[TR] Lead Substitute

[Reihing, Randall S.]

I think Dave may have a point. I have not had any problems in older vehicles, or with my TR3A, using 89 octane without a lead substitute, or additive. But, I do not drive that TR3A 15,000 miles per year, the national average for daily drivers. Someone who does and whose 60's era vehicle, or even older, that still has original valve train metallurgy may not have the same outcome.

In my airplane I use 100LL fuel or ethanol free auto fuel. That lack of lead in auto fuel is/was a serious concern for all pilots operating aircraft with older engines that had FAA permission to use ethanol free auto fuel but whose engines did not have the newer hardened valve seats, and other components that eliminated the need for lead.

After I had the engine rebuilt to zero time, in part using Superior Air Parts Millennium cylinder assemblies with hardened valve seats, valves, valve stems and updated valve guides, that eliminated any and all lead issues, including any concerns regarding excess lead deposits.

Can something like this be done with a TR3 head, or is it prohibitively expensive?

Sincerely,
Randall Reihing
1959 TR3A


From: Triumphs [triumphs-bounces at autox.team.net] on behalf of David P [frogeye at porterscustom.com]
Sent: Monday, October 01, 2018 2:05 PM
To: triumphs at autox.team.net
Subject: Re: [TR] Lead Substitute


Guess I'll add another two cents.. as many will recall, a valve job was the bread and butter of repair shops (mine included) since the advent of unleaded fuel I have not seen a single valve job and valve seat recession

only on a race engine. New chemicals have been added to replace the octane boosting and lubricating attributes of lead. Most of what is out there as advice is a total myth or marketing BS.. My opinion .

DaveP

On 10/1/2018 11:15 AM, Reihing, Randall S. wrote:
Checking the web I found that the Red Line lead substitute fuel additive is available through Amazon in 12 ounce bottles to treat 25 gallons for close to $17.00, plus shipping, and adds about $.70 per gallon to the cost of whatever octane is selected.

An alternative might be 100 Low Lead, or 100LL, aviation fuel available at almost any airport and add it to the auto fuel. Shell Oil Co.'s web site lists 100LL as having 0.56g/liter of lead per gallon, https://www.shell.com/business-customers/aviation/aviation-fuel/avgas.html<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.shell.com_business-2Dcustomers_aviation_aviation-2Dfuel_avgas.html&d=DwMD-g&c=heEcP2AsrLOv4XP8e7I9NA&r=M9Vli1OgG7_7RAFFVpeXHiQAUCpprOLL1VRvWP3OJtI&m=r66tYSNXuHW4PCg5SzjQI-oFFHujZgSrVyT9KcNeDNA&s=r78lsQjJ6ovAzk5ReL4vasC3CL4u5QsNeYTcg0wh5RE&e=>,  which is about 560 ppm, or parts per million per gallon. I don't know if one gallon of 100LL could be diluted in today's auto fuel and be enough lead to for a TR3's valve seats.

An alternative might be to use a few gallons of 100LL ($4.75/gallon in Ohio) from time-to-time and maybe (hopefully) enough lead residue would build up to protect the valve seats. Click on this link to see 100LL av gas cost per state. http://www.airnav.com/fuel/greatdeals/long?type=1<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.airnav.com_fuel_greatdeals_long-3Ftype-3D1&d=DwMD-g&c=heEcP2AsrLOv4XP8e7I9NA&r=M9Vli1OgG7_7RAFFVpeXHiQAUCpprOLL1VRvWP3OJtI&m=r66tYSNXuHW4PCg5SzjQI-oFFHujZgSrVyT9KcNeDNA&s=vgDLOtEbOMGRJFozs7F4QcfBpMZMnsMivVVgn09qw5c&e=>

Maybe one of the lists math wizards could research how much lead was in auto fuel before it was phased out and determine if 100LL can help.

Sincerely,
Randall Reihing
1959 TR3A




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