.S. ?? If so, I mainly DO use (as I have said TOO many times) the Lucas Oil product along with Castrol GTX 20w50 in MY cars ('Caminos & '73 Black Tulip MGB [actually wife's] and BJ-7 Healey.) <> See Paul Root's post (and I still won't use & I WILL save MONEY)!! << I have always used Castrol 20-50>> Me to. If this ain't enough, USE THE ARCHIVES !!! Ed Please visit MY site at: www.justbrits.com _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 19 10:50:31 2009 From: "Ed's Shop" To: "MG List" Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 11:51:47 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] list <> Archives, Gene, <> NOT doing your motor any favors AND $5.00 says your cat is as empty as a used beer can!!! And BEEN that way for awhile!! Ed Please visit MY site at: www.justbrits.com _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 19 11:13:32 2009 From: "Larry Daniels" To: "Ed's Shop" , "MG List" Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 12:12:01 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] list OK, Ed, what is the ppm of ZDDP in your Lucas additive and your Castrol GTX 20W-50? Nothing anecdotal, Ed. Real numbers and make them current. Larry ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ed's Shop" To: "MG List" Sent: Friday, June 19, 2009 11:45 AM Subject: Re: [Mgs] list <> In their Syn line, Frank. Dino DOES have the "reduced levels to 'protect' modern cats"!! <> While I CAN believe that they have never heard of "Castrol ZDDP", I do find in hard to believe they don't know about ZDDP itself?!?!? <> Did they try to sell you a Lucas Oil one?? or GM E.O.S. ?? If so, I mainly DO use (as I have said TOO many times) the Lucas Oil product along with Castrol GTX 20w50 in MY cars ('Caminos & '73 Black Tulip MGB [actually wife's] and BJ-7 Healey.) <> See Paul Root's post (and I still won't use & I WILL save MONEY)!! << I have always used Castrol 20-50>> Me to. If this ain't enough, USE THE ARCHIVES !!! Ed Please visit MY site at: www.justbrits.com You are subscribed as ladaniels@sbcglobal.net Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 19 11:50:21 2009 From: To: "MG List" , "Rick Brown" Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 12:55:40 -0400 Subject: Re: [Mgs] list Rick: Unfortunately my 1980 LE has a cat but my 64 does not. Ed had mentioned on here that he uses Castrol ZDDP with every oil change. Eastwoood has it for $8.99 but they want $9.95 for shipping! Napa has never heard of it. I was wondering where it is available. The Classic Car Castrol would work but I have never been able to find it here. Ffrank ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rick Brown" To: "MG List" Sent: Friday, June 19, 2009 11:01 AM Subject: Re: [Mgs] list > Frank > > I have not been able to find the Castrol for Classic cars anywhere here in > Florida - guess I should call the distributor in Tampa. > > I sent an email to Valvoline the other day and this is their response: > > The Valvoline Racing Oils do have a slightly less of a detergent package > in the products, but the Valvoline VR1 Racing Oil product is still > recommended for daily use vehicles that do not have a catalytic converter, > which your vehicles should not, as it carries a 3 month/3,000 mile change > interval. Using 5 quarts of the Valvoline VR1 Racing Oil will be perfectly > fine and safe for use in your street vehicles. > > Rick > > Webmaster for: > http://www.mgcars.org.uk/namgbr - The North American MGB Register > http://www.mgcars.org.uk/mgcouncil - North American Council of MG > Registers > http://www.mgcars.org.uk/amgcr - American MGC Register > http://www.flamemini.net - Florida mini Enthusiasts > http://www.britishcarclub.net - Nature Coast English Car Club and The > Suncoast Classic MG Club > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: "MG List" ; "Ed's Shop" > Sent: Friday, June 19, 2009 10:11 > Subject: Re: [Mgs] list > > >> Ed: Where the heck do you find the Castrol ZDDP? I went to my local Napa >> store and they never heard of ZDDP and tried to sell me all kinds of oil >> additives even though I explained the problem with the newer oils for our >> older British cars. >> Did we every resolve the issue with Valvoline racing oil? Is it ok to use >> in our non-racing LBC? I have always used Castrol 20-50 >> Frank "Swamp Yankee" _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 19 12:09:49 2009 From: "Ed's Shop" To: "MG List" Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 13:11:06 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] list Larry The Lazy A**!!! <> Me?? Shirley YOU jest !!!!! Addition of 16 oz. to 4.5 quarts motor oil will achieve approximately 5,000 ppm of Zinc. <> FOUR (4) minutes ago. "Current" enough??? Ed Please visit MY site at: www.justbrits.com PS: Tech Sheet *.pdf WILL be added to "Various Articles" later this afternoon!! _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 19 12:20:11 2009 From: "Ed's Shop" To: "MG List" Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 13:19:13 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] list DAM* it Frank, can't you READ?????????? I did NOT say... <> Just 'cause we HAVE met & become friends does NOT give you the right to MIS-quote me!! At precisely 11:45AM THIS date, I typed: If so, I mainly DO use (as I have said TOO many times) the Lucas Oil product along with Castrol GTX 20w50 in MY cars ('Caminos & '73 Black Tulip MGB [actually wife's] and BJ-7 Healey.) Mad Ed _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 19 13:26:17 2009 From: "Larry Daniels" To: "Ed's Shop" , "MG List" Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 14:24:39 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] list Ed, really, 5000 ppm? Did you mean 1500? Can you cite sources for that? The question was how much in the oil and how much in the additive, individually. I would REALLY love to see your citation for your numbers. They are as outrageous as they are unbelievable. Recommended is around 1200 to 1500 ppm. Too much is not good. 5000? http://lnengineering.com/oil.html#Z1 I use Brad Penn Racing Oil. This is the old Kendall product. 1500 ppm of zinc and 1300 to 1400 ppm phosphorus. Endorsed by: Koerner Racing Cams Cam Motion Howard Cams Schneider Racing Cams Crower Cams Crane Cams http://www.bradpennracing.com/ http://www.bradpennracing.com/Zinc.html By the way, "lazy"? You made the claim; I only asked for your proof. It's not up to me to prove your statements. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ed's Shop" To: "MG List" Sent: Friday, June 19, 2009 1:11 PM Subject: Re: [Mgs] list Larry The Lazy A**!!! <> Me?? Shirley YOU jest !!!!! Addition of 16 oz. to 4.5 quarts motor oil will achieve approximately 5,000 ppm of Zinc. <> FOUR (4) minutes ago. "Current" enough??? Ed Please visit MY site at: www.justbrits.com PS: Tech Sheet *.pdf WILL be added to "Various Articles" later this afternoon!! _______________________________________________ _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 19 13:31:06 2009 From: To: "MG List" , "Larry Daniels" Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 15:30:42 -0400 Subject: Re: [Mgs] list Larry: Is it safe for cars with catalyic converters like my 1980? Earlier posts indicated that racing oil would destroy them Frank ----- Original Message ----- From: "Larry Daniels" To: "Ed's Shop" ; "MG List" Sent: Friday, June 19, 2009 3:24 PM Subject: Re: [Mgs] list > Ed, really, 5000 ppm? Did you mean 1500? Can you cite sources for that? > The question was how much in the oil and how much in the additive, > individually. I would REALLY love to see your citation for your numbers. > They are as outrageous as they are unbelievable. > > Recommended is around 1200 to 1500 ppm. Too much is not good. 5000? > > http://lnengineering.com/oil.html#Z1 > > I use Brad Penn Racing Oil. This is the old Kendall product. 1500 ppm of > zinc and 1300 to 1400 ppm phosphorus. > > Endorsed by: > > Koerner Racing Cams > Cam Motion > Howard Cams > Schneider Racing Cams > Crower Cams > Crane Cams > > http://www.bradpennracing.com/ > > http://www.bradpennracing.com/Zinc.html > > > > By the way, "lazy"? You made the claim; I only asked for your proof. > It's > not up to me to prove your statements. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Ed's Shop" > To: "MG List" > Sent: Friday, June 19, 2009 1:11 PM > Subject: Re: [Mgs] list > > > Larry The Lazy A**!!! > > < Lucas additive and your Castrol GTX 20W-50? > Nothing anecdotal, Ed.>> > > Me?? Shirley YOU jest !!!!! > > > Addition of 16 oz. to 4.5 quarts motor oil will > achieve approximately 5,000 ppm of Zinc. > > > <> > > FOUR (4) minutes ago. "Current" enough??? > > Ed > Please visit MY site at: > www.justbrits.com > > PS: Tech Sheet *.pdf WILL be added to > "Various Articles" later this afternoon!! > _______________________________________________ _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 19 15:10:51 2009 From: "Ed's Shop" To: "Larry Daniels" , "MG List" Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 16:11:36 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] list <> Yep!! www.lucasoil.com Me _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 19 15:24:52 2009 From: "Ed's Shop" To: "MG List" Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 16:23:42 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] list <> >From what I have read Frank, most likely 'hurts' newer cats. <> See above AND what I wrote Gene B. about his question. Same answer applies to your cat (and most likely EVERY ORGINAL-equipment Cat.)!! BTW, the link to Archives IS at the bottom of EVERY List Post. THIRD (3rd) link down from my sig (since I'll bet you ARE wondering) !!! LOL Ed Please visit MY site at: www.justbrits.com _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 19 15:29:45 2009 From: "Larry Daniels" To: "Ed's Shop" , "MG List" Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 16:28:12 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] list ED! Nowhere on that site does it say that their products even contain Zinc or ZDDP. Nowhere! Are you understanding the question? You write back when you actually have an answer, OK, Sunshine? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ed's Shop" To: "Larry Daniels" ; "MG List" Sent: Friday, June 19, 2009 4:11 PM Subject: RE: [Mgs] list <> Yep!! www.lucasoil.com Me _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 19 16:09:29 2009 From: "Ed's Shop" To: "00 - MGs" Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 17:10:47 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] list I had to 'clean' what I sent directly (and this does NOT have the attachment). What I said TO Larry: << <> YOU ARE OUTTA YOUR F***ING MIND!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! And if you think I took the TIME to make the attached up, you ARE CERTIFIABLELY INSANE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! >> Just thru the (attachment) *.pdf (need Adobe Reader) I referred to above: http://www.justbrits.com/Articles/LucasOil_TBzinc.pdf Ed Please visit MY site at: www.justbrits.com _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 19 17:09:22 2009 From: Glenn Schnittke To: mgs@autox.team.net Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 18:09:00 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] list > I have a cat on my 80 B, and I have > been using the VR-1 That won't get rid of the cat. Glenn _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 19 17:13:29 2009 From: Aaron Whiteman To: MG Mailing List Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 16:13:16 -0700 Subject: Re: [Mgs] list On Jun 19, 2009, at 4:09 PM, Glenn Schnittke wrote: >> I have a cat on my 80 B, and I have >> been using the VR-1 > > That won't get rid of the cat. A dog might. (I'm sorry. I just can't resist the opportunity. Maybe it's the hydrocodone) _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 19 17:16:38 2009 From: "Larry Daniels" To: "00 - MGs" Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 18:15:03 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] list OK, Ed (AKA Mr. Tact) was right. I looked under the Lucas Oil Additives as we were talking about, but instead Ed was talking about a break-in formula. Now, despite Ed's solution, read the FAQ cited below from somebody who actually knows what he is talking about regarding supplements that over-boost the ZDDP levels. Mr. Navarro specifically addresses this subject and warns pretty strongly against doing this. http://lnengineering.com/oil.html#Z13 If you are concerned with this subject, read the entire article and then make an informed decision. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 19 19:45:32 2009 From: Dan DiBiase To: Larry Daniels , 00 - MGs Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 18:45:14 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Mgs] list Thanks, Larry, now there will be NO living with him! :-) Dan D Central NJ USA '76 MGB Tourer '65 MGB Tourer (Project) NAMGBR #5-2328 http://dans65b.blogspot.com/ http://dans76b.blogspot.com/ http://dansautoblog.blogspot.com/ http://mywebpages.comcast.net/dibiase/Working_MG_Gallery.html http://dans-life-blog.blogspot.com/ ________________________________ From: Larry Daniels To: 00 - MGs Sent: Friday, June 19, 2009 7:15:03 PM Subject: Re: [Mgs] list OK, Ed (AKA Mr. Tact) was right. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 19 20:08:47 2009 From: "Larry Daniels" To: "Dan DiBiase" , "00 - MGs" Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 21:07:05 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] list LOL, Dan. I reconsidered that after it was too late. You can start hating me now. ;-)) Larry ----- Original Message ----- From: Dan DiBiase To: Larry Daniels ; 00 - MGs Sent: Friday, June 19, 2009 8:45 PM Subject: Re: [Mgs] list Thanks, Larry, now there will be NO living with him! :-) Dan D Central NJ USA '76 MGB Tourer '65 MGB Tourer (Project) NAMGBR #5-2328 http://dans65b.blogspot.com/ http://dans76b.blogspot.com/ http://dansautoblog.blogspot.com/ http://mywebpages.comcast.net/dibiase/Working_MG_Gallery.html http://dans-life-blog.blogspot.com/ ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- From: Larry Daniels To: 00 - MGs Sent: Friday, June 19, 2009 7:15:03 PM Subject: Re: [Mgs] list OK, Ed (AKA Mr. Tact) was right. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 19 21:34:53 2009 From: Glenn Schnittke To: mgs@autox.team.net Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 22:34:38 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] list >>> >> I have a cat on my 80 B, and I have >>> >> been using the VR-1 >> > >> > That won't get rid of the cat. > > > A dog might. Prestone. Dog might like the cat. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 20 06:42:25 2009 From: "Paul Hunt" To: "Glenn Schnittke" , Date: Sat, 20 Jun 2009 13:14:16 +0100 Subject: Re: [Mgs] list Takes me back to a looooong thread just after I joined, on how to get rid of cats from sleeping on the warm top. ----- Original Message ----- > I have a cat on my 80 B, and I have > been using the VR-1 That won't get rid of the cat. