OK, I'll chime in since I race my Spitfire in both SCCA Regional/National
events and in Vintage. When I built the car, I wanted it to do double duty,
vintage body, drivetrain and suspension with safety equipment per current
GCR.
Last weekend, I entered the vintage class at the SCCA regional in Portland.
The car ran great on Saturday, so on Sunday morning I entered the car in HP
also(only 2 other HP cars, both Rabbit's). I started at the back of the
pack since I didn't qualify in HP. At the end of the day. I had won HP and
set a new lap record in the process (not really a big deal since they
reconfigured the track last winter and all records are being reset this
year, a real HP national car would clean my clock).
While this was a thrill, I actually had more fun racing in the Vintage group
trying to keep up with a Volvo sedan. This was broken up when a FF dropped
oil all around the track, right on the center of the line. Rain racing is
easier than negotiating a track like that.
The biggest difference I saw was that the "real racers" don't give near the
racing room that the vintage drivers do. Even with the terrible, oily track
conditions, only one car spun out in the vintage group. In the other race,
a friend in an beautiful MGB had his rear fender rubbed by a Miata driver
that was merely "trying to keep up with his buddies".
Racing dual sessions like this is pretty economical. The second group was
half price, so in two days, for less than $400, I got 135 minutes of track
time (would have been more had I practiced and qualified in HP on Saturday).
On Sunday alone, I had 90 minutes of track time, all races.
Next year, I think I'll limit my "real" racing to Nationals. Fewer cars and
better drivers. I can easily change the configuration back and forthby
changing to a fiberglass bonnet and slicks for the Nationals and back to the
steel bonnet and treadded tires for vintage.
Finally, and off the topic, I want to give a word of thanks to Ted at TSI,
Arnie at Loynings Engine Service and Keith at Foreign Parts Positively for
helping to get my reliability back where it belongs. We've now finished all
sessions in 4 consecutive weekends.
Jim
-----Original Message-----
From: fot-bounces@autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces@autox.team.net] On
Behalf Of westerneagleracing@att.net
Sent: Thursday, October 23, 2008 9:29 AM
To: Bill Babcock
Cc: fot@autox.team.net
Subject: Re: [Fot] State of Vintage Racing
FOT
Great comments on the state of vintage racing. I race both SCCA (Spec Ford
so not too many modifications but sometimes a contact sport) and Vintage
(TR-4A can be real racing without contact). I am also running for the Board
of CSRG and while I doubt that there will ever be a consensus I'd like to
hear more comments on the state of vintage racing. Ron Jacobs Western Eagle
Racing
-------------- Original message from Bill Babcock <Billb@bnj.com>:
--------------
> Actually I think Testarossas have aluminum blocks. Enzo was allergic
> to cast iron.
>
> Mosport sets it's own limits. I'd like wings, slicks and an ejection
> seat.
>
> On Oct 23, 2008, at 7:14 AM, Andre Rousseau wrote:
>
> > You forgot to recast the block in aluminium.
> > Maybe this can't be controlled.
> >
> > So maybe an option is to further sub-divid the classes?
> >
> > - Show room stock class
> > - Semi prepped class
> > - Your richer then smarter class
> >
> > And let people run what you brung.
> >
> > Kinda like the slicks and wings class at Mosport, you get a mix from
> > low end neat ideas to full out ex F1 cars.
> >
> > Its a mad mad world.
> >
> > A.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > 2008/10/23 Bill Babcock
> >
> >> What makes you think bodies aren't already acid dipped? I'm working
> >> on that "personal lightening program"--have a weight bet going with
> >> my brother.
> >> Actually I think the most serious problem in vintage racing is more
> >> that the
> >> valuable cars can't be changed much--it would decrease their sky-high
> >> value--while specials and production racers can skirt the edge of the
> >> rulebook. That means there isn't a testarossa on the planet that
> >> can stay
> >> with Peyote, which is both silly and sad. We don't get to see them
> >> on track
> >> very often anymore--they are too valuable to risk and the owners
> >> don't like
> >> getting hammered by cars they should be able to romp over.
