From eric at megageek.com Thu May 2 05:57:36 2019 From: eric at megageek.com (eric at megageek.com) Date: Thu, 2 May 2019 07:57:36 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] High end Flare nut wrench sets- and the power of induction! Message-ID: Morning all! I'm not a snap-on guy, I realize the quality is there, but I normally don't need it for the premium it costs. Last night, I was working on brake lines and some of the nuts were rusted on tight. My normal flare wrenches were actually opening up as I put force on them. So I'm ready to put serious money on a good set (both metric and SAE), but not knowing the top end brands well, which should I look for? Is Snap-on the way to go? Is Mac or another brand just as good? What about the gear wrench brand and other ones on Amazon? (like these OEM brand https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07876M87B/ref=psdc_553422_t2_B000V5CZXY NOTE, I do NOT want flex head.) Also, where is a good place to get the wrenches? If I go Snap-on, do I have to find a truck? BTW, in the end I got to use my induction bolt heater for a stuck on bleeder valve. I couldn't believe how well it worked! About 4 mins from opening the case to putting it back down. A few minutes to let the nut cool, and it just came right off! Here is the link... https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07PDBVWJM/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1 No flames, no damage to any of the rubber lines near the nut. Just 'as seen on YouTube' action! Sent from my Commodore 64 on a 2400 Baud Modem. Tech Viper "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson -Who is John Galt? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jmitch at snet.net Thu May 2 06:25:31 2019 From: jmitch at snet.net (John Mitchell) Date: Thu, 2 May 2019 08:25:31 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] GMC front suspension refresh Message-ID: I have a 2005 GMC Sierra Denali that I have owned since new. It's AWD and has 117,000 miles.?? The front end is not as tight as I would like and I wanted to refresh the front end.?? I've seen the kits from various manufacturers that include ball joints, A-arms, etc.?? I've researched them online and most appear to be junk. Even Moog doesn't have the reputation it once had.?? Should I bite the bullet and buy individual AC/Delco parts and which ones, or is there a decent manufacturer of suspension parts out there. Thanks?????????????? John?????? Shelton, CT From mayfield+shoptalk at sackheads.org Thu May 2 08:00:13 2019 From: mayfield+shoptalk at sackheads.org (Jimmie Mayfield) Date: Thu, 2 May 2019 10:00:13 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] High end Flare nut wrench sets- and the power of induction! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Ouch.? $299 for the bolt heater.? I was ready to buy one until I saw the price.? For now I've added it to my would-be-nice-to-have list.? Out of curiosity, I wonder how often you have to replace the heating coil? On 5/2/19 7:57 AM, eric--- via Shop-talk wrote: > Morning all! > > I'm not a snap-on guy, I realize the quality is there, but I normally > don't need it for the premium it costs. > > Last night, I was working on brake lines and some of the nuts were > rusted on tight. ?My normal flare wrenches were actually opening up as > I put force on them. > > So I'm ready to put serious money on a good set (both metric and SAE), > but not knowing the top end brands well, which should I look for? > > Is Snap-on the way to go? ?Is Mac or another brand just as good? ?What > about the gear wrench brand and other ones on Amazon? ?(like these OEM > brand > _https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07876M87B/ref=psdc_553422_t2_B000V5CZXY_? > NOTE, I do NOT want flex head.) > > Also, where is a good place to get the wrenches? ?If I go Snap-on, do > I have to find a truck? > > > BTW, in the end I got to use my induction bolt heater for a stuck on > bleeder valve. ?I couldn't believe how well it worked! ?About 4 mins > from opening the case to putting it back down. ?A few minutes to let > the nut cool, and it just came right off! > > Here is the link... > _https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07PDBVWJM/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1_ > > No flames, no damage to any of the rubber lines near the nut. ?Just > 'as seen on YouTube' action! > > > Sent from my Commodore 64 on a 2400 Baud Modem. > Tech Viper > "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a > rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your > territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson > -Who is John Galt? > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/mayfield+shoptalk at sackheads.org > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From eric at megageek.com Thu May 2 08:11:28 2019 From: eric at megageek.com (eric at megageek.com) Date: Thu, 2 May 2019 10:11:28 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] High end Flare nut wrench sets- and the power of induction! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Yes, it was a little pricey, but there are smaller/cheaper units (but I can't say how well they work, I'm sure they would be fine.) For last night, to get that nut off and prevent me from having to remove a caliper, drill out the nut, chase a thread, replace the nut and put it all back on, not to mention the aggravation that goes with it, it paid for itself! I was even able to reuse the bleed nut (not my car, and the person needed it to get to work today, so getting a replacement last night wasn't an option.) I'm now not worried about rusty bolt as much. It's a go to tool for sure! Sent from my Commodore 64 on a 2400 Baud Modem. Tech Viper "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson -Who is John Galt? From: Jimmie Mayfield via Shop-talk To: shop-talk at autox.team.net Date: 05/02/2019 10:00 AM Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] High end Flare nut wrench sets- and the power of induction! Sent by: "Shop-talk" Ouch. $299 for the bolt heater. I was ready to buy one until I saw the price. For now I've added it to my would-be-nice-to-have list. Out of curiosity, I wonder how often you have to replace the heating coil? On 5/2/19 7:57 AM, eric--- via Shop-talk wrote: Morning all! I'm not a snap-on guy, I realize the quality is there, but I normally don't need it for the premium it costs. Last night, I was working on brake lines and some of the nuts were rusted on tight. My normal flare wrenches were actually opening up as I put force on them. So I'm ready to put serious money on a good set (both metric and SAE), but not knowing the top end brands well, which should I look for? Is Snap-on the way to go? Is Mac or another brand just as good? What about the gear wrench brand and other ones on Amazon? (like these OEM brand https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07876M87B/ref=psdc_553422_t2_B000V5CZXY NOTE, I do NOT want flex head.) Also, where is a good place to get the wrenches? If I go Snap-on, do I have to find a truck? BTW, in the end I got to use my induction bolt heater for a stuck on bleeder valve. I couldn't believe how well it worked! About 4 mins from opening the case to putting it back down. A few minutes to let the nut cool, and it just came right off! Here is the link... https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07PDBVWJM/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1 No flames, no damage to any of the rubber lines near the nut. Just 'as seen on YouTube' action! Sent from my Commodore 64 on a 2400 Baud Modem. Tech Viper "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson -Who is John Galt? _______________________________________________ Shop-talk at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Suggested annual donation $12.96 Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/mayfield+shoptalk at sackheads.org _______________________________________________ Shop-talk at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Suggested annual donation $12.96 Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/eric at megageek.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ronnie.day at gmail.com Thu May 2 09:28:58 2019 From: ronnie.day at gmail.com (Ronnie Day) Date: Thu, 2 May 2019 10:28:58 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] GMC front suspension refresh In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Some years ago we bought an ?02 Suburban (2WD) with 102K on it. The looseness of the front really bugged me until we replaced both the idler and pitman arms. We also soon replaced one of the front unit bearings and the shocks. The parts were OE except the shocks, IIRC. All that made a huge difference in how the truck drove and felt. It now has around 185K on it and is still pretty tight. Look at RockAuto to compare OE and aftermarket prices. On Thu, May 2, 2019 at 7:25 AM John Mitchell via Shop-talk < shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote: > I have a 2005 GMC Sierra Denali that I have owned since new. It's AWD > and has 117,000 miles.?? The front end is not as tight as I would like > and I wanted to refresh the front end.?? I've seen the kits from various > manufacturers that include ball joints, A-arms, etc.?? I've researched > them online and most appear to be junk. Even Moog doesn't have the > reputation it once had.?? Should I bite the bullet and buy individual > AC/Delco parts and which ones, or is there a decent manufacturer of > suspension parts out there. Thanks?????????????? John?????? Shelton, CT > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/ronnie.day at gmail.com > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dmscheidt at gmail.com Thu May 2 09:39:52 2019 From: dmscheidt at gmail.com (David Scheidt) Date: Thu, 2 May 2019 10:39:52 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] High end Flare nut wrench sets- and the power of induction! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Thu, May 2, 2019 at 6:58 AM eric--- via Shop-talk wrote: > > Morning all! > > I'm not a snap-on guy, I realize the quality is there, but I normally don't need it for the premium it costs. > > Last night, I was working on brake lines and some of the nuts were rusted on tight. My normal flare wrenches were actually opening up as I put force on them. > > So I'm ready to put serious money on a good set (both metric and SAE), but not knowing the top end brands well, which should I look for? > > Is Snap-on the way to go? Is Mac or another brand just as good? What about the gear wrench brand and other ones on Amazon? (like these OEM brand https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07876M87B/ref=psdc_553422_t2_B000V5CZXY NOTE, I do NOT want flex head.) Snap-On and SK are the only readily available flare nut wrenches worth owning. I suspect the expensive high end german wrenches are nice, too, but I have no experience with their flare wrenches. Everything else is garbage. I have broken a snap-on flare wrench on a seriously stuck brake line fitting -- but, and this is important, the only other thing damaged were my knuckles. The fitting was not damaged, and we were able to take it apart after getting heat into it. > > Also, where is a good place to get the wrenches? If I go Snap-on, do I have to find a truck? > > Used snap on flare wrenches are available for a decent price, look at ebay; if you want new, find the truck (you can buy from the website, the truck will probably give you a little better price.). For SK, if they're not sold locally to you, try Harry Epstein (https://www.harryepstein.com/). -- David Scheidt dmscheidt at gmail.com From jem at milleredp.com Thu May 2 09:50:27 2019 From: jem at milleredp.com (John Miller) Date: Thu, 2 May 2019 08:50:27 -0700 Subject: [Shop-talk] High end Flare nut wrench sets- and the power of induction! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <854f69eb-900f-bcb5-cc96-bc8532eb8c38@milleredp.com> > Snap-On and SK are the only readily available flare nut wrenches worth > owning. I suspect the expensive high end german wrenches are nice, > too, but I have no experience with their flare wrenches. Everything > else is garbage. I have broken a snap-on flare wrench on a seriously > stuck brake line fitting -- but, and this is important, the only other > thing damaged were my knuckles. The fitting was not damaged, and we > were able to take it apart after getting heat into it. I have to admit, this is about on target. I got sick of rounding off tube nuts (and having to resort to the Ultimate Flare-Nut Wrench - the Vise-Grip) and went out and got a bunch of Snap-Ons. Happy, happy, joy, joy as they used to say. Mine came off eBay. A good place to get stuff if you know what you're looking for, Mac, the poverty-spec Snap-Ons (Blue Point) and '60s-70s Craftsman are often a reasonable deal. John. From jem at milleredp.com Thu May 2 10:07:31 2019 From: jem at milleredp.com (John Miller) Date: Thu, 2 May 2019 09:07:31 -0700 Subject: [Shop-talk] GMC front suspension refresh In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On 5/2/2019 5:25 AM, John Mitchell via Shop-talk wrote: > I have a 2005 GMC Sierra Denali that I have owned since new. It's AWD > and has 117,000 miles.?? The front end is not as tight as I would like > and I wanted to refresh the front end.?? I've seen the kits from various > manufacturers that include ball joints, A-arms, etc.?? I've researched > them online and most appear to be junk. Even Moog doesn't have the > reputation it once had.?? Should I bite the bullet and buy individual > AC/Delco parts and which ones, or is there a decent manufacturer of > suspension parts out there. Thanks?????????????? John?????? Shelton, CT Let's see, I've got a 2003 Suburban 2500 4x4 and a 2002 Silverado 2500 2WD diesel, for some reason the GMT800 seems to suit me... Both are substantially original, they both have Bilsteins, the Suburban got a couple new front wheel bearings and new sway-bar end links. They have these little bumpstops/auxiliary rubber springs/whatever that die routinely (the truck needs them now) and the steering intermediate shaft is renowned for developing a knocking knoise (the Silverado's was replaced before I got it and is quiet now, I have the part to do the Suburban on the shelf but just haven't gotten to it, that one has the adjustable pedals and apparently it's a bit more of a