From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 1 07:57:28 2009 From: David Sosna To: triumphs@autox.team.net Date: Mon, 01 Jun 2009 06:57:15 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] insane ebay sunbeam part I think adding the words "Shelby Cobra" onto anything that you sell on e-pay uprates the price of the item by a factor of 600%. :-) Best Regards David Sosna P.S. I really should buy the SUNBEAM TIGER ALPINE set of 4 wheel studs SHELBY COBRA before some slick fellow grabs 'em. michael king wrote: > Did anyone see this on ebay.. am i missing something? What the hell were > people thinking? _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 1 09:16:16 2009 From: To: Tigers@autox.team.net Date: Mon, 1 Jun 2009 11:15:42 -0400 Subject: [Tigers] For Sale: No Reserve !!!!! Rare, Limited Edition and Original NOS Shelby Cobra Sunbeam Tiger Oil http://www.bruteforceeng.com/10_Tour/03_Tour_Diary/Diary%20Pictures/July_03/Oilspot.JPG _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 1 09:18:21 2009 From: To: Tigers@autox.team.net Date: Mon, 1 Jun 2009 11:18:01 -0400 Subject: [Tigers] For Sale: No Reserve !!!!! Rare, Limited Edition and Original NOS Shelby Cobra Sunbeam Tiger Oil http://www.bruteforceeng.com/10_Tour/03_Tour_Diary/Diary%20Pictures/July_03/Oilspot.JPG _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 1 10:15:30 2009 From: "Robin Young" To: Date: Mon, 1 Jun 2009 12:15:11 -0400 Subject: [Tigers] FW: For Sale: No Reserve !!!!! I too have one of those that I am willing to part with. RObin -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of sralsten@ca.rr.com Sent: Monday, June 01, 2009 11:16 AM To: Tigers@autox.team.net Subject: [Tigers] For Sale: No Reserve !!!!! Rare, Limited Edition and Original NOS Shelby Cobra Sunbeam Tiger Oil http://www.bruteforceeng.com/10_Tour/03_Tour_Diary/Diary%20Pictures/July_03/ Oilspot.JPG _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 1 10:18:05 2009 From: "Bob Dixon" To: tigers@autox.team.net Date: Mon, 1 Jun 2009 10:17:53 -0600 (MDT) Subject: Re: [Tigers] FW: For Sale: No Reserve !!!!! How do I know this isn't Alger oil? Has it been TAC'd? _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 1 10:27:27 2009 From: "Jim" To: "'Bob Dixon'" , Date: Mon, 1 Jun 2009 09:27:20 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] FW: For Sale: No Reserve !!!!! I saw an N.O.S. O.E.M. Tiger lower rad hose go for waaay over $200 last year on e-Pay... My thinking was that it must have been purchased for 'display only' purposes as once it's installed on the car it would eventually become worth - less ...!! Jim B382000446 -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Bob Dixon Sent: June 1, 2009 9:18 AM To: tigers@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Tigers] FW: For Sale: No Reserve !!!!! How do I know this isn't Alger oil? Has it been TAC'd? Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 1 10:47:20 2009 From: To: tigers@autox.team.net, robin02@mindspring.com Date: Mon, 1 Jun 2009 12:47:14 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] FW: For Sale: No Reserve !!!!! Is yours on asphalt or concrete ? I'd trade but I'm afraid shipping costs to and from Australia would be prohibitive. Steve ---- Robin Young wrote: > I too have one of those that I am willing to part with. RObin > > -----Original Message----- > From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] > On Behalf Of sralsten@ca.rr.com > Sent: Monday, June 01, 2009 11:16 AM > To: Tigers@autox.team.net > Subject: [Tigers] For Sale: No Reserve !!!!! > > Rare, Limited Edition and Original NOS > Shelby Cobra Sunbeam Tiger Oil > > http://www.bruteforceeng.com/10_Tour/03_Tour_Diary/Diary%20Pictures/July_03/ > Oilspot.JPG > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 1 10:47:25 2009 From: "John Dillman" To: Date: Mon, 1 Jun 2009 11:47:15 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Water pump dates About 10 years ago I was working on my '56 Corvette and wandered into an old parts store in a sleepy part of town to get a water pump . . . The guy pulls a rebuilt one off the shelf that looks correct, no extra bosses or outlets or anything like newer ones sometimes have. I look at the casting number and you could have knocked me over with a feather. It was a correct '56 pump. For the princely sum of $18.95 and some ridiculously low core charge, it now graces the car . . .. You never know . . . BTW, the (fairly new) Tiger and I LOVE this list. John Dillman _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 1 11:11:46 2009 From: "Smit, Theo" To: , , Date: Mon, 1 Jun 2009 11:08:53 -0600 Subject: Re: [Tigers] FW: For Sale: No Reserve !!!!! I may be bringing some of those to SUNI... Depending on how it all goes (and how well my efforts of the last couple of weeks pan out), you may have a choice of engine oil, trans fluid, brake fluid (either from the clutch or brakes), and antifreeze. The only things it hasn't seriously leaked yet are gear oil (from the diff) and electrical smoke. But I haven't yet figured out why the wipers aren't working... The engine went back in yesterday and I'll hopefully be back on the road Thurs or Friday. You can tell, from the weather forecast: http://www.weatheroffice.gc.ca/city/pages/ab-1_metric_e.html Theo _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 1 11:46:02 2009 From: "Robin Young" To: , Date: Mon, 1 Jun 2009 13:45:38 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] FW: For Sale: No Reserve !!!!! Steve, Mine is a very clean example with a natural, yellow patina if that helps. RObin -----Original Message----- From: sralsten@ca.rr.com [mailto:sralsten@ca.rr.com] Sent: Monday, June 01, 2009 12:47 PM To: tigers@autox.team.net; robin02@mindspring.com Subject: Re: [Tigers] FW: For Sale: No Reserve !!!!! Is yours on asphalt or concrete ? I'd trade but I'm afraid shipping costs to and from Australia would be prohibitive. Steve ---- Robin Young wrote: > I too have one of those that I am willing to part with. RObin > > -----Original Message----- > From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net > [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] > On Behalf Of sralsten@ca.rr.com > Sent: Monday, June 01, 2009 11:16 AM > To: Tigers@autox.team.net > Subject: [Tigers] For Sale: No Reserve !!!!! > > Rare, Limited Edition and Original NOS Shelby Cobra Sunbeam Tiger Oil > > http://www.bruteforceeng.com/10_Tour/03_Tour_Diary/Diary%20Pictures/Ju > ly_03/ > Oilspot.JPG _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 1 11:46:41 2009 From: "Kirk Smith" To: Date: Mon, 01 Jun 2009 09:31:32 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] FW: For Sale: No Reserve !!!!!! It might be Lucasoil. I use only Jaeger in mine... Kirk. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 1 12:57:06 2009 From: CoolVT@aol.com To: tigers@autox.team.net Date: Mon, 1 Jun 2009 14:56:04 EDT Subject: [Tigers] Brake cylinder Does anyone know which other vehicle uses the same brake cylinder as the Tiger? I thought it was a Triumph of some kind or is that brake pads? I need a small part and can get it locally if it matches an MG, Triumph, etc. Ask for a Tiger part and the counter person's face turns into a question mark. Thanks, Mark L **************We found the real bHotel Californiab and the bSeinfeldb diner. What will you find? Explore WhereItsAt.com. (http://www.whereitsat.com/#/music/all-spots/355/47.796964/-66.374711/2/Youve -Found-Where-Its-At?ncid=eml cntnew00000007) _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 1 13:12:52 2009 From: "Thomas Witt" To: Date: Mon, 01 Jun 2009 10:58:46 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] For Sale: No Reserve !!!!! Let's not get too worked up over a fluid Tiger component. Why that is just the bastard step-child of the Rootes family tree. On the other hand I have a significant supply of genuine, renewable Tiger rust. Imagine the value of this melted down into Tiger replacement parts. Keep the blood line pure! Preserve the Rootes DNA! And hey, it helps the environment too! _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 1 13:27:57 2009 From: Marc James Small To: tigers@autox.team.net Date: Mon, 01 Jun 2009 15:19:17 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Brake cylinder At 02:56 PM 6/1/2009, CoolVT@aol.com wrote: >Does anyone know which other vehicle uses the same brake cylinder as the >Tiger? I thought it was a Triumph of some kind or is that brake pads? I >need a small part and can get it locally if it matches an MG, Triumph, etc. >Ask for a Tiger part and the counter person's face turns into a question >mark. Working from memory here, but I believe that all Alpine I through 4 and all Tigers share the Girling brake system with that used in the Triumph TR4A, TR250, and TR6. The Alpine V, save for very late production, shared its brake system with the German Ford Capri I's of the 1970 vintage. Any shop worth its salt will have an old copy of the Lucas catalogue that will tell all. Marc msmall@aya.yale.edu Cha robh b`s fir gun ghr`s fir! _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 1 13:43:55 2009 From: marden@mistral.co.uk To: Date: Mon, 1 Jun 2009 20:35:28 +0100 Subject: [Tigers] Amtrak/Staples poster I decided to send an e-mail to the president of the company and this is the response I received. Enjoy! That is if you can inderstand it. How can a poster get creased in a tube? Martin BODY { font-family:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:12px; } June 1, 2009 Case #: 00041269 Dear Martin: Thank you again for taking the time to write to us regarding the difficulties you have encountered with Amtrak, our program vendor. In speaking with the management team responsible for the relationship it was explained to me that the current partnership agreement is set up only to manage shipping domestically. Due to the wide cost variances in shipping international the system is currently designed to have any orders that request international shipping to go through a representative in order to secure an accurate freight cost. Per the contractual requirements set out by Amtrak, they will only allow us to ship posters flat therefore roll them up in a shipping tube. Those requirements cause the shipping charges to be very high, even for domestic shipments. WeBve received that feedback before on previous poster orders, but Amtrak is adamant about not rolling them up in a shipping tube (to prevent creases). Thank you again for passing along the feedback to our offices as we are responsible for the service and relationship with our vendors we contract with and it will be passed on for them to reconsider that policy. Ultimately you the customer is not getting the best of experiences when they want to order these posters and I sincerely apologize for the time and inconvenience we have caused you on your order. Thank you Stacey Marshall Customer Relations Team Manager 877-235-9088 x33382 Thank you, Stacey Marshall Office of the President Staples, Inc. 508-253-3382 ref:00D79PXl.50078wdlG:ref ------------------------- Message sent via KC WebMail - http://webmail.mistral.net/ _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 1 15:58:30 2009 From: Steve Laifman To: Ross , Tiger's Den Date: Mon, 01 Jun 2009 14:56:20 -0700 Subject: [Tigers] Map Lights O.K. Guys, I have uploaded the Map Light, to my picture gallery on Facebook, the eBay map light picture, and mine. Major difference is the black eBay case and my "dull chrome" plated housing. Maybe a "cad" plate would make the eBay offering better. Lot's of Rootes cars must use this same light. p.s. I crawled under the dash to get my pic, and saw some detached vinyl. I guess I'll add that to my list! http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=23591&id=1360287247&saved#/album.php?page=2&aid=23591&id=1360287247 Steve ___ Steve Laifman Editor - TigersUnited.com Ross wrote: > So Steve, where can I see the one to which you are referring? _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 1 16:29:55 2009 From: Steve Laifman To: sralsten@ca.rr.com Date: Mon, 01 Jun 2009 15:29:48 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] For Sale: No Reserve !!!!! Steve R., and Tigers, I have a few premium examples. Willing to part with a few some. Two types: dark oil and green stuff. Should be worth a lot, as these are "original" oil and antifreeze. Can't sell my "original tire air". The cans it comes in are now very dear. Packaging and Shipping are extra. The price reflects removal and restoration of surface. These are Premium Concrete samples, and not the ordinary asphalt. Steve ___ Steve Laifman Editor - TigersUnited.com sralsten@ca.rr.com wrote: > Rare, Limited Edition and Original NOS > Shelby Cobra Sunbeam Tiger Oil > > http://www.bruteforceeng.com/10_Tour/03_Tour_Diary/Diary%20Pictures/July_03/Oilspot.JPG _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 1 17:28:37 2009 From: "Stu Brennan" To: Date: Mon, 1 Jun 2009 19:28:17 -0400 Subject: [Tigers] British Car Day - Boston It's here already! What, you ask? British Car Day at the Lars Anderson Auto Museum in Brookline, MA. It's on June 7 this year, earlier than ever. We expect the usual collection of everything British on 4 wheels (or maybe fewer) to be filling the lawn at the museum. We've had 200 cars or more in the past! More details and directions can be found at: http://www.larzanderson.org That's it for now. The weather is getting good, so get them out and drive them! Stu Brennan TE/AE Regional Rep. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 1 17:59:37 2009 From: "Samouce's" To: Date: Mon, 1 Jun 2009 18:59:23 -0500 Subject: [Tigers] Mid West Mustangers car show I showed my car again at the MidWest Mustangers all Ford and Ford powered show yesterday. It is held each year at a Ford Dealer about 30 minutes from my house. Last year I was in the 1965-1970 Shelby class. I pre registered in the same class this year. When I showed up they told me I would be in the Ford "powered" class and not the Shelby. I told them that was the wrong class and last year I was in the Shelby class.....the guy I was talking to told me it was a mistake last year and quickly changed the subject. I did not feel like making a big seen trying to educate a Shelby snob, so I let it be. I did put out my "Sunbeam Tiger, A Carroll Shelby creation" story board that was read by many people all during the show. It beats the hell out of explaining the story 100 times during the day. Kinda ticks me off though. Don't get me wrong, Shelby is quite the snake and I know his input was limited and that his shop created the prototype. Then you have all of the 2008 Shelby GT 500 guys walking around thinking their car is a "real" Shelby when all the cars have ever seen is a Ford factory. BTW - I received third prize last year competing against 7 other "real" 1965-170 Shelby's. Yesterday, I won 2nd. Duke B382002037 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 1 18:44:22 2009 From: michael king To: Tiger Talk List Tiger Date: Tue, 2 Jun 2009 10:42:35 +1000 Subject: [Tigers] Winton Historic racing photos Here are some pictures from the Winton Historic meet in country Victoria from weekend of 30-31 May 2009. There are a few interesting rootes related cars in there and a bunch of other nice motors... http://rides.webshots.com/album/572729709VJfFtx -- Regards Michael King _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 1 18:58:45 2009 From: michael king To: "Samouce's" Date: Tue, 2 Jun 2009 10:51:59 +1000 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Mid West Mustangers car show Sorry Duke, i have to side with the guys who said "no" to having you in the Shelby class.. same issue i have with people putting "Shelby" on their parts on ebay.. he was involved in the prototype and in an early racing example... he doesn't really have much to do with the production cars and pushing the point makes you look like a Shelby want to be... enjoy the car for what it is,, not some tenuous link to some guy who hot rodded other peoples creations. there was never a "Shelby tiger" except for the yellow racer he ran.. even the prototype was a Shelby alpine... Anyway.. how much of the Shelby stuff actually ended up on the car rootes made their own steering, kept alpine brakes.. used a different rear end to the Shelby car etc... Let the mustang guys think what they want with their 2009 sepc cars.. they do legitimately have SHELBY on the title.. Which essentially equates to paying ol' Carroll a royalty for that privilege.. -- Regards Michael King _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 1 19:43:17 2009 From: "Thomas Witt" To: Date: Mon, 01 Jun 2009 18:35:00 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Mid West Mustangers car show If anyone is to be honored for the (physical) development of the Tiger it is George Boskoff who did the bulk of the work. And while I'm sure he is honored for such recognition I would be inclined to think at the time it was just another days work for him. He has in essence said such. That said, I have seen a picture (business card?) advertising a "Shelby" Tiger that was from back in the 60's. I took a glance in TBON and Taylor's book, but didn't find it. It doesn't mean its not there, but my error margin grows with age. Maybe others can point to it's location. I guess asking if a Tiger is a Shelby is like asking if Ray Krebs was a Ewing! It all came down to who you asked. Tom Subject: Re: [Tigers] Mid West Mustangers car show > Sorry Duke, > > > > i have to side with the guys who said "no" to having you in the Shelby > class.. same issue i have with people putting "Shelby" on their parts on > ebay.. he was involved in the prototype and in an early racing example... > he > doesn't really have much to do with the production cars and pushing the > point makes you look like a Shelby want to be... enjoy the car for what it > is,, not some tenuous link to some guy who hot rodded other peoples > creations. there was never a "Shelby tiger" except for the yellow racer he > ran.. even the prototype was a Shelby alpine... > > > > Anyway.. how much of the Shelby stuff actually ended up on the car rootes > made their own steering, kept alpine brakes.. used a different rear end to > the Shelby car etc... Let the mustang guys think what they want with their > 2009 sepc cars.. they do legitimately have SHELBY on the title.. Which > essentially equates to paying ol' Carroll a royalty for that privilege.. > > > -- > Regards > > Michael King _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 1 20:13:48 2009 From: Chris Thompson To: marden@mistral.co.uk Date: Mon, 01 Jun 2009 22:05:06 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Amtrak/Staples poster Unfortunately, I understand her response completely. "My management and their customers are completely clueless, and they leave me to deal with the fallout. Do you know where I can get a real job where I can do something besides just write apologies for them?" Chris marden@mistral.co.uk wrote: > I decided to send an e-mail to the president of the company and this > is the response I received. Enjoy! That is if you can inderstand it. > How can a poster get creased in a tube? > > Martin BODY { font-family:Arial, Helvetica, > sans-serif;font-size:12px; } > > June 1, 2009 > Case #: 00041269 > Dear Martin: > Thank you again for taking the time to write to us regarding the > difficulties you have encountered with Amtrak, our program vendor. > In speaking with the management team responsible for the > relationship it was explained to me that the current partnership > agreement is set up only to manage shipping domestically. Due to the > wide cost variances in shipping international the system is currently > designed to have any orders that request international shipping to go > through a representative in order to secure an accurate freight cost. > Per the contractual requirements set out by Amtrak, they will only > allow us to ship posters flat therefore roll them up in a shipping > tube. Those requirements cause the shipping charges to be very high, > even for domestic shipments. WeBve received that feedback before on > previous poster orders, but Amtrak is adamant about not rolling them > up in a shipping tube (to prevent creases). > Thank you again for passing along the feedback to our offices as we > are responsible for the service and relationship with our vendors we > contract with and it will be passed on for them to reconsider that > policy. > Ultimately you the customer is not getting the best of experiences > when they want to order these posters and I sincerely apologize for > the time and inconvenience we have caused you on your order. > Thank you > Stacey Marshall > Customer Relations Team Manager > 877-235-9088 x33382 > Thank you, > Stacey Marshall > Office of the President > Staples, Inc. > 508-253-3382 > ref:00D79PXl.50078wdlG:ref > ------------------------- _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 1 20:14:56 2009 From: "Samouce's" To: "'michael king'" Date: Mon, 1 Jun 2009 21:09:26 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Mid West Mustangers car show Carroll was also paid a royalty for every Tiger sold. I am not a Shelby want to be by any stretch. Duke B382002037 From: michael king [mailto:michael.s.king@gmail.com] Sent: Monday, June 01, 2009 19:52 To: Samouce's Cc: Tigers@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Tigers] Mid West Mustangers car show Sorry Duke, i have to side with the guys who said "no" to having you in the Shelby class.. same issue i have with people putting "Shelby" on their parts on ebay.. he was involved in the prototype and in an early racing example... he doesn't really have much to do with the production cars and pushing the point makes you look like a Shelby want to be... enjoy the car for what it is,, not some tenuous link to some guy who hot rodded other peoples creations. there was never a "Shelby tiger" except for the yellow racer he ran.. even the prototype was a Shelby alpine... Anyway.. how much of the Shelby stuff actually ended up on the car rootes made their own steering, kept alpine brakes.. used a different rear end to the Shelby car etc... Let the mustang guys think what they want with their 2009 sepc cars.. they do legitimately have SHELBY on the title.. Which essentially equates to paying ol' Carroll a royalty for that privilege.. -- Regards Michael King _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 1 20:48:20 2009 From: To: Tiger Talk List Tiger , michael king Date: Mon, 1 Jun 2009 22:48:13 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Winton Historic racing photos Thanks for posting. Love that Lotus Cortina on page 1 Except for the wheels that was my first car. One of several that it was a mistake to sell. Steve ---- michael king wrote: > Here are some pictures from the Winton Historic meet in country Victoria > from weekend of 30-31 May 2009. There are a few interesting rootes related > cars in there and a bunch of other nice motors... > > http://rides.webshots.com/album/572729709VJfFtx > > -- > Regards > > Michael King > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 1 20:59:00 2009 From: "Teepen, Jere" To: Samouce's , 'michael king' Date: Mon, 1 Jun 2009 22:54:30 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Mid West Mustangers car show No one has mentioned that the SAAC is inclusive of the Sunbeam Tiger in all of their events. It may not be a Shelby generated vehicle, but it is a sort of step child, and thus accepted at the family reunions. Jere -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Samouce's Sent: Monday, June 01, 2009 7:09 PM To: 'michael king' Cc: Tigers@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Tigers] Mid West Mustangers car show Carroll was also paid a royalty for every Tiger sold. I am not a Shelby want to be by any stretch. Duke B382002037 From: michael king [mailto:michael.s.king@gmail.com] Sent: Monday, June 01, 2009 19:52 To: Samouce's Cc: Tigers@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Tigers] Mid West Mustangers car show Sorry Duke, i have to side with the guys who said "no" to having you in the Shelby class.. same issue i have with people putting "Shelby" on their parts on ebay.. he was involved in the prototype and in an early racing example... he doesn't really have much to do with the production cars and pushing the point makes you look like a Shelby want to be... enjoy the car for what it is,, not some tenuous link to some guy who hot rodded other peoples creations. there was never a "Shelby tiger" except for the yellow racer he ran.. even the prototype was a Shelby alpine... Anyway.. how much of the Shelby stuff actually ended up on the car rootes made their own steering, kept alpine brakes.. used a different rear end to the Shelby car etc... Let the mustang guys think what they want with their 2009 sepc cars.. they do legitimately have SHELBY on the title.. Which essentially equates to paying ol' Carroll a royalty for that privilege.. -- Regards Michael King _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 1 22:28:25 2009 From: michael king To: "Teepen, Jere" Date: Tue, 2 Jun 2009 14:24:10 +1000 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Mid West Mustangers car show Ok, The shelby bastards child mailing list :-) -- Regards Michael King _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 1 22:44:02 2009 From: To: 'michael king' , Samouce's Date: Mon, 1 Jun 2009 21:38:01 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Mid West Mustangers car show ---- "Teepen wrote: > No one has mentioned that the SAAC is inclusive of the Sunbeam Tiger in all of > their events. It may not be a Shelby generated vehicle, but it is a sort of > step child, and thus accepted at the family reunions. > Here is an interesting side note to what Jere has posted... SAAC may still recognize Tigers as Shelby creations, but Shelby Automobiles sure doesn't. One of the largest, if not the largest, Shelby events held each year is the Mid-America Shelby Meet in Tulsa, OK. They used to be affiliated with SAAC but, after some kind of a falling out between them, they are no longer a part of SAAC. Instead, as of last year they were picked up by Shelby Automobiles and they are now Shelby Automobiles' national event, which puts them in direct competition with SAAC. Unfortunately, the Tiger has become a casualty in the switchover; they've relegated us to the "Special Interest" class at the car show instead of keeping us in our own class as they have done for the last 34 YEARS!!!! I served on the Board of the Oklahoma Region of the SAAC from 1982 to 1994. During that time, I owned a '67 Shelby GT 350, a '65 Shelby GT 350 and three Tigers. I've been part of the "Shelby in-crowd" for many years, but when they did away with the Tiger class for this years show (which is coming up on the weekend of June 25-28), they lost me for good. I, for one, couldn't give a Tinker's damn for the Shelby connection to our cars. As Michael King pointed out, Shelby-American was only given the job of producing the prototype that Rootes used to model their production car out of. Other than that, they had nothing to do with it. It has been very nice of SAAC to include the Tigers at their events over the years as "charter member" cars, along with the Cobra, the Shelby and Ford GT. As far as I'm concerned, it's very narrow-minded of Shelby Automobiles to cut the Tigers out now. Let's face it, folks...if Shelby can't make a buck off of something, he's not gonna mess with it. The Cobra got him where he is now and he can't really get away from that; the original Shelbys bear his name and that makes it hard to turn away from them. The Tigers, however, are definitely the "step children" to him. I guarantee you, though, that he would turn his back on all the old cars if he could. He's in the business of selling the new Shelbys now...there's no more money in the old stuff for him! We all know that the Tiger is a good enough car to stand on it's own; it really doesn't need the connection to Shelby to make it a winner. However, if you all haven't figured it out yet, it still just pisses me off to the core to have them (Shelby Automobiles) turn their backs on part of their heritage. So, Jere is partly right...the Tiger may be the step-child to SAAC, but it's the red-headed step-child to Shelby Automobiles. My .02 worth, Andy Walker Edmond, OK B382001600LRXFE B9006857LRX _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 1 23:32:28 2009 From: michael king To: Tiger Talk List Tiger Date: Tue, 2 Jun 2009 15:32:01 +1000 Subject: [Tigers] nice tiger resto Does anyone know/own this car? http://www.tltracetek.com/66Tiger/sunbeam.html really nice car and job.. wonder what they did with the original wheel on the car.. was in nicer condition than most.. and they replaced it with a mota-lita wood item -- Regards Michael King _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 2 00:15:41 2009 From: garywinblad@comcast.net To: Steve Laifman Date: Tue, 2 Jun 2009 06:15:33 +0000 (UTC) Subject: Re: [Tigers] Map Lights Steve, Mine is now a "dull chrome" look too... BUT, I think it was originally a sort of dark brown. If you pull the lens off, look at the metal tabs where they are protected inside. NOT dull chrome look.. Does any original owner know what it looked like originally? Gary ----- Original Message ----- From: Steve Laifman To: Ross , Tiger's Den , michael king Sent: Mon, 1 Jun 2009 21:56:20 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Tigers] Map Lights O.K. Guys, I have uploaded the Map Light, to my picture gallery on Facebook, the eBay map light picture, and mine. Major difference is the black eBay case and my "dull chrome" plated housing. Maybe a "cad" plate would make the eBay offering better. Lot's of Rootes cars must use this same light. p.s. I crawled under the dash to get my pic, and saw some detached vinyl. I guess I'll add that to my list! http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=23591&id=1360287247&saved#/album.php?page=2&aid=23591&id=1360287247 Steve ___ Steve Laifman Editor - TigersUnited.com Ross wrote: > So Steve, where can I see the one to which you are referring? Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 2 06:16:50 2009 From: "Samouce's" To: "'michael king'" , "'Tiger Talk List Date: Tue, 2 Jun 2009 07:16:30 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tigers] nice tiger resto It is a nice car. They got the tach and spedo switched though :>) Duke B382002037 -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of michael king Sent: Tuesday, June 02, 2009 00:32 To: Tiger Talk List Tiger Subject: [Tigers] nice tiger resto Does anyone know/own this car? http://www.tltracetek.com/66Tiger/sunbeam.html really nice car and job.. wonder what they did with the original wheel on the car.. was in nicer condition than most.. and they replaced it with a mota-lita wood item -- Regards Michael King Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 2 06:33:57 2009 From: parlanti@comcast.net To: tigers@autox.team.net Date: Tue, 2 Jun 2009 12:33:51 +0000 (UTC) Subject: Re: [Tigers] Amtrak/Staples poster I received my poster in the mail yesterday, very nice. I also was going to buy several of them but the shipping costs were multiplied. BTW, several of us used the Auto Train 2 years to travel to United XXVIII in Florida. I often wonder if it might have formed the genesis for the poster... Joe Parlanti B382000026 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 2 06:43:33 2009 From: parlanti@comcast.net To: tigers@autox.team.net Date: Tue, 2 Jun 2009 12:40:15 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Tigers] British Car Day The Original British Car Day will be held this Sunday at Lilypons Water Gardens near Frederick, Md. It's a nice event, and we generally have several Sunbeams in attendance. This year, Ronnie Silber, Rick Kellett and myself will be grilling up some nice food for the Sunbeamers. Feel free to contact me off line if you will be there so we can get a ballpark number for the food. Here's a link: http://www.chesapeakechaptermgtclub.com/OBCD_main.htm Thanks, Joe B382000026 Joseph V. Parlanti Cell - 301-461-0626 Email - Parlanti@comcast.net _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 2 07:14:56 2009 From: Tony Somebody To: Samouce's , 'michael king' Date: Tue, 2 Jun 2009 06:06:36 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Tigers] Suni Information Does anyone know who is in charge of the upcoming SUNI meet. I need some more information. Thanks in advance. TtT --- On Mon, 6/1/09, Teepen, Jere wrote: > From: Teepen, Jere > Subject: Re: [Tigers] Mid West Mustangers car show > To: "Samouce's" , "'michael king'" > Cc: "Tigers@autox.team.net" > Date: Monday, June 1, 2009, 9:54 PM > No one has mentioned that the SAAC is > inclusive of the Sunbeam Tiger in all of > their events. It may not be a Shelby generated > vehicle, but it is a sort of > step child, and thus accepted at the family reunions. > > Jere > > -----Original Message----- > From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net > [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] > On > Behalf Of Samouce's > Sent: Monday, June 01, 2009 7:09 PM > To: 'michael king' > Cc: Tigers@autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Tigers] Mid West Mustangers car show > > Carroll was also paid a royalty for every Tiger sold. > > > > I am not a Shelby want to be by any stretch. > > > Duke > > B382002037 > > > > From: michael king [mailto:michael.s.king@gmail.com] > Sent: Monday, June 01, 2009 19:52 > To: Samouce's > Cc: Tigers@autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Tigers] Mid West Mustangers car show > > > > Sorry Duke, > > > > i have to side with the guys who said "no" to having you in > the Shelby > class.. same issue i have with people putting "Shelby" on > their parts on > ebay.. he was involved in the prototype and in an early > racing example... he > doesn't really have much to do with the production cars and > pushing the > point makes you look like a Shelby want to be... enjoy the > car for what it > is,, not some tenuous link to some guy who hot rodded other > peoples > creations. there was never a "Shelby tiger" except for the > yellow racer he > ran.. even the prototype was a Shelby alpine... > > > > Anyway.. how much of the Shelby stuff actually ended up on > the car rootes > made their own steering, kept alpine brakes.. used a > different rear end to > the Shelby car etc... Let the mustang guys think what they > want with their > 2009 sepc cars.. they do legitimately have SHELBY on the > title.. Which > essentially equates to paying ol' Carroll a royalty for > that privilege.. > > > > > -- > Regards > > Michael King > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 2 08:14:48 2009 From: "Smit, Theo" To: "Tony Somebody" , "Samouce's" Date: Tue, 2 Jun 2009 08:12:21 -0600 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Suni Information Max Pahmeier (pahmeier@verizon.net) is the chairman, the VanderPools (Jerry and Marlene, jrv309@charter.net) are doing registration. http://www.tigersunited.com/news/events.asp Theo > -----Original Message----- > From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net > [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Tony Somebody > Sent: June 2, 2009 7:07 AM > To: Samouce's; 'michael king'; JereTeepen > Cc: Tigers@autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Tigers] Suni Information > > Does anyone know who is in charge of the upcoming SUNI meet. > I need some more information. > Thanks in advance. > TtT > > --- On Mon, 6/1/09, Teepen, Jere wrote: > > > From: Teepen, Jere > > Subject: Re: [Tigers] Mid West Mustangers car show > > To: "Samouce's" , "'michael king'" > > > Cc: "Tigers@autox.team.net" > > Date: Monday, June 1, 2009, 9:54 PM > > No one has mentioned that the SAAC is > > inclusive of the Sunbeam Tiger in all of their events. It > may not be > > a Shelby generated vehicle, but it is a sort of step child, > and thus > > accepted at the family reunions. > > > > Jere > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net > > [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] > > On > > Behalf Of Samouce's > > Sent: Monday, June 01, 2009 7:09 PM > > To: 'michael king' > > Cc: Tigers@autox.team.net > > Subject: Re: [Tigers] Mid West Mustangers car show > > > > Carroll was also paid a royalty for every Tiger sold. > > > > > > > > I am not a Shelby want to be by any stretch. > > > > > > Duke > > > > B382002037 > > > > > > > > From: michael king [mailto:michael.s.king@gmail.com] > > Sent: Monday, June 01, 2009 19:52 > > To: Samouce's > > Cc: Tigers@autox.team.net > > Subject: Re: [Tigers] Mid West Mustangers car show > > > > > > > > Sorry Duke, > > > > > > > > i have to side with the guys who said "no" to having you in > the Shelby > > class.. same issue i have with people putting "Shelby" on > their parts > > on ebay.. he was involved in the prototype and in an early racing > > example... he doesn't really have much to do with the > production cars > > and pushing the point makes you look like a Shelby want to > be... enjoy > > the car for what it is,, not some tenuous link to some guy who hot > > rodded other peoples creations. there was never a "Shelby tiger" > > except for the yellow racer he ran.. even the prototype was > a Shelby > > alpine... > > > > > > > > Anyway.. how much of the Shelby stuff actually ended up on the car > > rootes made their own steering, kept alpine brakes.. used a > different > > rear end to the Shelby car etc... Let the mustang guys > think what they > > want with their > > 2009 sepc cars.. they do legitimately have SHELBY on the > title.. Which > > essentially equates to paying ol' Carroll a royalty for that > > privilege.. > > > > > > > > > > -- > > Regards > > > > Michael King > > _______________________________________________ > > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > Tigers@autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > > > http://www.team.net/archive > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 2 08:44:05 2009 From: "Rense, Mark (GE Indust, ConsInd)" To: Date: Tue, 2 Jun 2009 10:41:16 -0400 Subject: [Tigers] Yet Another British Car Day This weekend the 25th British Bash will be held in Louisville, KY at the St. Joseph's Children's Home on Frankfort Avenue. There are over 200 cars pre-registered and the proceeds go to St. Joe's, a worthy charity. http://www.britishbash.com This has always been one of our favorite shows, and the 400 mile trip through Ohio and Kentucky back country make for great Tigering! Bugz _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 2 08:44:12 2009 From: "Ross" To: , "'Steve Laifman'" Date: Tue, 2 Jun 2009 07:41:34 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Map Lights The original color was exactly like the one on eBay. The original cover was a very dark brown almost black. Steve's light is what they look like when exposed to UV for years. So, his has the special Sunbeam patina and must be worth more! Ross Subject: Re: [Tigers] Map Lights Steve, Mine is now a "dull chrome" look too... BUT, I think it was originally a sort of dark brown. If you pull the lens off, look at the metal tabs where they are protected inside. NOT dull chrome look.. Does any original owner know what it looked like originally? Gary O.K. Guys, I have uploaded the Map Light, to my picture gallery on Facebook, the eBay map light picture, and mine. Major difference is the black eBay case and my "dull chrome" plated housing. Maybe a "cad" plate would make the eBay offering better. Lot's of Rootes cars must use this same light. p.s. I crawled under the dash to get my pic, and saw some detached vinyl. I guess I'll add that to my list! http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=23591&id=1360287247&saved#/album.php?p age=2&aid=23591&id=1360287247 Steve ___ Steve Laifman Editor - TigersUnited.com _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 2 08:44:12 2009 From: To: tigers@autox.team.net, parlanti@comcast.net Date: Tue, 2 Jun 2009 10:41:52 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Amtrak/Staples poster Must have been, unless an autotrain worker is also a Sunbeam owner. ---- parlanti@comcast.net wrote: > I received my poster in the mail yesterday, very nice. I also was going to buy several of them but the shipping costs were multiplied. BTW, several of us used the Auto Train 2 years to travel to United XXVIII in Florida. I often wonder if it might have formed the genesis for the poster... > > > > Joe Parlanti > > B382000026 > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 2 10:13:44 2009 From: wwwdg@webtv.net (David or Gary) To: tigers@autox.team.net ('Tiger's Den') Date: Tue, 2 Jun 2009 09:09:21 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Map Lights My NOS map light cover is satin black in color. I believe the brownish, gold, silver are just various shades of faded color. See photo links. David Franchi Map lens http://pic50.picturetrail.com/VOL439/2051017/21606493/366020878.jpg Close-up http://pic50.picturetrail.com/VOL439/2051017/21606493/366020880.jpg _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 2 10:13:51 2009 From: Tony Somebody To: michael king Date: Tue, 2 Jun 2009 09:10:29 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Tigers] Mid West Mustangers car show I have absolutely no proof, other than a gut feeling BUT the 289 was available for fitment in the first Tigers. My gut tells me CS had a part in helping Rootes get 260 engines from Ford. he had to be aware the Tiger was going to be a serious contender for outrunniing the first Cobras that also received power from a 260 engine.I have no opinion of what claim we have to Mr. shelby, especially calling the Tiger a shelby Tiger- it just didnt exist. I have attended Shelby events at the Brown cnty.anual Shelby event. His name is not on our cars but we are set aside with our own group at the event and we are accepted by them or we acceppt them if you will. At one time I thought that some of the shelby tiger parts might also be used on the Cobra but it is evident now that sellers are just using shelby to put the parts on more screens and if the Cobra used the same part as a tiger it was very few. If we could lay claim to being a real member of the Shelby family it could only increase the value of our cars BUT I only see the bastard stepson relationship. Im sure when ask that CS is happy to claim the Tiger but Im not sure it is a valid claim. TtT --- On Mon, 6/1/09, michael king wrote: > From: michael king > Subject: Re: [Tigers] Mid West Mustangers car show > To: "Samouce's" > Cc: Tigers@autox.team.net > Date: Monday, June 1, 2009, 7:51 PM > Sorry Duke, > > > > i have to side with the guys who said "no" to having you in > the Shelby > class.. same issue i have with people putting "Shelby" on > their parts on > ebay.. he was involved in the prototype and in an early > racing example... he > doesn't really have much to do with the production cars and > pushing the > point makes you look like a Shelby want to be... enjoy the > car for what it > is,, not some tenuous link to some guy who hot rodded other > peoples > creations. there was never a "Shelby tiger" except for the > yellow racer he > ran.. even the prototype was a Shelby alpine... > > > > Anyway.. how much of the Shelby stuff actually ended up on > the car rootes > made their own steering, kept alpine brakes.. used a > different rear end to > the Shelby car etc... Let the mustang guys think what they > want with their > 2009 sepc cars.. they do legitimately have SHELBY on the > title.. Which > essentially equates to paying ol' Carroll a royalty for > that privilege.. > > > -- > Regards > > Michael King > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 2 10:30:28 2009 From: Tony Somebody To: Tigers@autox.team.net, Samouce's Date: Tue, 2 Jun 2009 09:28:28 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Tigers] Mid West Mustangers car show CONGRATULATIONS Duke for placing so well both years.Im sure you are just a Tiger person and if you wanted to be a Shelby person you would buy a Shelby car. i wonder what CS would respond with when ask how he feels about the Tiger being in the same class as the Cobras?? if he comes to suni we can ask him personally. Has anyone heard if we have any celeberities saying the will attend SUNI???? TtT _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 2 12:16:29 2009 From: "Tiger Man" To: Date: Tue, 2 Jun 2009 12:16:07 -0600 Subject: [Tigers] Windshield wiper blade refills I recently had my drivers side (LHD) windshield wiper blade shred on me when I got caught in the rain. Having gone down to the chain auto parts stores, they barely even sell just replacement blades anymore, thier only choise for that is a cut it yourself universal blade. The universal blade is what i would expect for replacing a standard windshield wiper blade, but my Tiger seems to be expecting a much smaller blade configuration. In the universal blade replacement, I believe it has a narrow channel for holding a metal stiffiner, a larger channel for sliding on to your winshield wiper, followed by the blade portion itself. The remaining blade on my tiger appears to not be that thick and when trying to slide the universal blade on it is obviously too thick to make it down to the channel where it is suppose to hold on. I'm not sure if the wipers are original or 'original looking' But was this blade configuration used on a more common british car I could give to the parts counter guy as thier eyes just roll back up into thier head when I say 'Sunbeam Tiger'. Thanks, Steve _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 2 13:59:20 2009 From: garywinblad@comcast.net To: David or Gary Date: Tue, 2 Jun 2009 19:50:05 +0000 (UTC) Subject: Re: [Tigers] Map Lights Thanks guys.. David, Yours is definitely NOS but it must be a "cost reduced" Chrysler part. At least from the picture, it looks like it is plastic on the exposed part. Mine is Mk I and has an aluminum(?) cover over clear plastic. BUT, looking through the clear plastic to the underside of the aluminum, it does look black, and there is black paint on the ends and inside ends of the clear plastic. On the outside in the back edge is where it does looks faded brown... Inside molded in is the manufacturer: SPARTO Ref. No. 5911 It looks like the Alpine guys have been pondering this too: http://www.sunbeamalpine.org/forum/showthread.php?t=10105 Gary ----- Original Message ----- From: David or Gary To: 'Tiger's Den' Sent: Tue, 2 Jun 2009 16:09:21 +0000 (UTC) Subject: Re: [Tigers] Map Lights My NOS map light cover is satin black in color. I believe the brownish, gold, silver are just various shades of faded color. See photo links. David Franchi Map lens http://pic50.picturetrail.com/VOL439/2051017/21606493/366020878.jpg Close-up http://pic50.picturetrail.com/VOL439/2051017/21606493/366020880.jpg _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 2 16:14:08 2009 From: "J. Nichols" To: Date: Tue, 2 Jun 2009 18:13:50 -0400 Subject: [Tigers] The Cost Of Shelby "i have to side with the guys who said "no" to having you in the Shelby class.. .. he was involved in the prototype and in an early racing example... he doesn't really have much to do with the production cars and pushing the point makes you look like a Shelby want to be... enjoy the car for what it is,, not some tenuous link to some guy who hot rodded other peoples creations." "Carroll was also paid a royalty for every Tiger sold." That is correct, Shelby didn't build production cars and he was paid $5.00 per Tiger built by Rootes. Doing the math that comes out to 7067(cars built) x $5.00/car = $35,335 in 1960's dollars. Plus, add in the $10,000 or so for the prototype and whatever it cost for the race car. It appears Shelby made some money off of Rootes. My guess is that the Shelby club had no idea Rootes was paying Shelby royalties for each Tiger. Jef f _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 2 16:59:20 2009 From: "Samouce's" To: "'J. Nichols'" , Date: Tue, 2 Jun 2009 17:56:29 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tigers] The Cost Of Shelby To add more to this silly debate. The office Carroll Shelby club has a registry. It includes the Tiger - http://registry.teamshelby.com/register_new.asp The below notice tells it all. "Copyright C Shelby Automobiles, Inc. All Rights Reserved. CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This program and its contents are for the exclusive and confidential use of Shelby Automobiles. Under no circumstances shall any of the contents of this program be shared with any outside agency without the express written consent of Shelby management. Use of this program constitutes your consent to this policy." Whataboutthat? Duke B382002037 From: J. Nichols [mailto:jxnichols@sbcglobal.net] Sent: Tuesday, June 02, 2009 17:14 To: tigers@autox.team.net Cc: michael king; wsamouce@kc.rr.com Subject: The Cost Of Shelby "i have to side with the guys who said "no" to having you in the Shelby class.. .. he was involved in the prototype and in an early racing example... he doesn't really have much to do with the production cars and pushing the point makes you look like a Shelby want to be... enjoy the car for what it is,, not some tenuous link to some guy who hot rodded other peoples creations." "Carroll was also paid a royalty for every Tiger sold." That is correct, Shelby didn't build production cars and he was paid $5.00 per Tiger built by Rootes. Doing the math that comes out to 7067(cars built) x $5.00/car = $35,335 in 1960's dollars. Plus, add in the $10,000 or so for the prototype and whatever it cost for the race car. It appears Shelby made some money off of Rootes. My guess is that the Shelby club had no idea Rootes was paying Shelby royalties for each Tiger. Jeff _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 2 17:35:04 2009 From: wwwdg@webtv.net (David or Gary) To: garywinblad@comcast.net Date: Tue, 2 Jun 2009 16:34:46 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Map Lights Gary, The NOS one is also marked SPARTO Ref. No. 5911 on the plastic lens. The top black part is non magnetic metal painted? black and held to the lens by bent over metal tabs on the ends and two clips inside the middle. All painted? black on the inside and outside. The clear lens is painted black on the on the two outside corners. Inside photo below. David http://pic50.picturetrail.com/VOL439/2051017/21606493/366045108.jpg ----- Original Message ----- David, Yours is definitely NOS but it must be a "cost reduced" Chrysler part. At least from the picture, it looks like it is plastic on the exposed part. Mine is Mk I and has an aluminum(?) cover over clear plastic. BUT, looking through the clear plastic to the underside of the aluminum, it does look black, and there is black paint on the ends and inside ends of the clear plastic. On the outside in the back edge is where it does looks faded brown... Inside molded in is the manufacturer: SPARTO Ref. No. 5911 It looks like the Alpine guys have been pondering this too: http://www.sunbeamalpine.org/forum/showthread.php?t=10105 Gary ----- Original Message ----- From: David or Gary To: 'Tiger's Den' Sent: Tue, 2 Jun 2009 16:09:21 +0000 (UTC) Subject: Re: [Tigers] Map Lights My NOS map light cover is satin black in color. I believe the brownish, gold, silver are just various shades of faded color. See photo links. David Franchi Map lens http://pic50.picturetrail.com/VOL439/2051017/21606493/366020878.jpg Close-up http://pic50.picturetrail.com/VOL439/2051017/21606493/366020880.jpg _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 2 17:44:10 2009 From: "Will Seay" To: "michael king" , "Tiger Talk List Tiger" Date: Tue, 2 Jun 2009 19:36:47 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] nice tiger resto Michael, I was thinking the same thing about the wheel. BTW, do you think that the owner knows that the tach goes on the left and the spedo right? ____________________________ Will Seay wseay@embarqmail.