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I can confirm this. Have a friend, who also had phantom leaks, where the fl=
uid disappeared into the vacuum box the the power brake system.
Cheers,
Hans 71 BGT
Van: Mgs [mailto:mgs-bounces@autox.team.net] Namens Max Heim via Mgs
Verzonden: woensdag 6 mei 2020 18:59
Aan: mgs@autox.team.net List
Onderwerp: Re: [Mgs] Brake filaure
I have heard of =E2=80=9Cdisappearing brake fluid=E2=80=9D cases where it h=
as been sucked into the booster due to a leak in the master cylinder seal. =
Normally one would expect it to drip into the footwell, but engine vacuum s=
ucks it in and burns it. In any case, mere bleeding is not going to solve t=
his issue. It definitely went somewhere.
--
Max Heim
'66 MGB
On May 6, 2020, at 12:23 AM, PaulHunt73 via Mgs <mgs@autox.team.net> wrote:=
I'm not aware that blowing and sucking on any tube at the carb will help in=
diagnosing the brakes. If you mean the servo hose that should come from t=
he inlet manifold but still be no help.
Stomping on the pedal should not put air into the system, if it does then t=
here is a fault somewhere that needs to be found.
Is this single-circuit or dual-circuit brakes? The former should have a 's=
low-return' valve in the master outlet and with that if a couple of quick p=
umps on the pedal makes the pedal shorter and harder, but then it goes long=
and spongy again if released for a few seconds, that does indicate air in =
the system. Dual circuit varied.
Unless the fluid level in the master dropped right down to outlet level, or=
you have opened the plumbing anywhere, you should not get air in the syste=
m by being parked up. A leak will of course lower the level, could possibl=
y allow air in I suppose, but doubtful in my mind. I've found that fluid d=
ropping on a concrete floor 'evaporates' over time. Check the carpets unde=
r the pedal as that is another place where fluid goes if the master seconda=
ry seal fails.
Bleeding method varies according to system type i.e. single or dual.
PaulH.
----- Original Message -----
I have a power assist brake system which after bringing out of winter cover=
my MGB GT V8 exhibited brake failure No brake fluid on the floor but it d=
id need topping up. So added Dot 4 but still soft squashy pedal. Blowi=
ng/sucking on tube to Edelbrock carb (I have a Rover V8 dropped in) it suc=
ked but would not blow (I understand this is correct}. So we figured that =
the brakes need bleeding - is this a correct diagnosis? Any tips for a non=
-brake but fairly well versed owner. If I stomped a lot on the pedal when=
engine running would that put air into the brake pipes
_______________________________________________
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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=3DNL link=3Dblue vlink=
=3Dpurple style=3D'word-wrap: break-word;-webkit-nbsp-mode: space;-webkit-l=
ine-break: after-white-space'><div class=3DWordSection1><p class=3DMsoNorma=
l><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-=
serif";color:#1F497D'>I can confirm this. Have a friend, who also had phant=
om leaks, where the fluid disappeared into the vacuum box the the power bra=
ke system.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US sty=
le=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o=
:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'=
font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Cheers,<=
o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-=
size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Hans 71 BGT<o=
:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-s=
ize:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o=
:p></span></p><div><div style=3D'border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt=
;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm'><p class=3DMsoNormal><b><span style=3D'font-siz=
e:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>Van:</span></b><span style=3D'f=
ont-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> Mgs [mailto:mgs-bounces=
@autox.team.net] <b>Namens </b>Max Heim via Mgs<br><b>Verzonden:</b> woensd=
ag 6 mei 2020 18:59<br><b>Aan:</b> mgs@autox.team.net List<br><b>Onderwerp:=
</b> Re: [Mgs] Brake filaure<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=3DMs=
oNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>I have heard of =E2=80=9C=
disappearing brake fluid=E2=80=9D cases where it has been sucked into the b=
ooster due to a leak in the master cylinder seal. Normally one would expect=
it to drip into the footwell, but engine vacuum sucks it in and burns it. =
In any case, mere bleeding is not going to solve this issue. It definitely =
went somewhere.<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></=
p><div><div><div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;=
color:black'>--<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;color:black'>Max Heim<o:p></o:p></span></p></div>=
<div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;color:black'>'66 =
MGB<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>=
</o:p></p><div><blockquote style=3D'margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.=
0pt'><div><p class=3DMsoNormal>On May 6, 2020, at 12:23 AM, PaulHunt73 via =
Mgs <<a href=3D"mailto:mgs@autox.team.net";>mgs@autox.team.net</a>> wr=
ote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><di=
v><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'background:white'><span style=3D'font-size:=