PITA on those.) I've been happy enough with Moog parts but bear in mind that it looks like everyone (including ACDelco) these days has a cheap-line and an OEM-grade line. John. From jmitch at snet.net Thu May 2 10:14:12 2019 From: jmitch at snet.net (John Mitchell) Date: Thu, 2 May 2019 12:14:12 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] GMC front suspension refresh In-Reply-To: <000001d500f0$4e6fd2c0$eb4f7840$@com> References: <000001d500f0$4e6fd2c0$eb4f7840$@com> Message-ID: <4013ff5f-ca06-73cf-b1f3-3113f6f0a1cc@snet.net> I love the truck and still looks new.?? I haven't had any issues with it, but of course now that I've said that, something bad will happen.?? The price of a new replacement for this truck is just obscene. I will probably keep it as long as it makes financial sense,?? maybe 200, 000 miles.?? Thanks for the advice on Moog. On 5/2/2019 10:06 AM, Pat Horne wrote: > John, > > First question is how long do you plan to keep the truck with how many miles > to add. > > I still use Moog parts & a local shop does too. They say they Moog is still > the best aftermarket supplier. > > Check Rock Auto to see what the price differences are for OEM vs. others. > > Peace, > Pat > > -----Original Message----- > From: Shop-talk [mailto:shop-talk-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of John > Mitchell via Shop-talk > Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2019 7:26 AM > To: Shop Talk > Subject: [Shop-talk] GMC front suspension refresh > > I have a 2005 GMC Sierra Denali that I have owned since new. It's AWD > and has 117,000 miles.?? The front end is not as tight as I would like > and I wanted to refresh the front end.?? I've seen the kits from various > manufacturers that include ball joints, A-arms, etc.?? I've researched > them online and most appear to be junk. Even Moog doesn't have the > reputation it once had.?? Should I bite the bullet and buy individual > AC/Delco parts and which ones, or is there a decent manufacturer of > suspension parts out there. Thanks?????????????? John?????? Shelton, CT > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patintexas at icloud.com > > > From jmitch at snet.net Thu May 2 10:15:41 2019 From: jmitch at snet.net (John Mitchell) Date: Thu, 2 May 2019 12:15:41 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] GMC front suspension refresh In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <8c000667-5d86-84dc-ddb5-11f70033e924@snet.net> Thanks, that helps to narrow what I need to buy. On 5/2/2019 11:28 AM, Ronnie Day wrote: > Some years ago we bought an ???02 Suburban (2WD) with 102K on it. The > looseness of the front really bugged me until we replaced both the > idler and pitman arms. We also soon replaced one of the front unit > bearings and the shocks. The parts were OE except the shocks, IIRC. > All that made a huge difference in how the truck drove and felt. It > now has around 185K on it and is still pretty tight. > > Look at RockAuto to compare OE and aftermarket prices. > > On Thu, May 2, 2019 at 7:25 AM John Mitchell via Shop-talk > > wrote: > > I have a 2005 GMC Sierra Denali that I have owned since new. It's AWD > and has 117,000 miles.?? The front end is not as tight as I would > like > and I wanted to refresh the front end.?? I've seen the kits from > various > manufacturers that include ball joints, A-arms, etc.?? I've > researched > them online and most appear to be junk. Even Moog doesn't have the > reputation it once had.?? Should I bite the bullet and buy individual > AC/Delco parts and which ones, or is there a decent manufacturer of > suspension parts out there. Thanks?????????????? John?????? > Shelton, CT > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation?? $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/ronnie.day at gmail.com > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From eric at megageek.com Thu May 2 12:08:13 2019 From: eric at megageek.com (eric at megageek.com) Date: Thu, 2 May 2019 14:08:13 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] High end Flare nut wrench sets- and the power of induction! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Thanks David (and the others) I ordered a full set from Harry Epstein's. I'm looking forward to them! Sent from my Commodore 64 on a 2400 Baud Modem. Tech Viper "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson -Who is John Galt? From: David Scheidt To: "eric at megageek.com" , shop-talk Date: 05/02/2019 11:40 AM Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] High end Flare nut wrench sets- and the power of induction! On Thu, May 2, 2019 at 6:58 AM eric--- via Shop-talk wrote: > > Morning all! > > I'm not a snap-on guy, I realize the quality is there, but I normally don't need it for the premium it costs. > > Last night, I was working on brake lines and some of the nuts were rusted on tight. My normal flare wrenches were actually opening up as I put force on them. > > So I'm ready to put serious money on a good set (both metric and SAE), but not knowing the top end brands well, which should I look for? > > Is Snap-on the way to go? Is Mac or another brand just as good? What about the gear wrench brand and other ones on Amazon? (like these OEM brand https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07876M87B/ref=psdc_553422_t2_B000V5CZXY NOTE, I do NOT want flex head.) Snap-On and SK are the only readily available flare nut wrenches worth owning. I suspect the expensive high end german wrenches are nice, too, but I have no experience with their flare wrenches. Everything else is garbage. I have broken a snap-on flare wrench on a seriously stuck brake line fitting -- but, and this is important, the only other thing damaged were my knuckles. The fitting was not damaged, and we were able to take it apart after getting heat into it. > > Also, where is a good place to get the wrenches? If I go Snap-on, do I have to find a truck? > > Used snap on flare wrenches are available for a decent price, look at ebay; if you want new, find the truck (you can buy from the website, the truck will probably give you a little better price.). For SK, if they're not sold locally to you, try Harry Epstein (https://www.harryepstein.com/). -- David Scheidt dmscheidt at gmail.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pethier7 at gmail.com Tue May 7 17:26:25 2019 From: pethier7 at gmail.com (Philip Ethier) Date: Tue, 7 May 2019 18:26:25 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] sealant for tapered threads in gasoline line. Hylomar? Message-ID: Sealant for tapered threads in gasoline line. Hylomar? Suspect small leak in Facet fuel pump output, tapered thresd, which was assembled dry. Is good old Hylomar Blue a good product here? I have some on hand. Is there a favorite others have used? -- Phil Ethier West Side Saint Paul Minnesota USA 1973 Triumph Stag LE22439UBW "uncle jack", Sapphire Blue 2004 Suburban 8.1, Sport Red 2005 Lotus Elise, Bordeaux Red Pearl 2006 Gulf Stream Conquest Super C, 8.1, White 2017 Ford Fusion SE 2.0 Turbo, Oxford White http://www.mnautox.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From stearman809 at gmail.com Tue May 7 17:37:02 2019 From: stearman809 at gmail.com (Karl Vacek) Date: Tue, 07 May 2019 18:37:02 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] sealant for tapered threads in gasoline line. Hylomar? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <16a94a85930.2800.cd27845553c78383775132770b7455be@gmail.com> Hylomar is probably fine. Aviation Permatex (brush-cap container) is great for gasoline connections too. On May 7, 2019 6:26:40 PM Philip Ethier via Shop-talk wrote: > Sealant for tapered threads in gasoline line. Hylomar? > > Suspect small leak in Facet fuel pump output, tapered thresd, which was > assembled dry. > > Is good old Hylomar Blue a good product here? I have some on hand. > > Is there a favorite others have used? > > > > > > -- > > Phil Ethier West Side Saint Paul Minnesota USA > 1973 Triumph Stag LE22439UBW "uncle jack", Sapphire Blue > 2004 Suburban 8.1, Sport Red > 2005 Lotus Elise, Bordeaux Red Pearl > 2006 Gulf Stream Conquest Super C, 8.1, White > 2017 Ford Fusion SE 2.0 Turbo, Oxford White > http://www.mnautox.com > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/stearman809 at gmail.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From patintexas at icloud.com Tue May 7 17:56:54 2019 From: patintexas at icloud.com (Pat Horne) Date: Tue, 7 May 2019 18:56:54 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] sealant for tapered threads in gasoline line. Hylomar? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I like permatex 3, also known as aviation form-a-gasket. Started using it in the 60?s on air cooled VW engines. It stands up to gasoline just fine. Peace, Pat Pat Horne We support Habitat for Humanity On May 7, 2019, at 6:26 PM, Philip Ethier via Shop-talk wrote: Sealant for tapered threads in gasoline line. Hylomar? Suspect small leak in Facet fuel pump output, tapered thresd, which was assembled dry. Is good old Hylomar Blue a good product here? I have some on hand. Is there a favorite others have used? -- Phil Ethier West Side Saint Paul Minnesota USA 1973 Triumph Stag LE22439UBW "uncle jack", Sapphire Blue 2004 Suburban 8.1, Sport Red 2005 Lotus Elise, Bordeaux Red Pearl 2006 Gulf Stream Conquest Super C, 8.1, White 2017 Ford Fusion SE 2.0 Turbo, Oxford White http://www.mnautox.com _______________________________________________ Shop-talk at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Suggested annual donation $12.96 Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patintexas at icloud.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bspidell at comcast.net Wed May 8 08:04:06 2019 From: bspidell at comcast.net (Bob Spidell) Date: Wed, 8 May 2019 07:04:06 -0700 Subject: [Shop-talk] sealant for tapered threads in gasoline line. Hylomar? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5bf3e2c7-6ae3-1f87-37fb-b11002e007ec@comcast.net> I've used this on cork gaskets to stop some pesky leaks: *https://tinyurl.com/y2lyh2mg* FWIW, it looks, smells and feels a lot like Hylomar (not sure how either would work on threads).? Teflon pipe sealant should work at least as good: https://www.grainger.com/product/PERMATEX-50mL-Tube-Pipe-Thread-Sealant-2GXX5 I think I'd go with the pipe sealant. Bob On 5/7/2019 4:26 PM, Philip Ethier via Shop-talk wrote: > Sealant for tapered threads in gasoline line. Hylomar? > > Suspect small leak in Facet fuel pump output, tapered thresd, which > was assembled dry. > > Is good old Hylomar Blue a good product here?? I have some on hand. > > Is there a favorite others have used? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jamesf at groupwbench.org Wed May 8 08:17:35 2019 From: jamesf at groupwbench.org (Jim Franklin) Date: Wed, 8 May 2019 10:17:35 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] sealant for tapered threads in gasoline line. Hylomar? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I've used Gasoila as the recommended sealant for fuel injection threads (unpressurized side). I don't remember if it was recommended for the pressurized side. https://www.gasoila.com/ jim > On May 7, 2019, at 7:26 PM, Philip Ethier via Shop-talk wrote: > > Sealant for tapered threads in gasoline line. Hylomar? > > Suspect small leak in Facet fuel pump output, tapered thresd, which was assembled dry. > > Is good old Hylomar Blue a good product here? I have some on hand. > > Is there a favorite others have used? > > > > > -- > Phil Ethier West Side Saint Paul Minnesota USA > 1973 Triumph Stag LE22439UBW "uncle jack", Sapphire Blue > 2004 Suburban 8.1, Sport Red > 2005 Lotus Elise, Bordeaux Red Pearl > 2006 Gulf Stream Conquest Super C, 8.1, White > 2017 Ford Fusion SE 2.0 Turbo, Oxford White > http://www.mnautox.com > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jamesf at groupwbench.org > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/pkcs7-signature Size: 1386 bytes Desc: not available URL: From patintexas at icloud.com Wed May 8 14:37:50 2019 From: patintexas at icloud.com (Pat Horne) Date: Wed, 8 May 2019 15:37:50 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] sealant for tapered threads in gasoline line. Hylomar? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <6FBA1803-3232-4293-9B30-38A99DD8C087@icloud.com> That?s it. You might try to find a smaller package, I could do several engines on this size container! I didn?t see that they still sell it in tubes so it might not be available. What makes this stuff so good is that it doesn?t harden so it doesn?t fracture under small movement. Peace, Pat Pat Horne We support Habitat for Humanity On May 8, 2019, at 3:28 PM, Philip Ethier wrote: I found this at NAPA in West Saint Paul: https://www.permatex.com/products/gasketing/gasket-sealants/permatex-aviation-form-a-gasket-no-3-sealant-liquid-3/ > On Tue, May 7, 2019 at 6:57 PM Pat Horne wrote: > I like permatex 3, also known as aviation form-a-gasket. Started using it in the 60?s on air cooled VW engines. It stands up to gasoline just fine. > > Peace, > Pat > > Pat Horne > We support Habitat for Humanity > > > On May 7, 2019, at 6:26 PM, Philip Ethier via Shop-talk wrote: > > Sealant for tapered threads in gasoline line. Hylomar? > > Suspect small leak in Facet fuel pump output, tapered thresd, which was assembled dry. > > Is good old Hylomar Blue a good product here? I have some on hand. > > Is there a favorite others have used? > > > > > -- > Phil Ethier West Side Saint Paul Minnesota USA > 1973 Triumph Stag LE22439UBW "uncle jack", Sapphire Blue > 2004 Suburban 8.1, Sport Red > 2005 Lotus Elise, Bordeaux Red Pearl > 2006 Gulf Stream Conquest Super C, 8.1, White > 2017 Ford Fusion SE 2.0 Turbo, Oxford White > http://www.mnautox.com > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patintexas at icloud.com > -- Phil Ethier West Side Saint Paul Minnesota USA 1973 Triumph Stag LE22439UBW "uncle jack", Sapphire Blue 2004 Suburban 8.1, Sport Red 2005 Lotus Elise, Bordeaux Red Pearl 2006 Gulf Stream Conquest Super C, 8.1, White 2017 Ford Fusion SE 2.0 Turbo, Oxford White http://www.mnautox.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From TR3driver at ca.rr.com Wed May 8 15:56:58 2019 From: TR3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Wed, 8 May 2019 14:56:58 -0700 Subject: [Shop-talk] sealant for tapered threads in gasoline line. Hylomar? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5C63010D623A49708809E92774FD6C43@RYPC> > I like permatex 3, also known as aviation form-a-gasket. > Started using it in the 60's on air cooled VW engines. It > stands up to gasoline just fine. Even gasohol? The solvent in Permatex 3 is ethanol ... Or at least it used to be. -- Randall From nogera at icloud.com Wed May 8 18:38:14 2019 From: nogera at icloud.com (Robert Nogueirao) Date: Wed, 8 May 2019 19:38:14 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] True or false Message-ID: Doesn?t know where I heard it butI once heard that once you remove a water pump and the seal drys out the pump will leak if reinstalled. Any truth to that? Bob Nogueira From dave1massey at cs.com Thu May 9 06:07:30 2019 From: dave1massey at cs.com (DAVID MASSEY) Date: Thu, 9 May 2019 12:07:30 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Shop-talk] True or false References: <2145758326.2007182.1557403650196.ref@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <2145758326.2007182.1557403650196@mail.yahoo.com> That may have been true at one time but modern pumps use rubber lip seals which are unaffected by the presence of absence of water. Dave -----Original Message----- From: Robert Nogueirao via Shop-talk To: Shop-talk Sent: Wed, May 8, 2019 7:38 pm Subject: [Shop-talk] True or false Doesn?t know where I heard it butI once heard that once you remove a water pump and the seal drys out the pump will leak if reinstalled.? Any truth to that? Bob Nogueira _______________________________________________ Shop-talk at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Suggested annual donation? $12.96 Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dave1massey at cs.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bjzwissler at gmail.com Thu May 9 07:45:41 2019 From: bjzwissler at gmail.com (Benjamin Zwissler) Date: Thu, 9 May 2019 09:45:41 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] True or false In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I don't know that that's true. The coolant side seal of the pump is usually a carbon/ceramic face seal in "modern" pumps (modern meaning for the last several decades). The outside seal is just to keep the grease in and is usually a lip seal. The rubber could degrade with time, the carbon/ceramic wouldn't. A problem I could see if is the drying coolant left some crystalline deposits behind and they worked their way into the face seal that could cause a leak. I once got a TR8 water pump from a supplier that had clearly been on the shelf for many years. I was a little worried about installing it, but did, and it has worked trouble free for 10+ years. Of course it had never been installed so not exactly your dilemma. Ben..... On Wed, May 8, 2019 at 8:38 PM Robert Nogueirao via Shop-talk < shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote: > Doesn?t know where I heard it butI once heard that once you remove a water > pump and the seal drys out the pump will leak if reinstalled. Any truth > to that? > > Bob Nogueira > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/bjzwissler at gmail.com > > -- Ben Zwissler bjzwissler at gmail.com Columbus, IN -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From patintexas at icloud.com Thu May 9 08:26:02 2019 From: patintexas at icloud.com (Pat Horne) Date: Thu, 9 May 2019 09:26:02 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] sealant for tapered threads in gasoline line. Hylomar? In-Reply-To: <5C63010D623A49708809E92774FD6C43@RYPC> References: <5C63010D623A49708809E92774FD6C43@RYPC> Message-ID: <65E3A91B-009D-42C5-A036-223C162A0234@icloud.com> Permatex says they don?t recommend #3 for modern fuel contact. Peace, Pat Pat Horne We support Habitat for Humanity > On May 8, 2019, at 4:56 PM, Randall via Shop-talk wrote: > > I like permatex 3, also known as aviation form-a-gasket. > Started using it in the 60's on air cooled VW engines. It > stands up to gasoline just fine. Even gasohol? The solvent in Permatex 3 is ethanol ... Or at least it used to be. -- Randall _______________________________________________ Shop-talk at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Suggested annual donation $12.96 Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patintexas at icloud.com From pethier7 at gmail.com Wed May 8 14:28:08 2019 From: pethier7 at gmail.com (Philip Ethier) Date: Wed, 8 May 2019 15:28:08 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] sealant for tapered threads in gasoline line. Hylomar? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I found this at NAPA in West Saint Paul: https://www.permatex.com/products/gasketing/gasket-sealants/permatex-aviation-form-a-gasket-no-3-sealant-liquid-3/ On Tue, May 7, 2019 at 6:57 PM Pat Horne wrote: > I like permatex 3, also known as aviation form-a-gasket. Started using it > in the 60?s on air cooled VW engines. It stands up to gasoline just fine. > > Peace, > Pat > > Pat Horne > We support Habitat for Humanity > > > On May 7, 2019, at 6:26 PM, Philip Ethier via Shop-talk < > shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote: > > Sealant for tapered threads in gasoline line. Hylomar? > > Suspect small leak in Facet fuel pump output, tapered thresd, which was > assembled dry. > > Is good old Hylomar Blue a good product here? I have some on hand. > > Is there a favorite others have used? > > > > > -- > Phil Ethier West Side Saint Paul Minnesota USA > 1973 Triumph Stag LE22439UBW "uncle jack", Sapphire Blue > 2004 Suburban 8.1, Sport Red > 2005 Lotus Elise, Bordeaux Red Pearl > 2006 Gulf Stream Conquest Super C, 8.1, White > 2017 Ford Fusion SE 2.0 Turbo, Oxford White > http://www.mnautox.com > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patintexas at icloud.com > > -- Phil Ethier West Side Saint Paul Minnesota USA 1973 Triumph Stag LE22439UBW "uncle jack", Sapphire Blue 2004 Suburban 8.1, Sport Red 2005 Lotus Elise, Bordeaux Red Pearl 2006 Gulf Stream Conquest Super C, 8.1, White 2017 Ford Fusion SE 2.0 Turbo, Oxford White http://www.mnautox.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From eric at megageek.com Tue May 14 06:02:20 2019 From: eric at megageek.com (eric at megageek.com) Date: Tue, 14 May 2019 08:02:20 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] harryepstein.com and box art Message-ID: I never ordered from harryepstein.com before, but I needed a new set of SK flared box wrenches and they had a great deal on them. (they were recommended to me from my reply to the question about wrenches here.) The website states that you can request a free painting on the shipping box. So I asked for a cat and raccoon playing together. (I have 2 stray cats and about 4 raccoons that I feed each morning.) This is the painting I got and I LOVE it! I'll be framing it to put in my garage as well as adding to it with many more orders to harryepstein.com! BTW, they told me the artist is named "Emit" and he works there. https://www.megageek.com/photo/photoa~1.nsf/a7ffeab012bbfb5b85256eb1007ca7f6/4a6004f30a113816852583fa0040eaab?OpenDocument BTW, it may take a few seconds for the image to load. Sent from my Commodore 64 on a 2400 Baud Modem. Tech Viper "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson -Who is John Galt? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From shop-talk2 at mcfetridge.org Tue May 14 15:51:28 2019 From: shop-talk2 at mcfetridge.org (Ian McFetridge) Date: Tue, 14 May 2019 17:51:28 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] harryepstein.com and box art In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Wow, nice painting and certainly a unique way to differentiate and build loyalty. :) On Tue, May 14, 2019 at 8:02 AM eric--- via Shop-talk < shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote: > *I never ordered from harryepstein.com before, > but I needed a new set of SK flared box wrenches and they had a great deal > on them. (they were recommended to me from my reply to the question about > wrenches here.) The website states that you can request a free painting on > the shipping box. So I asked for a cat and raccoon playing together. (I > have 2 stray cats and about 4 raccoons that I feed each morning.) This is > the painting I got and I LOVE it! I'll be framing it to put in my garage > as well as adding to it with many more orders to harryepstein.com > ! BTW, they told me the artist is named "Emit" > and he works there.* > > > > *https://www.megageek.com/photo/photoa~1.nsf/a7ffeab012bbfb5b85256eb1007ca7f6/4a6004f30a113816852583fa0040eaab?OpenDocument* > > > BTW, it may take a few seconds for the image to load. > > > > Sent from my Commodore 64 on a 2400 Baud Modem. > Tech Viper > "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational > being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph > Waldo Emerson > -Who is John Galt? > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/shop-talk2 at mcfetridge.org > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From fishplate at gmail.com Wed May 15 06:26:17 2019 From: fishplate at gmail.com (Jeff Scarbrough) Date: Wed, 15 May 2019 08:26:17 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] harryepstein.com and box art In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: That's brilliant! Now I have to buy more tools I don't need! Jeff Scarbrough Corrosion Acres, Ga. On Tue, May 14, 2019 at 8:02 AM eric--- via Shop-talk wrote: > > I never ordered from harryepstein.com before, but I needed a new set of SK flared box wrenches and they had a great deal on them. (they were recommended to me from my reply to the question about wrenches here.) The website states that you can request a free painting on the shipping box. So I asked for a cat and raccoon playing together. (I have 2 stray cats and about 4 raccoons that I feed each morning.) This is the painting I got and I LOVE it! I'll be framing it to put in my garage as well as adding to it with many more orders to harryepstein.com! BTW, they told me the artist is named "Emit" and he works there. > > > https://www.megageek.com/photo/photoa~1.nsf/a7ffeab012bbfb5b85256eb1007ca7f6/4a6004f30a113816852583fa0040eaab?OpenDocument > > BTW, it may take a few seconds for the image to load. > > > > Sent from my Commodore 64 on a 2400 Baud Modem. > Tech Viper > "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson > -Who is John Galt? > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/fishplate at gmail.com > From patintexas at icloud.com Mon May 20 06:56:33 2019 From: patintexas at icloud.com (Pat Horne) Date: Mon, 20 May 2019 07:56:33 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Saving steel panels Message-ID: <88A934B8-8DAF-4C1A-8545-BE411BD1B9E0@icloud.com> I had a fire in my shop. Now that the shop is getting back in shape I am looking at saving some of the contents. I have a new hood for my ?67 Datsun that was in the shop. It didn?t get fire damage but was smoked up badly. Over time it has developed surface rust from the acidic smoke. Is there a way to remove the rust from the hidden areas which I can?t get to, or should I just try to find another one? I know there is a process for lightening panels for race cars using acid but longevity is not a requirement in this process. I would rather take it to someone to do it rather than doing it myself but will consider doing it if isn?t too much trouble. Peace, Pat Pat Horne We support Habitat for Humanity From jniolon at att.net Mon May 20 09:57:30 2019 From: jniolon at att.net (john niolon) Date: Mon, 20 May 2019 10:57:30 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] adding to a 4-way switch circuit. Message-ID: <185321F4FAF24519A07F8DF1FCA974D6@Johnsdesktop> I have 4- 8? fluorescent fixtures in my garage that are controlled from three different doors. I?d like to be able to do some circuit changes so when I actuate the garage door opener it would also turn on these lights instead of the puny light in the unit. It seems something might be able to work using the light circuit in the opener but my head won?t wrap around a 4-way circuit and the relay/switch/hicky-thing in the opener ! any suggestions thanks john -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hillman at planet-torque.com Mon May 20 15:57:15 2019 From: hillman at planet-torque.com (David Hillman) Date: Mon, 20 May 2019 17:57:15 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Shop-talk] B&S mower engine, surging and dying. Ideas? Message-ID: Ok, I'm out of ideas. Requesting new ones. I have a Craftsman walk-behind mower with a 163cc Briggs & Stratton 4-stroke engine ( engine: 104m02-0008-f1 to be precise ). It's only 3 or 4 years old, but it will not run. And it's starting to piss me off. It starts normally ( no manual prime or choke, so it takes ~3 pulls but it always has ), and runs fine for less than 5 minutes. After that, it surges rhythmically and after a minute or so of that, dies. Following that, it will not re-start until allowed to rest for a few minutes. I have installed a new plug, new air filter, new carburetor, and new ignitor. I checked and set the gap on the plug and the ignitor to spec ( .030" and .006-.014" respectively ). Has clean oil, and brand new gas. Fuel screen in the tank is clean, as is the fuel hose to the carb. Carb bowl has fuel. What else can be wrong with it? It seems to be heat-related, but it has no cooling system. Thanks. Obligatory Shop Content: I can't work on anything interesting until this damn mower runs. -- David Hillman From patintexas at icloud.com Mon May 20 17:19:59 2019 From: patintexas at icloud.com (Pat Horne) Date: Mon, 20 May 2019 18:19:59 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] adding to a 4-way switch circuit. In-Reply-To: <185321F4FAF24519A07F8DF1FCA974D6@Johnsdesktop> References: <185321F4FAF24519A07F8DF1FCA974D6@Johnsdesktop> Message-ID: <8731B309-C96C-443A-A118-F2E7FAFFBBA7@icloud.com> It isn?t difficult as long as you can access one of the wires between switches & the power to the lights. You will need a relay with a coil rated at the light voltage. I assume that it is 120v. You also don?t want to turn the lights off if they already on! Do you want to allow the light timer in the GDO to turn off the lights or do you want to be able to turn them off manually without waiting for the delay? I can draw up a drawing for you. Peace, Pat Pat Horne We support Habitat for Humanity On May 20, 2019, at 10:57 AM, john niolon via Shop-talk wrote: I have 4- 8? fluorescent fixtures in my garage that are controlled from three different doors. I?d like to be able to do some circuit changes so when I actuate the garage door opener it would also turn on these lights instead of the puny light in the unit. It seems something might be able to work using the light circuit in the opener but my head won?t wrap around a 4-way circuit and the relay/switch/hicky-thing in the opener ! any suggestions thanks john _______________________________________________ Shop-talk at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Suggested annual donation $12.96 Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patintexas at icloud.