[Top] [All Lists]

Re: Humble reply to Her Majesty - (non LBC, rant, long - hopefully obje

To: "John Macartney" <>, "Triumph List" <>
Subject: Re: Humble reply to Her Majesty - (non LBC, rant, long - hopefully objective)
From: "Jeff McNeal" <>
Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2000 15:49:17 -0800
References: <002d01c058ca$8a345f20$9de307c3@jonmac>

My comments about the French were meant in jest in reply to the "Humble
reply to Her Majesty", by author unknown, which most certainly was meant in
jest (at least I should hope so!).

While my general experience with the French in Eleuthera was less than
impressive, we certainly met a few that were far and away some of the nicest
people we encountered the entire week that we were there.  Two or three were
genuinely friendly and we had a great time talking about our mutual disdain
for the British.

JUST KIDDING, John!!  Good Lord!

I would never condemn any particular race, creed, religion or nationality.
I'm sorry if anyone was truly offended by my remarks, as apparently you
were.  And for the record, I think we "Yanks" have come under quite a bit of
criticism on this list as of late, so yes, I know full well how the boot
feels on the other foot.

By the way, I think I received two e-mails from folks that didn't understand
my comments were intended in a joking manner.  With all due respect, John, I
think you misunderstood.

Again, my apologies to all who I have offended, which includes anyone that I
may offend in the future without meaning to.

Ciao for now.


----- Original Message -----
From: John Macartney <>
To: Triumph List <>
Sent: Monday, November 27, 2000 3:33 PM
Subject: Re: Humble reply to Her Majesty - (non LBC, rant, long - hopefully

> Someone wrote:
> I do take acception to one glaring innacuracy, however.  The French
> ARE the spawn of the devil.  I spent a week with trapped with a hoard
> of them in Eleuthera at Club Med one recent summer.  The couldn't
> speak a word of English... until they wanted you to pass the wine...
> The children were rude and ill-tempered
> Any self-respecting French national reading the above would have my
> wholehearted support if he/she uttered, or wrote "foutre le camp" in
> response!
> Is the author of these words truly serious - and if so, is it really
> accurate to castigate a whole nation to the last man, woman and child
> as "the spawn of the devil" based on one week's experience in a
> glorified holiday or summer camp?
> Does this person also realise that there could well be some French
> enthusiasts owning Triumphs on this list? If so, how would he or she
> react if the boot was on the other foot and his / her own nation was
> condemned in such an out of hand, dismissive and flagrantly rude
> manner?
> All of us would surely agree that every nationality has its fair share
> of 'unpreferables' within a total population and I can think of a
> number of Brits and Americans I have met over the years who were
> equally entitled to wear this "spawn of the devil" epithet. I'd go a
> stage further and categorise such individuals as excresences of
> humanity that both nations could well do without in the best interests
> of their own national identities.
> Having lived twice in France, both in Paris and further south in the
> country for a total period of nearly ten years, my memories are of a
> people whose culture, language, traditions, fervent patriotism and
> *courtesy to others* - especially at an international level - has few
> equals. Yes, I met some 'pains' in the process but I saw and
> experienced many convincing demonstrations of kindness, generosity,
> care, consideration and concern on the part of the French to
> 'foreigners.'
> Those experiences set standards that others would do well to imitate
> and just because a few French people may not have behaved within a
> given set of circumstances as another might expect or prefer, does not
> mean the whole nation should be damned into eternity.
> To further condemn a very small number of a total whole for not
> speaking English is both narrow-minded and ludicrous in its arrogance.
> Why should they speak your/our language in their country - assuming
> the Club Med location was in France?
> Why is it that 'x' million odd Brits and 'y' million Americans (both
> mainly abroad as tourists?) expect some 300 million people living in
> mainland Europe are *obligated* to speak English, merely for the
> convenience of others who may be too idle or just too pig-ignorant to
> learn another language for themselves?
> I can only conclude this person has spent most of his or her life in
> such a deeply entrenched and insular Anglophone environment that it is
> beyond his or her wit to envisage an alternative - be it 'better' or
> 'worse'?
> Finally, it may come as no surprise (or will it?) for him/her to know
> that the regard held by the French as a nation towards 'les rosbifs'
> and 'les yankees' as collective but individual nations is not too far
> removed from the contents of an overfull and very deep sewer. In their
> eyes, we are by no means the best thing that happened to humanity and
> having seen many examples of the behaviour of both those *foreign*
> nationalities at work and at leisure in France, this is an opinion the
> French are more than legitimately and reasonably entitled to hold for
> a long time into the future.
> By all means luxuriate in the freedom of speech but do not damn a
> nation until you have spoken to every single person holding that
> nationality. Only then can a realistic opinion "Based_on_Experience"
> be expressed.
> Rant mode off
> Jonmac

<Prev in Thread] Current Thread [Next in Thread>