It takes as much energy to convert water to hydrogen (and oxygen) as you
get back when you burn it to get H20 back, minus those good old
efficiency loses. In thermodynamics there is never a free lunch.
Storing hydrogen is one of the major problems, since it doesn't like to
exist in liquid form and thus takes up a lot of space. Since Oklahoma
is a gas producing state, there is a lot of interest in CNG, but it has
the same storage problem. Nevertheless, a lot of public vehicles are
being converted to CNG and a few filling stations are even showing up.
Hydrogen seems like it would be very clean, but if all cars ran on it,
how much would the humidity change in our cities? Would Phoenix become
more like Houston? Not a happy thought.
On 4/2/2013 5:23 PM, Tim Murphy wrote:
> Hydrogen has to be produced also. You can either extract it from the air or
> strip it off of water molecules. Both processes take energy, and if I
> recall correctly, not necessarily an insignificant amount.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: fot-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces@autox.team.net] On
> Behalf Of Tylerpthompson@yahoo.com(
> Sent: Monday, April 01, 2013 3:00 PM
> To: Randall
> Cc: fot@autox.team.net
> Subject: Re: [Fot] Electric cars
>
> You are correct. It takes coal fired power plants, gas fire power plants,
> hydro, solar and wind to power these batteries! Then they end up in a
> landfill as it doesn't pay to recycle them. But they are "green" vehicles
> and
> oh so manly. I am waiting for a hydrogen vehicle. Zero emissions and
> power....maybe not in my lifetime but.
>
> I almost got hit walking in a parking lot a few months back. The guy was
> backing up in his Prius and since it makes no noise, he just about clipped
> me.
> Had I not heard the sand under the tires, and yelled, well.....
>
> Ty
>
>
> Sent from my iPad
> (Please excuse any errors or typos)
>
> On Apr 1, 2013, at 12:07 PM, Randall <tr3driver@ca.rr.com> wrote:
>
>> ---- RACER BUD <budscars@comcast.net> wrote:
>>> What happens to The electric cars when the batteries are no good
>>> anymore..?..and what does it cost to replace tham..or..what becomes of
> the
>>> car?
>> They're kind of expensive to replace; buddy of mine said the battery for
> his
> 1st gen Prius was $7k but he convinced Toyota to cover half (which I suspect
> means the wholesale price is closer to $3.5k). (Yes, I realize a Prius has
> a
> relatively small battery, it's just a data point).
>> When the car isn't worth the price of a new or rebuilt battery, it gets
> scrapped just like any other car that isn't worth repairing.
>> At the moment, AFAIK the nearest Li-ion battery recycling facility is in
> Canada. Toxco was supposed to open a new plant in Ohio last year, but it
> doesn't seem to have happened yet. At the moment, lithium is so cheap that
> it
> doesn't pay to recycle it; but likely that will change if electric cars gain
> more acceptance.
>> Personally, I don't see full electric as ever replacing internal
> combustion.
> There is certainly a niche market for them, short distance commuting and so
> on. But the advantages aren't nearly as great as some folks like to claim.
> They aren't anywhere close to "zero pollution"; its just that most of the
> pollution comes out somewhere else. NFI, YMMV, etc.
>> Randall
>> _______________________________________________
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>>
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