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From fishplate at gmail.com Mon May 20 17:44:14 2019 From: fishplate at gmail.com (Jeff Scarbrough) Date: Mon, 20 May 2019 19:44:14 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] Pipe/tube size Message-ID: I have a commercial laundry sink that I'd like to make sit a little higher. The legs appear to be a regular tube of some type (has a weld stripe down the side). At first I assumed it was EMT, since it seems the same weight and construction. I figured it would be simple to get some longer pieces... But the legs have an OD of 1-5/16", and I don't find a standard EMT size to match. Wall thickness is about 1/16" +/-. The leg fits in a socket in the sink, and a foot is inserted into the tube at the bottom, so size is pretty critical. Any ideas on what it might be? Jeff Scarbrough Corrosion Acres, Ga. From fishplate at gmail.com Mon May 20 17:52:27 2019 From: fishplate at gmail.com (Jeff Scarbrough) Date: Mon, 20 May 2019 19:52:27 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] adding to a 4-way switch circuit. In-Reply-To: <185321F4FAF24519A07F8DF1FCA974D6@Johnsdesktop> References: <185321F4FAF24519A07F8DF1FCA974D6@Johnsdesktop> Message-ID: Wire it as four 4-way switches, with a DPDT relay switched by the light output of the garage door operator. Look about halfway down this page: https://www.do-it-yourself-help.com/4-way-switch-wiring-diagrams.html Of course, that will switch the lights off if they are on when you open the door, and switch them off after the opener times out. You might be able to add a latching relay to hold them in position until you use one of the wall switches...but that might not yet be complex enough. You might be better off adding a couple of general light fixtures controlled by the opener. Then they provide light if there is none, or add to the light if they are already on. Or use an Arduino mini or similar to look for switch inputs from each switch plus the operator, and drive a relay to turn the lights on or off. Low-voltage wiring for the switches, so easy... Then you can program the lights to do any number of combinations... On Mon, May 20, 2019 at 6:11 PM john niolon via Shop-talk wrote: > > I have 4- 8? fluorescent fixtures in my garage that are controlled from three different doors. I?d like to be able to do some circuit changes > so when I actuate the garage door opener it would also turn on these lights instead of the puny light in the unit. It seems something might > be able to work using the light circuit in the opener but my head won?t wrap around a 4-way circuit and the relay/switch/hicky-thing in the opener ! > > any suggestions > > thanks > john > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/fishplate at gmail.com > From patintexas at icloud.com Mon May 20 18:42:52 2019 From: patintexas at icloud.com (Pat Horne) Date: Mon, 20 May 2019 19:42:52 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] B&S mower engine, surging and dying. Ideas? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Try leaving the fuel cap loose to see if that helps. Will it start up when it dies with starting fluid. Peace, Pat Pat Horne We support Habitat for Humanity On May 20, 2019, at 4:57 PM, David Hillman via Shop-talk wrote: Ok, I'm out of ideas. Requesting new ones. I have a Craftsman walk-behind mower with a 163cc Briggs & Stratton 4-stroke engine ( engine: 104m02-0008-f1 to be precise ). It's only 3 or 4 years old, but it will not run. And it's starting to piss me off. It starts normally ( no manual prime or choke, so it takes ~3 pulls but it always has ), and runs fine for less than 5 minutes. After that, it surges rhythmically and after a minute or so of that, dies. Following that, it will not re-start until allowed to rest for a few minutes. I have installed a new plug, new air filter, new carburetor, and new ignitor. I checked and set the gap on the plug and the ignitor to spec ( .030" and .006-.014" respectively ). Has clean oil, and brand new gas. Fuel screen in the tank is clean, as is the fuel hose to the carb. Carb bowl has fuel. What else can be wrong with it? It seems to be heat-related, but it has no cooling system. Thanks. Obligatory Shop Content: I can't work on anything interesting until this damn mower runs. -- David Hillman _______________________________________________ Shop-talk at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Suggested annual donation $12.96 Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patintexas at icloud.com From gsteve at hammatt.com Mon May 20 18:50:00 2019 From: gsteve at hammatt.com (Steve Hammatt, Mount Vernon WA USA) Date: Mon, 20 May 2019 17:50:00 -0700 Subject: [Shop-talk] Pipe/tube size In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Jeff Sorry, I don't know exactly "what" it is, but I know exactly what you're talking about since I SHORTENED my leg on my commercial sink last year (sorry 'bout that)! In my case, IIRC, the socket on the underside of the sink is a sloppy fit, but it has a set screw on the side that firmly locates the leg and keeps it from being wobbly. The adjustable bottom floor fitting on the let fits inside the tube so that's the critical measurement. Also, in many places the adjustable feet are rather expensive, but I kept looking and eventually found a source for 1/3 or 1/4 the cost quoted by others. Again, sorry but I don't recall the source. I spent some time with Google, etc. and found the better source. Good luck! Steve Hammatt Mount Vernon WA USA www.leatherplates.com -----Original Message----- From: Jeff Scarbrough via Shop-talk Sent: Monday, May 20, 2019 4:44 PM To: shop-talk at autox.team.net Subject: [Shop-talk] Pipe/tube size I have a commercial laundry sink that I'd like to make sit a little higher. The legs appear to be a regular tube of some type (has a weld stripe down the side). At first I assumed it was EMT, since it seems the same weight and construction. I figured it would be simple to get some longer pieces... But the legs have an OD of 1-5/16", and I don't find a standard EMT size to match. Wall thickness is about 1/16" +/-. The leg fits in a socket in the sink, and a foot is inserted into the tube at the bottom, so size is pretty critical. Any ideas on what it might be? Jeff Scarbrough Corrosion Acres, Ga. _______________________________________________ Shop-talk at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Suggested annual donation $12.96 Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/gsteve at hammatt.com From TR3driver at ca.rr.com Mon May 20 19:32:59 2019 From: TR3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Mon, 20 May 2019 18:32:59 -0700 Subject: [Shop-talk] adding to a 4-way switch circuit. In-Reply-To: <185321F4FAF24519A07F8DF1FCA974D6@Johnsdesktop> References: <185321F4FAF24519A07F8DF1FCA974D6@Johnsdesktop> Message-ID: <9F24CAFE20B747BBBE39A87A69E45D60@RYPC> You probably don't want the opener to, in effect, act like another 4-way switch, since that would turn the lights off if they were already on. So instead, I suggest wiring the opener output so it will power the set of lights directly, skipping all of the 4-way switch stuff. Should be simpler anyway. Mine has a relay output for that exact purpose, but I don't know if they all do. If not, pick up a SPST relay with a 110vac coil, and power it from the light in the opener. If you do want it to act like another 4-way switch, then you'll need a DPDT relay, wired like a DC reversing switch. -- Randall > -----Original Message----- > From: Shop-talk [mailto:shop-talk-bounces at autox.team.net] On > Behalf Of john niolon via Shop-talk > Sent: Monday, May 20, 2019 8:58 AM > To: shop-talk > Subject: [Shop-talk] adding to a 4-way switch circuit. > > I have 4- 8' fluorescent fixtures in my garage that are > controlled from three different doors. I'd like to be able > to do some circuit changes so when I actuate the garage door > opener it would also turn on these lights instead of the puny > light in the unit. It seems something might be able to work > using the light circuit in the opener but my head won't wrap > around a 4-way circuit and the relay/switch/hicky-thing in > the opener ! > > any suggestions > > thanks > john > From scott.hall.personal at gmail.com Mon May 20 21:48:12 2019 From: scott.hall.personal at gmail.com (Scott Hall) Date: Mon, 20 May 2019 22:48:12 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] B&S mower engine, surging and dying. Ideas? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: This. Sounds like it's running just long enough to get a vacuum on the fuel tank, then starving for gas. Then sitting until the tank reaches atmospheric again. Then repeat. On Mon, May 20, 2019, 7:43 PM Pat Horne via Shop-talk < shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote: > Try leaving the fuel cap loose to see if that helps. > > Will it start up when it dies with starting fluid. > > Peace, > Pat > > Pat Horne > We support Habitat for Humanity > > > On May 20, 2019, at 4:57 PM, David Hillman via Shop-talk < > shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote: > > > Ok, I'm out of ideas. Requesting new ones. > > I have a Craftsman walk-behind mower with a 163cc Briggs & Stratton > 4-stroke engine ( engine: 104m02-0008-f1 to be precise ). It's only 3 or 4 > years old, but it will not run. And it's starting to piss me off. > > It starts normally ( no manual prime or choke, so it takes ~3 pulls but > it always has ), and runs fine for less than 5 minutes. After that, it > surges rhythmically and after a minute or so of that, dies. Following > that, it will not re-start until allowed to rest for a few minutes. > > I have installed a new plug, new air filter, new carburetor, and new > ignitor. I checked and set the gap on the plug and the ignitor to spec ( > .030" and .006-.014" respectively ). Has clean oil, and brand new gas. > Fuel screen in the tank is clean, as is the fuel hose to the carb. Carb > bowl has fuel. > > What else can be wrong with it? It seems to be heat-related, but it has > no cooling system. > > Thanks. > > Obligatory Shop Content: I can't work on anything interesting until this > damn mower runs. > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bspidell at comcast.net Mon May 20 21:54:28 2019 From: bspidell at comcast.net (Bob Spidell) Date: Mon, 20 May 2019 20:54:28 -0700 Subject: [Shop-talk] B&S mower engine, surging and dying. Ideas? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <844aaa2e-1e86-c94c-8c9f-f8ab94c17855@comcast.net> I had a surging problem on an ExMark--really, a tarted-up Toro--zero-turn and they ended up replacing the engine due to worn rings (intake manifold was getting oiled-up).? Don't ask me why, but nothing else--carburetion, spark, etc.--made sense either. We're talking a rhythmic pulsing, and not sputtering, right?? Worn rings might make the engine's power ebb-and-flow, I suppose. Bob On 5/20/2019 8:48 PM, Scott Hall via Shop-talk wrote: > This. Sounds like it's running just long enough to get a vacuum on the > fuel tank, then starving for gas. Then sitting until the tank reaches > atmospheric again. Then repeat. > > On Mon, May 20, 2019, 7:43 PM Pat Horne via Shop-talk > > wrote: > > Try leaving the fuel cap loose to see if that helps. > > Will it start up when it dies with starting fluid. > > Peace, > Pat > > Pat Horne > We support Habitat for Humanity > > > On May 20, 2019, at 4:57 PM, David Hillman via Shop-talk > > wrote: > > > ? Ok, I'm out of ideas.? Requesting new ones. > > ? I have a Craftsman walk-behind mower with a 163cc Briggs & > Stratton 4-stroke engine ( engine: 104m02-0008-f1 to be precise > ).? It's only 3 or 4 years old, but it will not run.? And it's > starting to piss me off. > > ? It starts normally ( no manual prime or choke, so it takes ~3 > pulls but it always has ), and runs fine for less than 5 minutes.? > After that, it surges rhythmically and after a minute or so of > that, dies.? Following that, it will not re-start until allowed to > rest for a few minutes. > > ? I have installed a new plug, new air filter, new carburetor, and > new ignitor.? I checked and set the gap on the plug and the > ignitor to spec ( .030" and .006-.014" respectively ).? Has clean > oil, and brand new gas. Fuel screen in the tank is clean, as is > the fuel hose to the carb. Carb bowl has fuel. > > ? What else can be wrong with it?? It seems to be heat-related, > but it has no cooling system. > > ? Thanks. > > Obligatory Shop Content: I can't work on anything interesting > until this damn mower runs. > > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/bspidell at comcast.net > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From lee at automate-it.com Mon May 20 22:10:36 2019 From: lee at automate-it.com (Lee Daniels) Date: Mon, 20 May 2019 23:10:36 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] adding to a 4-way switch circuit. In-Reply-To: References: <185321F4FAF24519A07F8DF1FCA974D6@Johnsdesktop> Message-ID: <71fa76723e277b2860b6a75401461c60.squirrel@automate-it.com> Jeff Scarbrough wrote: > You might be better off adding a couple of general light fixtures > controlled by the opener. This is exactly what I did. Just used a couple of old-school ceramic bases and loaded them 150W-equivalent CFL's, powered from the original wires going to the garage-door-opener bulb socket. (Probably not to code here in Texas in 2019.) I do have 12 T-8 fixtures loaded with "daylight" bulbs to light up the garage/shop at other times. I didn't see a need to fire these up when I drive in. Lee From bspidell at comcast.net Mon May 20 22:25:09 2019 From: bspidell at comcast.net (Bob Spidell) Date: Mon, 20 May 2019 21:25:09 -0700 Subject: [Shop-talk] B&S mower engine, surging and dying. Ideas? In-Reply-To: <844aaa2e-1e86-c94c-8c9f-f8ab94c17855@comcast.net> References: <844aaa2e-1e86-c94c-8c9f-f8ab94c17855@comcast.net> Message-ID: <27ef751c-e747-b05c-8c53-d5315ac81e33@comcast.net> Addendum:? I'm beginning to think this might be a characteristic of air-cooled engines (air-cooled engines have larger clearances to begin with).? I've never seen/heard a liquid-cooled engine do exactly this but, then again, I don't recall any aircraft engines doing it--they have dual ignition systems, maybe that makes a difference?