From tims_datsun_stuff at outlook.com  Sat Dec  6 11:02:12 2025
From: tims_datsun_stuff at outlook.com (Tim .)
Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2025 18:02:12 +0000
Subject: [Shop-talk] odd cartridge??
Message-ID: <MN2PR14MB286277E9BE9F9560D48729F4B4A4A@MN2PR14MB2862.namprd14.prod.outlook.com>

I need to replace at least the cold cartridge in our shower--probably just do both IF I can find replacements. I do not know how old this system is but assume 40+ years, maybe 50.

This is what it looks like before full removal. At this stage in disassembly, it looks nothing like any of the videos I have looked at online.

Does anyone recognize this? What are my chances of finding a replacement? Or should I just hope I can rebuild it?

I can find no markings to ID the system.

Thanks
tim
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From tims_datsun_stuff at outlook.com  Sat Dec  6 11:03:15 2025
From: tims_datsun_stuff at outlook.com (Tim .)
Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2025 18:03:15 +0000
Subject: [Shop-talk] odd cartridge??
In-Reply-To: <MN2PR14MB286277E9BE9F9560D48729F4B4A4A@MN2PR14MB2862.namprd14.prod.outlook.com>
References: <MN2PR14MB286277E9BE9F9560D48729F4B4A4A@MN2PR14MB2862.namprd14.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <MN2PR14MB28623F177EB08243E96686AAB4A4A@MN2PR14MB2862.namprd14.prod.outlook.com>

A picture might help.....ffs tim
________________________________
From: Tim . <tims_datsun_stuff at outlook.com>
Sent: Saturday, December 6, 2025 12:02 PM
To: Shop Talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net>
Subject: odd cartridge??

I need to replace at least the cold cartridge in our shower--probably just do both IF I can find replacements. I do not know how old this system is but assume 40+ years, maybe 50.

This is what it looks like before full removal. At this stage in disassembly, it looks nothing like any of the videos I have looked at online.

Does anyone recognize this? What are my chances of finding a replacement? Or should I just hope I can rebuild it?

I can find no markings to ID the system.

Thanks
tim
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From patintexas at icloud.com  Sat Dec  6 11:20:43 2025
From: patintexas at icloud.com (Pat Horne)
Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2025 12:20:43 -0600
Subject: [Shop-talk] odd cartridge??
In-Reply-To: <MN2PR14MB286277E9BE9F9560D48729F4B4A4A@MN2PR14MB2862.namprd14.prod.outlook.com>
References: <MN2PR14MB286277E9BE9F9560D48729F4B4A4A@MN2PR14MB2862.namprd14.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <463EA98A-051B-4113-BC4A-FD62361A9BF7@icloud.com>

Tim, no photos came through. If there is an escutcheon on it, is there any markings?

Peace, Pat

Pat Horne 
We support Habitat for Humanity


On Dec 6, 2025, at 12:17?PM, Tim . <tims_datsun_stuff at outlook.com> wrote:

?
I need to replace at least the cold cartridge in our shower--probably just do both IF I can find replacements. I do not know how old this system is but assume 40+ years, maybe 50.

This is what it looks like before full removal. At this stage in disassembly, it looks nothing like any of the videos I have looked at online. 

Does anyone recognize this? What are my chances of finding a replacement? Or should I just hope I can rebuild it?

I can find no markings to ID the system. 

Thanks
tim
_______________________________________________

Shop-talk at autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Suggested annual donation  $12.96
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patintexas at icloud.com

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From patintexas at icloud.com  Sat Dec  6 11:22:35 2025
From: patintexas at icloud.com (Pat Horne)
Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2025 12:22:35 -0600
Subject: [Shop-talk] odd cartridge??
In-Reply-To: <MN2PR14MB286277E9BE9F9560D48729F4B4A4A@MN2PR14MB2862.namprd14.prod.outlook.com>
References: <MN2PR14MB286277E9BE9F9560D48729F4B4A4A@MN2PR14MB2862.namprd14.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <2EBBC9FD-B9DE-4141-9DA4-88104F6CBDB3@icloud.com>

Also, if you have the cartridge out, try a search with google lens. 


Pat Horne 
We support Habitat for Humanity


On Dec 6, 2025, at 12:17?PM, Tim . <tims_datsun_stuff at outlook.com> wrote:

?
I need to replace at least the cold cartridge in our shower--probably just do both IF I can find replacements. I do not know how old this system is but assume 40+ years, maybe 50.

This is what it looks like before full removal. At this stage in disassembly, it looks nothing like any of the videos I have looked at online. 

Does anyone recognize this? What are my chances of finding a replacement? Or should I just hope I can rebuild it?

I can find no markings to ID the system. 

Thanks
tim
_______________________________________________

Shop-talk at autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Suggested annual donation  $12.96
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patintexas at icloud.com

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From bk13 at earthlink.net  Sat Dec  6 15:44:07 2025
From: bk13 at earthlink.net (Brian Kemp)
Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2025 14:44:07 -0800
Subject: [Shop-talk] odd cartridge??
In-Reply-To: <MN2PR14MB286277E9BE9F9560D48729F4B4A4A@MN2PR14MB2862.namprd14.prod.outlook.com>
References: <MN2PR14MB286277E9BE9F9560D48729F4B4A4A@MN2PR14MB2862.namprd14.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <847fd9a3-0aee-45fb-99f8-2d93efbd3d7c@earthlink.net>

Take the picture to a local plumbing supply place or a good hardware 
store.? If you have it, chances are other's in your community also have 
it and a smart local person can take care of you.

Brian

On 12/6/2025 10:02 AM, Tim . wrote:
> I need to replace at least the cold cartridge in our shower--probably 
> just do both IF I can find replacements. I do not know how old this 
> system is but assume 40+ years, maybe 50.
>
> This is what it looks like before full removal. At this stage in 
> disassembly, it looks nothing like any of the videos I have looked at 
> online.
>
> Does anyone recognize this? What are my chances of finding a 
> replacement? Or should I just hope I can rebuild it?
>
> I can find no markings to ID the system.
>
> Thanks
> tim
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate:http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive:http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/bk13 at earthlink.net
>
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From mark at bradakis.com  Mon Dec 15 03:09:54 2025
From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark Bradakis)
Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2025 03:09:54 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] List info, history
Message-ID: <4d010752-dda0-4320-b4f6-44cf81713b44@bradakis.com>

There was some discussion on one of the Team Net lists about how things 
have changed,  This is what I wrote, some of you may find it interesting.

====

A lot has changed over the last 35 years or so.  When I took over from 
Jim Muller, who took over from Dale Cook, back in the late 80s the 
"Internet" was still a wet behind the ears baby.  These days, wow, 
completely different!

This list is a fragment of the original british-cars list.  But one 
thing has not changed, and that is my commitment to providing this 
content as best I can, free of charge.  Sure there were times when I did 
*everything* by hand, one request at a time, for email address changes, 
additions, deletions.  There were times I was belittled for making what 
seemed like arbitrary decisions to the unaware observer. There were 
times I worked 20 - 30 hours a week on Team dot Net, even before it was 
Team dot Net.

These days my workload is way down, thanks to automated email list 
software.  But things are always changing when it comes to computers. 
These days it is all still running, but who knows for how long.

