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Nice summary! I don't have much to add other than the Quaife gearset
uses substantial needle bearings inside each of the gears, much larger
input to mainshaft needle bearing, steel thrust washers within the
stack. Work of art. Layshaft still uses semi-stock bearings.
When I blew up my tranny I ended up going with the Quaife and really
like it. No synchros to break, shifts are lightning quick, gear ratios
work well.
Cheers, Tony Drews
On 6/18/2019 9:24 AM, Robert Lang via Fot wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Those are THE questions, aren't they?
>
> Okay - Quaife has a straight-cut gear set that uses dog-rings, no
> synchros. Big $$$, 1600 UK pounds. Quaife just ran off a set and the
> one source that I know of in the UK can get them:
>
> Dennis Vessey - Quaife gear kits for Triumph TRs
> <http://www.vessey-classic-car-services.co.uk/triumph-gear-kit.htm#.XQjuu3t7n64>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Dennis Vessey - Quaife gear kits for Triumph TRs
>
> metatags generator
>
> Vesseys Triumph TR Dog-Engagement Gear Kit - developed with Quaife
>
> <http://www.vessey-classic-car-services.co.uk/triumph-gear-kit.htm#.XQjuu3t7n64>
>
>
>
> Note, if you decide to go that route, please contact me, I've been in
> contact with the vendor and I'm trying to place an order for this
> gearset. Maybe we can save some shipping if we get a couple of sets.
>
> Note too that Bastuck has dog box gear sets including one using the
> J-type overdrive. When I contacted them last fall, they had none in
> stock and there was no production scheduled.
>
> Failing that option, there's the "Dolomite Close Ratio Gearset". This
> consists of a different input shaft and main 3rd gear along with the
> corresponding layshaft gears. You need to work the case to get these
> to pit, but they work great. These are helical gears. I've used this
> setup for around 20 years, and it is really really good. Note: for the
> best total gear ratio option, get a later TR6 gearbox with the
> 16-tooth 1st laygear.
>
> Now, the drawback to the helical gears is apparently excessive thrust
> forces and they effect the layshaft thrust washers as well as the
> layshaft needle bearings. If you make torque and you have any end
> float for the layshaft, you will spin the thrust washers and wreck the
> case. There are some workarounds to compensate for excessive end float.
>
> Note too that because of torque multiplication, the layshaft needle
> bearings on the 1st gear end of the layshaft get beat really, really
> hard. One fix is to install a double bearing on the layshaft (or buy a
> new one from Moss or another source) that is set up for the double
> bearing. I've had Quantum Mechanics install the double bearings, they
> seem to work better than the stock setup. But even with that setup,
> the layshaft still gets pounded and you need to keep an eye on it.
>
> As you may know, a lot of the racers are gravitating away from the
> stock and/or modified Triumph gearboxes mostly because the quality
> consistency of replacement parts is all over the place and you need to
> know what you're getting to spot the differences. That said, frequent
> oil changes and paying attention to the detritus in the oil, you can
> stay ahead of problems.
>
> If you're going to build a good gearbox, it will cost you as much or
> more than some of the conversions out there, hence a lot of folks
> switch to Toyota/T5/Rocket, etc.
>
> Hopefully you'll get other good advice on this list, but that's where
> I'm at right now (too). The Quaife gearset in the TR gearbox seems
> like the most "vintage" solution, but ALL of the options have pluses
> and minuses. In the spirit of full transparency, I'm also looking at
> Super T10 transmissions which are the same as the old Muncie "Rock
> Crusher" and there is a gearset available with a 2.43 1st, 1.63 2nd,
> 1.23 3rd and 1 4th which is pretty close to the Dolomite Sprint setup.
> And the gearbox is 70 pounds which is really close to the stock box.
> Also, if you want to dish out more $$$, Gear Vendors has an overdrive
> that bolts to the T-10, I haven't researched that enough to see if
> there are any particulars, but it is an option, albeit around $3k. But
> you get a BRAND NEW overdrive. Just sayin. A drawback to the Super T10
> is that you will need to make or source a bell housing, but that is
> do-able with a combo of a trashed TR gearbox, a competent machinist
> and more $$$. ;-)
>
> Regards,
> Bob Lang
> 339-927-4489
>
> On Tuesday, June 18, 2019, 9:02:31 AM EDT, Mike Deweerd via Fot
> <fot@autox.team.net> wrote:
>
>
> Amici
> What is the preferred gearbox for the TR4 non overdrive and where is
> the best source for getting such
> Iâ??m looking at the pros and cons of the straight cut gear set vs the
> close ratio gear set (Iâ??m assuming the close ratio is still helical
> gears)
> Please chime in with preferences and opinions
> Cheers
> Mike Deweerd #77
>
>
>
> Sent from my iPhone
> _______________________________________________
>
> http://www.fot-racing.com
>
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://autox.team.net/archive <http://autox.team.net/archive
> >http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/robertlangtr6@yahoo.com
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> fot@autox.team.net
>
> http://www.fot-racing.com
>
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://autox.team.net/archive http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot
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<p>Nice summary! I don't have much to add other than the Quaife
gearset uses substantial needle bearings inside each of the gears,
much larger input to mainshaft needle bearing, steel thrust
washers within the stack. Work of art. Layshaft still uses
semi-stock bearings.</p>
<p>When I blew up my tranny I ended up going with the Quaife and
really like it. No synchros to break, shifts are lightning quick,
gear ratios work well.</p>
<p>Cheers, Tony Drews<br>
</p>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 6/18/2019 9:24 AM, Robert Lang via
Fot wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:608220374.2397603.1560867891639@mail.yahoo.com">
<meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8">
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9]><xml><o:OfficeDocumentSettings><o:AllowPNG/><o:PixelsPerInch>96</o:PixelsPerInch></o:OfficeDocumentSettings></xml><![endif]-->
<div class="ydp435d1f9fyahoo-style-wrap"
style="font-family:Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial,
sans-serif;font-size:13px;">
<div>Hi,</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Those are THE questions, aren't they?</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Okay - Quaife has a straight-cut gear set that uses
