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Greg made an excellent suggestion. You can relieve or bevel the edge next =
to the squish area a lot, if it isn't already. Basically back to the facto=
ry shape before the milling and then some. =20
I took .125" off my head for racing and got around 10.8 compression after c=
hamber work, and my car will run on 91 pump gas after retarding the timing =
2 degrees. I mix pump gas and race fuel 50:50 when on track. I keep race =
gas at home and a gallon or two mixed with pump gas settles any concern abo=
ut detonation with no retarding of the timing for street.
You can see my head work on my restoration and race car build Youtube video=
, starting around 7:50 in the video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DUW-cSGzyKXs&t=3D3s
Dave H.=20
> On 04/07/2021 3:39 PM Greg Lemon <grglmn@gmail.com> wrote:
> =20
> =20
> If you want to save the head you may be able to lower the compression=
ratio a bit by reshaping the combustion chamber. This is theoretically, I=
don't know how much can be removed, Kastner book would be a starting point=
, but you would probably want to take out more than that, measure combustio=
n chamber size, etc.
>=20
> On Wed, Apr 7, 2021, 5:23 PM Dave Connitt < dconnitt@fuse.net mailto:=
dconnitt@fuse.net > wrote:
>=20
> > > Hi Cliff,
> > A lot of racers have milled the heads of wet liner engines to i=
ncrease compression. In Kas Kastner=E2=80=99s TR4/TR4A competition preparat=
ion manual, he goes into much detail about how to reshape the combustion ch=
ambers in the head to reduce/eliminate =E2=80=9Chot spots=E2=80=9D. This ma=
y be the cause of your pre-ignition. Yoy may want to get that book and read=
over his cylinder head chapter. Regarding the push rod length, the length =
reduction is directly related to how much material is removed from the head=
so just buying shortened pushrods won=E2=80=99t get you the best results. =
I think you should figure out how much material was removed from the =E2=80=
=9Cstock=E2=80=9D head and shorten the pushrods accordingly.=20
> > I think you can certainly save the head but you will need to do=
some homework reading over Kas=E2=80=99s competition prep manual and find =
a good automotive machinist for the pushrods.
> > Dave Connitt=20
> >=20
> > Sent from my iPhone
> >=20
> >=20
> > > > > On Apr 7, 2021, at 5:41 PM, DAVID MASSEY < dave1masse=
y@cs.com mailto:dave1massey@cs.com > wrote:
> > >=20
> > >=20
> > > > >=20
> > > > > I went the band-aid route on my TR3 for t=
he same reason. But the right way is to get a machinist to shorten the pus=
hrods. BPNW sells short rods for the TR6/SC engine but at that time they d=
idn't have any for the wet-sleeve engine.
> > > =20
> > > Dave
> > >=20
> > > =20
> > > =20
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: Cliff Hansen <cliff_hansen@outlook.com mailto:cliff=
_hansen@outlook.com >
> > > To: list Triumph <triumphs@autox.team.net mailto:triumphs=
@autox.team.net >
> > > Sent: Wed, Apr 7, 2021 4:23 pm
> > > Subject: [TR] Advice on high compression head
> > >=20
> > > The telenovela =E2=80=9CWhat=E2=80=99s going on with this=
4A cylinder head=E2=80=9D has developed a new plot twist.
> > > =20
> > > The head, after cleanup, measures 3.21=E2=80=9D from bott=
om to the surface for the valve cover gasket. Stock is 3.330 (if I got the =
number correctly). Some PO cut 0.11 off, because only 0.010=E2=80=9D was re=
moved in this round of clean up. Now I can see an explanation for the persi=
stent pinging I=E2=80=99ve dealt with over the last few years (head has bee=
n milled so compression is high, material near intake valves has been thinn=
ed, increasing likelihood of hot spots =E2=80=93 I=E2=80=99m getting this f=
rom Kastner=E2=80=99s preparation book), which I had thought was due to lea=
king intakes, carb shafts, or operating at higher altitude.
> > > =20
> > > As is, I can=E2=80=99t use this head because there is not=
enough slack in the valve train to give 0.010=E2=80=9D clearance on severa=
l valves. I didn=E2=80=99t notice before, but now that I am looking, all th=
e valve adjusters were nearly backed out all the way.
> > > =20
> > > Looking for advice from the list: is there any reasonable=
way to use this head?
> > > - I=E2=80=99d prefer to reduce compression but don=E2=80=
=99t see any reasonable way to accomplish that. I called GasketWorks and he=
gently discouraged me from getting a custom thick head gasket, saying inst=
ead I=E2=80=99d be better off finding a head which had not been milled so m=
uch.