10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"'>I'm not aware that blowing and s=
ucking on any tube at the carb will help in diagnosing the brakes. If=
you mean the servo hose that should come from the inlet manifold but still=
be no help.</span><span style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sa=
ns-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'b=
ackground:white'><span style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans=
-serif"'> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal style=
=3D'background:white'><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana"=
,"sans-serif"'>Stomping on the pedal should not put air into the system, if=
it does then there is a fault somewhere that needs to be found.</span><spa=
n style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p><=
/span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'background:white'><span =
style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"'> <o:p></o=
:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'background:white'><s=
pan style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"'>Is this s=
ingle-circuit or dual-circuit brakes? The former should have a 'slow-=
return' valve in the master outlet</span><span style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;fon=
t-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"'> </span><span style=3D'font-size:10.0=
pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"'>and with that if a couple of quick p=
umps on the pedal makes the pedal shorter and harder, but then it goes long=
and spongy again if released for a few seconds, that does indicate air in =
the system. Dual circuit varied.</span><span style=3D'font-size:9.0pt=
;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p cl=
ass=3DMsoNormal style=3D'background:white'><span style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;f=
ont-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"'> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><=
p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'background:white'><span style=3D'font-size:10.=
0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"'>Unless the fluid level in the maste=
r dropped right down to outlet level, or you have opened the plumbing =
anywhere, you should not get air in the system by being parked up. A =
leak will of course lower the level, could possibly allow air in I suppose,=
but doubtful in my mind. I've found that fluid dropping on a concret=
e floor 'evaporates' over time. Check the carpets under the pedal as =
that is another place where fluid goes if the master secondary seal fails.<=
/span><span style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"'><o=
:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'background:whi=
te'><span style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"'>&nbs=
p;<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'background=
:white'><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"'=
>Bleeding method varies according to system type i.e. single or dual.</span=
><span style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"'><o:p></=
o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'background:white'><=
span style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"'> <o:=
p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'background:whit=
e'><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"'>Paul=
H.</span><span style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"'=
><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote style=3D'border:none;border-left:s=
olid black 1.5pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:5.=
0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt;font-variant-caps: normal;text-ali=
gn:start;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;word-spacing:0px'><div><p class=3DM=
soNormal style=3D'background:white'><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-fa=
mily:"Arial","sans-serif"'>----- Original Message -----<o:p></o:p></span></=
p></div><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'background:white'><span style=3D'font=
-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br>I have a power assist br=
ake system which after bringing out of winter cover my MGB GT V8 exhibited =
brake failure No brake fluid on the floor but it did need topping up.=
So added Dot 4 but still soft squashy pedal. =
Blowing/sucking on tube to Edelbrock carb (I have a Rover V8 dropped=
in) it sucked but would not blow (I understand this is correct}. So =
we figured that the brakes need bleeding - is this a correct diagnosis?&nbs=
p; Any tips for a non-brake but fairly well versed owner. If I =
stomped a lot on the pedal when engine running would that put air into the =
brake pipes</span><span style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","san=
s-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote><p class=3DMsoNormal><span sty=
le=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";background:white'>=
_______________________________________________</span><span style=3D'font-s=
ize:9.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"'><br><br></span><a href=3D"mai=
lto:Mgs@autox.team.net"><span style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Verdana=
","sans-serif";background:white'>Mgs@autox.team.net</span></a><span style=
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