--and, if one did, I wouldn't fly behind it. Bob On 5/20/2019 8:54 PM, Bob Spidell via Shop-talk wrote: > > I had a surging problem on an ExMark--really, a tarted-up > Toro--zero-turn and they ended up replacing the engine due to worn > rings (intake manifold was getting oiled-up).? Don't ask me why, but > nothing else--carburetion, spark, etc.--made sense either.? We're > talking a rhythmic pulsing, and not sputtering, right?? Worn rings > might make the engine's power ebb-and-flow, I suppose. > > Bob > > On 5/20/2019 8:48 PM, Scott Hall via Shop-talk wrote: >> This. Sounds like it's running just long enough to get a vacuum on >> the fuel tank, then starving for gas. Then sitting until the tank >> reaches atmospheric again. Then repeat. >> >> On Mon, May 20, 2019, 7:43 PM Pat Horne via Shop-talk >> > wrote: >> >> Try leaving the fuel cap loose to see if that helps. >> >> Will it start up when it dies with starting fluid. >> >> Peace, >> Pat >> >> Pat Horne >> We support Habitat for Humanity >> >> >> On May 20, 2019, at 4:57 PM, David Hillman via Shop-talk >> > wrote: >> >> >> ? Ok, I'm out of ideas.? Requesting new ones. >> >> ? I have a Craftsman walk-behind mower with a 163cc Briggs & >> Stratton 4-stroke engine ( engine: 104m02-0008-f1 to be precise >> ).? It's only 3 or 4 years old, but it will not run.? And it's >> starting to piss me off. >> >> ? It starts normally ( no manual prime or choke, so it takes ~3 >> pulls but it always has ), and runs fine for less than 5 >> minutes.? After that, it surges rhythmically and after a minute >> or so of that, dies.? Following that, it will not re-start until >> allowed to rest for a few minutes. >> >> ? I have installed a new plug, new air filter, new carburetor, >> and new ignitor.? I checked and set the gap on the plug and the >> ignitor to spec ( .030" and .006-.014" respectively ).? Has clean >> oil, and brand new gas. Fuel screen in the tank is clean, as is >> the fuel hose to the carb. Carb bowl has fuel. >> >> ? What else can be wrong with it?? It seems to be heat-related, >> but it has no cooling system. >> >> ? Thanks. >> >> Obligatory Shop Content: I can't work on anything interesting >> until this damn mower runs. >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Shop-talk at autox.team.net >> Donate:http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Suggested annual donation $12.96 >> Archive:http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive >> >> Unsubscribe/Manage:http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/bspidell at comcast.net >> > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/bspidell at comcast.net > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jniolon at att.net Tue May 21 07:04:39 2019 From: jniolon at att.net (john niolon) Date: Tue, 21 May 2019 08:04:39 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] adding to a 4-way switch circuit. In-Reply-To: <8731B309-C96C-443A-A118-F2E7FAFFBBA7@icloud.com> References: <185321F4FAF24519A07F8DF1FCA974D6@Johnsdesktop> <8731B309-C96C-443A-A118-F2E7FAFFBBA7@icloud.com> Message-ID: <38A2AC770D8F494FB8BCE828F03F3588@Johnsdesktop> thanks for all the replies and way more information than I could process. The suggestion I liked the best was to just add a couple more fixtures and wire them directly to the lamp output circuit in the opener. I don?t want to learn a new type of electronics and I don?t have easy access to the existing wiring (floor above the ceiling... and I?m 71 years old.) You guys always come up with a way to do anything !!! thanks john From: Pat Horne Sent: Monday, May 20, 2019 6:19 PM To: john niolon Cc: Shop Talk List Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] adding to a 4-way switch circuit. It isn?t difficult as long as you can access one of the wires between switches & the power to the lights. You will need a relay with a coil rated at the light voltage. I assume that it is 120v. You also don?t want to turn the lights off if they already on! Do you want to allow the light timer in the GDO to turn off the lights or do you want to be able to turn them off manually without waiting for the delay? I can draw up a drawing for you. Peace, Pat Pat Horne We support Habitat for Humanity On May 20, 2019, at 10:57 AM, john niolon via Shop-talk wrote: I have 4- 8? fluorescent fixtures in my garage that are controlled from three different doors. I?d like to be able to do some circuit changes so when I actuate the garage door opener it would also turn on these lights instead of the puny light in the unit. It seems something might be able to work using the light circuit in the opener but my head won?t wrap around a 4-way circuit and the relay/switch/hicky-thing in the opener ! any suggestions thanks john _______________________________________________ Shop-talk at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Suggested annual donation $12.96 Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patintexas at icloud.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From battmain at yahoo.com Tue May 21 12:52:51 2019 From: battmain at yahoo.com (Battmain battmain) Date: Tue, 21 May 2019 14:52:51 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] B&S mower engine, surging and dying. Ideas? Message-ID: If there is a fuel shutoff valve, bypass it and see what happens. The plastic valve I removed from a similar engine has not yet been re-installed. The engine starts on the third pull everytime and doesn't shutdown until it is out of fuel or I switch it off. I do have to empty any left over fuel if I screw up and put too much in the tank. Brian On May 21, 2019 00:25, Bob Spidell via Shop-talk wrote: > > Addendum:? I'm beginning to think this might be a characteristic of air-cooled engines (air-cooled engines have larger clearances to begin with).? I've never seen/heard a liquid-cooled engine do exactly this but, then again, I don't recall any aircraft engines doing it--they have dual ignition systems, maybe that makes a difference?--and, if one did, I wouldn't fly behind it. > > Bob > > > On 5/20/2019 8:54 PM, Bob Spidell via Shop-talk wrote: > > I had a surging problem on an ExMark--really, a tarted-up Toro--zero-turn and they ended up replacing the engine due to worn rings (intake manifold was getting oiled-up).? Don't ask me why, but nothing else--carburetion, spark, etc.--made sense either.? We're talking a rhythmic pulsing, and not sputtering, right?? Worn rings might make the engine's power ebb-and-flow, I suppose. > > Bob > > On 5/20/2019 8:48 PM, Scott Hall via Shop-talk wrote: > > This. Sounds like it's running just long enough to get a vacuum on the fuel tank, then starving for gas. Then sitting until the tank reaches atmospheric again. Then repeat. > > On Mon, May 20, 2019, 7:43 PM Pat Horne via Shop-talk wrote: >> >> Try leaving the fuel cap loose to see if that helps. >> >> Will it start up when it dies with starting fluid. >> >> Peace, >> Pat >> >> Pat Horne >> We support Habitat for Humanity >> >> >> On May 20, 2019, at 4:57 PM, David Hillman via Shop-talk wrote: >> >> >> ? Ok, I'm out of ideas.? Requesting new ones. >> >> ? I have a Craftsman walk-behind mower with a 163cc Briggs & Stratton 4-stroke engine ( engine: 104m02-0008-f1 to be precise ).? It's only 3 or 4 years old, but it will not run.? And it's starting to piss me off. >> >> ? It starts normally ( no manual prime or choke, so it takes ~3 pulls but it always has ), and runs fine for less than 5 minutes.? After that, it surges rhythmically and after a minute or so of that, dies.? Following that, it will not re-start until allowed to rest for a few minutes. >> >> ? I have installed a new plug, new air filter, new carburetor, and new ignitor.? I checked and set the gap on the plug and the ignitor to spec ( .030" and .006-.014" respectively ).? Has clean oil, and brand new gas. Fuel screen in the tank is clean, as is the fuel hose to the carb. Carb bowl has fuel. >> >> ? What else can be wrong with it?? It seems to be heat-related, but it has no cooling system. >> >> ? Thanks. >> >> Obligatory Shop Content: I can't work on anything interesting until this damn mower runs. > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive > > > > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/bspidell at comcast.net > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive > > > > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/bspidell at comcast.net > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bkahler1 at gmail.com Tue May 21 13:28:44 2019 From: bkahler1 at gmail.com (Brad Kahler) Date: Tue, 21 May 2019 15:28:44 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] Hearing protection for mowing Message-ID: I mow with a commercial model Scag Turf Tiger that has a 27 hp Kawasaki motor with the muffler that sits about 30" from my head. I'm looking for recommendations for a really good set of ear muffs that will help keep my ears from ringing when I'm done. Currently I've been using a pair of Echo ear muffs, sometimes with ear plugs combined. The combination isn't real bad but I'd like something better. Any suggestions? Thanks, Brad -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jdinnis at gmail.com Tue May 21 13:38:14 2019 From: jdinnis at gmail.com (John Innis) Date: Tue, 21 May 2019 14:38:14 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Hearing protection for mowing In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I'd also like to find something better. I am using 3M worktunes muffs, but if I wear sunglasses there is a gap around the ear seals that reduce the effectiveity quite a lot. I tried EAR brand rubber plugs, and various brands of foam plugs, but they won't stay in my ears. On Tue, May 21, 2019 at 2:29 PM Brad Kahler via Shop-talk < shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote: > I mow with a commercial model Scag Turf Tiger that has a 27 hp Kawasaki > motor with the muffler that sits about 30" from my head. > > I'm looking for recommendations for a really good set of ear muffs that > will help keep my ears from ringing when I'm done. Currently I've been > using a pair of Echo ear muffs, sometimes with ear plugs combined. The > combination isn't real bad but I'd like something better. > > Any suggestions? > > Thanks, > > Brad > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jdinnis at gmail.com > > -- ================================= = Never offend people with style when you = = can offend with substance --- Sam Brown = ================================= -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bkahler1 at gmail.com Tue May 21 14:02:01 2019 From: bkahler1 at gmail.com (Brad Kahler) Date: Tue, 21 May 2019 16:02:01 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] Hearing protection for mowing In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: John, good point about the sun glasses. I wear them as well so they need to be included in the equation for whatever the solution might be. Brad On Tue, May 21, 2019 at 3:38 PM John Innis wrote: > I'd also like to find something better. I am using 3M worktunes muffs, > but if I wear sunglasses there is a gap around the ear seals that reduce > the effectiveity quite a lot. I tried EAR brand rubber plugs, and various > brands of foam plugs, but they won't stay in my ears. > > On Tue, May 21, 2019 at 2:29 PM Brad Kahler via Shop-talk < > shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote: > >> I mow with a commercial model Scag Turf Tiger that has a 27 hp Kawasaki >> motor with the muffler that sits about 30" from my head. >> >> I'm looking for recommendations for a really good set of ear muffs that >> will help keep my ears from ringing when I'm done. Currently I've been >> using a pair of Echo ear muffs, sometimes with ear plugs combined. The >> combination isn't real bad but I'd like something better. >> >> Any suggestions? >> >> Thanks, >> >> Brad >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Shop-talk at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Suggested annual donation $12.96 >> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk >> http://autox.team.net/archive >> >> Unsubscribe/Manage: >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jdinnis at gmail.com >> >> > > -- > ================================= > = Never offend people with style when you = > = can offend with substance --- Sam Brown = > ================================= > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hillman at planet-torque.com Tue May 21 14:27:33 2019 From: hillman at planet-torque.com (David Hillman) Date: Tue, 21 May 2019 16:27:33 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Shop-talk] B&S mower engine, surging and dying. Ideas? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Yes, it does, but I tried removing the cap to no avail. Thanks. On Mon, 20 May 2019, Scott Hall wrote: > This. Sounds like it's running just long enough to get a vacuum on the fuel > tank, then starving for gas. Then sitting until the tank reaches > atmospheric again. Then repeat. > > On Mon, May 20, 2019, 7:43 PM Pat Horne via Shop-talk < > shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote: > >> Try leaving the fuel cap loose to see if that helps. >> >> Will it start up when it dies with starting fluid. >> >> Peace, >> Pat >> >> Pat Horne >> We support Habitat for Humanity >> >> >> On May 20, 2019, at 4:57 PM, David Hillman via Shop-talk < >> shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote: >> >> >> Ok, I'm out of ideas. Requesting new ones. >> >> I have a Craftsman walk-behind mower with a 163cc Briggs & Stratton >> 4-stroke engine ( engine: 104m02-0008-f1 to be precise ). It's only 3 or 4 >> years old, but it will not run. And it's starting to piss me off. >> >> It starts normally ( no manual prime or choke, so it takes ~3 pulls but >> it always has ), and runs fine for less than 5 minutes. After that, it >> surges rhythmically and after a minute or so of that, dies. Following >> that, it will not re-start until allowed to rest for a few minutes. >> >> I have installed a new plug, new air filter, new carburetor, and new >> ignitor. I checked and set the gap on the plug and the ignitor to spec ( >> .030" and .006-.014" respectively ). Has clean oil, and brand new gas. >> Fuel screen in the tank is clean, as is the fuel hose to the carb. Carb >> bowl has fuel. >> >> What else can be wrong with it? It seems to be heat-related, but it has >> no cooling system. >> >> Thanks. >> >> Obligatory Shop Content: I can't work on anything interesting until this >> damn mower runs. >> > -- David Hillman From bk13 at earthlink.net Tue May 21 17:39:30 2019 From: bk13 at earthlink.net (Brian Kemp) Date: Tue, 21 May 2019 16:39:30 -0700 Subject: [Shop-talk] Hearing protection for mowing In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I like the foam ear plugs best.? I roll them tight so they slip right in the ear and I've never had one fall out.? I find when almost fully inserted, they work pretty good.? If I'm using something extra loud like a router, I add ear muffs. On the mower, do you have the option of changing the direction of the muffler or adding a tip to the muffler?? If not, can you add a shroud of some sort between your head and the muffler?? Just like we have lots of options for car mufflers, is there an optional muffler that reduces the sound more? Brian On 5/21/2019 12:38 PM, John Innis via Shop-talk wrote: > I'd also like to find something better.? I am using 3M worktunes > muffs, but if I wear sunglasses there is a gap around the ear seals > that reduce the effectiveity quite a lot. I tried EAR brand rubber > plugs, and various brands of foam plugs, but they won't stay in my ears. > > On Tue, May 21, 2019 at 2:29 PM Brad Kahler via Shop-talk > > wrote: > > I mow with a commercial model Scag Turf Tiger that has a 27 hp > Kawasaki motor with the muffler that sits about 30" from my head. > > I'm looking for recommendations for a really good set of ear muffs > that will help keep my ears from ringing when I'm done.? Currently > I've been using a pair of Echo ear muffs, sometimes with ear plugs > combined.? The combination isn't real bad but I'd like something > better. > > Any suggestions? > > Thanks, > > Brad > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation? $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jdinnis at gmail.com > > > > -- > ================================= > = Never offend people with style when you?? = > = can offend with substance --- Sam Brown? = > ================================= > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate:http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive:http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage:http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/bk13 at earthlink.net > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From fishplate at gmail.com Tue May 21 18:25:23 2019 From: fishplate at gmail.com (Jeff Scarbrough) Date: Tue, 21 May 2019 20:25:23 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] Hearing protection for mowing In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: When using foam ear plugs, roll them between your fingers so they get small. Then reach over your head with the opposite hand and pull up on the top of your ear while you insert the rolled plug in your ear. Looks goofy, gets results. On Tue, May 21, 2019 at 3:29 PM Brad Kahler via Shop-talk wrote: > > I mow with a commercial model Scag Turf Tiger that has a 27 hp Kawasaki motor with the muffler that sits about 30" from my head. > > I'm looking for recommendations for a really good set of ear muffs that will help keep my ears from ringing when I'm done. Currently I've been using a pair of Echo ear muffs, sometimes with ear plugs combined. The combination isn't real bad but I'd like something better. > > Any suggestions? > > Thanks, > > Brad > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/fishplate at gmail.com > From 1789alpine at gmail.com Tue May 21 19:04:03 2019 From: 1789alpine at gmail.com (Jim Stone) Date: Tue, 21 May 2019 21:04:03 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] Hearing protection for mowing In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: When it comes to ear plugs, I have had much better luck with silicone ones than foam. Like these: https://www.cvs.com/shop/cvs-health-ultra-soft-silicone-earplugs-antimicrobial-protection-prodid-457795. On occasion, I have used them under ?ear muff? protectors and the combination works especially well. Technically, heavy duty foam ones have a higher db reduction rating, but I have found the silicone ones seal better and thus do a better job of reducing noise. > On May 21, 2019, at 8:25 PM, Jeff Scarbrough via Shop-talk wrote: > > When using foam ear plugs, roll them between your fingers so they get > small. Then reach over your head with the opposite hand and pull up > on the top of your ear while you insert the rolled plug in your ear. > Looks goofy, gets results. > > On Tue, May 21, 2019 at 3:29 PM Brad Kahler via Shop-talk > wrote: >> >> I mow with a commercial model Scag Turf Tiger that has a 27 hp Kawasaki motor with the muffler that sits about 30" from my head. >> >> I'm looking for recommendations for a really good set of ear muffs that will help keep my ears from ringing when I'm done. Currently I've been using a pair of Echo ear muffs, sometimes with ear plugs combined. The combination isn't real bad but I'd like something better. >> >> Any suggestions? >> >> Thanks, >> >> Brad >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Shop-talk at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Suggested annual donation $12.96 >> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive >> >> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/fishplate at gmail.com >> > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/1789alpine at gmail.com > From eric at megageek.com Wed May 22 06:15:31 2019 From: eric at megageek.com (eric at megageek.com) Date: Wed, 22 May 2019 08:15:31 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] MILTON S-99705 SAFETY COUPLER and the next harryepstein painting Message-ID: So after the great painting from harryepstein.com, I was looking for other items to order to get another one. I found this air line connectors, MILTON S-99705 SAFETY COUPLER... https://www.harryepstein.com/index.php/milton-s-99705-safety-coupler.html So I bought one. They are 1/4 and type "M" connectors. I got it last night and I can't believe home well they work! As a result, I bought all of the ones at HE that they had left (and still bought 10 more from Amazon) just to replace all my connectors with them. FWIW, amazon's price is about a dollar more, but it has free shipping (but they also have to charge me tax.) So the price is a wash. I never heard or saw these connectors before, but I'm very impressed with them. I had cheapo combo connectors before that took either standard, but I'm replacing them all (and all the tools that were not M before.) And for those that want to see the box art, here is a link.... (request was cats watching a man chop wood.) https://www.megageek.com/photo/photoa~1.nsf/a7ffeab012bbfb5b85256eb1007ca7f6/4a6004f30a113816852583fa0040eaab?OpenDocument I do love this idea! Have a great day. Sent from my Commodore 64 on a 2400 Baud Modem. Tech Viper "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson -Who is John Galt? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From fishplate at gmail.com Wed May 22 07:07:12 2019 From: fishplate at gmail.com (Jeff Scarbrough) Date: Wed, 22 May 2019 09:07:12 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] MILTON S-99705 SAFETY COUPLER and the next harryepstein painting In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Wed, May 22, 2019 at 8:16 AM eric--- via Shop-talk wrote: > > So I bought one. They are 1/4 and type "M" connectors. I got it last night and I can't believe home well they work! As a result, I bought all of the ones at HE that they had left (and still bought 10 more from Amazon) just to replace all my connectors with them. > > FWIW, amazon's price is about a dollar more, but it has free shipping (but they also have to charge me tax.) So the price is a wash. For me, Amazon shows them at $7.30 more, plus $4.99 shipping. Over twice as expensive. Your buying a bunch made them seek more profit, maybe? camelcamelcamel.com doesn't have enough data to provide price tracking. > And for those that want to see the box art, here is a link.... (request was cats watching a man chop wood.) > https://www.megageek.com/photo/photoa~1.nsf/a7ffeab012bbfb5b85256eb1007ca7f6/4a6004f30a113816852583fa0040eaab?OpenDocument If the price didn't make it an attractive buy, the box art does. These are fabulous! Jeff Scarbrough Corrosion Acres, Ga. From rande90 at gmail.com Wed May 22 07:16:01 2019 From: rande90 at gmail.com (RandE) Date: Wed, 22 May 2019 08:16:01 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] MILTON S-99705 SAFETY COUPLER and the next harryepstein painting In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: There are a couple listed on Amazon from different sellers. This one is only a couple dollars more and free shipping. https://smile.amazon.com/Milton-S-99705-Style-Safety-Coupler/dp/B00820LVJY/ref=sr_1_fkmrnull_3?keywords=MILTON+S-99705+SAFETY+COUPLER&qid=1558530862&s=gateway&sr=8-3-fkmrnull Randy On Wed, May 22, 2019 at 8:08 AM Jeff Scarbrough via Shop-talk < shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote: > On Wed, May 22, 2019 at 8:16 AM eric--- via Shop-talk > wrote: > > > > So I bought one. They are 1/4 and type "M" connectors. I got it last > night and I can't believe home well they work! As a result, I bought all > of the ones at HE that they had left (and still bought 10 more from Amazon) > just to replace all my connectors with them. > > > > FWIW, amazon's price is about a dollar more, but it has free shipping > (but they also have to charge me tax.) So the price is a wash. > > For me, Amazon shows them at $7.30 more, plus $4.99 shipping. Over > twice as expensive. Your buying a bunch made them seek more profit, > maybe? camelcamelcamel.com doesn't have enough data to provide price > tracking. > > > And for those that want to see the box art, here is a link.... (request > was cats watching a man chop wood.) > > > https://www.megageek.com/photo/photoa~1.nsf/a7ffeab012bbfb5b85256eb1007ca7f6/4a6004f30a113816852583fa0040eaab?OpenDocument > > If the price didn't make it an attractive buy, the box art does. > These are fabulous! > > Jeff Scarbrough > Corrosion Acres, Ga. > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/rande at pobox.com > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alfuller194 at gmail.com Thu May 23 18:42:28 2019 From: alfuller194 at gmail.com (Al Fuller) Date: Thu, 23 May 2019 20:42:28 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] adding to a 4-way switch circuit. Message-ID: <09ab01d511c9$90859570$b190c050$@gmail.com> John: I?m late to this topic, but I have info that might help you? I too was struggling to get more light in the garage when the garage door opened. After considering a lot of options, I went with a solution that is cheap and effective! I replaced the florescent bulb in the opener with an LED light strip that I mounted to the ceiling. Now, when the door opens I get a 16 ft long bright LED strip of light instead of the single bulb. It?s very bright, and if you need, you can daisy-chain multiples together. It looks like it is currently $16.99 on Amazon. You will also need a socket adapter so you can plug it into the light bulb socket. I think mine cost me about $3.00. following is the link to the LEDs on Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B074N4YVDK/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o09_s00?ie=UTF8 &psc=1 Al Fuller From: Shop-talk [mailto:shop-talk-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of john niolon via Shop-talk Sent: Monday, May 20, 2019 11:58 AM To: shop-talk Subject: [Shop-talk] adding to a 4-way switch circuit. I have 4- 8? fluorescent fixtures in my garage that are controlled from three different doors. I?d like to be able to do some circuit changes so when I actuate the garage door opener it would also turn on these lights instead of the puny light in the unit. It seems something might be able to work using the light circuit in the opener but my head won?t wrap around a 4-way circuit and the relay/switch/hicky-thing in the opener ! any suggestions thanks john -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mark at bradakis.com Tue May 28 20:47:12 2019 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Tue, 28 May 2019 20:47:12 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] The time has come? Message-ID: So many years I spun a bearing in the Killer Spit during an IVR race out at Wendover.? It was the same summer I got laid off from my job at the U of U.? I decided at that time it would be wise to ot spend money redoing the motor and continuing to race.? That was, like 2005? Earlier this month I attended the VARA British Extravaganza at Buttonwillow Raceway in California.? Highlight of the weekend was the annual Kastner Cup event.? Had a great timefor the most part, and got inspired.? So I am going to commit to getting the Killer Spit back in action.? Probably just an autocross or two near the end of the summer, on a real racetrack in 2020 or 2021.? We shall see. But gee, the garage has been used for a storage closet for years, a complete mess.? Many tools and parts and stuff were lost when I couldn't keep paying the rent on storage units and the contents were auctioned off.? I may have to actually buy a few things this summer to carry out my plan.? Like an engine stand and a crane to lift motors in and out. Maybe more painting stuff, another HVLP gun or two.? Gosh, I may be asking for advice and recommendations on a few things this summer, sure you folks will be quite helpful. First order of business is defrosting the old fridge out there, it got a bit of buildup. mjb. Frosty Fridge From mark at bradakis.com Tue May 28 21:03:00 2019 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Tue, 28 May 2019 21:03:00 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] The time has come? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <23235316-a785-b6d8-bbff-d905f3cb72ef@bradakis.com> A tough row to hoe. What a mess mjb. From mark at bradakis.com Tue May 28 21:04:42 2019 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Tue, 28 May 2019 21:04:42 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] The time has come? In-Reply-To: <23235316-a785-b6d8-bbff-d905f3cb72ef@bradakis.com> References: <23235316-a785-b6d8-bbff-d905f3cb72ef@bradakis.com> Message-ID: <340e7cb3-2de8-72a8-c2c7-b53f06008d59@bradakis.com> On 5/28/19 9:03 PM, Mark J Bradakis via Shop-talk wrote: > A tough row to hoe. > > What a mess > > > mjb. > What a mess From mark at bradakis.com Tue May 28 23:50:01 2019 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Tue, 28 May 2019 23:50:01 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Sheesh Message-ID: <1c74c60b-05be-3586-0b16-abd785d11b9c@bradakis.com> You'd think that if there was anyone on the planet who could send a picture in a Team.Net email, it would be yours truly.? Can't believe I messed it up.? Oh well, so it goes, here's what I am dealing with in getting back toe making The Fat Chance Garage a working garage again. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: 20190528_205420.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 401375 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: 20190528_234639.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 457510 bytes Desc: not available URL: From lee at automate-it.com Wed May 29 05:29:39 2019 From: lee at automate-it.com (Lee Daniels) Date: Wed, 29 May 2019 06:29:39 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Sheesh In-Reply-To: <1c74c60b-05be-3586-0b16-abd785d11b9c@bradakis.com> References: <1c74c60b-05be-3586-0b16-abd785d11b9c@bradakis.com> Message-ID: <27487260c454c632b4eae33f31b29681.squirrel@automate-it.com> Amazing how many similarities I see to my workspace. Including a stereo with a cassette player, and a box labelled "misc chemicals". Ha! On Wed, May 29, 2019 00:50, Mark J Bradakis via Shop-talk wrote: > You'd think that if there was anyone on the planet who could send a > picture in a Team.Net email, it would be yours truly.?? Can't believe I messed > it up.?? Oh well, so it goes, here's what I am dealing with in getting back > toe making The Fat Chance Garage a working garage again. From marka at maracing.com Wed May 29 06:28:35 2019 From: marka at maracing.com (Mark Andy) Date: Wed, 29 May 2019 08:28:35 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] Sheesh In-Reply-To: <1c74c60b-05be-3586-0b16-abd785d11b9c@bradakis.com> References: <1c74c60b-05be-3586-0b16-abd785d11b9c@bradakis.com> Message-ID: Howdy, You've got some organizing and clean up ahead of you for sure! Looks like some nice tools nestled away in there though. I bet they'll appreciate being woken up and brought back into use. Mark On Wed, May 29, 2019 at 1:54 AM Mark J Bradakis via Shop-talk < shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote: > You'd think that if there was anyone on the planet who could send a > picture in a Team.Net email, it would be yours truly. Can't believe I > messed it up. Oh well, so it goes, here's what I am dealing with in > getting back toe making The Fat Chance Garage a working garage again. > > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/marka at maracing.com > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rkg at teleport.com Wed May 29 09:35:03 2019 From: rkg at teleport.com (Richard George) Date: Wed, 29 May 2019 08:35:03 -0700 Subject: [Shop-talk] Sheesh In-Reply-To: <1c74c60b-05be-3586-0b16-abd785d11b9c@bradakis.com> References: <1c74c60b-05be-3586-0b16-abd785d11b9c@bradakis.com> Message-ID: <12d54ea7-4790-7f1b-dd84-95c2e735c423@teleport.com> Oh man, that looks familiar - its sad when your shop ends up becoming a storage space :-/ Good luck Best, rkg (Richard George) On 5/28/2019 10:50 PM, Mark J Bradakis via Shop-talk wrote: > You'd think that if there was anyone on the planet who could send a > picture in a Team.Net email, it would be yours truly.? Can't believe I > messed it up.? Oh well, so it goes, here's what I am dealing with in > getting back toe making The Fat Chance Garage a working garage again. > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/rkg at teleport.com > -- ?People don?t know what they?re doing. And you?ve got this whole culture of people who don?t know what the hell they?re doing teaching every other idiot out there.? Britton Clouse -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From fishplate at gmail.com Wed May 29 12:03:30 2019 From: fishplate at gmail.com (Jeff Scarbrough) Date: Wed, 29 May 2019 14:03:30 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] Sheesh In-Reply-To: <12d54ea7-4790-7f1b-dd84-95c2e735c423@teleport.com> References: <1c74c60b-05be-3586-0b16-abd785d11b9c@bradakis.com> <12d54ea7-4790-7f1b-dd84-95c2e735c423@teleport.com> Message-ID: On Wed, May 29, 2019 at 11:36 AM Richard George via Shop-talk wrote: > > Oh man, that looks familiar - its sad when your shop ends up becoming a storage space :-/ My shop is full of parts that I need to get rid of, so I have room to fix the parts of my car. Jeff Scarbrough Corrosion Acres, Ga. From bkahler1 at gmail.com Wed May 29 09:59:32 2019 From: bkahler1 at gmail.com (Brad Kahler) Date: Wed, 29 May 2019 11:59:32 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] Hearing protection for mowing In-Reply-To: <4c7096a2-1bba-f080-07e2-70114ef185b6@earthlink.net> References: <4c7096a2-1bba-f080-07e2-70114ef185b6@earthlink.net> Message-ID: Thanks all, for the replies. Late last week I ordered a pair of 3M Peltor Optime 105 ear muffs from Amazon. Yesterday I mowed with them and they are definitely better than the Echo branded ear muffs that I had been using. When I use ear plugs I prefer the silicone style over the foam style. I'd prefer not to wear ear plugs AND ear muffs. The muffler on the mower points out to the side. Changing the direction of the muffler is definitely something to consider although at most about all I can do is put a 90 on the end of the nipple sticking out of the muffler and angling it to the rear. Now that I have new ear muffs redirection would be the next thing to try. While I'd love to have a pair of Bose Quiet Comfort 20 or something similar, the price is pretty daunting and knowing how rough I am with things I don't know that they would last the number of years I would expect for the price. One thing I really like about ear muff style protection is they keep my ears from getting sunburned! If the 3M ear muffs and redirection don't cut it for the long haul then I'll look into ANR ear muffs. Thanks again for the suggestions. Brad On Tue, May 21, 2019 at 7:37 PM Brian Kemp wrote: > I like the foam ear plugs best. I roll them tight so they slip right in > the ear and I've never had one fall out. I find when almost fully > inserted, they work pretty good. If I'm using something extra loud like a > router, I add ear muffs. > > On the mower, do you have the option of changing the direction of the > muffler or adding a tip to the muffler? If not, can you add a shroud of > some sort between your head and the muffler? Just like we have lots of > options for car mufflers, is there an optional muffler that reduces the > sound more? > > Brian > > On 5/21/2019 12:38 PM, John Innis via Shop-talk wrote: > > I'd also like to find something better. I am using 3M worktunes muffs, > but if I wear sunglasses there is a gap around the ear seals that reduce > the effectiveity quite a lot. I tried EAR brand rubber plugs, and various > brands of foam plugs, but they won't stay in my ears. > > On Tue, May 21, 2019 at 2:29 PM Brad Kahler via Shop-talk < > shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote: > >> I mow with a commercial model Scag Turf Tiger that has a 27 hp Kawasaki >> motor with the muffler that sits about 30" from my head. >> >> I'm looking for recommendations for a really good set of ear muffs that >> will help keep my ears from ringing when I'm done. Currently I've been >> using a pair of Echo ear muffs, sometimes with ear plugs combined. The >> combination isn't real bad but I'd like something better. >> >> Any suggestions? >> >> Thanks, >> >> Brad >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Shop-talk at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Suggested annual donation $12.96 >> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk >> http://autox.team.net/archive >> >> Unsubscribe/Manage: >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jdinnis at gmail.com >> >> > > -- > ================================= > = Never offend people with style when you = > = can offend with substance --- Sam Brown = > ================================= > > _______________________________________________ > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/bk13 at earthlink.net > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From 1789alpine at gmail.com Wed May 29 16:39:36 2019 From: 1789alpine at gmail.com (Jim Stone) Date: Wed, 29 May 2019 18:39:36 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] Hearing protection for mowing In-Reply-To: References: <4c7096a2-1bba-f080-07e2-70114ef185b6@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <538AAFFC-4D83-4F98-B673-BCF848EADA03@gmail.com> "While I'd love to have a pair of Bose Quiet Comfort 20?? Just for what its worth, I am on my third set of the Bose QC20?s and could not live without them. They work incredibly well, but I don?t know if they qualify as hearing protection. As I understand it, they work by generating anti-noise: the opposite wave length of the noise coming in. While what you can hear is greatly diminished - they are awesome on airplanes and in hotels with noisy HVAC systems - I wonder if they actually prevent hearing damage. It would be nice to know if they do qualify, or if noise+anti-noise is still damaging to the ears, even if you can?t actually perceive it. Does anyone here know? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From 1789alpine at gmail.com Wed May 29 17:34:30 2019 From: 1789alpine at gmail.com (Jim Stone) Date: Wed, 29 May 2019 19:34:30 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] Hearing protection for mowing In-Reply-To: <16b05e92d40.2800.cd27845553c78383775132770b7455be@gmail.com> References: <4c7096a2-1bba-f080-07e2-70114ef185b6@earthlink.net> <538AAFFC-4D83-4F98-B673-BCF848EADA03@gmail.com> <16b05e92d40.2800.cd27845553c78383775132770b7455be@gmail.com> Message-ID: Thanks, Karl. That is good to know, although I will probably restrict use of my ear buds this way, simply due to their cost. I?ve ruined conventional earphones while working and don?t want to risk damage to the expensive QC20?s, especially when inexpensive solutions are available. > On May 29, 2019, at 7:24 PM, Karl Vacek wrote: > > ANR - Active Noise Reduction - indeed does protect hearing. The units vary in sophistication, but all essentially have a microphone in each earcup that "listens" to the sound inside. The circuitry of course knows what it's putting out (assuming this is an actual audio headset and not just a hearing protector) and ignores that. It generates an opposite-phase sound wave to whatever it "hears" as noise, and thus the noise and the ANR signal cancel each other. Your ear received less sound pressure. > > I have a pair of Peltor muffs for shooting with microphones in front so that you can speak with someone and still be ready when a shot goes off. They're good, but for mowing the lawn I still turn off the sound from the microphones and they're more quiet. > > I also have aftermarket ANR kits I installed in several of my aviation headsets and they're far more effective even for mowing. But the price difference is huge. The Peltor ANR muffs were about $50, while the ANR kits I put in my David Clark headsets cost over $100, on top of a few hundred dollars for the headsets themselves. > > David Clark sells headsets with ANR from the factory, but they're over $500, and Bose aviation headsets are about $1,000. Ear plugs are cheaper if they're satisfactory. > > On May 29, 2019 5:39:42 PM Jim Stone via Shop-talk wrote: > >> "While I'd love to have a pair of Bose Quiet Comfort 20?? >> >> Just for what its worth, I am on my third set of the Bose QC20?s and could not live without them. They work incredibly well, but I don?t know if they qualify as hearing protection. As I understand it, they work by generating anti-noise: the opposite wave length of the noise coming in. While what you can hear is greatly diminished - they are awesome on airplanes and in hotels with noisy HVAC systems - I wonder if they actually prevent hearing damage. It would be nice to know if they do qualify, or if noise+anti-noise is still damaging to the ears, even if you can?t actually perceive it. Does anyone here know? >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Shop-talk at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Suggested annual donation $12.96 >> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive >> >> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/stearman809 at gmail.com >> >> > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From stearman809 at gmail.com Wed May 29 17:24:56 2019 From: stearman809 at gmail.com (Karl Vacek) Date: Wed, 29 May 2019 18:24:56 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Hearing protection for mowing In-Reply-To: <538AAFFC-4D83-4F98-B673-BCF848EADA03@gmail.com> References: <4c7096a2-1bba-f080-07e2-70114ef185b6@earthlink.net> <538AAFFC-4D83-4F98-B673-BCF848EADA03@gmail.com> Message-ID: <16b05e92d40.2800.cd27845553c78383775132770b7455be@gmail.com> ANR - Active Noise Reduction - indeed does protect hearing. The units vary in sophistication, but all essentially have a microphone in each earcup that "listens" to the sound inside. The circuitry of course knows what it's putting out (assuming this is an actual audio headset and not just a hearing protector) and ignores that. It generates an opposite-phase sound wave to whatever it "hears" as noise, and thus the noise and the ANR signal cancel each other. Your ear received less sound pressure. I have a pair of Peltor muffs for shooting with microphones in front so that you can speak with someone and still be ready when a shot goes off. They're good, but for mowing the lawn I still turn off the sound from the microphones and they're more quiet. I also have aftermarket ANR kits I installed in several of my aviation headsets and they're far more effective even for mowing. But the price difference is huge. The Peltor ANR muffs were about $50, while the ANR kits I put in my David Clark headsets cost over $100, on top of a few hundred dollars for the headsets themselves. David Clark sells headsets with ANR from the factory, but they're over $500, and Bose aviation headsets are about $1,000. Ear plugs are cheaper if they're satisfactory. On May 29, 2019 5:39:42 PM Jim Stone via Shop-talk wrote: > "While I'd love to have a pair of Bose Quiet Comfort 20?? > Just for what its worth, I am on my third set of the Bose QC20?s and could > not live without them. They work incredibly well, but I don?t know if they > qualify as hearing protection. As I understand it, they work by generating > anti-noise: the opposite wave length of the noise coming in. While what > you can hear is greatly diminished - they are awesome on airplanes and in > hotels with noisy HVAC systems - I wonder if they actually prevent hearing > damage. It would be nice to know if they do qualify, or if > noise+anti-noise is still damaging to the ears, even if you can?t actually > perceive it. Does anyone here know? > > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/stearman809 at gmail.