[Shotimes] RE: supercharging

Mon, 10 Feb 2003 08:39:47 -0500

I'll chime in on this thread now...  The SHO is an awesome engine.  I don't
like the Taurus body.  It is really a piece of crap.  Now, it's a better
piece of crap than what the rest of Detroit was selling at the time.  When I
get behind the wheel of my Taurus, drive for a bit, get out, then get into
my wife's BMW (an 89 325i auto), it's a night and day difference.  The BMW
is more solid, and handles LEAGUES better than the SHO could ever hope to
imagine, and this is on skinny 195/60-14's.  Now granted, the SHO is about
500 lbs. heavier, so the BMW should handle a little better because of the
weight difference.  Factoring in my 90 M3 (rest in piece :-(, I don't see
any SHO handling near as good as that car.  Both cars given the same
attention, I feel the M3 would still obliterate the SHO.

Now, considering price...  Both cars cost roughly the same, so the roughly
the same quality should be assumed, but sadly not.  The BMW has MUCH better
quality AND craftsmanship than the Taurus could ever think of having.  And
resale...  The 325i has resale a little over twice the value of a similar
SHO, used car retail, private sale, or trade in.  You want to talk more
about resale value?  I paid $14k for my M3, got $17k out of it when I was
rear ended by a big pickup truck (only the trunk was smashed in from that,
no intrusion into the back seat area), I was stopped, he was doing about
50-60, pushed me into the car in front of me, also smashing up the front.
Beat to heck E30 (87-90) M3's still fetch around $7-8k.

As Ron P. said, compare Dinan to SHOshop, the prices will be about the same.
Sure, you may have paid more in the beginning to get the BMW, but you DO get
what you pay for, either Ponderosa (SHO), or Ruth's Cris (BMW).  I'll take a
535i + Dinan and my Ruth's Cris medium rare :-)

But, like the SHO, one can find discounted parts prices for BMW's as well.
I'm finding places that offer BMW parts well discounted from retail (so I
paid a little over $200 for a BMW fuel pump, but it took LESS than 15
minutes to install, try THAT on a SHO!).  I'm sure, with enough looking and
researching, one could find performance parts at the same prices as
discounted SHO performance goodies.  Plus, with the BMW, there is more than
ONE major tuner for performance, and performance products.

Now, you may be thinking...  Why in the heck do I still have a SHO?!?!?  I
haven't found the right car to put my SHO engine into (ideally, it would be
a Locost 7).  The SHO is an awesome engine, in a crappy chassis :-(  If I
ever build a Locost, and put my SHO engine into it, I'll probably sell the
SHO (I have a spare SHO engine), and buy either another BMW or a Porsche (89
944 Turbo, wish I could afford ANY 911 Turbo right now).  The SHO engine is
one of the MOST beautiful engines EVER made.  It is a work of art!

Ron N. - Dalton, GA
90 SHO
89 325i
"It takes a man to suffer ignorance and smile"

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ron Porter" <ronporter@prodigy.net>
To: <shotimes@autox.team.net>
Sent: Sunday, February 09, 2003 9:02 PM
Subject: RE: RE: RE: RE: [Shotimes] RE: supercharging