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 20 06:42:46 2009 From: "Paul Hunt" To: "Larry Daniels" , "00 - MGs" Date: Sat, 20 Jun 2009 13:30:34 +0100 Subject: Re: [Mgs] list Interesting, particularly the table of additive content of various oils *they tested*. However it says that zinc and phosphorus make up the ZDDP, and in the table it says SE to SJ have 1301ppm of zinc and 1280 of phosphorus, which surely means 2581 of ZDDP? Quite a bit more than the 1500-1600ppm being bandied about. On the face of it a useful comparison with SL and SM, but without knowing what the levels are in individual oils we are still largely in the dark. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- http://lnengineering.com/oil.html#Z13 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 20 08:27:13 2009 From: Dan DiBiase To: Paul Hunt , Glenn Schnittke Date: Sat, 20 Jun 2009 07:27:00 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Mgs] list Me too, Paul. I wasn't sure what I had gotten myself into.... ;-) Dan D Central NJ USA '76 MGB Tourer '65 MGB Tourer (Project) NAMGBR #5-2328 http://dans65b.blogspot.com/ http://dans76b.blogspot.com/ http://dansautoblog.blogspot.com/ http://mywebpages.comcast.net/dibiase/Working_MG_Gallery.html http://dans-life-blog.blogspot.com/ ________________________________ From: Paul Hunt To: Glenn Schnittke ; mgs@autox.team.net Sent: Saturday, June 20, 2009 8:14:16 AM Subject: Re: [Mgs] list Takes me back to a looooong thread just after I joined, on how to get rid of cats from sleeping on the warm top. ----- Original Message ----- > I have a cat on my 80 B, and I have > been using the VR-1 That won't get rid of the cat. _______________________________________________ _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 20 13:22:02 2009 From: To: "MG List" , "Larry Daniels" Date: Sat, 20 Jun 2009 15:21:37 -0400 Subject: Re: [Mgs] list Larry: That was too informative! I read the whole article several times. I understood much of it but some was too technical for me. I am still left wondering what oil to use. I was about to switch to Castrol Syntec at $6.50 a quart but that author said that he developed oil leaks in his engine which previously had none when he went from dino oil to synthetic. The Castrol Syntec says "it is engineered for classic cars". I assume that includes our MGBs. Frank ----- Original Message ----- From: "Larry Daniels" To: "00 - MGs" Sent: Friday, June 19, 2009 7:15 PM Subject: Re: [Mgs] list > OK, Ed (AKA Mr. Tact) was right. I looked under the Lucas Oil Additives > as > we were talking about, but instead Ed was talking about a break-in > formula. > > Now, despite Ed's solution, read the FAQ cited below from somebody who > actually knows what he is talking about regarding supplements that > over-boost the ZDDP levels. Mr. Navarro specifically addresses this > subject > and warns pretty strongly against doing this. > > http://lnengineering.com/oil.html#Z13 > > If you are concerned with this subject, read the entire article and then > make an informed decision. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 20 22:30:37 2009 From: don To: mgs@autox.team.net Date: Sat, 20 Jun 2009 21:30:09 -0700 Subject: [Mgs] Interesting TC on BAT http://bringatrailer.com/2009/06/19/seller-racing-it-since-1949-1948-mg-tc/ _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jun 21 04:45:47 2009 From: "Paul Hunt" To: , "MG List" Date: Sun, 21 Jun 2009 11:27:16 +0100 Subject: Re: [Mgs] list That is definitely more likely if you go to lower viscosities than you are used to, for *any* type of oil. Whether it is synthetic or not shouldn't make a difference. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- ... but that author said that he developed oil leaks in his engine which previously had none when he went from dino oil to synthetic... _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jun 21 05:17:00 2009 From: "Craig Tufty" To: Date: Sun, 21 Jun 2009 07:16:48 -0400 Subject: [Mgs] DC to Chicago Hello: Any suggestions of a "Blue Roads" route to Chicago from Washington, DC would be greatly appreciated. Thanks Craig Tufty Alexandria, Virginia 22307 72B _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jun 21 12:57:57 2009 From: Dan DiBiase To: MG-MGB@yahoogroups.com, MG List Date: Sun, 21 Jun 2009 11:57:44 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Mgs] [MG-MGB] Re: Fuel Pump Replacement - Now Blockage? Ok, I have blown through all of the lines. No blockages at all. There was plenty of fuel in the line between the pump and the filter, as it backed up into my mouth when I first blew through it (prior to unhooking the line at the filter)..... I ordered a new filter even though this one isn't blocked. I don't recall ever changing it before, so..... I am thinking that I am going to just try and start the car and see what happens. The motor is humming, there are no blockages, so it should work. My next problem is the starter but I think I have diagnosed that as well. Separate post for that. Dan D Central NJ USA '76 MGB Tourer '65 MGB Tourer (Project) NAMGBR #5-2328 http://dans65b.blogspot.com/ http://dans76b.blogspot.com/ http://dansautoblog.blogspot.com/ http://mywebpages.comcast.net/dibiase/Working_MG_Gallery.html http://dans-life-blog.blogspot.com/ ________________________________ _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jun 21 13:02:20 2009 From: Dan DiBiase To: mg-mgb@yahoogroups.com, MG List Date: Sun, 21 Jun 2009 12:01:27 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Mgs] On to the Next Challenge - Starter Ok, the symptoms are turn they key, no sound (from the starter) at all. According to Astley, it could be the battery (no, because I had it hooked up to my Audi), the ignition switch (no, because when I turn the switch, the fuel pump runs and instruments work) or the relay. My relay is a little melted on top, like it was lying against something hot (it isn't attached to the inner wing, just wedged into a spot. So I am going to order a new relay and see if that fixes it. I should note that the car has started and run since I put the new engine in it, so I assume that I have all of the starter wiring done correctly. Dan D Central NJ USA '76 MGB Tourer '65 MGB Tourer (Project) NAMGBR #5-2328 http://dans65b.blogspot.com/ http://dans76b.blogspot.com/ http://dansautoblog.blogspot.com/ http://mywebpages.comcast.net/dibiase/Working_MG_Gallery.html http://dans-life-blog.blogspot.com/ _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 22 02:13:19 2009 From: "Paul Hunt" To: "Dan DiBiase" , , "MG Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 09:11:42 +0100 Subject: Re: [Mgs] [MG-MGB] Re: Fuel Pump Replacement - Now Blockage?Nope.... Bench-test the pump by putting the suction end into (preferably) a container of paraffin, and the outlet into the same container but above fluid level, and power it up. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- I am thinking that I am going to just try and start the car and see what happens. The motor is humming, there are no blockages, so it should work. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 22 02:43:04 2009 From: "Paul Hunt" To: "Dan DiBiase" , , "MG Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 09:30:00 +0100 Subject: Re: [Mgs] On to the Next Challenge - Starter Not two white/brown on the starter relay, but one standard gauge white/red from the ignition switch and one thicker gauge white/brown to the solenoid. I'm assuming this is for the 76 as MGBs didn't have one until 1970. As such it could be a plastic relay, which could well have heat damage from poor connections internally i.e. bad contacts, although this would normally only affect continuously operated relays which the starter isn't of course. Before 76/77 the relays were metal canned so only show heat damage on the fibre base that carries the terminals. Of course of the relay has been hanging loose the brown terminal may have been shorting out, but that is likely to do more damage to the wiring than the relay case! Even though putting the battery on another car has proved the battery itself OK, it could be battery cable connections. Turn the lights on then turn the key to crank and if they dim right down it is battery or connections, if not it is the starter circuit. If not that and you can't even hear the relay click when you turn the key to crank (you should if you have the door and bonnet open) then it could be there is no voltage coming from the switch, it isn't getting to the relay on the white/red, or indeed the relay *is* faulty. You can check the latter by bridging the brown wire to the white/red terminal. If the relay clicks the problem is with the switch or the white/red wire. If it doesn't then the earth to the relay could be bad, you really need a meter to test/lamp to test with now to check the voltage conditions on all four wires with the key both operated and released, as there could be more than one problem anyway. If the relay clicks but no crank connect the brown to the white/brown and that should cause the solenoid to operate and the motor to crank. If it does then the relay is faulty, if it still doesn't then either the 12v supply on the brown is bad, the white/brown to the solenoid is bad, or the solenoid itself is bad. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- Ok, the symptoms are turn they key, no sound (from the starter) at all. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 22 05:39:03 2009 From: Paul Osborne To: mgs@autox.team.net Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 07:38:48 -0400 Subject: [Mgs] Starter Relay Ok, I give. What makes a MGB starter relay worth $99?? Just because they can? -- Paul Osborne University of Rochester Department of Electrical and Computer Engineering 201 Hopeman Building RC Rochester New York 14627 585-275-5226 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 22 05:58:25 2009 From: Tuck Southworth To: , , mg info list Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 07:58:13 -0400 Subject: Re: [Mgs] On to the Next Challenge - Starter Dan, Could be the relay but...... For what its worth I had the same problem with my 70 B. Fuel pump worked, as did the instruments, but turn the key to start and nothing. I thought it was the relay too until I checked with folks on the list. Even though I cleaned the battery connections someone suggested I remove and clean the cables because apparently even a small amt. of corrosion can be problematic. I found the corrosion hidden between the ground cable and the connection to the body. Cleaned it up and no issues. Cheap fix. Tuck > > Ok, the symptoms are turn they key, no sound (from the starter) at all. According to Astley, it could be the battery (no, because I had > it hooked up to my Audi), the ignition switch (no, because when I turn the switch, the fuel pump runs and instruments work) or the > relay. My relay is a little melted on top, like it was lying against something hot (it isn't attached to the inner wing, just wedged into a > spot. So I am going to order a new relay and see if that fixes it. > > I should note that the car has started and run since I put the new engine in it, so I assume that I have all of the starter wiring done > correctly. > > Dan D > Central NJ USA > '76 MGB Tourer > '65 MGB Tourer (Project) > NAMGBR #5-2328 > http://dans65b.blogspot.com/ > http://dans76b.blogspot.com/ > http://dansautoblog.blogspot.com/ > http://mywebpages.comcast.net/dibiase/Working_MG_Gallery.html > http://dans-life-blog.blogspot.com/ > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > You are subscribed as tsouthworth70@hotmail.com > > > Mgs@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 22 06:28:09 2009 From: Paul Root To: Paul Hunt Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 07:27:53 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] [MG-MGB] Re: Fuel Pump Replacement - Now Blockage?Nope.... Paraffin is kerosene here in America, I believe. Not wax. On Jun 22, 2009, at 3:11 AM, Paul Hunt wrote: > Bench-test the pump by putting the suction end into (preferably) a > container > of paraffin, and the outlet into the same container but above fluid > level, and > power it up. > > PaulH. > ----- Original Message ----- > I am thinking that I am going to just try and start the car and see > what > happens. The motor is humming, there > are no blockages, so it should work. > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > You are subscribed as ptrmgb@gmail.com > > > Mgs@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 22 06:31:52 2009 From: "Paul Hunt" To: , "Paul Osborne" Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 13:25:55 +0100 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Starter Relay Yes, because they can (which is why a dog licks it privates), but don't confuse 'worth' with 'cost'! :o) #27 in the UK, with the later round relays #16, and generic at #6. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- Ok, I give. What makes a MGB starter relay worth $99?? Just because they can? _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 22 07:02:49 2009 From: Dan DiBiase To: Paul Osborne , mgs@autox.team.net Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 06:02:36 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Mgs] Starter Relay LOL, good q, fortunately, I am able to use the later one which is $27 or so. I guess I could have gone generic as well. Dan D Central NJ USA '76 MGB Tourer '65 MGB Tourer (Project) NAMGBR #5-2328 http://dans65b.blogspot.com/ http://dans76b.blogspot.com/ http://dansautoblog.blogspot.com/ http://mywebpages.comcast.net/dibiase/Working_MG_Gallery.html http://dans-life-blog.blogspot.com/ ________________________________ From: Paul Osborne To: mgs@autox.team.net Sent: Monday, June 22, 2009 7:38:48 AM Subject: [Mgs] Starter Relay Ok, I give. What makes a MGB starter relay worth $99?? Just because they can? -- Paul Osborne University of Rochester Department of Electrical and Computer Engineering 201 Hopeman Building RC Rochester New York 14627 585-275-5226 You are subscribed as d_dibiase@yahoo.com Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 22 11:10:22 2009 From: Max Heim To: MG List Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 09:52:48 -0700 Subject: Re: [Mgs] list No, that is improper chemistry. 