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "michael king" To: "Tiger Talk List Tiger" Sent: Tuesday, June 02, 2009 1:32 AM Subject: [Tigers] nice tiger resto Does anyone know/own this car? http://www.tltracetek.com/66Tiger/sunbeam.html really nice car and job.. wonder what they did with the original wheel on the car.. was in nicer condition than most.. and they replaced it with a mota-lita wood item -- Regards Michael King _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 2 17:44:16 2009 From: michael king To: Tiger Talk List Tiger Date: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 09:38:27 +1000 Subject: [Tigers] The Cost Of Shelby ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: michael king Date: 2009/6/3 Subject: Re: The Cost Of Shelby To: Samouce's I know that Shelby was involved in the Tigers evolution; I know he had offered to build them and was ultimately paid a royalty for each car rootes did build. I guess what i was getting at with Duke is we all know the Carrol's involvement (or lack of depending if you are one of the Boskoff camp) but while he did play an important part in the prototyping stage his production involvement was limited. As for the LAT options.. yes they are largely re-badged cobra items.. but thats still aftermarket stuff and was never on "production" cars. Dont get me wrong.. I would hope nobody would question my respect, enjoyment and love of our Sunbeam Tigers (and alpines!) but i actually get quite annoyed when people start calling them "shelby tigers" they are trying to associate their car with that name for generally 2 reasons.. either jacking up the value or trying to associate it with a perceived prestige of the shelby name... truth be told.. the SUNBEAM name has far more racing pedigree than shelby... As for the registry.. this popped up maybe 2 years ago.. the one thing i will credit shelby for is his ability to make a $ off anything he is remotely involved with. if you go back through the archives this registry evolved when good ol carrol decided to have a go at the people that had maintained and evolved the brand of his old cars for which he had turned his back on for so long.. Suddenly he loved his mustangs and cobras again as their was money to be made... if allowing tiger guys to register got a few more $.. "then welcome to the club!" and he threatened the members of the clubs bearing his name with legal action for using it... Look i dont realyl care one way or another.. I love Sunbeams.. I was flattered when i was invited to a special interest section at the ferrari concourse in 2008 and parked with bugattis, maserati GP cars etc.. as for display cars.. i guess time to promote mine again.. free to download for everyone.. simply print and laminate! http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2113355360054462410DzKnVh http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2517842820054462410EQCeiW http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2276233220054462410Shqpwp -- Regards Michael King -- Regards Michael King _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 2 17:59:15 2009 From: michael king To: David or Gary Date: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 09:52:27 +1000 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Map Lights Something of note... Sparto manufactured these lights for many cars.. they are on MKII and 420G jags.. they made them without switches (early alpine) and with later alpine and tiger. The early alpines have a different finsh on the lens.. you really need one from a rootes package with the part number from the parts book.. and i am talking a rootes package pre-chrysler as in yellow circle blue background.. as the later chrysler packaging often has a part that superceeds the earlier one.. just my .02 :-) -- Regards Michael King _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 2 18:44:09 2009 From: Tony Somebody To: "'J. Nichols'" , tigers@autox.team.net, Date: Tue, 2 Jun 2009 17:37:04 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Tigers] The Cost Of Shelby WELL THAT PRETTY MUCH SETTELS THAT ARGUEMENT. wait. stop, i REALLY HAD NO INTENTIONS OR THOUGHTS ABOUT my caps key being on- no, really, i wasnt trying to argue or step on anyones toes, just wrote my thoughts- sometimes I must have flash backs to the days of rocknroll free love and flowers on bettles posters. I want to say Im sorry if i somehow said something that made anyone think I was argueing, disagreeing or just being a pain in the arse. i had a friend say something about it and even tho I wasnt sure what he was talking about, i thought I would drop this to whomever might have mistaken my thoughts for something more than just that. now, remember, pay little attention to me, im old and broken down and my facilites arent in so great a shape nither. Happy Tigering. TonytheTiger and no one loves a Tiger more than me. LOL --- On Tue, 6/2/09, Samouce's wrote: > From: Samouce's > Subject: Re: [Tigers] The Cost Of Shelby > To: "'J. Nichols'" , tigers@autox.team.net > Date: Tuesday, June 2, 2009, 5:56 PM > To add more to this silly debate. > > > > The office Carroll Shelby club has a registry. It > includes the Tiger - > http://registry.teamshelby.com/register_new.asp > > > > The below notice tells it all. > > > > "Copyright C Shelby > Automobiles, Inc. > All Rights Reserved. > > CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This program and its contents are > for the exclusive > and confidential use of Shelby Automobiles. Under no > circumstances shall any > of the contents of this program be shared with any outside > agency without > the express written consent of Shelby management. Use of > this program > constitutes your consent to this policy." > > > > > > Whataboutthat? > > > > Duke > > B382002037 > > > > > > > > From: J. Nichols [mailto:jxnichols@sbcglobal.net] > > Sent: Tuesday, June 02, 2009 17:14 > To: tigers@autox.team.net > Cc: michael king; wsamouce@kc.rr.com > Subject: The Cost Of Shelby > > > > "i have to side with the guys who said "no" to having you > in the Shelby > class.. .. he was involved in the prototype and in an early > racing > example... he > doesn't really have much to do with the production cars and > pushing the > point makes you look like a Shelby want to be... enjoy the > car for what it > is,, not some tenuous link to some guy who hot rodded other > peoples > creations." > > > > "Carroll was also paid a royalty for every Tiger sold." > > That is correct, Shelby didn't build production cars and he > was paid $5.00 > per Tiger built by Rootes. Doing the math that comes > out to 7067(cars > built) x $5.00/car = $35,335 in 1960's dollars. Plus, > add in the $10,000 or > so for the prototype and whatever it cost for the race > car. It appears > Shelby made some money off of Rootes. My > guess is that the Shelby club had > no idea Rootes was paying Shelby royalties for each Tiger. > > > > > > > > > > Jeff > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 2 18:46:37 2009 From: Chris Thompson To: "J. Nichols" Date: Tue, 02 Jun 2009 20:45:51 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] The Cost Of Shelby According to an inflation calculator on the web, that $35,000 in 1965 is worth about a quarter million today. Not a bad payoff considering where CS was in his career at that time...... J. Nichols wrote: > "i have to side with the guys who said "no" to having you in the Shelby > class.. .. he was involved in the prototype and in an early racing example... > he > doesn't really have much to do with the production cars and pushing the > point makes you look like a Shelby want to be... enjoy the car for what it > is,, not some tenuous link to some guy who hot rodded other peoples > creations." > > "Carroll was also paid a royalty for every Tiger sold." > > That is correct, Shelby didn't build production cars and he was paid $5.00 per > Tiger built by Rootes. Doing the math that comes out to 7067(cars built) x > $5.00/car = $35,335 in 1960's dollars. Plus, add in the $10,000 or so for the > prototype and whatever it cost for the race car. It appears Shelby made some > money off of Rootes. My guess is that the Shelby club had no idea Rootes was > paying Shelby royalties for each Tiger. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 2 22:03:57 2009 From: garywinblad@comcast.net To: David or Gary Date: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 04:03:44 +0000 (UTC) Subject: Re: [Tigers] Map Lights Thanks David, Ok, it sounds just like mine.. except my black has gone away! Satin black is easy to restore at least ;-) Gary ----- Original Message ----- From: David or Gary To: garywinblad@comcast.net Cc: 'Tiger's Den' Sent: Tue, 2 Jun 2009 23:34:46 +0000 (UTC) Subject: Re: [Tigers] Map Lights Gary, The NOS one is also marked SPARTO Ref. No. 5911 on the plastic lens. The top black part is non magnetic metal painted? black and held to the lens by bent over metal tabs on the ends and two clips inside the middle. All painted? black on the inside and outside. The clear lens is painted black on the on the two outside corners. Inside photo below. David http://pic50.picturetrail.com/VOL439/2051017/21606493/366045108.jpg ----- Original Message ----- David, Yours is definitely NOS but it must be a "cost reduced" Chrysler part. At least from the picture, it looks like it is plastic on the exposed part. Mine is Mk I and has an aluminum(?) cover over clear plastic. BUT, looking through the clear plastic to the underside of the aluminum, it does look black, and there is black paint on the ends and inside ends of the clear plastic. On the outside in the back edge is where it does looks faded brown... Inside molded in is the manufacturer: SPARTO Ref. No. 5911 It looks like the Alpine guys have been pondering this too: http://www.sunbeamalpine.org/forum/showthread.php?t=10105 Gary ----- Original Message ----- From: David or Gary To: 'Tiger's Den' Sent: Tue, 2 Jun 2009 16:09:21 +0000 (UTC) Subject: Re: [Tigers] Map Lights My NOS map light cover is satin black in color. I believe the brownish, gold, silver are just various shades of faded color. See photo links. David Franchi Map lens http://pic50.picturetrail.com/VOL439/2051017/21606493/366020878.jpg Close-up http://pic50.picturetrail.com/VOL439/2051017/21606493/366020880.jpg _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 3 00:33:52 2009 From: michael king To: Tiger Talk List Tiger Date: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 16:33:33 +1000 Subject: [Tigers] Shelby tiger info Ok, For those who would like a Sunbeam Tiger display sheet with a shelby conection feel free to download: http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2904787900054462410ujhDfU Now.. this just uses the image and quote from 1 of the 2 ads i have with good ol' carroll and tigers.. it makes no claim for parentage, just lets it go with an image and a quote. now everyone can be happy .. Oh and i dont want any shelby american guys knocking on my door for using his face!!! for those who want other options: http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2113355360054462410DzKnVh http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2517842820054462410EQCeiW http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2276233220054462410Shqpwp -- Regards Michael King _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 3 07:01:16 2009 From: Bill Waite To: Tiger Talk List Tiger Date: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 05:55:52 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Tigers] Internet "Movie Cars" Database http://imcdb.org/vehicles.php?make=Sunbeam&model=Tiger Hope this isn't a repeat of a prior post. Thought this was an interesting website. On the home page there is a search feature permitting you to find pictures of specific vehicles featured in films. Bill _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 3 09:21:05 2009 From: " Ron Fraser" To: "'Samouce's'" , Date: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 11:09:19 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Original engine? Duke There were a number of design changes between 1964 and 1966 for the water pump including the cast iron water pump for the 289 in June 1965. Different boss heights were needed for the alternator and A/C brackets. Ron Fraser -----Original Message----- From: Samouce's [mailto:wsamouce@kc.rr.com] Sent: Sunday, May 31, 2009 7:02 PM To: rfraser@bluefrog.com; tigers@autox.team.net Subject: RE: [Tigers] Original engine? It is also interesting that it is a 289 water pump. The 260 never had the addition bosses for the alternator like this one does. The part number indicated a 1965 pump but it was manufactured in 1964. Duke B382002037 -----Original Message----- From: Ron Fraser [mailto:rfraser@bluefrog.com] Sent: Sunday, May 31, 2009 07:36 To: 'Samouce's'; tigers@autox.team.net Subject: RE: [Tigers] Original engine? Duke Interesting; this would seem to indicate that Ford stock piled the aluminum water pump to cover the 260 Tiger engine build. Numbers with history can be interesting. Ron Fraser -----Original Message----- From: Samouce's [mailto:wsamouce@kc.rr.com] Sent: Saturday, May 30, 2009 9:42 PM To: rfraser@bluefrog.com; sralsten@ca.rr.com; tigers@autox.team.net Subject: RE: [Tigers] Original engine? Just checked. The date code is 64. Duke No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.46/2145 - Release Date: 05/31/09 05:53:00 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 3 10:16:39 2009 From: wwwdg@webtv.net (David or Gary) To: michael.s.king@gmail.com (michael king) Date: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 09:13:10 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Map Lights After reading the Alpine Thread and further posts here, I dug through my parts and found a used Gold/Silver cover. Picture links below. The Chrysler/Rootes parts book shows the #5041255 cover used on Series III onwards. The earlier cover is #5039585. I don't know if both covers are the same, only being different in color. The #5039585 pre Series III unit doesn't have a on/off switch, but the cover looks the same in the Rootes parts illustration. This metal Gold cover does not have mounting pins/blades on the inner area, even though the plastic lens is the same as my NOS one and has the same SPARTO number and holes for pin/blades. In the photos below the cover is definitely not black, it appears to have been gold and faded or worn to silver. I now believe early Tigers may have had the Gold cover. The finish doesn't look like paint it could be anodized, but does anodizing fade in the sun or oxidize? The way the silver/gold color is, it almost has to be faded/oxidized as the map light isn't in an area were it would get that much wear. Also the inside part against the plastic is still gold and couldn't get worn or oxidized? David Outside gold/silver http://pic50.picturetrail.com/VOL439/2051017/21606493/366048018.jpg Inside gold/silver http://pic50.picturetrail.com/VOL439/2051017/21606493/366048016.jpg Outside end close-up http://pic50.picturetrail.com/VOL439/2051017/21606493/366048020.jpg Inside end close-up http://pic50.picturetrail.com/VOL439/2051017/21606493/366048019.jpg ---------------- Reply with original e-mail message Sparto manufactured these lights for many cars.. they are on MKII and 420G jags.. they made them without switches (early alpine) and with later alpine and tiger. The early alpines have a different finsh on the lens.. you really need one from a rootes package with the part number from the parts book.. and i am talking a rootes package pre-chrysler as in yellow circle blue background.. as the later chrysler packaging often has a part that superceeds the earlier one.. just my .02 :-) -- Regards Michael King _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 3 11:34:54 2009 From: "Thomas Witt" To: Date: Wed, 03 Jun 2009 09:45:19 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Shelby tiger info That is very similar to the ad I mentioned the other day. The one I recall has Shelby sitting in the car. Either way I'm not taking sides. One thing has become apparent looking at this ad. When George Boskoff stated Shelby told him, "...to just bend the d*mn steering arms," I always had an image of an 80 year old looking Carroll barking out the order. The reality is he likely looked like he does in the ad. >>> http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2904787900054462410ujhDfU<<< _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 3 12:05:39 2009 From: " Ron Fraser" To: Date: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 13:56:18 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Mid West Mustangers car show Take your Tiger to a Chrysler meet with a poster showing the Sunbeam Tiger with the Chrysler Pentestar and really freak them out. Ron Fraser -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Teepen, Jere Sent: Monday, June 01, 2009 10:55 PM To: Samouce's; 'michael king' Cc: Tigers@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Tigers] Mid West Mustangers car show No one has mentioned that the SAAC is inclusive of the Sunbeam Tiger in all of their events. It may not be a Shelby generated vehicle, but it is a sort of step child, and thus accepted at the family reunions. Jere -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Samouce's Sent: Monday, June 01, 2009 7:09 PM To: 'michael king' Cc: Tigers@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Tigers] Mid West Mustangers car show Carroll was also paid a royalty for every Tiger sold. I am not a Shelby want to be by any stretch. Duke B382002037 From: michael king [mailto:michael.s.king@gmail.com] Sent: Monday, June 01, 2009 19:52 To: Samouce's Cc: Tigers@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Tigers] Mid West Mustangers car show Sorry Duke, i have to side with the guys who said "no" to having you in the Shelby class.. same issue i have with people putting "Shelby" on their parts on ebay.. he was involved in the prototype and in an early racing example... he doesn't really have much to do with the production cars and pushing the point makes you look like a Shelby want to be... enjoy the car for what it is,, not some tenuous link to some guy who hot rodded other peoples creations. there was never a "Shelby tiger" except for the yellow racer he ran.. even the prototype was a Shelby alpine... Anyway.. how much of the Shelby stuff actually ended up on the car rootes made their own steering, kept alpine brakes.. used a different rear end to the Shelby car etc... Let the mustang guys think what they want with their 2009 sepc cars.. they do legitimately have SHELBY on the title.. Which essentially equates to paying ol' Carroll a royalty for that privilege.. -- Regards Michael King No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.46/2145 - Release Date: 06/03/09 05:53:00 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 3 13:10:13 2009 From: To: Tigers@autox.team.net, rfraser@bluefrog.com Date: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 14:49:27 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Mid West Mustangers car show Are there Chrysler meets ? Kind of hard to imagine. One reason I bought a Mk1 was so I could properly not have the pentastar on the fender Steve ---- Ron Fraser wrote: > Take your Tiger to a Chrysler meet with a poster showing the Sunbeam Tiger > with the Chrysler Pentestar and really freak them out. > > Ron Fraser > > -----Original Message----- > From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] > On Behalf Of Teepen, Jere > Sent: Monday, June 01, 2009 10:55 PM > To: Samouce's; 'michael king' > Cc: Tigers@autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Tigers] Mid West Mustangers car show > > > No one has mentioned that the SAAC is inclusive of the Sunbeam Tiger in all > of their events. It may not be a Shelby generated vehicle, but it is a sort > of step child, and thus accepted at the family reunions. > > Jere > > -----Original Message----- > From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] > On Behalf Of Samouce's > Sent: Monday, June 01, 2009 7:09 PM > To: 'michael king' > Cc: Tigers@autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Tigers] Mid West Mustangers car show > > Carroll was also paid a royalty for every Tiger sold. > > > > I am not a Shelby want to be by any stretch. > > > Duke > > B382002037 > > > > From: michael king [mailto:michael.s.king@gmail.com] > Sent: Monday, June 01, 2009 19:52 > To: Samouce's > Cc: Tigers@autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Tigers] Mid West Mustangers car show > > > > Sorry Duke, > > > > i have to side with the guys who said "no" to having you in the Shelby > class.. same issue i have with people putting "Shelby" on their parts on > ebay.. he was involved in the prototype and in an early racing example... he > doesn't really have much to do with the production cars and pushing the > point makes you look like a Shelby want to be... enjoy the car for what it > is,, not some tenuous link to some guy who hot rodded other peoples > creations. there was never a "Shelby tiger" except for the yellow racer he > ran.. even the prototype was a Shelby alpine... > > > > Anyway.. how much of the Shelby stuff actually ended up on the car rootes > made their own steering, kept alpine brakes.. used a different rear end to > the Shelby car etc... Let the mustang guys think what they want with their > 2009 sepc cars.. they do legitimately have SHELBY on the title.. Which > essentially equates to paying ol' Carroll a royalty for that privilege.. > > > > > -- > Regards > > Michael King > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.46/2145 - Release Date: 06/03/09 > 05:53:00 > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 3 13:25:36 2009 From: "George Re" To: "tigers" Date: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 14:57:45 -0400 Subject: [Tigers] Tiger Side moldind clips? I just got a call from the body shop and asked me if he can remove the clips on the car he sais it would make the body work a lot easier I said that I would get back to him so my question is What sources do we have for the side molding clips the ones that look like pop rivets? I see that there are ones in plastic but I saw notes that they really do not work well. Thanks George _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 3 13:26:01 2009 From: Cullen McCann To: "tigers@autox.team.net" Date: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 14:02:19 -0500 Subject: [Tigers] Tiger for sale on craigslist? hello group, I was browsing craigslist looking for some odds and ends, and ran across an ad for a Tiger ( or claimed to be ) in Arizona...near flagstaff...Im not in the market for another Tiger right now but I thought I would pass along the ad in case it's a deal for someone or if someone wanted to inquire about it. I have no idea if its still even available....but I also laughed when I read the ad....especially in light of the recent discussion about Carroll's involvement....I didn't know that the Tiger was the prototype for the shelby cobra, did you guys? LOL....maybe it has some merit for someone. this is a direct copy of the ad, found on craigslist for flagstaff AZ........good luck, Cullen Sunbeam Tiger 65/260 (sedona) Reply to:sale-wed8h-1180935631@craigslist.org [Errors when replying to ads?] Date: 2009-05-20, 3:10PM MST I have an original Tiger Sunbeam. It has a rebuilt 260 motor, standard 4 speed trans, all original parts, stock Ford. It has custom wheels. This is a very valuable car and in perfect restored condition it has fetched 50+ thousand. I have never had it painted and have somewhat upgraded the interior, but it is in total need for restoration. I am the second owner. The original owner had it imported into California from England. This car is the prototype to the Shelby Cobra, It was designed by him in the 60's. Hardly needs any parts or pieces, no dents and minor surface scratches and worn paint, just needs cleaned and painted. If you are a serious buyer then you know that I am not going to get a few thousand for this rare and delightful car. It is probably worth somewhere in the 20 thousand dollar range, I have to do a little more research. The beautiful thing about this car is you can jump in it and start it right up. It has a little brake problem, but has a lifetime warranty on it and just needs to be replaced. This would make a car collecters dream come true, they are sought after in Caliofornia especially. It is a convertable. contact Carolyn @ 928-202-1018 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 3 13:26:03 2009 From: Cullen McCann To: "tigers@autox.team.net" Date: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 14:05:26 -0500 Subject: [Tigers] FW: Tiger for sale on craigslist? hello group, resending in plain text format...see if this goes thru....... I was browsing craigslist looking for some odds and ends, and ran across an ad for a Tiger ( or claimed to be ) in Arizona...near flagstaff...Im not in the market for another Tiger right now but I thought I would pass along the ad in case it's a deal for someone or if someone wanted to inquire about it. I have no idea if its still even available....but I also laughed when I read the ad....especially in light of the recent discussion about Carroll's involvement....I didn't know that the Tiger was the prototype for the shelby cobra, did you guys? LOL....maybe it has some merit for someone. this is a direct copy of the ad, found on craigslist for flagstaff AZ........good luck, Cullen Sunbeam Tiger 65/260 (sedona) Reply to:sale-wed8h-1180935631@craigslist.org [Errors when replying to ads?] Date: 2009-05-20, 3:10PM MST I have an original Tiger Sunbeam. It has a rebuilt 260 motor, standard 4 speed trans, all original parts, stock Ford. It has custom wheels. This is a very valuable car and in perfect restored condition it has fetched 50+ thousand. I have never had it painted and have somewhat upgraded the interior, but it is in total need for restoration. I am the second owner. The original owner had it imported into California from England. This car is the prototype to the Shelby Cobra, It was designed by him in the 60's. Hardly needs any parts or pieces, no dents and minor surface scratches and worn paint, just needs cleaned and painted. If you are a serious buyer then you know that I am not going to get a few thousand for this rare and delightful car. It is probably worth somewhere in the 20 thousand dollar range, I have to do a little more research. The beautiful thing about this car is you can jump in it and start it right up. It has a little brake problem, but has a lifetime warranty on it and just needs to be replaced. This would make a car collecters dream come true, they are sought after in Caliofornia especially. It is a convertable. contact Carolyn @ 928-202-1018 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 3 13:53:19 2009 From: " Ron Fraser" To: "'Bob Dixon'" , Date: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 15:35:18 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Original engine? Bob You are correct; that engine does seem too early for your Tiger. Your casting date and build date are May 1964; I would have expected 1965. This is not an impossible combination due to the way the engines were shipped, stacked, stored and moved to final line. What is the engine number for this Tiger? Do you have the small aluminum engine tag for this engine? Any Ford casting numbers and date code help determine exactly what engine configuration you have. Ron Fraser -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Bob Dixon Sent: Sunday, May 31, 2009 7:25 PM To: tigers@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Tigers] Original engine? My 260 seems too early for my car. The car is B382001436. The engine is: C4OE-6015E 4E11 date code 4E16F _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 3 14:25:04 2009 From: " Ron Fraser" To: "'George Re'" , "'tigers'" Date: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 15:53:53 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Tiger Side moldind clips? George I'm not sure there is a source for the original side molding clips, maybe there are sum in England. I have been using the plastic ones for a couple of decades now and I think I replaced 2 of them in that time frame. I believe they were originally a VW part but not totally sure right now so unless that part has changed I don't see a problem with them. Let's see what others have to say and offer. Ron Fraser -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of George Re Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 2:58 PM To: tigers Subject: [Tigers] Tiger Side moldind clips? I just got a call from the body shop and asked me if he can remove the clips on the car he sais it would make the body work a lot easier I said that I would get back to him so my question is What sources do we have for the side molding clips the ones that look like pop rivets? I see that there are ones in plastic but I saw notes that they really do not work well. Thanks George No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.46/2145 - Release Date: 06/03/09 05:53:00 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 3 14:28:50 2009 From: "Thomas Witt" To: Date: Wed, 03 Jun 2009 12:52:19 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Mid West Mustangers car show I once sat down and thought of all the different car shows a Tiger COULD be eligible for. I don't know that shows would be so delineated, but you never know. Here is the list: Sports car (type) British (country) Ford (engine) V-8 only (engine type) Chrysler (super parent company) Rootes (parent company) Sunbeam (company) Jensen (builder) Shelby (developer) Historic race car (certain Tigers) TV/movie cars (certain Tigers) And any car show with an "Other" category Can you think of any others? Tom > Are there Chrysler meets ? Kind of hard to imagine. One reason > I bought a Mk1 was so I could properly not have the pentastar > on the fender > > Steve _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 3 15:12:23 2009 From: stubrennan@comcast.net To: Thomas Witt Date: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 20:55:15 +0000 (UTC) Subject: Re: [Tigers] Mid West Mustangers car show The Lars Anderson Musuem in Brookline has had an "Orphan Car Day", for cars from marques that have disappeared.B B Soon thatB showB could be full of Pontiacs, Saturns, Saabs.... Stu _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 3 15:56:17 2009 From: larryall@pacbell.net To: tigers@autox.team.net Date: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 14:40:28 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Tigers] Car-Auto Train Poster I received my poster yesterday delivered via UPS. The poster is a nice piece of art and would look good put in a simple poster frame on the wall. Mine cane in a thick walled carboard tube to protect it from damage in transit. Unfortunately, it looks like someone at UPS may have dropped a heavy box on the tube and crushed it plus the poster inside. So much for the extra expense of the mailing tube. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 3 16:42:19 2009 From: Randy Zimmermann To: rfraser@bluefrog.com Date: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 15:21:59 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Tigers] Tiger Side moldind clips? Last year when I finally got around to re-attaching the side trim, I used nylon bolts and nuts for most of the moldings. The holes I couldn't reach for attaching the nuts, I used trim adhesive. Has held up well so far. Randy Z. Duluth, MN --- On Wed, 6/3/09, Ron Fraser wrote: From: Ron Fraser Subject: Re: [Tigers] Tiger Side moldind clips? To: "'George Re'" , "'tigers'" Date: Wednesday, June 3, 2009, 2:53 PM George I'm not sure there is a source for the original side molding clips, maybe there are sum in England. I have been using the plastic ones for a couple of decades now and I think I replaced 2 of them in that time frame. I believe they were originally a VW part but not totally sure right now so unless that part has changed I don't see a problem with them. Let's see what others have to say and offer. Ron Fraser -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of George Re Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 2:58 PM To: tigers Subject: [Tigers] Tiger Side moldind clips? I just got a call from the body shop and asked me if he can remove the clips on the car he sais it would make the body work a lot easier I said that I would get back to him so my question is What sources do we have for the side molding clips the ones that look like pop rivets? I see that there are ones in plastic but I saw notes that they really do not work well. Thanks George No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.46/2145 - Release Date: 06/03/09 05:53:00 Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 3 16:57:45 2009 From: Sandy Ganz To: tigers@autox.team.net Date: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 15:35:51 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Tigers] Car-Auto Train Poster Below is a note from the Amtrak poster creator! So someone knows Michael that has this tiger ;) B -- B Hello Sandy. You have a good eye. For this AMTRAK ad (attached), the agency wanted a bsportyb carB but unrecognizable.B So I used my friendbs Tiger as reference. B Ibve always really admired his car. B The ad agency had me remove a couple of the distinct Tiger details (bumper guards). Itbs a great car. Thanks for your inquiry. B Regards, / Michael S. B MICHAEL SCHWAB STUDIO 108 Tamalpais Avenue San Anselmo, CA B 94960 415/ 257-5792 http://www.michaelschwab.com P.S: B If you are interested in a more fine-printed, signed art print on archival paper, let me know. We could print it for you at any size.B B ------ Forwarded Message Hi Michael b B I have a quick question, I saw one of your posters that you did for Amtrakbs Auto Train and it was one with a Red Sunbeam tiger. A few folks from the Sunbeam Tiger club had wondered how their obscure model of car made it to the poster! B BTW all of the poster have been sold out from the Amtrak store as of last week as it seemed once the Sunbeam Tiger folks found out about it they ordered them until sold out. B Thanks for any insight. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 3 17:29:42 2009 From: larryall@pacbell.net To: tigers@autox.team.net Date: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 16:06:40 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Tigers] (Tigers) Car-Auto Train Poster I called Customer Service and after being put thru 4 different representatives finally got someone who was sympathetic to my plight. She told me that there had been such a demand for this poster that they are out now. She expects more by the end of the month. She told me to just keep the damaged poster and that they would send me a replacement end of June. She was curious why the posters sold out so fast and so i told her the story about these wonderful cars that we are fortunate to own and that anything related to them is always of interest to our hobbyists. She appreciated "the rest of the story"... Message: 9 Date: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 14:40:28 -0700 (PDT) From: larryall@pacbell.net Subject: [Tigers] Car-Auto Train Poster To: tigers@autox.team.net Message-ID: <157097.58960.qm@web83003.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I received my poster yesterday delivered via UPS. The poster is a nice piece of art and would look good put in a simple poster frame on the wall. Mine cane in a thick walled carboard tube to protect it from damage in transit. Unfortunately, it looks like someone at UPS may have dropped a heavy box on the tube and crushed it plus the poster inside. So much for the extra expense of the mailing tube. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 3 17:43:38 2009 From: "Stu Brennan" To: "'Randy Zimmermann'" , Date: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 19:14:31 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Tiger Side moldind clips? I used nylon screws for my side trim, too. 4-40 pan heads, IIRC. Places like Lowes, HD, or any good HW store should have them. I, too, am not too sure how long they will last. Mine have only been in since 1977... Stu _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 3 17:43:43 2009 From: "Kirk Smith" To: Date: Wed, 03 Jun 2009 16:15:21 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Mid West Mustangers car show Although close to the 'V-8' category, another place to show a Tiger would be at a Muscle Car show. Kirk B382000503 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 3 18:13:59 2009 From: "Bob Dixon" To: , Date: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 17:54:39 -0600 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Original engine? Looks like my valve cover plate/sticker is a reproduction, but it says engine 2063 A27KA. ----- Original Message ----- From: " Ron Fraser" To: "'Bob Dixon'" ; Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 1:35 PM Subject: RE: [Tigers] Original engine? > Bob > You are correct; that engine does seem too early for your Tiger. > Your casting date and build date are May 1964; I would have expected 1965. > This is not an impossible combination due to the way the engines were > shipped, stacked, stored and moved to final line. > > What is the engine number for this Tiger? > Do you have the small aluminum engine tag for this engine? > Any Ford casting numbers and date code help determine exactly what engine > configuration you have. > > Ron Fraser > > > -----Original Message----- > From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] > On Behalf Of Bob Dixon > Sent: Sunday, May 31, 2009 7:25 PM > To: tigers@autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Tigers] Original engine? > > > My 260 seems too early for my car. > > The car is B382001436. > > The engine is: > C4OE-6015E 4E11 > date code 4E16F _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 3 19:28:17 2009 From: garywinblad@comcast.net To: Stu Brennan Date: Thu, 4 Jun 2009 01:11:20 +0000 (UTC) Subject: Re: [Tigers] Tiger Side moldind clips? In 1979 I used steel screws. I chucked em up in my drill and using a file, put an "inverse camber" on them to duplicate the original rivet. They're still there holding the trim on. On the parts of the car that still had original rivets, I just sanded around them.. caused some slight rippling of the surface but hardly noticeable.. Gary ----- Original Message ----- From: Stu Brennan To: 'Randy Zimmermann' , rfraser@bluefrog.com Cc: tigers@autox.team.net Sent: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 23:14:31 +0000 (UTC) Subject: Re: [Tigers] Tiger Side moldind clips? I used nylon screws for my side trim, too. 4-40 pan heads, IIRC. Places like Lowes, HD, or any good HW store should have them. I, too, am not too sure how long they will last. Mine have only been in since 1977... Stu _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 3 19:59:41 2009 From: garywinblad@comcast.net To: David or Gary Date: Thu, 4 Jun 2009 01:37:54 +0000 (UTC) Subject: Re: [Tigers] Map Lights I now think my MKI had the early style. I've only had it since 1971 and my memory is not too good, but I think it originally had the "gold" look (NOT silver like now). There is no sign of any paint, pretty sure it is some kind of anodize or die. There is a slight hint of brown on the very top protected edge now, not gold though. It sounds like your metal "blades" just went away.. one of my metal blade (clip) is broken, probably ready to go away.. Gary ----- Original Message ----- From: David or Gary To: michael king Cc: garywinblad@comcast.net, Tiger's Den Sent: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 16:13:10 +0000 (UTC) Subject: Re: [Tigers] Map Lights After reading the Alpine Thread and further posts here, I dug through my parts and found a used Gold/Silver cover. Picture links below. The Chrysler/Rootes parts book shows the #5041255 cover used on Series III onwards. The earlier cover is #5039585. I don't know if both covers are the same, only being different in color. The #5039585 pre Series III unit doesn't have a on/off switch, but the cover looks the same in the Rootes parts illustration. This metal Gold cover does not have mounting pins/blades on the inner area, even though the plastic lens is the same as my NOS one and has the same SPARTO number and holes for pin/blades. In the photos below the cover is definitely not black, it appears to have been gold and faded or worn to silver. I now believe early Tigers may have had the Gold cover. The finish doesn't look like paint it could be anodized, but does anodizing fade in the sun or oxidize? The way the silver/gold color is, it almost has to be faded/oxidized as the map light isn't in an area were it would get that much wear. Also the inside part against the plastic is still gold and couldn't get worn or oxidized? David Outside gold/silver http://pic50.picturetrail.com/VOL439/2051017/21606493/366048018.jpg Inside gold/silver http://pic50.picturetrail.com/VOL439/2051017/21606493/366048016.jpg Outside end close-up http://pic50.picturetrail.com/VOL439/2051017/21606493/366048020.jpg Inside end close-up http://pic50.picturetrail.com/VOL439/2051017/21606493/366048019.jpg ---------------- _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 3 21:58:20 2009 From: " Ron Fraser" To: "'Bob Dixon'" , Date: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 23:24:16 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Original engine? Bob That number should also be on the Vin Plate. A27KA = 4/27/64 engine group 4E16F = May 16, 1964 the engine build date C40E-6015E engine block casting started production in May, 1964 4E11 = casting date May 11, 1964 Everything here is consistent. This probably means all the A27KA engine group are the C40E-E casting which was the last casting change for the 260 block The inconsistency of the engine numbers, I believe is due to shipping and storage of the engines. I don't know the details for this but here is how I see it. The Cleveland Foundry casts and builds the engines, then they go to packaging and shipping where they probably receives the valve cover labels and numbers. The engine and transmission are crated and packaged for shipment in sequential order and possibly put into cargo containers. The crates and containers are in 1 order on the ship; in England they are removed and stacked in a different order. The crates are most likely put on the train and delivered to Rootes receiving and put in storage, another order. Someone has to break down the crates and the engines are sent to final line storage or to final line delivery, another order. I think you can see how the sequential order has now become a random sequence of engine numbers for the final assembly line. There is no clear explanation of how all of this was handled so this is purely a guess on my part. Hopefully this gives you a slight understanding how and why the engine numbers jump around so. Ron Fraser -----Original Message----- From: Bob Dixon [mailto:bobdixon@frii.com] Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 7:55 PM To: rfraser@bluefrog.com; tigers@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Tigers] Original engine? Looks like my valve cover plate/sticker is a reproduction, but it says engine 2063 A27KA. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 4 08:15:47 2009 From: "rande" To: tigers@autox.team.net Date: Thu, 4 Jun 2009 10:00:07 -0400 Subject: [Tigers] moulding clips for Tiger Someone posted the replacement clips come from VW. The 1975-6 Rabbit with similar slim moulding takes PN 155 853 585 clip (white with red hole seal). I have some but I'll have to match them to the mouldings and the SS clips I also have. The 1967-8 113/117 bug uses a PN 113 853 585C clip and I won't see these until this weekend to compare them. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 4 13:14:55 2009 From: "Tiger Man" To: "michael king" , "Tiger Talk List Tiger" Date: Thu, 4 Jun 2009 12:49:22 -0600 Subject: Re: [Tigers] The Cost Of Shelby Thanks for posting this again, actually last week I went through the old email messages looking for this, since I am going to a small local car show in a couple of weeks. Trouble is, webshots is not playing very nice. It will let you download them only in webshots format, and printing straight from webshots does not get you a full page print. Any chance you could make these available as straight jpegs or something at some at some other location that will let the files be kept in original format? I appreciate how useful it is to have a basic spec sheet. Thanks, Steve > > Look i dont realyl care one way or another.. I love Sunbeams.. I was > flattered when i was invited to a special interest section at the ferrari > concourse in 2008 and parked with bugattis, maserati GP cars etc.. as for > display cars.. i guess time to promote mine again.. free to download for > everyone.. simply print and laminate! > > > http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2113355360054462410DzKnVh > http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2517842820054462410EQCeiW > > > http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2276233220054462410Shqpwp _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 4 15:32:57 2009 From: To: tigers@autox.team.net Date: Thu, 4 Jun 2009 21:17:47 +0000 Subject: [Tigers] Going to the light side.....alternator I have been through the archives and am stumped. How do I wire my red light to work with an alternator? I am using a "two" wire alt. One large wire goes to the batt and the other goes to the ignition switch to activate the alt when the ignition is on. I plan on staying with the AMP meter for now but will eventually go to a volt meter. TIA! Duke B382002037 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 4 16:44:32 2009 From: "Smit, Theo" To: , Date: Thu, 4 Jun 2009 16:16:40 -0600 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Going to the light side.....alternator Some "two-wire" alternators have an additional output that can be wired to the charge light... Others actually use the ignition switch wire, a diode and the lightbulb to enable the alternator... When the ignition is turned on (but without the engine running), the current flows through the diode and the bulb; when the engine is started, the alternator brings the voltage on the other side up and the bulb goes out. You'd have to dig through the wiring diagram for the original application of your alternator to see what their intentions were. I put together this solid state regulator with undervoltage detection: http://members.shaw.ca/tsmit/stabilizer/stabilizer.html It illuminates the LED (and the OEM charge light if you want) when the system voltage is below about 12.7 volts. I have some on hand, and Tom Hall also does. Theo _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 4 17:15:09 2009 From: "spook01" To: Date: Thu, 4 Jun 2009 17:50:56 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tigers] FW: Tiger for sale on craigslist? i still have a project tiger with zero rust new paint for sale. it needs to be bolted together. fresh engine, engine and drive train installed, suspension under it. a roller. funky metallic dark brown paint, but hey, for what they are selling for now, you can't go wrong. Ray ----- Original Message ----- From: "Cullen McCann" To: Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 2:05 PM Subject: [Tigers] FW: Tiger for sale on craigslist? > hello group, > > resending in plain text format...see if this goes thru....... > > I was browsing craigslist looking for some odds and ends, and ran across > an ad > for a Tiger ( or claimed to be ) in Arizona...near flagstaff...Im not in > the > market for another Tiger right now but I thought I would pass along the ad > in > case it's a deal for someone or if someone wanted to inquire about it. I > have > no idea if its still even available....but I also laughed when I read the > ad....especially in light of the recent discussion about Carroll's > involvement....I didn't know that the Tiger was the prototype for the > shelby > cobra, did you guys? LOL....maybe it has some merit for someone. > > this is a direct copy of the ad, found on craigslist for flagstaff > AZ........good luck, Cullen > > > Sunbeam Tiger 65/260 (sedona) > Reply to:sale-wed8h-1180935631@craigslist.org [Errors when replying to > ads?] > Date: 2009-05-20, 3:10PM MST > > I have an original Tiger Sunbeam. It has a rebuilt 260 motor, standard 4 > speed > trans, all original parts, stock Ford. It has custom wheels. > This is a very valuable car and in perfect restored condition it has > fetched > 50+ thousand. I have never had it painted and have somewhat upgraded the > interior, but it is in total need for restoration. I am the second owner. > The > original owner had it imported into California from England. This car is > the > prototype to the Shelby Cobra, It was designed by him in the 60's. > Hardly needs any parts or pieces, no dents and minor surface scratches and > worn paint, just needs cleaned and painted. If you are a serious buyer > then > you know that I am not going to get a few thousand for this rare and > delightful car. It is probably worth somewhere in the 20 thousand dollar > range, I have to do a little more research. The beautiful thing about this > car > is you can jump in it and start it right up. It has a little brake > problem, > but has a lifetime warranty on it and just needs to be replaced. This > would > make a car collecters dream come true, they are sought after in > Caliofornia > especially. It is a convertable. > contact Carolyn @ 928-202-1018 > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 5 07:18:02 2009 From: "spook01" To: "Tony Somebody" , "michael king" Date: Fri, 5 Jun 2009 08:01:35 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Mid West Mustangers car show hi guys, tony is correct. and, just to put a little more interest in, here's a little history: I had dinner with ian garrard years ago at the first tiger meet in vail, co. and asked him about shelby's role. he told me shelby's role was merely that he had prepared a prototype from parts given to him. since he was present at the time, i took him at his word. so. be satisfied with what you have, a unique auto, and forget about trying to cash in on the shelby cobra-mustang (early and late)-dodgeshelbydaytona four- banger bucks. cs would no doubt be happy to claim rock invention if he could squeeze money out of them! he's now in the cobra kit car business after years of dumping on the phenom. our automotive gods have clay feet, too. Ray ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tony Somebody" To: "michael king" Cc: "Beamclub" Sent: Tuesday, June 02, 2009 11:10 AM Subject: Re: [Tigers] Mid West Mustangers car show >I have absolutely no proof, other than a gut feeling BUT the 289 was >available > for fitment in the first Tigers. My gut tells me CS had a part in helping > Rootes get 260 engines from Ford. he had to be aware the Tiger was going > to be > a serious contender for outrunniing the first Cobras that also received > power > from a 260 engine.I have no opinion of what claim we have to Mr. shelby, > especially calling the Tiger a shelby Tiger- it just didnt exist. I have > attended Shelby events at the Brown cnty.anual Shelby event. His name is > not > on our cars but we are set aside with our own group at the event and we > are > accepted by them or we acceppt them if you will. > At one time I thought that some of the shelby tiger parts might also be > used > on the Cobra but it is evident now that sellers are just using shelby to > put > the parts on more screens and if the Cobra used the same part as a tiger > it > was very few. If we could lay claim to being a real member of the Shelby > family it could only increase the value of our cars BUT I only see the > bastard > stepson relationship. Im sure when ask that CS is happy to claim the Tiger > but > Im not sure it is a valid claim. > TtT > --- On Mon, 6/1/09, michael king wrote: > >> From: michael king >> Subject: Re: [Tigers] Mid West Mustangers car show >> To: "Samouce's" >> Cc: Tigers@autox.team.net >> Date: Monday, June 1, 2009, 7:51 PM >> Sorry Duke, >> >> >> >> i have to side with the guys who said "no" to having you in >> the Shelby >> class.. same issue i have with people putting "Shelby" on >> their parts on >> ebay.. he was involved in the prototype and in an early >> racing example... he >> doesn't really have much to do with the production cars and >> pushing the >> point makes you look like a Shelby want to be... enjoy the >> car for what it >> is,, not some tenuous link to some guy who hot rodded other >> peoples >> creations. there was never a "Shelby tiger" except for the >> yellow racer he >> ran.. even the prototype was a Shelby alpine... >> >> >> >> Anyway.. how much of the Shelby stuff actually ended up on >> the car rootes >> made their own steering, kept alpine brakes.. used a >> different rear end to >> the Shelby car etc... Let the mustang guys think what they >> want with their >> 2009 sepc cars.. they do legitimately have SHELBY on the >> title.. Which >> essentially equates to paying ol' Carroll a royalty for >> that privilege.. >> >> >> -- >> Regards >> >> Michael King >> _______________________________________________ >> Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Tigers@autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers >> >> http://www.team.net/archive > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 6 00:42:42 2009 From: kevin beck To: rfraser@bluefrog.com Date: Fri, 5 Jun 2009 20:09:01 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Original engine? This is what I have C40E-6015E---4E22 99 percent sure I have the original block it was painted black. Also have a couple of questions my 260 has been sitting for quit afew years on the garage floor and the bores have started to rust I know the bores are thin wall, but has anyone had their 260 rebuilt if so did you use 10 thousand over pistons or what and are they available, also my car came with the optioned intake that says tiger on it also painted black . Any feedback would be appreciated. Thanks Kevin On Wed, Jun 3, 2009 at 11:24 PM, Ron Fraser wrote: > Bob > That number should also be on the Vin Plate. > A27KA = 4/27/64 engine group > > 4E16F = May 16, 1964 the engine build date > > C40E-6015E engine block casting started production in May, 1964 > 4E11 = casting date May 11, 1964 > > Everything here is consistent. > > This probably means all the A27KA engine group are the C40E-E casting which > was the last casting change for the 260 block > > > The inconsistency of the engine numbers, I believe is due to shipping and > storage of the engines. > > I don't know the details for this but here is how I see it. The > Cleveland Foundry casts and builds the engines, then they go to packaging > and shipping where they probably receives the valve cover labels and > numbers. The engine and transmission are crated and packaged for shipment > in sequential order and possibly put into cargo containers. The crates > and > containers are in 1 order on the ship; in England they are removed and > stacked in a different order. The crates are most likely put on the train > and delivered to Rootes receiving and put in storage, another order. > Someone has to break down the crates and the engines are sent to final line > storage or to final line delivery, another order. I think you can see how > the sequential order has now become a random sequence of engine numbers for > the final assembly line. There is no clear explanation of how all of this > was handled so this is purely a guess on my part. > > Hopefully this gives you a slight understanding how and why the engine > numbers jump around so. > > Ron Fraser > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Bob Dixon [mailto:bobdixon@frii.com] > Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 7:55 PM > To: rfraser@bluefrog.com; tigers@autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Tigers] Original engine? > > > Looks like my valve cover plate/sticker is a reproduction, but it says > engine 2063 A27KA. > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 6 03:58:06 2009 From: michael king To: Tiger Talk List Tiger Date: Sat, 6 Jun 2009 19:28:05 +1000 Subject: [Tigers] Sunbeam Tiger history page I have recieved several requests about my info pages, and several people have spoken to me about what they would like. I am going to produce another version of the page with a breif history of the Tiger story. This will be in A3 portrait format with text and several images of key Tigers (miles, shelby prototypes, LM tigers, rally tigers, SCCA and NHRA cars and MI/II production cars prhaps some other images depending how it looks - i dont wantit to crowded) anyway.. here is the text.. I appreciate any feedback or corrections: In 1962 Rootes Groups west coast manager Ian Garrad, conceived the idea of squeezing the small block ford Windsor V8 into its Sunbeam Alpine sports car. Ken Miles was commissioned to produce a quick prototype. Over the next 6 weeks Miles installed a 260CuIn V8 and 2 speed auto into a 1600cc SII Alpine. Mounting the engine very forward to allow for the stock steering the Candy Apple Red prototype proved very quick, but with dubious handling. Encouraged by the results Garrad approached Carroll Shelby to develop a more refined prototype that could be presented to the Rootes board in the UK. Shelby American adapted another SII Alpine, Geoeoge Boskoff fitting a 260 V8, 4 speed transmission, rack and pinion steering and Studebaker final drive. After further development by Doane Spencer and Ken Miles the white prototype was given some interior detailing and proved the concept was ready to be sent to the UK. Presented to the board in July 1963 Lord Rootes personally drove the car, rumoured with the handbrake on, and was so impressed with the performance ordered that it go into production. Henry Ford was contacted and an order for 400 engines and transmissions was placed. The final specification of the SIV Alpine based car was finalised over the next 11 months and the car was in production at Jensen motors by June of 1964. The Sunbeam Tiger would make a name for itself in its short production run. The press praised the cars sporting and touring abilities, editors of Autorcar and Motor both owning MKI and MKII Tigers. In 1965 and 66 Car & Driver awarded the Tiger best grand touring car $2500-$3500. The Tiger would also distinguish itself in competition. It competed in the 1964 Lemans 24 hours, was successful in international rallying and proved competitive in SCCA racing and NHRA and AHRA drag racing in America. With Chryslers purchase of a controlling share of the Rootes group in 1967 the Tigers days were numbered. Just 533 examples of the MKII development of the Tiger were produced before the plug was pulled and the Tiger past into history with only 7085 examples being made. Today the Tigers understated looks and well finished interior combined with its muscle car potential have endowed it with a loyal following. Its continued success in historic racing and rallying and increasing collectability ensure that the Sunbeam still has a Tiger in its tank. -- Regards Michael King _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 6 07:28:21 2009 From: "Samouce's" To: "'kevin beck'" , Date: Sat, 6 Jun 2009 08:06:28 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Original engine? My original 260 is bored .030 over. Pistons have 030 on the tops. I can relieve you of that nasty manifold. Duke B382002037 -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of kevin beck Sent: Friday, June 05, 2009 19:09 To: rfraser@bluefrog.com Cc: tigers@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Tigers] Original engine? This is what I have C40E-6015E---4E22 99 percent sure I have the original block it was painted black. Also have a couple of questions my 260 has been sitting for quit afew years on the garage floor and the bores have started to rust I know the bores are thin wall, but has anyone had their 260 rebuilt if so did you use 10 thousand over pistons or what and are they available, also my car came with the optioned intake that says tiger on it also painted black . Any feedback would be appreciated. Thanks Kevin On Wed, Jun 3, 2009 at 11:24 PM, Ron Fraser wrote: > Bob > That number should also be on the Vin Plate. > A27KA = 4/27/64 engine group > > 4E16F = May 16, 1964 the engine build date > > C40E-6015E engine block casting started production in May, 1964 > 4E11 = casting date May 11, 1964 > > Everything here is consistent. > > This probably means all the A27KA engine group are the C40E-E casting which > was the last casting change for the 260 block > > > The inconsistency of the engine numbers, I believe is due to shipping and > storage of the engines. > > I don't know the details for this but here is how I see it. The > Cleveland Foundry casts and builds the engines, then they go to packaging > and shipping where they probably receives the valve cover labels and > numbers. The engine and transmission are crated and packaged for shipment > in sequential order and possibly put into cargo containers. The crates > and > containers are in 1 order on the ship; in England they are removed and > stacked in a different order. The crates are most likely put on the train > and delivered to Rootes receiving and put in storage, another order. > Someone has to break down the crates and the engines are sent to final line > storage or to final line delivery, another order. I think you can see how > the sequential order has now become a random sequence of engine numbers for > the final assembly line. There is no clear explanation of how all of this > was handled so this is purely a guess on my part. > > Hopefully this gives you a slight understanding how and why the engine > numbers jump around so. > > Ron Fraser > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Bob Dixon [mailto:bobdixon@frii.com] > Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 7:55 PM > To: rfraser@bluefrog.com; tigers@autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Tigers] Original engine? > > > Looks like my valve cover plate/sticker is a reproduction, but it says > engine 2063 A27KA. > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 6 07:43:33 2009 From: " Ron Fraser" To: "'kevin beck'" , Date: Sat, 6 Jun 2009 09:14:44 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Original engine? Kevin 4E22 = May 22, 1964 I would need additional information but it should be the original block and yes it should be black. Information that would help; Vin # Engine # Build date code Engine tag numbers; Ford started engine tags in Jan 1964, this is small aluminum tag on the intake manifold Yours maybe gone since you have a different intake manifold The Tiger 4bbl intake manifold is aluminum. I would have left it natural aluminum color. I'm not sure what is available for the rebuild of a 260 block. Your best bet is to talk to an engine rebuilder to determine your options and what is available now. Hot tanking and honing might take all the rust away. Ron Fraser -----Original Message----- From: kevin beck [mailto:kevinteresa.beck74@gmail.com] Sent: Friday, June 05, 2009 8:09 PM To: rfraser@bluefrog.com Cc: Bob Dixon; tigers@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Tigers] Original engine? This is what I have C40E-6015E---4E22 99 percent sure I have the original block it was painted black. Also have a couple of questions my 260 has been sitting for quit afew years on the garage floor and the bores have started to rust I know the bores are thin wall, but has anyone had their 260 rebuilt if so did you use 10 thousand over pistons or what and are they available, also my car came with the optioned intake that says tiger on it also painted black . Any feedback would be appreciated. Thanks Kevin _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 6 14:27:25 2009 From: Steve Laifman To: Tiger's Den Date: Sat, 06 Jun 2009 13:02:35 -0700 Subject: [Tigers] Where the heck is it! Tigers, Thanks to Michael King, frequent list contributor, we added a very nicely rendered LAT official Brochure : http://www.tigersunited.com/resources/parts_service/LAT-brochure.pdf In addition, the long lost "Tiger Wheels" pictures were found, by Theo Smit, to be located at: http://www.tigersunited.com/techtips/tech_threads/tt-wheel.asp Thanks to Theo Smit for his quick work in posting the LAT brochure, and finding the mysteriously located "Raiders of the Lost Wheels and Tyres" address. :-) Steve -- ___ Steve Laifman Editor - TigersUnited.com _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 6 19:09:32 2009 From: To: Tiger Talk List Tiger , michael king Date: Sat, 6 Jun 2009 20:48:12 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Sunbeam Tiger history page Very well done Michael. I like it. Steve B9473720 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 6 20:40:23 2009 From: michael king To: Tiger Talk List Tiger , Buck Trippel Date: Sun, 7 Jun 2009 12:11:06 +1000 Subject: [Tigers] Updated Tiger history page Thanks to those who have asked questions and provided clarification on some points, I have revised the text, i am still trying to keep this short so as to leave room on the page for images, and so its not an essay.. but want the important facts in there.. and hopefully mo errors! I still mneed some things clarified as i am getting conflicting information. In 1962 Rootes Groups west coast manager Ian Garrad conceived the idea of squeezing a higher performance engine into its Sunbeam Alpine sports car. Garrad approached Carroll Shelby of Cobra fame to develop a prototype that could be presented to the Rootes board in the UK. Shelby American was provided a white SII Alpine as the base. Gorge Boskoff removed the stock 1600cc 4 cylinder and began modifying it to accommodate a 260 Ford V8, 4 speed transmission, rack and pinion steering and Studebaker final drive. Impatient to see his idea realised Ken Miles was commissioned to produce a quick prototype. Over the next 6 weeks *(can someone confirm this I have people sayin 1 week and books saying 6)* Miles installed a 260 V8 and 2 speed auto into another SII Alpine. Mounting the engine very forward to allow for the stock steering the Candy Apple Red prototype proved very quick, but with dubious handling. Encouraged by the results Garrard waited as the Shelby prototype was developed by Doane Spencer and Ken Miles. After some mechanical refinements the white prototype was given some interior detailing and proved the concept was ready to be sent to the UK. Presented to the board in July 1963 Lord Rootes personally drove the car, rumoured with the handbrake on, and was so impressed with the performance ordered that it go into production. Henry Ford was contacted and an order for 400 engines *(can someone confirm numbers?) *and transmissions was placed. The final specification of the SIV Alpine based car was finalised over the next 11 months and the car was in production at Jensen motors by June of 1964. The Sunbeam Tiger would make a name for itself in its short production run. The press praised the cars sporting and touring abilities, editors of Autorcar and Motor both owning MKI and MKII Tigers. In 1965 and 66 Car & Driver awarded the Tiger best grand touring car $2500-$3500. The Tiger would also distinguish itself in competition. It competed in the 1964 Lemans 24 hours, was successful in international rallying and proved competitive in SCCA racing and NHRA and AHRA drag racing in America. With Chryslers purchase of a controlling share of the Rootes group in 1967 the Tigers days were numbered. Just 533 examples of the MKII development of the Tiger were produced before the plug was pulled and the Tiger passed into history with only 7085 examples being made. Today the Tigers understated looks and well finished interior combined with its muscle car potential have endowed it with a loyal following. Its continued success in historic racing and rallying and increasing collectability ensure that the Sunbeam still has a Tiger in its tank. . -- Regards Michael King _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 6 21:29:46 2009 From: "rande" To: tigers@autox.team.net Date: Sat, 6 Jun 2009 22:56:16 -0400 Subject: [Tigers] wheels on Harrington Tiger If we're thinking of Bill Van Velkinburgs former car, the wheel his car was photographed with at the May 1992 Temecula United was a different brand and design than Tom Witt is thinking of. It's a Cosmic brand wheel ( I don't know the model name). If you have a copy of the Mike Taylor book Tiger-The making of a Sports Car, first edition with color pictures (1979, not the 1984 reprint), there's a picture of the car and the wheels taken in the UK. These are the same wheels the car was displayed with at Temecula. I have a jpg of just the wheels if anyone needs a look, or can send a photostat of the car at Temecula via snail mail. RB _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 6 23:57:30 2009 From: "Thomas Witt" To: Date: Sat, 06 Jun 2009 22:31:25 -0700 Subject: [Tigers] wheels on Harrington Tiger Hi Rande, Actually my wheels (shown on the Tigers United web site) are Cosmics. The name is cast right into the wheel. While I haven't scrutinized every detail between mine and the wheels on the Harrington they appear similar. However, the previous owner I purchased the car from did tell me that the blacked out (painted) portion of the wheel is pretty much the reverse of the Harrington Tiger. So, that might account for the difference in appearance. I also have replacement center caps (made to fit by wrapping with electrical tape, by PO not me). The picture that Steve used on the TU site is a zoomed in portion of a larger picture. So the resolution is also limited. I'd be happy to swap wheel pictures with you to confirm what is accurate. If in fact my wheels are different I will seek to rectify the error. Regards, Tom Witt > If we're thinking of Bill Van Velkinburgs former car, the wheel his car > was photographed > with at the May 1992 Temecula United was a different brand and design than > Tom > Witt is thinking of. > > It's a Cosmic brand wheel ( I don't know the model name). If you have a > copy > of the Mike Taylor book Tiger-The making of a Sports Car, first edition > with > color pictures (1979, not the 1984 reprint), there's a picture of the car > and > the wheels taken in the UK. These are the same wheels the car was > displayed > with at Temecula. > > I have a jpg of just the wheels if anyone needs a look, or can send a > photostat > of the car at Temecula via snail mail. > > RB _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jun 7 00:28:41 2009 From: "Kirk Smith" To: Date: Sat, 06 Jun 2009 23:09:48 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Cosmic wheels There seem to be many variations of the 'Cosmic' wheels. Check these out: http://www.cosmic-wheels.com/page.php?4 Kirk B382000503 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jun 7 16:39:48 2009 From: "Pointers" To: Date: Sun, 7 Jun 2009 17:18:29 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Where the heck is it! Wonder why so many LATs are missing from the LAT official brochure? Gary. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- -------------------------------- Date: Sat, 06 Jun 2009 13:02:35 -0700 From: Steve Laifman Subject: [Tigers] Where the heck is it! To: Tiger's Den Cc: "Smit, Theo" Message-ID: <4A2ACB5B.8070504@SoCal.rr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Tigers, Thanks to Michael King, frequent list contributor, we added a very nicely rendered LAT official Brochure : http://www.tigersunited.com/resources/parts_service/LAT-brochure.pdf _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 8 06:12:01 2009 From: "Robert J. Wanty" To: "Samouce's" , "kevin beck" Date: Mon, 8 Jun 2009 07:48:16 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Original engine? My 260 is .040 over and runs great. Bob B382001318 -----Original Message----- From: Samouce's [mailto:wsamouce@kc.rr.com] Sent: Saturday, June 06, 2009 9:06 AM To: 'kevin beck'; rfraser@bluefrog.com Cc: tigers@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Tigers] Original engine? My original 260 is bored .030 over. Pistons have 030 on the tops. I can relieve you of that nasty manifold. Duke B382002037 -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of kevin beck Sent: Friday, June 05, 2009 19:09 To: rfraser@bluefrog.com Cc: tigers@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Tigers] Original engine? This is what I have C40E-6015E---4E22 99 percent sure I have the original block it was painted black. Also have a couple of questions my 260 has been sitting for quit afew years on the garage floor and the bores have started to rust I know the bores are thin wall, but has anyone had their 260 rebuilt if so did you use 10 thousand over pistons or what and are they available, also my car came with the optioned intake that says tiger on it also painted black . Any feedback would be appreciated. Thanks Kevin On Wed, Jun 3, 2009 at 11:24 PM, Ron Fraser wrote: > Bob > That number should also be on the Vin Plate. > A27KA = 4/27/64 engine group > > 4E16F = May 16, 1964 the engine build date > > C40E-6015E engine block casting started production in May, 1964 > 4E11 = casting date May 11, 1964 > > Everything here is consistent. > > This probably means all the A27KA engine group are the C40E-E casting which > was the last casting change for the 260 block > > > The inconsistency of the engine numbers, I believe is due to shipping and > storage of the engines. > > I don't know the details for this but here is how I see it. The > Cleveland Foundry casts and builds the engines, then they go to packaging > and shipping where they probably receives the valve cover labels and > numbers. The engine and transmission are crated and packaged for shipment > in sequential order and possibly put into cargo containers. The crates > and > containers are in 1 order on the ship; in England they are removed and > stacked in a different order. The crates are most likely put on the train > and delivered to Rootes receiving and put in storage, another order. > Someone has to break down the crates and the engines are sent to final line > storage or to final line delivery, another order. I think you can see how > the sequential order has now become a random sequence of engine numbers for > the final assembly line. There is no clear explanation of how all of this > was handled so this is purely a guess on my part. > > Hopefully this gives you a slight understanding how and why the engine > numbers jump around so. > > Ron Fraser > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Bob Dixon [mailto:bobdixon@frii.com] > Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 7:55 PM > To: rfraser@bluefrog.com; tigers@autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Tigers] Original engine? > > > Looks like my valve cover plate/sticker is a reproduction, but it says > engine 2063 A27KA. > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 8 13:23:51 2009 From: Sandy Ganz To: tigers@autox.team.net Date: Mon, 8 Jun 2009 12:23:35 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Tigers] Amtrack Posters From the Artist... Here is a note that was sent to me, if anyone is interested run and ownB it, I have what I need but figured others might be interested in something else nicer or a group purchase. Below is the contact information and a quoted email that I was on. Sandy -- Hi, I spoke with Michael and he is willing to offer a custom open edition of signed bstudio printsb (approx. 13x19b) for Tiger owners. These prints would be digitally printed on archival fine art paper.B B Cost: $150 per print - minimum order, 12 prints sent to one address. Thank you for your interest! Best, Lisa -- Lisa Hilgers c/o Michael Schwab Studio 108 Tamalpais Ave San Anselmo, CA 94960 415-257-5792 fax: 415-257-5793 www.michaelschwab.com _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 9 15:28:28 2009 From: Steve Laifman To: Pointers Date: Tue, 09 Jun 2009 14:28:11 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Where the heck is it! Gary and Tigers, There are numerous LAT "dealer" options shown on the PDF: http://www.tigersunited.com/resources/parts_service/LAT-brochure.pdf as well as the "individual sheets" at: http://www.tigersunited.com/resources/parts_service/lat.asp Some are missing, and not shown in *RED* as hot. /"We do not have access to pictures of ALL of the factory LAT options, as can be seen. Any individual contributions, in JPEG or GIF form would be appreciated. If this is not convenient, we can scan a good photo and return it." /Some of these are those for racing, as promoted by Doane Spencer of Hollywood Sport Cars and Lew Spencer (no relation) of Larry Reed Sports Cars, and were special order from very specific dealers. If you have any (or anybody else), let us know and we will gladly post them. Check out: http://www.tigersunited.com/history/pioneers.asp http://www.tigersunited.com/history/tr-PalmerRacing1.asp _ Steve Laifman Editor - TigersUnited.com Pointers wrote: > Wonder why so many LATs are missing from the LAT official brochure? > > Gary. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 9 20:01:44 2009 From: kevin beck To: tigers@autox.team.net Date: Tue, 9 Jun 2009 22:01:23 -0400 Subject: [Tigers] wheels don't want to get back on the shelby thing, but years ago I bought some Shelby mini-lite rims for my tiger and mounted some 205 60 HR tires. My question is does any one now where I could get acouple center caps. Thanks _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 9 20:08:58 2009 From: " Ron Fraser" To: "'kevin beck'" , Date: Tue, 9 Jun 2009 22:08:45 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] wheels Kevin Have you contacted Carroll Shelby Wheel Company? They may still have center caps that fit those wheels. http://www.carrollshelbywheels.com/ Ron Fraser -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of kevin beck Sent: Tuesday, June 09, 2009 10:01 PM To: tigers@autox.team.net Subject: [Tigers] wheels don't want to get back on the shelby thing, but years ago I bought some Shelby mini-lite rims for my tiger and mounted some 205 60 HR tires. My question is does any one now where I could get acouple center caps. Thanks No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.59/2165 - Release Date: 06/09/09 18:08:00 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 9 22:24:17 2009 From: THEO SMIT To: tigers@autox.team.net Date: Tue, 09 Jun 2009 22:23:29 -0600 Subject: [Tigers] NW US/Canada convoys to SUNI? Hi all, Trying to make the trailer vs. driving decision... trailering would mean going out and getting a trailer, but we'd possibly arrive in a less frazzled state, and that is worth something. Currently our plan is to go to Great Falls on Saturday and then driving the remainder on Sunday. What is everyone else from the Pacific Northwest and Alberta doing? Cheers, Theo _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 10 09:23:46 2009 From: "Jerry and Marlene VanderPool" To: Date: Wed, 10 Jun 2009 08:23:22 -0700 Subject: [Tigers] Traveling to SUNI V Theo and All; Marlene and I are leaving Warrenton, OR. (Astoria) early morning on Thursday the 18th. We will trailer our Tiger as we find that 3 days of driving is easier on these old bones in our Tahoe than in the Tiger. Our first stop will be Spokane then on to Billings the next day. The last leg will be on Saturday going from Billings to Rapid City. We are going a little early as we need to set up for registration which will start on Sunday the 21st. I talked to Lynn Wall yesterday and he advised me that while talking to the folks at the Host Hotel he inquired about the weather. They told him was at the end of the HAIL season. I plan on parking the Tiger in covered parking or putting the Tiger back in the trailer. See you all at SUNI V. Safe travel everyone. Jerry and Marlene. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 10 11:03:29 2009 From: "Jerry and Marlene VanderPool" To: Date: Wed, 10 Jun 2009 10:03:12 -0700 Subject: [Tigers] TAC at SUNI V Hello Andy and all on the list. TAC inspections at SUNI V is a go. We will have a Great TAC Team to inspect your Tigers. We really appreciate the volunteer time that the inspectors are giving to SUNI V. See you all at SUNI V. Jerry and Marlene. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 10 13:24:53 2009 From: Jeffrey Nichols To: tigers@autox.team.net Date: Wed, 10 Jun 2009 12:24:27 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Tigers] LAT photos You can find photos of the "racing only" LAT options in the SCCA and FIA homo... (no offense intended) papers. There is a copy in the "Works Tigers" book in one of the appendix sections. Some of them look like Doane Spencer originals (the axel locating device comes to mind) and I doubt if more that one was ever made of some of the parts. Probably they were used only on the HSC Tiger and Doane took photos and assigned LAT numbers to make it official. Jeff _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 10 13:54:11 2009 From: " Ron Fraser" To: "'Jeffrey Nichols'" , Date: Wed, 10 Jun 2009 15:53:54 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] LAT photos Jeff and all I believe Ian Garrad gave all this information to Tom Hall or STOA. I have a copy of "Sunbeam Tiger Stock Options For Solo II use under SCCA Rules", a rather poor copy by today's standards for copy machines, and it indicates Ian gave this information to Tom Hall of San Francisco around 1973. Hopefully that information is still available and can be scanned with better clarity for everyone's enjoyment. It looks like there is some FIA information in there too. Anyone know if that package of information is still available? Ron Fraser -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Jeffrey Nichols Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2009 3:24 PM To: tigers@autox.team.net Subject: [Tigers] LAT photos You can find photos of the "racing only" LAT options in the SCCA and FIA homo... (no offense intended) papers. There is a copy in the "Works Tigers" book in one of the appendix sections. Some of them look like Doane Spencer originals (the axel locating device comes to mind) and I doubt if more that one was ever made of some of the parts. Probably they were used only on the HSC Tiger and Doane took photos and assigned LAT numbers to make it official. Jeff No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.60/2166 - Release Date: 06/10/09 05:52:00 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 10 16:33:21 2009 From: MWood24020@aol.com To: tigers@autox.team.net Date: Wed, 10 Jun 2009 18:34:03 EDT Subject: Re: [Tigers] Camber question In a message dated 5/26/2009 6:44:00 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, ross_hulse@sbcglobal.net writes: Lynn, First let me apologize as my post in HTML did not translate to Plain Text. The spec you quote you are trying to meet is the spec for Castor not Camber. The spec for castor is 30 minutes positive plus or minus 15 minutes. So castor can be from 45 minutes to as little as little as 15 minutes. There are 60 minutes in a degree. So to correlate castor can be from 3 quarters to a degree to as little as 1 quarter of a degree. This is way different than nearly 4 degrees positive. Ross "Commodore Blues" Hulse Subject: [Tigers] Camber question Hey all, First let me say thanks to all the vets out there. Your sacrifice is appreciated Second I am trying to align my tiger and the camber has me puzzled. The owners manual says 3 degrees 50 minutes positive camber. It describes positive camber as the top of the tire moving AWAY from the engine I cant believe that applies to todays tires and wheels. I am running 16 Panasports and when I went even slightly positive the handling became EXTREMELY twitchy. I looked up what my 67 mustang should be and it suggested = to 1 negative camber. I tried that an it seems to handle much better. Any ideas/suggestions. Im getting pretty good at changing out shims. Thank you in advance. Lynn Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive **************Download the AOL Classifieds Toolbar for local deals at your fingertips. (http://toolbar.aol.com/aolclassifieds/download.html?ncid=emlcntusdown00000004) _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 10 17:32:22 2009 From: michael king To: MWood24020@aol.com Date: Thu, 11 Jun 2009 09:32:13 +1000 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Camber question > I can t believe that applies to todays tires and wheels. I am running 16 > Panasports and when I went even slightly positive the handling became > EXTREMELY twitchy. I looked up what my 67 mustang should be and it > suggested = to 1 negative camber. I tried that an it seems to handle > much > better. > > Any ideas/suggestions. I m getting pretty good at changing out shims. > > Thank you in advance. > > Lynn > > Another thing to check is the toe in/out. If you are running to much toe in the car will have a bit of understeer then will transition to oversteer quite violently mid corner. This would lead to a twitchy feeling in corners.. the tyres will scallop if you are runnign to much toe in. -- Regards Michael King _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 11 08:24:27 2009 From: WHIZZZBANG13@aol.com To: tigers@autox.team.net Date: Thu, 11 Jun 2009 10:27:10 EDT Subject: Re: [Tigers] Tigers re-subscribe Somewhere along the line the electronics of my computer and email dropped me from the Tigers list. I have tried to re-subscribe to na avail. I must have an incorrect address or am doing it wrong. Would someone please tell me how to get back on the list? Contact me off line at: _WHIZZZBANG13@AOL.COM_ (mailto:WHIZZZBANG13@AOL.COM) Thanks. Fred Baum Tiger owner missing the action _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 11 12:36:37 2009 From: "Bill Rogers Motorsport Memories" To: "Tigers" Date: Thu, 11 Jun 2009 11:35:18 -0700 Subject: [Tigers] FAI Homologation Documents I have copies of all three ('64, '65 and '66) and have offered to make copies for Steve Laifmans Tigers United site. The pictures of options are pretty rough (deliberately) so that scrutineers could not be too picky. I will bring them to SUNI; if people are interested look me up. Bill Rogers (Mediterranean Blue Mk1) _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 11 12:44:02 2009 From: Tony Somebody To: Tigers , Bill Rogers Motorsport Memories Date: Thu, 11 Jun 2009 11:43:12 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Tigers] FAI Homologation Documents It would be nice if they could be viewed in the hospitality suite. Im sure everyone wants to take a look see. TtT --- On Thu, 6/11/09, Bill Rogers Motorsport Memories wrote: > From: Bill Rogers Motorsport Memories > Subject: [Tigers] FAI Homologation Documents > To: "Tigers" > Date: Thursday, June 11, 2009, 1:35 PM > I have copies of all three ('64, '65 > and '66) and have offered to make copies > for Steve Laifmans Tigers United site. The pictures of > options are pretty > rough (deliberately) so that scrutineers could not be too > picky. > > I will bring them to SUNI; if people are interested look me > up. > > Bill Rogers (Mediterranean Blue Mk1) > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 11 13:05:13 2009 From: "Schonberger, Barry K" To: "'tigers@autox.team.net'" Date: Thu, 11 Jun 2009 14:03:06 -0500 Subject: [Tigers] SCCA June Sprints Coverage If you are headed to SUNI or sitting at home June 19-21st, you can follow the performance of Tom Patton's TIGER at the 2009 June Sprints in the following ways: Thanks to Eric Prill and Con Peplowski - we will have live timing and scoring for the June Sprints, beginning with practice on Friday morning. The web address is http://www.livetiming.net/SCCA/club/livetiming.asp. - The June Sprints will be televised - GoRacingTV.com will be taping all of the races for later broadcast via their website. - There will be a live radio broadcast on WLS AM 890 out of Chicago from 8-9AM on Saturday morning (like last year). This event is a tune up for the SCCA Runoffs that will be held at the same track, Road America, this September. Barry Schonberger _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 11 18:45:02 2009 From: "Kirk Smith" To: Date: Thu, 11 Jun 2009 17:41:05 -0700 Subject: [Tigers] centerforce clutch Well, the McCleod clutch unit that has been giving me faithful service for the last 20 years is needing a replacement. While I was fairly happy with it, I am considering a Centerforce unit this time around. Anything I should watch out for? Dual friction or ? Tiger specific or same as a Ford unit? Thanks! Kirk B382000503 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 11 19:35:12 2009 From: "Jim" To: "'Kirk Smith'" , Date: Thu, 11 Jun 2009 18:35:01 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] centerforce clutch I changed from a Mcleod to a Centerforce dual friction a couple years ago... I absotivly posilutely love it !! My 2 cents Jim B382000446 -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Kirk Smith Sent: June 11, 2009 5:41 PM To: tigers@autox.team.net Subject: [Tigers] centerforce clutch Well, the McCleod clutch unit that has been giving me faithful service for the last 20 years is needing a replacement. While I was fairly happy with it, I am considering a Centerforce unit this time around. Anything I should watch out for? Dual friction or ? Tiger specific or same as a Ford unit? Thanks! Kirk B382000503 Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 11 19:40:12 2009 From: Tony Somebody To: 'Kirk Smith' , tigers@autox.team.net, Jim Date: Thu, 11 Jun 2009 18:40:02 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Tigers] centerforce clutch I installed a centerforce as well. Im sold- when my other Tiger is running, it too will have a centerforce clutch. I bought mine at an O'Rileys parts store and it was cheaper than Summitt and I had it the next day. Just dont tell them its for a Sunbeam Tiger. Any mid 60s Ford with a 4 speed but unless you want mass confusion, dont tell the truth.TtT --- On Thu, 6/11/09, Jim wrote: > From: Jim > Subject: Re: [Tigers] centerforce clutch > To: "'Kirk Smith'" , tigers@autox.team.net > Date: Thursday, June 11, 2009, 8:35 PM > I changed from a Mcleod to a > Centerforce dual friction a couple years ago... > I absotivly posilutely love it !! > > My 2 cents > > Jim > B382000446 > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net > [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] > On Behalf Of Kirk Smith > Sent: June 11, 2009 5:41 PM > To: tigers@autox.team.net > Subject: [Tigers] centerforce clutch > > Well, the McCleod clutch unit that has been giving me > faithful service for > the > last 20 years is needing a replacement. While I was > fairly happy with it, I > am considering a Centerforce unit this time around. > Anything I should watch > out for? Dual friction or ? Tiger specific or > same as a Ford unit? > Thanks! > > Kirk > B382000503 > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 11 23:10:52 2009 From: Peter MacDonald To: tigers@autox.team.net Date: Thu, 11 Jun 2009 22:10:30 -0700 Subject: [Tigers] Cosmic Wheels The wheels on the Harrington Tiger are Cosmic Mk 2 wheels. The spare is one that I sent to Bill and he had it refurbished. They are painted black background with polished spokes, kind of a "tulip" shape to the spoke pattern. I have Mk 1 Cosmics on my car, what I refer to as the 2nd generation Mk 1; there were 3 versions that I know of. After our accident took out my LF wheel, Damian at the Cosmic Wheels website managed to scare up a spare or two for me. They are getting hard to find. They also made some interesting accessories. Centre caps are a bit of a problem as there is no retaining groove on the earlier wheels. Peter _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 12 00:33:55 2009 From: "Kirk Smith" To: Date: Thu, 11 Jun 2009 23:33:30 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] centerforce clutch So far I've heard nothing but good things about the Centerforce unit. Thanks for the responses! Kirk. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 12 07:39:27 2009 From: Owain Lloyd To: Kirk Smith Date: Fri, 12 Jun 2009 08:39:10 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tigers] centerforce clutch i'll add my endorsement. after tearing my ford king cobra to bits last summer, i installed a small 10" centerforce II. one year on, i'm extremely happy with it. very tough with a nice feel to it. On Fri, Jun 12, 2009 at 1:33 AM, Kirk Smith wrote: > So far I've heard nothing but good things about the Centerforce unit. > Thanks > for the responses! Kirk. > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 12 12:41:09 2009 From: "John Dillman" To: Date: Fri, 12 Jun 2009 13:40:47 -0500 Subject: [Tigers] Centerforce Built a Kirkham aluminum Cobra a few years ago (and I won't touch the Shelby angle there . . .) with a 427 side oiler. That car has limited space for an effective clutch arm, so it took a while to give up and go with hydraulic t/o bearing, but the clutch is great, and seems to take everything that we can throw at it. John Dillman _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 12 13:18:23 2009 From: Tony Somebody To: tigers@autox.team.net, John Dillman Date: Fri, 12 Jun 2009 12:18:13 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Tigers] Centerforce John- when I installd a Cf in my Tiger I wanted to add a hyd. To bearing but the counter person told me he had several retuns. I dont rcll the specfic problems but I decided to go with a regular TO bearing. What brand did you use on the sideoiler? (notice I didnt use that other word) also, have you had any problems with it? Im sure everyone will be interested in the brand if its been a successful unit or even a bad one. thanks, TtT _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 12 13:24:28 2009 From: "John Dillman" To: "Tony Somebody" , Date: Fri, 12 Jun 2009 14:24:11 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Centerforce Tt T Having had a factory hyd t/o bearing go bad in an Explorer once, I DID NOT want to go that route. When they leak, you get a soaked clutch, etc. . . So I see your counterman's point. That said, it has worked flawlessly for maybe three or four years and we've been VERY happy we switched. It is a McCleod unit that we actually got from the Kirkhams, as they had them on the shelf for the cars they assemble (and I can't say enough nice things about them). You have to adjust it for height at the time you install, and then bleed it, but it hasn't given us a moment's trouble. Like all this stuff, I expect you just order the Mustang one . . . John Dillman -----Original Message----- From: Tony Somebody [mailto:achd73@yahoo.com] Sent: Friday, June 12, 2009 2:18 PM To: tigers@autox.team.net; John Dillman Subject: Re: [Tigers] Centerforce John- when I installd a Cf in my Tiger I wanted to add a hyd. To bearing but the counter person told me he had several retuns. I dont rcll the specfic problems but I decided to go with a regular TO bearing. What brand did you use on the sideoiler? (notice I didnt use that other word) also, have you had any problems with it? Im sure everyone will be interested in the brand if its been a successful unit or even a bad one. thanks, TtT _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 12 13:47:23 2009 From: Sandy Ganz To: tigers@autox.team.net Date: Fri, 12 Jun 2009 12:47:06 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Tigers] Centerforce Check the couple of Cobra, TM, Ford Motors :) kit sites/forums (I can't remember Kirkaham, Superformance, FF) but early Mcleod's Hydraulic TRB's had a bad problem and seems to also have complaints on fluid line connections as I recall. This was a couple of years back. I was looking at them and came across many threads about them failing, but after some point (McLeod) seemed to correct the problem. I also looked at the Tilton line and they had a products that looked good. Tilton has several types of H-TRB's the one I picked was for the stock style bell housing where you replace the front shaft support and screws the H-TRB onto that. I think it is somewhere in the Archives of the Tiger list maybe about 1 year of so ago. But all of them seem to have a higher fail rate then the external push/pull and you have to yank the trans when it fails. The last note is that setup is critial with these type of H-TRB's. They must be set up with proper master cylinder size and potentially a stop on the pedal to prevent overstroke of the cylinder which can result in 2 problems, one if you're using a double/triple plate clutch a quick way to ruin it due to over engaging/stroking the PP, and the other is pushing the piston too far out of the bore of the H-TRB. Lot's of READ THIS FIRST and WARNINGS on the installation instruction! The nice thing is that the H-TRB does is get rid of a bunch of stuff in an already tight area of the car. 2 Hoses out the bell and your done. I think I had part numbers for the tilton one up on the gtsparkplugs.com site but I can't remember now... HTH Sandy ----- Original Message ---- From: Tony Somebody To: tigers@autox.team.net; John Dillman Sent: Friday, June 12, 2009 12:18:13 PM Subject: Re: [Tigers] Centerforce John- when I installd a Cf in my Tiger I wanted to add a hyd. To bearing but the counter person told me he had several retuns. I dont rcll the specfic problems but I decided to go with a regular TO bearing. What brand did you use on the sideoiler? (notice I didnt use that other word) also, have you had any problems with it? Im sure everyone will be interested in the brand if its been a successful unit or even a bad one. thanks, TtT _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 12 13:53:25 2009 From: Sandy Ganz To: Sandy Ganz , tigers@autox.team.net Date: Fri, 12 Jun 2009 12:53:16 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Tigers] Centerforce Here was the page with the Tilton stuff I'm using... http://gtsparkplugs.com/TigerTransmission.html _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 12 14:19:04 2009 From: "Smit, Theo" To: "Sandy Ganz" , Date: Fri, 12 Jun 2009 14:18:51 -0600 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Centerforce About a month ago I finally started driving my Tiger with a McLeod hydraulic release bearing, and had it fail after a couple of days. Took the engine out, rebuilt the release bearing, made an anti rotation plate for the release bearing assembly, and bolted it all back together. It's been (cross fingers and everything else) good for the last week or so and about 100 miles of test runs... Still don't know whether to drive or tow to SUNI. This release bearing was the newer style of the McLeod unit, it has swivel fittings top and bottom rather than O-ringed banjo fittings. The failure I got was that the inlet elbow started leaking hydraulic fluid. It may have been a coincidence, but this is the side that's under tension if the throwout bearing assembly were to rotate due to bearing drag from the clutch. So when I put it back together I made a plate that bolts to the release bearing and captures the ball pivot for the OEM clutch arm, to prevent any rotation and thereby keep the side load off the swivel fittings. I have a Ford Racing clutch (diaphragm spring) and the Girling 5/8" cylinder... Pedal force is "firm" but the clutch engagement point is good. Theo [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of IMG_0344_x.jpg] _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 12 14:25:29 2009 From: "Smit, Theo" To: Date: Fri, 12 Jun 2009 14:25:19 -0600 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Centerforce I neglected to mention that before I started driving the McLeod throwout bearing, it had been sitting, assembled but unused, inside the transmission for about four years. This is a no-no according to McLeod - they want you to use it every day to prevent things drying out. I'm currently running a DOT4 fluid in it... McLeod recommends DOT3 but I wanted to have the same thing in all 3 hydraulic systems. Theo _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 12 17:10:32 2009 From: Steve Laifman To: Thomas Witt Date: Fri, 12 Jun 2009 16:10:17 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Shelby tiger info If you would like to see Carrol, as well as other advertising pics, as well as Art Arfons, and Lew Spencer, then try TigersUnited: http://www.tigersunited.com/galleries/mktg_items.asp and Ken Miles: http://www.tigersunited.com/history/p-kmiles.asp The last page shows his Tiger History. Steve ___ Steve Laifman Editor - TigersUnited.com Thomas Witt wrote: > That is very similar to the ad I mentioned the other day. The one I > recall has Shelby sitting in the car. Either way I'm not taking sides. > One thing has become apparent looking at this ad. When George Boskoff > stated Shelby told him, "...to just bend the d*mn steering arms," I > always had an image of an 80 year old looking Carroll barking out the > order. The reality is he likely looked like he does in the ad. > >>>> http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2904787900054462410ujhDfU<<< _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 13 10:32:24 2009 From: Tony Somebody To: Beamclub , Alpine List Date: Sat, 13 Jun 2009 09:32:02 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Tigers] Tiger on alpine auction at epay 220433193563 auction number There is a Tiger being auctioned on the Alpine section of ebay. its listed as a 1950 to a 63 I think- no title and in NY. Ive bid on it but I will be outbid- I called and was told someone was offering 4k but she (lsited under a females name) is required by ebay and prolly law to see auction to an end- I know, they kept my listing cost becuse I said I maintained the right to end an auction early because I have my wheels advertized locally- so they pulled the auction and informed me once its up, im required to sell to highest bidder if it meets reserve. I dont have the funds to buy the car but take a look-its in primer with only a couple of parts- I was told by some guy who spoke very broken english that was all the parts there where- also a LAT hood with it tho or at least a fiberglass lat looking hood. 220433193563 and if it works--- http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=220433193563&_trksid=p2759.l1259 My next call got a full answering machine and my last i was told she sold it for 4K. Please make sure I ma right- it is a Tiger or maybe an Alger???? _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 13 11:32:10 2009 From: " Ron Fraser" To: "'Tony Somebody'" , "'Beamclub'" Date: Sat, 13 Jun 2009 13:28:10 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Tiger on alpine auction at epay 220433193563 auction Tony The sheet metal around the shifter does look like Tiger and there is no battery box. You would need the Vin # to determine exactly it's pedigree. Better and more pictures would help and a personal look see to confirm. Ron Fraser -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Tony Somebody Sent: Saturday, June 13, 2009 12:32 PM To: Beamclub; Alpine List Subject: [Tigers] Tiger on alpine auction at epay 220433193563 auction number There is a Tiger being auctioned on the Alpine section of ebay. its listed as a 1950 to a 63 I think- no title and in NY. Ive bid on it but I will be outbid- I called and was told someone was offering 4k but she (lsited under a females name) is required by ebay and prolly law to see auction to an end- I know, they kept my listing cost becuse I said I maintained the right to end an auction early because I have my wheels advertized locally- so they pulled the auction and informed me once its up, im required to sell to highest bidder if it meets reserve. I dont have the funds to buy the car but take a look-its in primer with only a couple of parts- I was told by some guy who spoke very broken english that was all the parts there where- also a LAT hood with it tho or at least a fiberglass lat looking hood. 220433193563 and if it works--- http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=220433193563&_ trksid=p2759.l1259 My next call got a full answering machine and my last i was told she sold it for 4K. Please make sure I ma right- it is a Tiger or maybe an Alger???? No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.364 / Virus Database: 270.12.65/2171 - Release Date: 06/13/09 05:53:00 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 13 13:26:44 2009 From: "Samouce's" To: , "'Tony Somebody'" , Date: Sat, 13 Jun 2009 14:26:16 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Tiger on alpine auction at epay 220433193563 auction Looks like a 65 car. Duke -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Ron Fraser Sent: Saturday, June 13, 2009 12:28 To: 'Tony Somebody'; 'Beamclub'; 'Alpine List' Subject: Re: [Tigers] Tiger on alpine auction at epay 220433193563 auction number Tony The sheet metal around the shifter does look like Tiger and there is no battery box. You would need the Vin # to determine exactly it's pedigree. Better and more pictures would help and a personal look see to confirm. Ron Fraser -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Tony Somebody Sent: Saturday, June 13, 2009 12:32 PM To: Beamclub; Alpine List Subject: [Tigers] Tiger on alpine auction at epay 220433193563 auction number There is a Tiger being auctioned on the Alpine section of ebay. its listed as a 1950 to a 63 I think- no title and in NY. Ive bid on it but I will be outbid- I called and was told someone was offering 4k but she (lsited under a females name) is required by ebay and prolly law to see auction to an end- I know, they kept my listing cost becuse I said I maintained the right to end an auction early because I have my wheels advertized locally- so they pulled the auction and informed me once its up, im required to sell to highest bidder if it meets reserve. I dont have the funds to buy the car but take a look-its in primer with only a couple of parts- I was told by some guy who spoke very broken english that was all the parts there where- also a LAT hood with it tho or at least a fiberglass lat looking hood. 220433193563 and if it works--- http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=220433193563&_ trksid=p2759.l1259 My next call got a full answering machine and my last i was told she sold it for 4K. Please make sure I ma right- it is a Tiger or maybe an Alger???? No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.364 / Virus Database: 270.12.65/2171 - Release Date: 06/13/09 05:53:00 Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 13 14:32:53 2009 From: "rande" To: tigers@autox.team.net Date: Sat, 13 Jun 2009 16:31:44 -0400 Subject: [Tigers] brake fluid Theo was discussing brake fluid earlier. American Honda Motors ships only Honda-labeled DOT 3 to their car dealers, including S2000 and NSX usage. They told dealers that only motorcycle stores should be using DOT 4 in their shops. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 13 17:23:19 2009 From: "TMLH" To: "TIGERS" Date: Sat, 13 Jun 2009 18:22:04 -0500 Subject: [Tigers] FW: More Video > -----Original Message----- > From: tigers-bounces+wiseowl=thevision.net@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers- > bounces+wiseowl=thevision.net@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Sandy Ganz > Sent: Monday, June 30, 2008 11:40 PM > To: Teepen, Jere > Cc: tigers@autox.team.net > Subject: [Tigers] More Video > > Jere - > The link to your wife's video is - > http://www.motorator.com/videos/225 > (May be a bit of time before it is active) > And the one with you driving is - > http://www.motorator.com/videos/216 > I have a ton of pics too, just have not > had a chance to post them up. > Sandy :) > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > You are subscribed as wiseowl@thevision.net > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 13 18:46:49 2009 From: THEO SMIT To: rande@thecia.net Date: Sat, 13 Jun 2009 18:42:40 -0600 Subject: Re: [Tigers] brake fluid My bottle of Castrol LMA is labeled DOT 4... I figured I'd at least continue to use a similar family of fluid. I found some Prestone stuff labeled DOT 4, specified boiling point 478F, and supposedly compatible wherever DOT3 or DOT4 is recommended by the vehicle manufacturer. There are at least two different grades of DOT 3 available here: One has a lower boiling point (375F IIRC), and the other is specified for Ford disc brake applications and is rated for 550F boiling point. We used to use that for our racing applications and never really had a brake fluid related problem that wasn't obviously attributable to some other cause. It would be nice if the various compatibility issues related to brake fluid were a little more clear-cut. The worst is that there is a British standard DOT5.1 that is related to DOT4 fluids, and is completely incompatible with silicone type DOT5 fluid. I have British made Hope disc brakes on one of my mountain bikes and of course they recommend the British brake fluids... Theo ----- Original Message ----- From: rande Date: Saturday, June 13, 2009 2:32 pm Subject: [Tigers] brake fluid To: tigers@autox.team.net > Theo was discussing brake fluid earlier. > > American Honda Motors ships only Honda-labeled DOT 3 to > their car dealers, > including S2000 and NSX usage. They told dealers that only > motorcycle stores > should be using DOT 4 in their shops. > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 13 19:41:50 2009 From: "Jerry and Marlene VanderPool" To: Date: Sat, 13 Jun 2009 18:41:29 -0700 Subject: [Tigers] Brake Fluid Hi gang; We use Motorcraft High Performance brake fluid after having Dale A. install the brakes. Bye the bye, Dale will be at SUNI V. Jerry and Marlene with the Candy Apple Tiger. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 13 23:07:38 2009 From: Sandy Ganz To: tigers@autox.team.net Date: Sat, 13 Jun 2009 22:07:27 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Tigers] brake fluid My understanding was Dot 3 and Dot 4 (and it seems Dot 5.1 as in five point one) are compatible. But some differences on what I found below was interesting. I have run Motul RBF600 in a few cars and had good results with it, also ran it in an external clutch slave in the Mustang, and running it in the Tilton Hydro-TRB in the Cobra. The Cobra has not been in use yet so hard to say if it would have any effect, but I would expect it not to have any natural rubber seals, which might be more common on older british stuff. DOT3: Brake Fluid Grade - Min dry boiling pt =205degC or 401degF. Min wet boiling pt = 140degC or 284degF. aliphatic polyether-based, can be mixed with DOT4, characteristics will be (linearly) in between DOT3/DOt4 parameters. Cheap, most widely used, eats paint, absorbs water easily, eats natural rubber seals. DOT4: Brake Fluid Grade - Min dry boiling pt=230degC or 446degreesF. Min wet boiling pt = 155degC or 311degreesF. borate ester based, can be mixed with DOT3, characteristics will be (linearly) in between DOT3/DOT4 parameters, 50% more expensive than DOT3, eats paint, significantly increased resistance to moisture absorption compared to DOT3 (but still absorbs water), does not eat natural rubber seals. DOT5.1: Brake Fluid Grade - Min dry boiling pt=260degC or 500degF. Min wet boiling pt = 180degC or 356degF. It's a stupid name as it's glycol-based (borate ester) like DOT3/4 and has NO silicone. Absorbs water, eats paint, more expensive than DOT4, difficult to locate. DOT5: Brake Fluid Grade - Min dry boiling pt=260degC or 500degF. Min wet boiling pt = 180degC or 356degF. Cannot mix with other fluids as it contains silicone, turns to jelly if done so; colored purple. Used mostly for antique cars and some motorcycles because it does not damage paint and does not absorb water (it allows water to pool in the low parts of the braking system). Is more compressible than DOT3/4 though. Twice as expensive as DOT4 (and thus 3 times as expensive as DOT3) and has limited availability. Sandy _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jun 14 15:03:17 2009 From: "James E. Pickard" To: "Sandy Ganz" , Date: Sun, 14 Jun 2009 16:02:39 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tigers] brake fluid I thought you were supposed to use DOT 3 in Tigers because of the natural rubber. According to this, you should use DOT 4. Am I reading this wrong? Jim Pickard B9473298 ('65 Tiger) AN5L/12109 ('59 Sprite) - sold 2003 Mini Cooper Lafayette, LA ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sandy Ganz" To: Sent: Sunday, June 14, 2009 12:07 AM Subject: Re: [Tigers] brake fluid > My understanding was Dot 3 and Dot 4 (and it seems Dot 5.1 as in five > point > one) are compatible. But some differences on what I found below was > interesting. I have run Motul RBF600 in a few cars and had good results > with > it, also ran it in an external clutch slave in the Mustang, and running it > in > the Tilton Hydro-TRB in the Cobra. The Cobra has not been in use yet so > hard > to say if it would have any effect, but I would expect it not to have any > natural rubber seals, which might be more common on older british stuff. > > > DOT3: Brake > Fluid Grade - Min dry boiling pt =205degC or 401degF. Min wet > boiling pt = > 140degC or 284degF. aliphatic polyether-based, can be mixed > with DOT4, > characteristics will be (linearly) in between DOT3/DOt4 > parameters. Cheap, > most widely used, eats paint, absorbs water easily, eats > natural rubber seals. > DOT4: Brake Fluid Grade - Min dry boiling pt=230degC or 446degreesF. Min > wet > boiling pt = 155degC or 311degreesF. borate ester based, can be mixed > with > DOT3, characteristics will be (linearly) in between DOT3/DOT4 > parameters, 50% > more expensive than DOT3, eats paint, significantly > increased resistance to > moisture absorption compared to DOT3 (but still > absorbs water), does not eat > natural rubber seals. > > DOT5.1: Brake Fluid Grade - Min dry boiling pt=260degC > or 500degF. Min wet > boiling pt = 180degC or 356degF. It's a stupid name as > it's glycol-based > (borate ester) like DOT3/4 and has NO silicone. Absorbs > water, eats paint, > more expensive than DOT4, difficult to locate. > > DOT5: Brake > Fluid Grade - Min dry boiling pt=260degC or 500degF. Min wet > boiling pt = > 180degC or 356degF. Cannot mix with other fluids as it > contains silicone, > turns to jelly if done so; colored purple. Used mostly > for antique cars and > some motorcycles because it does not damage paint and > does not absorb water > (it allows water to pool in the low parts of the > braking system). Is more > compressible than DOT3/4 though. Twice as > expensive as DOT4 (and thus 3 times > as expensive as DOT3) and has limited > availability. > > Sandy _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 15 07:48:33 2009 From: "Rense, Mark (GE Indust, ConsInd)" To: Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 09:47:10 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] brake fluid - Types The main difference between DOT 3 and DOT 4 (both glycol-based) is the boiling point. The DOT 4 has a higher boiling point for both wet and dry measurements. This is important to us because our clutch and master cylinder reservoirs are not sealed and therefore allow the passage of moisture, and since glycol-based fluid is hydroscopic, the DOT 4 rating will allow more moisture content while still providing adequate service. You CANNOT mix DOT 3 or 4 with DOT 5, as DOT 5 is silicon based. However, you can mix with the new DOT 5.1 fluid. The recommended fluid for most British cars old and new is Castrol GT/LMA, which is rated as a DOT 3/4. If you rebuild your hydraulics with all new synthetic rubber parts, you can use the silicon-based DOT 5, the advantage here is that when (notice I didn't say "if") it leaks, it does not affect the paint. The disadvantage of DOT 5 is that it does not absorb water at all, so the water pools in the cylinders and causes corrosion. In any case, flushing your brake fluid every other year is a Best Practice. Brake Fluid Rating Dry boiling point Wet boiling point DOT 3 2050C (4010F) 1400C (2840F) DOT 4 2300C (4460F) 1550C (3110F) DOT 5 2600C (5000F) 1800C (3560F) DOT 5.1 2700C (5180F) 1910C ( 3760F) Bugz _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 15 08:03:08 2009 From: drmayf To: "Rense, Mark (GE Indust, ConsInd)" Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 07:01:22 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] brake fluid - Types Bugz... did you miss some decimal points in the boiling points table below? Hard for me to believe those temperatures. I mean DOT 5.1 boils at 5180 degrees F? And so on... I think that may be higher than melting tungsten or other exotic metal alloys... mayf, just funning ya Rense, Mark (GE Indust, ConsInd) wrote: >The main difference between DOT 3 and DOT 4 (both glycol-based) is the boiling >point. The DOT 4 has a higher boiling point for both wet and dry measurements. >This is important to us because our clutch and master cylinder reservoirs are >not sealed and therefore allow the passage of moisture, and since glycol-based >fluid is hydroscopic, the DOT 4 rating will allow more moisture content while >still providing adequate service. > >You CANNOT mix DOT 3 or 4 with DOT 5, as DOT 5 is silicon based. However, you >can mix with the new DOT 5.1 fluid. The recommended fluid for most British >cars old and new is Castrol GT/LMA, which is rated as a DOT 3/4. If you >rebuild your hydraulics with all new synthetic rubber parts, you can use the >silicon-based DOT 5, the advantage here is that when (notice I didn't say >"if") it leaks, it does not affect the paint. The disadvantage of DOT 5 is >that it does not absorb water at all, so the water pools in the cylinders and >causes corrosion. > >In any case, flushing your brake fluid every other year is a Best Practice. > >Brake Fluid Rating Dry boiling point Wet boiling point >DOT 3 2050C (4010F) 1400C (2840F) >DOT 4 2300C (4460F) 1550C (3110F) >DOT 5 2600C (5000F) 1800C (3560F) >DOT 5.1 2700C (5180F) 1910C ( 3760F) > >Bugz _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 15 08:48:30 2009 From: "Paul R. Breuhan" To: Tigers Den Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 10:48:21 -0400 Subject: [Tigers] Electric Cooling Fans... Hello Listers, In search of better cooling. I want to add back on an electric cooling fan, I am not impressed with what I had before. I am currently without one, I could add the one I have back on but really want to make a change here. There seems to be a dizzying number of fans out there with 4...5...10 blades...straight blades...curved blades...10"...11"...12"...along with prices from $20 to $120... So I am looking recommendations...money isn't the issue, I just want to avoid making multple purchases to find a better fan. Thanks in advance, Paul _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail. has ever-growing storage! Dont worry about storage limits. http://windowslive.com/Tutorial/Hotmail/Storage?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Tutorial _Storage_062009 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 15 08:53:59 2009 From: "Paul R. Breuhan" To: Tigers Den Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 10:53:49 -0400 Subject: [Tigers] Looking for a fuel tank sending unit... Listers, The previous owner of my Tiger had aftermarket gauges and I have gone back to the factory gauges and now my fuel gauge is off, it never dips below 1/2 a tank. Now with the price of gas being so high, a miracle tank that never empties would be great...but walking home 2 miles the first drive out this Spring is not so great. Fills up to full fine...so I am guessing I need a new sender. Anyone got one that they can spare? I have contacted a couple people so far and have come up empty so to speak. Let me know how much you want for it...for shipping purposes I am just outside of Detroit Michigan, USA Again...thanks in advance, Paul _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail. has ever-growing storage! Dont worry about storage limits. http://windowslive.com/Tutorial/Hotmail/Storage?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Tutorial _Storage_062009 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 15 09:25:30 2009 From: Sandy Ganz To: "James E. Pickard" , tigers@autox.team.net Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 08:25:20 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Tigers] brake fluid I don't know, but that is what I saw. I would not know how much natural rubber is on our cars or how to tell but someone with more old brit car experience would have to chime in. I would not imagine it to be a problem for any later model or aftermarket stuff. The wilwood calipers came with a warning that said use you may be killed if you don't set up your brakes correctly, ignoring that it said use DOT3 or DOT4 fluids. Another thing to look for is the WET boiling point, while some of the Hi-Temp ones are good with no moisture in the mix, they are not too good with it, and that is the normal operating conditing from what it seems like. Lots of interesting reading on the web. But it's pretty clear that Silicone is not something that should be used unless you have specific reasons to do it. Sandy ----- Original Message ---- From: James E. Pickard To: Sandy Ganz ; tigers@autox.team.net Sent: Sunday, June 14, 2009 2:02:39 PM Subject: Re: [Tigers] brake fluid I thought you were supposed to use DOT 3 in Tigers because of the natural rubber. According to this, you should use DOT 4. Am I reading this wrong? Jim Pickard B9473298 ('65 Tiger) AN5L/12109 ('59 Sprite) - sold 2003 Mini Cooper Lafayette, LA ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sandy Ganz" To: Sent: Sunday, June 14, 2009 12:07 AM Subject: Re: [Tigers] brake fluid > My understanding was Dot 3 and Dot 4 (and it seems Dot 5.1 as in five point > one) are compatible. But some differences on what I found below was > interesting. I have run Motul RBF600 in a few cars and had good results with > it, also ran it in an external clutch slave in the Mustang, and running it in > the Tilton Hydro-TRB in the Cobra. The Cobra has not been in use yet so hard > to say if it would have any effect, but I would expect it not to have any > natural rubber seals, which might be more common on older british stuff. > > > DOT3: Brake > Fluid Grade - Min dry boiling pt =205degC or 401degF. Min wet > boiling pt = > 140degC or 284degF. aliphatic polyether-based, can be mixed > with DOT4, > characteristics will be (linearly) in between DOT3/DOt4 > parameters. Cheap, > most widely used, eats paint, absorbs water easily, eats > natural rubber seals. > DOT4: Brake Fluid Grade - Min dry boiling pt=230degC or 446degreesF. Min > wet > boiling pt = 155degC or 311degreesF. borate ester based, can be mixed > with > DOT3, characteristics will be (linearly) in between DOT3/DOT4 > parameters, 50% > more expensive than DOT3, eats paint, significantly > increased resistance to > moisture absorption compared to DOT3 (but still > absorbs water), does not eat > natural rubber seals. > > DOT5.1: Brake Fluid Grade - Min dry boiling pt=260degC > or 500degF. Min wet > boiling pt = 180degC or 356degF. It's a stupid name as > it's glycol-based > (borate ester) like DOT3/4 and has NO silicone. Absorbs > water, eats paint, > more expensive than DOT4, difficult to locate. > > DOT5: Brake > Fluid Grade - Min dry boiling pt=260degC or 500degF. Min wet > boiling pt = > 180degC or 356degF. Cannot mix with other fluids as it > contains silicone, > turns to jelly if done so; colored purple. Used mostly > for antique cars and > some motorcycles because it does not damage paint and > does not absorb water > (it allows water to pool in the low parts of the > braking system). Is more > compressible than DOT3/4 though. Twice as > expensive as DOT4 (and thus 3 times > as expensive as DOT3) and has limited > availability. > > Sandy _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 15 09:33:59 2009 From: "Rense, Mark (GE Indust, ConsInd)" To: Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 11:33:31 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] brake fluid - Types Interesting. Folks, the wonderful world of cut and paste into a plain text editor seemed to have replaced the "degree" symbol with a zero. Not kewl. Here is what they should be. Also, I misspelled one term, glycol-based brake fluid is hyGroscopic. Too early on a Monday. Brake Fluid Rating Dry boiling point Wet boiling point DOT 3 205C (401F) 140C (284F) DOT 4 230C (446F) 155C (311F) DOT 5 260C (500F) 180C (356F) DOT 5.1 270C (518F) 191C (376F) And as for you Dr. Mayf, tungsten doesn't melt until over 3420C (3693K), so there! Here is a chart just for you: Brake Fluid Rating Dry boiling point Wet boiling point DOT 3 478K 413K DOT 4 503K 428K DOT 5 533K 453K DOT 5.1 543K 464K Bugz -----Original Message----- From: drmayf [mailto:drmayf@mayfco.com] Sent: Monday, June 15, 2009 10:01 AM To: Rense, Mark (GE Indust, ConsInd) Cc: tigers@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Tigers] brake fluid - Types Bugz... did you miss some decimal points in the boiling points table below? Hard for me to believe those temperatures. I mean DOT 5.1 boils at 5180 degrees F? And so on... I think that may be higher than melting tungsten or other exotic metal alloys... mayf, just funning ya Rense, Mark (GE Indust, ConsInd) wrote: >The main difference between DOT 3 and DOT 4 (both glycol-based) is the >boiling point. The DOT 4 has a higher boiling point for both wet and dry measurements. >This is important to us because our clutch and master cylinder >reservoirs are not sealed and therefore allow the passage of moisture, >and since glycol-based fluid is hydroscopic, the DOT 4 rating will >allow more moisture content while still providing adequate service. > >You CANNOT mix DOT 3 or 4 with DOT 5, as DOT 5 is silicon based. >However, you can mix with the new DOT 5.1 fluid. The recommended fluid >for most British cars old and new is Castrol GT/LMA, which is rated as >a DOT 3/4. If you rebuild your hydraulics with all new synthetic rubber >parts, you can use the silicon-based DOT 5, the advantage here is that >when (notice I didn't say >"if") it leaks, it does not affect the paint. The disadvantage of DOT 5 >is that it does not absorb water at all, so the water pools in the >cylinders and causes corrosion. > >In any case, flushing your brake fluid every other year is a Best Practice. > >Brake Fluid Rating Dry boiling point Wet boiling point >DOT 3 2050C (4010F) 1400C (2840F) >DOT 4 2300C (4460F) 1550C (3110F) >DOT 5 2600C (5000F) 1800C (3560F) >DOT 5.1 2700C (5180F) 1910C ( 3760F) > >Bugz _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 15 10:09:05 2009 From: drmayf To: "Rense, Mark (GE Indust, ConsInd)" Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 09:08:39 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] brake fluid - Types Dang, Bugz, now I will have to find my kelvin thermometer, lol.... mayf Rense, Mark (GE Indust, ConsInd) wrote: >Interesting. Folks, the wonderful world of cut and paste into a plain >text editor seemed to have replaced the "degree" symbol with a zero. Not >kewl. > >Here is what they should be. Also, I misspelled one term, glycol-based >brake fluid is hyGroscopic. Too early on a Monday. > >Brake Fluid Rating Dry boiling point Wet boiling >point >DOT 3 205C (401F) 140C (284F) >DOT 4 230C (446F) 155C (311F) >DOT 5 260C (500F) 180C (356F) >DOT 5.1 270C (518F) 191C (376F) > >And as for you Dr. Mayf, tungsten doesn't melt until over 3420C (3693K), >so there! > >Here is a chart just for you: > >Brake Fluid Rating Dry boiling point Wet boiling >point >DOT 3 478K 413K >DOT 4 503K 428K >DOT 5 533K 453K >DOT 5.1 543K >464K > >Bugz > > > snip _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 15 12:18:17 2009 From: Steve Laifman To: "James E. Pickard" Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 11:15:28 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] brake fluid Well, Guys and Gals, The Factory Workshop Manual specifies Castro(l) / Girling Amber Fluid (LMA). http://www.tigersunited.com/resources/wsm/wsmP2.asp I gather that ANYTHING is OK, as long as it's "Amber", like orange juice. However, I contacted Castrol and was told the specifications for this hydraulic fluid EXCEED DOT 4 and DOT 5. I still have a can of it that came with the car. I was able to buy pint quantities from B.A.P. (British Auto Parts), and the like. You should definitely NOT use DOT 3. And the British made original product does NOT dissolve natural rubber. If your brakes don't work under heavy use, or your seals disintegrate, your using the wrong stuff. Steve ___ Steve Laifman Editor - TigersUnited.com James E. Pickard wrote: > I thought you were supposed to use DOT 3 in Tigers because of the > natural rubber. According to this, you should use DOT 4. Am I > reading this wrong? > > Jim Pickard > B9473298 ('65 Tiger) > AN5L/12109 ('59 Sprite) - sold > 2003 Mini Cooper > Lafayette, LA _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 15 12:32:57 2009 From: Steve Laifman To: "Paul R. Breuhan" Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 11:32:17 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Electric Cooling Fans... Paul, As one of my Cooling Tips, in "Cool It, Buddy": http://www.tigersunited.com/techtips/SteveLaifmanValance/pt-SteveLaifmanValance1.asp I used a 13" pusher fan (about 8 blades) and it works just fine. Read the article on the entire solution. Steve ___ Steve Laifman Editor - TigersUnited.com Paul R. Breuhan wrote: > Hello Listers, > > In search of better cooling. I want to add back on an electric cooling fan, I > am not impressed with what I had before. I am currently without one, I could > add the one I have back on but really want to make a change here. > > > > There seems to be a dizzying number of fans out there with 4...5...10 > blades...straight blades...curved blades...10"...11"...12"...along with prices > from $20 to $120... > > > > So I am looking recommendations...money isn't the issue, I just want to avoid > making multple purchases to find a better fan. > > > > Thanks in advance, > > Paul > > _________________________________________________________________ > Hotmail. has ever-growing storage! Dont worry about storage limits. > http://windowslive.com/Tutorial/Hotmail/Storage?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Tutorial > _Storage_062009 > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 15 12:47:58 2009 From: "Paul R. Breuhan" To: Steve Laifman Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 14:45:08 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Electric Cooling Fans... Hi Steve, I have read your article...and I have read the TEAE article. Both are good reading. The TEAE article recommends no larger than a 11" fan, saying at higher speeds it restrict air flow. I looked up "Quest Cooling" and other than the Nissan Quest didn't come up with anything about them. So I am exploring some options and wanted to get some feedback before plunking down my greenbacks. Paul > Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 11:32:17 -0700 > From: SLaifman@SoCal.rr.com > To: prbreuhan@hotmail.com > CC: tigers@autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Tigers] Electric Cooling Fans... > > Paul, > > As one of my Cooling Tips, in "Cool It, Buddy": > > http://www.tigersunited.com/techtips/SteveLaifmanValance/pt-SteveLaifmanValan ce1.asp > > I used a 13" pusher fan (about 8 blades) and it works just fine. Read the article on the entire solution. > > Steve > > ___ > Steve Laifman > Editor - TigersUnited.com > > > > > Paul R. Breuhan wrote: > > Hello Listers, > > > > In search of better cooling. I want to add back on an electric cooling fan, I > > am not impressed with what I had before. I am currently without one, I could > > add the one I have back on but really want to make a change here. > > > > > > > > There seems to be a dizzying number of fans out there with 4...5...10 > > blades...straight blades...curved blades...10"...11"...12"...along with prices > > from $20 to $120... > > > > > > > > So I am looking recommendations...money isn't the issue, I just want to avoid > > making multple purchases to find a better fan. _________________________________________________________________ Lauren found her dream laptop. Find the PC thats right for you. http://www.microsoft.com/windows/choosepc/?ocid=ftp_val_wl_290 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 15 13:53:35 2009 From: "Smit, Theo" To: "Paul R. Breuhan" Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 13:53:14 -0600 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Electric Cooling Fans... Hi Paul, I'm sure it's not the right answer, but my current cooling system has: - no mechanical fan - a 12" pusher electric fan from a 80's Toyota Cressida AC condenser - the header tank re-plumbed to the right side rad tank (Rob Guerra was making stealth rad conversions for this - it's not what I'm using but you could do it that way) - horn hole blockoffs - Tim Ronak's lower radiator baffle to keep air from recirculating underneath the rad - weatherstripping seal around the radiator top and sides to keep the air from going by the rad So far it seems to work, although I haven't tried sustained high-speed operation at high ambient temperatures yet. It will definitely be marginal on the 90 degree days and stop-and-go traffic combination, just because unless the fan is on you need to be moving to get airflow through the rad. However, running the header tank from the cold radiator tank gets you five or six PSI of extra cooling system pressure and that helps prevent boilovers and puking. I've gone to 220 degrees (accidentally pulled the fuse for the fan and had it sitting in the driveway... Bad idea) and it wasn't spitting anything. My longer term plan is to get an aluminum rad with the plumbing arrangement that I want - that should help the cooling system efficiency as well as taking about ten pounds off the front of the car. Theo > > > > > > Paul R. Breuhan wrote: > > > Hello Listers, > > > > > > In search of better cooling. I want to add back on an electric > > > cooling > fan, I > > > am not impressed with what I had before. I am currently > without one, > > > I > could > > > add the one I have back on but really want to make a change here. > > > > > > > > > > > > There seems to be a dizzying number of fans out there with > > > 4...5...10 blades...straight blades...curved > > > blades...10"...11"...12"...along with > prices > > > from $20 to $120... > > > > > > > > > > > > So I am looking recommendations...money isn't the issue, > I just want > > > to > avoid > > > making multple purchases to find a better fan. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 15 14:41:10 2009 From: Rollright@aol.com To: tigers@Autox.Team.Net Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 16:41:16 EDT Subject: [Tigers] no data Hello, I seem to have either been 1)dropped from the list/serve, 2)there are no notes being sent back and forth, or 3)my computer is playing tricks on me. A Tiger friend tells me there is the usual activity on the list/serve......... Help ! Jim Armstrong rollright@aol.com **************Download the AOL Classifieds Toolbar for local deals at your fingertips. (http://toolbar.aol.com/aolclassifieds/download.html?ncid=emlcntusdown00000004) _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 15 15:53:53 2009 From: "Samouce's" To: Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 16:53:42 -0500 Subject: [Tigers] Air filter drama...easy...no. So I need a new air filter for my upcoming trip. Too easy, I have an AC A350C on the car now. I am also armed with CAT shop notes and a list of other filter that should work. Fram CA-114, CA-148PL - can't get AC 335C - can't get Motocraft FA-41 - can't get. The filter that is on the car AC A350C - does not cross. So the only thing that would come close is a FA-186 which is 2.2" high and will most likely be too tall. I have a F4B manifold and very little room to the hood. So, what are you guys using? I am NOT interested in the K&N hype or price. Thanks! Duke B382002037 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 15 16:22:26 2009 From: "Smit, Theo" To: "Samouce's" , Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 16:22:14 -0600 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Air filter drama...easy...no. Would you be interested in the K&N size? I put in a K&N E-3710. Height 2", ID 11.75, OD 13.5". It fits (having reshaped the circle to an oval) perfectly. The E-2859 (listed as the Tiger filter) has the same ID and OD, but is 1.5" tall. The FRAM CA3371 is listed as 1.88 high, 11.31 ID, 13.55 OD... That MIGHT fit. The application for this one is '75-76 Mustang V8 2 bbl. Cheers, Theo > -----Original Message----- > From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net > [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Samouce's > Sent: June 15, 2009 3:54 PM > To: tigers@autox.team.net > Subject: [Tigers] Air filter drama...easy...no. > > So I need a new air filter for my upcoming trip. > > Too easy, I have an AC A350C on the car now. I am also armed > with CAT shop notes and a list of other filter that should work. > > Fram CA-114, CA-148PL - can't get > AC 335C - can't get > Motocraft FA-41 - can't get. > > The filter that is on the car AC A350C - does not cross. > > So the only thing that would come close is a FA-186 which is > 2.2" high and will most likely be too tall. I have a F4B > manifold and very little room to the hood. > > So, what are you guys using? I am NOT interested in the K&N > hype or price. > > Thanks! > > Duke > B382002037 > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 15 16:41:49 2009 From: David Sosna To: Spridgets Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 15:41:32 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Air filter drama...easy...no. Duke: Try Sunbeam Specialties for all (well, most) of your Tiger needs. From the February 2008 catalog (may have been superseded) Air filter element, aftermarket: Part # TM24, $15.80 www.rootes.com (408) 371-1642 Best Regards David Sosna P.S. don't know if they still have paper catalogs, but if they do, I'm sure they'd be happy to drop one in the mail :-) Samouce's wrote: > So I need a new air filter for my upcoming trip. > > Too easy, I have an AC A350C on the car now. I am also armed with CAT shop > notes and a list of other filter that should work. > > Fram CA-114, CA-148PL - can't get > AC 335C - can't get > Motocraft FA-41 - can't get. > > The filter that is on the car AC A350C - does not cross. > > So the only thing that would come close is a FA-186 which is 2.2" high and > will most likely be too tall. I have a F4B manifold and very little room to > the hood. > > So, what are you guys using? I am NOT interested in the K&N hype or price. > > Thanks! > > Duke > B382002037 > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4157 (20090615) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 15 16:57:54 2009 From: Steve Laifman To: David Sosna , Duke Samouce Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 15:57:41 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Air filter drama...easy...no. Duke, I can second David's recommendation, as I bought one from SS. I am using the K&N filter, as it will last "forever" Just follow directions for cleaning and re-lubricating. Beware of asking K&N. They don't know what a "Sunbeam Tiger" is, and the numbers on the rubber are ONLY numbers for the Rubber! Beware of using a taller filter due to the bonnet wanting the same space! SS has "broken the code" for the correct K&N filter. I have been using K&N filters for a great number of years and cars. As long as you maintain them per instructions, with their oil. The original was in a rectangular box, and was pulled out and fastened with the sticky pad to form a circle. Very dear now, and it was only paper. Steve ___ Steve Laifman Editor - TigersUnited.com David Sosna wrote: > Duke: > Try Sunbeam Specialties for all (well, most) of your Tiger needs. > From the February 2008 catalog (may have been superseded) > Air filter element, aftermarket: Part # TM24, $15.80 > www.rootes.com > (408) 371-1642 > > Best Regards > David Sosna > P.S. don't know if they still have paper catalogs, but if they do, I'm > sure they'd be happy to drop one in the mail :-) > > Samouce's wrote: >> So I need a new air filter for my upcoming trip. >> >> Too easy, I have an AC A350C on the car now. I am also armed with >> CAT shop >> notes and a list of other filter that should work. >> >> Fram CA-114, CA-148PL - can't get >> AC 335C - can't get >> Motocraft FA-41 - can't get. >> >> The filter that is on the car AC A350C - does not cross. >> >> So the only thing that would come close is a FA-186 which is 2.2" >> high and >> will most likely be too tall. I have a F4B manifold and very little >> room to >> the hood. >> >> So, what are you guys using? I am NOT interested in the K&N hype or >> price. >> >> Thanks! >> >> Duke >> B382002037 >> _______________________________________________ >> Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Tigers@autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers >> >> http://www.team.net/archive >> >> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >> signature database 4157 (20090615) __________ >> >> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >> >> http://www.eset.com > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 15 17:09:44 2009 From: "Smit, Theo" To: "Steve Laifman" Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 17:09:33 -0600 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Air filter drama...easy...no. Actually, K&N filters lists their E-2859 specifically with the application "Sunbeam Tiger 4.3L V8". However, this means that when you're using their online vehicle application part search tool, you will only see that filter if you select the 4.3L engine, and NOT if you select 260 or 289 CID. The best feature of the K&N site is that you can also search filters by ID, OD, and height, which is how I found the 3710. Theo > -----Original Message----- > From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net > [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Steve Laifman > Sent: June 15, 2009 4:58 PM > To: David Sosna; Duke Samouce > Cc: tigers@autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Tigers] Air filter drama...easy...no. > > Duke, > > I can second David's recommendation, as I bought one from SS. > I am using the K&N filter, as it will last "forever" Just > follow directions for cleaning and re-lubricating. > > Beware of asking K&N. They don't know what a "Sunbeam Tiger" > is, and the numbers on the rubber are ONLY numbers for the > Rubber! Beware of using a taller filter due to the bonnet > wanting the same space! > > SS has "broken the code" for the correct K&N filter. > > I have been using K&N filters for a great number of years and > cars. As long as you maintain them per instructions, with > their oil. The original was in a rectangular box, and was > pulled out and fastened with the sticky pad to form a circle. > Very dear now, and it was only paper. > > Steve > > ___ > Steve Laifman > Editor - TigersUnited.com > > > > > David Sosna wrote: > > Duke: > > Try Sunbeam Specialties for all (well, most) of your Tiger needs. > > From the February 2008 catalog (may have been superseded) > Air filter > > element, aftermarket: Part # TM24, $15.80 www.rootes.com > > (408) 371-1642 > > > > Best Regards > > David Sosna > > P.S. don't know if they still have paper catalogs, but if > they do, I'm > > sure they'd be happy to drop one in the mail :-) > > > > Samouce's wrote: > >> So I need a new air filter for my upcoming trip. > >> > >> Too easy, I have an AC A350C on the car now. I am also armed with > >> CAT shop notes and a list of other filter that should work. > >> > >> Fram CA-114, CA-148PL - can't get > >> AC 335C - can't get > >> Motocraft FA-41 - can't get. > >> > >> The filter that is on the car AC A350C - does not cross. > >> > >> So the only thing that would come close is a FA-186 which is 2.2" > >> high and > >> will most likely be too tall. I have a F4B manifold and > very little > >> room to the hood. > >> > >> So, what are you guys using? I am NOT interested in the > K&N hype or > >> price. > >> > >> Thanks! > >> > >> Duke > >> B382002037 > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > >> > >> Tigers@autox.team.net > >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > >> > >> http://www.team.net/archive > >> > >> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > >> signature database 4157 (20090615) __________ > >> > >> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > >> > >> http://www.eset.com > > _______________________________________________ > > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > Tigers@autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > > > http://www.team.net/archive > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 15 19:39:17 2009 From: To: Tigers@autox.team.net Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 21:38:52 -0400 Subject: [Tigers] My newest favorite car website (off topic) I was watching Bond "You Only Live Twice" and saw a great car that I didn't recognize. I want one... Thanks to a site I discovered on the Alpine board I found out it's a 1966 Toyota 2000GT http://imcdb.org/vehicle_2661-Toyota-2000GT-MF10-1966.html Home page for this site is http://imcdb.org You can enter a car and get a list of films it's been in but more useful if you see a car in a film you can search by film title to find out what car it was. I entered You Only Live Twice and viola the Toyota picture with identification popped up. What a great idea. Steve _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 15 19:48:04 2009 From: michael king To: sralsten@ca.rr.com Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2009 11:45:04 +1000 Subject: Re: [Tigers] My newest favorite car website (off topic) They never produced a productin 2000GT convertible, they did however make 2 "show cars" that toured for the film. I think one now resides in the cars for the starts museum. As a side note the original is missing.. and the converted cars never had soft tops.. but those with alpine GT's (and the very few with tiger GT's) know how to live with that. 2009/6/16 > I was watching Bond "You Only Live Twice" and saw a great car > that I didn't recognize. I want one... > > Thanks to a site I discovered on the Alpine board I found out it's a 1966 > Toyota 2000GT > > http://imcdb.org/vehicle_2661-Toyota-2000GT-MF10-1966.html > > > Home page for this site is http://imcdb.org > > You can enter a car and get a list of films it's been in but more useful > if you see a car in a film you can search by film title to find out what > car > it was. I entered You Only Live Twice and viola the Toyota picture with > identification > popped up. What a great idea. > > Steve > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive > -- Regards Michael King _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 15 20:53:31 2009 From: "Paul R. Breuhan" To: , Tigers Den Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 22:53:11 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] My newest favorite car website (off topic) It's a good website but my son and I were watching the original "Love Bug" movie last night, lo and behold there was a racing Series 1 or 2 Alpine in a couple scenes. I just checked and IMCDB has it listed as a Tiger. Those slanted fins, round gas cap located lower in the rear quarter give it away as he is passing Herbie. It is fun to visit that website. Paul > Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 21:38:52 -0400 > From: sralsten@ca.rr.com > To: Tigers@autox.team.net > Subject: [Tigers] My newest favorite car website (off topic) > > I was watching Bond "You Only Live Twice" and saw a great car > that I didn't recognize. I want one... > > Thanks to a site I discovered on the Alpine board I found out it's a 1966 Toyota 2000GT > > http://imcdb.org/vehicle_2661-Toyota-2000GT-MF10-1966.html > > > Home page for this site is http://imcdb.org > > You can enter a car and get a list of films it's been in but more useful > if you see a car in a film you can search by film title to find out what car > it was. I entered You Only Live Twice and viola the Toyota picture with identification > popped up. What a great idea. > > Steve _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail. has ever-growing storage! Dont worry about storage limits. http://windowslive.com/Tutorial/Hotmail/Storage?