I know what will fix my clutch problem......swapping the TR6 in my garage
with a Factory Five '65 Roadster :-) For anyone interested I will have a
1973 TR6 with solid body, frame and driveline (except clutch) for sale
after 10/14/02. I'll send out more info as that date approaches. Stay
tuned as I also have a very decent project car that I will be parting out
and many, many, many parts. The sale of the car and parts will be
financing the Cobra project.
Jay Welch, Abington MA
On Wed, 21 Aug 2002 13:16:26 -0500 "Vink, Graham" <vinkg@fleishman.com>
writes:
> hey, no fair including graphics in an e-mail argument!
>
> Actually, very nice work. Next time, please show the function and
> operation
> of carburetor temp compensators and bypass diaphragms, preferably
> with
> animation ...
>
> :)
>
> I believe our difference of opinion comes down to what constitutes
> "slack."
> I agree with you that if the throwout arm does not move under light
> pressure
> (ie a finger's touch), then shimming the cylinder makes no
> difference.
>
> But if there's enough "slop" in the system (i.e worn clevis pin
> hole) that
> by shimming the position of the master cylinder, you would eliminate
> the
> slop and make everything snug, then I think you'd see some benefit.
>
> Another example: for the carburetors, there is (deliberately) some
> slack
> between the throttle rod and the carburetor linkage. The first tiny
> bit of
> pressure on the accelerator takes up the slop, and continued pushing
> starts
> to rotate the throttle shafts. You can adjust the linkage to
> increase or
> reduce the slack -- which doesn't affect how much the throttle
> shafts
> themselves open or close.
>
> --Graham
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: James Franks [mailto:jimmble@adelphia.net]
> Sent: Wednesday, August 21, 2002 1:37 PM
> To: Vink, Graham
> Cc: Six pack
> Subject: Re: Clutch Problem Discussion
>
>
> "Shimming the cylinder so it is physically located farther toward
> the
> rear of
> the car puts that location at Point A plus 1/8 inch (or whatever the
> amount
> of "slack" is that you have eliminated)."
>
>
> No....... shimming the cylinder just locates the rod further into
> the
> cylinder by 1/8th inch in your example.
>
> The rod is fixed to the throwout arm and it's position doesn't
> change.
> You just push 1/8th inch of displaced brake fluid up out of your
> full
> reservoir.
>
> This takes a bit to get your mind around the first time. I drew a
> very
> crude bitmap representation of what I'm trying to say . I don't
> know if
> it'll come thru as an attachment to the list, but I can send it to
> anyone that cares. :^)
>
> Jim
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Vink, Graham" <vinkg@fleishman.com>
> To: "Six pack" <6pack@autox.team.net>
> Sent: Wednesday, August 21, 2002 12:27 PM
> Subject: RE: Clutch Problem Discussion
>
>
> > Well, I like a good obscure technical discussion as well as the
> next
> guy,
> > especially if it threatens to erupt into a flame war and doesn't
> involve
> > fuel injection, so I'm jumping in with my two bits:
> >
> > IMHO (and contrary to some other posts by my esteemed fellow
> listers)
> I
> > believe it WOULD help slightly if you shimmed out the physical
> location of
> > the slave cylinder to remove any "slack" in the system (ie worn
> clevis
> pin
> > holes).
> >
> > If we agree that the spring always pulls back the piston of the
> slave
> > cylinder to the same point in the cylinder, regardless of the
> cylinder's
> > location, then that becomes Point A.
> >
> > Shimming the cylinder so it is physically located farther toward
> the
> rear of
> > the car puts that location at Point A plus 1/8 inch (or whatever
> the
> amount
> > of "slack" is that you have eliminated).
> >
> > When you step on the clutch, you are no longer using the first 1/8
> inch of
> > piston travel to take up the "slack." So your full 1/2 inch of
> piston
> > movement is being applied directly to the fork, throwout bearing,
> etc.
> >
> > This also could compensate modestly for any slack inside the
> clutch
> case if
> > it exists (for example, any space between the throwout bearing and
> the
> > fingers on the clutch disc)
> >
> > I agree that such shimming does not affect the total travel range
> of
> the
> > piston. And I also agree the best solution is new parts.
> >
> > Graham
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: James Franks [mailto:jimmble@adelphia.net]
> > Sent: Wednesday, August 21, 2002 11:38 AM
> > To: jay_welch@juno.com
> > Cc: Six pack
> > Subject: Re: Clutch Problem Discussion
> >
> >
> > Jay,
> >
> > All you can do for a worn clevis and pin is repair and/or replace
> the
> > worn parts. Shimming won't work, and neither will a spring. (All
> that
> > will happen is the slack will be taken up at the beginning of the
> > stroke, and the spring will drag the arm back the same distance
> on
> the
> > return. Net gain= 0. )
> >
> > Jim
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: <jay_welch@juno.com>
> > To: <6pack@autox.team.net>
> > Sent: Wednesday, August 21, 2002 9:16 AM
> > Subject: Re: Clutch Problem Discussion
> >
> >
> > > Hello All,
> > >
> > > My thoughts are that the addition of a 1/4" to 3/8" shim where
> the
> > slave
> > > attaches to the plate might make up for worn clevis pins/holes
> between
> > > the clutch pedal and the rod??? Would I be correct in that
> > assumption??
> > >
> > > Jay Welch, Abington MA
> > > Secretary, "Cape Cod British Car Club"
> > > http://clubs.hemmings.com/capecodbritish/
> > > 1973 TR6 driver, 1971 TR6 project
> > > 1989 Mustang GT someday morphing into a Factory Five '65
> Roadster
> > >
> > >
> > > On Wed, 21 Aug 2002 05:42:38 -0700 (PDT) michael lunsford
> > > <mblunsfordsr@yahoo.com> writes:
> > > > Jim Franks wrote:
> > > >
> > > > <Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2002 09:49:19 -0400
> > > > From: "James Franks" <jimmble@adelphia.net>
> > > > Subject: Re: Clutch Problem
> > > >
> > > > <Mike,
> > > >
> > > > <Moving the slave cylinder, or adding washers, or lengthening
> the
> > > > pushrod
> > > > does NOT change the travel range of the slave cylinder piston.
> It
> > > > may
> > > > move the travel to an unworn area in the slave cylinder bore,
> which
> > > > is
> > > > the only potential benefit of doing this. ( I have gained a
> few
> > > > years
> > > > service from a bad slave this way) With new or unworn parts,
> > > > assemble
> > > > as
> > > > designed for best result>
> > > >
> > > > My response to the above is that I know that the range of the
> slave
> > > > cylinder does not change with these alterations. The
> suggested
> > > > changes result in the slave cylinder being in a position that
> takes
> > > > up any slackness between the pushrod and the initial
> disengagement
> > > > of the throw out bearing fork to the clutch. This idea is
> identical
> > > > to the fact that the adjustment of the rear brake shoes to the
> point
> > > > where they are closer to the drums results in less travel in
> the
> > > > brake pedal. This may not be the actual problem but it is a
> lot
> > > > easier to check/try this idea than to remove the transmission
> to
> > > > check the fork/throw out bearing/clutch. I learned this
> lesson
> the
> > > > hard way by putting the slave on the wrong side of the plate
> during
> > > > my restoration-BTDT. Good Luck.
> > > >
> > > > Mike Lunsford, 1970 TR6
> > > > HotJobs, a Yahoo! service - Search Thousands of New Jobs
>
> [demime 0.97c removed an attachment of type image/bmp which had a
> name of slave example.bmp]
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