Mailman 2, the version I have running on the Team Net server, was 
released in April of 2004.  It has long since been shuffled off to 
inactive status as far as the folks maintaining it are concerned.  But 
still it chugs along, these days pieced together with chewing gum and 
baling wire.

In case you are wondering:

  [root at autox data]# uptime
  15:13:45 up 876 days, 21:00,  1 user,  load average: 0.61, 0.55, 0.59
  [root at autox data]# uname -a
  Linux autox 5.3.11-100.fc29.x86_64 #1 SMP Tue Nov 12 20:41:25 UTC 2019 
x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux

Yes, the server has not been booted for about 2 and a half years.  The 
fc29 in the uname output is the level of Fedora running, last updated in 
2019.  My personal computer is at revision 41.  A LOT has changed.  I 
fear that if the server goes down, it may never come back up cleanly on 
its own.  I am hoping to make it go for at least 1,000 days of 
continuous running.  But I'll burn that bridge before we cross it, or 
however the saying goes.

For now, there are people who still enjoy these old lists, still finding 
them useful, and a lot more appealing than mass market social media 
outlets, with advertising you need to wade through to find anything 
worthwhile.

And as long as I am able, I will keep it that way.  Enjoy the coming 
festive season!

mjb.

ps:  A week before the winter solstice, and I just got back from a top 
down drive with the British Motor Club of Utah.  Sunny, mid 50s here in 
the Salt Lake area.  Unreal!

From james.f.juhas at snet.net  Mon Dec 15 14:43:57 2025
From: james.f.juhas at snet.net (Jim Juhas)
Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2025 16:43:57 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] Architect software recommendations
References: <70b144c0-c94d-4d6f-8cb0-145c7bfeed39.ref@snet.net>
Message-ID: <70b144c0-c94d-4d6f-8cb0-145c7bfeed39@snet.net>

I have been planning some remodeling at our seasonal cottage that's next 
to my workshop. I have seen the internet ads for something called Plan 7 
Architect that seems quite robust and reasonably priced at about $100. I 
need to create some plans for a kitchen remodel that I can use to guide 
my likely contractor toward something unique to our needs and 
preferences. He provided a plan from a kitchen designer he likes 
completely? misses our point, which is to preserve the rustic structure 
of the cottage but to build a workable space with updated appliances and 
cabinetry. What he provided looks like something out of Better Homes and 
Gardens.

When we designed the basic layout for the kitchen in our full-time 
house, I used Visio to create it. We took that to Lowes and had their 
guy assemble a design of cabinets to generally follow that plan, making 
accommodations to suit the cabinetry that was available.

The thing I saw advertised recently looks like it would be way easier 
and would include 3D renderings. After seeing the Plan 7 ads, I did some 
searching and found a dozen or more products with similar claims.

So, does anyone here have direct experience with any of these products? 
I'd love to hear some recommendations.

Thanks.

Jim
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From kentsu at corvairkid.com  Tue Dec 16 11:00:36 2025
From: kentsu at corvairkid.com (Kent Sullivan)
Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2025 10:00:36 -0800
Subject: [Shop-talk] Rolling bridge jacks
In-Reply-To: <1d8401dc6256$8a0539a0$9e0face0$@corvairkid.com>
References: <1d8401dc6256$8a0539a0$9e0face0$@corvairkid.com>
Message-ID: <0ca601dc6eb5$e20003e0$a6000ba0$@corvairkid.com>

Following up-I did indeed purchase the Challenger rolling bridge jack. Am
very happy with it so far. Happy to answer questions.

 

--Kent

 

From: Shop-talk <shop-talk-bounces at autox.team.net> On Behalf Of Kent
Sullivan
Sent: Sunday, November 30, 2025 4:08 PM
To: shop-talk at autox.team.net
Subject: [Shop-talk] Rolling bridge jacks

 

Hi,

 

I hope y'all had a nice Thanksgiving.

 

I have been doing research on rolling bridge jacks over the past couple of
months. My 4-post lift is a ~20-year-old Rotary model, from their first
foray into the "prosumer" space (blue paint) and before the same item was
spun off as part of the separate Revolution line (black paint). It has a
7000 lbs. capacity.

 

As far as I can tell, Rotary never offered a rolling bridge jack for this
line. I have looked at all that they do offer (which is quite a few choices,
since they bought companies like Forward and merged their products in) but
for various reasons I wasn't happy with the choices. (I can go into detail
for anyone who cares.)

 

I have pretty much settled on the Challenger RJ3.5 - 3500 lbs. capacity,
manual pump (no air assist). I would be interested in hearing from anyone
who has experience with this model - or with a different Challenger rolling
bridge jack. Or a different manufacturer altogether.

 

Happy Holidays,

 

--Kent

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From jniolon at att.net  Wed Dec 17 08:26:18 2025
From: jniolon at att.net (john niolon)
Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2025 09:26:18 -0600
Subject: [Shop-talk] blast media
References: <1UkY24Vdnf.1EE2NOHFPRI.ref@johns-desktop>
Message-ID: <1UkY24Vdnf.1EE2NOHFPRI@johns-desktop>

not MSNBC or CBS    Sand blast cabinet media...   I know that black beauty is 
fairly aggressive and  glass beads or walnut shell is much less so
 
What is a good type of media for cleaning general low rust metals and 
aluminum... auto parts, etc 
 
john
 
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From ejrussell61 at gmail.com  Wed Dec 17 09:11:34 2025
From: ejrussell61 at gmail.com (Eric Russell)
Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2025 11:11:34 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] blast media
In-Reply-To: <1UkY24Vdnf.1EE2NOHFPRI@johns-desktop>
References: <1UkY24Vdnf.1EE2NOHFPRI.ref@johns-desktop>
 <1UkY24Vdnf.1EE2NOHFPRI@johns-desktop>
Message-ID: <CAP7dBXCDBMF8w2j_i3a13QHDYZ3gFXTdrxo9bQpftw2SQux6Wg@mail.gmail.com>

IME, Black Beauty (coal slag) is cheap but dusty & dirty. I'm not sure how
long lasting it is, either.

I use Aluminum Oxide - great for rust & paint removal. Avoid using on
machined surfaces (a layer or two of duct tape can be used to prevent
harming machined surfaces).
I have also used crushed glass - made from recycled glass. The sharp edges
cut well without being too aggressive.

Do be careful if you spill any glass beads. It will be like walking on
greased ice...

TP Tools has lots of options with good descriptions of each.
https://www.tptools.com/Abrasives-and-Accessories.html

EjR

On Wed, Dec 17, 2025 at 10:29?AM john niolon <jniolon at att.net> wrote:

> not MSNBC or CBS    Sand blast cabinet media...   I know that black beauty
> is fairly aggressive and  glass beads or walnut shell is much less so
>
> What is a good type of media for cleaning general low rust metals and
> aluminum... auto parts, etc
>
> john
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/ejrussell61 at gmail.com
>
>
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From patintexas at icloud.com  Wed Dec 17 09:32:43 2025
From: patintexas at icloud.com (Pat Horne)
Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2025 10:32:43 -0600
Subject: [Shop-talk] blast media
In-Reply-To: <CAP7dBXCDBMF8w2j_i3a13QHDYZ3gFXTdrxo9bQpftw2SQux6Wg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAP7dBXCDBMF8w2j_i3a13QHDYZ3gFXTdrxo9bQpftw2SQux6Wg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <76187FBC-A7FB-4A21-97FF-76C80F915C45@icloud.com>

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From jdinnis at gmail.com  Wed Dec 17 11:46:20 2025
From: jdinnis at gmail.com (John Innis)
Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2025 12:46:20 -0600
Subject: [Shop-talk] blast media
In-Reply-To: <1UkY24Vdnf.1EE2NOHFPRI@johns-desktop>
References: <1UkY24Vdnf.1EE2NOHFPRI.ref@johns-desktop>
 <1UkY24Vdnf.1EE2NOHFPRI@johns-desktop>
Message-ID: <CANuE7YCyHj_TAZLR_hXW9ookbWtfFYfqzxeDAbTVTZZjJJt6wg@mail.gmail.com>

Also be careful with your dust collection when using glass or silica
media.  That stuff is REALLY bad to breathe.  The Black Beauty is not great
but no where near as dangerous as some of the finer media.  Walnut shell is
the safest of these.  I use it for sot metals like AL and Brass and it does
a good job most of the time but is not aggressive enough to remove some
types of powder coat.

