--===============1764563722457269615==
boundary="Apple-Mail=_BD2ACD4E-80DC-44C5-BA15-E7060A518015"
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How could the capsule get damaged?
I unscrewed it from the head, and gently pulled the tube out of the way. =
Then I replaced it after replacing the head.
Unfortunately, it never occurred to me to see what the gauge was reading =
while the head was off and the capsule was resting on the inner fender.
I=E2=80=99m not sure what the test would demonstrate. I already know it =
responds to temperature changes, so the capillary tube is not broken. =
The problem seems to be at the gauge end. I just can=E2=80=99t figure =
out what that would be.
I know there is a flattened tube rolled into a coil inside the gauge. =
Could it have unrolled beyond its intended limit during the overheating =
episode, and is now hung up on some protuberance inside the housing, =
preventing it from recoiling?
--
Max Heim
mvheim@sonic.net
> On Oct 7, 2018, at 3:49 PM, B H <mgbobh@gmail.com> wrote:
>=20
> Yours has the non-electric temp sender and gauge?=20
> If it does, the gauge is moved by pressure of expanding ether in the =
little capsule that is screwed into the engine. If it reads 220 from the =
beginning, my guess is that the capsule got squeezed or the tube damaged =
during the R&R.
> Test by removing capsule from engine, and putting it into a pan of =
hot water. Check the temp with your hand-held thermometer.
> Bob
>=20
>=20
> On Sun, Oct 7, 2018 at 6:30 PM Max Heim via Mgs <mgs@autox.team.net =
> I just got the engine back together, but now the temperature gauge is =
malfunctioning.
>=20
> It seems to have got stuck at about 220. That=E2=80=99s what it was =
reading before I even tried to start the car. After warming up to =
operating temp (estimated, of course), the gauge had climbed into the =
oil pressure zone, reading at 85 psi. At this point my cheap temp gun =
had the thermostat housing at around 180.
>=20
> Anyone seen this before? Any suggestions?
>=20
>=20
> --
> Max Heim
> '66 MGB
>=20
>> On Sep 26, 2018, at 9:11 AM, Max Heim via Mgs <mgs@autox.team.net =
>>=20
>> Actually, when we finally got to my house, we swapped the luggage =
into my 1967 Barracuda convertible and headed up the freeway to catch up =
with the Melee. Reached the first night=E2=80=99s stop in Red Bluff by =
7pm.
>>=20
>> Not the first participants to have to pull in a backup vehicle=E2=80=A6=
>>=20
>> The plastic blade didn=E2=80=99t directly =E2=80=9Cpuncture=E2=80=9D =
the radiator, actually. But it was trapped inside the shroud, and wound =
up smashing several tubes right where they enter the top and bottom =
tanks (the blade being caught on the lip of the tank at each revolution, =
I think). I didn't even know that it had thrown a blade until I started =
disassembly =E2=80=94 I was assuming the 50+ year old radiator had just =
suddenly developed a stress crack after being transferred from one body =
to another.
>>=20
>> With 5 or 6 tubes mangled top and bottom, it lost coolant instantly, =
and the radiator shop said it was irreparable other than by completely =
recoring it.
>>=20
>> --
>> Max Heim
>> '66 MGB
>>=20
>>> On Sep 26, 2018, at 3:56 AM, Dan DiBiase <dan.dibiase@gmail.com =
>>>=20
>>> A bummer that you couldn't participate in the melee, Max, I bet you =
were disappointed. Good recovery by Moss, though.=20
>>>=20
>>> Just tells you how fast these things spin, for a plastic blade to =
puncture a metal radiator!=20
>>>=20
>>> Dan D
>>> '76B, '65B
>>> Central NJ USA
>>> http://dandibiase.cbintouch.com/ <http://dandibiase.cbintouch.com/>
>>>=20
>>> On Tue, Sep 25, 2018 at 11:36 PM Max Heim via Mgs =
>>> I haven=E2=80=99t said much on the list about my project. but I got =
my =E2=80=9Cnew=E2=80=9D 66 B roadster together in time for the start of =
the California Melee on Sept. 8. Unfortunately, a blade flew off the new =
Moss plastic fan within the first ten miles and punctured the radiator, =
so that was as far as it got =E2=80=94 from the San Francisco Presidio =
to Marin Civic Center.=20
>>>=20
>>> I made the mistake of trying to get it to the next exit (it was a =
bad place to be on the shoulder, between the sound wall and 5 lanes of =
traffic doing 75+), which resulted in overheating and a blown head =
gasket. Total mileage to failure on this fan was 307 miles.