1300ppm zinc plus 1300ppm phosphorus doesn't equal 2600ppm of the compound -- if they are in equal proportions, it would still be 1300ppm of ZDDP. on 6/20/09 5:30 AM, Paul Hunt at paul.hunt1@blueyonder.co.uk wrote: > Interesting, particularly the table of additive content of various oils *they > tested*. However it says that zinc and phosphorus make up the ZDDP, and in > the table it says SE to SJ have 1301ppm of zinc and 1280 of phosphorus, which > surely means 2581 of ZDDP? Quite a bit more than the 1500-1600ppm being > bandied about. On the face of it a useful comparison with SL and SM, but > without knowing what the levels are in individual oils we are still largely in > the dark. > > PaulH. > > -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Mountain View, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 22 11:11:03 2009 From: Max Heim To: MG List Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 09:54:33 -0700 Subject: Re: [Mgs] On to the Next Challenge - Starter Does the relay need to be grounded (that is, properly bolted down)? -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Mountain View, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires on 6/21/09 12:01 PM, Dan DiBiase at d_dibiase@yahoo.com wrote: > Ok, the symptoms are turn they key, no sound (from the starter) at all. > According to Astley, it could be the battery (no, because I had > it hooked up to my Audi), the ignition switch (no, because when I turn the > switch, the fuel pump runs and instruments work) or the > relay. My relay is a little melted on top, like it was lying against something > hot (it isn't attached to the inner wing, just wedged into a > spot. So I am going to order a new relay and see if that fixes it. > > I should note that the car has started and run since I put the new engine in > it, so I assume that I have all of the starter wiring done > correctly. > > Dan D > Central NJ USA > '76 MGB Tourer > '65 MGB Tourer (Project) > NAMGBR #5-2328 > http://dans65b.blogspot.com/ > http://dans76b.blogspot.com/ > http://dansautoblog.blogspot.com/ > http://mywebpages.comcast.net/dibiase/Working_MG_Gallery.html > http://dans-life-blog.blogspot.com/ > _______________________________________________ _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 22 11:54:52 2009 From: Dan DiBiase To: Max Heim , MG List Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 10:52:18 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Mgs] On to the Next Challenge - Starter Good question, but I am going to assume 'no' since the one in my car has been the same since I purchased the car in 1988! Dan D Central NJ USA '76 MGB Tourer '65 MGB Tourer (Project) NAMGBR #5-2328 http://dans65b.blogspot.com/ http://dans76b.blogspot.com/ http://dansautoblog.blogspot.com/ http://mywebpages.comcast.net/dibiase/Working_MG_Gallery.html http://dans-life-blog.blogspot.com/ ________________________________ From: Max Heim To: MG List Sent: Monday, June 22, 2009 12:54:33 PM Subject: Re: [Mgs] On to the Next Challenge - Starter Does the relay need to be grounded (that is, properly bolted down)? -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Mountain View, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires on 6/21/09 12:01 PM, Dan DiBiase at d_dibiase@yahoo.com wrote: > Ok, the symptoms are turn they key, no sound (from the starter) at all. > According to Astley, it could be the battery (no, because I had > it hooked up to my Audi), the ignition switch (no, because when I turn the > switch, the fuel pump runs and instruments work) or the > relay. My relay is a little melted on top, like it was lying against something > hot (it isn't attached to the inner wing, just wedged into a > spot. So I am going to order a new relay and see if that fixes it. > > I should note that the car has started and run since I put the new engine in > it, so I assume that I have all of the starter wiring done > correctly. > > Dan D > Central NJ USA > '76 MGB Tourer > '65 MGB Tourer (Project) > NAMGBR #5-2328 > http://dans65b.blogspot.com/ > http://dans76b.blogspot.com/ > http://dansautoblog.blogspot.com/ > http://mywebpages.comcast.net/dibiase/Working_MG_Gallery.html > http://dans-life-blog.blogspot.com/ > _______________________________________________ You are subscribed as d_dibiase@yahoo.com Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 22 12:10:17 2009 From: Max Heim To: MG List Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 11:00:21 -0700 Subject: Re: [Mgs] On to the Next Challenge - Starter Next question: Is the melting of the relay caused by the terminal shorting out to the body, as it bounced around (in its unsecured state)? -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Mountain View, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires on 6/22/09 10:52 AM, Dan DiBiase at d_dibiase@yahoo.com wrote: > Good question, but I am going to assume 'no' since the one in my car has been > the same since I purchased the car > in 1988! > > Dan D > Central NJ USA > '76 MGB Tourer > '65 MGB Tourer (Project) > NAMGBR #5-2328 > http://dans65b.blogspot.com/ > http://dans76b.blogspot.com/ > http://dansautoblog.blogspot.com/ > http://mywebpages.comcast.net/dibiase/Working_MG_Gallery.html > http://dans-life-blog.blogspot.com/ > > > > > > ________________________________ > From: Max Heim > To: MG List > Sent: Monday, June 22, 2009 12:54:33 PM > Subject: Re: [Mgs] On to the Next Challenge - Starter > > Does the relay need to be grounded (that is, properly bolted down)? > > > -- > > Max Heim > '66 MGB GHN3L76149 > If you're near Mountain View, CA, > it's the primer red one with chrome wires > > on 6/21/09 12:01 PM, Dan DiBiase at d_dibiase@yahoo.com wrote: > >> Ok, the symptoms are turn they key, no sound (from the starter) at all. >> According to Astley, it could be the battery (no, because I had >> it hooked up to my Audi), the ignition switch (no, because when I turn the >> switch, the fuel pump runs and instruments work) or the >> relay. My relay is a little melted on top, like it was lying against >> something >> hot (it isn't attached to the inner wing, just wedged into a >> spot. So I am going to order a new relay and see if that fixes it. >> >> I should note that the car has started and run since I put the new engine in >> it, so I assume that I have all of the starter wiring done >> correctly. >> >> Dan D >> Central NJ USA >> '76 MGB Tourer >> '65 MGB Tourer (Project) >> NAMGBR #5-2328 >> http://dans65b.blogspot.com/ >> http://dans76b.blogspot.com/ >> http://dansautoblog.blogspot.com/ >> http://mywebpages.comcast.net/dibiase/Working_MG_Gallery.html >> http://dans-life-blog.blogspot.com/ _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 22 12:18:39 2009 From: The Roxter To: MG List Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 13:18:27 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] [MG-MGB] Re: Fuel Pump Replacement - Now Blockage?Nope.... Paul Hunt wrote: > Bench-test the pump by putting the suction end into (preferably) a container > of paraffin, and the outlet into the same container but above fluid level, and > power it up. A friend of mine in Canada tried to use similar advice. Not realizing that paraffin is the UK word for kerosene, he melted some paraffin (in USA and Canada, a petroleum-based wax) and used it in his carburetors and ruined them forever. No matter how much he heated them and tried to use compressed air to blow them out, they were never the same after that. -The Roxter -- _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 22 12:33:08 2009 From: Dan DiBiase To: Max Heim , MG List Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 11:32:55 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Mgs] On to the Next Challenge - Starter Could very well be, but I plan to attach the new one properly. Dan D Central NJ USA '76 MGB Tourer '65 MGB Tourer (Project) NAMGBR #5-2328 http://dans65b.blogspot.com/ http://dans76b.blogspot.com/ http://dansautoblog.blogspot.com/ http://mywebpages.comcast.net/dibiase/Working_MG_Gallery.html http://dans-life-blog.blogspot.com/ ________________________________ From: Max Heim To: MG List Sent: Monday, June 22, 2009 2:00:21 PM Subject: Re: [Mgs] On to the Next Challenge - Starter Next question: Is the melting of the relay caused by the terminal shorting out to the body, as it bounced around (in its unsecured state)? -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Mountain View, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires on 6/22/09 10:52 AM, Dan DiBiase at d_dibiase@yahoo.com wrote: > Good question, but I am going to assume 'no' since the one in my car has been > the same since I purchased the car > in 1988! > > Dan D > Central NJ USA > '76 MGB Tourer > '65 MGB Tourer (Project) > NAMGBR #5-2328 > http://dans65b.blogspot.com/ > http://dans76b.blogspot.com/ > http://dansautoblog.blogspot.com/ > http://mywebpages.comcast.net/dibiase/Working_MG_Gallery.html > http://dans-life-blog.blogspot.com/ > > > > > > ________________________________ > From: Max Heim > To: MG List > Sent: Monday, June 22, 2009 12:54:33 PM > Subject: Re: [Mgs] On to the Next Challenge - Starter > > Does the relay need to be grounded (that is, properly bolted down)? > > > -- > > Max Heim > '66 MGB GHN3L76149 > If you're near Mountain View, CA, > it's the primer red one with chrome wires > > on 6/21/09 12:01 PM, Dan DiBiase at d_dibiase@yahoo.com wrote: > >> Ok, the symptoms are turn they key, no sound (from the starter) at all. >> According to Astley, it could be the battery (no, because I had >> it hooked up to my Audi), the ignition switch (no, because when I turn the >> switch, the fuel pump runs and instruments work) or the >> relay. My relay is a little melted on top, like it was lying against >> something >> hot (it isn't attached to the inner wing, just wedged into a >> spot. So I am going to order a new relay and see if that fixes it. >> >> I should note that the car has started and run since I put the new engine in >> it, so I assume that I have all of the starter wiring done >> correctly. >> >> Dan D >> Central NJ USA >> '76 MGB Tourer >> '65 MGB Tourer (Project) >> NAMGBR #5-2328 >> http://dans65b.blogspot.com/ >> http://dans76b.blogspot.com/ >> http://dansautoblog.blogspot.com/ >> http://mywebpages.comcast.net/dibiase/Working_MG_Gallery.html >> http://dans-life-blog.blogspot.com/ You are subscribed as d_dibiase@yahoo.com Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 22 13:52:22 2009 From: Patrick Harris <1962mga1600mkii@bellsouth.net> To: MG List Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 15:52:03 -0400 Subject: [Mgs] MGA Oil leak rear main - possible solution?? I just saw the following at the LBC web site (lbcarco.com) and would like to know if anyone else has any experience with this recommendation: 05/24/09 Leaking 3 Main Engine? This Weeks Tech Tip Is From Frank Grimaldi. If you are experiencing oil leaks on a MGB/MGA 3-main or "T" Series engine you may want to consider the following: My 3-main MGB had significant oil leaks originating from the rear main and both ends of the oil pan. Rather than pull the engine to measure and correct the scroll clearance and reinstall the straight cork seals, I decided to first install a PCV valve. A PCV valve, if installed correctly, will create a vacuum in the crankcase of about minus 2 PSI and would draw air in and prevent oil from leaking out. I tried it and low and behold it worked! I used a PCV valve and related parts from a 1964 - 1967 MGB and a front tappet cover w/an oil separator from a 1967 MGB. The PCV valve and related items are available, new, from LBC. The tappet cover will have to be used, as they are not available new. Thanks, Pat _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 22 13:56:31 2009 From: Patrick Harris <1962mga1600mkii@bellsouth.net> To: MG List Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 15:56:19 -0400 Subject: [Mgs] MGA - gearbox dip stick markings On the MGA gearbox dip stick when the fluid level is at the "LOW" mark how much fluid is needed to raise the level to the "HIGH" mark? Thanks, Pat _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 22 14:24:56 2009 From: To: "MG List" Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 16:24:36 -0400 Subject: [Mgs] Oil After a brief search I found 20/50 Grade 1Brad Penn oil on Amazon for the best price. It's a partial synthetic and contains the additives necessary for our older MGs. Thanks to those of you who recommended it. I hope it's the right stuff! Frank Krajewski _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 22 14:32:25 2009 From: Simon Matthews To: frankk12@verizon.net Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 13:32:13 -0700 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Oil Did anyone comment on Amsoil? They have a 20/50W oil that has high zinc content for flat tappet engines. Simon On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 1:24 PM, wrote: > After a brief search I found 20/50 Grade 1Brad Penn oil on Amazon for the > best price. It's a partial synthetic and contains the additives necessary for > our older MGs. Thanks to those of you who recommended it. I hope it's the > right stuff! > Frank Krajewski > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > You are subscribed as simon.d.matthews@gmail.com > > > Mgs@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 22 15:02:21 2009 From: To: "MG List" Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 17:01:41 -0400 Subject: [Mgs] Fw: Oil ----- Original Message ----- From: To: "Simon Matthews" Sent: Monday, June 22, 2009 5:00 PM Subject: Re: [Mgs] Oil >I recall Amsoil being cited on here. After reading all of the posts I >decided to go with the Brad Penn. Too bad I just changed my oil too and >used plain old Castrol 20/25. I doubt that a few thousand miles on the new >Castrol will do any harm unless someone has evidence to the contrary. I >assumed it's similar to using unleaded gas in our cars. Unless you amass a >large amout of miles it will take a long time to do any damage I've been >told by a Jaguar restoration authority here in Rhode Island,Bill Bassett of >Bassett's Jaguars. > Frank Krajewski > Frank Krajewski > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Simon Matthews" > To: > Cc: "MG List" > Sent: Monday, June 22, 2009 4:32 PM > Subject: Re: [Mgs] Oil > > > Did anyone comment on Amsoil? They have a 20/50W oil that has high > zinc content for flat tappet engines. > > Simon > > On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 1:24 PM, wrote: >> After a brief search I found 20/50 Grade 1Brad Penn oil on Amazon for the >> best price. It's a partial synthetic and contains the additives necessary >> for >> our older MGs. Thanks to those of you who recommended it. I hope it's the >> right stuff! >> Frank Krajewski _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 22 15:06:40 2009 From: "Larry Daniels" To: , "MG List" Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 16:04:43 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Oil Frank, check around at your local speed shops. You might find it there and save shipping costs. I know of three places local to me that have it. Larry ----- Original Message ----- From: To: "MG List" Sent: Monday, June 22, 2009 3:24 PM Subject: [Mgs] Oil After a brief search I found 20/50 Grade 1Brad Penn oil on Amazon for the best price. It's a partial synthetic and contains the additives necessary for our older MGs. Thanks to those of you who recommended it. I hope it's the right stuff! Frank Krajewski You are subscribed as ladaniels@sbcglobal.net Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 22 16:06:58 2009 From: Barrie Robinson To: Paul Root ,Paul Hunt Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 13:40:16 -0400 Subject: Re: [Mgs] [MG-MGB] Re: Fuel Pump Replacement - Now Blockage?Nope.... I believe there is "paraffin" and something we called "parrafin wax" in UK At 08:27 AM 6/22/2009, Paul Root wrote: >Paraffin is kerosene here in America, I believe. Not wax. > >On Jun 22, 2009, at 3:11 AM, Paul Hunt wrote: > >>Bench-test the pump by putting the suction end into (preferably) a >>container >>of paraffin, and the outlet into the same container but above fluid >>level, and >>power it up. >> >>PaulH. >> ----- Original Message ----- >> I am thinking that I am going to just try and start the car and see >>what >>happens. The motor is humming, there >> are no blockages, so it should work. >>_______________________________________________ >>Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> >>You are subscribed as ptrmgb@gmail.com >> >> >>Mgs@autox.team.net >>http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs >> >>http://www.team.net/archive >_______________________________________________ >Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > >You are subscribed as barrie@look.ca > > >Mgs@autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs > >http://www.team.net/archive > > >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.81/2189 - Release Date: >06/20/09 06:15:00 Regards Barrie Barrie Robinson (705) 721-9060 http://www.britishv8.org/MG/BarrieRobinson.htm http://www.britcot.com _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 22 17:32:39 2009 From: Barney Gaylord To: Patrick Harris <1962mga1600mkii@bellsouth.net>, MG List Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 18:32:20 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] MGA - gearbox dip stick markings At 03:56 PM 6/22/2009 -0400, Patrick Harris wrote: >On the MGA gearbox dip stick when the fluid level is at the "LOW" mark >how much fluid is needed to raise the level to the "HIGH" mark? About a pint. I holds a total of about 3 US quarts. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 22 20:42:51 2009 From: "Eugene Balinski" To: "Larry Daniels" ,, Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 22:42:32 -0400 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Oil Have been away from the list for a bit. So does this mean that the Valvoline VR-1 racing oil is no longer in favor for our MGs ? Gene Balinski 80B On Mon, 22 Jun 2009 16:04:43 -0500 "Larry Daniels" wrote: > Frank, check around at your local speed shops. You might > find it there and > save shipping costs. > > I know of three places local to me that have it. > > Larry > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: "MG List" > Sent: Monday, June 22, 2009 3:24 PM > Subject: [Mgs] Oil > > > After a brief search I found 20/50 Grade 1Brad Penn oil > on Amazon for the > best price. It's a partial synthetic and contains the > additives necessary > for > our older MGs. Thanks to those of you who recommended it. > I hope it's the > right stuff! > Frank Krajewski > You are subscribed as ladaniels@sbcglobal.net > > > Mgs@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs > > http://www.team.net/archive > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > You are subscribed as eugeneb@nni.com > > > Mgs@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs > > http://www.team.net/archive --------------------------------------------------------------------- Web mail provided by NuNet, Inc. The Premier National provider. http://www.nni.com/ _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 22 22:07:43 2009 From: Carl French To: Larry Daniels , frankk12@verizon.net, MG Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 21:07:30 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Mgs] Oil No, it is still fine. Just don't confuse the real racing oil (behind the counter) with the common silver bottle ZR1 'racing' oil that is formulated for street cars (MGs). Carl Nothing at all wrong with the Brad Penn oil. That is great but hard for me to find and a bit pricey. --- On Mon, 6/22/09, Eugene Balinski wrote: From: Eugene Balinski Subject: Re: [Mgs] Oil To: "Larry Daniels" , frankk12@verizon.net, "MG List" Date: Monday, June 22, 2009, 10:42 PM Have been away from the list for a bit. So does this mean that the Valvoline VR-1 racing oil is no longer in favor for our MGs ? Gene Balinski 80B On Mon, 22 Jun 2009 16:04:43 -0500 "Larry Daniels" wrote: > Frank, check around at your local speed shops. You might > find it there and > save shipping costs. > > I know of three places local to me that have it. > > Larry > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: "MG List" > Sent: Monday, June 22, 2009 3:24 PM > Subject: [Mgs] Oil > > > After a brief search I found 20/50 Grade 1Brad Penn oil > on Amazon for the > best price. It's a partial synthetic and contains the > additives necessary > for > our older MGs. Thanks to those of you who recommended it. > I hope it's the > right stuff! > Frank Krajewski > You are subscribed as ladaniels@sbcglobal.net > > > Mgs@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs > > http://www.team.net/archive > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > You are subscribed as eugeneb@nni.com > > > Mgs@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs > > http://www.team.net/archive --------------------------------------------------------------------- Web mail provided by NuNet, Inc. The Premier National provider. http://www.nni.com/ You are subscribed as leylandauto@yahoo.com Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 23 02:08:11 2009 From: "Paul Hunt" To: "Max Heim" , "MG List" Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 08:59:57 +0100 Subject: Re: [Mgs] list But the 'million' refers to the final result. Yes I agree that if you add a dilution of 1300ppm to another dilution of 1300ppm, of the same product or different it doesn't matter, you still have a dilution of 1300ppm, because you now have double the quantity of final product you had before. But if you take a given quantity of a mixture of chemicals, each with its own ppm dilution, they are each expressed as a proportion of the total mixture, so they must all add up to a million parts per million in the final result. Is that not so? PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- No, that is improper chemistry. 1300ppm zinc plus 1300ppm phosphorus doesn't equal 2600ppm of the compound -- if they are in equal proportions, it would still be 1300ppm of ZDDP. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 23 02:08:48 2009 From: "Paul Hunt" To: "Max Heim" , "MG List" Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 09:02:02 +0100 Subject: Re: [Mgs] On to the Next Challenge - Starter No and Yes! No it doesn't need to be bolted down to be grounded, it has a ground wire to one of the winding terminals. But it does need to be bolted down for mechanical reasons i.e. to avoid unwanted flexing of the wires and eventual fracture. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- Does the relay need to be grounded (that is, properly bolted down)? _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 23 02:08:53 2009 From: "Paul Hunt" To: "Max Heim" , "MG List" Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 09:04:59 +0100 Subject: Re: [Mgs] On to the Next Challenge - Starter As I said before it's possible but in that case I'd expect the heat damage to be right by the terminal. You can get internal heat generation from faulty contacts which can cause a relay to get very hot, but only in continuously operated relays, not the intermittent operation of a starter relay. It's more likely to have come from an external source. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- Next question: Is the melting of the relay caused by the terminal shorting out to the body, as it bounced around (in its unsecured state)? _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 23 02:38:18 2009 From: "Paul Hunt" To: "Patrick Harris" <1962mga1600mkii@bellsouth.net>, "MG List" Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 09:10:26 +0100 Subject: Re: [Mgs] MGA Oil leak rear main - possible solution?? It's quite possible, but remember 3-main engines got PCV anyway in Feb 64 with the 18GA, as the article implies. Remember if it stops oil leaking out it may well also be pulling other stuff in. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- My 3-main MGB had significant oil leaks originating from the rear main and both ends of the oil pan. Rather than pull the engine to measure and correct the scroll clearance and reinstall the straight cork seals, I decided to first install a PCV valve. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 23 07:26:29 2009 From: "Bob Donahue" To: "mgs" Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 09:25:22 -0400 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Flushing the cooling system? I buy "Premix" because I'm lazy. I appreciate convenience. (Plus, I don't have to worry about the horrible lime in my tap water.) Bob Donahue (Still Stuck in the '50s) Email - bobmgtd@comcast.net Cars: 52 MGTD - #17639 71 MGB - #GHN5UB254361 Member: NEMGTR #11470 NAMGBR # 7-3336 Hoosier MGB Club Olde Octagons of Indiana ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bob Howard" To: Cc: Sent: Tuesday, March 10, 2009 3:42 PM Subject: Re: [Mgs] Flushing the cooling system? > "Premix" Prestone in this area of the USA is 50/50 mix. It costs about > 10% less per gallon than 100% Prestone. Why folks buy the premix puzzles > me, but one sees people leaving the stores with gallon jugs as often as > one sees them leaving with 100%. > > > > On Tue, 10 Mar 2009 20:37:06 +0200 "R. Martin Rogovein" > writes: >> > > The question still stands, just how hot does it have to be >> > > to have an MGB in good condition boil over? >> >> Well, FWIW, I've driven my more or less stock 70 roadster up the > > Also, they only sell premixed coolant here, supposedly optimized for >> the climate (often hot, never freezes, lots and lots of minerals in the > >> tap water) >> >> R Martin >> Herzliya Israel. > ____________________________________________________________ > Click here to find the perfect picture with our powerful photo search > features. > http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/BLSrjpTEuJCZT2wXBMmDuOO8c8zGPFSfbW7kiwYa6VAI7uZh2k81QGweZgM/ > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > You are subscribed as bobmgtd@comcast.net > > > Mgs@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 23 08:20:05 2009 From: "Bob Donahue" To: "mgs" Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 10:20:37 -0400 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Flushing the cooling system? I never understood the need for an overflow bottle. If you read the owner/shop manual on any "pre-overflow-bottle" car, you will discover that the radiator itself has a fill line or at least a spec about the fill level. In other words the very top of the radiator is supposed to be empty. The top of the radiator itself is the "overflow bottle". Perhaps too many people were blindly filling their radiators to the very top. The government decided to put the fill line "in your face" with the overflow bottle. Of course you can still fill the overflow bottle to the top. Then you need an overflow bottle for the overflow bottle ;-) I bet the auto makers are just thrilled about the overflow bottle requirement. They really needed something to fill the vast void under the hood of the modern car ;-) Bob Donahue (Still Stuck in the '50s) Email - bobmgtd@comcast.net Cars: 52 MGTD - #17639 71 MGB - #GHN5UB254361 Member: NEMGTR #11470 NAMGBR # 7-3336 Hoosier MGB Club Olde Octagons of Indiana ----- Original Message ----- From: "Denise Thorpe" To: Sent: Tuesday, March 10, 2009 9:12 PM Subject: Re: [Mgs] Flushing the cooling system? > Hi Paul, > > Since my last pontificating went over so well, I'll do it again. A > radiator boils over when the coolant increases in volume to the point that > the pressure overcomes the pressure limit of the radiator cap...something > about PV=nRT. If a car has an overflow bottle, like a late model B, the > air in the bottle is displaced and absorbs the extra volume so the coolant > never boils over. That's why there's an upper limit on filling the > bottle. Early Bs have an overflow tube so that extra volume is dumped on > the ground before it has a chance to bypass the radiator cap. The problem > with this is that the coolant is then gone for good and doesn't get sucked > back in like it would if it went into a bottle. So to answer your > question, Bs with the correct parts should never boil over. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 23 08:26:17 2009 From: "Bob Donahue" To: "mgs" Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 10:26:48 -0400 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Flushing the cooling system? While on the subject of flushing cooling systems, I've heard the term "burping" in conjunction with refilling the radiator. What is "burping"? Is this something I should be doing on my MGB and TD????? Bob Donahue (Still Stuck in the '50s) Email - bobmgtd@comcast.net Cars: 52 MGTD - #17639 71 MGB - #GHN5UB254361 Member: NEMGTR #11470 NAMGBR # 7-3336 Hoosier MGB Club Olde Octagons of Indiana _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 23 08:37:55 2009 From: Rick Lindsay To: paul.hunt1@blueyonder.co.uk, MGS Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 07:37:43 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Mgs] e-mail change Afternoon Paul, et al., I have changed my MGS e-mail delivery option to 'digest' so I will not get list posts immediately. Please feel free to e-mail me directly if I can help with anything (e.g. electrics, carbs, etc.), or if you just want to talk (e.g. Why on earth F1 management would want to leave Silverstone?!). regards, -rick / houston / texas / USA / Earth / Sol / Western Spiral Arm / Milky Way _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 23 08:59:25 2009 From: Richard Gosling To: Bob Donahue Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 15:59:13 +0100 Subject: [Mgs] Burping the cooling system While filling the coolant system, air can get trapped in some high points, such as the radiator top hose. Squeezing the top hose once you appear to be full can "burp" a bit of this air out. You'll never get every last bit out, but this can help. Richard & Sammy ('73 Black Tulip BGT) 2009/6/23 Bob Donahue > While on the subject of flushing cooling systems, I've heard the term > "burping" in conjunction with refilling the radiator. What is "burping"? Is > this something I should be doing on my MGB and TD????? _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 23 09:09:23 2009 From: "Eugene Balinski" To: "Bob Donahue" ,"mgs" Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 11:09:12 -0400 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Flushing the cooling system? Burping is the process of removing unwanted air from the cooling system. In some cars, enough air can hide in the way that hoses run and or in castings to prevent the proper filling of the cooling system, thereby causing overheating. Some cars even have air relief valves at certain parts of the cooling system that are opened when coolant is added. It is akin to removing the air from an older force hot water heating system in