On Wed, Dec 17, 2025 at 9:38?AM john niolon <jniolon at att.net> wrote:

> not MSNBC or CBS    Sand blast cabinet media...   I know that black beauty
> is fairly aggressive and  glass beads or walnut shell is much less so
>
> What is a good type of media for cleaning general low rust metals and
> aluminum... auto parts, etc
>
> john
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jdinnis at gmail.com
>
>

-- 
=================================
= Never offend people with style when you   =
= can offend with substance --- Sam Brown  =
=================================
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From jblair1948 at cox.net  Wed Dec 17 12:37:00 2025
From: jblair1948 at cox.net (John T Blair)
Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2025 19:37:00 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [Shop-talk] blast media
In-Reply-To: <CANuE7YCyHj_TAZLR_hXW9ookbWtfFYfqzxeDAbTVTZZjJJt6wg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <1UkY24Vdnf.1EE2NOHFPRI.ref@johns-desktop>
 <1UkY24Vdnf.1EE2NOHFPRI@johns-desktop>
 <CANuE7YCyHj_TAZLR_hXW9ookbWtfFYfqzxeDAbTVTZZjJJt6wg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1408207485.1028581.1766000220022@mail.yahoo.com>

On Wednesday, December 17, 2025 at 01:56:49 PM EST, John Innis <jdinnis at gmail.com> wrote: 


>Also be careful with your dust collection when using glass or silica media.??>That stuff is REALLY bad to breathe.? The Black Beauty is not great but no?>where near as dangerous as some of the finer media .....
You don't say wither your doing pressure Blasting in the open or using a plasting cabinet.? But either way I strongly recommend that you wear a respirator anytime you are doing any kind of blasting. ? 

JohnT
John T. Blair? WA4OHZ???? email:? jblair1948 at cox.netVa. Beach, Va????????????????? Phone:? (757) 495-8229

48 TR1800??? 48 #4 Midget??? 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106)
???? 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887)??? 77 Spitfire??? 71 Saab Sonett III
?????????????????????? 65 Rambler Classic

Morgan:??? http://autox.team.net/morgan/

Bricklin:???? http://www.bricklin.org

If you can read this???????????? - Thank a teacher!
If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!!

>From Dennis Prager - The American Trilogy:
???? e pluribus Unum, "from many, one."
???? In God We Trust
???? Liberty - the? power? of? choosing,? thinking,? and? acting? for? 
????????????????? oneself; freedom? from? control? or? restriction? 



 

   

 

|  | Virus-free. www.avast.com  |

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From 1789alpine at gmail.com  Thu Dec 18 16:25:26 2025
From: 1789alpine at gmail.com (Jim Stone)
Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2025 18:25:26 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] New engine for a Honda?  RESOLUTION
In-Reply-To: <OFA3C3A210.DAEC1EF2-ON85258D49.0080D932-85258D49.00823821@mail.megageek.com>
References: <OF7439AC60.D14B173F-ON85258D48.003E33F6-85258D48.003FD243@mail.megageek.com>
 <OF0C143EA7.849A030B-ON85258D48.004138ED-85258D48.00414C24@mail.megageek.com>
 <CAG1pxga3CcDxBSo2A5Zj2KDHdFa3UaMZP6EB5kT-bRq_56-jCg@mail.gmail.com>
 <OFA3C3A210.DAEC1EF2-ON85258D49.0080D932-85258D49.00823821@mail.megageek.com>
Message-ID: <6F7045E5-A8C7-4580-9682-D040354AD0D3@gmail.com>

I thought I would resurrect Moose?s discussion to share a recent article from Haggerty on the use of AI to diagnose vehicle problems.  In a nutshell, their experience mirrors Moose?s and suggests we might all want to add ChatGTP into our toolboxes.

https://www.hagerty.com/media/maintenance-and-tech/tested-is-ai-your-next-classic-car-mechanic/?utm_source=SFMC&utm_medium=email&utm_content=MED_UN_NA_EML_UN_UN_WeekendRoadTrip&hashed_email=c8a202749fb3ee180da46bc01753dfea37cacafc792579d503edc6e326ce4e4e&dtm_em=c8a202749fb3ee180da46bc01753dfea37cacafc792579d503edc6e326ce4e4e

> On Nov 21, 2025, at 6:42?PM, Moose <eric at megageek.com> wrote:
> 
> Well gurus, I fixed the Honda and I'm almost embarrassed to say it. 
> 
> First, I checked the intake for oil thinking that would show me if it was a pcv valve that failed.  It was clean. 
> 
> HOWEVER, I didn't realize the best way to check them is to just pull them out and replace them. (It was $4.50 and $8 for the grommet.)  Actually, if you pull them out and shake them, you should hear it rattle. 
> 
> Well, I replaced it. And no more oil leak!!!!!  I also borescoped the cylinders (all were near perfect) and replaced the spark plugs while I was there.  Car runs much smoother now as a result! 
> 
> So, who was the winner that told me this... 
> 
> AI.  That is right, I put the question to ChatGPT and that was the first thing it told me to try.  It gave me a nice list of things to try in order. 
> 
> Since I figured, I was on a roll, I pushed on.  One of the problems with the car that we never had the 'radio security code' and after a battery replacement, the radio was locked. 
> 
> So I found a link to a Honda site where you can recover the codes, but it required the S/N of the radio (and car VIN.)  No problem I figured.  Taking the radio out was 2 clips and 3 screws to get the dash off of it.  HOWEVER, there was a surprise hidden for 'non-Honda' mechanics that may try to do this.  The button for the hazard lights has an electrical connector attached to it.  Like all automotive connectors, it requires a magic spell, 2 incantations, and a bit of unicorn farts to disconnect it (Seriously, why can't they standardize electrical connectors?)   
> Anyway, when you get it apart, the spring that returns the hazard light button is held in-between the switch and the connector.  So guess where this spring shoots one you disconnect the plug.  That's right, straight into the depths of the dash board.  CRUD! 
> 
> Luckily, I found a spring that worked in my 'springs and things' draw and was able to get it all back together. So the car now has a radio as well. 
> 
> In the end, I'm a happy man and the SO thinks I can walk on water.  Don't worry, I'm sure I'll screw up soon enough to dispel that image.  8>) 
> 
> Moose_______________________________________________
> 
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
> 
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/1789alpine at gmail.com
> 