>>>=20
>>> Subsequent examination of the stub revealed an air pocket in the =
plastic right at the center of the base of the blade. Moss accepted my =
photo of this as evidence of a manufacturing flaw. This model of fan was =
already out of production (and out of warranty) =E2=80=94 I had =
purchased it as part of a large order back in 2015 when the car body was =
still in the paint shop.
>>>=20
>>> But regardless, they decided to send me a new fan ("new model" nylon =
7-blade fan) and a new aluminum radiator (the shop had told me mine was =
irreparable). I thought this was pretty decent of them.
>>>=20
>>> I just picked up my head at the machine shop where they had skimmed =
the surface and cleaned up the valves. In the meantime I had inspected =
the lifters based on a tip from Dave at British Motorsports in Campbell =
and found a few of them were showing pitting. By replacing them now I =
can save the cam.
>>>=20
>>> Now I just need to pick up the lifters and the gasket set and I =
should be able to have it back together this weekend.
>>>=20
>>> A few tips based on my experience:
>>>=20
>>> 1. Just shut it down. If I had stayed out on the freeway verge I =
would have saved the head gasket, and AAA would have picked me up in a =
timely manner. But since I had reported myself =E2=80=9Csafe=E2=80=9D =
and off the highway, it took 4 hours to get a tow.=20
>>>=20
>>> 2. Check your lifters every so often. I had replaced the cam and =
lifters due to lifter spalling sometime between 1998 and 2010. The new =
lifters were just starting to pit in 2018.
>>>=20
>>> 3. If you have a yellow plastic 7-bladed fan from Moss USA purchased =
prior to mid-2015, you may want to consider retiring it. I suppose if it =
hasn=E2=80=99t broken so far, it probably doesn=E2=80=99t have air =
bubbles in a critical location. But they had perhaps a dozen reported =
incidents. The current product being sold as part #434-332 is a =
different pattern by a different maker in a different material, so =
should not be a cause for worry.
>>>=20
>>> Buy British, Buy Best!
>>>=20
>>> --
>>> Max Heim
>>> '66 MGB
>>> _______________________________________________
>>>=20
>>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html =
<http://www.team.net/donate.html>
>>> Suggested annual donation $12.75
>>>=20
>>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs =
<http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs>
>>>=20
>>> Unsubscribe: =
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/dan.dibiase@gmail.com =
<http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/dan.dibiase@gmail.com>
>>=20
>> _______________________________________________
>>=20
>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html =
<http://www.team.net/donate.html>
>> Suggested annual donation $12.75
>>=20
>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs =
<http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs>
>>=20
>> Unsubscribe: =
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mvheim@sonic.net =
<http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mvheim@sonic.net>
>=20
> _______________________________________________
>=20
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html =
<http://www.team.net/donate.html>
> Suggested annual donation $12.75
>=20
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs =
<http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs>
>=20
> Unsubscribe: =
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mgbobh@gmail.com =
<http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/mgbobh@gmail.com>
--Apple-Mail=_BD2ACD4E-80DC-44C5-BA15-E7060A518015
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
charset=utf-8
<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html =
charset=3Dutf-8"></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" =
class=3D"">How could the capsule get damaged?<div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">I unscrewed it from the head, and =
gently pulled the tube out of the way. Then I replaced it after =
replacing the head.</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D"">Unfortunately, it never occurred to me to see what the gauge =
was reading while the head was off and the capsule was resting on the =
inner fender.</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D"">I=E2=80=99m not sure what the test would demonstrate. I =
already know it responds to temperature changes, so the capillary tube =
is not broken. The problem seems to be at the gauge end. I just can=E2=80=99=
t figure out what that would be.</div><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">I know there is a flattened tube rolled =