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Tutorial _Storage_062009 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 15 21:12:19 2009 From: "Samouce's" To: "'Smit, Theo'" , Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 22:12:16 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Air filter drama...easy...no. Thanks for the info Theo. Looks like I am going to have Auto Zone get me a 2859. I really do not think I have the extra 1/2" to play with. I have also put 1/8" spacers under the engine mounts for the 15" Derale fan to rack clearance. I will get AZ points and not have to pay shipping. Duke -----Original Message----- From: Smit, Theo [mailto:Theo.Smit@dynastream.com] Sent: Monday, June 15, 2009 17:22 To: Samouce's; tigers@autox.team.net Subject: RE: [Tigers] Air filter drama...easy...no. Would you be interested in the K&N size? I put in a K&N E-3710. Height 2", ID 11.75, OD 13.5". It fits (having reshaped the circle to an oval) perfectly. The E-2859 (listed as the Tiger filter) has the same ID and OD, but is 1.5" tall. The FRAM CA3371 is listed as 1.88 high, 11.31 ID, 13.55 OD... That MIGHT fit. The application for this one is '75-76 Mustang V8 2 bbl. Cheers, Theo > -----Original Message----- > From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net > [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Samouce's > Sent: June 15, 2009 3:54 PM > To: tigers@autox.team.net > Subject: [Tigers] Air filter drama...easy...no. > > So I need a new air filter for my upcoming trip. > > Too easy, I have an AC A350C on the car now. I am also armed > with CAT shop notes and a list of other filter that should work. > > Fram CA-114, CA-148PL - can't get > AC 335C - can't get > Motocraft FA-41 - can't get. > > The filter that is on the car AC A350C - does not cross. > > So the only thing that would come close is a FA-186 which is > 2.2" high and will most likely be too tall. I have a F4B > manifold and very little room to the hood. > > So, what are you guys using? I am NOT interested in the K&N > hype or price. > > Thanks! > > Duke > B382002037 > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 16 07:02:49 2009 From: "spook01" To: "Smit, Theo" , "Samouce's" Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2009 08:00:03 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Air filter drama...easy...no. some times the filter supplier recognizes the application of a 1966 Pontiac GTO, with tri-power carbs. this is a round a/c Ray ----- Original Message ----- From: "Smit, Theo" To: "Samouce's" ; Sent: Monday, June 15, 2009 5:22 PM Subject: Re: [Tigers] Air filter drama...easy...no. > Would you be interested in the K&N size? I put in a K&N E-3710. Height > 2", ID 11.75, OD 13.5". It fits (having reshaped the circle to an oval) > perfectly. > The E-2859 (listed as the Tiger filter) has the same ID and OD, but is > 1.5" tall. > > The FRAM CA3371 is listed as 1.88 high, 11.31 ID, 13.55 OD... That MIGHT > fit. The application for this one is '75-76 Mustang V8 2 bbl. > > Cheers, > Theo > > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net >> [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Samouce's >> Sent: June 15, 2009 3:54 PM >> To: tigers@autox.team.net >> Subject: [Tigers] Air filter drama...easy...no. >> >> So I need a new air filter for my upcoming trip. >> >> Too easy, I have an AC A350C on the car now. I am also armed >> with CAT shop notes and a list of other filter that should work. >> >> Fram CA-114, CA-148PL - can't get >> AC 335C - can't get >> Motocraft FA-41 - can't get. >> >> The filter that is on the car AC A350C - does not cross. >> >> So the only thing that would come close is a FA-186 which is >> 2.2" high and will most likely be too tall. I have a F4B >> manifold and very little room to the hood. >> >> So, what are you guys using? I am NOT interested in the K&N >> hype or price. >> >> Thanks! >> >> Duke >> B382002037 >> _______________________________________________ >> Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Tigers@autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers >> >> http://www.team.net/archive > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 16 10:27:26 2009 From: " Ron Fraser" To: , Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2009 12:26:56 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] My newest favorite car website (off topic) Steve Articles about the 2000GT; Road and Track June 1967, Motor Trend May 1968. Very interesting car with 2L inline 6 engine, 5 sp, 4 wheel disc brakes and independent rear suspension. The door to the rear of the front right wheel is where the battery is located on the left side is where the air cleaner is located. Web search indicates that 337 units were produced with only 54 being imported the USA. Designer Raymond Loewry; offered to Nissan/ Datsun, accepted by Toyota. I always liked the looks of that car. Ron Fraser -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of sralsten@ca.rr.com Sent: Monday, June 15, 2009 9:39 PM To: Tigers@autox.team.net Subject: [Tigers] My newest favorite car website (off topic) I was watching Bond "You Only Live Twice" and saw a great car that I didn't recognize. I want one... Thanks to a site I discovered on the Alpine board I found out it's a 1966 Toyota 2000GT http://imcdb.org/vehicle_2661-Toyota-2000GT-MF10-1966.html Home page for this site is http://imcdb.org You can enter a car and get a list of films it's been in but more useful if you see a car in a film you can search by film title to find out what car it was. I entered You Only Live Twice and viola the Toyota picture with identification popped up. What a great idea. Steve No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.364 / Virus Database: 270.12.70/2177 - Release Date: 06/15/09 05:54:00 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 16 17:12:51 2009 From: michael king To: rfraser@bluefrog.com Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 09:12:33 +1000 Subject: Re: [Tigers] My newest favorite car website (off topic) Tounge in cheek.. Iknow how this car relates to sunbeams... Shelby america raced them in SCCA for 2 years as factory cars -- Regards Michael King _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 16 17:49:13 2009 From: "Buck Trippel" To: "michael king" , Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2009 16:48:28 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] My newest favorite car website (off topic) And the drivers were Scooter Patrick (who sold Tigers and other Rootes products in Manhattan Beach) and Davey Jordan (who raced Alpines and attended TU at Big Bear last year). ;-) bt ----- Original Message ----- From: "michael king" To: Cc: Sent: Tuesday, June 16, 2009 4:12 PM Subject: Re: [Tigers] My newest favorite car website (off topic) > Tounge in cheek.. > > Iknow how this car relates to sunbeams... > > Shelby america raced them in SCCA for 2 years as factory cars > -- > Regards > > Michael King _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 16 18:18:14 2009 From: "Clyde McLaughlin" To: Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2009 20:17:47 -0400 Subject: [Tigers] shelby recognition Hi Listers, having noted some varying opinions about Ole Carroll, yes he sure new how to make money, few did in the fifties and sixties.. They used to say the way to a small forture in racing was to start with a big one..But now with Nascar I guess that's not all true..anyway, I used to have an early GT350 in the 70's when the shelby club first started, most members were do it yourselfers and the car were very personalized, if you went to a show you didn't see 50 cars all alike, and you did not need tobe a millionaire to partake in club activeties, having recently bought my third Tiger I rejoined the club at a great price and then noted they did away with the news letter and magizine, and the price to attend the last nation meet was to much for me, I did not renew my membership, enough said...but the reason for this note was to mention an exibit at the Saratoga Auto Museum in NY, that featured Shelby, the Ford Connection, this was written up in Autoweek, jan 31, 2005...Tiger's were given mention and my car when owned by George Izett was on display..So I guess we can all decide as has been mentioned before...but I must say the Tiger group seems to be much more connected to their cars than the newer Cobra/Shelby owners who are all about value, investment etc. I hope the value holds, Clyde MK1A _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 16 18:27:34 2009 From: " Ron Fraser" To: "'Buck Trippel'" , "'michael king'" Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2009 20:27:17 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] My newest favorite car website (off topic) You forgot Kenneth Howes designed the Alpine, who once worked for Raymond Loewry. Ron Fraser -----Original Message----- From: Buck Trippel [mailto:BuckTrippel@Verizon.net] Sent: Tuesday, June 16, 2009 7:48 PM To: michael king; rfraser@bluefrog.com Cc: Tigers@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Tigers] My newest favorite car website (off topic) And the drivers were Scooter Patrick (who sold Tigers and other Rootes products in Manhattan Beach) and Davey Jordan (who raced Alpines and attended TU at Big Bear last year). ;-) bt ----- Original Message ----- From: "michael king" To: Cc: Sent: Tuesday, June 16, 2009 4:12 PM Subject: Re: [Tigers] My newest favorite car website (off topic) > Tounge in cheek.. > > Iknow how this car relates to sunbeams... > > Shelby america raced them in SCCA for 2 years as factory cars > -- > Regards > > Michael King No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.364 / Virus Database: 270.12.70/2177 - Release Date: 06/16/09 17:55:00 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 17 00:11:10 2009 From: "Mike Michels" To: "Buck Trippel" , "michael king" Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2009 23:10:58 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] My newest favorite car website (off topic) Scooter drove his car again at the Monterey Historics last summer. His car is now owned by Toyota dealer Craig Zinn. Scooter was joined by Timo Glock in the Fangio/Jones Gurney Eagle Mk III GTP car, motoGP legend Eddie Lawson in the ex Chris Cord/Willy T Ribbs IMSA GTO Celica, and Chuck Wade, who runs the Toyota Motorsports Shop, in Gurney's first Toyota effort which was an IMSA GTU Celica. I was lucky enough to be part of it. The drivers had no familiarization or warmup opportunities before demo hot laps for the crowd. I can tell you that these otherwise fearless guys were nervous as can be, praying not to screw up, especially the Turbo cars which have throttle behavior akin to an on-off switch. Scooter actually did spin but no harm done. Everyone had a blast and I'm not sure who had more fun, the drivers or the owners of the historic cars who got to see them at speed again. We have several 2000GTs in the Toyota historic car collection in Torrance and occasionally get them on the road for special occasions. Nice to see everyone's interest in this rare car. Here are some YouTube clips from some fans at the track: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AA8B_Blw0GE http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acn-Q5A-63A&feature=related http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acn-Q5A-63A&feature=related ----- Original Message ----- From: "Buck Trippel" To: "michael king" ; Cc: Sent: Tuesday, June 16, 2009 4:48 PM Subject: Re: [Tigers] My newest favorite car website (off topic) > And the drivers were Scooter Patrick (who sold Tigers and other Rootes > products in Manhattan Beach) and Davey Jordan (who raced Alpines and > attended TU at Big Bear last year). > > ;-) > > bt > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "michael king" > To: > Cc: > Sent: Tuesday, June 16, 2009 4:12 PM > Subject: Re: [Tigers] My newest favorite car website (off topic) > > >> Tounge in cheek.. >> >> Iknow how this car relates to sunbeams... >> >> Shelby america raced them in SCCA for 2 years as factory cars >> -- >> Regards >> >> Michael King > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 17 02:52:00 2009 From: "George Leibert" To: "Tiger List" Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 04:51:35 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Drag Racers, Watch Out!!! Not Tiger! Now this is an "ELECTRIC CAR!" Would not like to go against this bad boy! Have a nice day!!! This car is really impressive. Check out this video. 11 Second Electric Car? If a little guy in a home garage can make this, what should all the big car makers be doing in all their giant labs??? If this isn't absolutely pathetic! What have all the Detroit automakers been doing! What a joke! No wonder they are going under! Check this out. www.opb.org/programs/ofg/videos/view/56-Electric-Drag-Racing _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 17 09:24:42 2009 From: "spook01" To: "Clyde McLaughlin" , Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 10:24:30 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tigers] shelby recognition well, i finally got to drive a real 427 s/c cobra last weekend. it isn't faster than light. but light DOES shift toward the red spectrum as you begin to gain on it!! pretty puzzling, though. third pulls like first. so does fourth. forge the tach, you don't have time to read it; and besides the phone poles are rushing by too fast.... now i just have to come up with 600k to get one. wonder if my wife would mind sleeping in the trunk? Ray ----- Original Message ----- From: "Clyde McLaughlin" To: Sent: Tuesday, June 16, 2009 7:17 PM Subject: [Tigers] shelby recognition > Hi Listers, having noted some varying opinions about Ole Carroll, yes he > sure new how to make money, few did in the fifties and sixties.. They > used to > say the way to a small forture in racing was to start with a big one..But > now > with Nascar I guess that's not all true..anyway, I used to have an early > GT350 in the 70's when the shelby club first started, most members were > do it > yourselfers and the car were very personalized, if you went to a show you > didn't see 50 cars all alike, and you did not need tobe a millionaire to > partake in club activeties, having recently bought my third Tiger I > rejoined > the club at a great price and then noted they did away with the news > letter > and magizine, and the price to attend the last nation meet was to much > for > me, I did not renew my membership, enough said...but the reason for this > note was to mention an exibit at the Saratoga Auto Museum in NY, that > featured Shelby, the Ford Connection, this was written up in Autoweek, > jan > 31, 2005...Tiger's were given mention and my car when owned by George > Izett > was on display..So I guess we can all decide as has been mentioned > before...but I must say the Tiger group seems to be much more connected > to > their cars than the newer Cobra/Shelby owners who are all about value, > investment etc. I hope the value holds, Clyde MK1A > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 17 16:26:55 2009 From: "J. Nichols" To: Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 18:26:38 -0400 Subject: [Tigers] Who Or What Killed the Electric Car? You will be amazed "If a little guy in a home garage can make this, what should all the big car makers be doing in all their giant labs??? If this isn't absolutely pathetic! What have all the Detroit automakers been doing! What a joke! No wonder they are going under! " I find it truly amazing that one backyard/shadetree mechanic (in his own garage no less) can build a car and solve complex engineering and electical design issues that continually stump Detroit's engineers and research scientists. And we don't want to forget the Japanese and German engineers who seem to be clueless in this regard. Really, what good is a master or PHD degree in engineering if some dude in his garage can build something that goes faster in a 1/4 mile than any Corvette? Why hasn't this guy been on all the news shows and written up in the car magazines? You have to shake your head and wonder if there isn't a vast conspiracy against the electric car like there was against the 50 mpg carburator back in the 1970's. This demands a full investigation by the Obama administration, or do you think he is part of the conspiracy? I bet you Nostradamus has a prediction that this would happen. Let me check some conspiracy web sites........................................... it seems that Area 51 is involved along with Sasquatch.....................Ameilia Erhart and Sasquatch once dated in Area 51 and their offspring is the CEO of Exxon and General Electric thus explaining the conspiracy against the electric car. Jeff _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 17 16:27:55 2009 From: Paul Rudge To: Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 16:27:35 -0600 Subject: [Tigers] Mk.1 Seat Wire Hello fellow Tiger enthusiasts, I don't get on the chat line that much as my car is in a very slow restoration mode. Having confessed to this I am currently progressing completion of one of my winter projects which was to recover the seats. Things are going well thanks to some good materials from Rick at Sunbeam Specialties and Mike Schriener who supplied me with a seat back frame to replace the badly broken down one I had. All is going together with copious amounts of contact cement (a gallon should do the pair ;) except I've hit a hit of a snag. The early seats had 1/16" wires (6/seat) placed in the back of the frame to hold the back rest cushion in place. This wire is very strong and doesn't come in your average hardware store. My next trip is to the farmers depot (UFA) to see what good things they have there. If anyone has any idea of where/whom I might be able to get a couple of feet of this stuff from I'd sure appreciate the advise. Thanks all! This electronic message and any attached documents are intended only for the named addressee(s). This communication from TransCanada may contain information that is privileged, confidential or otherwise protected from disclosure and it must not be disclosed, copied, forwarded or distributed without authorization. If you have received this message in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete the original message. Thank you. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 17 16:34:24 2009 From: "Smit, Theo" To: "Paul Rudge" , Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 16:34:14 -0600 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Mk.1 Seat Wire Hi Paul, Go to PM Hobbycraft on 32nd Ave NE. and get some music wire in the size you need. Any good hobby shop will carry the K&S line of metal products... Lots of good stuff for one-of restoration needs. http://ksmetals.com/ Cheers, Theo > -----Original Message----- > From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net > [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Paul Rudge > Sent: June 17, 2009 4:28 PM > To: tigers@autox.team.net > Subject: [Tigers] Mk.1 Seat Wire > > except I've hit a hit of a snag. The early seats had 1/16" > wires (6/seat) placed in the back of the frame to hold the > back rest cushion in place. This wire is very strong and > doesn't come in your average hardware store. My next trip is _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 17 16:49:07 2009 From: "Smit, Theo" To: "J. Nichols" , Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 16:48:56 -0600 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Who Or What Killed the Electric Car? You will be The problem with pushing the boundary on any car design these days is that the marketeers have brainwashed the public and the government into believing that any car sold anywhere is no good unless it comes with power steering, electric windows, door locks, and mirrors, heated seats, ABS, traction control, stability assist, airbags, and devices that turn off the air bags when the passenger is under a certain weight. And it's got to be quiet and plush inside with no sheetmetal showing anywhere. Maybe I'll turn my Series V bodyshell into an electric car for Suni VI... It would need none of the above items, which simplifies the design exercise about tenfold. Theo > -----Original Message----- > From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net > [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of J. Nichols > Sent: June 17, 2009 4:27 PM > To: tigers@autox.team.net > Subject: [Tigers] Who Or What Killed the Electric Car? You > will be amazed and astonished! > > I find it truly amazing that one backyard/shadetree > mechanic (in his own garage no less) can build a car and > solve complex engineering and electical design issues that > continually stump Detroit's engineers and research > scientists. And we don't want to forget the Japanese and > German engineers who > seem to be clueless in this regard. Really, what good is a > master or PHD > degree in engineering if some dude in his garage can build > something that goes faster in a 1/4 mile than any Corvette? > > Why hasn't this guy been on all the news shows and written > up in the car magazines? You have to shake your head and > wonder if there isn't a vast conspiracy against the electric > car like there was against the 50 mpg > carburator back in the 1970's. This demands a full > investigation by the > Obama administration, or do you think he is part of the > conspiracy? I bet > you Nostradamus has a prediction that this would happen. Let > me check some conspiracy web > sites........................................... it seems > that Area 51 is involved along with > Sasquatch.....................Ameilia Erhart and Sasquatch > once dated in Area 51 and their offspring is the CEO of Exxon > and General Electric thus explaining the conspiracy against > the electric car. > > > > > > Jeff > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 17 17:17:34 2009 From: drmayf To: "J. Nichols" Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 16:15:31 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Who Or What Killed the Electric Car? You will be Jeeze, I blew milk ou tmy nose laughing so hard... but you are right. technically, it is an energy density issue. You can go fast or you can go far, just cannot do both. electricity just doesn't cut it in that regards (unless you run a really really long power cord, lol). mayf J. Nichols wrote: >"If a little guy in a home garage can make this, what should all the big car >makers be doing in all their giant labs??? > >If this isn't absolutely pathetic! > >What have all the Detroit automakers been doing! > >What a joke! > >No wonder they are going under! " > > > I find it truly amazing that one backyard/shadetree mechanic (in his own >garage no less) can build a car and solve complex engineering and electical >design issues that continually stump Detroit's engineers and research >scientists. And we don't want to forget the Japanese and German engineers who >seem to be clueless in this regard. Really, what good is a master or PHD >degree in engineering if some dude in his garage can build something that goes >faster in a 1/4 mile than any Corvette? > > Why hasn't this guy been on all the news shows and written up in the car >magazines? You have to shake your head and wonder if there isn't a vast >conspiracy against the electric car like there was against the 50 mpg >carburator back in the 1970's. This demands a full investigation by the >Obama administration, or do you think he is part of the conspiracy? I bet >you Nostradamus has a prediction that this would happen. Let me check some >conspiracy web sites........................................... it seems that >Area 51 is involved along with Sasquatch.....................Ameilia Erhart >and Sasquatch once dated in Area 51 and their offspring is the CEO of Exxon >and General Electric thus explaining the conspiracy against the electric car. > > > > > Jeff >_______________________________________________ >Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Tigers@autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > >http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 17 17:21:19 2009 From: drmayf To: "Smit, Theo" Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 16:21:02 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Who Or What Killed the Electric Car? You will be Well, now there is a thought! Since about the only modern creature comforts these cars have is at best a soft top and radio and maybe just maybe a clock, then it would make a good transitional car. But make sur eit is a rust free one cause all them batteries are really heavy! Or maybe you could make or find a really large capacitor and use that for the energy storage.....just do not get too close, lol... I have zero skills in something like this but couldn't one start with a defunct electric golf cart for the electronics? mayf Smit, Theo wrote: >The problem with pushing the boundary on any car design these days is >that the marketeers have brainwashed the public and the government into >believing that any car sold anywhere is no good unless it comes with >power steering, electric windows, door locks, and mirrors, heated seats, >ABS, traction control, stability assist, airbags, and devices that turn >off the air bags when the passenger is under a certain weight. And it's >got to be quiet and plush inside with no sheetmetal showing anywhere. > >Maybe I'll turn my Series V bodyshell into an electric car for Suni >VI... It would need none of the above items, which simplifies the design >exercise about tenfold. > >Theo > > > > > >>-----Original Message----- >>From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net >>[mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of J. Nichols >>Sent: June 17, 2009 4:27 PM >>To: tigers@autox.team.net >>Subject: [Tigers] Who Or What Killed the Electric Car? You >>will be amazed and astonished! >> >> >> > > > >> I find it truly amazing that one backyard/shadetree >>mechanic (in his own garage no less) can build a car and >>solve complex engineering and electical design issues that >>continually stump Detroit's engineers and research >>scientists. And we don't want to forget the Japanese and >>German engineers who >>seem to be clueless in this regard. Really, what good is a >>master or PHD >>degree in engineering if some dude in his garage can build >>something that goes faster in a 1/4 mile than any Corvette? >> >> Why hasn't this guy been on all the news shows and written >>up in the car magazines? You have to shake your head and >>wonder if there isn't a vast conspiracy against the electric >>car like there was against the 50 mpg >>carburator back in the 1970's. This demands a full >>investigation by the >>Obama administration, or do you think he is part of the >>conspiracy? I bet >>you Nostradamus has a prediction that this would happen. Let >>me check some conspiracy web >>sites........................................... it seems >>that Area 51 is involved along with >>Sasquatch.....................Ameilia Erhart and Sasquatch >>once dated in Area 51 and their offspring is the CEO of Exxon >>and General Electric thus explaining the conspiracy against >>the electric car. >> >> >> >> >> >> Jeff >>_______________________________________________ _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 17 17:44:51 2009 From: michael king To: spook01 Date: Thu, 18 Jun 2009 09:44:21 +1000 Subject: Re: [Tigers] shelby recognition I guess there is always an original spec Kirkam 427? I personally ama big fan of the 289 FIA cars.. brutish and agressive but a bit more delicate than the 427 they spawned 2009/6/18 spook01 > well, i finally got to drive a real 427 s/c cobra last weekend. > it isn't faster than light. > but light DOES shift toward the red spectrum as you begin to gain on it!! > pretty puzzling, though. third pulls like first. so does fourth. > forge the tach, you don't have time to read it; and besides the phone poles > are rushing by too fast.... > now i just have to come up with 600k to get one. > wonder if my wife would mind sleeping in the trunk? > Ray > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Clyde McLaughlin" < > clydemclaughlin@verizon.net> > To: > Sent: Tuesday, June 16, 2009 7:17 PM > Subject: [Tigers] shelby recognition > > > > Hi Listers, having noted some varying opinions about Ole Carroll, yes he >> sure new how to make money, few did in the fifties and sixties.. They >> used to >> say the way to a small forture in racing was to start with a big one..But >> now >> with Nascar I guess that's not all true..anyway, I used to have an early >> GT350 in the 70's when the shelby club first started, most members were >> do it >> yourselfers and the car were very personalized, if you went to a show you >> didn't see 50 cars all alike, and you did not need tobe a millionaire to >> partake in club activeties, having recently bought my third Tiger I >> rejoined >> the club at a great price and then noted they did away with the news >> letter >> and magizine, and the price to attend the last nation meet was to much >> for >> me, I did not renew my membership, enough said...but the reason for this >> note was to mention an exibit at the Saratoga Auto Museum in NY, that >> featured Shelby, the Ford Connection, this was written up in Autoweek, >> jan >> 31, 2005...Tiger's were given mention and my car when owned by George >> Izett >> was on display..So I guess we can all decide as has been mentioned >> before...but I must say the Tiger group seems to be much more connected >> to >> their cars than the newer Cobra/Shelby owners who are all about value, >> investment etc. I hope the value holds, Clyde MK1A >> _______________________________________________ >> Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Tigers@autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers >> >> http://www.team.net/archive >> > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive > -- Regards Michael King _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 17 20:41:04 2009 From: Paul Rudge To: , Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 20:36:49 -0600 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Mk.1 Seat Wire Thanks to Theo and Tony I'm finally going to get some insight into that musical education I skipped earlier on. Piano wire.....I was thinking wire fencing. Thanks guys! ----- Original Message ----- From: Smit, Theo To: Paul Rudge; tigers@autox.team.net Sent: Wed Jun 17 16:34:14 2009 Subject: RE: [Tigers] Mk.1 Seat Wire Hi Paul, Go to PM Hobbycraft on 32nd Ave NE. and get some music wire in the size you need. Any good hobby shop will carry the K&S line of metal products... Lots of good stuff for one-of restoration needs. http://ksmetals.com/ Cheers, Theo > -----Original Message----- > From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net > [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Paul Rudge > Sent: June 17, 2009 4:28 PM > To: tigers@autox.team.net > Subject: [Tigers] Mk.1 Seat Wire > > except I've hit a hit of a snag. The early seats had 1/16" > wires (6/seat) placed in the back of the frame to hold the > back rest cushion in place. This wire is very strong and > doesn't come in your average hardware store. My next trip is This electronic message and any attached documents are intended only for the named addressee(s). This communication from TransCanada may contain information that is privileged, confidential or otherwise protected from disclosure and it must not be disclosed, copied, forwarded or distributed without authorization. If you have received this message in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete the original message. Thank you. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 18 00:57:32 2009 From: Gary To: Tiger List Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 23:57:14 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Tigers] Drag Racers, Watch Out!!! Not Tiger! This is an awesome car!!! However, as usual, these people never take into account all the chemicals and energy required to manufacture the batteries, let alone to recycler them. All storage and conversion of energy has some kind and amount of parasitic loss. Granted, the actual driving time creates practically no emissions, but the fabrication is hazardous and energy intensive. Why is that never figured into the environmental pollution equation? And can you imagine the size of the power grid necessary if all of Los Angeles had to plug in every night?!!! And what about all the batteries that would have to be manufactured and recycled?!!! And what about all the chemical spills from all the accidents from all the crazy drivers we have here in L.A.?!!! and what about ... you get the picture. A friend of mine just finished converting an S10 pickup to electric. It's got lots of torque, but it's a trade off between performance and longevity. He's hoping to gingerly get 50 miles per charge. His 22 batteries weigh 72 lbs apiece and cost $7,500 and have to be changed every 3 three years and he still has to pay for the nightly electricity. I am not against electric vehicles. I just don't think they're the nirvana everyone in government thinks they are. When oil gets back to $150 a gallon, they may become financially viable, but until then...! Actually high gas prices will solve a plethora of problems - more car/van pooling, fewer cars on the roads, less congestion on the roads, fewer cars manufactured, more people using public transportation (for which we already pay billions in taxes to subsidize, whether we use it or not), more people riding motorcycles and bicycles, more people walking (nobody walks in L.A.), we all might even lose a few pounds, so less obesity and lower health costs, less dependence on foreign oil (less money for terrorist), etc., etc., etc. Ironically society screamed when gas prices were higher than what we were used to and the politicians responded in kind. What a catch 22!!! Gary Boy, are these comments going to get everybody off subject or what?!!! --- On Wed, 6/17/09, George Leibert wrote: From: George Leibert Subject: Re: [Tigers] Drag Racers, Watch Out!!! Not Tiger! To: "Tiger List" Date: Wednesday, June 17, 2009, 1:51 AM Now this is an "ELECTRIC CAR!" Would not like to go against this bad boy! Have a nice day!!! This car is really impressive. Check out this video. 11 Second Electric Car? If a little guy in a home garage can make this, what should all the big car makers be doing in all their giant labs??? If this isn't absolutely pathetic! What have all the Detroit automakers been doing! What a joke! No wonder they are going under! Check this out. www.opb.org/programs/ofg/videos/view/56-Electric-Drag-Racing Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 18 01:02:59 2009 From: Gary To: Tiger List Date: Thu, 18 Jun 2009 00:02:18 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Tigers] Drag Racers, Watch Out!!! Not Tiger! Oops. I meant $150 a barrel. --- On Wed, 6/17/09, Gary wrote: From: Gary Subject: Re: [Tigers] Drag Racers, Watch Out!!! Not Tiger! To: "Tiger List" Date: Wednesday, June 17, 2009, 11:57 PM This is an awesome car!!! However, as usual, these people never take into account all the chemicals and energy required to manufacture the batteries, let alone to recycle them. All storage and conversion of energy has some kind and amount of parasitic loss. Granted, the actual driving time creates practically no emissions, but the fabrication is hazardous and energy intensive. Why is that never figured into the environmental pollution equation? And can you imagine the size of the power grid necessary if all of Los Angeles had to plug in every night?!!! And what about all the batteries that would have to be manufactured and recycled?!!! And what about all the chemical spills from all the accidents from all the crazy drivers we have here in L.A.?!!! and what about ... you get the picture. A friend of mine just finished converting an S10 pickup to electric. It's got lots of torque, but it's a trade off between performance and longevity. He's hoping to gingerly get 50 miles per charge. His 22 batteries weigh 72 lbs apiece and cost $7,500 and have to be changed every 3 three years and he still has to pay for the nightly electricity. I am not against electric vehicles. I just don't think they're the nirvana everyone in government thinks they are. When oil gets back to $150 a barrel, they may become financially viable, but until then...! Actually high gas prices will solve a plethora of problems - more car/van pooling, fewer cars on the roads, less congestion on the roads, fewer cars manufactured, more people using public transportation (for which we already pay billions in taxes to subsidize, whether we use it or not), more people riding motorcycles and bicycles, more people walking (nobody walks in L.A.), we all might even lose a few pounds, so less obesity and lower health costs, less dependence on foreign oil (less money for terrorist), etc., etc., etc. Ironically society screamed when gas prices were higher than what we were used to and the politicians responded in kind. What a catch 22!!! Gary Boy, are these comments going to get everybody off subject or what?!!! _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 18 08:00:38 2009 From: "Rense, Mark (GE Indust, ConsInd)" To: "J. Nichols" Date: Thu, 18 Jun 2009 09:59:28 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Who Or What Killed the Electric Car? You will be Jeff, Hey, watch it there, buddy! I resent you implying that our CEO was the product of a tryst between a great aviation heroine and a fictitious creature when we all know it was the outcome of a union between Charles Lindbergh and a Wookiee named Layemalloff while they were caught in a inter-dimensional sub-space rift! So there! -----Original Message----- From: J. Nichols >snip Let me check some conspiracy web sites........................................... it seems that Area 51 is involved along with Sasquatch.....................Ameilia Erhart and Sasquatch once dated in Area 51 and their offspring is the CEO of Exxon and General Electric thus explaining the conspiracy against the electric car. Jeff _______________________________________________ _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 18 08:03:09 2009 From: "spook01" To: "Gary" , "Tiger List" Date: Thu, 18 Jun 2009 09:02:41 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Drag Racers, Watch Out!!! Not Tiger! and don't forget that nickel is a VERY bad thing in the eco system. Ray "Everyone wants to live at the expense of the state. They forget that the state lives at the expense of everyone." --French economist, statesman and author Frederic Bastiat (1801-1850) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gary" To: "Tiger List" Sent: Thursday, June 18, 2009 1:57 AM Subject: Re: [Tigers] Drag Racers, Watch Out!!! Not Tiger! > This is an awesome car!!! However, as usual, these people never take into > account all the chemicals and energy required to manufacture the > batteries, > let alone to recycler them. All storage and conversion of energy has some > kind > and amount of parasitic loss. Granted, the actual driving time creates > practically no emissions, but the fabrication is hazardous and energy > intensive. Why is that never figured into the environmental pollution > equation? And can you imagine the size of the power grid necessary if all > of > Los Angeles had to plug in every night?!!! And what about all the > batteries > that would have to be manufactured and recycled?!!! And what about all the > chemical spills from all the accidents from all the crazy drivers we have > here > in L.A.?!!! and what about ... you get the picture. > A friend of mine just finished converting an S10 pickup to electric. It's > got > lots of torque, but it's a trade off between performance and longevity. > He's > hoping to gingerly get 50 miles per charge. His 22 batteries weigh 72 lbs > apiece and cost $7,500 and have to be changed every 3 three years and he > still > has to pay for the nightly electricity. > I am not against electric vehicles. I just don't think they're the nirvana > everyone in government thinks they are. When oil gets back to $150 a > gallon, > they may become financially viable, but until then...! Actually high gas > prices will solve a plethora of problems - more car/van pooling, fewer > cars on > the roads, less congestion on the roads, fewer cars manufactured, more > people > using public transportation (for which we already pay billions in taxes to > subsidize, whether we use it or not), more people riding motorcycles and > bicycles, more people walking (nobody walks in L.A.), we all might even > lose a > few pounds, so less obesity and lower health costs, less dependence on > foreign > oil (less money for terrorist), etc., etc., etc. Ironically society > screamed > when gas prices were higher than what we were used to and the politicians > responded in kind. What a catch 22!!! > Gary > Boy, are these comments going to get everybody off subject or what?!!! > > > > --- On Wed, 6/17/09, George Leibert wrote: > > From: George Leibert > Subject: Re: [Tigers] Drag Racers, Watch Out!!! Not Tiger! > To: "Tiger List" > Date: Wednesday, June 17, 2009, 1:51 AM > > Now this is an "ELECTRIC CAR!" > > > > Would not like to go against this bad boy! > > > > Have a nice day!!! > > > > This car is really impressive. Check out this video. > > 11 Second Electric Car? > > If a little guy in a home garage can make this, what should all the big > car > makers be doing in all their giant labs??? > > If this isn't absolutely pathetic! > > > > What have all the Detroit automakers been doing! > > > > What a joke! > > No wonder they are going under! > > Check this out. > > www.opb.org/programs/ofg/videos/view/56-Electric-Drag-Racing > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 18 08:12:58 2009 From: "Smit, Theo" To: "Gary" , "Tiger List" Date: Thu, 18 Jun 2009 08:12:46 -0600 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Drag Racers, Watch Out!!! Not Tiger! You know what irks me? I have a Toyota Echo as a daily driver, that I bought used. It's totally awesome for the job... It gets about 45 miles per US gallon, it's small on the outside and big enough inside that I can pick up the kids or a ten foot piece of bar stock. But recently I got a letter from my insurance that they're offering discounts for people that drive hybrids, because they're "green". Any kind of hybrid... But as far as I know, the only hybrids that will actually beat the mileage I get are the Honda Insight and the Prius. And both of those will have significantly higher operating cost and environmental impact than the Echo, to say nothing of what the fullsize hybrids will require. So really, the insurance company is inducing people to spend more money on a new car, that has significant environmental impact. They ought to be teaching people how to take care of their older cars so that they run as clean as possible and to get maximum life out of what's already been built. At the same time, it's good that electric drives are finally getting some exposure, and it's even better that there are people doing hot-rod conversions and showing the performance potential even if it's only in a straight line. Racing improves the breed. Cheers, Theo > -----Original Message----- > From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net > [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Gary > Sent: June 18, 2009 1:02 AM > To: Tiger List > Subject: Re: [Tigers] Drag Racers, Watch Out!!! Not Tiger! > > Oops. I meant $150 a barrel. > > --- On Wed, 6/17/09, Gary wrote: > > From: Gary > Subject: Re: [Tigers] Drag Racers, Watch Out!!! Not Tiger! > To: "Tiger List" > Date: Wednesday, June 17, 2009, 11:57 PM > > This is an awesome car!!! However, as usual, these people > never take into account all the chemicals and energy required > to manufacture the batteries, let alone to recycle them. All > storage and conversion of energy has some kind and amount of > parasitic loss. Granted, the actual driving time creates _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 18 12:27:03 2009 From: "Thomas Witt" To: Date: Thu, 18 Jun 2009 10:20:25 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Drag Racers, Watch Out!!! Not Tiger! Sitting in my shed is the motor/control system etc. out of a 1981 Jet Industries Electrica 007. http://jetelectrica007.blogspot.com/ I paid all of $102 out the door for it at a Pick A Part 50% off sale. When the cheapest gas hit $4.59 here in California last year it sure was tempting to proceed. Of course at the cost of setting my 10 year Tiger project back further. The two holdbacks are the need for an early 80's Rabbit or early 80's Chrysler econo car and batterie$. Both cars used the same VW transmission (1.7 engine) that the engine plate is built for. Ironically both VW and Chrysler made mini pick up trucks (put batteries in the bed) that would have the same (correct) transmission and allow for good weight distribution. I would sure like to get one of those. While finding one is getting harder to do (the VW's are often diesel and command a price) it is the battery cost ($2,000+ for 20, 6 volt, lead acid, batteries) that is the real holdback. As best I can tell the last only about 2 years and then need to be replaced. Theo had a lot of well thought out things to say regarding the "reality" of an electric vehicle. To that end I drive a '91 Mazda 323 that car also get 42-45 MPG at 55 MPH. And, even at the highest gas prices it didn't justify the battery cost and their short life. FYI that Lipo pack the guy in the video ran was probably 10's of thousands of dollars and they do have a propensity to ignite under certain conditions. Ask any R/C hobbiest. So, point of source power pollution, battery construction related pollution, power distribution, limited range are just a few of the things to be factored in (Liberal politicians take notice). Still for those who find interest a very cool thing to do as a hobbiest. Tom _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 18 13:50:11 2009 From: To: "Rense, Mark (GE Indust, ConsInd)" Date: Thu, 18 Jun 2009 12:49:55 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Who Or What Killed the Electric Car? You will be Layemalloff, isn't he also known as "Neutron" Jack Welch, the progenitor of Iminentmeltdown? Rob Hogan B382001560 GEAE was ME til 93 --- mark.rense@ge.com wrote: From: "Rense, Mark (GE Indust, ConsInd)" To: "J. Nichols" Cc: tigers@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Tigers] Who Or What Killed the Electric Car? You will be amazed and astonished! Date: Thu, 18 Jun 2009 09:59:28 -0400 Jeff, Hey, watch it there, buddy! I resent you implying that our CEO was the product of a tryst between a great aviation heroine and a fictitious creature when we all know it was the outcome of a union between Charles Lindbergh and a Wookiee named Layemalloff while they were caught in a inter-dimensional sub-space rift! So there! -----Original Message----- From: J. Nichols >snip Let me check some conspiracy web sites........................................... it seems that Area 51 is involved along with Sasquatch.....................Ameilia Erhart and Sasquatch once dated in Area 51 and their offspring is the CEO of Exxon and General Electric thus explaining the conspiracy against the electric car. Jeff _______________________________________________ Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 18 19:33:35 2009 From: "Robert Neeley" To: Date: Thu, 18 Jun 2009 18:32:58 -0700 Subject: [Tigers] Hardtop color I am about to do a complete repaint of my Tiger to its original color, including the hardtop. I know/think/believe that the hardtops were originally available only in black, although I have seen many/most painted to match body color. What is the 'correct' color scheme to maintain originality? Were the black hardtops intended to be painted or remain black regardless of body color? Thanks! _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 18 19:48:30 2009 From: "Joe Brown" To: "'Robert Neeley'" , Date: Thu, 18 Jun 2009 20:46:38 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Hardtop color Mine is still original and has a gloss black finish. It doesn't look like it was intended to be painted over. But I'm sure some original owners might have requested that their dealers spray it to match the car. Thanks, Joe Brown B382000217 -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Robert Neeley Sent: Thursday, June 18, 2009 8:33 PM To: tigers@autox.team.net Subject: [Tigers] Hardtop color I am about to do a complete repaint of my Tiger to its original color, including the hardtop. I know/think/believe that the hardtops were originally available only in black, although I have seen many/most painted to match body color. What is the 'correct' color scheme to maintain originality? Were the black hardtops intended to be painted or remain black regardless of body color? Thanks! Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 18 19:56:25 2009 From: "John R. Engle" To: "Tiger Board" Date: Thu, 18 Jun 2009 21:55:51 -0400 Subject: [Tigers] (Tigers) Hardtop color If your Tiger/Alpine came from the factory with an optional hardtop it was painted the body color. Hardtops that were sold out of the parts room were black. John Engle _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 18 19:58:09 2009 From: michael king To: Joe Brown Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 11:57:51 +1000 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Hardtop color If you bought a top from a dealer after buying the car.. or on the day of purchasing the car the factoy supplied them as black. A dealer could paint them to match the car. Now.. I believe if you ordered the car in adavance with a hardtop it came in body colour as with GT alpine.. the top would match the car. 2009/6/19 Joe Brown > Mine is still original and has a gloss black finish. It doesn't look like > it was intended to be painted over. But I'm sure some original owners > might > have requested that their dealers spray it to match the car. > > Thanks, > Joe Brown > B382000217 > > -----Original Message----- > From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] > On Behalf Of Robert Neeley > Sent: Thursday, June 18, 2009 8:33 PM > To: tigers@autox.team.net > Subject: [Tigers] Hardtop color > > I am about to do a complete repaint of my Tiger to its original color, > including the hardtop. I know/think/believe that the hardtops were > originally available only in black, although I have seen many/most painted > to match body color. What is the 'correct' color scheme to maintain > originality? Were the black hardtops intended to be painted or remain > black > regardless of body color? > > Thanks! > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive > -- Regards Michael King _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 18 20:00:39 2009 From: "Robert Neeley" To: "John R. Engle" , "Tiger Board" Date: Thu, 18 Jun 2009 19:00:35 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] (Tigers) Hardtop color Thanks! Was there variation in the headliner color as well? -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net]On Behalf Of John R. Engle Sent: Thursday, June 18, 2009 6:56 PM To: Tiger Board Subject: [Tigers] (Tigers) Hardtop color If your Tiger/Alpine came from the factory with an optional hardtop it was painted the body color. Hardtops that were sold out of the parts room were black. John Engle Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 18 20:03:41 2009 From: michael king To: Robert Neeley Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 12:02:11 +1000 Subject: Re: [Tigers] (Tigers) Hardtop color headliner is always white 2009/6/19 Robert Neeley > Thanks! > > Was there variation in the headliner color as well? > > -----Original Message----- > From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net > [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net]On Behalf Of John R. Engle > Sent: Thursday, June 18, 2009 6:56 PM > To: Tiger Board > Subject: [Tigers] (Tigers) Hardtop color > > > If your Tiger/Alpine came from the factory with an optional hardtop it was > painted the body color. Hardtops that were sold out of the parts room were > black. > > John Engle > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive > -- Regards Michael King _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 18 21:42:24 2009 From: " Ron Fraser" To: "'Robert Neeley'" , "'John R. Engle'" Date: Thu, 18 Jun 2009 23:41:55 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] (Tigers) Hardtop color Robert Rootes Publication 6600992 Alpine Parts lists the Headliner for the Hardtop as follows: Light Grey Vynair Light Grey Perforated Vynide I believe the Tiger listing is the same. Ron Fraser -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Robert Neeley Sent: Thursday, June 18, 2009 10:01 PM To: John R. Engle; Tiger Board Subject: Re: [Tigers] (Tigers) Hardtop color Thanks! Was there variation in the headliner color as well? _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 18 21:50:11 2009 From: "spook01" To: "Smit, Theo" , "Gary" Date: Thu, 18 Jun 2009 22:50:06 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Drag Racers, Watch Out!!! Not Tiger! well, here in Nashville we have algore preaching about "global warming" -the kind that happens every summer- while he tools around in his diesel houseboat. and, no it isn't bio diesel... Best, Ray "The U.N. is a place where governments opposed to free speech demand to be heard." - Alfred E. Neuman ----- Original Message ----- From: "Smit, Theo" To: "Gary" ; "Tiger List" Sent: Thursday, June 18, 2009 9:12 AM Subject: Re: [Tigers] Drag Racers, Watch Out!!! Not Tiger! > You know what irks me? I have a Toyota Echo as a daily driver, that I > bought used. It's totally awesome for the job... It gets about 45 miles > per US gallon, it's small on the outside and big enough inside that I > can pick up the kids or a ten foot piece of bar stock. But recently I > got a letter from my insurance that they're offering discounts for > people that drive hybrids, because they're "green". Any kind of > hybrid... But as far as I know, the only hybrids that will actually beat > the mileage I get are the Honda Insight and the Prius. And both of those > will have significantly higher operating cost and environmental impact > than the Echo, to say nothing of what the fullsize hybrids will require. > So really, the insurance company is inducing people to spend more money > on a new car, that has significant environmental impact. They ought to > be teaching people how to take care of their older cars so that they run > as clean as possible and to get maximum life out of what's already been > built. > > At the same time, it's good that electric drives are finally getting > some exposure, and it's even better that there are people doing hot-rod > conversions and showing the performance potential even if it's only in a > straight line. Racing improves the breed. > > Cheers, > Theo > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net >> [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Gary >> Sent: June 18, 2009 1:02 AM >> To: Tiger List >> Subject: Re: [Tigers] Drag Racers, Watch Out!!! Not Tiger! >> >> Oops. I meant $150 a barrel. >> >> --- On Wed, 6/17/09, Gary wrote: >> >> From: Gary >> Subject: Re: [Tigers] Drag Racers, Watch Out!!! Not Tiger! >> To: "Tiger List" >> Date: Wednesday, June 17, 2009, 11:57 PM >> >> This is an awesome car!!! However, as usual, these people >> never take into account all the chemicals and energy required >> to manufacture the batteries, let alone to recycle them. All >> storage and conversion of energy has some kind and amount of >> parasitic loss. Granted, the actual driving time creates > > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 18 21:51:15 2009 From: "spook01" To: "Gary" , "Tiger List" Date: Thu, 18 Jun 2009 22:51:12 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Drag Racers, Watch Out!!! Not Tiger! so, that would make a trip to san diego take three days. counting recharge times. Best, Ray "The U.N. is a place where governments opposed to free speech demand to be heard." - Alfred E. Neuman ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gary" To: "Tiger List" Sent: Thursday, June 18, 2009 1:57 AM Subject: Re: [Tigers] Drag Racers, Watch Out!!! Not Tiger! > This is an awesome car!!! However, as usual, these people never take into > account all the chemicals and energy required to manufacture the > batteries, > let alone to recycler them. All storage and conversion of energy has some > kind > and amount of parasitic loss. Granted, the actual driving time creates > practically no emissions, but the fabrication is hazardous and energy > intensive. Why is that never figured into the environmental pollution > equation? And can you imagine the size of the power grid necessary if all > of > Los Angeles had to plug in every night?!!! And what about all the > batteries > that would have to be manufactured and recycled?!!! And what about all the > chemical spills from all the accidents from all the crazy drivers we have > here > in L.A.?!!! and what about ... you get the picture. > A friend of mine just finished converting an S10 pickup to electric. It's > got > lots of torque, but it's a trade off between performance and longevity. > He's > hoping to gingerly get 50 miles per charge. His 22 batteries weigh 72 lbs > apiece and cost $7,500 and have to be changed every 3 three years and he > still > has to pay for the nightly electricity. > I am not against electric vehicles. I just don't think they're the nirvana > everyone in government thinks they are. When oil gets back to $150 a > gallon, > they may become financially viable, but until then...! Actually high gas > prices will solve a plethora of problems - more car/van pooling, fewer > cars on > the roads, less congestion on the roads, fewer cars manufactured, more > people > using public transportation (for which we already pay billions in taxes to > subsidize, whether we use it or not), more people riding motorcycles and > bicycles, more people walking (nobody walks in L.A.), we all might even > lose a > few pounds, so less obesity and lower health costs, less dependence on > foreign > oil (less money for terrorist), etc., etc., etc. Ironically society > screamed > when gas prices were higher than what we were used to and the politicians > responded in kind. What a catch 22!!! > Gary > Boy, are these comments going to get everybody off subject or what?!!! > > > > --- On Wed, 6/17/09, George Leibert wrote: > > From: George Leibert > Subject: Re: [Tigers] Drag Racers, Watch Out!!! Not Tiger! > To: "Tiger List" > Date: Wednesday, June 17, 2009, 1:51 AM > > Now this is an "ELECTRIC CAR!" > > > > Would not like to go against this bad boy! > > > > Have a nice day!!! > > > > This car is really impressive. Check out this video. > > 11 Second Electric Car? > > If a little guy in a home garage can make this, what should all the big > car > makers be doing in all their giant labs??? > > If this isn't absolutely pathetic! > > > > What have all the Detroit automakers been doing! > > > > What a joke! > > No wonder they are going under! > > Check this out. > > www.opb.org/programs/ofg/videos/view/56-Electric-Drag-Racing > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 18 21:53:45 2009 From: "spook01" To: "michael king" Date: Thu, 18 Jun 2009 22:53:42 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tigers] shelby recognition i like the early 289 cars, myself. more delicate beauty, and more balanced, though the 427 was very surprising in that regard. Best, Ray ----- Original Message ----- From: michael king To: spook01 Cc: Clyde McLaughlin ; tigers@autox.team.net Sent: Wednesday, June 17, 2009 6:44 PM Subject: Re: [Tigers] shelby recognition I guess there is always an original spec Kirkam 427? I personally ama big fan of the 289 FIA cars.. brutish and agressive but a bit more delicate than the 427 they spawned 2009/6/18 spook01 well, i finally got to drive a real 427 s/c cobra last weekend. it isn't faster than light. but light DOES shift toward the red spectrum as you begin to gain on it!! pretty puzzling, though. third pulls like first. so does fourth. forge the tach, you don't have time to read it; and besides the phone poles are rushing by too fast.... now i just have to come up with 600k to get one. wonder if my wife would mind sleeping in the trunk? Ray ----- Original Message ----- From: "Clyde McLaughlin" To: Sent: Tuesday, June 16, 2009 7:17 PM Subject: [Tigers] shelby recognition Hi Listers, having noted some varying opinions about Ole Carroll, yes he sure new how to make money, few did in the fifties and sixties.. They used to say the way to a small forture in racing was to start with a big one..But now with Nascar I guess that's not all true..anyway, I used to have an early GT350 in the 70's when the shelby club first started, most members were do it yourselfers and the car were very personalized, if you went to a show you didn't see 50 cars all alike, and you did not need tobe a millionaire to partake in club activeties, having recently bought my third Tiger I rejoined the club at a great price and then noted they did away with the news letter and magizine, and the price to attend the last nation meet was to much for me, I did not renew my membership, enough said...but the reason for this note was to mention an exibit at the Saratoga Auto Museum in NY, that featured Shelby, the Ford Connection, this was written up in Autoweek, jan 31, 2005...Tiger's were given mention and my car when owned by George Izett was on display..So I guess we can all decide as has been mentioned before...but I must say the Tiger group seems to be much more connected to their cars than the newer Cobra/Shelby owners who are all about value, investment etc. I hope the value holds, Clyde MK1A _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive -- Regards Michael King _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 18 22:03:49 2009 From: "spook01" To: , "Tiger List" Date: Thu, 18 Jun 2009 23:03:47 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Drag Racers, Watch Out!!! Not Tiger! I guess you heard that Area 51 is full of electric, nuclear, hydrogen and cold fusion cars stolen from small inventors who were killed by black ops teams for inventing something the Detroit muscle couldn't. add that to the 200 mile per gallon carbs secreted away in the 40's and 50's along with little aliens and you get an idea of the magnitude of the conspiracy! did I mention a black helicopter is on the roof now, and they are rappelling down to stop me fro ----- Original Message ----- From: "George Leibert" To: "Tiger List" Sent: Wednesday, June 17, 2009 3:51 AM Subject: Re: [Tigers] Drag Racers, Watch Out!!! Not Tiger! > Now this is an "ELECTRIC CAR!" > > > > Would not like to go against this bad boy! > > > > Have a nice day!!! > > > > This car is really impressive. Check out this video. > > 11 Second Electric Car? > > If a little guy in a home garage can make this, what should all the big > car > makers be doing in all their giant labs??? > > If this isn't absolutely pathetic! > > > > What have all the Detroit automakers been doing! > > > > What a joke! > > No wonder they are going under! > > Check this out. > > www.opb.org/programs/ofg/videos/view/56-Electric-Drag-Racing > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 19 05:26:58 2009 From: "rande" To: robertn@surewest.net Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 07:26:27 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] hard top colors Robert, I would use Ron Frasers info on the headliner colors. I had a discussion with Norm Miller about how hardtops were delivered. He maintains that they were all shipped black. I have a couple of photos, one a press photo showing a Tiger 1 with matching hard top, and the other showing delivery of new 1966 Tiger's to a Madison, WI dealer with what to me look like matching hardtops. To be fair to Norm,he has the same photo, and he insists it doesn't match and is black. As for whether the black tops were meant to be used black or were prepped for repaint, they had the same finish as the rest of the car, but of course a body shop could prep them for a color change, like any other painted surface on the car. I have a black top, but my 1A started out as Embassy Black. According to the latest versions of the Canadian and European Tiger 2 sales folders, you could get a like-painted hard top if you ordered it when you ordered the car, or black from a dealer. Rande _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 19 06:36:19 2009 From: " Ron Fraser" To: , Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 08:35:45 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] hard top colors Robert This is a case of it's your car, paint it the way you want. Your way will be accepted by us all. I like the contrasting color between BRG and the black top on my Tiger. If the car was black I'm not sure off hand what color I would want the hardtop. White or red come to mind first but pearl white might just win in my case. It's hard to call when not in that situation. Headliners are available from SS and others in several colors. The headliner in my hardtop is an off white with small black dots. Ron Fraser -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of rande Sent: Friday, June 19, 2009 7:26 AM To: robertn@surewest.net Cc: tigers@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Tigers] hard top colors Robert, I would use Ron Frasers info on the headliner colors. I had a discussion with Norm Miller about how hardtops were delivered. He maintains that they were all shipped black. I have a couple of photos, one a press photo showing a Tiger 1 with matching hard top, and the other showing delivery of new 1966 Tiger's to a Madison, WI dealer with what to me look like matching hardtops. To be fair to Norm,he has the same photo, and he insists it doesn't match and is black. As for whether the black tops were meant to be used black or were prepped for repaint, they had the same finish as the rest of the car, but of course a body shop could prep them for a color change, like any other painted surface on the car. I have a black top, but my 1A started out as Embassy Black. According to the latest versions of the Canadian and European Tiger 2 sales folders, you could get a like-painted hard top if you ordered it when you ordered the car, or black from a dealer. Rande Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.374 / Virus Database: 270.12.78/2185 - Release Date: 06/18/09 05:53:00 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 19 07:10:50 2009 From: jd.sencindiver@gmail.com To: Ron Fraser Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 13:10:40 +0000 Subject: Re: [Tigers] hard top colors The "Works" rally Tigers were carnival red with a white hard top. I think they looked pretty sharp. I've seen other cars (a 66 GTO comes to mind) that were red with a white (convertible) top that looked pretty good as well. One of these days I'm going to paint my black hard top white to emulate the works paint scheme on my carnival red Mk II. Jim Sencindiver B382100451/TAC 448 http://www.tigersunited.com/car_show/sencindiver_j/default.asp _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 19 08:16:28 2009 From: Tony Somebody To: Beamclub Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 07:16:10 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Tigers] axle shims As per the norm, Im always working on my car the dy Im suppose to be leaving- this time for SUNI. I just replaced the axle bearings and I have serious back problems, so I took several days to do the entire project plus chasing down orgianl type seals isnt easy either. I wasnt sure where the shims went on the axle and the shop mannual didnt have a very good pic. The book also said there should be equal thickness of shims on each side. well, my car had one shim that was made from 1/4 " plate and a few thin ones- i didnt use it when I put the axles back in. The book also says ther should be .006 to .008 of what Im going to cal endplay- back and forth of the axle - whatever that is. When I left the shop this moring, after working all night( stop laughing DaddyTiger) th Tiger was purring. It hasnt be driven in a long time and suddenly I had a noise coming from the rear end. Im goin to try to locate it but Im a bit afraid to drive it. I left out the thick shim becuse what the shop man. said about equal ammounts of shims per side and too, it looked home made and had a different size hole in its center. It might be low on rearend lube- so Im starting there- maybe a brake came loose so i will check that or maybe its a Ujoint- Ok, i didnt spin the tirs but I did wind second gear out. I went first to buy gas, then headed home- all was fine for about a mile- then I slowd down to go on the square( midwest towns have a square in their center- along w/ the courthouse) and the knck started- i pulled over becuse it sounded like a flat tire- wrong there. I went on home and the knock went along with my speed- the faster I went, the faster it knocked- I didnt go fast tho for fear of tearing something up- any advice is welcome and knowledge about the shims is alos GOOD. I have until noon tomorrow to have the Tiger at the StLois airport to pick up a hitchiker going to SD and if I dont show up, my arse is kicked. Im so tierd I cant think and my front end shop , who I made an appointment with for this a.m. is closed yeaterday and today- Whay I was told to bring the Tiger in is beyound me. Throw me some ideas please. especially anyone who has had hands on doing this job themselves. With luck I put a brake spring on wrong and it came off and the brake shoe is the noise or maybe the key is hitting something as I cleaned it up extremely better than it was. AND, its the hottest day of the year so far in souuthern IL. or even Mo. Im melting down and I have to go to SUNI. Norman say. Use my blood for brake fluid, make gaskest out of my skin- I have to go to SUNI- Norman say.Buy gasoline with my change, I gotta go to SUNI, Norman say.I have to meet my west cost friends and drink beer Im sure, I gotta go to SUNI, Norman say.If the car doesnt go, what will i do? Norman didnt tell me but I gotta go to SUNI, Schriner say. TtT _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 19 08:54:43 2009 From: " Ron Fraser" To: "'Tony Somebody'" , "'Beamclub'" Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 10:54:11 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] axle shims Tony First get some rest and clear your head. Now inspect the rear brakes for a broken spring or something out of place. Also check for anything loose or maybe rubbing in the driveline and suspension. I can't help you with any shim information. I have always farmed that work out to experts. Have fun at SUNI I wanted to go but its not possible this time. Ron Fraser -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Tony Somebody Sent: Friday, June 19, 2009 10:16 AM To: Beamclub Subject: [Tigers] axle shims As per the norm, Im always working on my car the dy Im suppose to be leaving- this time for SUNI. I just replaced the axle bearings and I have serious back problems, so I took several days to do the entire project plus chasing down orgianl type seals isnt easy either. I wasnt sure where the shims went on the axle and the shop mannual didnt have a very good pic. The book also said there should be equal thickness of shims on each side. well, my car had one shim that was made from 1/4 " plate and a few thin ones- i didnt use it when I put the axles back in. The book also says ther should be .006 to .008 of what Im going to cal endplay- back and forth of the axle - whatever that is. When I left the shop this moring, after working all night( stop laughing DaddyTiger) th Tiger was purring. It hasnt be driven in a long time and suddenly I had a noise coming from the rear end. Im goin to try to locate it but Im a bit afraid to drive it. I left out the thick shim becuse what the shop man. said about equal ammounts of shims per side and too, it looked home made and had a different size hole in its center. It might be low on rearend lube- so Im starting there- maybe a brake came loose so i will check that or maybe its a Ujoint- Ok, i didnt spin the tirs but I did wind second gear out. I went first to buy gas, then headed home- all was fine for about a mile- then I slowd down to go on the square( midwest towns have a square in their center- along w/ the courthouse) and the knck started- i pulled over becuse it sounded like a flat tire- wrong there. I went on home and the knock went along with my speed- the faster I went, the faster it knocked- I didnt go fast tho for fear of tearing something up- any advice is welcome and knowledge about the shims is alos GOOD. I have until noon tomorrow to have the Tiger at the StLois airport to pick up a hitchiker going to SD and if I dont show up, my arse is kicked. Im so tierd I cant think and my front end shop , who I made an appointment with for this a.m. is closed yeaterday and today- Whay I was told to bring the Tiger in is beyound me. Throw me some ideas please. especially anyone who has had hands on doing this job themselves. With luck I put a brake spring on wrong and it came off and the brake shoe is the noise or maybe the key is hitting something as I cleaned it up extremely better than it was. AND, its the hottest day of the year so far in souuthern IL. or even Mo. Im melting down and I have to go to SUNI. Norman say. Use my blood for brake fluid, make gaskest out of my skin- I have to go to SUNI- Norman say.Buy gasoline with my change, I gotta go to SUNI, Norman say.I have to meet my west cost friends and drink beer Im sure, I gotta go to SUNI, Norman say.If the car doesnt go, what will i do? Norman didnt tell me but I gotta go to SUNI, Schriner say. TtT _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.374 / Virus Database: 270.12.78/2185 - Release Date: 06/19/09 06:53:00 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 19 09:04:27 2009 From: Owain Lloyd To: Tony Somebody Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 10:03:33 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tigers] axle shims tony, it sounds like one of the nightmares i manage to create for myself by constantly underestimating what is involved in a job! when i did my rear end, i used the same shims that were already in there. it probably isn't right and its on my list to address that again but there doesn't seem like too much play in it. i tried to measure the end float but its not so easy. if the knock is speed dependent, it doesn't sounds like its related to the shims so i'd look at the UJs (mark them with correction fluid or paint to see if they move), the brake pistons and shoes (these are not too well secured at the best of times) and anything that could be catching around there. i hope you make it to SUNI one way or another as i've managed to arrange that i'll be there on sunday and monday. get some rest and good luck! - owain. On Fri, Jun 19, 2009 at 9:16 AM, Tony Somebody wrote: > As per the norm, Im always working on my car the dy Im suppose to be > leaving- this time for SUNI. I just replaced the axle bearings and I have > serious back problems, so I took several days to do the entire project plus > chasing down orgianl type seals isnt easy either. I wasnt sure where the > shims went on the axle and the shop mannual didnt have a very good pic. The > book also said there should be equal thickness of shims on each side. well, > my car had one shim that was made from 1/4 " plate and a few thin ones- i > didnt use it when I put the axles back in. The book also says ther should be > .006 to .008 of what Im going to cal endplay- back and forth of the axle - > whatever that is. When I left the shop this moring, after working all night( > stop laughing DaddyTiger) th Tiger was purring. It hasnt be driven in a long > time and suddenly I had a noise coming from the rear end. Im goin to try to > locate it but Im a bit afraid to drive it. I left out the thick shim > becuse what the shop man. said about equal ammounts of shims per side and > too, it looked home made and had a different size hole in its center. It > might be low on rearend lube- so Im starting there- maybe a brake came loose > so i will check that or maybe its a Ujoint- Ok, i didnt spin the tirs but I > did wind second gear out. I went first to buy gas, then headed home- all was > fine for about a mile- then I slowd down to go on the square( midwest towns > have a square in their center- along w/ the courthouse) and the knck > started- i pulled over becuse it sounded like a flat tire- wrong there. I > went on home and the knock went along with my speed- the faster I went, the > faster it knocked- I didnt go fast tho for fear of tearing something up- any > advice is welcome and knowledge about the shims is alos GOOD. I have until > noon tomorrow to have the Tiger at the StLois airport to pick up a hitchiker > going to SD and if I dont show up, my arse is kicked. Im so tierd > I cant think and my front end shop , who I made an appointment with for > this a.m. is closed yeaterday and today- Whay I was told to bring the Tiger > in is beyound me. Throw me some ideas please. especially anyone who has had > hands on doing this job themselves. With luck I put a brake spring on wrong > and it came off and the brake shoe is the noise or maybe the key is hitting > something as I cleaned it up extremely better than it was. AND, its the > hottest day of the year so far in souuthern IL. or even Mo. Im melting down > and I have to go to SUNI. Norman say. Use my blood for brake fluid, make > gaskest out of my skin- I have to go to SUNI- Norman say.Buy gasoline with > my change, I gotta go to SUNI, Norman say.I have to meet my west cost > friends and drink beer Im sure, I gotta go to SUNI, Norman say.If the car > doesnt go, what will i do? Norman didnt tell me but I gotta go to SUNI, > Schriner say. > TtT > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 19 09:38:18 2009 From: "Robert Neeley" To: , Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 08:38:04 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] hard top colors Thanks for all the help! -----Original Message----- From: Ron Fraser [mailto:rfraser@bluefrog.com] Sent: Friday, June 19, 2009 5:36 AM To: rande@thecia.net; robertn@surewest.net Cc: tigers@autox.team.net Subject: RE: [Tigers] hard top colors Robert This is a case of it's your car, paint it the way you want. Your way will be accepted by us all. I like the contrasting color between BRG and the black top on my Tiger. If the car was black I'm not sure off hand what color I would want the hardtop. White or red come to mind first but pearl white might just win in my case. It's hard to call when not in that situation. Headliners are available from SS and others in several colors. The headliner in my hardtop is an off white with small black dots. Ron Fraser -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of rande Sent: Friday, June 19, 2009 7:26 AM To: robertn@surewest.net Cc: tigers@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Tigers] hard top colors Robert, I would use Ron Frasers info on the headliner colors. I had a discussion with Norm Miller about how hardtops were delivered. He maintains that they were all shipped black. I have a couple of photos, one a press photo showing a Tiger 1 with matching hard top, and the other showing delivery of new 1966 Tiger's to a Madison, WI dealer with what to me look like matching hardtops. To be fair to Norm,he has the same photo, and he insists it doesn't match and is black. As for whether the black tops were meant to be used black or were prepped for repaint, they had the same finish as the rest of the car, but of course a body shop could prep them for a color change, like any other painted surface on the car. I have a black top, but my 1A started out as Embassy Black. According to the latest versions of the Canadian and European Tiger 2 sales folders, you could get a like-painted hard top if you ordered it when you ordered the car, or black from a dealer. Rande Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.374 / Virus Database: 270.12.78/2185 - Release Date: 06/18/09 05:53:00 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 19 10:14:11 2009 From: "Paul R. Breuhan" To: , Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 12:13:46 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] hard top colors Robert, I agree with the paint it your way opinion ...it's not like you are cutting a sunroof hole in it or anything...paint can always be repainted! I have a white car and flip and flop between white body color and black...but then again someone cut a sunroof hole in my hardtop...so it will be a while before paint is applied. Paul > From: robertn@surewest.net > To: rfraser@bluefrog.com; rande@thecia.net > Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 08:38:04 -0700 > CC: tigers@autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Tigers] hard top colors > > Thanks for all the help! > > -----Original Message----- > From: Ron Fraser [mailto:rfraser@bluefrog.com] > Sent: Friday, June 19, 2009 5:36 AM > To: rande@thecia.net; robertn@surewest.net > Cc: tigers@autox.team.net > Subject: RE: [Tigers] hard top colors > > > Robert > This is a case of it's your car, paint it the way you want. Your > way will be accepted by us all. > > I like the contrasting color between BRG and the black top on my Tiger. If > the car was black I'm not sure off hand what color I would want the hardtop. > White or red come to mind first but pearl white might just win in my case. > It's hard to call when not in that situation. > > Headliners are available from SS and others in several colors. The > headliner in my hardtop is an off white with small black dots. > > Ron Fraser > > -----Original Message----- > From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] > On Behalf Of rande > Sent: Friday, June 19, 2009 7:26 AM > To: robertn@surewest.net > Cc: tigers@autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Tigers] hard top colors > > > Robert, > > I would use Ron Frasers info on the headliner colors. > > I had a discussion with Norm Miller about how hardtops were delivered. He > maintains that they were all shipped black. I have a couple of photos, one a > press photo showing a Tiger 1 with matching hard top, and the other showing > delivery of new 1966 Tiger's to a Madison, WI dealer with what to me look > like matching hardtops. To be fair to Norm,he has the same photo, and he > insists it doesn't match and is black. > > As for whether the black tops were meant to be used black or were prepped > for repaint, they had the same finish as the rest of the car, but of course > a body shop could prep them for a color change, like any other painted > surface on the car. I have a black top, but my 1A started out as Embassy > Black. > > According to the latest versions of the Canadian and European Tiger 2 sales > folders, you could get a like-painted hard top if you ordered it when you > ordered the car, or black from a dealer. > > Rande _________________________________________________________________ Bing brings you maps, menus, and reviews organized in one place. Try it now. http://www.bing.com/search?q=restaurants&form=MLOGEN&publ=WLHMTAG&crea=TEXT_M LOGEN_Core_tagline_local_1x1 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 19 10:25:06 2009 From: "Paul R. Breuhan" To: , Tigers Den Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 12:24:56 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] axle shims Son, Tony, Tony, Tony, you need to start earlier on these things... I have no particular advise on the shims. Just get some rest and approach it logically, starting with some of the good suggestions offered here, I know it can be hard when you are tired and your brain stops focusing....been there done that. I am looking forward to partying with you and your friend Mike....you said beer and munchies, right? Don't tell mom. Paul DaddyTiger P.S. next time call me and dear old dad will come down and help you out. > Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 07:16:10 -0700 > From: achd73@yahoo.com > To: tigers@autox.team.net > Subject: [Tigers] axle shims > > As per the norm, Im always working on my car the dy Im suppose to be leaving- this time for SUNI. I just replaced the axle bearings and I have serious back problems, so I took several days to do the entire project plus chasing down orgianl type seals isnt easy either. I wasnt sure where the shims went on the axle and the shop mannual didnt have a very good pic. The book also said there should be equal thickness of shims on each side. well, my car had one shim that was made from 1/4 " plate and a few thin ones- i didnt use it when I put the axles back in. The book also says ther should be .006 to .008 of what Im going to cal endplay- back and forth of the axle - whatever that is. When I left the shop this moring, after working all night( stop laughing DaddyTiger) th Tiger was purring. It hasnt be driven in a long time and suddenly I had a noise coming from the rear end. Im goin to try to locate it but Im a bit afraid to drive it. I left out the thick shim > becuse what the shop man. said about equal ammounts of shims per side and too, it looked home made and had a different size hole in its center. It might be low on rearend lube- so Im starting there- maybe a brake came loose so i will check that or maybe its a Ujoint- Ok, i didnt spin the tirs but I did wind second gear out. I went first to buy gas, then headed home- all was fine for about a mile- then I slowd down to go on the square( midwest towns have a square in their center- along w/ the courthouse) and the knck started- i pulled over becuse it sounded like a flat tire- wrong there. I went on home and the knock went along with my speed- the faster I went, the faster it knocked- I didnt go fast tho for fear of tearing something up- any advice is welcome and knowledge about the shims is alos GOOD. I have until noon tomorrow to have the Tiger at the StLois airport to pick up a hitchiker going to SD and if I dont show up, my arse is kicked. Im so tierd > I cant think and my front end shop , who I made an appointment with for this a.m. is closed yeaterday and today- Whay I was told to bring the Tiger in is beyound me. Throw me some ideas please. especially anyone who has had hands on doing this job themselves. With luck I put a brake spring on wrong and it came off and the brake shoe is the noise or maybe the key is hitting something as I cleaned it up extremely better than it was. AND, its the hottest day of the year so far in souuthern IL. or even Mo. Im melting down and I have to go to SUNI. Norman say. Use my blood for brake fluid, make gaskest out of my skin- I have to go to SUNI- Norman say.Buy gasoline with my change, I gotta go to SUNI, Norman say.I have to meet my west cost friends and drink beer Im sure, I gotta go to SUNI, Norman say.If the car doesnt go, what will i do? Norman didnt tell me but I gotta go to SUNI, Schriner say. > TtT _________________________________________________________________ Insert movie times and more without leaving Hotmail.. http://windowslive.com/Tutorial/Hotmail/QuickAdd?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Tutoria l_QuickAdd_062009 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 19 21:53:03 2009 From: "Thomas Witt" To: , "Tony Somebody" Date: Fri, 19 Jun 2009 20:52:41 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] axle shims Tony, The axle shims are used to set axle endplay. There is metal piece in the differential that basically transfers the bearing load when cornering. Axle I======= ( =) ==========I Axle Consider the ( ) as the differential and the equal sign inside the (= ) as the metal piece that transfers the axle load. There should be .006 to .008 which occurs between the axles and the metal piece in the differential. You measure this with a dial indicator on the hub. If you have too little endplay you can load the bearings and they can make noise. Assuming you used the same differential and axles I would thing putting it back together the way you found it (same shims, same location) would be appropriate. I reused my shims with a VERY thin film of silicone on each. While the recommended "centering" (with equal shims) is ideal I do not think it extremely critical. I think their main point was to not be lazy and set the endplay with shims only on one side. I guess there can be some situations where that metal piece can be too off center and cause issues. But to me it seems remote. So, sleep and then put the same shims back in the same location they came out of. After all that work for years, - Right? Tom _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 20 06:27:48 2009 From: Tony Somebody To: Beamclub Date: Sat, 20 Jun 2009 05:27:30 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Tigers] front end specs IF anyone is up early enough to help before I get to the front end shop__________-- my front end guy is on vacation and the noises I had was one- bad tie rod ends and two- loose wheel- I forgot to retorque after the car wasnon the ground and that was the biggest noise. The place doing the alingment out me off yesterady at my appointment tim- Dindt have enough info for his computer- I had two books but he couldnt read the part in hours or min utes, so Im there shortly. I was going to ask last night but my brain was dead and my body was running a close second. Any specs different than the books would be of help if I get it in time. THANKS for the recent help- Im heading to Suni as soon as the front end man says GO. TtT _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 20 08:21:06 2009 From: " Ron Fraser" To: "'Tony Somebody'" , "'Beamclub'" Date: Sat, 20 Jun 2009 10:18:24 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] front end specs Tony First you need to see what you have now. Latitude for setup is limited depending on your car. Stock settings are castor +3 degrees 50 min, camber +30 min, toe in 1/8" Street settings: castor +3 to +4 degrees, camber -.75 to -1 degree, toe in 1/16" If your already done; how did it come out? Glad you found most or all of the noises. Ron Fraser -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Tony Somebody Sent: Saturday, June 20, 2009 8:28 AM To: Beamclub Subject: [Tigers] front end specs IF anyone is up early enough to help before I get to the front end shop__________-- my front end guy is on vacation and the noises I had was one- bad tie rod ends and two- loose wheel- I forgot to retorque after the car wasnon the ground and that was the biggest noise. The place doing the alingment out me off yesterady at my appointment tim- Dindt have enough info for his computer- I had two books but he couldnt read the part in hours or min utes, so Im there shortly. I was going to ask last night but my brain was dead and my body was running a close second. Any specs different than the books would be of help if I get it in time. THANKS for the recent help- Im heading to Suni as soon as the front end man says GO. TtT Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.374 / Virus Database: 270.12.80/2187 - Release Date: 06/20/09 06:15:00 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 20 09:24:21 2009 From: Tony Somebody To: Beamclub , Will Seay Date: Sat, 20 Jun 2009 08:17:27 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Tigers] front end specs THANKS for the front end help- I was back home after a couple hous waitng- I wasnt allowed to watch eventho the kid couldnt figure how to set the toe. he freaked when i told him to drop the ti rod and adjust as needed- then I learned I was paying by the hour- first alingment I ever had I paid for by the hour- he swore caster and camber where right on- not sure how he knew since he had no idea about the terms in degress and minutes. He couldnt get the toe in on the R side so he had to adjust the left to match the extreme right- prolly a frame, suspension problem from the broken fulcrum pin the PO endured, although my regular guy has never had a problem- I paid what I thought was to much- in Ca. it was prolly a deal but in the midwest it was hiway robery- IMO at least. I told him where I was going and when I returned I would bring him the tires if they wear during the trip. AGAIN< Thanks for all the help on my problems- as soon as I get the hard top in the house and a set of tools in the car, Im heading to the StL airport to pick up Mike Schriner- I hope he is sober enough to drive. LOL Im teasing of course. With luck my next report will be from SD. Cheers, TonytheTiger --- On Sat, 6/20/09, Will Seay wrote: > From: Will Seay > Subject: Re: [Tigers] front end specs > To: "Tony Somebody" , "Beamclub" > Date: Saturday, June 20, 2009, 9:35 AM > Tony, > > Not exactly sure what your problem is. The shop > manual gives alignment > angles in degrees (deg) and minutes of arc ('). A > minute of arc is 1/60 > deg. You can do your own math. Here's my shot > at it: > > Toe in: 1/8" > (0.125") > Camber: 30' +/- 15' (0.25 deg to 0.75 > deg) > Castor: 3 deg 50' > (3.833 deg) > Steering axis inclination: 5 deg 15' +/- 15' (5 deg to 5.5 > deg) > > - Will B382001570 > ____________________________ > w_seay@embarqmail.com > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Tony Somebody" > To: "Beamclub" > Sent: Saturday, June 20, 2009 8:27 AM > Subject: [Tigers] front end specs > > > IF anyone is up early enough to help before I get to the > front end > shop__________-- my front end guy is on vacation and the > noises I had was > one- bad tie rod ends and two- loose wheel- I forgot to > retorque after the > car wasnon the ground and that was the biggest noise. The > place doing the > alingment out me off yesterady at my appointment tim- Dindt > have enough info > for his computer- I had two books but he couldnt read the > part in hours or > min utes, so Im there shortly. I was going to ask last > night but my brain > was dead and my body was running a close second. Any specs > different than > the books would be of help if I get it in time. THANKS for > the recent help- > Im heading to Suni as soon as the front end man says GO. > TtT > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 20 11:56:31 2009 From: " Ron Fraser" To: "'Tony Somebody'" , "'Beamclub'" Date: Sat, 20 Jun 2009 13:55:47 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] front end specs Tony They should have at least given you a print out of the before and after settings. If it feels OK when driving and braking; that's good. I would park it on a flat level surface, stand back and look at the front wheels to make sure it looks reasonably in alignment. Ron Fraser -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Tony Somebody Sent: Saturday, June 20, 2009 11:17 AM To: Beamclub; Will Seay Subject: Re: [Tigers] front end specs THANKS for the front end help- I was back home after a couple hous waitng- I wasnt allowed to watch eventho the kid couldnt figure how to set the toe. he freaked when i told him to drop the ti rod and adjust as needed- then I learned I was paying by the hour- first alingment I ever had I paid for by the hour- he swore caster and camber where right on- not sure how he knew since he had no idea about the terms in degress and minutes. He couldnt get the toe in on the R side so he had to adjust the left to match the extreme right- prolly a frame, suspension problem from the broken fulcrum pin the PO endured, although my regular guy has never had a problem- I paid what I thought was to much- in Ca. it was prolly a deal but in the midwest it was hiway robery- IMO at least. I told him where I was going and when I returned I would bring him the tires if they wear during the trip. AGAIN< Thanks for all the help on my problems- as soon as I get the hard top in the house and a set of tools in the car, Im heading to the StL airport to pick up Mike Schriner- I hope he is sober enough to drive. LOL Im teasing of course. With luck my next report will be from SD. Cheers, TonytheTiger _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 20 12:50:07 2009 From: atwittsend@verizon.net To: achd73@yahoo.com, tigers@autox.team.net Date: Sat, 20 Jun 2009 13:48:08 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Re: [Tigers] axle shims _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 20 12:57:58 2009 From: Steve Laifman To: "Paul R. Breuhan" , Tiger's Den Date: Sat, 20 Jun 2009 11:57:14 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] hard top colors Paul, and Tigers, Here is what I believe to be "the skinny" in hardtop colors. The "GT" came with a hard top, and it was body color. A "Special Order" came as you ordered it. A dealer sold Tiger did not even come with a hardtop, it was an extra with hardtop ordered by the dealer. This would only be the case if what you wanted was non-standard. An consumer would not order from the factory, unless he was accepting delivery abroad, but I believe it must be sold thru a US dealer. Now, the situation that a normal consumer might be in, required the dealer to stock hard tops as an accessory, and to paint it whatever the customer wanted and paid for. In 1959 I purchased a new Porsche 356 from Porsche dealer/racer driver Jack McAfee. I wanted it black with red upholstery, and so ordered it. Non were in stock, and I it took 3 months. I believe it was factory ordered. Got a phone call from Jack saying my car was in. It had GREEN upholstery. I said "Jack, if I wanted it green I would have bought it that way." He said he'd call me back. 2 days later my black Porsche with red upholstery was ready. No, he didn't dye it. I presume another customer wanted one, and he thought he could close both. Similarly, when I was gazing at the Miata, they would paint the hardtop (black) whatever other color I wanted. I was going to buy until I looked in the trunk, which had room for your baseball cap (and ball inside the hat). Pardon me for wandering, but the issues were the same. Steve ___ Steve Laifman Editor - TigersUnited.com Paul R. Breuhan wrote: > Robert, > > I agree with the paint it your way opinion ...it's not like you are cutting a > sunroof hole in it or anything...paint can always be repainted! > > > > I have a white car and flip and flop between white body color and black...but > then again someone cut a sunroof hole in my hardtop...so it will be a while > before paint is applied. > > > > Paul _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 20 14:32:08 2009 From: AAAGLASSS@aol.com To: tigers@Autox.Team.Net Date: Sat, 20 Jun 2009 16:31:46 EDT Subject: [Tigers] Test Think I got taken off the list haven't gotten any thing for a while. **************A Good Credit Score is 700 or Above. See yours in just 2 easy steps! (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100126575x1222585064x1201462784/aol?redir=http://www.freecreditreport.com/pm/default.aspx?sc=668072&hmpgID=62&bcd= JunestepsfooterNO62) _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 20 15:14:38 2009 From: AAAGLASSS@aol.com To: srwick@hotmail.com Date: Sat, 20 Jun 2009 17:13:48 EDT Subject: Re: [Tigers] Test I didn't get my message In a message dated 6/20/2009 2:10:29 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, srwick@hotmail.com writes: You got through. Steve ----- Original Message ----- From: _AAAGLASSS@aol.com_ (mailto:AAAGLASSS@aol.com) To: _tigers@Autox.Team.Net_ (mailto:tigers@Autox.Team.Net) Sent: Saturday, June 20, 2009 1:31 PM Subject: [Tigers] Test Think I got taken off the list haven't gotten any thing for a while. **************A Good Credit Score is 700 or Above. See yours in just 2 easy steps! (_http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100126575x1222585064x1201462784/aol?redir=ht tp://www.freecreditreport.com/pm/default.aspx?sc=668072&hmpgID=62&bcd_ (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100126575x1222585064x1201462784/aol?redir=http://w ww.freecreditreport.com/pm/default.aspx?sc=668072&hmpgID=62&bcd) = JunestepsfooterNO62) _Tigers@autox.team.net_ (mailto:Tigers@autox.team.net) _http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers_ (http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers) _http://www.team.net/archive_ (http://www.team.net/archive) **************A Good Credit Score is 700 or Above. See yours in just 2 easy steps! (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100126575x1222585064x1201462784/aol?redir=http://www.freecreditreport.com/pm/default.aspx?sc=668072&hmpgID=62&bcd= JunestepsfooterNO62) _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 20 22:11:38 2009 From: Owain Lloyd To: "tigers@autox.team.net" Date: Sat, 20 Jun 2009 23:11:09 -0500 Subject: [Tigers] Who's here? Just arrived at the hotel. (What a drive!). There's a tiger and and an alpine harrington out the back. Who's here then? _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jun 21 14:14:14 2009 From: "Buck Trippel" To: , Date: Sun, 21 Jun 2009 13:13:44 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Who's here? Hi Owain, I've seen Tom Hall, Rob Guerra, Duke, Larry Young, Tom McDaniel & the Van der Pooles. Not to forget the spouses. Steve Alcala, Dan Walters and Dale A are still enroute. We drove the Beartooth Highway yesterday, then went to the Little Big Horn Battlefield. Stopped by the Devil's Tower, Deadwood & Sturgis this morning on the way to Rapid City. Buck Trippel ----- Original Message ----- From: "Owain Lloyd" To: Sent: Saturday, June 20, 2009 9:11 PM Subject: [Tigers] Who's here? > Just arrived at the hotel. (What a drive!). There's a tiger and and > an alpine harrington out the back. Who's here then? > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jun 21 16:57:22 2009 From: Steve Sage To: Buck Trippel Date: Sun, 21 Jun 2009 15:56:56 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Who's here? Hello Buck and Owain: Unfortunately, I am not going to be there. I am very unhappy about it, but I could not make it happen this year. Steve Sage Buck Trippel wrote: > Hi Owain, > > I've seen Tom Hall, Rob Guerra, Duke, Larry Young, Tom McDaniel & the > Van der Pooles. Not to forget the spouses. Steve Alcala, Dan Walters > and Dale A are still enroute. > > We drove the Beartooth Highway yesterday, then went to the Little Big > Horn Battlefield. Stopped by the Devil's Tower, Deadwood & Sturgis > this morning on the way to Rapid City. > > Buck Trippel > E-mail message checked by Spyware Doctor (6.0.1.441) Database version: 6.12650 http://www.pctools.com/en/spyware-doctor-antivirus/ _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jun 21 20:39:43 2009 From: kevin beck To: tigers@autox.team.net Date: Sun, 21 Jun 2009 22:39:24 -0400 Subject: [Tigers] bumpers Never had a bumper on the front, need to start thinking about it. Have two bumpers in garage, is there a difference between the front and rear. May have some hardware floating around, but after 20 plus years who knows where. Earlier there was talk about map light color looked at mine and it still appears to have a gold color. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jun 21 21:01:14 2009 From: michael king To: kevin beck Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 13:00:59 +1000 Subject: Re: [Tigers] bumpers front and rear should be the same, the mounting hardware is different though. 2009/6/22 kevin beck > Never had a bumper on the front, need to start thinking about it. Have two > bumpers in garage, is there a difference between the front and rear. May > have some hardware floating around, but after 20 plus years who knows > where. > Earlier there was talk about map light color looked at mine and it still > appears to have a gold color. > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive > -- Regards Michael King _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 22 01:16:59 2009 From: Tony Somebody To: Buck Trippel , Steve Sage Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 00:16:28 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Tigers] Who's here? TonytheTiger and Mike Schriner (sp) are here at last. Dam what a hot driv from StL in a Tiger- wasnt much better from home to StL. At the hospitality suite a lady told me the high for tomorrow was going to be 80- dam, I hate to hear such good news. I will post whats going on ocassinally and ty to get pics IF Im smart enough to operate my camera- any requests for parts or pics email them asap. Tony --- On Sun, 6/21/09, Steve Sage wrote: > From: Steve Sage > Subject: Re: [Tigers] Who's here? > To: "Buck Trippel" > Cc: tigers@autox.team.net > Date: Sunday, June 21, 2009, 5:56 PM > Hello Buck and Owain: > Unfortunately, I am not going to be there. I am very > unhappy about it, but I could not make it happen this year. > > Steve Sage > > > > > Buck Trippel wrote: > > Hi Owain, > > > > I've seen Tom Hall, Rob Guerra, Duke, Larry Young, Tom > McDaniel & the Van der Pooles. Not to forget the > spouses. Steve Alcala, Dan Walters and Dale A are still > enroute. > > > > We drove the Beartooth Highway yesterday, then went to > the Little Big Horn Battlefield. Stopped by the Devil's > Tower, Deadwood & Sturgis this morning on the way to > Rapid City. > > > > Buck Trippel > > > > > > > > E-mail message checked by Spyware Doctor (6.0.1.441) > Database version: 6.12650 > http://www.pctools.com/en/spyware-doctor-antivirus/ > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 22 08:59:26 2009 From: " Ron Fraser" To: "'Tony Somebody'" , "'Buck Trippel'" Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 10:59:01 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Who's here? Tony Glad you and Mike made it OK; wish I could have made the trip this year. First off, enjoy your self at SUNI it is a great experience. 