[JONAT] Costs and revenue
Bob
jonat@autox.team.net
Thu Feb 26 14:25:01 2004
And watch out for our mad cows! We're not quite sure what they're mad at
yet, and there has only been one really mad one, but boy the press seems to
think it's very upset.
-----Original Message-----
From: jonat-admin@autox.team.net [mailto:jonat-admin@autox.team.net]On
Behalf Of Fazal Cader
Sent: February 26, 2004 2:52 PM
To: jonat@autox.team.net
Subject: Re: [JONAT] Costs and revenue
I didn't realise that diseases were that regional in the North American
continent. I contribute to fighting diseases in areas I never want to drive
through!
Fazal Cader
Executive Committee, ISC - Australia
Jaguar Owner's North American Tour - www.jonat.org
April 15, 2004 - July 4, 2004
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob" <engl@accesscomm.ca>
To: <jonat@autox.team.net>
Sent: Friday, February 27, 2004 3:56 AM
Subject: RE: [JONAT] Costs and revenue
Regina is Multiple Sclerosis ... have you selected one for you sector ?
-----Original Message-----
From: jonat-admin@autox.team.net [mailto:jonat-admin@autox.team.net]On
Behalf Of Dr Gregory Andrachuk
Sent: February 26, 2004 9:55 AM
To: jonat@autox.team.net
Subject: Re: [JONAT] Costs and revenue
Bob: selling of a fee for this thing will require specifics about WHICH
charity, and where it is. It isn't reasonable to expect people in Victoria
to be excited about contributing to a charity in Atlanta.
Gregory
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob" <engl@accesscomm.ca>
To: <jonat@autox.team.net>
Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2004 6:04 AM
Subject: RE: [JONAT] Costs and revenue
: Mark
:
: You are right on a number of counts, but I disagree on others. Keep in
: mind, I'm an Engineer not an accountant, and forced into putting a budget
: together as no-one else would volunteer. The budget was reviewed by
others,
: but you can blame me for it 100%.
:
: I did want to clarify one thing though. The $5000 I mentioned in my
e-mail
: was seed money for printing the plates, not an out-of-pocket amount for
low
: participation. Sorry if I mislead you on this - my better half would kill
: me if I dropped $5k on this event!
:
: Also, keep in mind as we move along we are refining the costs. For
example,
: we have some legal advice (yesterday) that indicated rather than register
as
: a non-profit (not a charity) (registering as a charity is about $300 by
the
: way, this is info from late Tuesday) with participants, we're best to be
an
: association with members. Although this is in Canada only, it still is a
: pretty darn good saving, which would mean additional $ to charity.
:
: I haven't heard anyone mention charity yet (including me), lets not forget
: this aspect.
:
: Bob England
:
:
: -----Original Message-----
: From: jonat-admin@autox.team.net [mailto:jonat-admin@autox.team.net]On
: Behalf Of Mark Stephenson
: Sent: February 26, 2004 2:41 AM
: To: jonat@autox.team.net
: Subject: [JONAT] Costs and revenue
:
:
: "A good portion of our membership monies will come from participants that
: are in the local clubs - this may create a situation where we would not
: reach the break even number due to all of the "exempt" drivers in this
: scenario" - this would tick me off royally as I'm the guy who is likely
: going to have to spring the $5,000 to pay for the registration packages
: until the money starts rolling (well trickling really) in." -Bob
:
: See:
: http://jonat.org/bob/registrationform/registrationbudget.htm
: For the numbers I reference below.
:
: Bob,
:
: Oh, pullllleeeaaaaassssse! You are making it look like you are going to be
: $5000 out of pocket if we only have 100 entrants. No way!
:
: I started to write you an e-mail off list because I felt we were
: overcharging. A number of us requested that you keep the costs down, but
in
: the end, the EC came up with a cost close to where it was before we
started
: the discussion. That's fine. It's your decision. I was too irritated at
the
: time and held the e-mail until I could tone down my rhetoric. This
however,
: sends me over the top, so I'm cranking up my old-time cash register and
: pullin' the shotgun out from under the counter.
:
: First of all, you guys came up with the rule that if there aren't five
: entrants in a sector, the SC has to pay. Well, excuse me, but how are you
: going to have 90 free SCs with only 14 paid entrants. You would have at
: most, two people on a free ride. That means you'd have 102 paid
: registrations which would equal, with shipping, $4794Cdn. Given total
: expenses of $5369.28, you'd be out less than $600.
:
: Cha-ching.
:
: Let's take a look at some of the expenses. Why do we have to register as a
: charity? In two countries? We're not doing any charitable work. We might
be
: passing money through to a charity, but it doesn't mean that we have to
: register as one. All we have to do, if we want to go to the trouble right
: now, is form a non-profit corporation. In the U.S. that costs a few
hundred
: dollars. I can't believe it's much more in Canada. You don't have to do
that
: in every country just because you're driving there. Just pick one. US?
: Canada? But why be out of pocket now? Use some of the extra money after
the
: tour. There's $2000 in costs eliminated.
:
: Cha-ching.