> Who puts a turbo on a BMW? Sorry, I'm not a turbo fan. Yeah, I would buy a
> factory turbo 911, but that's about it. Turbos on BMWs are quite rare. I
am
> familiar with mods for 911s, and for BMWs through what good friends of
mine
> do, and I won't get into that discussion here. Besides, older M3s are low
> 14-second cars, new ones are high 13s STOCK....you start from a different
> base.
>
> Dinan is a top-end aftermarket tuner. Take a SHO to Vadim, hand him the
> keys, and have him do a complete turnkey blower car.....THEN compare the
> price to Dinan.
>
> Sorry, BMWs have held resale very well wrt to used-car market. Look at the
> percentages, not absolute $$$. Even so, an '89 535i that listed for 2x the
> cost of an '89 SHO is now worth 5x the price of a used '89 SHO, and if it
> was cared for, it's tighter than the SHO ever was when new.
>
> As has been said here before.......don't confuse "best for the money" with
> "the best". A Ponderosa steak at $5.99 may be the "best for the money"
> compared to a Ruth's Cris or Morton's steak for $25-30, but it ain't "the
> best". SHOs have been BMW wannabes since the day the first SHO rolled off
> the line.
>
> Ron Porter
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: shotimes-admin@autox.team.net
> [mailto:shotimes-admin@autox.team.net]On Behalf Of Timothy Tyner
> Sent: Sunday, February 09, 2003 5:53 PM
> To: shotimes@autox.team.net
> Subject: Fw: RE: RE: RE: [Shotimes] RE: supercharging
>
>
> That is what I mean.  Turbo kits for BMW's are not cheap.  Even a Dinan SC
> is crazy expensive.  If you think it is cheaper to modify an M3 than a
SHO,
> I have some SHO mods to sell you.  Also, unless it is an M, the resale
value
> on BMW's sucks.
>
> Toolman
>
>
> -------Original Message-------
>
> From: Ron Porter
> Date: Sunday, February 09, 2003 1:51:30 PM
> To: Timothy Tyner; shotimes@autox.team.net
> Subject: RE: RE: RE: [Shotimes] RE: supercharging
>
> No, why would I? There aren't any BMW turbos from the factory. Only one I
> can recall is a model for Europe-only back in the '80s.
>
> FWIW, I can maintain my 911 for less than a SHO. As I move into BMWs, I
have
> a few friends who are long-time BMW owners, and I can bet their
maintenance
> & performance upgrades are less costly than anything for a SHO.
>
> Plus, their cars (as well as my 911) have something that is very foreign
to
> SHO owners.......it's called "resale value".
>
> Ron Porter
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: shotimes-admin@autox.team.net
> [mailto:shotimes-admin@autox.team.net]On Behalf Of Timothy Tyner
> Sent: Sunday, February 09, 2003 2:38 PM
> To: shotimes@autox.team.net
> Subject: Fw: RE: RE: [Shotimes] RE: supercharging
>
>
> Have you priced a turbo for a BMW lately?
>
> Toolman
>
> -------Original Message-------
>
> From: Ron Porter
> Date: Sunday, February 09, 2003 1:28:38 PM
> To: Timothy Tyner; shotimes@autox.team.net
> Subject: RE: RE: [Shotimes] RE: supercharging
>
> Yes, but.....
>
> Other cars have cheaper performance mods, which also can have decent
resale
> if you pull them off.
>
> Other cars can get more bang for the buck in performance mods.
>
> Ron Porter
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: shotimes-admin@autox.team.net
> [mailto:shotimes-admin@autox.team.net]On Behalf Of Timothy Tyner
> Sent: Sunday, February 09, 2003 1:44 PM
> To: shotimes@autox.team.net
> Subject: Fw: RE: [Shotimes] RE: supercharging
>
>
> That is true of any car.
> -------Original Message-------
>
> From: Ian Fisher
> Date: Saturday, February 08, 2003 7:51:47 PM
> To: 'Michael Humbert'; 1badsho@mail.tnh.net
> Cc: shotimes@autox.team.net
> Subject: RE: [Shotimes] RE: supercharging
>
> but you'll
> never get the money that you put into it back.
>
> Ian
> More mods and maintenance than you can shake a stick at and still worth
> nothing.
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: shotimes-admin@autox.team.net
> [mailto:shotimes-admin@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Michael Humbert
> Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2003 8:36 PM
> To: 1badsho@mail.tnh.net
> Cc: shotimes@autox.team.net
> Subject: [Shotimes] RE: supercharging
>
>
> Upon consideration of all the advice given, I've determined that I may
> be acting a bit naovely. I'm thinking that I should add a Quaife, a
> better exhaust system, a larger MAF, and a higher performance clutch.
> Then, after all of that has been completed, I will begin planning out
> the installation of a supercharger, assuming I still have some money and
> the desire to mess with my car anymore. Thanks for knocking some sense
> into me!
>
> Mike Humbert
> 90 titanium w/159K
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Donelson Don [mailto:1badsho@mail.tnh.net]
> Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2003 9:15 AM
> To: humbem@rpi.edu
> Cc: shotimes@mail.tnh.net
> Subject: supercharging
>
> With what I know about Supercharged SHO's I dont recommend them unless
> your A) totally proficent on working on your car B) the installer is in
> your home town.
>
> A super charged show is a hoot to drive. My car was probably on the
> light end of HP as S/C SHO's go. I estimate I was about 360 HP +/-.
>
> When you mod a car to the point of S/C you will potentially face
> problems from a variety of areas. Blown clutchs, possibly blown motors
> ........ bad running motor , turned half shafts ..etc.etc.
>
> This is a very expensive propostion. I most certainly would not have the
> car as your daily driver.
>
> Bottom line ; yes they are a blast to have ... but unless your very
> proficent and plan to use this as your second car I would advise against
> it.
>
> dond
> 91 Super SHO
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