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bk13 at earthlink.net Wed May 29 19:10:29 2019 From: bk13 at earthlink.net (Brian Kemp) Date: Wed, 29 May 2019 18:10:29 -0700 Subject: [Shop-talk] Sheesh In-Reply-To: <1c74c60b-05be-3586-0b16-abd785d11b9c@bradakis.com> References: <1c74c60b-05be-3586-0b16-abd785d11b9c@bradakis.com> Message-ID: <1818b739-f764-bc48-29d0-cbd9b36459ff@earthlink.net> Mark - You have empty shelf space and a visible floor with a clear walking path.? You have lots of space still to go to have a real mess. On 5/28/2019 10:50 PM, Mark J Bradakis via Shop-talk wrote: > You'd think that if there was anyone on the planet who could send a > picture in a Team.Net email, it would be yours truly.? Can't believe I > messed it up.? Oh well, so it goes, here's what I am dealing with in > getting back toe making The Fat Chance Garage a working garage again. > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/bk13 at earthlink.net > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jamesf at groupwbench.org Wed May 29 19:13:34 2019 From: jamesf at groupwbench.org (Jim Franklin) Date: Wed, 29 May 2019 21:13:34 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] Sheesh In-Reply-To: <1818b739-f764-bc48-29d0-cbd9b36459ff@earthlink.net> References: <1c74c60b-05be-3586-0b16-abd785d11b9c@bradakis.com> <1818b739-f764-bc48-29d0-cbd9b36459ff@earthlink.net> Message-ID: Yea, I'm trying to figure out what the problem is :-) jim > On May 29, 2019, at 9:10 PM, Brian Kemp via Shop-talk wrote: > > Mark - You have empty shelf space and a visible floor with a clear walking path. You have lots of space still to go to have a real mess. > > On 5/28/2019 10:50 PM, Mark J Bradakis via Shop-talk wrote: >> You'd think that if there was anyone on the planet who could send a picture in a Team.Net email, it would be yours truly. Can't believe I messed it up. Oh well, so it goes, here's what I am dealing with in getting back toe making The Fat Chance Garage a working garage again. >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> >> Shop-talk at autox.team.net >> >> Donate: >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Suggested annual donation $12.96 >> Archive: >> http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive >> >> >> Unsubscribe/Manage: >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/bk13 at earthlink.net >> >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jamesf at groupwbench.org > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/pkcs7-signature Size: 1386 bytes Desc: not available URL: From strovato at optonline.net Fri May 31 11:09:45 2019 From: strovato at optonline.net (Steven Trovato) Date: Fri, 31 May 2019 13:09:45 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] misshapen hex nuts Message-ID: <7D.C5.17549.35061FC5@mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> My son and I just replaced struts on his 2002 Toyota Avalon. With the new parts we received the nuts you can see in the attached picture. The hex shape is not normal. It is as though it was crushed side to side. The distance from point to opposite point is significantly greater for one pair of points. No socket I have will fit on these. A 15 mm socket is the closest, which is not a very common choice. I was set to write this all off as crappy Chinese parts, but I found the same nuts with both the strut and the sway bar link. They are different brands and were purchased separately. Maybe both buy their nuts from the same crappy nut supplier. Anyway, I just thought I would check if I am missing something. Is there some kind of locking nut that is intentionally made this way? -Steve T. --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: oval nuts cropped.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 142729 bytes Desc: not available URL: From lspector at gmail.com Fri May 31 11:17:57 2019 From: lspector at gmail.com (Larry Spector) Date: Fri, 31 May 2019 13:17:57 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] misshapen hex nuts In-Reply-To: <7D.C5.17549.35061FC5@mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> References: <7D.C5.17549.35061FC5@mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> Message-ID: Maybe they're a cheap form of Jet Nut? On Fri, May 31, 2019 at 1:12 PM Steven Trovato via Shop-talk < shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote: > My son and I just replaced struts on his 2002 Toyota Avalon. With > the new parts we received the nuts you can see in the attached > picture. The hex shape is not normal. It is as though it was > crushed side to side. The distance from point to opposite point is > significantly greater for one pair of points. No socket I have will > fit on these. A 15 mm socket is the closest, which is not a very > common choice. I was set to write this all off as crappy Chinese > parts, but I found the same nuts with both the strut and the sway bar > link. They are different brands and were purchased separately. Maybe > both buy their nuts from the same crappy nut supplier. Anyway, I > just thought I would check if I am missing something. Is there some > kind of locking nut that is intentionally made this way? > > -Steve T. > > --- > This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. > https://www.avast.com/antivirus > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/lspector at gmail.com > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jdinnis at gmail.com Fri May 31 11:18:59 2019 From: jdinnis at gmail.com (John Innis) Date: Fri, 31 May 2019 12:18:59 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] misshapen hex nuts In-Reply-To: <7D.C5.17549.35061FC5@mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> References: <7D.C5.17549.35061FC5@mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> Message-ID: This looks like a shortcut on the part of the mfgr. I have seen nuts where the threaded hole is bolonged a bit to create tension to assist with self locking, but all of those I have seen has a perfect hex. On Fri, May 31, 2019 at 12:12 PM Steven Trovato via Shop-talk < shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote: > My son and I just replaced struts on his 2002 Toyota Avalon. With > the new parts we received the nuts you can see in the attached > picture. The hex shape is not normal. It is as though it was > crushed side to side. The distance from point to opposite point is > significantly greater for one pair of points. No socket I have will > fit on these. A 15 mm socket is the closest, which is not a very > common choice. I was set to write this all off as crappy Chinese > parts, but I found the same nuts with both the strut and the sway bar > link. They are different brands and were purchased separately. Maybe > both buy their nuts from the same crappy nut supplier. Anyway, I > just thought I would check if I am missing something. Is there some > kind of locking nut that is intentionally made this way? > > -Steve T. > > --- > This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. > https://www.avast.com/antivirus > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jdinnis at gmail.com > > -- ================================= = Never offend people with style when you = = can offend with substance --- Sam Brown = ================================= -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From strovato at optonline.net Fri May 31 13:12:00 2019 From: strovato at optonline.net (Steven Trovato) Date: Fri, 31 May 2019 15:12:00 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] misshapen hex nuts In-Reply-To: <26B8F3C490654FA98539F27933973A18@RYPC> References: <7D.C5.17549.35061FC5@mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> <26B8F3C490654FA98539F27933973A18@RYPC> Message-ID: <93.49.18670.AEC71FC5@mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> Maybe. The nuts on the car from Toyota were nothing like this. These were the replacements that came with the new parts. The job is already done, we used different nuts. I was just wondering for future reference. I have a collection of tricks for removing odd nuts, including that pin socket in the Amazon link. I don't usually resort to such things when installing new parts. If this is intentional, I wonder how they expect them to be installed? It might be possible to use an open end wrench if you only use the closer pair of flats, but that is kind of ridiculous. -Steve T. At 01:28 PM 5/31/2019, Randall wrote: >I've seen those as well. IMO the distortion is deliberate, a cheap form of >Stover nut. OEMs are always looking for ways to save another $.001 per car, >so they might well be to Toyota specs. > >My solution is to just toss them, and use something else (with Loctite). > >But you might try using a "flank drive" socket on them. They're usually a >lot more tolerant of odd shapes and such. > >Another possibility: >https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B073PRY9W6?tag=b0c55-20 > >-- Randall --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus From johnnybh at windstream.net Fri May 31 13:43:39 2019 From: johnnybh at windstream.net (johnny b) Date: Fri, 31 May 2019 15:43:39 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] misshapen hex nuts Message-ID: <7392a18e-853a-8960-918b-694d83914da4@windstream.net> Those appear to be distorted-thread flange lock nuts.? They are stronger than nylon locking nuts and withstand much higher temperatures.? The serrated flanges are a plus. From McMaster-Carr - "An irregularly-shaped thread grips the bolt for a stronger hold than nylon-insert flange locknuts. They have a flange that distributes pressure where the nut meets the material surface, eliminating the need for a separate washer." johnny b From strovato at optonline.net Fri May 31 14:27:43 2019 From: strovato at optonline.net (Steven Trovato) Date: Fri, 31 May 2019 16:27:43 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] misshapen hex nuts In-Reply-To: <7392a18e-853a-8960-918b-694d83914da4@windstream.net> References: <7392a18e-853a-8960-918b-694d83914da4@windstream.net> Message-ID: <01.83.18670.E9E81FC5@mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> That's fine, but I haven't seen any before where the hex was distorted so a socket won't fit. The flange is nice and they can shape the threads to lock better, but I would think the hex should be made to work with a wrench or socket. Either that or provide a special shape socket for installation. -Steve T. At 03:43 PM 5/31/2019, johnny b via Shop-talk wrote: >Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64Those appear to be distorted-thread >flange lock nuts. They are stronger >than nylon locking nuts and withstand much higher temperatures. The >serrated flanges are a plus. > > From McMaster-Carr - "An irregularly-shaped thread grips the bolt > for a stronger hold than nylon-insert flange locknuts. They have a > flange that distributes pressure where the nut meets the material > surface, eliminating the need for a separate washer." > >johnny b > > >_______________________________________________ > >Shop-talk at autox.team.net >Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >Suggested annual donation $12.96 >Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive > >Unsubscribe/Manage: >http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/strovato at optonline.net --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus From phoenix722 at comcast.net Fri May 31 15:30:23 2019 From: phoenix722 at comcast.net (Mike Sinclair) Date: Fri, 31 May 2019 14:30:23 -0700 Subject: [Shop-talk] misshapen hex nuts In-Reply-To: <93.49.18670.AEC71FC5@mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> References: <7D.C5.17549.35061FC5@mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> <26B8F3C490654FA98539F27933973A18@RYPC> <93.49.18670.AEC71FC5@mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> Message-ID: Looks clever.? How well does it work?? Can it take a lot of torque? Mike On 5/31/2019 12:12 PM, Steven Trovato via Shop-talk wrote: > Another possibility: > https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B073PRY9W6?tag=b0c55-20 --- This email has been checked for viruses by AVG. https://www.avg.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mdporter at dfn.com Fri May 31 13:48:12 2019 From: mdporter at dfn.com (Michael Porter) Date: Fri, 31 May 2019 13:48:12 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] misshapen hex nuts In-Reply-To: References: <7D.C5.17549.35061FC5@mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> Message-ID: <017ccac9-8727-cbd2-8228-61ea45aedef6@dfn.com> On 5/31/2019 11:18 AM, John Innis via Shop-talk wrote: > This looks like a shortcut on the part of the mfgr.? I have seen nuts > where the threaded hole is bolonged a bit to create tension to assist > with self locking, but all of those I have seen has a perfect hex. To add to that, in all the stover nuts I've seen, the distortion is only in the upper part of the nut, not the full thread--otherwise, it could not be installed without difficulty or chance of cross-threading. Pitch `em.? They're junk. Cheers. -- Michael Porter Roswell, NM Never let anyone drive you crazy when you know it's within walking distance....