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From mayfield+shoptalk at sackheads.org  Thu Dec 18 18:15:15 2025
From: mayfield+shoptalk at sackheads.org (Jimmie Mayfield)
Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2025 20:15:15 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] New engine for a Honda? RESOLUTION
In-Reply-To: <6F7045E5-A8C7-4580-9682-D040354AD0D3@gmail.com>
References: <OF7439AC60.D14B173F-ON85258D48.003E33F6-85258D48.003FD243@mail.megageek.com>
 <OF0C143EA7.849A030B-ON85258D48.004138ED-85258D48.00414C24@mail.megageek.com>
 <CAG1pxga3CcDxBSo2A5Zj2KDHdFa3UaMZP6EB5kT-bRq_56-jCg@mail.gmail.com>
 <OFA3C3A210.DAEC1EF2-ON85258D49.0080D932-85258D49.00823821@mail.megageek.com>
 <6F7045E5-A8C7-4580-9682-D040354AD0D3@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <b916774a-aebf-4cbb-a8e0-4d1b6b238468@sackheads.org>

ChatGPT and Gemini and Claude are useful tools.? But I've run into a 
couple situations where AI answers, Gemini's in particular, were 
complete fabrications.? Most recently, I'd asked Gemini to summarize the 
backstory for an online novel that I've been reading.? Gemini's answers 
were completely believable and, in some cases, completely false. 
Descriptions of events that never occurred and events that did occur but 
involved different characters.? (It was fascinating how the answers wove 
a cohesive picture that wound up at the same place as the original novel 
but took a different path to get there.)

Trust but verify is the name of the game.


On 12/18/25 18:25, Jim Stone wrote:
> I thought I would resurrect Moose?s discussion to share a recent 
> article from Haggerty on the use of AI to diagnose vehicle problems. 
> ?In a nutshell, their experience mirrors Moose?s and suggests we might 
> all want to add ChatGTP into our toolboxes.
>
> hagerty.com 
> <https://www.hagerty.com/media/maintenance-and-tech/tested-is-ai-your-next-classic-car-mechanic/?utm_source=SFMC&utm_medium=email&utm_content=MED_UN_NA_EML_UN_UN_WeekendRoadTrip&hashed_email=c8a202749fb3ee180da46bc01753dfea37cacafc792579d503edc6e326ce4e4e&dtm_em=c8a202749fb3ee180da46bc01753dfea37cacafc792579d503edc6e326ce4e4e>
> 	<https://www.hagerty.com/media/maintenance-and-tech/tested-is-ai-your-next-classic-car-mechanic/?utm_source=SFMC&utm_medium=email&utm_content=MED_UN_NA_EML_UN_UN_WeekendRoadTrip&hashed_email=c8a202749fb3ee180da46bc01753dfea37cacafc792579d503edc6e326ce4e4e&dtm_em=c8a202749fb3ee180da46bc01753dfea37cacafc792579d503edc6e326ce4e4e>
>
> <https://www.hagerty.com/media/maintenance-and-tech/tested-is-ai-your-next-classic-car-mechanic/?utm_source=SFMC&utm_medium=email&utm_content=MED_UN_NA_EML_UN_UN_WeekendRoadTrip&hashed_email=c8a202749fb3ee180da46bc01753dfea37cacafc792579d503edc6e326ce4e4e&dtm_em=c8a202749fb3ee180da46bc01753dfea37cacafc792579d503edc6e326ce4e4e>
>
>
>> On Nov 21, 2025, at 6:42?PM, Moose <eric at megageek.com> wrote:
>>
>> Well gurus, I fixed the Honda and I'm almost embarrassed to say it.
>>
>> First, I checked the intake for oil thinking that would show me if it 
>> was a pcv valve that failed. ?It was clean.
>>
>> HOWEVER, I didn't realize the best way to check them is to just pull 
>> them out and replace them. (It was $4.50 and $8 for the grommet.) 
>> ?Actually, if you pull them out and shake them, you should hear it 
>> rattle.
>>
>> Well, I replaced it. And no more oil leak!!!!! ?I also borescoped the 
>> cylinders (all were near perfect) and replaced the spark plugs while 
>> I was there. ?Car runs much smoother now as a result!
>>
>> So, who was the winner that told me this...
>>
>> AI. ?That is right, I put the question to ChatGPT and that was the 
>> first thing it told me to try. ?It gave me a nice list of things to 
>> try in order.
>>
>> Since I figured, I was on a roll, I pushed on. ?One of the problems 
>> with the car that we never had the 'radio security code' and after a 
>> battery replacement, the radio was locked.
>>
>> So I found a link to a Honda site where you can recover the codes, 
>> but it required the S/N of the radio (and car VIN.) ?No problem I 
>> figured. ?Taking the radio out was 2 clips and 3 screws to get the 
>> dash off of it. ?HOWEVER, there was a surprise hidden for 'non-Honda' 
>> mechanics that may try to do this. ?The button for the hazard lights 
>> has an electrical connector attached to it. ?Like all automotive 
>> connectors, it requires a magic spell, 2 incantations, and a bit of 
>> unicorn farts to disconnect it (Seriously, why can't they standardize 
>> electrical connectors?)
>> Anyway, when you get it apart, the spring that returns the hazard 
>> light button is held in-between the switch and the connector. ?So 
>> guess where this spring shoots one you disconnect the plug. ?That's 
>> right, straight into the depths of the dash board. ?CRUD!
>>
>> Luckily, I found a spring that worked in my 'springs and things' draw 
>> and was able to get it all back together. So the car now has a radio 
>> as well.
>>
>> In the end, I'm a happy man and the SO thinks I can walk on water. 
>> ?Don't worry, I'm sure I'll screw up soon enough to dispel that 
>> image. ?8>)
>>
>> Moose_______________________________________________
>>
>> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
>> Suggested annual donation ?$12.96
>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk 
>> http://autox.team.net/archive
>>
>> Unsubscribe/Manage: 
>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/1789alpine at gmail.com
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate:http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive:http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/mayfield+shoptalk at sackheads.org
>
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From dirtbeard at live.com  Thu Dec 18 18:46:30 2025
From: dirtbeard at live.com (Old Dirtbeard)
Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2025 01:46:30 +0000
Subject: [Shop-talk] New engine for a Honda? RESOLUTION
In-Reply-To: <b916774a-aebf-4cbb-a8e0-4d1b6b238468@sackheads.org>
References: <OF7439AC60.D14B173F-ON85258D48.003E33F6-85258D48.003FD243@mail.megageek.com>
 <OF0C143EA7.849A030B-ON85258D48.004138ED-85258D48.00414C24@mail.megageek.com>
 <CAG1pxga3CcDxBSo2A5Zj2KDHdFa3UaMZP6EB5kT-bRq_56-jCg@mail.gmail.com>
 <OFA3C3A210.DAEC1EF2-ON85258D49.0080D932-85258D49.00823821@mail.megageek.com>
 <6F7045E5-A8C7-4580-9682-D040354AD0D3@gmail.com>
 <b916774a-aebf-4cbb-a8e0-4d1b6b238468@sackheads.org>
Message-ID: <BN9PR12MB5114B4A68F038DC6D7EC2961D8A9A@BN9PR12MB5114.namprd12.prod.outlook.com>

I have been using MS Copilot, it is bundled with Edge for free and can be quite helpful in the initial exploration phase. It can help you to ask the right questions.