into a coil inside the gauge. Could it have unrolled beyond its intended =
limit during the overheating episode, and is now hung up on some =
protuberance inside the housing, preventing it from recoiling?</div><div =
class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D""><div class=3D"">
<div class=3D"">--</div><div class=3D"">Max Heim</div><div class=3D""><a =
href=3D"mailto:mvheim@sonic.net"; class=3D"">mvheim@sonic.net</a></div><div=
class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><br class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline">
</div>
<br class=3D""><div><blockquote type=3D"cite" class=3D""><div =
class=3D"">On Oct 7, 2018, at 3:49 PM, B H <<a =
href=3D"mailto:mgbobh@gmail.com"; class=3D"">mgbobh@gmail.com</a>> =
wrote:</div><br class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=3D""><div =
dir=3D"ltr" style=3D"font-family: Verdana; font-size: 12px; font-style: =
normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: =
normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; =
white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" =
class=3D""><div class=3D""> Yours has the non-electric temp sender =
and gauge?<span class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><br =
class=3D""></div><div class=3D""> If it does, the gauge is moved =
by pressure of expanding ether in the little capsule that is screwed =
into the engine. If it reads 220 from the beginning, my guess is that =
the capsule got squeezed or the tube damaged during the =
R&R.</div><div class=3D""> Test by removing capsule from =
engine, and putting it into a pan of hot water. Check the temp with your =
hand-held thermometer.</div><div class=3D"">Bob</div><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div></div><br style=3D"font-family: Verdana; font-size: =
12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: =
normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; =
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=3D""><div class=3D"gmail_quote" =
style=3D"font-family: Verdana; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; =
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; =
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: =
normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><div =
dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"">On Sun, Oct 7, 2018 at 6:30 PM Max Heim via Mgs =
<<a href=3D"mailto:mgs@autox.team.net"; =
class=3D"">mgs@autox.team.net</a>> wrote:<br =
class=3D""></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0px =
0px 0px 0.8ex; border-left-width: 1px; border-left-style: solid; =
border-left-color: rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;"><div =
style=3D"word-wrap: break-word;" class=3D"">I just got the engine back =
together, but now the temperature gauge is malfunctioning.<div =
class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">It seems to have got =
stuck at about 220. That=E2=80=99s what it was reading before I even =
tried to start the car. After warming up to operating temp (estimated, =
of course), the gauge had climbed into the oil pressure zone, reading at =
85 psi. At this point my cheap temp gun had the thermostat housing at =
around 180.</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D"">Anyone seen this before? Any suggestions?</div><div =
class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D""><div class=3D""><div style=3D"letter-spacing: normal; =
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: =
normal; word-spacing: 0px; word-wrap: break-word;" class=3D""><div =
style=3D"letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; =
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; word-wrap: =
break-word;" class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: 0px; font-size: 13px;" =
class=3D"">--</div><div style=3D"margin: 0px; font-size: 13px; =
min-height: 16px;" class=3D"">Max Heim</div><div style=3D"margin: 0px; =
font-size: 13px;" class=3D"">'66 MGB</div></div></div></div><br =
class=3D""><div class=3D""><blockquote type=3D"cite" class=3D""><div =
class=3D"">On Sep 26, 2018, at 9:11 AM, Max Heim via Mgs <<a =
href=3D"mailto:mgs@autox.team.net"; target=3D"_blank" =
class=3D"">mgs@autox.team.net</a>> wrote:</div><br =
class=3D"m_-7840722686676637303Apple-interchange-newline"><div =
class=3D""><div style=3D"word-wrap: break-word;" class=3D"">Actually, =
when we finally got to my house, we swapped the luggage into my 1967 =
Barracuda convertible and headed up the freeway to catch up with the =
Melee. Reached the first night=E2=80=99s stop in Red Bluff by 7pm.<div =