> > > - Shimming the rocker pedestals to get valve clearance f=
eels like a bandaid which certainly won=E2=80=99t address the pinging (assu=
ming that the pinging is a result of the shortened head).
> > > =20
> > > Would appreciate any advice on the way forward.
> > > =20
> > > Cliff
> > > =20
> > > Sent from Mail https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=3D=
550986 for Windows 10
> > > =20
> > > ** triumphs@autox.team.net mailto:triumphs@autox.team.net=
**
> > >=20
> > > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> > > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs http://ww=
w.team.net/pipermail/triumphs http://www.team.net/archive
> > >=20
> > > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options=
/triumphs/dave1massey@cs.com
> > > ** triumphs@autox.team.net mailto:triumphs@autox.team.net=
**
> > >=20
> > > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> > > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs http://=
www.team.net/archive
> > >=20
> > > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options=
/triumphs/dconnitt@fuse.net
> > >=20
> > > > > ** triumphs@autox.team.net mailto:triumphs@autox.=
team.net **
> >=20
> > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs http://www.tea=
m.net/archive
> >=20
> > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/trium=
phs/grglmn@gmail.com
> >=20
> > > ** triumphs@autox.team.net **
>=20
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs http://www.team.net/a=
rchive
>=20
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/dl=
hogye@comcast.net
>=20
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
<!doctype html>
<html>
<head>=20
<meta charset=3D"UTF-8">=20
</head>
<body>
<div style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: helvetica,arial,sans-serif; c=
olor: #333333;">
<span style=3D"font-family: helvetica; font-size: 12pt;">Greg made an ex=
cellent suggestion. You can relieve or bevel the edge next to the squ=
ish area a lot, if it isn't already. Basically back to the factory sh=
ape before the milling and then some. </span>
</div>=20
<div style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: helvetica,arial,sans-serif; c=
olor: #333333;">
<span style=3D"font-family: helvetica; font-size: 12pt;">I took .125" of=
f my head for racing and got around 10.8 compression after chamber work, an=
d my car will run on 91 pump gas after retarding the timing 2 degrees. =
; I mix pump gas and race fuel 50:50 when on track. I keep race gas a=
t home and a gallon or two mixed with pump gas settles any concern about de=
tonation with no retarding of the timing for street.</span>
</div>=20
<div style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: helvetica,arial,sans-serif; c=
olor: #333333;">
<span style=3D"font-family: helvetica; font-size: 12pt;">You can see my =
head work on my restoration and race car build Youtube video, starting arou=
nd 7:50 in the video.</span>
</div>=20
<div style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: helvetica,arial,sans-serif; c=
olor: #333333;">
<span style=3D"font-family: helvetica; font-size: 12pt;"><a href=3D"http=
s://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DUW-cSGzyKXs&t=3D3s">https://www.youtube.c=
om/watch?v=3DUW-cSGzyKXs&t=3D3s</a></span>
</div>=20
<div style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: helvetica,arial,sans-serif; c=
olor: #333333;">
<span style=3D"font-family: helvetica; font-size: 12pt;">Dave H. </=
span>
</div>=20
<blockquote type=3D"cite">=20
<div>
On 04/07/2021 3:39 PM Greg Lemon <grglmn@gmail.com> wrote:
</div>=20
<div>
</div>=20
<div>
</div>=20
<div dir=3D"auto">
If you want to save the head you may be able to lower the compression r=
atio a bit by reshaping the combustion chamber. This is theoretically=
, I don't know how much can be removed, Kastner book would be a starting po=
int, but you would probably want to take out more than that, measure combus=
tion chamber size, etc.
</div>=20
<br>=20
<div class=3D"gmail_quote">=20
<div class=3D"gmail_attr" dir=3D"ltr">
On Wed, Apr 7, 2021, 5:23 PM Dave Connitt <
<a href=3D"mailto:dconnitt@fuse.net";>dconnitt@fuse.net</a>> wrote:
</div>=20
<blockquote>=20
<div dir=3D"auto">
Hi Cliff,=20
<div>
A lot of racers have milled the heads of wet liner engines to increa=
se compression. In Kas Kastner=E2=80=99s TR4/TR4A competition preparation m=
anual, he goes into much detail about how to reshape the combustion chamber=
s in the head to reduce/eliminate =E2=80=9Chot spots=E2=80=9D. This may be =
the cause of your pre-ignition. Yoy may want to get that book and read over=
his cylinder head chapter. Regarding the push rod length, the length reduc=
tion is directly related to how much material is removed from the head so j=
ust buying shortened pushrods won=E2=80=99t get you the best results. I thi=
nk you should figure out how much material was removed from the =E2=80=9Cst=
ock=E2=80=9D head and shorten the pushrods accordingly.
