[Shotimes] Which MAF is best?

Mon, 25 Nov 2002 19:06:08 -0600 (Central Standard Time)

I believe that is the original LPM on Prine's car, from what he told me.
When he swapped to the larger turbo and downpipe, he simply added an FMU (a
band-aid IMO) to the old LPM and got 360 fwhp.  As far as going through an
engine, he was planning a 3.2 upgrade, and that is what he did, not because
he blew the old one.  In fact, I think the 3.2 SS upgrade was done to the
original engine, although I could be mistaken.  All in all, he has the
quickest most reliable blown SHO out there, with three years and many miles
on the setup.  Granted,  I am sure he has spent some time on the dyno, but
with 360hp and 345tq, I would expect nothing else.  That said, I feel there
is much hidden hp waiting to be discovered by an Apexi or similar unit, but
the LPM has done great so far.

Toolman

-------Original Message-------

From: ianf@eden.rutgers.edu
Date: Monday, November 25, 2002 3:42:55 PM
To: Timothy Tyner
Cc: Shotimes@autox.team.net
Subject: RE: [Shotimes] Which MAF is best?

I am not sure which turbo SHO that you are referring to. There is one
that is well known (Jeremy Prine's) and then there are a few other
project cars out there as well. If I recall correctly, Jeremy has been
trough a lot of LPM reburns, dyno time and at least one engine. Quarter
mile times have nothing to do with safe A/F mixtures, reliabilty via
tuning and other factors such as drivability, etc. I believe this all
started because I stated that there might be a connection between poor
LPM tuning and spun rod bearings due to detonation. I still maintain my
views that LPM programming is too much of a crap shoot for the average
SHO owner who is looking for a plug and play answer to unleash hidden
horsepower.

Ian

> When turbo'd SHO's are running 13.1's with only an LPM for tuning (for
> years), and when my NA 95 runs 14.5's with only an LPM for tuning
(for three
> years and 50k miles, first and only burn), I can not see the need for
the
> Apexi (which is much more than $300 last I checked). Not saying one
is not
> in my future, just that the LPM can do wonders if the guy knows what
he is
> doing. I am surely not going to remove an LPM to replace it with an
Apexi,
> but if I was starting from ground up, I would consider one.
>
> Toolman
>
> -------Original Message-------
>
> From: Bill Murray
> Date: Sunday, November 24, 2002 11:06:53 PM
> To: SHOTimes
> Subject: RE: [Shotimes] Which MAF is best?
>
> If you're willing to spend more than $200 on mods, why not be willing
to
> spend more than $200 for a mod that will make your other mods work
> better and make your engine live longer? Seems silly to not want to
> spend $300 of the Apex'i to make your $1000's of mods work better and
> live longer.
>
> Bill
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: shotimes-admin@autox.team.net
> [mailto:shotimes-admin@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Timothy Tyner
> Sent: Thursday, November 21, 2002 8:10 PM
> To: shotimes@autox.team.net
> Subject: RE: [Shotimes] Which MAF is best?
>
> If a mixture is so bad the car detonates then something is wrong with
> the
> calibration of the LPM for sure. I can not imagine getting a program
> that
> was so far out of whack it caused the car to detonate. Wow! When the
> Apexi
> gets down to $200 let me know. Also, if you can boost a car with no
> changes
> to the computer, sign me up.
>
> Toolman
>
> -------Original Message-------
>
> From: Ian Fisher
> Date: Thursday, November 21, 2002 6:57:08 PM
> To: 'Timothy Tyner'; shotimes@autox.team.net
> Subject: RE: [Shotimes] Which MAF is best?
>
> If the mixture is so bad that the motor detonates, this will create
> severe punishment on the rods and the rod bearings. Just cause you
> haven't heard it doesn't mean that it hasn't been discussed before. :P
>
> If a car has serious mods, it will need some tuning. An LPM will be
most
> effective with dyno time, but I find that there are other tools out
> there that will be more effective if one is going to be tuning on a
dyno
> anyway. (ie Apex'i S'AFC etc)
>
> I know of a SHO that runs 12.9's with no EPROM. You can build a car
> around the LPM or you can build it and utilize the most from the Ford
> programming. Personally, I prefer the Ford programming.
>
> Ian
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: shotimes-admin@autox.team.net
> [mailto:shotimes-admin@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Timothy Tyner
> Sent: Thursday, November 21, 2002 7:30 PM
> To: shotimes@autox.team.net
> Subject: RE: [Shotimes] Which MAF is best?
>
>
> Rod bearing failures caused by LPM's? That is a first for my ears.
> Elaborate please. As far as gettings serious HP out of an SHO, the LPM
> is the way to go. I know of a certain boosted car that runs 13.1's at
> 113 with a little LPM.
>
>
> Toolman
>
> -------Original Message-------
>
> From: Ian Fisher
> Date: Thursday, November 21, 2002 2:36:59 PM
> To: 'Ron Childs'; shotimes@autox.team.net
> Subject: RE: [Shotimes] Which MAF is best?
>
> What constitutes "better drivability" though? Personally, I don't
think
> that the SHO suffers from any drivability issues that require the aid
of
> an LPM.
>
> My car was running way rich with the LPM. Others have also theorized
> that the rod bearing failures may be attributed to poor A/F tuning via
> LPM. It's too iffy for such negligible gains/losses; I was not
satisfied
> with my LPM and I'm glad that I got rid of it.
>
> Ian
> 93 mtx getting better every day
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: shotimes-admin@autox.team.net
> [mailto:shotimes-admin@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Ron Childs
> Sent: Thursday, November 21, 2002 3:18 PM
> To: shotimes@autox.team.net
> Subject: Re: [Shotimes] Which MAF is best?
>
>
> I thought that there are changes to the fuel mixture as well at part
> throttle. Ted has always claimed better "drivability," not just HP
gains
>
> because of remapping fuel curves (I thought, but could be wrong.)
>
> -Ron Childs
>
>
>
> >From: "Dave Kegel" <d.kegel@attbi.com>
> >
> >The part throttle timing advance is iffy (often results in pinging)
> >there is
> >arguably no reason to change the opening point of the secondaries,
nor
> do I
> >think the idle speed needs to be bumped, even with UDPs. That leaves
> >turning on the cooling fan(s) a bit sooner than stock, big deal.
> >
> >Obviously if you have some wild cams or a blower, that's a different
> >story. As always, this is my opinion only, YMMV.
>
>
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