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Re: [Mgs] MGB rear brakes

To: Max Heim <max_heim@sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: [Mgs] MGB rear brakes
From: Simon Matthews <simon.d.matthews@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 10:11:08 -0800
Max,

It's not quite so simple. This description of dual master cylinders
describes a balance bar used to ensure equal force is applied to each
cylinder:
http://www.hotrodheaven.com/tech/brakes/brakes3.htm
In this scenario, the balance bar would act to equalise the pressures
between front and rear. Also, are not some brake systems split
diagonally?

This patent describes a tandem dual-master cylinder setup in which the
two circuits also have equal pressure:

http://www.tpub.com/content/construction/14273/css/14273_248.htm

Regards,
Simon


On Tue, Feb 24, 2009 at 9:31 AM, Max Heim <max_heim@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> But in a dual master cylinder system, it is possible to meet resistance in
> one circuit before reaching that point in the other circuit (for example, in
> the case of a failed hose in one circuit). The pressure does NOT equalize
> between the completely independent circuits. So my argument is that by using
> larger wheel cylinders in the rear brake circuit, you are delaying the onset
> of braking force in the rear circuit, by requiring more fluid to be moved in
> order to reach the point of applying braking force RELATIVE TO THE FRONT
> CIRCUIT. Now do you see what I mean?
>
> I think we have established that single and dual master cylinder systems
> behave very differently in this respect, so that one needs to be careful in
> defining the question.
>
> --
>
> Max Heim
> '66 MGB GHN3L76149
> If you're near Mountain View, CA,
> it's the primer red one with chrome wires
>
>
>
> on 2/24/09 9:07 AM, Simon Matthews at simon.d.matthews@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> Charles,
>>
>> When you brake, do you push your foot down a certain distance? Or do
>> you push down until you get the appropriate resistance from the pedal?
>>
>> Yes, it takes more fluid, but this is irrelevant. The driver just
>> pushes the pedal further in order to get the same resistance. The
>> fluid will move in  the system to keep the pressure uniform
>> throughout.
>>
>> Simon
>>
>> On Tue, Feb 24, 2009 at 6:23 AM, Charles & Peggy Robinson
>> <ccrobins@ktc.com> wrote:
>>> OK Simon but he's right about the movement being less in a larger cylinder,
>>> with the same amount of fluid displaced by the master.
>>>
>>>  CR
>>>
>>>
>>> Simon Matthews wrote:
>>>>
>>>> It's not about the amount of fluid, it's about the force applied. With
>>>> a larger diameter slave cylinder, the same pressure is  applied to a
>>>> larger area, resulting in a greater force. Hence greater braking
>>>> effort.
>>>>
>>>
>>>> Simon
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