Get Outlook for Android<https://aka.ms/AAb9ysg>
________________________________
From: Shop-talk <shop-talk-bounces at autox.team.net> on behalf of Jimmie Mayfield <mayfield+shoptalk at sackheads.org>
Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2025 5:15:15 PM
To: shop-talk at autox.team.net <shop-talk at autox.team.net>
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] New engine for a Honda? RESOLUTION

ChatGPT and Gemini and Claude are useful tools.  But I've run into a couple situations where AI answers, Gemini's in particular, were complete fabrications.  Most recently, I'd asked Gemini to summarize the backstory for an online novel that I've been reading.  Gemini's answers were completely believable and, in some cases, completely false.  Descriptions of events that never occurred and events that did occur but involved different characters.  (It was fascinating how the answers wove a cohesive picture that wound up at the same place as the original novel but took a different path to get there.)

Trust but verify is the name of the game.


On 12/18/25 18:25, Jim Stone wrote:
I thought I would resurrect Moose?s discussion to share a recent article from Haggerty on the use of AI to diagnose vehicle problems.  In a nutshell, their experience mirrors Moose?s and suggests we might all want to add ChatGTP into our toolboxes.

<https://www.hagerty.com/media/maintenance-and-tech/tested-is-ai-your-next-classic-car-mechanic/?utm_source=SFMC&utm_medium=email&utm_content=MED_UN_NA_EML_UN_UN_WeekendRoadTrip&hashed_email=c8a202749fb3ee180da46bc01753dfea37cacafc792579d503edc6e326ce4e4e&dtm_em=c8a202749fb3ee180da46bc01753dfea37cacafc792579d503edc6e326ce4e4e>
hagerty.com<https://www.hagerty.com/media/maintenance-and-tech/tested-is-ai-your-next-classic-car-mechanic/?utm_source=SFMC&utm_medium=email&utm_content=MED_UN_NA_EML_UN_UN_WeekendRoadTrip&hashed_email=c8a202749fb3ee180da46bc01753dfea37cacafc792579d503edc6e326ce4e4e&dtm_em=c8a202749fb3ee180da46bc01753dfea37cacafc792579d503edc6e326ce4e4e>
[X]<https://www.hagerty.com/media/maintenance-and-tech/tested-is-ai-your-next-classic-car-mechanic/?utm_source=SFMC&utm_medium=email&utm_content=MED_UN_NA_EML_UN_UN_WeekendRoadTrip&hashed_email=c8a202749fb3ee180da46bc01753dfea37cacafc792579d503edc6e326ce4e4e&dtm_em=c8a202749fb3ee180da46bc01753dfea37cacafc792579d503edc6e326ce4e4e>


On Nov 21, 2025, at 6:42?PM, Moose <eric at megageek.com><mailto:eric at megageek.com> wrote:

Well gurus, I fixed the Honda and I'm almost embarrassed to say it.

First, I checked the intake for oil thinking that would show me if it was a pcv valve that failed.  It was clean.

HOWEVER, I didn't realize the best way to check them is to just pull them out and replace them. (It was $4.50 and $8 for the grommet.)  Actually, if you pull them out and shake them, you should hear it rattle.

Well, I replaced it. And no more oil leak!!!!!  I also borescoped the cylinders (all were near perfect) and replaced the spark plugs while I was there.  Car runs much smoother now as a result!

So, who was the winner that told me this...

AI.  That is right, I put the question to ChatGPT and that was the first thing it told me to try.  It gave me a nice list of things to try in order.

Since I figured, I was on a roll, I pushed on.  One of the problems with the car that we never had the 'radio security code' and after a battery replacement, the radio was locked.

So I found a link to a Honda site where you can recover the codes, but it required the S/N of the radio (and car VIN.)  No problem I figured.  Taking the radio out was 2 clips and 3 screws to get the dash off of it.  HOWEVER, there was a surprise hidden for 'non-Honda' mechanics that may try to do this.  The button for the hazard lights has an electrical connector attached to it.  Like all automotive connectors, it requires a magic spell, 2 incantations, and a bit of unicorn farts to disconnect it (Seriously, why can't they standardize electrical connectors?)
Anyway, when you get it apart, the spring that returns the hazard light button is held in-between the switch and the connector.  So guess where this spring shoots one you disconnect the plug.  That's right, straight into the depths of the dash board.  CRUD!

Luckily, I found a spring that worked in my 'springs and things' draw and was able to get it all back together. So the car now has a radio as well.

In the end, I'm a happy man and the SO thinks I can walk on water.  Don't worry, I'm sure I'll screw up soon enough to dispel that image.  8>)

Moose_______________________________________________

Shop-talk at autox.team.net<mailto:Shop-talk at autox.team.net>
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Suggested annual donation  $12.96
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/1789alpine at gmail.com





_______________________________________________

Shop-talk at autox.team.net<mailto:Shop-talk at autox.team.net>
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Suggested annual donation  $12.96
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/mayfield+shoptalk at sackheads.org



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From miq at bigllama.com  Thu Dec 18 20:17:36 2025
From: miq at bigllama.com (MIQ MILLMAN)
Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2025 19:17:36 -0800
Subject: [Shop-talk] New engine for a Honda? RESOLUTION
In-Reply-To: <b916774a-aebf-4cbb-a8e0-4d1b6b238468@sackheads.org>
References: <OF7439AC60.D14B173F-ON85258D48.003E33F6-85258D48.003FD243@mail.megageek.com>
 <OF0C143EA7.849A030B-ON85258D48.004138ED-85258D48.00414C24@mail.megageek.com>
 <CAG1pxga3CcDxBSo2A5Zj2KDHdFa3UaMZP6EB5kT-bRq_56-jCg@mail.gmail.com>
 <OFA3C3A210.DAEC1EF2-ON85258D49.0080D932-85258D49.00823821@mail.megageek.com>
 <6F7045E5-A8C7-4580-9682-D040354AD0D3@gmail.com>
 <b916774a-aebf-4cbb-a8e0-4d1b6b238468@sackheads.org>
Message-ID: <CAASF5jGbEvgPHK4OLGje9ApZFLw0X-B+qVwOZrTTYRCWPKHSCA@mail.gmail.com>

There are many paths up the mountain, but the view is always the same.

Ask the question at least 3 times to get a hint of the true answer is my
experience.

