[Shotimes] (OT) Michelin Pilot Sport Cups gone greasy

[Ron Porter]

That question was asked, and no one had an answer. I would suspect any
activity that gets them warm like a 10-mile drive, one 15-minute track
session, etc.

I haven't looked it up on ire Rack's site for awhile, but the heat-cycle is
really a pretty low temp in their oven.

Ron Porter

-----Original Message-----
From: Tom Smith [mailto:tjsmith@monmouth.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, May 10, 2005 4:31 PM
To: Ron Porter
Cc: Shotimes; SHO Tech
Subject: Re: [Shotimes] (OT) Michelin Pilot Sport Cups gone greasy


I wonder if a heat cycle to him is a 20-30 minute run session?
I am lucky to get 4-6 days (16-24 heat cycles?) with many tire rotations
out of Kumho VictoRacers. I heat cycle them a few times before heading
to the first track event. They stick like glue till they cord.

Watkins and Atlanta are easier on the tires (to a point), Lime Rock and
Summit are on the shorter end of tire life. Depends are how many
Porsches, BMW, Audis and Corvettes your are trying to pass ;)


Full weight car and extra weight driver ;)


Tom 91+ (heading to Watkins this weekend with the BMW club)


On Tue, 10 May 2005, Ron Porter wrote:

> FYI, for the track folks mostly....
>
> Rick asked a question about the Michelin Pilot Sport Cup (MPSC) tires,
then
> after a long thread, he called Michelin and got the answer in the lower
> post.
>
> Ron Porter
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Richard Betterley [mailto:rbetterley@betterley.com] On Behalf Of
> rick_betterley@rennlist.net
> Sent: Thursday, May 05, 2005 1:28 PM
> To: 911/993/996
> Subject: Michelin Pilot Sport Cups gone greasy
>
> Looking for experience with MPSCs (used for DE events on my '84 Carrera).
> I have put 45 heat cycles (about 12 months) on my MPSCs; my first time
using
> them.  Not knocked out by their grip (previous tires were Hosier SO3s,
> before they had the 04 problems), but acceptable if I get a lot of wear
out
> of them.
> They were fine until about 35 cycles or so, but really went greasy right
> away at New Hampshire this week (previous event at Lime Rock, they were
> fine).  Pressures were same as at Lime Rock, both cold (25/26) and hot
> (32-33).  Lime Rock was sunnier and somewhat warmer, but I don't think the
> lack of a sunny day makes enough difference for what I was experiencing;
> lots more sliding around, although not terminal by any stretch (kind of
fun,
> actually).
> Tread still is good (such as it is for a DE tire), worn on outside half,
> much less wear on inside.
> Camber settings are maxed out as far as can be with factory suspension
bits.
> So, what are others experiencing in terms of heat cycles?  I hear reports
of
> 50-60, so I am getting there, but wonder if I can expect 60, or is my '35
> then you start sliding' experience typical.
> Thanks; still wondering whether I go back to the Hoosiers.  How are they
> wearing?
>
> Rick Betterley
>
> Had a very fruitful exchange of info with Michelin re my Sport Cups going
> greasy after 35 heat cycles.
> Here is what I have learned:
> 1) Michelin is very responsive to requests for info and advice; good
follow
> up and knowledge
> 2) More than 35 heat cycles is expected; they didn't give me number I
could
> expect, but it sounds like it should be well in excess of 35 They asked me
> to run the existing tires at next event (Monday next at Watkins Glen with
> Todd and Tracquest) and then call them to discuss results, since going
> greasy after 35 cycles was apparently unusual.
> 3) Negative camber 1.3-3.0 is ideal (pretty wide range)
> 4) Cold hot pressures should be 25/26 or so, hot 32-33, which I have been
> using (at least on a 1984 911)
> 5) Tire temps should be 160-220 hot; I need to borrow a pyrometer to test
> this.
> 6) Flipping tires is not recommended, due to their asymmetricallity.
> Hope this helps anyone else using these tires.
>
> Rick Betterley
> Rennlist and PCA Northeast Region member
> 1984 Carrera Coupe for the track (Guards Red #86)
> 1986 Carrera Cabriolet for the street (also Guards Red) 2000 F350 Diesel
> crew cab duallie (tow vehicle) and 2003 CargoPro enclosed trailer
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