class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">Not the first =
participants to have to pull in a backup vehicle=E2=80=A6</div><div =
class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">The plastic blade =
didn=E2=80=99t directly =E2=80=9Cpuncture=E2=80=9D the radiator, =
actually. But it was trapped inside the shroud, and wound up smashing =
several tubes right where they enter the top and bottom tanks (the blade =
being caught on the lip of the tank at each revolution, I think). I =
didn't even know that it had thrown a blade until I started disassembly =
=E2=80=94 I was assuming the 50+ year old radiator had just suddenly =
developed a stress crack after being transferred from one body to =
another.</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">With =
5 or 6 tubes mangled top and bottom, it lost coolant instantly, and the =
radiator shop said it was irreparable other than by completely recoring =
it.</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""><div class=3D""><div =
style=3D"letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; =
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; word-wrap: =
break-word;" class=3D""><div style=3D"letter-spacing: normal; =
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: =
normal; word-spacing: 0px; word-wrap: break-word;" class=3D""><div =
style=3D"margin: 0px; font-size: 13px;" class=3D"">--</div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0px; font-size: 13px; min-height: 16px;" class=3D"">Max =
Heim</div><div style=3D"margin: 0px; font-size: 13px;" class=3D"">'66 =
MGB</div></div></div></div><br class=3D""><div class=3D""><blockquote =
type=3D"cite" class=3D""><div class=3D"">On Sep 26, 2018, at 3:56 AM, =
Dan DiBiase <<a href=3D"mailto:dan.dibiase@gmail.com"; target=3D"_blank"=
class=3D"">dan.dibiase@gmail.com</a>> wrote:</div><br =
class=3D"m_-7840722686676637303Apple-interchange-newline"><div =
class=3D""><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"">A bummer that you couldn't =
participate in the melee, Max, I bet you were disappointed. Good =
recovery by Moss, though. <div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D"">Just tells you how fast these things spin, for a plastic =
blade to puncture a metal radiator! <div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">Dan D</div><div class=3D"">'76B, =
'65B</div><div class=3D"">Central NJ USA<br clear=3D"all" class=3D""><div =
class=3D""><div dir=3D"ltr" =
class=3D"m_-7840722686676637303gmail_signature" =
data-smartmail=3D"gmail_signature"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D""><a =
href=3D"http://dandibiase.cbintouch.com/"; target=3D"_blank" =
class=3D"">http://dandibiase.cbintouch.com/</a></div></div></div><br =
class=3D""></div></div></div><br class=3D""><div =
class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"">On Tue, Sep 25, 2018 =
at 11:36 PM Max Heim via Mgs <<a href=3D"mailto:mgs@autox.team.net"; =
target=3D"_blank" class=3D"">mgs@autox.team.net</a>> wrote:<br =
class=3D""></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0px =
0px 0px 0.8ex; border-left-width: 1px; border-left-style: solid; =
border-left-color: rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;"><div =
style=3D"word-wrap: break-word;" class=3D""><div class=3D"">I haven=E2=80=99=
t said much on the list about my project. but I got my =E2=80=9Cnew=E2=80=9D=
66 B roadster together in time for the start of the California Melee on =
Sept. 8. Unfortunately, a blade flew off the new Moss plastic fan within =
the first ten miles and punctured the radiator, so that was as far as it =
got =E2=80=94 from the San Francisco Presidio to Marin Civic =
Center. </div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">I =
made the mistake of trying to get it to the next exit (it was a bad =
place to be on the shoulder, between the sound wall and 5 lanes of =
traffic doing 75+), which resulted in overheating and a blown head =
gasket. Total mileage to failure on this fan was 307 miles.</div><div =
class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">Subsequent examination =
of the stub revealed an air pocket in the plastic right at the center of =
the base of the blade. Moss accepted my photo of this as evidence of a =
manufacturing flaw. This model of fan was already out of production (and =
out of warranty) =E2=80=94 I had purchased it as part of a large order =
back in 2015 when the car body was still in the paint shop.</div><div =
class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">But regardless, they =
decided to send me a new fan ("new model" nylon 7-blade fan) and a new =