  --Miq

On Thu, Dec 18, 2025 at 5:21?PM Jimmie Mayfield <
mayfield+shoptalk at sackheads.org> wrote:

> ChatGPT and Gemini and Claude are useful tools.  But I've run into a
> couple situations where AI answers, Gemini's in particular, were complete
> fabrications.  Most recently, I'd asked Gemini to summarize the backstory
> for an online novel that I've been reading.  Gemini's answers were
> completely believable and, in some cases, completely false.  Descriptions
> of events that never occurred and events that did occur but involved
> different characters.  (It was fascinating how the answers wove a cohesive
> picture that wound up at the same place as the original novel but took a
> different path to get there.)
>
> Trust but verify is the name of the game.
>
>
> On 12/18/25 18:25, Jim Stone wrote:
>
> I thought I would resurrect Moose?s discussion to share a recent article
> from Haggerty on the use of AI to diagnose vehicle problems.  In a
> nutshell, their experience mirrors Moose?s and suggests we might all want
> to add ChatGTP into our toolboxes.
>
> hagerty.com
> <https://www.hagerty.com/media/maintenance-and-tech/tested-is-ai-your-next-classic-car-mechanic/?utm_source=SFMC&utm_medium=email&utm_content=MED_UN_NA_EML_UN_UN_WeekendRoadTrip&hashed_email=c8a202749fb3ee180da46bc01753dfea37cacafc792579d503edc6e326ce4e4e&dtm_em=c8a202749fb3ee180da46bc01753dfea37cacafc792579d503edc6e326ce4e4e>
>
> <https://www.hagerty.com/media/maintenance-and-tech/tested-is-ai-your-next-classic-car-mechanic/?utm_source=SFMC&utm_medium=email&utm_content=MED_UN_NA_EML_UN_UN_WeekendRoadTrip&hashed_email=c8a202749fb3ee180da46bc01753dfea37cacafc792579d503edc6e326ce4e4e&dtm_em=c8a202749fb3ee180da46bc01753dfea37cacafc792579d503edc6e326ce4e4e>
> <https://www.hagerty.com/media/maintenance-and-tech/tested-is-ai-your-next-classic-car-mechanic/?utm_source=SFMC&utm_medium=email&utm_content=MED_UN_NA_EML_UN_UN_WeekendRoadTrip&hashed_email=c8a202749fb3ee180da46bc01753dfea37cacafc792579d503edc6e326ce4e4e&dtm_em=c8a202749fb3ee180da46bc01753dfea37cacafc792579d503edc6e326ce4e4e>
>
>
> On Nov 21, 2025, at 6:42?PM, Moose <eric at megageek.com> <eric at megageek.com>
> wrote:
>
> Well gurus, I fixed the Honda and I'm almost embarrassed to say it.
>
> First, I checked the intake for oil thinking that would show me if it was
> a pcv valve that failed.  It was clean.
>
> HOWEVER, I didn't realize the best way to check them is to just pull them
> out and replace them. (It was $4.50 and $8 for the grommet.)  Actually, if
> you pull them out and shake them, you should hear it rattle.
>
> Well, I replaced it. And no more oil leak!!!!!  I also borescoped the
> cylinders (all were near perfect) and replaced the spark plugs while I was
> there.  Car runs much smoother now as a result!
>
> So, who was the winner that told me this...
>
> AI.  That is right, I put the question to ChatGPT and that was the first
> thing it told me to try.  It gave me a nice list of things to try in order.
>
> Since I figured, I was on a roll, I pushed on.  One of the problems with
> the car that we never had the 'radio security code' and after a battery
> replacement, the radio was locked.
>
> So I found a link to a Honda site where you can recover the codes, but it
> required the S/N of the radio (and car VIN.)  No problem I figured.  Taking
> the radio out was 2 clips and 3 screws to get the dash off of it.  HOWEVER,
> there was a surprise hidden for 'non-Honda' mechanics that may try to do
> this.  The button for the hazard lights has an electrical connector
> attached to it.  Like all automotive connectors, it requires a magic spell,
> 2 incantations, and a bit of unicorn farts to disconnect it (Seriously, why
> can't they standardize electrical connectors?)
> Anyway, when you get it apart, the spring that returns the hazard light
> button is held in-between the switch and the connector.  So guess where
> this spring shoots one you disconnect the plug.  That's right, straight
> into the depths of the dash board.  CRUD!
>
> Luckily, I found a spring that worked in my 'springs and things' draw and
> was able to get it all back together. So the car now has a radio as well.
>
> In the end, I'm a happy man and the SO thinks I can walk on water.  Don't
> worry, I'm sure I'll screw up soon enough to dispel that image.  8>)
>
> Moose_______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/1789alpine at gmail.com
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/mayfield+shoptalk at sackheads.org
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/miq at bigllama.com
>
>
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From jblair1948 at cox.net  Thu Dec 18 22:03:18 2025
From: jblair1948 at cox.net (John T Blair)
Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2025 05:03:18 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [Shop-talk] New engine for a Honda? RESOLUTION
In-Reply-To: <BN9PR12MB5114B4A68F038DC6D7EC2961D8A9A@BN9PR12MB5114.namprd12.prod.outlook.com>
References: <OF7439AC60.D14B173F-ON85258D48.003E33F6-85258D48.003FD243@mail.megageek.com>
 <OF0C143EA7.849A030B-ON85258D48.004138ED-85258D48.00414C24@mail.megageek.com>
 <CAG1pxga3CcDxBSo2A5Zj2KDHdFa3UaMZP6EB5kT-bRq_56-jCg@mail.gmail.com>
 <OFA3C3A210.DAEC1EF2-ON85258D49.0080D932-85258D49.00823821@mail.megageek.com>
 <6F7045E5-A8C7-4580-9682-D040354AD0D3@gmail.com>
 <b916774a-aebf-4cbb-a8e0-4d1b6b238468@sackheads.org>
 <BN9PR12MB5114B4A68F038DC6D7EC2961D8A9A@BN9PR12MB5114.namprd12.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <1473894561.1333145.1766120598453@mail.yahoo.com>

   On Thursday, December 18, 2025 at 09:34:23 PM EST, Old Dirtbeard <dirtbeard at live.com> wrote:  
 >I have been using MS Copilot, it is bundled with Edge for free and can be?>quite helpful in the initial exploration phase. It can help you to ask the right?>questions.....
So with all this AI don't forget about AllData for the DIYers.? You can get a 1 mo. subscription for $20.? So if you're stumped try that.? I keep meaning to as I used one of the commercial on-line diagnostic similar to the "Pro" version of AllData when I was talking auto classes at the local community college.??
I haven't been stumped yet.? My son had a problem with his 2011 F150, no instrument lights and no start.? We spent about 5 hr. working on it and searching the internet? to no avail. Then he found a youtube video about the problem.? Turns out a loose connector in the passenger side front kick panel.? Pulled the panel and sure enough.? Plugged the plug back in and off it went.
These computers and all the support site are our best friends!!!!

JohnT

John T. Blair? WA4OHZ???? email:? jblair1948 at cox.netVa. Beach, Va????????????????? Phone:? (757) 495-8229

48 TR1800??? 48 #4 Midget??? 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106)
???? 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887)??? 77 Spitfire??? 71 Saab Sonett III
?????????????????????? 65 Rambler Classic

Morgan:??? http://autox.team.net/morgan/

Bricklin:?????http://www.bricklin.org
If you can read this????????? ? ? ?? ? - Thank a teacher!If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!!

>From Dennis Prager - The American Trilogy:
???? e pluribus Unum, "from many, one."
???? In God We Trust
???? Liberty - the? power? of? choosing,? thinking,? and? acting? for? 
????????????????? oneself; freedom? from? control? or? restriction? 






