[Shotimes] (OT) Re: NASCAR numbnuts

[Noah South III]

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Donald Mallinson [mailto:dmall@mwonline.net]
> Sent: Tuesday, May 11, 2004 4:07 PM
> To: Noah South III
> Cc: SHOTimes-Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [Shotimes] (OT) Re: NASCAR numbnuts
> You say none of the NASCAR drivers would last in a WRC car?
> (WRC IS Rally BTW)  I don't know how many have tried it, but
> many have driven Baja trucks, Pikes Peak, and I would love
> you to stand toe to toe with Tony STewart and say his
> experience going in circles on a dirt track or pavement in a
> modified is anything but "real" racing.  AJ Foyt also has
> driven just about anything with wheels, and he turns left
> with the best of them.

But Don, are you saying that because AJ now drives in circles that means
it's a better form of racing?  I'd say it just pays a hell of a lot better.
If you want money, do NASCAR or CART.  Oh shit, I came in last place.......I
guess I'll just have to settle for $80k then.

Also, and this is a serious question.  Of the big winners in NASCAR, which
ones HAVE actually competed in Baja or Pikes Peak events?  And if they did,
did they even place at a respected level?  I started searching through bios
of a few people on foxsports.net, and I haven't found anyone that's done a
pikes peak event.

 
> Also, you base your argument on VIDEO GAMES?

Don, you've known me for how long, you should know I make some of the most
ridiculous arguments that still make a good point.  <G>

> How about butts in the stands?  At least in this country,
> the fans don't support road racing that much and WRC has
> never gotten much support.  Yes, it is hard to watch a WRC
> race, and if I had a choice of a video game, I would rather
> have a WRC game than NASCAR, but there are a bunch of NASCAR
> games, and before quoting stats, better get actual sales
> numbers not just how many you see on the shelves.

Sales numbers don't mean anything when it comes to quality of a videogame,
that just shows how many people bought it.  A LOT of people bought Need For
Speed Hot Pursuit, which is just another lame arcade racer with a gimmick.
And no, there are not a bunch of NASCAR games.  Go to Gamespot.com and look
under driving games.  There are 24, count them, 24 NASCAR games, and those
are mostly lame series games that make very little changes to the engine or
gameplay and just update the stats on real life drivers.  Actually, half of
those games are EA Sports games, and I've already related by opinion on EA
Sports and their own lack of skill.  Now if EA Big made a NASCAR game it
might be pretty good, but EA Big has a way of taking "real sports" and
exaggerating them so that they're way more entertaining to play than real
life.  Basically taking advantage of being in the video game world with
"Tekken Physics."

> Again, I am not saying NASCAR is the ultimate, but those,
> including you that say what they do is not real racing just
> don't know what racing is!  Plain and simple.

Ok, you're right, NASCAR is racing, it's not something your average Joe
could do.  But it's also not the end all be all of racing, and it's far from
being all encompassing of what racing is all about.  If racing, as a sports
genre, were to have a spokesperson, NASCAR would not be it.  In fact if
NASCAR was the spokesperson, I would imagine it would look a lot like Dorf
on Racing.

> I could make the argument that one car on a nearly deserted
> road (WRC) isn't anywhere near as exciting or dangerous or
> require the skill of going 200 mph inches from four other
> cars on each side and end of you while on the ragged edge of
> control.  See what I mean?

You're mixing types of skill though, the skill required to keep your car
steady on a clean track at 200mph inchs away from 5 other cars, is not the
same skill required to drift out of an S curve over a hill you've never been
on before and the only heads up you get is a 5 word sentence from the guy
sitting shotgun about 2 seconds before you hit it.  They're both skill, but
for different reasons.  When it comes down to driving, JUST driving, rally
style driving is much closer to the driving we all do on a regular basis
than NASCAR is.

> It takes all kinds, but those that are anti-NASCAR just need
> to admit they hate that style of racing but don't disrespect
> the drivers, they have skill as much as in any motorsport.

Ok, so I hate NASCAR and most of what it embodies, I'm not saying the
drivers of NASCAR have no skill, just not the same kind of skill required to
drive in a varied environment.  It's racing, but a different kind of racing.
American racing if you will.  You should note that outside America, there
are very little NASCAR fans.

> P.S. Ever notice how those video games of street racing and
> WRC almost never get close to the real thing, because it
> won't sell.  The cars in those games fly higher, farther and
> do things that the real cars can't.  Don't quote GAMES as a
> reason WRC drivers are great.  They don't need that kind of
> put-down.

And I never said that because WRC games are better that makes WRC drivers
better, I was making the point that as far as being entertaining in actually
racing goes, NASCAR isn't.  Driving ability isn't required to play a NASCAR
game, it's really easy to pick up and get good at.  Qualifying for the S
class license in GT3, now THAT is difficult.  I still don't have all of
them.

Like I said before, you should play Rallisport 2, it redefines racing games.
It's as close to the reality of Rally as you can get with a videogame right
now.

-Noah South III