2nd have a beer or 2 or relax in your own way and at least get a couple hours sleep. I had hoped to be there to gather more Stock engine casting numbers and date code information. If anyone would like to contribute information or there are any questions; have them email me. I will gladly answer any questions. I'm especially interested in the early build of the B19KC engine group that were painted black. Don't go out of your way for any of this. You will be plenty busy with activities and all. Enjoy the week Ron Fraser -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Tony Somebody Sent: Monday, June 22, 2009 3:16 AM To: Buck Trippel; Steve Sage Cc: tigers@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Tigers] Who's here? TonytheTiger and Mike Schriner (sp) are here at last. Dam what a hot driv from StL in a Tiger- wasnt much better from home to StL. At the hospitality suite a lady told me the high for tomorrow was going to be 80- dam, I hate to hear such good news. I will post whats going on ocassinally and ty to get pics IF Im smart enough to operate my camera- any requests for parts or pics email them asap. Tony _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 22 18:18:47 2009 From: "rande" To: tigers@autox.team.net Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 20:18:21 -0400 Subject: [Tigers] Calling # 8 Darryl Mountjoy, could you contact me. I'm on the road, and I lost you email address. Rande _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 22 19:09:12 2009 From: kevin beck To: Tigers@autox.team.net Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 21:08:59 -0400 Subject: [Tigers] gas tank Now that I'm asking questions, I was able to see the inside of my one tank today have some rust in one very small area. I work on and restore old snowmobiles if I had a gas tank with this little rust I'd throw on a in line filter run a tank a gas through and call it good. Pretty sure I drained the tanks 20 years ago, but can't see the other tank. Should I pull the other tank? What do you think. Thanks Kevin _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 22 22:28:32 2009 From: "Robert Neeley" To: "kevin beck" , Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 21:28:10 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] gas tank I pulled both of my tanks as well as the crossover and connecting pipes and found little rust but quite a collection of paint peelings and other crap ... I had had chronic fuel delivery problems, all attributable to the decades of junk in the tanks clogging the fuel line. It was well worth the time to disassemble, clean and reseal. I used the KBS system ... www.kbs-coatings.com ... and very happy with the results ... -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net]On Behalf Of kevin beck Sent: Monday, June 22, 2009 6:09 PM To: Tigers@autox.team.net Subject: [Tigers] gas tank Now that I'm asking questions, I was able to see the inside of my one tank today have some rust in one very small area. I work on and restore old snowmobiles if I had a gas tank with this little rust I'd throw on a in line filter run a tank a gas through and call it good. Pretty sure I drained the tanks 20 years ago, but can't see the other tank. Should I pull the other tank? What do you think. Thanks Kevin Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 22 23:52:24 2009 From: "Robin Young" To: "'kevin beck'" , Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 01:51:10 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] gas tank Kevin, most of us have found that the coating inside the tanks have failed and a stringy sealant plugs the cross over at the gas line fitting. It sounds like your tanks are in very good shape but if the coating has not been removed and another put back, you have a problem coming. Also, if they have never been reconditioned chances are the gasket for the sender is original and hardened by now. On my car the connector hose and hose clamps were still Ok. Eastwood and Por 15 make good fuel tank coatings. The old coating can be removed with Purple Cleaner undiluted. Then tumble the tanks with sand to remove the rust. If you powder coat the tanks and cross over, it should be done before the coating is applied. One quart of POR 15 is all it takes for both tanks and the cross over tube. Robin Young -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of kevin beck Sent: Monday, June 22, 2009 9:09 PM To: Tigers@autox.team.net Subject: [Tigers] gas tank Now that I'm asking questions, I was able to see the inside of my one tank today have some rust in one very small area. I work on and restore old snowmobiles if I had a gas tank with this little rust I'd throw on a in line filter run a tank a gas through and call it good. Pretty sure I drained the tanks 20 years ago, but can't see the other tank. Should I pull the other tank? What do you think. Thanks Kevin _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 23 02:56:05 2009 From: "Harry B. Elam" To: tigers@autox.team.net Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 05:01:09 -0400 Subject: [Tigers] Front end alignment The shop that did my alignment is a small private venture in Nags Head NC.. The owner DID permit me to watch and discuss the process as the mechanic as he worked. I had previously had the correct "blocks" manufactured, as specified in the shop manual, and the mechanic used them. He related the difficulty in that one adjustment could affect more than one spec. It took him about 45 minutes, even with my "help." Harry Elam B38200471 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 23 12:46:16 2009 From: Steve Laifman To: Tiger's Den Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 11:45:54 -0700 Subject: [Tigers] OLD "New" Tires ! The subject of buying "new" tires comes along frequently. BUT, are the "NEW" tires you are buying really "Old Tires". And just how old are they? All tires are required to have a "Date Code" on them, and the NHTSA seem torn over what constitutes "out dated tires", but is required to show the actual build date on the tire. Only the "code" it. European CAR manufacturers recommend replacement after 6 years, regardless of mileage. OK, our problem is the "coding of the date" translation. Here is the link that describes the issue, and gives the correct "Captain Midnight Decoder Ring" to know what you are buying. If you don't know who "Captain Midnight" is, ask your father, or "Google It"! http://www.aa1car.com/library/tire_expire.htm It really doesn't matter how old your tire is, if you never drive it. Steve -- ___ Steve Laifman Editor - TigersUnited.com _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 23 18:26:18 2009 From: "Clyde McLaughlin" To: Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 20:25:48 -0400 Subject: [Tigers] Shenandoah Valley British Car Club Event Hi Eastcoasters, October 2-4,2009 is the date for the Shenandoah Valley British Car Festival in Waynesboro, Va....Have attended the past two years, it's in great location and is a great show, Sunbeams have not been well represented, maybe we could change that this year...SVBCC, P.O. Box 323, Waynesboro, Va 22980........Clyde _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 23 20:17:16 2009 From: kevin beck To: Tigers@autox.team.net Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 22:16:50 -0400 Subject: [Tigers] gas tank removal Got the first tank completely disconnected looks like I need to disconnect the trunk spring to get it out. Could probably make some large spring puller up or try vise grips, but thought I'd ask you guys what you used. Also my car at one time had some sorta traction bar on it, right in front of the leaf spring about 6 inches or so there is a welded on pin that look like something I'm guessing traction bar slid over, and then maybe bolted on the leaf spring. Does this sound like a stock option for the tiger. Thanks Kevin _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 23 20:32:15 2009 From: " Ron Fraser" To: "'kevin beck'" , Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2009 22:31:54 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] gas tank removal Kevin Traction Master traction bars were the norm of the day. http://tractionmaster.com/ Ron Fraser -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of kevin beck Sent: Tuesday, June 23, 2009 10:17 PM To: Tigers@autox.team.net Subject: [Tigers] gas tank removal Got the first tank completely disconnected looks like I need to disconnect the trunk spring to get it out. Could probably make some large spring puller up or try vise grips, but thought I'd ask you guys what you used. Also my car at one time had some sorta traction bar on it, right in front of the leaf spring about 6 inches or so there is a welded on pin that look like something I'm guessing traction bar slid over, and then maybe bolted on the leaf spring. Does this sound like a stock option for the tiger. Thanks Kevin _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.374 / Virus Database: 270.12.87/2195 - Release Date: 06/23/09 05:54:00 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 24 10:16:44 2009 From: "Richard" To: "Tiger List" Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 09:16:07 -0700 Subject: [Tigers] engine color & vc tags Recently there was a discussion on the correct engine colors for the Tigers, and a discussion of the tags that were fitted the valve covers. The PO had replaced the original valve covers with aluminum Tiger ones and we would like to put the original style back on. I seem to remember that someone knew how to stamp the original looking numbers and letters on the metal plate. Also did the IA have the small blue ford sticker on the drivers valve cover. Unfortunately I hit the delete button by mistake and all that info is gone. If someone would be so kind as to repost the info. It would be greatly appreciated. Thanks Rich _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 24 11:53:02 2009 From: " Ron Fraser" To: "'Richard'" , "'Tiger List'" Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 13:51:32 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] engine color & vc tags Rich Duke Samouce had his valve cover sticker re- stamped. He is at SUNI right now but maybe still online. The other Ford sticker I believe is silver and black but I never had one on my Tiger so I'm just guessing. Most 260 engines are painted Black. There is a cross over to Old Ford Blue for the B19KC engine group. I have a pretty good handle on the correct color for engines but I need more information to help there. Ron Fraser -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Richard Sent: Wednesday, June 24, 2009 12:16 PM To: Tiger List Subject: [Tigers] engine color & vc tags Recently there was a discussion on the correct engine colors for the Tigers, and a discussion of the tags that were fitted the valve covers. The PO had replaced the original valve covers with aluminum Tiger ones and we would like to put the original style back on. I seem to remember that someone knew how to stamp the original looking numbers and letters on the metal plate. Also did the IA have the small blue ford sticker on the drivers valve cover. Unfortunately I hit the delete button by mistake and all that info is gone. If someone would be so kind as to repost the info. It would be greatly appreciated. Thanks Rich Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.374 / Virus Database: 270.12.89/2197 - Release Date: 06/24/09 06:23:00 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 24 14:08:11 2009 From: Larry & Susan To: Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 16:06:24 -0400 Subject: [Tigers] Clocks, but not in dashboards The most recent Classic & Sportscar magazine made a small reference to a company that makes wall clocks that looks like classic car speedometers. So, I immediately checked out the website -- well, they surely look nice in the pictures. So, while trying to decide if I want to order an Allard clock or a Facel Vega one, I noticed on their site: "We are designing new clocks all the time so if you can't see your model listed just contact us and we'll design one for you." So, I contacted them, left a message about a Tiger clock. Thought you might like to know. So far, I haven't heard back and will follow up shortly, especially whether they handle U.S. sales and shipments. I wonder how many Tiger owners would be interested? I think I'd want two, one for the garage one for my office. Here's the website: http://www.chronosclocks.com/ Usual disclaimers apply. Larry Wright Seabrook, MD _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jun 24 14:38:15 2009 From: To: Richard , Tiger List Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 15:38:03 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tigers] engine color & vc tags Hey Rich, The engine decal was hand stamped by Larry Atkisson for $35. Here is his email - catkisson@aol.com. I got the Ford sticker from SS. Here are a couple of pictures of the finished VCs. http://e28-535i.com/upload/tgr3.JPG http://e28-535i.com/upload/tgr2.JPG SUNI is great. Having a super time. I Auto-Xed this morning and took four seconds off of my first run time. We are off for a drive and then BBQ in a couple of hours. My car has worked very well. Only hick-up (thus far) is a leaky heater valve. Luckily, I was able to find on from another Tiger owner. Sadly I head back in the morning. Duke B382002037 - TAC #739! ---- Richard wrote: > Recently there was a discussion on the correct engine colors for the Tigers, > and a discussion of the tags that were fitted the valve covers. > > The PO had replaced the original valve covers with aluminum Tiger ones and we > would like to put the original style back on. I seem to remember that someone > knew how to stamp the original looking numbers and letters on the metal plate. > Also did the IA have the small blue ford sticker on the drivers valve cover. > > Unfortunately I hit the delete button by mistake and all that info is gone. > If someone would be so kind as to repost the info. It would be greatly > appreciated. > > Thanks > > Rich > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 25 12:07:43 2009 From: " Ron Fraser" To: , "'Richard'" , "'Tiger List'" Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2009 13:59:55 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] engine color & vc tags Duke You got the Small Ford sticker from SS? When you get the time can you relay the part number for that sticker? I looked online but did not see it. I only saw the large SUNBEAM LTD sticker. Have a safe trip home from SUNI. Ron Fraser -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of wsamouce@kc.rr.com Sent: Wednesday, June 24, 2009 4:38 PM To: Richard; Tiger List Subject: Re: [Tigers] engine color & vc tags Hey Rich, The engine decal was hand stamped by Larry Atkisson for $35. Here is his email - catkisson@aol.com. I got the Ford sticker from SS. Here are a couple of pictures of the finished VCs. http://e28-535i.com/upload/tgr3.JPG http://e28-535i.com/upload/tgr2.JPG SUNI is great. Having a super time. I Auto-Xed this morning and took four seconds off of my first run time. We are off for a drive and then BBQ in a couple of hours. My car has worked very well. Only hick-up (thus far) is a leaky heater valve. Luckily, I was able to find on from another Tiger owner. Sadly I head back in the morning. Duke B382002037 - TAC #739! _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 25 17:55:12 2009 From: To: Tigers@autox.team.net Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2009 19:54:48 -0400 Subject: [Tigers] Towing a Tiger I've got an older Ford F150 V8 that has a great many mechanical and cosmetic problems. Without opening a discussion about the Cash for Clunkers bill, I was considering taking the opportunity to get the voucher for my 1991 truck and use it for something new. My question for those of you with towing experience..... To be safe and comfortable towing a trailer with a 2500 lb Tiger am I going to need another V8 or have you had good success with a 6 ? I have no towing experience at all. Steve B9473720 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 25 18:02:59 2009 From: michael king To: sralsten@ca.rr.com Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 10:02:49 +1000 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Towing a Tiger Just get a nice torquey motor.. modern V6's should be fine. -- Regards Michael King _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 25 18:15:22 2009 From: "Stu Brennan" To: Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2009 20:14:25 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Towing a Tiger I hope the newer ones are better, because the V-6 in my not so new Explorer causes me to think of that gross juice drink. "WOW, I shoulda had a V-8!" Stu _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 25 20:07:02 2009 From: michael king To: Tiger Talk List Tiger Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 12:06:38 +1000 Subject: [Tigers] Hollywood 55 crash! We all know the story of how the Hollywood 55 tiger got crashedinto by some vettes at the run offs.. here are the photos!! http://i.ebayimg.com/20/!BVJyZ9wBGk~$(KGrHgoH-CsEjlLlvGm7BKR!VdlpH!~~_1.JPG http://i.ebayimg.com/09/!BVJyY-g!mk~$(KGrHgoH-EEEjlLl)LvtBKR!V(jCu!~~_1.JPG\ http://i.ebayimg.com/11/!BVJyZfQBmk~$(KGrHgoH-DkEjlLly2R-BKR!V,hpS!~~_1.JPG -- Regards Michael King _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 25 20:16:18 2009 From: "steve wick" To: , Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2009 19:16:06 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Towing a Tiger If you buy an F250 Diesel, you won't even know the car is behind you. Steve (in N.Id.) ----- Original Message ----- From: sralsten@ca.rr.com To: Tigers@autox.team.net Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 4:54 PM Subject: [Tigers] Towing a Tiger I've got an older Ford F150 V8 that has a great many mechanical and cosmetic problems. Without opening a discussion about the Cash for Clunkers bill, I was considering taking the opportunity to get the voucher for my 1991 truck and use it for something new. My question for those of you with towing experience..... To be safe and comfortable towing a trailer with a 2500 lb Tiger am I going to need another V8 or have you had good success with a 6 ? I have no towing experience at all. Steve B9473720 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 25 20:58:21 2009 From: Stephen Waybright To: Tigers@autox.team.net, sralsten@ca.rr.com Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2009 19:58:08 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Tigers] Towing a Tiger My first question is how much does the trailer weigh... but even with a light open "economy" trailer (like I use with my Spec Miata), you probably want a towing capacity of >4000 lbs. I've been considering the V6 Chevy Traverse/Buick Enclave/GMC Acadia/Saturn Aura as a replacement for my V8 Ford E150. They can tow up to 5200 lbs. A Honda Ridgeline would also work. If you have an enclosed trailer, you'll need something with a V8. A turbo deisel V8 F-250 will tow anything you'd want all day long. Stephen --- On Thu, 6/25/09, steve wick wrote: > ----- Original Message ----- > From: sralsten@ca.rr.com > To: Tigers@autox.team.net > Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 4:54 PM > Subject: [Tigers] Towing a Tiger > > > I've got an older Ford F150 V8 that has a great many > mechanical > and cosmetic problems. Without opening a discussion > about > the Cash for Clunkers bill, I was considering taking > the opportunity > to get the voucher for my 1991 truck and use it for > something new. > > My question for those of you with towing > experience..... > > To be safe and comfortable towing a trailer with a > 2500 lb Tiger > am I going to need another V8 or have you had good > success with a 6 ? > > I have no towing experience at all. > > Steve > B9473720 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 25 21:01:25 2009 From: "Thomas Prager" To: "tigers_United_forum" Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2009 22:01:15 -0500 Subject: [Tigers] interesting Tiger for sale this for sale Tiger has a long racing history tom 9472154 http://bringatrailer.com/2009/06/21/sorted-vintage-racer-1965-sunbeam-tiger/# more-1836 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jun 25 22:43:13 2009 From: To: Tigers@autox.team.net, sralsten@ca.rr.com Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 0:42:55 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Towing a Tiger Steve: You failed to mention over what kind of terrain you'd be towing the trailer and Tiger. That's an important piece of info. I'll echo a couple of the guys who have answered already...if you get an F-250 Powerstroke Diesel, you'll never even know the trailer is back there. I've towed my Tiger with a 4.0L Ranger V6, a Ford F-150 with a 5.4L V8 and an '04 Ford F-250 Powerstroke Diesel. THERE IS NO COMPARISON...THE DIESEL WILL PULL A HOUSE DOWN IF NECESSARY!!!! My wife and I just got back from SUNI today and, other than catching a rock in the windshield on my F-250, we had an uneventful trip. I can't even imagine trying that in my old F-150 and there's no way in hell I'd EVER try that with a V6 Ranger. The bottom line is don't waste your money on a tow vehicle that is "marginal." Get a diesel F-250 and you'll never be sorry. Andy Walker Edmond, OK B382001600LRXFE TAC #740 ---- sralsten@ca.rr.com wrote: > I've got an older Ford F150 V8 that has a great many mechanical > and cosmetic problems. Without opening a discussion about > the Cash for Clunkers bill, I was considering taking the opportunity > to get the voucher for my 1991 truck and use it for something new. > > My question for those of you with towing experience..... > > To be safe and comfortable towing a trailer with a 2500 lb Tiger > am I going to need another V8 or have you had good success with a 6 ? > > I have no towing experience at all. > > Steve > B9473720 > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 26 06:26:32 2009 From: Chris Thompson To: awtiger@cox.net Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 08:25:42 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Towing a Tiger I tow my cars (and tractor) with an F-250 V10 gas. I wouldn't do it with anything less. You will be very sorry if you buy something marginal...... awtiger@cox.net wrote: > Steve: > > You failed to mention over what kind of terrain you'd be towing the trailer and Tiger. That's an important piece of info. > > I'll echo a couple of the guys who have answered already...if you get an F-250 Powerstroke Diesel, you'll never even know the trailer is back there. I've towed my Tiger with a 4.0L Ranger V6, a Ford F-150 with a 5.4L V8 and an '04 Ford F-250 Powerstroke Diesel. THERE IS NO COMPARISON...THE DIESEL WILL PULL A HOUSE DOWN IF NECESSARY!!!! My wife and I just got back from SUNI today and, other than catching a rock in the windshield on my F-250, we had an uneventful trip. I can't even imagine trying that in my old F-150 and there's no way in hell I'd EVER try that with a V6 Ranger. > > The bottom line is don't waste your money on a tow vehicle that is "marginal." Get a diesel F-250 and you'll never be sorry. > > Andy Walker > Edmond, OK > B382001600LRXFE > TAC #740 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 26 06:45:26 2009 From: "Rense, Mark (GE Indust, ConsInd)" To: Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 08:45:09 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Towing a Tiger Steve, Are you going to tow occasionally or multiple times a year? Long distance across mountain ranges or just across town? If you are only doing one or two trips a year, you could get away with a mid-size SUV, but if you plan on piling on miles, then a V-8 or diesel full-size pickup or SUV is the way to go. You must consider the minimum towing capacity of the vehicle you are looking for, a flatbed is around 1500 lbs., the Tiger another 2500, most V-6 SUVs/small trucks are topped out on towing capacity at 5000 lbs., the trailer will push a light vehicle all over the road, especially down hill. Also consider where you plan to tow, a rig that cannot safely go faster than 70 mph will get run over on most western interstates. One of my racing buddies thought he was going to save money and traded his big GMC pickup for a Honda Ridgeline, he regrets that move every time he hitches up his trailer. I have a first series Tundra 4WD that pulls a car hauler without blinking, but next time I will go for a diesel truck. Bugz -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of sralsten@ca.rr.com Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 7:55 PM To: Tigers@autox.team.net Subject: [Tigers] Towing a Tiger I've got an older Ford F150 V8 that has a great many mechanical and cosmetic problems. Without opening a discussion about the Cash for Clunkers bill, I was considering taking the opportunity to get the voucher for my 1991 truck and use it for something new. My question for those of you with towing experience..... To be safe and comfortable towing a trailer with a 2500 lb Tiger am I going to need another V8 or have you had good success with a 6 ? I have no towing experience at all. Steve B9473720 Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 26 07:42:03 2009 From: tym2@comcast.net To: Stephen Waybright Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 13:41:46 +0000 (UTC) Subject: Re: [Tigers] Towing a Tiger ...............................and all night too! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Stephen Waybright" To: Tigers@autox.team.net, sralsten@ca.rr.com Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 10:58:08 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: Re: [Tigers] Towing a Tiger My first question is how much does the trailer weigh... but even with a light open "economy" trailer (like I use with my Spec Miata), you probably want a towing capacity of >4000 lbs. I've been considering the V6 Chevy Traverse/Buick Enclave/GMC Acadia/Saturn Aura as a replacement for my V8 Ford E150. They can tow up to 5200 lbs. A Honda Ridgeline would also work. If you have an enclosed trailer, you'll need something with a V8. A turbo deisel V8 F-250 will tow anything you'd want all day long. Stephen --- On Thu, 6/25/09, steve wick wrote: > ----- Original Message ----- > From: sralsten@ca.rr.com > To: Tigers@autox.team.net > Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 4:54 PM > Subject: [Tigers] Towing a Tiger > > > I've got an older Ford F150 V8 that has a great many > mechanical > and cosmetic problems. Without opening a discussion > about > the Cash for Clunkers bill, I was considering taking > the opportunity > to get the voucher for my 1991 truck and use it for > something new. > > My question for those of you with towing > experience..... > > To be safe and comfortable towing a trailer with a > 2500 lb Tiger > am I going to need another V8 or have you had good > success with a 6 ? > > I have no towing experience at all. > > Steve > B9473720 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 26 07:59:25 2009 From: Cullen McCann To: "tigers@autox.team.net" Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 08:56:37 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Towing a Tiger I agree with Chris and Andy especially if you live in a region with any topography, hills and mountains terrain or will be towing over that type of terrain....even a car as light as a Tiger on a lightweight trailer, IMO will work a V6 to death....again, IMO....of course I tow with a duramax chevy....and I've also had a ford powerstroke....both with nearly 550 ft lbs of torque....factory...so I'm clearly biased, but its better to have too much than too little...and uphill battles with a loaded trailer will be a royal pain....and down hills without enough braking too. Most of the newer diesels have a trailer mode now that will keep the transmission shifting up a bit higher if necessary on accel, and let the motor do the braking on the downhills and save the heat on pads and rotors....which is nice if you have ever come down pikes peak with someone riding the brakes...someone I was with had to nosedive into the hill side to get it stopped with the brake fluid started to turn to vapor..... Now if budget wont allow for the diesel, at least go V8 or V10....fuel economy will be rough, which is another good reason for the diesel of course...my duramax gets about 18 mpg on the highway...where my dad's V10 Triton gets about 8 or 10 I think...so you need to consider that as well...but the gas motor will have its benefits....less lag since its naturally aspirated...etc...diesels are overly strong, but not too incredibly fast in stock trim.....they just pull hard, and they are a sweet ride. I had a straight 6 in a newer jeep cherokee for a few years that I tried to tow a pair of jetski's to the lake with.....even that sucked....the transmission worked itself to death just to make it up and down the hills on the highway at speed......and one more thing...do you really want your tow vehicle to have less cylinders than the vehicle on the trailer? just my two cents...good luck! Cullen McCann B382001452 LROFE Yukon, OK _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 26 09:24:43 2009 From: To: awtiger@cox.net, Tigers@autox.team.net Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 11:24:22 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Towing a Tiger Thanks for all the response. I see my question was incomplete due to my own lack of experience with the issue. The trailer I have in mind would be an open flatbed, not a heavier enclosed. My ideas at least now, wouldn't involve passes over 5000' My budget can't handle Diesal F250. Sounds like I should also put 6 cyl Ranger types out of my mind and focus on at least a full size w/ V8 Steve R _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 26 10:11:56 2009 From: "John Dillman" To: Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 11:11:40 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Towing a Tiger Haven't towed the Tiger, but my 2003 5.4 Expedition handles the '41 Continental pretty well, and it is heavy. I bought the 5.4 and not the 4.6 for that reason. If I didn't tow much, as I do/don't, I'd get a v-8 like this that won't kill you every day. It is a compromise. . . If I towed much, you'd find me at the diesel pump. . . John Dillman _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 26 10:57:37 2009 From: "Jerry & Maureen \(Mo\)" To: , Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 11:57:00 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Towing a Tiger Steve, I have a 2002 Ford 150 5.4eng. and it pulls my 19' enclosed trailer just fine, (albeit 10MPG). I pulled it to Covington, KY a few years ago and also out to Big Bear last year with no problems of any kind, (I live in East TX.) The only thing that I don't like about it is the fact that 90%+ of the time I'm not actually pulling the car behind me and I have far more truck than I need for daily use. There is no question that a diesel can pull anything, but do you actually need it. The Ford 4.6 just will not cut it. The Mustang club I belong to here in East TX some of the guys had 4.6 trucks and all have upgraded to the 5.4 engines in order to pull there car trailers. And of course some of the guys have the diesels, but those are usually company trucks. Jerry Christopherson 9473187 TAC Insp. #58 Just for grins check out WWW.payitforwardcar.com and see what I'm evolved with, (check out the left side for the progress).Too bad there wasn't a way to do a Tiger this way. -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of sralsten@ca.rr.com Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 6:55 PM To: Tigers@autox.team.net Subject: [Tigers] Towing a Tiger I've got an older Ford F150 V8 that has a great many mechanical and cosmetic problems. Without opening a discussion about the Cash for Clunkers bill, I was considering taking the opportunity to get the voucher for my 1991 truck and use it for something new. My question for those of you with towing experience..... To be safe and comfortable towing a trailer with a 2500 lb Tiger am I going to need another V8 or have you had good success with a 6 ? I have no towing experience at all. Steve B9473720 Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 26 11:21:52 2009 From: "Jerry & Maureen \(Mo\)" To: , , Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 12:21:37 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Towing a Tiger Steve, Another thing to consider is wheelbase, the shorter the wheelbase the worse it is for towing. Also when towing be sure NOT have the weight too far back in the trailer, the trailer will start dictating where the truck goes, very scary. (Don't ask me how I know that). Jerry Christopherson 9473187 -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of sralsten@ca.rr.com Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 10:24 AM To: awtiger@cox.net; Tigers@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Tigers] Towing a Tiger Thanks for all the response. I see my question was incomplete due to my own lack of experience with the issue. The trailer I have in mind would be an open flatbed, not a heavier enclosed. My ideas at least now, wouldn't involve passes over 5000' My budget can't handle Diesal F250. Sounds like I should also put 6 cyl Ranger types out of my mind and focus on at least a full size w/ V8 Steve R Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 26 12:57:41 2009 From: "Kirk Smith" To: Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 11:56:53 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Towing a Tiger My experience is with hauling horse trailers. A couple of horses and a trailer add up to about the same as a Tiger and a trailer. I only trailer about 1% of the time, so I was looking for the minimum that I felt would do the job and not kill me mileage wise the rest of the time. The last vehicle I bought for this was a 2000 Dodge Durango. It would probably be considered a mid-size SUV, but had decent wheelbase, gearing and power. I had a choice of a 5.9 V-8, a 5.2 V-8 or a 4.7 V-8. The 5.9 was a little overkill for everyday driving. The 4.7 was a newer design, overhead cam and made more peak power than the 5.2, but the torque curve was also peaky. I went with the 5.2, the old reliable 318 that had been around a few decades and had 300 ft/lbs of torque from just about idle. The whole package has worked out perfect for my occaisional towing needs. I knew it would be the minimum I would feel comfortable with, and am glad I didn't pick the smaller higher performance engine. Kirk B382000503 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 8:24 AM Subject: Re: [Tigers] Towing a Tiger > Thanks for all the response. I see my question was > incomplete due to my own lack of experience with the issue. > > The trailer I have in mind would be an open flatbed, not a heavier > enclosed. > > My ideas at least now, wouldn't involve passes over 5000' My budget can't > handle Diesal F250. Sounds like I should also put 6 cyl Ranger types > out of my mind and focus on at least a full size w/ V8 > > Steve R > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.329 / Virus Database: 270.12.92/2202 - Release Date: 06/25/09 17:58:00 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 26 14:47:38 2009 From: "Harry B. Elam" To: tigers@autox.team.net, sralsten@ca.rr.com Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 16:53:07 -0400 Subject: [Tigers] Towing Steve, I have towed my Tiger for years, but not on a trailer. The smallest engine vehicle I have ever used was a 1990 Jaguar XJ-6 and it towed fine. The longest trip was from California to Virginia. Also, in the past 26 years the largest tow vehicle was a Renegade 38 foot motor home on a FreightHauler chassis. It never knew it was being followed. I have also used the Tiger to tow a trailer cross country. One time I did tow a Honda Accord with the Tiger. That was unsafe because in turns the Honda wanted to go straight, pushing the Tiger rear a bit. I won't do that again. It is very handy to be able to "drive two cars at once." Harry Elam B382000471 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 26 16:01:14 2009 From: Tod Brown To: tigers@autox.team.net Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 17:59:36 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Towing a Tiger (or the reverse) How old are we getting? With all the discussion of what to use to tow a Tiger, I think back to my only experience with towing and a Tiger. When my Tiger was brand new, my new bride and I hitched it up to a pop-up and made our honeymoon tour of New England and Quebec. Still have the same Tiger (and the same wife). As Mr. Dylan says, "I was so much older then - I'm younger than that now" Cheers, Tod B382002384LRXFE _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 26 16:19:59 2009 From: THEO SMIT To: Tigers@autox.team.net Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 16:19:47 -0600 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Towing a Tiger I put the Tiger on a 16 foot flatdeck trailer and towed it out to SUNI with our 2000 Tundra. The only concession I made was to turn off the overdrive on the transmission - it hurts the mileage a bit but it can significantly extend the life of the tranny, so it's an easy choice. We did most of the trip at about 65 mph and had no issues whatsoever. The 4.7L V8 in the Tundra has more than enough jam to get the whole thing up to whatever speed you want to run - it's just a matter of how much money you want to spend on gas. The nice thing about the Tundra is that it gets decent mileage (for a truck) when you're not hauling anything so if you can't have a separate vehicle for every thing you do, then it's a good compromise. Theo ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jerry & Maureen (Mo)" Date: Friday, June 26, 2009 11:21 am Subject: Re: [Tigers] Towing a Tiger To: sralsten@ca.rr.com, awtiger@cox.net, Tigers@autox.team.net > Steve, > Another thing to consider is wheelbase, the shorter the > wheelbase the worse > it is for towing. > Also when towing be sure NOT have the weight too far back in the > trailer,the trailer will start dictating where the truck goes, > very scary. (Don't > ask me how I know that). > > Jerry Christopherson > 9473187 > > -----Original Message----- > From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers- > bounces@autox.team.net]On Behalf Of sralsten@ca.rr.com > Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 10:24 AM > To: awtiger@cox.net; Tigers@autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Tigers] Towing a Tiger > > Thanks for all the response. I see my question was > incomplete due to my own lack of experience with the issue. > > The trailer I have in mind would be an open flatbed, not a > heavier enclosed. > > My ideas at least now, wouldn't involve passes over 5000' My > budget can't > handle Diesal F250. Sounds like I should also put 6 cyl Ranger types > out of my mind and focus on at least a full size w/ V8 > > Steve R > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 26 16:41:33 2009 From: Larry & Susan To: Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 18:41:18 -0400 Subject: [Tigers] About: Clocks, but not in dashboards FYI, heard back fro a TE/AE member who has seen the items in question 1st-hand and perhaps these aren't as nice as the website depicts. Watch this space, I might order one anyway as "a test". ------ Forwarded Message From: Larry & Susan Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 16:06:24 -0400 To: Subject: Clocks, but not in dashboards The most recent Classic & Sportscar magazine made a small reference to a company that makes wall clocks that looks like classic car speedometers. So, I immediately checked out the website -- well, they surely look nice in the pictures. So, while trying to decide if I want to order an Allard clock or a Facel Vega one, I noticed on their site: "We are designing new clocks all the time so if you can't see your model listed just contact us and we'll design one for you." So, I contacted them, left a message about a Tiger clock. Thought you might like to know. So far, I haven't heard back and will follow up shortly, especially whether they handle U.S. sales and shipments. I wonder how many Tiger owners would be interested? I think I'd want two, one for the garage one for my office. Here's the website: http://www.chronosclocks.com/ Usual disclaimers apply. Larry Wright Seabrook, MD _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 26 18:05:00 2009 From: kevin beck To: Tigers@autox.team.net Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 20:04:39 -0400 Subject: [Tigers] towing We are getting older in my younger day I picked up a 67 alpine in Detroit towed it home on a car dolly behind my jeep cj5 with a straight 6, don't remember having any problems. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 26 18:58:10 2009 From: tym2@comcast.net To: kevin beck Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2009 00:57:59 +0000 (UTC) Subject: Re: [Tigers] towing I was thinking, and my bride reminded me. With all of this "Tiger towing" stuff.............. I recall bringing home my Tiger when I bought it. I didn't have any problems. I brought it home on a flatbed - in pieces - with lots of boxes filled with parts. And, when I arrived home, my wife said, "You paid $7,000 for that?" Tym McDowell ----- Original Message ----- From: "kevin beck" To: Tigers@autox.team.net Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 8:04:39 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: [Tigers] towing We are getting older in my younger day I picked up a 67 alpine in Detroit towed it home on a car dolly behind my jeep cj5 with a straight 6, don't remember having any problems. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 26 20:02:07 2009 From: Bill Waite To: kevin beck , tym2@comcast.net Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 19:01:47 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Tigers] towing Another Tiger towing story. In 1981, when I towed my "not running" Mark II from Dallas to Denver... I towed it behind my Mark I (stock 260). Middle of the summer, over 95 degrees through West Texas. Never missed a beat, ran cool all the way (totally stock cooling system, too) and I arrived safely. A bit of a miracle, considering I towed it using a tow bar attached to the front bumper attachment points (don't try this ever). I was young, stupid and very lucky. Now I'm old, not too lucky but still pretty stupid. Bill Waite Grand Rapids, MI --- On Fri, 6/26/09, tym2@comcast.net wrote: From: tym2@comcast.net Subject: Re: [Tigers] towing To: "kevin beck" Cc: Tigers@autox.team.net Date: Friday, June 26, 2009, 8:57 PM I was thinking, and my bride reminded me. With all of this "Tiger towing" stuff.............. I recall bringing home my Tiger when I bought it. I didn't have any problems. I brought it home on a flatbed - in pieces - with lots of boxes filled with parts. And, when I arrived home, my wife said, "You paid $7,000 for that?" Tym McDowell ----- Original Message ----- From: "kevin beck" To: Tigers@autox.team.net Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 8:04:39 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: [Tigers] towing We are getting older in my younger day I picked up a 67 alpine in Detroit towed it home on a car dolly behind my jeep cj5 with a straight 6, don't remember having any problems. Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 26 21:43:48 2009 From: kevin beck To: Tigers@autox.team.net Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 23:43:29 -0400 Subject: [Tigers] gas tank removal Its 11:30 Friday nite just got my second tank out. I want to remove the sending unit get the tanks and tubes cleaned, and ready for coating. When removing the sending unit do I bend the 3 tits down, rotate and lift out, or isn't that the right way. Thought I'd ask before I just went ahead and did it. Thanks Kevin B. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jun 26 23:38:54 2009 From: To: Tigers@autox.team.net Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2009 1:38:35 -0400 Subject: [Tigers] Towing Well I certainly found a place with lots of choices and experience to ask my question. After dinner tonight I was close to our local car dealer row so I browsed a bit. Shocked at the lack of availability of a plain vanilla truck, no wonder these guys are having sales problems. Ford dealer had about 25 vehicles ranging from $31K up. Not a single one that didn't have extended cab of some sort and wasn't dripping with packages. Chevy slightly better. Best looking new in stock option I thought was a GMC Canyon with a 5.3L 320 ft lb V8 and 6000lb tow capacity for $24k MSRP. The prices I saw had me reconsidering the 1991 F150 I already own and just putting a few thousand into it. It has a 351 Windsor ( about 380 torque I think) and load leveling rear shocks. If I go with a new purchase I really want to support an American company. On the other hand I could always buy a Mk2 to tow my Mk1 with ;^) Steve R _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 27 08:21:31 2009 From: " Ron Fraser" To: "'kevin beck'" , Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2009 10:20:50 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] gas tank removal Kevin Three tits, OMG. OK, I won't go there. Sorry I worked a late shift yesterday. That is not the way to remove the sender or at least not the way I removed it. The locking ring has 3 ramps that gives it the downward force onto the sender unit and gasket. You have to gradually turn the ring counter clockwise to disengage the ramps and remove. Do not use a screwdriver on the tabs, use a drive punch with a flat end to gradually move the ring. I'm not sure if lubricant would help here. The lube might swell the gasket and put more force on the ring.(?) Work slowly and try not to bend the tabs or shear them off. Hope this helps. Anyone do this job recently with a tip on removal? Ron Fraser -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of kevin beck Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 11:43 PM To: Tigers@autox.team.net Subject: [Tigers] gas tank removal Its 11:30 Friday nite just got my second tank out. I want to remove the sending unit get the tanks and tubes cleaned, and ready for coating. When removing the sending unit do I bend the 3 tits down, rotate and lift out, or isn't that the right way. Thought I'd ask before I just went ahead and did it. Thanks Kevin B. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.374 / Virus Database: 270.12.92/2203 - Release Date: 06/26/09 05:53:00 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 27 08:30:10 2009 From: Dave Munroe To: rfraser@bluefrog.com, 'kevin beck' , Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2009 11:29:59 -0300 Subject: Re: [Tigers] gas tank removal Kevin: Mine was quite easy to remove: the gasket had shrunk and the unit was loose. It was leaking profusely on fill-up, which was corrected with a new gasket. I hope yours is as easy ! Dave ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ron Fraser" To: "'kevin beck'" ; Sent: Saturday, June 27, 2009 11:20 AM Subject: Re: [Tigers] gas tank removal Kevin Three tits, OMG. OK, I won't go there. Sorry I worked a late shift yesterday. That is not the way to remove the sender or at least not the way I removed it. The locking ring has 3 ramps that gives it the downward force onto the sender unit and gasket. You have to gradually turn the ring counter clockwise to disengage the ramps and remove. Do not use a screwdriver on the tabs, use a drive punch with a flat end to gradually move the ring. I'm not sure if lubricant would help here. The lube might swell the gasket and put more force on the ring.(?) Work slowly and try not to bend the tabs or shear them off. Hope this helps. Anyone do this job recently with a tip on removal? Ron Fraser _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 27 10:50:50 2009 From: "Peter Laurinaitis" To: , Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2009 12:50:24 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Towing a Tiger i pull my tiger around on an 18' open trailer with my yuppie-mobile '03 bmw x5 v8 4.4 liter and i dont even know its back there. tiger 2500 + trailer 1500 = 4000 lbs with a tow capacity of something like 6000 lbs for the x5. strong engine and tranny cooler standard seems to work, while i kick it up front in comfort. that said, if i had my druthers id be towing with a ram 3500 cummins diesel with single rear wheels.... ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris Thompson" To: Cc: Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 8:25 AM Subject: Re: [Tigers] Towing a Tiger >I tow my cars (and tractor) with an F-250 V10 gas. I wouldn't do it with >anything less. You will be very sorry if you buy something marginal...... > > awtiger@cox.net wrote: >> Steve: >> >> You failed to mention over what kind of terrain you'd be towing the >> trailer and Tiger. That's an important piece of info. >> >> I'll echo a couple of the guys who have answered already...if you get an >> F-250 Powerstroke Diesel, you'll never even know the trailer is back >> there. I've towed my Tiger with a 4.0L Ranger V6, a Ford F-150 with a >> 5.4L V8 and an '04 Ford F-250 Powerstroke Diesel. THERE IS NO >> COMPARISON...THE DIESEL WILL PULL A HOUSE DOWN IF NECESSARY!!!! My wife >> and I just got back from SUNI today and, other than catching a rock in >> the windshield on my F-250, we had an uneventful trip. I can't even >> imagine trying that in my old F-150 and there's no way in hell I'd EVER >> try that with a V6 Ranger. >> The bottom line is don't waste your money on a tow vehicle that is >> "marginal." Get a diesel F-250 and you'll never be sorry. >> >> Andy Walker >> Edmond, OK >> B382001600LRXFE >> TAC #740 > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 27 11:24:00 2009 From: "Richard" To: "Tiger List" Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2009 10:23:22 -0700 Subject: [Tigers] questions on MK1A Does anyone still make an updated voltage stabilizer to replace the original one? Is there a way to decode the number on the tack to make sure that it is correct for the Tiger MK1A? And lastly, on my brothers MK1A the PO got rid of the original valve covers. Is there any way to get the Model number and the SO number for the valve cover ID plate? Thanks Richard _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 27 11:30:18 2009 From: Steve Laifman To: Richard Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2009 10:30:07 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] questions on MK1A Try Theo Smit. He was making a very nice solid state regulator. See e-mail I believe Tom Hall was marketing it. Steve ___ Steve Laifman Editor - TigersUnited.com Richard wrote: > Does anyone still make an updated voltage stabilizer to replace the original > one? > > Is there a way to decode the number on the tack to make sure that it is > correct for the Tiger MK1A? > > And lastly, on my brothers MK1A the PO got rid of the original valve covers. > Is there any way to get the Model number and the SO number for the valve cover > ID plate? > > Thanks > > Richard > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 27 11:35:43 2009 From: Bob Diehl To: tigers@autox.team.net Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2009 10:35:26 -0700 Subject: [Tigers] Two of everything Am I the only one getting two of every post to the list???????????? bob_diehl [demime found a multipart/alternative section which it tried to parse but could not find any section which it could render. Please send plain text.] _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 27 11:54:55 2009 From: " Ron Fraser" To: "'Richard'" , "'Tiger List'" Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2009 13:54:15 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] questions on MK1A Richard I believe Theo Smit has a transistor style voltage stabilizer. http://members.shaw.ca/tsmit/stabilizer/stabilizer.html Tach; if you have a Jaeger 8 cyl negative earth tach your OK Parts list PUB # 6691334 shows RV1/2012/00A for the MK I tach My MK Ia has RV1/2812/00A; 0 - 5000 rpm Model # and SO #; Norm Miller might have a better handle on this information. My MK Ia is model # C4PZ-6001-CF SO # is SO-2632 I believe those numbers continue through to the end of the MK Ia build but no absolute guarantee. Ron Fraser -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Richard Sent: Saturday, June 27, 2009 1:23 PM To: Tiger List Subject: [Tigers] questions on MK1A Does anyone still make an updated voltage stabilizer to replace the original one? Is there a way to decode the number on the tack to make sure that it is correct for the Tiger MK1A? And lastly, on my brothers MK1A the PO got rid of the original valve covers. Is there any way to get the Model number and the SO number for the valve cover ID plate? Thanks Richard Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.374 / Virus Database: 270.12.93/2205 - Release Date: 06/27/09 05:53:00 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jun 27 22:37:01 2009 From: kevin beck To: Tigers@autox.team.net Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 00:36:40 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] gas tank removal Both tanks and hardware are out not a bad job after all, that's for all your help. I'll keep you updated on my progress. Thanks Kevin On Tue, Jun 23, 2009 at 10:16 PM, kevin beck wrote: > Got the first tank completely disconnected looks like I need to disconnect > the trunk spring to get it out. Could probably make some large spring puller > up or try vise grips, but thought I'd ask you guys what you used. Also my > car at one time had some sorta traction bar on it, right in front of the > leaf spring about 6 inches or so there is a welded on pin that look like > something I'm guessing traction bar slid over, and then maybe bolted on the > leaf spring. Does this sound like a stock option for the tiger. Thanks > Kevin _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jun 28 21:38:14 2009 From: "Lynn Wall" To: Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 21:37:48 -0600 Subject: [Tigers] SUNI update an plea All, Suni has now ended and for those that missed it....you missed a GREAT one. Max could not have picked a better location or hotel. We spent a week there and could use another week to see all the area has to offer. Thanks again to all the event chairpersons. They did a great job. The area had received A LOT of rain (probably ordered by Max) and it was brilliant green everywhere you looked. The cars were amazing and it was great to see old friends and make new ones. The speakers were great and the rally will go down as one of the best. Now for the plea. To the person or persons that saw fit to steal (that is now the correct word since the event if now over) the parts from the parts swap area I would like to suggest the following. If you have developed a conscience you can simply go get a US postal order, have it made out to the various victims, this can be done anonymously and mail it to them. The chrome GT door escutcheons were $500.00 and can be mailed to the following address: Lynn Wall 3712 Ecker Hill Drive Park City, UT 84098 The NOS Tiger gas gauge from Doug Jennings was marked with a price. His address can be found very simply. The NOS red and green dash indicator lights from Bob Webb had prices marked as well. His address can also be located very simply. . Steve Alcala suspects some items were missing from him as well. It appears that all items were Tiger specific and of great value. Based on the hundreds of items that were displayed for sale and the selectiveness/quality of the thefts, the victims and the attendees I spoke with do not believe this was a done by someone outside the SUNI attendees. Again, no questions will be asked but since these people, myself included, were hoping to sell some items to help defer the cost of the trip or the cost of their restorations, payment would be greatly appreciated. Second suggestion/plea..if you have not developed a conscience do us all a favor and stay away from future events, you and your activities are not welcome. You were the only disappointment in the whole week and you were a BIG buzz kill to EVERYONE knowing we have a thief among us. I cannot tell you how many people expressed their shock and disappointment in this knowledge. We held out hope payment would have been made by the end of the show or that this was a mere accident. Sadly, that hope is gone. Final plea. If any of you know of this person or see these items suddenly appear on a car or on eBay, please notify the victims. I know I will have my eyes wide open. Thanks for your time. Regardless of this disappointment I plan on attending the next SUNI and hope you will as well. It will be worth the time and effort to attend regardless of location. Lynn _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jun 28 22:13:52 2009 From: To: tigers@autox.team.net Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 21:13:40 -0700 Subject: [Tigers] SUNI event To all SUNI participants: I just wanted to register my kudos to the folks who undertook the organization of the meet. My wife and I enjoyed our time in Rapid City although we didn't get to stay as long as we would have liked. I also would like to register my specific thanks to Tom Hall, Doug Babcock and Rob Guerera (sp?) for the TAC services they provided over the course of the event. It was very nice to be able to put faces with names on the mail list and various websites on the Internet; it was great meeting all of you. With the exception of the thievery that I just read about from Lynn Wall, the event sounds like it was a good one relative to the other SUNI events. Hopefully, the items in question will be returned to their rightful owners. I have two questions that maybe someone could help me with. On the evening of the Mt. Rushmore tour, I went to the parts room to buy a Tiger t-shirt. Earlier I had seen the shirt that I wanted and it was on the table set up just as you walked in the door to the parts room. Unfortunately, we missed them as the room was locked up. Can anyone tell me how to get in touch with whoever that was who had that table? Also, for those of us who had to leave early, how do we find out the results of the concours event? Will they be posted somewhere? Thanks again to everyone who made SUNI a success, Andy Walker Edmond, OK B382001600LRXFE (TAC #740) B9006857LRX _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jun 28 23:00:36 2009 From: "Buck Trippel" To: , Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 21:59:40 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] SUNI event Andy, The table to immediate right of the entrance door was Tom Hall's. He also had the STOA shirts & regalia. Buck (now back home at the beach after more than 3K miles in a Tiger in the last 10 days) ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 9:13 PM Subject: [Tigers] SUNI event > To all SUNI participants: > > I just wanted to register my kudos to the folks who undertook the > organization of the meet. My wife and I enjoyed our time in Rapid City > although we didn't get to stay as long as we would have liked. I also > would like to register my specific thanks to Tom Hall, Doug Babcock and > Rob Guerera (sp?) for the TAC services they provided over the course of > the event. > > It was very nice to be able to put faces with names on the mail list and > various websites on the Internet; it was great meeting all of you. With > the exception of the thievery that I just read about from Lynn Wall, the > event sounds like it was a good one relative to the other SUNI events. > Hopefully, the items in question will be returned to their rightful > owners. > > I have two questions that maybe someone could help me with. On the > evening of the Mt. Rushmore tour, I went to the parts room to buy a Tiger > t-shirt. Earlier I had seen the shirt that I wanted and it was on the > table set up just as you walked in the door to the parts room. > Unfortunately, we missed them as the room was locked up. Can anyone tell > me how to get in touch with whoever that was who had that table? Also, > for those of us who had to leave early, how do we find out the results of > the concours event? Will they be posted somewhere? > > Thanks again to everyone who made SUNI a success, > Andy Walker > Edmond, OK > B382001600LRXFE (TAC #740) > B9006857LRX > _______________________________________________ _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 29 06:07:46 2009 From: Owain Lloyd To: Buck Trippel Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 13:07:26 +0100 Subject: Re: [Tigers] SUNI event I would also like to send my thanks to Max and the Vanderpools for the impeccable organization of SUNI. Lucia and I (now back in England) are very glad we managed to make it albeit only until Tuesday breakfast. It was wonderful to put faces to many names from the list who have contributed their wisdom over the past two or three years, to meet many new sunbeam enthusiasts and to see so many beautiful cars. We felt very welcome and would particularly like to thank Claudia and Buck for their warm hospitality. I'm sure I'm not the only one who found it very strange to drive around Rapid City and see so many alpines and tigers bombing around! I'm saddened to hear of a dark cloud over the event but we should take heart that it is a very small minority in such a large group. - owain. On Mon, Jun 29, 2009 at 5:59 AM, Buck Trippel wrote: > Andy, > > The table to immediate right of the entrance door was Tom Hall's. He also > had the STOA shirts & regalia. > > Buck (now back home at the beach after more than 3K miles in a Tiger in the > last 10 days) > > ----- Original Message ----- From: > To: > Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 9:13 PM > Subject: [Tigers] SUNI event > > > > To all SUNI participants: >> >> I just wanted to register my kudos to the folks who undertook the >> organization of the meet. My wife and I enjoyed our time in Rapid City >> although we didn't get to stay as long as we would have liked. I also would >> like to register my specific thanks to Tom Hall, Doug Babcock and Rob >> Guerera (sp?) for the TAC services they provided over the course of the >> event. >> >> It was very nice to be able to put faces with names on the mail list and >> various websites on the Internet; it was great meeting all of you. With the >> exception of the thievery that I just read about from Lynn Wall, the event >> sounds like it was a good one relative to the other SUNI events. Hopefully, >> the items in question will be returned to their rightful owners. >> >> I have two questions that maybe someone could help me with. On the >> evening of the Mt. Rushmore tour, I went to the parts room to buy a Tiger >> t-shirt. Earlier I had seen the shirt that I wanted and it was on the table >> set up just as you walked in the door to the parts room. Unfortunately, we >> missed them as the room was locked up. Can anyone tell me how to get in >> touch with whoever that was who had that table? Also, for those of us who >> had to leave early, how do we find out the results of the concours event? >> Will they be posted somewhere? >> >> Thanks again to everyone who made SUNI a success, >> Andy Walker >> Edmond, OK >> B382001600LRXFE (TAC #740) >> B9006857LRX >> _______________________________________________ >> > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 29 08:21:00 2009 From: "Smit, Theo" To: "Beamclub" Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 08:20:32 -0600 Subject: [Tigers] SUNI Hi all, We made it safely back (no thanks to the eighteen-wheeled twit in Montana that made a suicide pass and then squeezed us onto the shoulder). It was great to renew acquaintances and to meet so many others for the first time. Unfortunately I didn't take as many pictures as I was planning to... spent too much time talking to everyone! I will add my congratulations and appreciation to Max, the VanderPools and the rest of the SUNI organizing group for a great event in a great location. And to the person or people that violated the trust that is one of the intrinsic elements of taking part in one of these events: You suck. I hope all the bad karma that can be amassed by a Lucas electrical system focuses itself in your Sunbeam, leaving you stranded on a lonely highway in the middle of nowhere. I hope you get picked up by a banjo-wielding hillbilly that chains your car to his rusty pickup truck and drags it off to his shack down a bumpy dirt road... and there will be nothing you can do about it. Theo _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 29 08:55:11 2009 From: To: Beamclub , "Smit, Theo" Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 14:54:56 +0000 Subject: Re: [Tigers] SUNI "I hope all the bad karma that can be amassed by a Lucas electrical system focuses itself in your Sunbeam, leaving you stranded on a lonely highway in the middle of nowhere. I hope you get picked up by a banjo-wielding hillbilly that chains your car to his rusty pickup truck and drags it off to his shack down a bumpy dirt road... and there will be nothing you can do about it." Theo, that was funny. I think that we may be barking up the wrong tree. I bet the slim that did this is not a member of this service. Itbs like yelling at a group of people at the beginning of meeting about those who walk in late.....and those people are not in the group because they are late. Happens all the time in the Military. Duke B382002037 ---- "Smit wrote: > Hi all, > We made it safely back (no thanks to the eighteen-wheeled twit in Montana that > made a suicide pass and then squeezed us onto the shoulder). It was great to > renew acquaintances and to meet so many others for the first time. > Unfortunately I didn't take as many pictures as I was planning to... spent too > much time talking to everyone! > > I will add my congratulations and appreciation to Max, the VanderPools and the > rest of the SUNI organizing group for a great event in a great location. > > And to the person or people that violated the trust that is one of the > intrinsic elements of taking part in one of these events: You suck. I hope all > the bad karma that can be amassed by a Lucas electrical system focuses itself > in your Sunbeam, leaving you stranded on a lonely highway in the middle of > nowhere. I hope you get picked up by a banjo-wielding hillbilly that chains > your car to his rusty pickup truck and drags it off to his shack down a bumpy > dirt road... and there will be nothing you can do about it. > > Theo > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 29 08:58:29 2009 From: "Smit, Theo" To: "Beamclub" Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 08:58:16 -0600 Subject: [Tigers] Things I learned at SUNI Prior to the event I'd only managed to put maybe 80 miles on the Tiger to verify that it was basically roadworthy after a complete re-do of the driveline, front suspension, and brakes. During the last week we were able to put on another couple of hundred miles as well as almost two days of autocross and figured out a bunch of things: 1. (always number one!) Keep your cooling system in shape, and don't get stuck in the slow line at the Mt. Rushmore park gates. I dumped a bunch of coolant in the parking lot after having to wait too long (and after a SLOW drive up the last segment of the climb). The next day I replaced the 10-year old 13 pound radiator cap with a new 16-pound cap and didn't see any more coolant - but I also didn't really test the system as hard for the remainder of the trip. 2. If you're going to replace 80 percent of the Lucas wiring harness then the remaining 20 percent will take offense and bring you down. My autocross day was over early on Thursday due to a melted starter wire - speculation is that the mini-starter solenoid draws more current than the original starter solenoid, and the resulting heat softened the insulation of the light-gauge wire and caused the conductors to short out against another wire in the harness. I still need to verify that but it's a good working theory. And Dave, I should have taken you up on your offer to drive your car for a fun run... I was distracted at the time. 3. Banjo brake fittings on a moving component (I have them going from the rear calipers to the chassis) can be a liability. For some reason the right-rear fitting came loose twice and contributed to my decision to park the Tiger on Thursday. Loctite may be the answer here but I might also see about orienting the lines so that they can't try to undo themselves. 4. It didn't happen to me, but having the ammeter connection come disconnected while the engine is running can seriously damage many parts of the electrical system. The phenomenon is called "alternator load dump", and it's pretty well described here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Load_dump . Always use ring terminals on the alternator (not spade lugs), with star locking washers, make sure the crimp connections are tight, and that the nuts on the ammeter are tight... and make sure that the engine is off and the battery ground is disconnected from the chassis while you're working on the ammeter circuit. 5. Speaking of nuts... make sure your lugnuts are tight. 6. Peter Thomson described a situation he'd been in where the steering arm came loose from the spindle - one bolt disappeared altogether but he was able to get the driver to stop the car before anything really bad happened. The steering arm was obviously marked up from having been attached only at the rear for some time. However, when he checked a bunch of spares at another club member's place, he found that all of the steering arms were similarly worn - apparently it is not uncommon for this to happen. So check your steering arm bolts - it might be worthwhile to use LocTite on the steering arm-to-spindle bolts. 7. Fat Tire makes a good beer... and it comes in 20 oz bottles. Cheers, Theo _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 29 11:01:42 2009 From: "Thomas Witt" To: Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 10:01:34 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Things I learned at SUNI >>> I dumped a bunch of coolant in the parking lot<<< Sounds like a foreign chemical attack on American soil! How did you elude the Department of Homeland Security, Department of the Interior, The Bureau of Land Management, State - local Police and Park Rangers. I hope they catch you and extradite you back to the USA - in time for the next SUNI. Of course, requiring your Tiger as evidence. :-) Tom _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 29 16:19:32 2009 From: John Crawley To: LIST TIGER Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 22:19:12 +0000 Subject: [Tigers] SUNNI Hi Folks: Dee and I are sure sorry that we could not make it but we are tied to the school system as Dee is not off unill July 1. So please write about what happened and post pictures and we can at least dream of what might have been. Godspeed Jc _________________________________________________________________ Attention all humans. We are your photos. Free us. http://go.microsoft.com/?linkid=9666046 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 29 16:26:31 2009 From: "Samouce's" To: Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 17:06:58 -0500 Subject: [Tigers] Intake manifold....carb boil. I was hoping to find answers to this issue at SUNI. I did not. I also checked the archives. I have a chronic problem with fuel boiling in the bowels and flooding my engine. This happens when I stop the car once it is up to temp. I saw other Tigers with the same issues at SUNI. My current equipment - 260 bored 030 over F4B manifold Holley four barrel carb (custom) OEM Hood Slightly modified fuel delivery. (line runs up the tranny tunnel to back of carb and has heat shield sock) The car runs cool and does not go above 200 at idle or on the freeway. What I am thinking about doing - Edelbrock Performer (low rise) manifold. The F4B leaves no room for any spacer. 1/2 wood carb spacer Recirculation fuel delivery system LAT 79 hood 13" Electric pusher fan and will run on timer for 5 minutes after engine is shut down (need to find a timer) and/or when the coolant temp is over 210. What are your thoughts? I am really looking for info on what the performance of the Performer manifold is compared to the F4B. Duke B382002037 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 29 17:30:30 2009 From: "Smit, Theo" To: "Samouce's" , Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 17:30:03 -0600 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Intake manifold....carb boil. Hi Duke, This 10-year-old thread http://www.tigersunited.com/techtips/tech_threads/tt-fuelsys.asp#Intake% 20Manifolds Has intake manifold dimensions as well as the advertised RPM range for the manifolds in question. There is also some discussion about performance - the Performer is rated as being not-as-good as the F4B at higher RPM, but that may not matter if the rest of your engine will not support 5500+ RPM. You could try an aluminum spacer plate that fits between the intake manifold and carb, and acts to shield the float bowls from the direct heat of the engine. http://www.holley.com/108-70.asp This might work on your existing setup without any stackup issues because the addition of the shield and one gasket shouldn't add more than about 1/8"... If you use an aftermarket fuel pump with a recirculation line from the regulator then you'll do two things - the fuel gets to cool down on the way back to the tank and you're constantly moving cooler fuel towards the carb, which is a good thing, but you can also increase the fuel pressure slightly over what the stock pump provides. If you go too high then you'll be prone to flooding under dynamic conditions because the needle valve will exert extra pressure on the floats. Lowering the float level slightly would help here. Make sure you start out with no crud in the needle and seat assembly. If there is any gunk caught in the needle and seat then you'll be flood-prone all the time. Did your car have any flooding issues at the autocross, in corners or during braking? Cheers, Theo > -----Original Message----- > From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net > [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Samouce's > Sent: June 29, 2009 4:07 PM > To: tigers@autox.team.net > Subject: [Tigers] Intake manifold....carb boil. > > I was hoping to find answers to this issue at SUNI. I did not. > > I also checked the archives. > > I have a chronic problem with fuel boiling in the bowels and > flooding my engine. This happens when I stop the car once it > is up to temp. I saw other Tigers with the same issues at SUNI. > > My current equipment - > > 260 bored 030 over > F4B manifold > Holley four barrel carb (custom) > OEM Hood > Slightly modified fuel delivery. (line runs up the tranny > tunnel to back of carb and has heat shield sock) > > The car runs cool and does not go above 200 at idle or on the freeway. > > What I am thinking about doing - > > Edelbrock Performer (low rise) manifold. The F4B leaves no > room for any spacer. > 1/2 wood carb spacer > Recirculation fuel delivery system > LAT 79 hood > 13" Electric pusher fan and will run on timer for 5 minutes > after engine is shut down (need to find a timer) and/or when > the coolant temp is over 210. > > > What are your thoughts? I am really looking for info on what > the performance of the Performer manifold is compared to the F4B. > > Duke > B382002037 > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 29 19:23:58 2009 From: Steve Laifman To: Tiger's Den Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 18:23:25 -0700 Subject: [Tigers] My Facebook pics. Posted pics on my Facebook pages. "Only the name has been changed to protect the innocent!" http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=23591&id=1360287247&l=f21ac448f1 (;-) Steve -- ___ Steve Laifman Editor - TigersUnited.com _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 29 19:24:28 2009 From: handy To: tigers@autox.team.net Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 18:23:51 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Intake manifold....carb boil. Hi Duke, I had the same problem and this is how I dealt with it. I took modeling clay and made 2 one inch cones and set them on either side of my air cleaner cover, and closed the bonnet. I opened the bonnet and measured the cones to see how much clearance I had between the air cleaner and the underside of the bonnet. It was 5/8". I then went to the local auto supply and bought a 3/8" paper carb spacer and four nylon washers to insulate the hold down bolts for the carb. I did this so the heat would not transfer from the bolts to the carb. I should note that I have bolts through the engine mounts to keep the engine from twisting under the hood too much. This worked for me. Ross Handy B382002129 On Jun 29, 2009, at 3:06 PM, Samouce's wrote: > I was hoping to find answers to this issue at SUNI. I did not. > > I also checked the archives. > > I have a chronic problem with fuel boiling in the bowels and > flooding my > engine. This happens when I stop the car once it is up to temp. I > saw > other Tigers with the same issues at SUNI. > > My current equipment - > > 260 bored 030 over > F4B manifold > Holley four barrel carb (custom) > OEM Hood > Slightly modified fuel delivery. (line runs up the tranny tunnel to > back of > carb and has heat shield sock) > > The car runs cool and does not go above 200 at idle or on the freeway. > > What I am thinking about doing - > > Edelbrock Performer (low rise) manifold. The F4B leaves no room for > any > spacer. > 1/2 wood carb spacer > Recirculation fuel delivery system > LAT 79 hood > 13" Electric pusher fan and will run on timer for 5 minutes after > engine is > shut down (need to find a timer) and/or when the coolant temp is > over 210. > > > What are your thoughts? I am really looking for info on what the > performance of the Performer manifold is compared to the F4B. > > Duke > B382002037 > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 29 19:41:28 2009 From: "James E. Pickard" To: Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 20:40:33 -0500 Subject: [Tigers] Handbrake clip When my Tiger was towed the handbrake mechanism was dislodged and the clip on the end of the rod across the axle was lost. Anybody have a source for one of these? It is part number 301 in the parts manual. Thanks. Jim Pickard B9473298 ('65 Tiger) AN5L/12109 ('59 Sprite) - sold 2003 Mini Cooper Lafayette, LA _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Jun 29 22:18:13 2009 From: Tony Somebody To: Beamclub , TheoSmit Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 21:17:48 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Tigers] SUNI Im home after a 24 lay over at friends out side of StL after dropping Mike off at the airport Sun afternoon. I want to THANK Max and his team for a wonderful time, for all the hard work and long hours they endured so that the rest of us might enjoy ourselves. I got to meet several people that I wanted to but also missed out on meting others.It was also great visiting with old friends and Ive gone so far as no longer refering to Doug Jr. as "Dougie"- from now on he is Doug, just like Sr. after all he is way past the age of IE after his name, so Doug, I hope to see you and your Dad, Doug at the Dayton SOS. TOO,I got my Tiger TACed and that alone was worth the trip- evnetho 2 thousand plus miles in a Tiger during a presummer heat wave is tough on a fat boy- at least this one. To address the person and I say that singuarly becuse I cant imangine two people with no spine at the same location. Theo wishes bad things for your car. I personally just want to know who you are, I wont describe the thoughts and ideas that I feel you deserve but PLEASE , never show yourself at another Sunbeam function. If you needed those parts that bad, I would have given you some- maybe not as nice but still free and you wouldnt have to be afraid of the consequenses if people ever learn your idenity. Just imangine, no one would ever help you with any problem. sell you any part,wouldnt even have a cold beer with you, much less talk to you. Could it be possible its worth having your name black listed forever. I cant imangine it is. You know, you could be man enough to mail the parts to any member and they would get returned and the owners and just maybe you could sleep at night. God has a way of getting people like you. May you find forgiveness from HIM, for I will never forget and I pray HE helps me forgive. It will take HIS help I promise. TonytheTiger _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 30 07:52:32 2009 From: " Ron Fraser" To: "'Samouce's'" , Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 09:52:03 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Intake manifold....carb boil. Duke Even the stock Tiger has this problem. I'm not sure we can get away from that problem completely without going to a fuel injection style system. I'm not sure that running the fuel line up the tranny tunnel is a good idea. All the heat is going to funnel into that area. When I first put my Tiger on the road I had no carpet and no shift boot installed. I had a huge amount of heat and hot air blowing through the shifter opening. I believe there is a reasonably priced reproduction Boss 302 carb spacers on the market now that might help. Ron Fraser -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Samouce's Sent: Monday, June 29, 2009 6:07 PM To: tigers@autox.team.net Subject: [Tigers] Intake manifold....carb boil. I was hoping to find answers to this issue at SUNI. I did not. I also checked the archives. I have a chronic problem with fuel boiling in the bowels and flooding my engine. This happens when I stop the car once it is up to temp. I saw other Tigers with the same issues at SUNI. My current equipment - 260 bored 030 over F4B manifold Holley four barrel carb (custom) OEM Hood Slightly modified fuel delivery. (line runs up the tranny tunnel to back of carb and has heat shield sock) The car runs cool and does not go above 200 at idle or on the freeway. What I am thinking about doing - Edelbrock Performer (low rise) manifold. The F4B leaves no room for any spacer. 1/2 wood carb spacer Recirculation fuel delivery system LAT 79 hood 13" Electric pusher fan and will run on timer for 5 minutes after engine is shut down (need to find a timer) and/or when the coolant temp is over 210. What are your thoughts? I am really looking for info on what the performance of the Performer manifold is compared to the F4B. Duke B382002037 Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.374 / Virus Database: 270.12.94/2208 - Release Date: 06/29/09 05:54:00 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 30 08:13:36 2009 From: "Smit, Theo" To: "Tony Somebody" , "Beamclub" Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 08:13:22 -0600 Subject: Re: [Tigers] SUNI I'd never wish bad things on a Sunbeam. I was hoping for the Sunbeam to turn on its owner so that they'd suffer some appropriate hardship. Theo > -----Original Message----- > From: Tony Somebody [mailto:achd73@yahoo.com] > Sent: June 29, 2009 10:18 PM > To: Beamclub; Smit, Theo; wsamouce@kc.rr.com > Subject: Re: [Tigers] SUNI > > > location. Theo wishes bad things for your car. I personally > TonytheTiger _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 30 09:54:55 2009 From: "A. C. Tynes" To: "'Smit, Theo'" , Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 10:54:37 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tigers] SUNI And you can be sure that it will turn on him. Sunbeams have too much self respect to run around using stolen parts. I hope the thief realizes this and gets so paranoid that he is afraid to leave the house in his Sunbeam. Maybe then it will pass to someone who appreciates both the marque and its people. May he then disappear forever in a black cloud of Lucas magic smoke. A. C. Tynes New Orleans > -----Original Message----- > From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net > [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Smit, Theo > Sent: Tuesday, June 30, 2009 9:13 AM > To: Tony Somebody; Beamclub > Subject: Re: [Tigers] SUNI > > I'd never wish bad things on a Sunbeam. I was hoping for the > Sunbeam to turn on its owner so that they'd suffer some > appropriate hardship. > > Theo > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Tony Somebody [mailto:achd73@yahoo.com] > > Sent: June 29, 2009 10:18 PM > > To: Beamclub; Smit, Theo; wsamouce@kc.rr.com > > Subject: Re: [Tigers] SUNI > > > > > > > location. Theo wishes bad things for your car. I personally > > > TonytheTiger > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 30 10:12:54 2009 From: To: tigers@autox.team.net Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 16:11:09 +0000 Subject: [Tigers] SUNI winners I was not present for the awards dinner (even though I paid for it), and am wondering who won what? Thanks for any info! Duke B382002037 _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 30 10:20:24 2009 From: Tony Somebody To: "A. C. Tynes" Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 09:20:11 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Tigers] SUNI Sorry Theo, didnt mean to misquote what you said.I know you would never wish bad to the Beam. Tony --- On Tue, 6/30/09, A. C. Tynes wrote: > From: A. C. Tynes > Subject: Re: [Tigers] SUNI > To: "'Smit, Theo'" , tigers@autox.team.net > Date: Tuesday, June 30, 2009, 10:54 AM > And you can be sure that it will > turn on him. Sunbeams have too much self > respect to run around using stolen parts. > > I hope the thief realizes this and gets so paranoid that he > is afraid to > leave the house in his Sunbeam. Maybe then it will pass to > someone who > appreciates both the marque and its people. > > May he then disappear forever in a black cloud of Lucas > magic smoke. > > A. C. Tynes > New Orleans > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net > > > [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] > On Behalf Of Smit, Theo > > Sent: Tuesday, June 30, 2009 9:13 AM > > To: Tony Somebody; Beamclub > > Subject: Re: [Tigers] SUNI > > > > I'd never wish bad things on a Sunbeam. I was hoping > for the > > Sunbeam to turn on its owner so that they'd suffer > some > > appropriate hardship. > > > > Theo > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Tony Somebody [mailto:achd73@yahoo.com] > > > Sent: June 29, 2009 10:18 PM > > > To: Beamclub; Smit, Theo; wsamouce@kc.rr.com > > > Subject: Re: [Tigers] SUNI > > > > > > > > > > > location. Theo wishes bad things for your car. I > personally > > > > > TonytheTiger > > _______________________________________________ > > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > Tigers@autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > > > http://www.team.net/archive > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 30 12:25:08 2009 From: "Peter Phelps" To: Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 11:24:48 -0700 Subject: [Tigers] carb boil Hi Duke and Tigers, You did mention pulling the intake, sooo.... Another consideration to reduce under carb heat would be to block off the exhaust passages that presently (in stock configuration) allow the hot gasses to flow into the chamber under the plenum floor of the intake manifold there by raising the temperature of the carb. This is the odd shaped passage is in the center of the line of intake ports. Many quality aftermarket gasket companies include this plate with their intake set, but you can make a pair from the bottom of soup cans. Lightly RTV them in place on the bare head surface and install the side gaskets over them. While it works fine in california, it may not be the right choice for Tigers in the Northeast (etc.) that see winter time duty (not sure where you are located). Among other benefits, it's designed to help to speed winter warm-ups and prevent carb icing. Peter _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 30 12:30:03 2009 From: To: tigers@autox.team.net, wsamouce@kc.rr.com Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 14:28:51 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] SUNI winners I second that motion!! We had to leave early, too, and have never heard the outcome of the concours event. How 'bout it??? Andy Walker Edmond, OK B382001600LRXFE (TAC #740) B9006857LRX ---- wsamouce@kc.rr.com wrote: > I was not present for the awards dinner (even though I paid for it), and am wondering who won what? > > Thanks for any info! > > Duke > B382002037 > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 30 13:01:51 2009 From: To: awtiger@cox.net, tigers@autox.team.net Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 14:01:39 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tigers] SUNI winners Yet another reason for a website........but don't get me started again. Duke B382002037 ---- awtiger@cox.net wrote: > I second that motion!! We had to leave early, too, and have never heard the outcome of the concours event. How 'bout it??? > > Andy Walker > Edmond, OK > B382001600LRXFE (TAC #740) > B9006857LRX > > ---- wsamouce@kc.rr.com wrote: > > I was not present for the awards dinner (even though I paid for it), and am wondering who won what? > > > > Thanks for any info! > > > > Duke > > B382002037 > > _______________________________________________ > > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > Tigers@autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 30 13:05:15 2009 From: To: tigers@autox.team.net, Peter Phelps Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 14:05:04 -0500 Subject: Re: [Tigers] carb boil Great idea Peter, will do it when I am putting on the new manifold. Car is garaged in winter so that will not be a factor. Duke B382002037 ---- Peter Phelps wrote: > Hi Duke and Tigers, > > You did mention pulling the intake, sooo.... > > Another consideration to reduce under carb heat would be to block off the > exhaust passages that presently (in stock configuration) allow the hot gasses > to flow into the chamber under the plenum floor of the intake manifold there > by raising the temperature of the carb. This is the odd shaped passage is in > the center of the line of intake ports. Many quality aftermarket gasket > companies include this plate with their intake set, but you can make a pair > from the bottom of soup cans. Lightly RTV them in place on the bare head > surface and install the side gaskets over them. > > While it works fine in california, it may not be the right choice for Tigers > in the Northeast (etc.) that see winter time duty (not sure where you are > located). Among other benefits, it's designed to help to speed winter warm-ups > and prevent carb icing. > > Peter > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 30 14:14:27 2009 From: "Smit, Theo" To: , , Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 14:12:15 -0600 Subject: Re: [Tigers] SUNI winners I can put together a webpage on tigersunited.com... But I need source material. Was anyone taking notes at the banquet? Pictures of the various winning cars and people would also be great. Theo > -----Original Message----- > From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net > [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of wsamouce@kc.rr.com > Sent: June 30, 2009 1:02 PM > To: awtiger@cox.net; tigers@autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Tigers] SUNI winners > > Yet another reason for a website........but don't get me > started again. > > Duke > B382002037 > > > ---- awtiger@cox.net wrote: > > I second that motion!! We had to leave early, too, and > have never heard the outcome of the concours event. How 'bout it??? > > > > Andy Walker > > Edmond, OK > > B382001600LRXFE (TAC #740) > > B9006857LRX > > > > ---- wsamouce@kc.rr.com wrote: > > > I was not present for the awards dinner (even though I > paid for it), and am wondering who won what? > > > > > > Thanks for any info! > > > > > > Duke > > > B382002037 > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > > > Tigers@autox.team.net > > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > > > > > http://www.team.net/archive > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 30 14:22:50 2009 From: Tony Somebody To: tigers@autox.team.net Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 13:22:39 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [Tigers] SUNI winners At the banquet, they took pics as they handed out awards for each class. Im sure the pic, information etc will all be available soon. I would love to tell you who won what but there where so many classes plus autocross awards its tough on a blonde to remember so much information. A bit of patience and Im sure a list will be forthcoming. TtT _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 30 15:51:50 2009 From: "Lynn Wall" To: "'Tony Somebody'" , "'Beamclub'" Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 15:51:29 -0600 Subject: Re: [Tigers] SUNI Well said. -----Original Message----- From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Tony Somebody Sent: Monday, June 29, 2009 10:18 PM To: Beamclub; TheoSmit; wsamouce@kc.rr.com Subject: Re: [Tigers] SUNI Im home after a 24 lay over at friends out side of StL after dropping Mike off at the airport Sun afternoon. I want to THANK Max and his team for a wonderful time, for all the hard work and long hours they endured so that the rest of us might enjoy ourselves. I got to meet several people that I wanted to but also missed out on meting others.It was also great visiting with old friends and Ive gone so far as no longer refering to Doug Jr. as "Dougie"- from now on he is Doug, just like Sr. after all he is way past the age of IE after his name, so Doug, I hope to see you and your Dad, Doug at the Dayton SOS. TOO,I got my Tiger TACed and that alone was worth the trip- evnetho 2 thousand plus miles in a Tiger during a presummer heat wave is tough on a fat boy- at least this one. To address the person and I say that singuarly becuse I cant imangine two people with no spine at the same location. Theo wishes bad things for your car. I personally just want to know who you are, I wont describe the thoughts and ideas that I feel you deserve but PLEASE , never show yourself at another Sunbeam function. If you needed those parts that bad, I would have given you some- maybe not as nice but still free and you wouldnt have to be afraid of the consequenses if people ever learn your idenity. Just imangine, no one would ever help you with any problem. sell you any part,wouldnt even have a cold beer with you, much less talk to you. Could it be possible its worth having your name black listed forever. I cant imangine it is. You know, you could be man enough to mail the parts to any member and they would get returned and the owners and just maybe you could sleep at night. God has a way of getting people like you. May you find forgiveness from HIM, for I will never forget and I pray HE helps me forgive. It will take HIS help I promise. TonytheTiger Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 30 16:01:45 2009 From: Owain Lloyd To: tigers@autox.team.net Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 22:59:14 +0100 Subject: [Tigers] distributor i wonder if anyone knows what the internals of this distributor are? it has a regular ford stamped lower body and this non standard rotor shaft. there is a blue plastic 'large' style upper body and a red HEI cap. none of the parts are marked. i'd like to get a new rotor for it but i'm not sure what to buy to fit that shaft. http://owainlloyd.no-ip.com:8080/photos/Tiger/dizzy/IMG_0858.jpg http://owainlloyd.no-ip.com:8080/photos/Tiger/dizzy/IMG_0859.jpg thanks, - owain. _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 30 16:09:35 2009 From: "Smit, Theo" To: , Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 16:09:21 -0600 Subject: Re: [Tigers] distributor Looks like standard Ford hardware to me, from about '77 to '85 where they used the Duraspark module. I gutted one of these distributors and used the upper halfshaft, with the reluctor, and the advance plate, inside an early style distributor with a vacuum advance diaphragm mount. I wired it direct to my MSD6AL and it worked great until the cam ate the distributor gear (no, it was not a roller cam engine - just poor lubrication). Theo > -----Original Message----- > From: tigers-bounces@autox.team.net > [mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Owain Lloyd > Sent: June 30, 2009 3:59 PM > To: tigers@autox.team.net > Subject: [Tigers] distributor > > i wonder if anyone knows what the internals of this distributor are? > > it has a regular ford stamped lower body and this non > standard rotor shaft. > there is a blue plastic 'large' style upper body and a red > HEI cap. none of the parts are marked. i'd like to get a > new rotor for it but i'm not sure what to buy to fit that shaft. > > http://owainlloyd.no-ip.com:8080/photos/Tiger/dizzy/IMG_0858.jpg > http://owainlloyd.no-ip.com:8080/photos/Tiger/dizzy/IMG_0859.jpg > > thanks, > > - owain. > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 30 18:03:02 2009 From: "Buck Trippel" To: , Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 16:56:01 -0700 Subject: Re: [Tigers] SUNI winners Off the top of my head, understanding that my recollections are vague and inconsistent and certainly not guaranteed... Furthest driven was given to the folks from BC (even though we drove further, I was the presenter so I couldn't give it to myself). (Well at least I didn't) Furthest away: the Lewis couple from Austrailia. Hard Luck: Rob Guerrera Autocross: Mens fast time: Burns Mens Tiger 1st Burns, 2nd McDaniel, 3rd Douggie?? Womens Tiger 1st Claudia Mens Alpine Steve Alcala Womens Alpine Jane Alcala Popular vote Tiger Dave McDermott Alpine Steve Alcala Concours Tiger Modified 1st Dale A 2nd John Engle And I don't remember much more except that I believe Duke got 3rd in Stock Tiger Buck Trippel . ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Tuesday, June 30, 2009 9:11 AM Subject: [Tigers] SUNI winners >I was not present for the awards dinner (even though I paid for it), and am >wondering who won what? > > Thanks for any info! > > Duke > B382002037 > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 30 20:06:51 2009 From: "Mark Rense" To: Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 22:06:37 -0400 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Towing a Tiger I was driving along thinking about towing vehicles in one of my Tigers when it struck me...a fine vintage English car needs to be hauled by a fine modern English motor vehicle. I believe if you examine the towing specifications, any of the Range Rovers, be it a HSE or LR3, will tow 7700 lbs (550 stone) worth of trailer in complete luxury. That seems to me to be the only proper answer! Now I know Rover is not really a British company anymore, but either is Jaguar, Mini or Lotus, so get over it and just accept it as you sink into that fine Connelly leather seat. Bugz _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 30 20:09:11 2009 From: michael king To: Mark Rense Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 12:08:59 +1000 Subject: Re: [Tigers] Towing a Tiger On that line of thinking.. and keeping to tiger tradition.. best option is the new Morgan Aero 8.. Still a british owned car company, still built there.. has a foreign (bmw) V8... seems the ideal solution :-) 2009/7/1 Mark Rense > I was driving along thinking about towing vehicles in one of my Tigers when > it struck me...a fine vintage English car needs to be hauled by a fine > modern English motor vehicle. I believe if you examine the towing > specifications, any of the Range Rovers, be it a HSE or LR3, will tow 7700 > lbs (550 stone) worth of trailer in complete luxury. That seems to me to be > the only proper answer! > > Now I know Rover is not really a British company anymore, but either is > Jaguar, Mini or Lotus, so get over it and just accept it as you sink into > that fine Connelly leather seat. > > Bugz > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Tigers@autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers > > http://www.team.net/archive > -- Regards Michael King _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 30 21:25:29 2009 From: DAVID GREEN To: Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 21:25:08 -0600 Subject: [Tigers] Suni 5 a Great Time! All Sunbeamers, Sue and I had a blast at Suni 5. Many thanks to Max, Jerry And Marlene, plus all who made this event a success. Location was great with lots to see. "Sprout" S1 Alpine performed splendidly. We did get caught in a heavy rain strom when in Deadwood on Friday and chased it all the way back to Rapid City. We caught up to it a couple of times and had to park until we could safely proceed. Even this was fun! Glad to have seen old friends, meet new friends, and put faces to lister's names. Sorry to hear of the thefts a the vendors room. Hope this person suffers the wrath of the Lucas Gods! Anyway enjoyed it and looking forward to Suni 6!!!! Take care all of you. Dave Green _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive From tigers-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jun 30 23:10:10 2009 From: "Buck Trippel" To: Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 22:09:38 -0700 Subject: [Tigers] SUNI Hi Guys, I'm in the process of posting some of my SUNI pictures on the CAT Forum site. Here're some links to the Pictures that are currently available: Going to SUNI http://www.catmbr.org/VB_forum/showthread.php?t=22 SUNI Concours Pt I http://www.catmbr.org/VB_forum/showthread.php?t=24 SUNI Concours Pt II http://www.catmbr.org/VB_forum/showthread.php?t=26 SUNI Concours Pt III http://www.catmbr.org/VB_forum/showthread.php?t=27 SUNI @ Mt. Rushmore http://www.catmbr.org/VB_forum/showthread.php?t=28 Coming Home from SUNI http://www.catmbr.org/VB_forum/showthread.php?t=20 I'll be away from the computer for a few days but will try to get the Badlands Tour, some Autocross action and (for Duke) some of the Chuck Wagon Dinner Party up by this coming weekend. Buck _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Tigers@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/tigers http://www.team.net/archive