  
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From eric at megageek.com  Fri Dec 19 02:58:09 2025
From: eric at megageek.com (eric at megageek.com)
Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2025 04:58:09 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] New engine for a Honda? RESOLUTION
In-Reply-To: <1473894561.1333145.1766120598453@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <OF7439AC60.D14B173F-ON85258D48.003E33F6-85258D48.003FD243@mail.megageek.com>
 <OF0C143EA7.849A030B-ON85258D48.004138ED-85258D48.00414C24@mail.megageek.com>
 <CAG1pxga3CcDxBSo2A5Zj2KDHdFa3UaMZP6EB5kT-bRq_56-jCg@mail.gmail.com>
 <OFA3C3A210.DAEC1EF2-ON85258D49.0080D932-85258D49.00823821@mail.megageek.com>
 <6F7045E5-A8C7-4580-9682-D040354AD0D3@gmail.com>
 <b916774a-aebf-4cbb-a8e0-4d1b6b238468@sackheads.org>
 <BN9PR12MB5114B4A68F038DC6D7EC2961D8A9A@BN9PR12MB5114.namprd12.prod.outlook.com>
 <1473894561.1333145.1766120598453@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <OF42C908D3.385329FD-ON85258D65.0035C00C-85258D65.0036C2CD@mail.megageek.com>

John, 

Years ago I used AllData, if I remember correctly, it was mostly just the 
pdfs of the manuals, but not that great.  I remember one time I was 
looking for a sensor on a Mercedes 190D, and the image was just of the 
sensor, but it was an 'illustration' and impossible to figure out where it 
was on the car.

Also, isn't it make specific, or do you get access to all makes/models?

I'm not trying to bad mouth it, but I don't remember it being worth the 
price.  Maybe it's changed.  I'll love to hear more about what you think 
of it, has it gotten better?

But right now, with youtube and AI, I've been getting great results. (but 
I'm always willing to buy another tool!) 8>)

FWIW on the AI side.  The Army released it's own AI and I was totally blow 
away by it.  I had a white paper to write (about 3 pages, in a very 
specific format.)  I just put in the data for each portion of the white 
paper, in normal speaking voice, and in less than 30 seconds, I had a VERY 
professional, perfectly formatted white paper.  It even included some 
additional technical data to expand on what I fed it (and yes, I checked 
it and it was correct.)  I was really impressed.

However, I totally agree that AI needs to be verified and doubled checked. 
 As an instructor in the Army, we have student's try to pass off papers 
that were AI generated and it is very clear what is AI.
I find it's best use is to have it do formatting, and the 'boiler plate' 
work.  The 'substance' needs to come from the person.

Often I need to write a letter or memo, and i just tell it what i need the 
document to say and it formats it perfectly and does all the 'heavy 
lifting' and i just go back and fix/add any details.

Have a great day!
Moose



From:   John T Blair <jblair1948 at cox.net>
To:     "shop-talk at autox.team.net" <shop-talk at autox.team.net>
Date:   12/19/2025 00:08
Subject:        Re: [Shop-talk] New engine for a Honda? RESOLUTION
Sent by:        "Shop-talk" <shop-talk-bounces at autox.team.net>



On Thursday, December 18, 2025 at 09:34:23 PM EST, Old Dirtbeard 
<dirtbeard at live.com> wrote: 

>I have been using MS Copilot, it is bundled with Edge for free and can be 

>quite helpful in the initial exploration phase. It can help you to ask 
the right 
>questions.....

So with all this AI don't forget about AllData for the DIYers.  You can 
get a 1 mo. subscription for $20.  So if you're stumped try that.  I keep 
meaning to as I used one of the commercial on-line diagnostic similar to 
the "Pro" version of AllData when I was talking auto classes at the local 
community college. 

I haven't been stumped yet.  My son had a problem with his 2011 F150, no 
instrument lights and no start.  We spent about 5 hr. working on it and 
searching the internet  to no avail. Then he found a youtube video about 
the problem.  Turns out a loose connector in the passenger side front kick 
panel.  Pulled the panel and sure enough.  Plugged the plug back in and 
off it went.

These computers and all the support site are our best friends!!!!

JohnT

John T. Blair  WA4OHZ     email:  jblair1948 at cox.net
Va. Beach, Va                  Phone:  (757) 495-8229

48 TR1800    48 #4 Midget    65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106)
     75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887)    77 Spitfire    71 Saab Sonett III
                       65 Rambler Classic

Morgan:    http://autox.team.net/morgan/

Bricklin:     http://www.bricklin.org

If you can read this                   - Thank a teacher!
If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!!

>From Dennis Prager - The American Trilogy:
     e pluribus Unum, "from many, one."
     In God We Trust
     Liberty - the  power  of  choosing,  thinking,  and  acting  for 
                  oneself; freedom  from  control  or  restriction 





_______________________________________________

Shop-talk at autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Suggested annual donation  $12.96
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk 
http://autox.team.net/archive

Unsubscribe/Manage: 
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/eric at megageek.com




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From jblair1948 at cox.net  Fri Dec 19 17:12:55 2025
From: jblair1948 at cox.net (John T Blair)
Date: Sat, 20 Dec 2025 00:12:55 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [Shop-talk] New engine for a Honda? RESOLUTION
In-Reply-To: <OF42C908D3.385329FD-ON85258D65.0035C00C-85258D65.0036C2CD@mail.megageek.com>
References: <OF7439AC60.D14B173F-ON85258D48.003E33F6-85258D48.003FD243@mail.megageek.com>
 <OF0C143EA7.849A030B-ON85258D48.004138ED-85258D48.00414C24@mail.megageek.com>
 <CAG1pxga3CcDxBSo2A5Zj2KDHdFa3UaMZP6EB5kT-bRq_56-jCg@mail.gmail.com>
 <OFA3C3A210.DAEC1EF2-ON85258D49.0080D932-85258D49.00823821@mail.megageek.com>
 <6F7045E5-A8C7-4580-9682-D040354AD0D3@gmail.com>
 <b916774a-aebf-4cbb-a8e0-4d1b6b238468@sackheads.org>
 <BN9PR12MB5114B4A68F038DC6D7EC2961D8A9A@BN9PR12MB5114.namprd12.prod.outlook.com>
 <1473894561.1333145.1766120598453@mail.yahoo.com>
 <OF42C908D3.385329FD-ON85258D65.0035C00C-85258D65.0036C2CD@mail.megageek.com>
Message-ID: <1289884143.1502233.1766189575924@mail.yahoo.com>

   On Friday, December 19, 2025 at 04:58:10 AM EST, eric at megageek.com <eric at megageek.com> wrote:  
 >Years ago I usedAllData, if I remember correctly, it was mostly just the pdfs of the?>manuals,but not that great. ?I remember one time I was looking for a sensoron a?>Mercedes 190D, and the image was just of the sensor, but it was an'illustration' and?>impossible to figure out where it was on the car. 

Interesting.? I don't remember the name of the system we were using at the school as that was back in 2007.? But it was very good.? I have several friends that are professional mechanics and they have talked about using alldata and similar systems and appear to be very happy with the results.
>Also, isn't itmake specific, or do you get access to all makes/models?
I believe that may still be true.? Like how many of use hobbyist have Lambo's we need to work on. 

>I'm not tryingto bad mouth it, but I don't remember it being worth the price. ?Maybeit's?>changed. ?I'll love to hear more about what you think of it,has it gotten better? 

In the past I'm pretty sure that's why I never used it.? But reciently I've come across several problems on these newer cars that I definitely could use some help on and I looked into Alldata.? I think they may have changed their DIY usages.? I thought there was one option for a specific car and one for maybe 2 or 3 cars.? But last time I looked it seemed to be time duration, like 1 mo.? But for a problem problem, $20 for a mo isn't bad, especially if it helps you find the problem.? 