:
: What are the registration inserts? We can get copies made down here for
: 5¢/page. If you double that for Cdn$, that's 50 pages per entrant. What
are
: we printing that's 50 pages? Someone is doing a whole lot of writing. If
: it's the JONAT info, maps, and directions, the simple solution is to have
: all that on line (as we discussed on this forum), have people download it,
: and print it out themselves. If someone who doesn't have Internet access
: knows about the tour, a friend had to have told them. The friend would
print
: out info. For those who have no way of getting the information, the SCs
can
: bring a copy of the route info to the starting point and have the
travelers
: make the copies themselves. Add another $565+Cdn.
:
: Cha-ching -- savings subtotal $2565 pops up in curly numbers. At the same
: time, we've cut the shipping costs, and reduced the amount of stuff the
SCs
: have to carry from one sector to the next.
:
: Packaging costs. You have $2.00 + tax for packaging for each entrant. That
: would be $20 for a box and filler to send 10 plates to an SC. We don't
have
: to get fancy to send things to the SC. Instead wrap the license plates in
: old newspapers -- they're free. Go to the local grocery or computer store
: and get boxes. Cut a piece of corrugated cardboard and wrap it around the
: ten plates. Tape the ends and the overlap. The plates will provide the
: rigidity. They aren't going to get bent. Packaging costs have now been
: reduced to $0. Even if you wanted to buy boxes that were close to the
: correct size, they would be at most, $5 with tax. For 100 participants,
: that's a savings of $200+Cdn or around $50 if you buy boxes.
:
: Cha-ching -- the little pointy-topped metal plates say savings subtotal
: approx. $2700.
:
: Now take a look at shipping costs. I think you are totally off base. If an
: SC has ten registrants, there is no way it is going to cost $70 to ship 10
: aluminum license plates to a SC (even if you were going to include the
ream
: of paper which doesn't appear to be necessary). I can't see it costing
more
: than $20 by UPS ground. Actually, I think something that size and weight
: anywhere within the US would be about $10US. If it's a lot more than my
: estimate to ship from Canada compared to the US, then ship one box with
all
: the plates across the border and have someone here send them out to the
SCs.
: Savings from $70 estimate to $20 estimate - at least $500 for 100
entrants.
:
: Cha-ching, cha-ching -- savings total at least $3200Cdn.
:
: OK, the big concern is what do we do with the late registrants? First off,
: don't make an excessive amount of plates in advance. I'm assuming that we
: are talking vinyl cut-outs on the aluminum plate. The most time consuming
: part is setting up the software to make your image. Once that's done, it
: doesn't cost any more to make up ten sets of letters than it does to make
: 100. Sure, you have to load the vinyl into the machine but that's a 5
minute
: job. I know because my brother did it as a sideline for a while. Next,
make
: the late registrants pay. Make it clear that if they register after a
: certain date, the plates will have already been sent to the SC, so they
will
: have to have theirs made specially and sent directly to them and there's
no
: guarantee that it will arrive in time for their sector departure. Get a
time
: frame for an order of a few plates from the vinyl cutter and post it on
the
: web site. Calculate how much it is to send one plate ground, 3rd day, 2nd
: day, and overnig!
: ht and have those shipping options available on the web site. Bump up the
: registration by an additional $20 for your time and trouble to
individually
: pack the plate. If 25 of the 100 registrants are late (and if our club is
: any indication, that's a conservative figure), you have an additional $500
: in revenue..
:
: If they don't get the plates in time, it's no big deal. I don't have a
place
: to mount it on my car and probably the majority of entrants won't either.
: Jags in states with no front plate requirement often don't have the ugly
: brackets installed. People in states that require front plates can't put
: them on. So most people are just going to be carrying them inside the car
: anyway.
:
: With the savings and revenue projections above and with only 100 entrants
: (an underestimation I'll bet) not only won't you be out of pocket, you'll
: have over $2500 for charity, to form a non-profit, and as seed money next
: time. If we eliminated the exorbitant $7.00 shipping cost and just charge
: the $40 for the people who are going to pick up their plates at the
: beginning of their sector, we'd still have nearly $2000 excess with only
100
: registrants.
:
: Keeping that in mind, here is how I'm going to approach it in my sector.
: People who want to be JONATers with the plate and everything can pay the
$40
: or whatever. By the same token, you guys are out of pocket for the website
: and the bank charges. If we had only 100 entrants, that would be
: $4.50Cdn/person. So, I'm going to get all the people who don't want or
need
: all the paraphernalia to kick in $10US for you guys and the work you've
: done. That would be about $15Cdn. I expect about 25 local cars to take at
: least part of my sector, so that's another $375 for the kitty. Keep in
mind
: that my group is already paying $44 for the Rt. 66 Fun Run. The Phoenix
: spur, the Fun Run, and the roads back are the exact same route they'd take
: if you, me, and the local club was not involved, so there's not much value
: add there. I'll push hard for the folks traveling to the Grand Canyon or
: earlier in my sector to pay the $36US, or maybe I'll see if they want to
pay
: $20 and skip the license plat!
: es and 50 pages of stuff.
:
: OK, now that I've gotten that off my chest, I'll get my route directions
to
: you, along with the hotels and eateries, just in time for the 2/29
deadline.
: :-)
:
: Mark - AZ
:
:
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