> >> I don't know how to fix that. Making Peyote slow won't change
> >> anything but
> >> the finish order at a few races. All the fast triumphs are rulebook-
> >> legal,
> >> more or less. Or could be without putting a serious dent in their
> >> lap times.
> >> The worst anyone is doing is running 89mm bores, and that's a
> >> tweak--not
> >> really worth much--you can get nearly the same horsepower with a 87.
> >> Pandoras box is knowledge, we all know how to make a car fast, we
> >> all have
> >> access to the learning of the last 50 years, and it goes into our
> >> cars,
> >> while testarossas are stuck in time.
> >>
> >> Of course if I had a TR the first thing I'd do would be to make a
> >> replica of the frame, only in titanium, and a carbon fibre body.
> >> Then... On Oct 23, 2008, at 5:45 AM, Andre Rousseau wrote:
> >>
> >> I guess that is the nature of racing, those with money will do what
> >> ever it costs to win.
> >>
> >> What's next acid dipping of the bodies?
> >>
> >> Frankly if I wanted to make my "future" racer lighter. I'd start
> >> with myself.
> >>
> >> A.
> >>
> >> --
> >> Andre Rousseau - andre@gt6.ca
> >> '68 Triumph GT6 MK1 - http://www.gt6.ca/
> >> Ottawa, ON, Canada
> >>
> >> 2008/10/23
> >>
> >> Good Morning
> >>
> >>
> >> What I am observing is that some vintage racing groups are going
> >>
> >> down the same path as CanAm and FI by allowing expensive
> >> modifications to
> >>
> >> take
> >>
> >> place. Is there really a need to have Kevlar bodywork on a Spitfire
> >> or TR6
> >>
> >> in
> >>
> >> vintage racing?
> >>
> >>
> >> It has always struck me as rather hypocritical that vintage groups
> >>
> >> wanted owners to use pre 1972 body specification and have the true
> >>
> >> appearance
> >>
> >> of post 1972 cars destroyed. Now we are putting Kevlar replacement
> >> panels
> >>
> >> to
> >>
> >> look like pre 1972 cars.
> >>
> >>
> >> I have to wonder why the people doing these modifications are not
> >>
> >> instead running SCCA. I am just as guilty as the next person here,
> >> our
> >>
> >> engines
> >>
> >> are too modified. They are nothing like what was raced in the 1970s
> >> and
> >>
> >> earlier.
> >>
> >>
> >> Vintage may be making itself too expensive too.
> >>
> >>
> >> Baseball Dad
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html
> >>
> >> http://www.fot-racing.com
> >>
> >> Fot mailing list
> >> Fot@autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot
> >>
> >>
> >> Bill Babcock
> >> Babcock & Jenkins
> >> Billb@bnj.com
> >> 503.936.7660
> >> www.bnj.com
> >>
> >> Editor
> >> Ke Nalu e-Magazine
> >> *Paddlesurfing's Web Journal*
> >> *
> >> *
> >> Bill@kenalu.com
> >> www.kenalu.com
> >> blog: www.ponohouse.com/ponoblog
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> > --
> > Andre Rousseau - andre@gt6.ca
> > '68 Triumph GT6 MK1 - http://www.gt6.ca/
> > Ottawa, ON, Canada
> > _______________________________________________
> > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html
> >
> > http://www.fot-racing.com
> >
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> > Fot@autox.team.net
> > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot
> >
>
> Bill Babcock
> Babcock & Jenkins
> Billb@bnj.com
> 503.936.7660
> www.bnj.com
>
> Editor
> Ke Nalu e-Magazine
> Paddlesurfing's Web Journal
>
> Bill@kenalu.com
> www.kenalu.com
> blog: www.ponohouse.com/ponoblog
> _______________________________________________
> Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html
>
> http://www.fot-racing.com
>
> Fot mailing list
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