[Shotimes] Gloly Days of Performance Cars
Donald Mallinson
dmall@mwonline.net
Sun, 21 Sep 2003 18:22:08 -0500
Jim,
Then based on what you wrote, we are in closer to 90%
NON-violent agreement.
No doubt that 60's tires, and suspension parts are not as
good as some of the newer stuff.
My point is that those older cars were a pretty good value
in the day even, and a better value today. They ran good,
were easy to keep running and didn't handle as horrible as
many people seem to claim.
A simple alignment with some changes that can be made with
suspension adjustment available, plus good bushings (don't
even need hard bushings, just good new ones) plus good
shocks and a lot of the old cars came with halfway decent
disk brakes. Yes, Drum brakes are far inferior to good disk
brakes so upgrade to decent disks and the older cars will
hang with a lot of new equal mission stuff. For instance
you don't pit a 454 Chevelle against a Viper in an autocross.
But todays Mustang versus a 60's Mustang? Heck the
technology is almost equal except for tires and rims!
we have been over it before, but there was nothing that
wrong with the 60's stuff that it can't be "restified" and
made to preform with modern equipment. And for straight
line stuff. If you compare the 60's numbers to today, then
puy todays' cars on 60's rubber to be fair! :) (or the
other way and the old cars performance, 0-60 and 1/4 mile
will be amazing.)
As I said, the new cars are superb, wonderful, great
handling cars, and if 40+ years doesn't give them that, then
I would be amazed, but looked at from the other side, for
FOURTY YEARS of so-called "advancement" todays cars aren't
any faster except for the cream of the crop, and don't
hardley get any better MPG for the equivalent performance.
Still getting 14-16 mpg on the big bruisers, and even big
block stuff could be tuned to get that when loafing down the
highway.
Shocks are still shocks, but we have gas pressure shocks and
some new valving. springs are still springs and bushings
are still bushings. A live axle is still a live axle.
And when stuff goes wrong, forget working on it yourself for
the most part.
WE have made some wonderful advances, but I would expect
that for the time that has passed.
There is nothing magic about todays tires and rims, it is
just that wider stuff and some minor advances have become
the vogue. All of it transfers to the old stuff without any
problem in most cases.
I have no problem agreeing that todays very good cars are
VERY good and handle superb and are better than cars built
in the 60's in many, many respects, but not in ease of
maintenance, or cost to maintain.
All along, as I have said and pointed out, with only the
most minor updates, 60's stuff can perform up to the
standards of most of todays vehicles.
There are also some low-line cars today that lean like a
BelAir and have dangerously undersized brakes, and for sure
are under-motored! So there are still crappy cars being
built. And like the 60's the more interesting cars are way
better.
Don Mallinson
Jim Heaton wrote:
> Don,
>
> I think we are in 90% violent agreement: I agree with
> your points (always up for a pun) about working on
> cars old vs new. But even so, when they were made, the
> old cars had far worse performance because of horrible
> tires, weak brakes and sloppy suspensions (over
> generalizing of course but generally true, especially
> about the American muscle I love so much). What they
> were best at (by today's standards) was putting big
> beautiful grunt engines into cars, yielding decent
> power to weight ratios even today.
>
> The Glory Days of the modern automobile *enable*
> upgrades for the 60's cars to bring them closer to the
> modern performance car - Street tires and rims that
> out perform 60's race tires, vastly better brake
> fluids, compounds and retrofit brake and suspension
> components that bring new technology to old cars. An
> old car with modern parts is a thing of beauty, but it
> is also a far better and I would argue a somewhat
> different vehicle than it was when it left the
> factory.
>
> A good example - AC Cobras can run very close to Z06
> performance on the track - but not with 60's-grade
> parts on them.
>
> -Jim
>
>
>>Jim,
>>
>>No doubt that today is the second coming of the
>>really FUN
>>car.
>>
>>There is one main reason, though that I would call
>>the first
>>coming just a bit better: ease of modification and
>>ease of
>>working on a car at a low cost.
>>
>>computerization has made some great things possible
>>(better
>>running, better fuel mileage, etc) but it also
>>brings
>>complexity that the vast majority of up and coming
>>gearheads
>>just can't content with.
>>
>>IN the 60's and early 70's if you had a screwdriver
>>and a
>>business card, you could set your ignition!
>>(oversimplification but you should get the point!
>>pun
>>intended!) :)
>>
>>Put todays tires and some of the upgraded suspension
>>
>>technology on yesterdays muscle and you get a great
>>combination that is dependable, handles well and
>>goes like
>>stink. Also is easier to modify and cheaper to work
>>on today.
>>
>>This IS a great time to be alive for the most part,
>>with
>>some really great car choices and still enough
>>freedom and
>>open space in America to enjoy it all. And to make
>>it
>>better yet, it is possible to have your cake (old
>>muscle
>>cars) and eat it too (new muscle cars).
>>
>>Don Mallinson
>>
>>Jim Heaton wrote:
>>
>>>I think today may be the best of all times. 390 hp
>>>Cobra, 400 hp base vette, 500 hp viper.
>>>
>>>Tires are SOOOO much better than they were then,
>>
>>not
>>
>>>to mention suspensions, active electronics & yaw
>>>control. Best 911's ever. 400-500+hp performance
>>>sedans as well as quite a few in the 300+hp range.
>>>
>>>IMO THESE are the glory days for cars.
>>>
>>>-Jim
>>
>
>
>
>
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