aluminum radiator (the shop had told me mine was irreparable). I thought =
this was pretty decent of them.</div><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">I just picked up my head at the machine =
shop where they had skimmed the surface and cleaned up the valves. In =
the meantime I had inspected the lifters based on a tip from Dave at =
British Motorsports in Campbell and found a few of them were showing =
pitting. By replacing them now I can save the cam.</div><div =
class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">Now I just need to pick =
up the lifters and the gasket set and I should be able to have it back =
together this weekend.</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D"">A few tips based on my experience:</div><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">1. Just shut it down. If I had stayed =
out on the freeway verge I would have saved the head gasket, and AAA =
would have picked me up in a timely manner. But since I had reported =
myself =E2=80=9Csafe=E2=80=9D and off the highway, it took 4 hours to =
get a tow. </div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D"">2. Check your lifters every so often. I had replaced the cam =
and lifters due to lifter spalling sometime between 1998 and 2010. The =
new lifters were just starting to pit in 2018.</div><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div>3. If you have a yellow plastic 7-bladed fan from Moss =
USA purchased prior to mid-2015, you may want to consider retiring it. I =
suppose if it hasn=E2=80=99t broken so far, it probably doesn=E2=80=99t =
have air bubbles in a critical location. But they had perhaps a dozen =
reported incidents. The current product being sold as part #434-332 is a =
different pattern by a different maker in a different material, so =
should not be a cause for worry.<div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D"">Buy British, Buy Best!</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""><div=
class=3D""><div style=3D"letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; =
text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; =
word-spacing: 0px; word-wrap: break-word;" class=3D""><div =
style=3D"letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; =
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; word-wrap: =
break-word;" class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: 0px; font-size: 13px;" =
class=3D"">--</div><div style=3D"margin: 0px; font-size: 13px; =
min-height: 16px;" class=3D"">Max Heim</div><div style=3D"margin: 0px; =
font-size: 13px;" class=3D"">'66 =
MGB</div></div></div></div></div></div>___________________________________=
____________<br class=3D""><br class=3D""><a =
href=3D"mailto:Mgs@autox.team.net"; target=3D"_blank" =
class=3D"">Mgs@autox.team.net</a><br class=3D"">Donate:<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><a =
href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html"; rel=3D"noreferrer" =
target=3D"_blank" class=3D"">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a><br =
class=3D"">Suggested annual donation $12.75<br class=3D""><br =
class=3D"">Archive:<span class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><a =
href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs"; rel=3D"noreferrer" =
target=3D"_blank" class=3D"">http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs</a><br =
class=3D""><br class=3D"">Unsubscribe:<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><a =
href=3D"http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/dan.dibiase@gmail.com"; =
rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank" =
class=3D"">http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/dan.dibiase@gmail.com=
</a><br class=3D""></blockquote></div></div></blockquote></div><br =
class=3D""></div></div>_______________________________________________<br =
class=3D""><br class=3D""><a href=3D"mailto:Mgs@autox.team.net"; =
target=3D"_blank" class=3D"">Mgs@autox.team.net</a><br =
class=3D"">Donate:<span class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><a =
href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html"; target=3D"_blank" =
class=3D"">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a><br class=3D"">Suggested =
annual donation $12.75<br class=3D""><br class=3D"">Archive:<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><a =
href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs"; target=3D"_blank" =
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class=3D"">Unsubscribe:<span =
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