>But right now,with youtube and AI, I've been getting great results. (but I'm always willingto?>buy another tool!) 8>) 

I definitely agree.? I was just trying to say there is an additional tool available that may be worth looking to.? Our cell phones and AI sure have helped the DIYer.? I can't believe that we ever got along with out these tools.
>FWIW on the AIside. ?The Army released it's own AI and I was totally blow away byit. ?I?>had a white paper to write (about 3 pages, in a very specificformat.) ?I just put in the data?>for each portion of the white paper,in normal speaking voice, and in less than 30 seconds,?>I had a VERY professional,perfectly formatted white paper. ?It even included some?>additionaltechnical data to expand on what I fed it (and yes, I checked it and itwas?>correct.) ?I was really impressed. 

I keep hearing stories like this.? I haven't had the need for anything like that now that I'm retired.? But I have taken some long items I've written and asked AI to help clean them up and maybe shorten them.? What I got back wasn't what I was looking for.? I guess I just didn't give it the right guidance.? I need more practice.
>However, I totallyagree that AI needs to be verified and doubled checked. ?As an instructor?>in the Army, we have student's try to pass off papers that were AI generatedand it is very?>clear what is AI.? I find it's bestuse is to have it do formatting, and the 'boiler plate' work.?>The'substance' needs to come from the person. 

True.? I will use MS Doc's to go over something I've written to check my grammar and spelling.? It does a great job at that, a lot better than just a spelling checker.? It will catch things like there and their that a spelling checker won't.? But spelling checkers sure were a great improvement of nothing! ? Me being dyslexic my spelling leaves a lot to be desired.
>Have a great day! 

Thanks, you also!!!
JohnT


 

|  | Virus-free. www.avast.com  |

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From tjcora at icloud.com  Mon Dec 22 09:42:46 2025
From: tjcora at icloud.com (Thomas Coradeschi)
Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2025 11:42:46 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] New engine for a Honda? RESOLUTION
In-Reply-To: <OF42C908D3.385329FD-ON85258D65.0035C00C-85258D65.0036C2CD@mail.megageek.com>
References: <OF7439AC60.D14B173F-ON85258D48.003E33F6-85258D48.003FD243@mail.megageek.com>
 <OF0C143EA7.849A030B-ON85258D48.004138ED-85258D48.00414C24@mail.megageek.com>
 <CAG1pxga3CcDxBSo2A5Zj2KDHdFa3UaMZP6EB5kT-bRq_56-jCg@mail.gmail.com>
 <OFA3C3A210.DAEC1EF2-ON85258D49.0080D932-85258D49.00823821@mail.megageek.com>
 <6F7045E5-A8C7-4580-9682-D040354AD0D3@gmail.com>
 <b916774a-aebf-4cbb-a8e0-4d1b6b238468@sackheads.org>
 <BN9PR12MB5114B4A68F038DC6D7EC2961D8A9A@BN9PR12MB5114.namprd12.prod.outlook.com>
 <1473894561.1333145.1766120598453@mail.yahoo.com>
 <OF42C908D3.385329FD-ON85258D65.0035C00C-85258D65.0036C2CD@mail.megageek.com>
Message-ID: <E5346EAE-6BE6-4F51-9836-B4184F08614B@icloud.com>

I used alldata for a number of years - subscriptions for individual vehicles were required, unless you wanted to pay pro pricing.

I?ve since discovered that Haynes has manuals for both the vehicles in question (honest to goodness printed manuals), so no more alldata for me.

I found their website to be mediocre and some of their info flat out inaccurate. When I pinged them about that their response was ?we dunno, we just use what the OEM gave us?. Meh.

?
Tom Coradeschi
tjcora at icloud.com


> On Dec 19, 2025, at 4:58?AM, eric at megageek.com wrote:
> 
> John, 
> 
> Years ago I used AllData, if I remember correctly, it was mostly just the pdfs of the manuals, but not that great.  I remember one time I was looking for a sensor on a Mercedes 190D, and the image was just of the sensor, but it was an 'illustration' and impossible to figure out where it was on the car. 
> 
> Also, isn't it make specific, or do you get access to all makes/models? 
> 
> I'm not trying to bad mouth it, but I don't remember it being worth the price.  Maybe it's changed.  I'll love to hear more about what you think of it, has it gotten better? 
> 
> But right now, with youtube and AI, I've been getting great results. (but I'm always willing to buy another tool!) 8>) 
> 
> FWIW on the AI side.  The Army released it's own AI and I was totally blow away by it.  I had a white paper to write (about 3 pages, in a very specific format.)  I just put in the data for each portion of the white paper, in normal speaking voice, and in less than 30 seconds, I had a VERY professional, perfectly formatted white paper.  It even included some additional technical data to expand on what I fed it (and yes, I checked it and it was correct.)  I was really impressed. 
> 
> However, I totally agree that AI needs to be verified and doubled checked.  As an instructor in the Army, we have student's try to pass off papers that were AI generated and it is very clear what is AI. 
> I find it's best use is to have it do formatting, and the 'boiler plate' work.  The 'substance' needs to come from the person. 
> 
> Often I need to write a letter or memo, and i just tell it what i need the document to say and it formats it perfectly and does all the 'heavy lifting' and i just go back and fix/add any details. 
> 
> Have a great day! 
> Moose 
> 
> 
> 
> From:        John T Blair <jblair1948 at cox.net> 
> To:        "shop-talk at autox.team.net" <shop-talk at autox.team.net> 
> Date:        12/19/2025 00:08 
> Subject:        Re: [Shop-talk] New engine for a Honda? RESOLUTION 
> Sent by:        "Shop-talk" <shop-talk-bounces at autox.team.net> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Thursday, December 18, 2025 at 09:34:23 PM EST, Old Dirtbeard <dirtbeard at live.com> wrote: 
> 
> >I have been using MS Copilot, it is bundled with Edge for free and can be 
> >quite helpful in the initial exploration phase. It can help you to ask the right 
> >questions..... 
> 
> So with all this AI don't forget about AllData for the DIYers.  You can get a 1 mo. subscription for $20.  So if you're stumped try that.  I keep meaning to as I used one of the commercial on-line diagnostic similar to the "Pro" version of AllData when I was talking auto classes at the local community college.   
> 
> I haven't been stumped yet.  My son had a problem with his 2011 F150, no instrument lights and no start.  We spent about 5 hr. working on it and searching the internet  to no avail. Then he found a youtube video about the problem.  Turns out a loose connector in the passenger side front kick panel.  Pulled the panel and sure enough.  Plugged the plug back in and off it went. 
> 
> These computers and all the support site are our best friends!!!! 
> 
> JohnT 
> 
> John T. Blair  WA4OHZ     email:  jblair1948 at cox.net 
> Va. Beach, Va                  Phone:  (757) 495-8229
> 
> 48 TR1800    48 #4 Midget    65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106)
>     75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887)    77 Spitfire    71 Saab Sonett III
>                       65 Rambler Classic
> 
> Morgan:    http://autox.team.net/morgan/
> 
> Bricklin:     http://www.bricklin.org 
> 
> If you can read this                   - Thank a teacher! 
> If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!!
> 
> From Dennis Prager - The American Trilogy:
>     e pluribus Unum, "from many, one."
>     In God We Trust
>     Liberty - the  power  of  choosing,  thinking,  and  acting  for  
>                  oneself; freedom  from  control  or  restriction  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> 
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
> 
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/eric at megageek.com
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> 
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
> 
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/tjcora at icloud.com
>