</div>=20
<div>
I think you can certainly save the head but you will need to do some=
homework reading over Kas=E2=80=99s competition prep manual and find a goo=
d automotive machinist for the pushrods.
</div>=20
<div>
Dave Connitt
<br>
<br>=20
<div dir=3D"ltr">
Sent from my iPhone
</div>=20
<div dir=3D"ltr">
<br>=20
<blockquote type=3D"cite">
On Apr 7, 2021, at 5:41 PM, DAVID MASSEY <
<a href=3D"mailto:dave1massey@cs.com"; target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noo=
pener">dave1massey@cs.com</a>> wrote:
<br>
<br>
</blockquote>=20
</div>=20
<blockquote type=3D"cite">=20
<div dir=3D"ltr">=20
<div style=3D"color: black; font: 12pt Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif;=
">=20
<div>
<span style=3D"font-size: medium;">I went the band-aid route on =
my TR3 for the same reason. But the right way is to get a machinist t=
o shorten the pushrods. BPNW sells short rods for the TR6/SC engine b=
ut at that time they didn't have any for the wet-sleeve engine.</span>
</div>=20
<div>
</div>=20
<div style=3D"clear: both;">
<span style=3D"font-size: large;">Dave </span>
<br>
<br>
</div>=20
<div>
</div>=20
<div>
</div>=20
<div style=3D"font-family: arial,helvetica; font-size: 10pt; colo=
r: black;">
<span style=3D"font-size: small;"><span style=3D"font-size: smal=
l;">-----Original Message-----<br>From: Cliff Hansen <<a href=3D"mailto:=
cliff_hansen@outlook.com" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener">cliff_hansen@o=
utlook.com</a>><br>To: list Triumph <<a href=3D"mailto:triumphs@autox=
.team.net" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener">triumphs@autox.team.net</a>&g=
t;<br>Sent: Wed, Apr 7, 2021 4:23 pm<br>Subject: [TR] Advice on high compre=
ssion head<br><br></span></span>=20
<div id=3D"m_5256231747994726540yiv4309632913">=20
<div>=20
<div>=20
<div>
The telenovela =E2=80=9CWhat=E2=80=99s going on with this 4A=
cylinder head=E2=80=9D has developed a new plot twist.
</div>=20
<div>
</div>=20
<div>
The head, after cleanup, measures 3.21=E2=80=9D from bottom =
to the surface for the valve cover gasket. Stock is 3.330 (if I got the num=
ber correctly). Some PO cut 0.11 off, because only 0.010=E2=80=9D was remov=
ed in this round of clean up. Now I can see an explanation for the persiste=
nt pinging I=E2=80=99ve dealt with over the last few years (head has been m=
illed so compression is high, material near intake valves has been thinned,=
increasing likelihood of hot spots =E2=80=93 I=E2=80=99m getting this from=
Kastner=E2=80=99s preparation book), which I had thought was due to leakin=
g intakes, carb shafts, or operating at higher altitude.
</div>=20
<div>
</div>=20
<div>
As is, I can=E2=80=99t use this head because there is not en=
ough slack in the valve train to give 0.010=E2=80=9D clearance on several v=
alves. I didn=E2=80=99t notice before, but now that I am looking, all the v=
alve adjusters were nearly backed out all the way.
</div>=20
<div>
</div>=20
<div>
Looking for advice from the list: is there any reasonable wa=
y to use this head?
</div>=20
<div>
- I=E2=80=99d prefer to reduce compression but don=E2=80=99t=
see any reasonable way to accomplish that. I called GasketWorks and he gen=
tly discouraged me from getting a custom thick head gasket, saying instead =
I=E2=80=99d be better off finding a head which had not been milled so much.
</div>=20
<div>
- Shimming the rocker pedestals to get valve clearance=
feels like a bandaid which certainly won=E2=80=99t address the pinging (as=
suming that the pinging is a result of the shortened head).
</div>=20
<div>
</div>=20
<div>
Would appreciate any advice on the way forward.
</div>=20
<div>
</div>=20
<div>
Cliff
</div>=20
<div>
</div>=20
<div>
Sent from=20
<a href=3D"https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=3D550986"=
target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener"> Mail</a> for Windows 10
</div>=20
<div>
</div>=20
</div>=20
</div>=20
</div>=20
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