your house. I do not believe that this applies to early B's. Not sure about earlier cars. However, when I was filling my 80 B through the neck above the thermostat, the cooling system appeared full. I grabbed the lower radiator hoes, and gave it a squeeze. The coolant level in the funnel in the filer neck rose, then a bunch of air came out (hence the burp) and the coolant level retreated. I added more coolant and repeated the process until no more air was expelled. I believe that part of the problem is that the radiator on the late B's is an indirect fill type - i.e you need to put the coolant in the fill above the thermostat as well as in the expansion tank. This is what I have found. I am interested in hearing about the experiences of other on the list. Safety Fast, Gene 80 B On Tue, 23 Jun 2009 10:26:48 -0400 "Bob Donahue" wrote: > While on the subject of flushing cooling systems, I've > heard the term "burping" in conjunction with refilling > the radiator. What is "burping"? Is this something I > should be doing on my MGB and TD????? > > Bob Donahue (Still Stuck in the '50s) > Email - bobmgtd@comcast.net > Cars: 52 MGTD - #17639 > 71 MGB - #GHN5UB254361 > Member: NEMGTR #11470 > NAMGBR # 7-3336 > Hoosier MGB Club > Olde Octagons of Indiana > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > You are subscribed as eugeneb@nni.com > > > Mgs@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs > > http://www.team.net/archive --------------------------------------------------------------------- Web mail provided by NuNet, Inc. The Premier National provider. http://www.nni.com/ _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 23 09:23:55 2009 From: Phil Bates To: 'Patrick Harris' <1962mga1600mkii@bellsouth.net>, 'MG List' Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 10:05:56 -0700 Subject: Re: [Mgs] MGA Oil leak rear main - possible solution?? /eOi1lB: Permission denied _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 23 09:57:05 2009 From: saidel@camden.rutgers.edu To: Bob Donahue Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 11:56:43 -0400 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Flushing the cooling system? Quoting Bob Donahue: :> While on the subject of flushing cooling systems, I've heard the term > "burping" in conjunction with refilling the radiator. What is > "burping"? Is this something I should be doing on my MGB and TD????? Only if you can put it over your shoulder and pat it on its back! Bill Saidel ((not quite the '50s but the '60s were good) BMCSNJ 74.5 & 76 MGB > > Bob Donahue (Still Stuck in the '50s) > Email - bobmgtd@comcast.net > Cars: 52 MGTD - #17639 > 71 MGB - #GHN5UB254361 > Member: NEMGTR #11470 > NAMGBR # 7-3336 > Hoosier MGB Club > Olde Octagons of Indiana > _ _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 23 10:01:35 2009 From: "Paul Hunt" To: "Rick Lindsay" , "MGS" Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 17:01:16 +0100 Subject: Re: [Mgs] e-mail change Money, which is all Bernie Ecclestone is interested in, i.e. how much can he screw out of each venue, and it is solely down to him where races are put on as he owns all the rights, or at least speaks for CVC who do. It's why the very popular (with the teams and viewing public) American and Canadian races were dropped - he could get more money from the new middle and far eastern countries, and there are only so many races the teams can do. The breakaway teams have said they intend to return if they go ahead. Looking at the British GP last weekend I thought to myself there is no way Donnington is going to match that, let alone improve on it, and now we hear that Ecclestone has changed his stance from 'no way will Silverstone put it on again' to 'It will be back in 2010 if Donnington can't meet the requirements' because Donnington can't raise the finance, and that is only because he wants the money from one of them! Donnington is a nice enough circuit, but it is little more than a club circuit with spectators sitting on the grass. Silverstone gets no Government support, has to pay council tax on permanent stands even though they are only used three or four days per year, and even had to pay to improve the road network outside the circuit. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- ... . Why on earth F1 management would want to leave Silverstone?!). _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 23 10:01:42 2009 From: "Paul Hunt" To: "Eugene Balinski" , "Bob Donahue" Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 16:52:34 +0100 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Flushing the cooling system? Simply running an MGB through 2 or 3 heat-cool cycles with the heater tap open for at least part of the time (if it is summer) should be all that is required to eliminate all the air, I've never had to do any more than that on any car I have owned, and have drained and refilled both the 4-cylinder and V8 several times. "I bet the auto makers are just thrilled about the overflow bottle requirement. They really needed something to fill the vast void under the hood of the modern car ;-)" There's not that much space in modern cars (American trucks excluded) with their low frontal area which is for aerodynamic and pedestrian safety reasons. The MGB had to go with the remote expansion tank when the radiator moved forwards for the V8 and 77 and on 4-cylinder as there was no longer enough room for the header tank and particularly the radiator cap under even that bonnet. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- Burping is the process of removing unwanted air from the cooling system. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 23 10:38:38 2009 From: "Councill, David" To: "Bob Donahue" , "mgs" Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 10:37:22 -0600 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Flushing the cooling system? My 67BGT came with an overflow bottle. Here is a picture taken by the previous owner: http://cu.imt.net/~dcouncil/mg/99mgeng.jpg Although the 67BGT had a few alterations, it was still mostly original and I have started the process of reverting the car fully original (close that is, within reasonable means). The overflow bottle has been removed and I have replaced the air filters with original ones. However, the change has allowed me to compare the car with and without the overflow bottle. It of course isn't "needed" but it does provide some conveniences much preferred by the masses. It is easy to tell if coolant levels are low just by sight and easy to top up, even when the engine is hot. Without it, the car eventually starts running hotter than normal, maybe after six months or so, where upon I have to let the engine cool down until the radiator is under minimal pressure, and then top up the coolant. With the earlier models, it is easier to overfill which is no problem as it will overflow the excess to the ground through the overflow tube, leaving a small trail on the ground whereas the overflow bottle contains such leakage. So the overflow bottle does represent some small advances in coolant maintenance. David Councill 67 BGT 72 B 73 B -----Original Message----- From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Bob Donahue Sent: Tuesday, June 23, 2009 8:21 AM To: mgs Subject: Re: [Mgs] Flushing the cooling system? I never understood the need for an overflow bottle. If you read the owner/shop manual on any "pre-overflow-bottle" car, you will discover that the radiator itself has a fill line or at least a spec about the fill level. In other words the very top of the radiator is supposed to be empty. The top of the radiator itself is the "overflow bottle". Perhaps too many people were blindly filling their radiators to the very top. The government decided to put the fill line "in your face" with the overflow bottle. Of course you can still fill the overflow bottle to the top. Then you need an overflow bottle for the overflow bottle ;-) I bet the auto makers are just thrilled about the overflow bottle requirement. They really needed something to fill the vast void under the hood of the modern car ;-) Bob Donahue (Still Stuck in the '50s) Email - bobmgtd@comcast.net Cars: 52 MGTD - #17639 71 MGB - #GHN5UB254361 Member: NEMGTR #11470 NAMGBR # 7-3336 Hoosier MGB Club Olde Octagons of Indiana _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 23 11:07:22 2009 From: Phil Bates To: mgs@autox.team.net Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 11:49:27 -0700 Subject: [Mgs] MGA rear main oil leak? Should have sent this in text file format earlier. Are you sure it's your rear main seal?? I too have a 3 main B motor in my MGA. I have a leak. But the leak is transmission oil - and this is common. So common that there is a hole drilled in the bottom of the bellhousing to let the oil get out - should be a cotter pin in the hole to help direct oil out. Also, there really is no rear main seal in a 3 main MGB motor (or MGA motor). It's a tight fitting backplate with a scroll that should push any oil back to the pan......and there's a groove cut in the backplate to direct any leakage from there out in front of the flywheel, on ont the flywheel/clutch. Designed oil leaks - aren't they great!! It's not leaking, it's just marking it's territory. When it stops marking it's territory - then you know you have a problem. Phil Bates _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 23 11:40:14 2009 From: Max Heim To: MG List Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 10:26:26 -0700 Subject: Re: [Mgs] list No. We are talking about ZDDP as a compound, not about the individual atoms of zinc and phosphorus. I don't know the actual chemical formula for ZDDP , so let's use a simple example -- CO2, carbon dioxide, expressed as PPM in the atmosphere. Each molecule of CO2 contains one carbon atom and 2 oxygen atoms. So, if there is, say, 1000ppm of carbon dioxide in a mixed gas, you could also say there is 1000ppm of carbon, or 2000ppm of oxygen. But you don't add the carbon and the oxygen to get 3000ppm of CO2 -- it's 1000ppm for the entire molecule of the compound. -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Mountain View, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires on 6/23/09 12:59 AM, Paul Hunt at paul.hunt1@blueyonder.co.uk wrote: > But the 'million' refers to the final result. Yes I agree that if you add a > dilution of 1300ppm to another dilution of 1300ppm, of the same product or > different it doesn't matter, you still have a dilution of 1300ppm, because you > now have double the quantity of final product you had before. But if you take > a given quantity of a mixture of chemicals, each with its own ppm dilution, > they are each expressed as a proportion of the total mixture, so they must all > add up to a million parts per million in the final result. Is that not so? > > PaulH. > ----- Original Message ----- > > > No, that is improper chemistry. 1300ppm zinc plus 1300ppm phosphorus doesn't > equal 2600ppm of the compound -- if they are in equal proportions, it would > still be 1300ppm of ZDDP. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 23 12:05:05 2009 From: "R. Martin Rogovein" To: "Mg Mailing List" Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 20:59:49 +0300 Subject: [Mgs] Flushing the cooling system? They ONLY sell premix here (israel )for exactly that reason. Our water has a very high calcium content, leaves white chalky deposits on everything. (in Hebrew they call it mayim yerukim - 'green water') ___________________________________________________ Once upon a time, long long ago in a far away land where there were no cellular phones, people used to engage in an ancient cultural tradition called "making plans." According to the history books it was a primitive way of arranging to see each other in which one person would suggest a specific date, time, and location, and the other person would either agree, or suggest an alternative until they reached an agreement. And then, without any intervening phone calls or other communication, both parties would actually show up to the agreed upon location at the agreed upon hour. It's amazing, in that primitive culture, that anyone had any friends at all. --KBN ___________________________________________________ _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 23 16:30:59 2009 From: "Stephen West-fisher" To: "'mgs'" Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 18:30:18 -0400 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Flushing the cooling system? I've always put an overflow bottle on the overflow tube so that nasty antifreeze doesn't get on the ground should there be a small overheat episode. Didn't help on the F-150 last Saturday, the upper hose blew :-) All over the front of the truck, windshield, mirrors, etc. The hose still feels nice and pliable except right where it gets close to the thermostat housing. Being original equipment on a 15 year old truck should have given me a clue. -- Stephen West-Fisher Coastal Data Systems 727.599.4271 http://www.coastaldatasystems.com/ -----Original Message----- From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Bob Donahue Sent: Tuesday, June 23, 2009 10:21 AM To: mgs Subject: Re: [Mgs] Flushing the cooling system? I never understood the need for an overflow bottle. If you read the owner/shop manual on any "pre-overflow-bottle" car, you will discover that the radiator itself has a fill line or at least a spec about the fill level. In other words the very top of the radiator is supposed to be empty. The top of the radiator itself is the "overflow bottle". _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 23 16:32:27 2009 From: "Stephen West-fisher" To: "'mgs'" Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 18:31:57 -0400 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Burping the cooling system And many vehicles these days actually have a bleed screw at some high point to let the last of the air out. -- Stephen West-Fisher Coastal Data Systems 727.599.4271 http://www.coastaldatasystems.com/ -----Original Message----- From: mgs-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Richard Gosling Sent: Tuesday, June 23, 2009 10:59 AM To: Bob Donahue Cc: mgs Subject: [Mgs] Burping the cooling system While filling the coolant system, air can get trapped in some high points, such as the radiator top hose. Squeezing the top hose once you appear to be full can "burp" a bit of this air out. You'll never get every last bit out, but this can help. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 23 16:39:49 2009 From: Richard Ewald To: Stephen West-fisher Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 15:39:38 -0700 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Burping the cooling system Poor man's LBC bleed screw. Park the car on an inclined driveway with the radiator higher than the rest of the car. If you live in the flats, jack the front end of the car up. Give the hard job to the lazy guy, he will find the easy way to do it. Rick On Tue, Jun 23, 2009 at 3:31 PM, Stephen West-fisher < steve@coastaldatasystems.com> wrote: > And many vehicles these days actually have a bleed screw at some high point > to let the last of the air out. > > -- > Stephen West-Fisher > Coastal Data Systems > 727.599.4271 > http://www.coastaldatasystems.com/ _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 24 02:24:12 2009 From: "Paul Hunt" To: "mgs" Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 09:11:46 +0100 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Flushing the cooling system? Is that pressurised or unpressurised? The latter I suspect as you say you can topup when the engine is hot. That's quite different to a remote pressurised expansion tank, and no MGB should need one if the system is working correctly and one isn't trying to keep it overfilled. You can have an overflow bottle on a remote expansion tank of course, and while I had a problem with my V8 cooling system that is what I had. Air bubbles were pressurising the system and forcing coolant into the expansion tank which eventually filled it and overflowed, lowering the level in the radiator and engine in the process. Periodically I had to pour the overflow bottle (rather than lose it and have to topup from another container) back into the radiator and blow the contents of the expansion tank back in as well. The only time an overflow bottle might give some piece of mind is with the earlier rear fill radiators where you can't see the tubes through the filler, but even then if you remove the cap when still warm you should be able to see it in the bottom of the angled tube even though you may not when it is cold. Incidentally it is only under extreme or fault conditions that I haven't been able to remove a radiator cap when at normal running temperature without boiling or overflowing, even on the V8. On the roadster I have never had a problem, it just gives a slight hiss and that is all. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- However, the change has allowed me to compare the car with and without the overflow bottle. It of course isn't "needed"... _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 24 02:24:54 2009 From: "Paul Hunt" To: "mgs" Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 08:57:20 +0100 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Flushing the cooling system? Well, of course, because the expansion tank is below the radiator, that is why there is the filler plug in the thermostat housing of 4-cylinder cars and in the top of the radiator of V8s. That is where you should fill the system, all you put in the expansion tank is enough to bring it up about half-way, then over 2 or 3 heat-cool cycles top-up the expansion tank as required. ----- Original Message ----- ... I believe that part of the problem is that the radiator on the late B's is an indirect fill type - i.e you need to put the coolant in the fill above the thermostat as well as in the expansion tank. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 24 02:54:08 2009 From: "Paul Hunt" To: "'mgs'" Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 09:31:49 +0100 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Burping the cooling system My 2004 ZS has a bleed screw - but in the *bottom* hose to let air out *while the system is being refilled*. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- And many vehicles these days actually have a bleed screw at some high point to let the last of the air out. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 24 02:54:25 2009 From: "Paul Hunt" To: "Max Heim" , "MG List" Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 09:51:55 +0100 Subject: Re: [Mgs] list Yes ZDDP is a compound, but it is obtained by the producer indicating he has added specific concentrations of zinc and phosphorus to a base product. Take sea-water. If you ignore all other compounds and constituents other than salt and water, there is about 3.5% salt and 96.5% water. Adding the two together you get 100%. Expressing things as a percentage is the same as expressing them as 'parts per hundred'. Parts per hundred is never or very rarely used of course, but parts per thousand and parts per million are, the only difference is they have more zeros but are used for convenience to express very small quantities. 3.5% is the same as 35 parts per thousand or 35,000 parts per million. The water would be 965 parts per thousand or 965000 parts per million. Add the two together and you get 100, 1000 or 100000 as appropriate. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- No. We are talking about ZDDP as a compound, not about the individual atoms of zinc and phosphorus. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 24 14:57:03 2009 From: "Hans Duinhoven" To: "Paul Root" , "Paul Hunt" Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 22:56:50 +0200 Subject: Re: [Mgs] [MG-MGB] Re: Fuel Pump Replacement - Now Blockage?Nope.... LOL - The US and British guys have similar language mixup's as we Dutch have with the Belgians. Basicly we speak the same laguage, but there are lots of differences, and may word have different meanings... Cheers, Hans ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul Root" To: "Paul Hunt" Cc: "MG List" ; Sent: Monday, June 22, 2009 2:27 PM Subject: Re: [Mgs] [MG-MGB] Re: Fuel Pump Replacement - Now Blockage?Nope.... > Paraffin is kerosene here in America, I believe. Not wax. > > On Jun 22, 2009, at 3:11 AM, Paul Hunt wrote: > >> Bench-test the pump by putting the suction end into (preferably) a >> container >> of paraffin, and the outlet into the same container but above fluid >> level, and >> power it up. >> >> PaulH. >> ----- Original Message ----- >> I am thinking that I am going to just try and start the car and see >> what >> happens. The motor is humming, there >> are no blockages, so it should work. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 24 17:29:21 2009 From: Max Heim To: MG List Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 16:28:25 -0700 Subject: [Mgs] Looking for LBC mechanic in North Bay I have a friend who is is suddenly having gear selection troubles in her 67 MG Midget. Her previous mechanic has passed on, so I said I would try to solicit some recommendations for a mechanic in the Sebastopol/Santa Rosa/Petaluma area. TIA for any suggestions. -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Mountain View, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 24 19:02:21 2009 From: Ron Engelhardt To: mgs Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 18:02:06 -0700 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Looking for LBC mechanic in North Bay She should try British European Motors in Rohnert Park. I think they bought Waterloo drive trains a while back. They aren't cheap but they are good and should be able to sort out her problems. She should also consider joining our club, North Bay British Carclub (Nobbc). She can send me an email at nobbc@sonic.net for more help or information. Ron 58 MGA Max Heim wrote: > I have a friend who is is suddenly having gear selection troubles in her 67 > MG Midget. Her previous mechanic has passed on, so I said I would try to > solicit some recommendations for a mechanic in the Sebastopol/Santa > Rosa/Petaluma area. > > TIA for any suggestions. > > > -- > > Max Heim > '66 MGB GHN3L76149 > If you're near Mountain View, CA, > it's the primer red one with chrome wires _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 25 11:10:23 2009 From: Max Heim To: MG List Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2009 10:03:19 -0700 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Looking for LBC mechanic in North Bay Thanks very much for the recommendation. I will pass it along. Cheers -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Mountain View, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires on 6/24/09 6:02 PM, Ron Engelhardt at hardt@sonic.net wrote: > She should try British European Motors in Rohnert Park. I think they > bought Waterloo drive trains a while back. They aren't cheap but they > are good and should be able to sort out her problems. She should also > consider joining our club, North Bay British Carclub (Nobbc). She can > send me an email at nobbc@sonic.net for more help or information. > > Ron > 58 MGA > > Max Heim wrote: >> I have a friend who is is suddenly having gear selection troubles in her 67 >> MG Midget. Her previous mechanic has passed on, so I said I would try to >> solicit some recommendations for a mechanic in the Sebastopol/Santa >> Rosa/Petaluma area. >> >> TIA for any suggestions. >> >> >> -- >> >> Max Heim >> '66 MGB GHN3L76149 >> If you're near Mountain View, CA, >> it's the primer red one with chrome wires _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jun 28 18:23:00 2009 From: Jack Feldman To: mgs@autox.team.net Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 19:22:44 -0500 Subject: [Mgs] Brake Fluid Loss The problem of brake fluid loss has come up several times. both in the Driveline, and on the Healey list. In both cases the car had brake boosters, and the suggested solution was the boosters. I have a 72 without brake boosters. The fluid keeps going down, and needs more from time to time. A more than competent mechanic has examined the car and says the brake cylinders and lines are fine, with no evidence of leaking from anything he has inspected. Obviously, I can't be leaking fluid! Any suggestions as to where to look. Jack _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jun 28 19:14:51 2009 From: "Maynard Hirsch" To: Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 20:14:36 -0500 Subject: [Mgs] Brake Fluid loss It is normal for the fluid level iln the master to drop as the pads wear. Excess loss different. Maynard ____________________________________________________________ See the difference a digital projector can make. Click now! http://thirdpartyoffers.netzero.net/TGL2241/fc/BLSrjpYZebkl9rjQoIqeioM7FZoXUTYGtSvZG2UJtSztQK1MS51d6EOCrlO/ _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jun 28 19:46:22 2009 From: Max Heim To: MG List Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 17:34:18 -0700 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Brake Fluid Loss You realize, of course, that the fluid level will naturally go down as the brake pads wear, and when you adjust the drum brakes. Other than that, a possible cause of a "hidden" fluid loss may be between the plies of a brake hose -- it may swell up under pressure, but look normal when inspected. You didn't mention inspecting the master cylinder. Any liquid in the driver's footwell? -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Mountain View, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires on 6/28/09 5:22 PM, Jack Feldman at qualitas.jack@gmail.com wrote: > The problem of brake fluid loss has come up several times. both in the > Driveline, and on the Healey list. In both cases the car had brake > boosters, and the suggested solution was the boosters. > > I have a 72 without brake boosters. The fluid keeps going down, and needs > more from time to time. A more than competent mechanic has examined the car > and says the brake cylinders and lines are fine, with no evidence of leaking > from anything he has inspected. > > Obviously, I can't be leaking fluid! Any suggestions as to where to look. > > Jack _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jun 28 23:00:07 2009 From: rabeys@aol.com To: mgs@autox.team.net Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 00:59:37 -0400 Subject: [Mgs] clutch? I took a long road trip recently and noticed I was having difficulty downshifting to 3rd...even if I double clutched.? I noticed that there was substantial shaking in the gear shift.? So bad that if you grabbed onto it and held it tight, it felt like it was shaking your whole body.? Bad enough that the vibration caused part of the heat shield for my carbs to break off.? When I stopped to see what fell off the car...again, I was unable to shift the car into gear after I started her.? If the car is off, I can shift into any gear whether or not the clutch is in or out.? If the car is running and I started it in neutral, I am unable to get it into any gear...clutch depressed of course.? If I stop the car, and put her in 2nd, I am able to start her and drive in 2nd...however, if I attempt to shift while driving, I am only able to put her in neutral and then I am unable to get her back into 2nd.? The last time I had tranny work done was in 2006.? In looking at the receipt, it doesnt look like clutch work was done at the same time.? Does this sound like a clutch issue?? Throw out bearing?? Thinking and hoping it is not the tranny again. Appreciate any help...Stephanie _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jun 28 23:48:47 2009 From: Mark J Bradakis To: MG LIST Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 23:52:24 -0600 Subject: [Mgs] MGC wire wheel hub? I took the wire wheels off a customer's MGC. He has three rights and one left side adapter. Anyone have a spare left side adapter and nut that fits the 5 lug MGC pattern? mjb. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 29 02:10:09 2009 From: Richard Gosling To: rabeys@aol.com Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 09:09:53 +0100 Subject: Re: [Mgs] clutch? Yes Stephanie, that sounds like a clutch issue. There are some springs in the clutch plate, these can break and jam the clutch so it is permanently engaged, even though the pedal feels normal when you press it - that would also cause the clutch to be unbalanced, causing that vibration. That happened to my Spitfire many moons ago. There are probably other causes, but it will be a clutch problem of some sort. Does the clutch pedal feel normal when you press it? In any case, something is wrong with the clutch, exactly what will become apparent when you take it apart. But, since you have to get it apart anyway, you might as well replace everything in there while it is open - clutch and throw-out bearing. Richard & Sammy ('73 Black Tulip BGT) 2009/6/29 > I took a long road trip recently and noticed I was having difficulty > downshifting to 3rd...even if I double clutched.? I noticed that there was > substantial shaking in the gear shift.? So bad that if you grabbed onto it > and held it tight, it felt like it was shaking your whole body.? Bad enough > that the vibration caused part of the heat shield for my carbs to break > off.? When I stopped to see what fell off the car...again, I was unable to > shift the car into gear after I started her.? > > If the car is off, I can shift into any gear whether or not the clutch is > in or out.? If the car is running and I started it in neutral, I am unable > to get it into any gear...clutch depressed of course.? If I stop the car, > and put her in 2nd, I am able to start her and drive in 2nd...however, if I > attempt to shift while driving, I am only able to put her in neutral and > then I am unable to get her back into 2nd.? > > The last time I had tranny work done was in 2006.? In looking at the > receipt, it doesnt look like clutch work was done at the same time.? Does > this sound like a clutch issue?? Throw out bearing?? Thinking and hoping it > is not the tranny again. > > Appreciate any help...Stephanie > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > You are subscribed as rbgosling@googlemail.com > > > Mgs@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 29 07:37:57 2009 From: "oliver" To: Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 08:36:58 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] clutch? replace the pilot bearing as well. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Richard Gosling" To: Cc: Sent: Monday, June 29, 2009 3:09 AM Subject: Re: [Mgs] clutch? > Yes Stephanie, that sounds like a clutch issue. There are some springs in > the clutch plate, these can break and jam the clutch so it is permanently > engaged, even though the pedal feels normal when you press it - that would > also cause the clutch to be unbalanced, causing that vibration. That > happened to my Spitfire many moons ago. There are probably other causes, > but it will be a clutch problem of some sort. > > Does the clutch pedal feel normal when you press it? > > In any case, something is wrong with the clutch, exactly what will become > apparent when you take it apart. But, since you have to get it apart > anyway, you might as well replace everything in there while it is open - > clutch and throw-out bearing. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 29 07:43:23 2009 From: Dan DiBiase To: mg-mgb@yahoogroups.com, mg info list Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 06:43:11 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Mgs] On to the Next Challenge - Starter Sorry to interrupt the personal banter on the Yahoo MGB group with a technical post. Just thought I would update on my progress. I've resolved the fuel pump issues, got the new one working - at least, it is pumping gas forward into the new fuel filter. I installed the new relay but still hase the same result. So I am going to remove and clean the battery cable and check the other connections. Once my aching back feels a bit better. Twisted funny getting out of my car and it's really complaining about doing anything except sitting around. And even that hurts. Dan D Central NJ USA '76 MGB Tourer '65 MGB Tourer (Project) NAMGBR #5-2328 http://dans65b.blogspot.com/ http://dans76b.blogspot.com/ http://dansautoblog.blogspot.com/ http://mywebpages.comcast.net/dibiase/Working_MG_Gallery.html http://dans-life-blog.blogspot.com/ ________________________________ From: Tuck Southworth To: d_dibiase@yahoo.com; mg-mgb@yahoogroups.com; mg info list Sent: Monday, June 22, 2009 7:58:13 AM Subject: RE: [Mgs] On to the Next Challenge - Starter Dan, Could be the relay but...... For what its worth I had the same problem with my 70 B. Fuel pump worked, as did the instruments, but turn the key to start and nothing. I thought it was the relay too until I checked with folks on the list. Even though I cleaned the battery connections someone suggested I remove and clean the cables because apparently even a small amt. of corrosion can be problematic. I found the corrosion hidden between the ground cable and the connection to the body. Cleaned it up and no issues. Cheap fix. Tuck > > Ok, the symptoms are turn they key, no sound (from the starter) at all. According to Astley, it could be the battery (no, because I had > it hooked up to my Audi), the ignition switch (no, because when I turn the switch, the fuel pump runs and instruments work) or the > relay. My relay is a little melted on top, like it was lying against something hot (it isn't attached to the inner wing, just wedged into a > spot. So I am going to order a new relay and see if that fixes it. > > I should note that the car has started and run since I put the new engine in it, so I assume that I have all of the starter wiring done > correctly. > > Dan D > Central NJ USA > '76 MGB Tourer > '65 MGB Tourer (Project) > NAMGBR #5-2328 > http://dans65b.blogspot.com/ > http://dans76b.blogspot.com/ > http://dansautoblog.blogspot.com/ > http://mywebpages.comcast.net/dibiase/Working_MG_Gallery.html > http://dans-life-blog.blogspot.com/ _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 29 08:56:04 2009 From: "Paul Hunt" To: "oliver" , Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 15:39:56 +0100 Subject: Re: [Mgs] clutch? And what about the crank oil seal? Or the gearbox oil seal? How about the gearbox bearing? The problem is knowing where to stop, whether to hope the disturbance won't cause existing oil seals to leak, or whether to replace anyway and hope that the new ones don't leak! PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- replace the pilot bearing as well. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 29 08:56:31 2009 From: "Paul Hunt" To: "Dan DiBiase" , , "mg Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 15:52:40 +0100 Subject: Re: [Mgs] On to the Next Challenge - Starter So remind us exactly what is and isn't happening when you try to crank. 1. Do you have any lights available, like headlights or the ignition warning light? If so what happens to those when you turn the key to start? If they dim right down then it is indeed battery and solenoid connections you should be looking at. 2. Does the relay click? If not you need to check the voltages on the white/red and black *terminals of the relay* with the key turned. White/red should show 12v and black should show 0v. Is the relay connected correctly? White/red and black should go to W1 or W2 (doesn't matter which way round they go) for a rectangular relay, 85 and 86 if a later cylindrical or cube relay. 3. Does the relay click but the solenoid not clunk? If so you need to check the voltages on the brown and brown/white at the relay with the key turned. Both should show 12v. They go to C1 and C2 on rectangular relays, 30 and 87 on the others (again doesn't matter which way round). 4. If all that is OK you need to check the voltage on the spade terminals at the solenoid. If you only have one spade that should be the operate terminal, with a brown/white wire, which should have 12v when you turn the key. If that's there then the solenoid is faulty. If you have two terminals and two wires on them try swapping those wires over. The second terminal is the coil boost terminal. It *should* have a smaller spade, but rebuilt starters in particular seem to have the same size on both. If you only have one visible spade make sure it isn't the coil boost spade and the solenoid operate terminal hasn't snapped off and the stub is hiding under grime. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- I installed the new relay but still hase the same result. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 29 09:34:48 2009 From: "oliver" To: Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 10:34:28 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] clutch? i'm sorry - i really object. when replacing the clutch its common sense to spend a few more bucks to get the pilot bearing as well. you are there; its easy to replace, and only a few bucks. it is often not necessary, but i know a few cases where it was not done and caused problems. c'mon paul - we respect your opinion but this is over the top. go down this road and you might as well do a frame off restoration . . . ----- Original Message ----- From: Paul Hunt To: oliver ; mgs@autox.team.net Sent: Monday, June 29, 2009 9:39 AM Subject: Re: [Mgs] clutch? And what about the crank oil seal? Or the gearbox oil seal? How about the gearbox bearing? The problem is knowing where to stop, whether to hope the disturbance won't cause existing oil seals to leak, or whether to replace anyway and hope that the new ones don't leak! PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- replace the pilot bearing as well. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 29 10:25:16 2009 From: Tom Gunderson To: "mgs@autox.team.net" Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 12:24:24 -0400 Subject: [Mgs] Rocker shims I cannot adjust the #8 valve after the head had been machined. Any ideas? Sent from my iPhone _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 29 11:52:50 2009 From: Max Heim To: MG List Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 10:40:57 -0700 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Rocker shims Why not? Do you mean there is not enough thread in the adjuster to get it where you want to go? Hard to believe you shaved the head that much, that you need a shorter pushrod. Maybe the threads are just fouled. Swap with a different rocker and try again? on 6/29/09 9:24 AM, Tom Gunderson at thgun@comporium.net wrote: > I cannot adjust the #8 valve after the head had been machined. Any > ideas? > -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Mountain View, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 29 12:40:31 2009 From: Max Heim To: MG List Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 11:29:12 -0700 Subject: [Mgs] Palo Alto Concours Big event, as usual. They featured Porsches, Mustangs, and emergency vehicles, and had more cop cars than I have ever seen in one place (other than a riot). Good assortment of British iron. Pix here: -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Mountain View, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 29 12:52:30 2009 From: Max Heim To: , MG List Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 11:43:38 -0700 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Rocker shims I didn't mean, swap the pushrods (but if you think you might have reversed them, I'd definitely try swapping #1 and #8). I meant find another rocker and substitute it for the one at #8, on the theory the threads were damaged. When you removed the rocker shaft, did you replace all the shims in the original locations? They can stick to the base of the pedestals, so you don't even realize they are there, then fall off later and get mixed up or lost. But you don't want to just try inserting shims at random -- I would imagine that would just bend the shaft. -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Mountain View, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires on 6/29/09 11:14 AM, thgun@comporium.net at thgun@comporium.net wrote: > When I removed the rods I stored them in order. When I replaced them I thought > that I may have reversed the order that they came from. The number 8 would not > adjust. I have screwed the adjuster all the way out. Still tight. So I > wondered about using shims. I was told that I should use the same rod in the > same valve slot. > Thanks for the info, > Tom Gunderson > 1957 mga 1500 rst > > ---- Original message ---- >> Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 10:40:57 -0700 >> From: Max Heim >> Subject: Re: [Mgs] Rocker shims >> To: MG List >> >> Why not? Do you mean there is not enough thread in the adjuster to get it >> where you want to go? >> >> Hard to believe you shaved the head that much, that you need a shorter >> pushrod. Maybe the threads are just fouled. Swap with a different rocker and >> try again? >> >> on 6/29/09 9:24 AM, Tom Gunderson at thgun@comporium.net wrote: >> >>> I cannot adjust the #8 valve after the head had been machined. Any >>> ideas? >>> >> >> -- >> >> Max Heim >> '66 MGB GHN3L76149 >> If you're near Mountain View, CA, >> it's the primer red one with chrome wires _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 29 12:58:28 2009 From: James F Juhas To: Tom Gunderson Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 14:58:09 -0400 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Rocker shims I just had this problem on my MGA, although I was recovering from a catastrophic failure. If it is too loose, look carefully to see if the rocker arm is bent. Mine didn't look obvious unless held immediately next to a good one. I don't know why it bent (it was not on the cylinder that dropped the valve) but it certainly was bent. Tom Gunderson wrote: > I cannot adjust the #8 valve after the head had been machined. Any ideas? > > Sent from my iPhone > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > You are subscribed as james.f.juhas@snet.net > > > Mgs@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs > > http://www.team.net/archive [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type text/x-vcard which had a name of james_f_juhas.vcf] _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 29 14:10:32 2009 From: Richard Ewald To: James F Juhas Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 13:10:17 -0700 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Rocker shims If the #8 valve has receeded into the head, or a valve job was done and the machine shop ground seats/valve too much, you will wind up with the problem you are experiencing. Have you measured the installed height of the valve springs to make sure you don't have a protruding valve? Rick On Mon, Jun 29, 2009 at 11:58 AM, James F Juhas wrote: > I just had this problem on my MGA, although I was recovering from a > catastrophic failure. If it is too loose, look carefully to see if the > rocker arm is bent. Mine didn't look obvious unless held immediately > next to a good one. I don't know why it bent (it was not on the > cylinder that dropped the valve) but it certainly was bent. > > Tom Gunderson wrote: > > I cannot adjust the #8 valve after the head had been machined. Any ideas? > > > > Sent from my iPhone > > _______________________________________________ > > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > > > You are subscribed as james.f.juhas@snet.net > > > > > > Mgs@autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs > > > > http://www.team.net/archive > > [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type text/x-vcard which had a name > of james_f_juhas.vcf] > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > You are subscribed as richard.ewald@gmail.com > > > Mgs@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 29 14:18:02 2009 From: "Ed Woods" To: "MGS" Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 16:20:09 -0400 Subject: [Mgs] Wiring diagram Hello List, Where can I obtain the most accurate '72 MGB wiring diagram? And, yes, I have the factory manuals. TIA, Ed Woods ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul Hunt" To: "Rick Lindsay" ; "MGS" Sent: Friday, December 14, 2007 10:59 AM Subject: Re: [Mgs] Heater Motor > Don't know why they provided individual footwell flaps as well as the > overall air direction control, maybe to push more air into the drivers > side > if the passenger seat was unoccupied and its vent closed. Mine has the > fixed vents but the same (or very similar) arrangement of defroster tubes. > > That switch is for the seat-belt warning system used in various flavours > over the years, the courtesy light switches always were the simpler > 'shorts > to ground when open' type. However the original style with metal pegs in > a > metal base have not been available for many years in the UK, there is an > alternative available here with a black plastic post in a metal base, but > this does need the hole in the A-post opening out a little to fit. > > PaulH. > > ----- Original Message ----- >> I still need this part, if anyone knows of an >> aftermarket supplier. I prefer the simpler model that >> shorts to ground when 'open' as I have rewired the >> courtesy lights for simpler operation: > _______________________________________________ > fogbro1@comcast.net > > Edit your replies > > Mgs@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.17.2/1184 - Release Date: > 12/14/2007 11:29 AM _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 29 14:21:35 2009 From: Carl French To: MGS , Ed Woods Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 13:21:23 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Mgs] Wiring diagram Ed, I have had great luck with the diagrams here; http://www.advanceautowire.com/ --- On Mon, 6/29/09, Ed Woods wrote: From: Ed Woods Subject: [Mgs] Wiring diagram To: "MGS" Date: Monday, June 29, 2009, 4:20 PM Hello List, Where can I obtain the most accurate '72 MGB wiring diagram? And, yes, I have the factory manuals. TIA, Ed Woods ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul Hunt" To: "Rick Lindsay" ; "MGS" Sent: Friday, December 14, 2007 10:59 AM Subject: Re: [Mgs] Heater Motor > Don't know why they provided individual footwell flaps as well as the > overall air direction control, maybe to push more air into the drivers side > if the passenger seat was unoccupied and its vent closed. Mine has the > fixed vents but the same (or very similar) arrangement of defroster tubes. > > That switch is for the seat-belt warning system used in various flavours > over the years, the courtesy light switches always were the simpler 'shorts > to ground when open' type. However the original style with metal pegs in a > metal base have not been available for many years in the UK, there is an > alternative available here with a black plastic post in a metal base, but > this does need the hole in the A-post opening out a little to fit. > > PaulH. > > ----- Original Message ----- >> I still need this part, if anyone knows of an >> aftermarket supplier. I prefer the simpler model that >> shorts to ground when 'open' as I have rewired the >> courtesy lights for simpler operation: > _______________________________________________ > fogbro1@comcast.net > > Edit your replies > > Mgs@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs > > > -- No virus found in this incoming message. > Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.17.2/1184 - Release Date: 12/14/2007 11:29 AM You are subscribed as leylandauto@yahoo.com Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 29 15:07:09 2009 From: Max Heim To: MG List Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 13:49:57 -0700 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Rocker shims Tom says the head was machined. Presumably all wear issues were resolved by the machine shop. But maybe he should confirm that and tell us what work was actually performed, and for what reason? We're kind of flying blind here. -- Max Heim '66 MGB GHN3L76149 If you're near Mountain View, CA, it's the primer red one with chrome wires on 6/29/09 1:10 PM, Richard Ewald at richard.ewald@gmail.com wrote: > If the #8 valve has receeded into the head, or a valve job was done and the > machine shop ground seats/valve too much, you will wind up with the problem > you are experiencing. > Have you measured the installed height of the valve springs to make sure you > don't have a protruding valve? > Rick > > On Mon, Jun 29, 2009 at 11:58 AM, James F Juhas wrote: > >> I just had this problem on my MGA, although I was recovering from a >> catastrophic failure. If it is too loose, look carefully to see if the >> rocker arm is bent. Mine didn't look obvious unless held immediately >> next to a good one. I don't know why it bent (it was not on the >> cylinder that dropped the valve) but it certainly was bent. >> >> Tom Gunderson wrote: >>> I cannot adjust the #8 valve after the head had been machined. Any ideas? _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 29 20:56:15 2009 From: Mike Duvall To: mgs Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 21:55:52 -0500 Subject: [Mgs] muffler recommendations I need a new muffler for my MGA. The inside rotted out of mine I think. It sounded great for a long time but not it is backfiring when I let of the gas and makes rattling noises. Any suggestions for achieving a nice sounding, deep throated sound? Thanks, Mike _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 30 05:08:45 2009 From: "Paul Hunt" To: "Ed Woods" , "MGS" Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 11:46:01 +0100 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Wiring diagram What's wrong with the factory manuals? Are you sure you are looking at the right year? You need to go by the chassis number and not the year on the registration documents. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- Where can I obtain the most accurate '72 MGB wiring diagram? And, yes, I have the factory manuals. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 30 05:09:11 2009 From: "Paul Hunt" To: "Tom Gunderson" , Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 11:44:29 +0100 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Rocker shims In what way? Are you sure a cam follower hasn't got cocked in the bore so the push-rod won't go down far enough? PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- I cannot adjust the #8 valve after the head had been machined. Any ideas? _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 30 05:12:41 2009 From: Dan DiBiase To: Mike Duvall , mgs Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 04:10:05 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Mgs] muffler recommendations I didn't think a muffler caused back-firing - isn't that carb-related? Dan D Central NJ USA '76 MGB Tourer '65 MGB Tourer (Project) NAMGBR #5-2328 http://dans65b.blogspot.com/ http://dans76b.blogspot.com/ http://dansautoblog.blogspot.com/ http://mywebpages.comcast.net/dibiase/Working_MG_Gallery.html http://dans-life-blog.blogspot.com/ ________________________________ From: Mike Duvall To: mgs Sent: Monday, June 29, 2009 10:55:52 PM Subject: [Mgs] muffler recommendations I need a new muffler for my MGA. The inside rotted out of mine I think. It sounded great for a long time but not it is backfiring when I let of the gas and makes rattling noises. Any suggestions for achieving a nice sounding, deep throated sound? Thanks, Mike You are subscribed as d_dibiase@yahoo.com Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 30 07:04:57 2009 From: Barrie Robinson To: Mike Duvall ,mgs Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 08:59:58 -0400 Subject: Re: [Mgs] muffler recommendations Mike, One thing I have learnt - do not get stainless steel ! Even though they last for ever I will go back to mild steel next time - and put a copper tail pipe on it !! Many many moons ago I did that on my TR2 in Malaya and it sounded fantastic At 10:55 PM 6/29/2009, Mike Duvall wrote: >I need a new muffler for my MGA. The inside rotted out of mine I >think. It sounded great for a long time but not it is backfiring when >I let of the gas and makes rattling noises. > >Any suggestions for achieving a nice sounding, deep throated sound? > >Thanks, Mike >_______________________________________________ >Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > >You are subscribed as barrie@look.ca > > >Mgs@autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs > >http://www.team.net/archive > > >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >Version: 8.5.375 / Virus Database: 270.12.94/2208 - Release Date: >06/29/09 05:54:00 Regards Barrie Barrie Robinson (705) 721-9060 http://www.britishv8.org/MG/BarrieRobinson.htm http://www.britcot.com _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 30 07:53:19 2009 From: "Craig Tufty" To: Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 09:53:03 -0400 Subject: [Mgs] For Ed Woods Craig Tufty Alexandria, Virginia 22307 72 B [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type application/pdf which had a name of Wiring Diagram.pdf] _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 30 08:03:00 2009 From: "oliver" To: "mgs" Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 09:00:31 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] muffler recommendations i'm real curious as to why not stainless steel - i have one on my 73 b roadster and am quite happy with it. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Barrie Robinson" To: "Mike Duvall" ; "mgs" Sent: Tuesday, June 30, 2009 7:59 AM Subject: Re: [Mgs] muffler recommendations > Mike, > > One thing I have learnt - do not get stainless steel ! Even though they > last for ever I will go back to mild steel next time - and put a copper > tail pipe on it !! Many many moons ago I did that on my TR2 in Malaya > and it sounded fantastic _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 30 08:30:01 2009 From: "Bob Donahue" To: "mgs" Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 10:30:53 -0400 Subject: Re: [Mgs] Brake Fluid Loss I had a "footwell" leak one winter. I was unaware of the source of the leak, and diligently kept the reservoir topped up. The Dot 4 brake fluid I use is clear and has almost no odor. So, I just assumed the puddle in the footwell was melted snow I was tracking into the car. Eventually my feet developed a nasty rash that my doctor couldn't explain. I didn't catch on until my shoes started to fall apart, they were slowly dissolving! I hope there won't be any long term heath issues with my brake fluid exposure. Beware the footwell leak! Bob Donahue (Still Stuck in the '50s) Email - bobmgtd@comcast.net Cars: 52 MGTD - #17639 71 MGB - #GHN5UB254361 Member: NEMGTR #11470 NAMGBR # 7-3336 Hoosier MGB Club Olde Octagons of Indiana ----- Original Message ----- From: "Max Heim" To: "MG List" Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 8:34 PM Subject: Re: [Mgs] Brake Fluid Loss > You realize, of course, that the fluid level will naturally go down as the > brake pads wear, and when you adjust the drum brakes. > > Other than that, a possible cause of a "hidden" fluid loss may be between > the plies of a brake hose -- it may swell up under pressure, but look > normal > when inspected. > > You didn't mention inspecting the master cylinder. Any liquid in the > driver's footwell? > > -- > > Max Heim > '66 MGB GHN3L76149 > If you're near Mountain View, CA, > it's the primer red one with chrome wires _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 30 08:31:49 2009 From: Barrie Robinson To: "oliver" ,"mgs" Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 10:30:05 -0400 Subject: Re: [Mgs] muffler recommendations Stainless is harder than mild steel thus does not vibrate as well. This is why a soft copper tail pipe from silencer (muffler) gives a nice note. My hunting horn is copper and its tone would be horrible if it was stainless steel (although I would not have to polish it so often !!!! How many stainless steel wind instruments have you seen? You would be even happier with a mild steel exhaust At 10:00 AM 6/30/2009, oliver wrote: >i'm real curious as to why not stainless steel - i have one on my 73 >b roadster and am quite happy with it. > > >----- Original Message ----- From: "Barrie Robinson" >To: "Mike Duvall" ; "mgs" >Sent: Tuesday, June 30, 2009 7:59 AM >Subject: Re: [Mgs] muffler recommendations > > >>Mike, >> >>One thing I have learnt - do not get stainless steel ! Even though >>they last for ever I will go back to mild steel next time - and put >>a copper tail pipe on it !! Many many moons ago I did that on my >>TR2 in Malaya and it sounded fantastic >_______________________________________________ >Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > >You are subscribed as barrie@look.ca > > >Mgs@autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs > >http://www.team.net/archive > > >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >Version: 8.5.375 / Virus Database: 270.13.0/2210 - Release Date: >06/30/09 06:10:00 Regards Barrie Barrie Robinson (705) 721-9060 http://www.britishv8.org/MG/BarrieRobinson.htm http://www.britcot.com _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 30 08:37:19 2009 From: "oliver" To: "mgs" Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 09:34:28 -0500 Subject: Re: [Mgs] muffler recommendations so i guess the tradeoff is sound vs longevity. of course, if i wanted a truly distinctive note, i guess a V8 is the answer i'm happy with the sound. its an mg, not a camaro! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Barrie Robinson" To: "oliver" ; "mgs" Sent: Tuesday, June 30, 2009 9:30 AM Subject: Re: [Mgs] muffler recommendations > Stainless is harder than mild steel thus does not vibrate as well. This > is why a soft copper tail pipe from silencer (muffler) gives a nice note. > My hunting horn is copper and its tone would be horrible if it was > stainless steel (although I would not have to polish it so often !!!! How > many stainless steel wind instruments have you seen? You would be even > happier with a mild steel exhaust > > > At 10:00 AM 6/30/2009, oliver wrote: >>i'm real curious as to why not stainless steel - i have one on my 73 b >>roadster and am quite happy with it. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 30 09:46:36 2009 From: "Paul Hunt" To: "oliver" , "mgs" Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 16:24:05 +0100 Subject: Re: [Mgs] muffler recommendations I can sort of agree with it. Although I have always been happy with the stainless system on the V8 on the roadster it sounded awful, one exhaust specialist he said he hated them because they sounded 'farty' and that was exactly what it was. However after crushing the middle box a bit a number of times, and about 20 years and 50k later, it has developed a nice rasp. However it doesn't sound anything like so many MGBs I hear, which is a very throaty 'drainpipe' sound. So if you can wait long enough ... stainless could be fine for you. PaulH. ----- Original Message ----- i'm real curious as to why not stainless steel - i have one on my 73 b roadster and am quite happy with it. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive From mgs-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 30 21:02:49 2009 From: "David F. Darby" To: Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 22:00:12 -0500 Subject: [Mgs] GOBMC car show, Missouri I thought I should mention our annual All-British show in Carthage, Missouri (US). It is 24-26 July, 2009. You can find a registration form, which has a schedule of events here: http://www.gobmc.org/ Just click on "Tenth Annual GOBMC All British Car & Cycle Blowout," for a PDF registration form. Carthage is on US highways 71 and 96 (old Route 66), in southwest Missouri, 140 miles south of Kansas City, 60 miles west of Springfield, and within cannon range of Joplin, Missouri. Hope some of you will consider coming. It is a fun weekend. Regards, David _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Mgs@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs http://www.team.net/archive