dog-rings, no synchros. Big $$$, 1600 UK pounds. Quaife just
ran off a set and the one source that I know of in the UK can
get them:</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><a
href="http://www.vessey-classic-car-services.co.uk/triumph-gear-kit.htm#.XQjuu3t7n64";
rel="nofollow" target="_blank"
class="enhancr_card_1791886968" moz-do-not-send="true">Dennis
Vessey - Quaife gear kits for Triumph TRs</a></div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div id="ydpd666f494enhancr_card_1791886968"
class="ydpd666f494yahoo-link-enhancr-card
ydpd666f494ymail-preserve-class
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style="max-width:400px;font-family:Helvetica Neue, Segoe UI,
Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif"
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data-type="YENHANCER" data-size="MEDIUM"
contenteditable="false"><a
href="http://www.vessey-classic-car-services.co.uk/triumph-gear-kit.htm#.XQjuu3t7n64";
style="text-decoration:none !important;color:#000
!important" class="ydpd666f494yahoo-enhancr-cardlink"
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class="ydpd666f494card-overlay-container-table
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class="ydpd666f494card-overlay-cell"
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inset="0,0,20px,0"><![endif]-->
<table
class="ydpd666f494yahoo-ignore-table"
style="width: 100%; min-height:
175px;" height="175" border="0">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td
class="ydpd666f494card-richInfo2"
style="text-align:left;padding:15px 0 0 15px;vertical-align:top"><br>
</td>
<td
class="ydpd666f494card-actions"
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<table class="ydpd666f494card-info
ydpd666f494yahoo-ignore-table"
style="background-color: rgb(255, 255,
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cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" border="0"
align="center">
<tbody>
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<td
style="background-color:#ffffff;padding:16px
0 16px
12px;vertical-align:top;border-radius:0
0 0 2px"><br>
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style="vertical-align:middle;padding:12px
24px 16px
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line-height: 19px; margin: 0px 0px
6px; font-family: Helvetica Neue,
Segoe UI, Helvetica, Arial,
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40,
42);">Dennis Vessey - Quaife gear
kits for Triumph TRs</h2>
<p
class="ydpd666f494card-richinfo-primary"
style="font-size:12px;line-height:16px;margin:0 0 4px 0;color:#979ba7">metatags
generator</p>
<p
class="ydpd666f494card-description"
style="font-size: 12px;
line-height: 16px; margin: 0px;
color: rgb(151, 155, 167);">Vesseys
Triumph TR Dog-Engagement Gear Kit
- developed with Quaife</p>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</a></div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Note, if you decide to go that route, please contact me,
I've been in contact with the vendor and I'm trying to place
an order for this gearset. Maybe we can save some shipping if
we get a couple of sets.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Note too that Bastuck has dog box gear sets including one
using the J-type overdrive. When I contacted them last fall,
they had none in stock and there was no production scheduled.<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Failing that option, there's the "Dolomite Close Ratio
Gearset". This consists of a different input shaft and main
3rd gear along with the corresponding layshaft gears. You need
to work the case to get these to pit, but they work great.
These are helical gears. I've used this setup for around 20
years, and it is really really good. Note: for the best total
gear ratio option, get a later TR6 gearbox with the 16-tooth
1st laygear.<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Now, the drawback to the helical gears is apparently
excessive thrust forces and they effect the layshaft thrust
washers as well as the layshaft needle bearings. If you make
torque and you have any end float for the layshaft, you will
spin the thrust washers and wreck the case. There are some
workarounds to compensate for excessive end float.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Note too that because of torque multiplication, the
layshaft needle bearings on the 1st gear end of the layshaft
get beat really, really hard. One fix is to install a double
bearing on the layshaft (or buy a new one from Moss or another
source) that is set up for the double bearing. I've had
Quantum Mechanics install the double bearings, they seem to
work better than the stock setup. But even with that setup,
the layshaft still gets pounded and you need to keep an eye on
it.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>As you may know, a lot of the racers are gravitating away
from the stock and/or modified Triumph gearboxes mostly
because the quality consistency of replacement parts is all
over the place and you need to know what you're getting to
spot the differences. That said, frequent oil changes and
paying attention to the detritus in the oil, you can stay
ahead of problems.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>If you're going to build a good gearbox, it will cost you
as much or more than some of the conversions out there, hence
a lot of folks switch to Toyota/T5/Rocket, etc.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Hopefully you'll get other good advice on this list, but
that's where I'm at right now (too). The Quaife gearset in the
TR gearbox seems like the most "vintage" solution, but ALL of
the options have pluses and minuses. In the spirit of full
transparency, I'm also looking at Super T10 transmissions
which are the same as the old Muncie "Rock Crusher" and there
is a gearset available with a 2.43 1st, 1.63 2nd, 1.23 3rd and
1 4th which is pretty close to the Dolomite Sprint setup. And
the gearbox is 70 pounds which is really close to the stock
box. Also, if you want to dish out more $$$, Gear Vendors has
an overdrive that bolts to the T-10, I haven't researched that
enough to see if there are any particulars, but it is an
option, albeit around $3k. But you get a BRAND NEW overdrive.
Just sayin. A drawback to the Super T10 is that you will need
to make or source a bell housing, but that is do-able with a
combo of a trashed TR gearbox, a competent machinist and more
$$$. ;-)<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Regards,</div>
<div>Bob Lang</div>
<div>339-927-4489<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
</div>
<div id="ydpe091f580yahoo_quoted_1530796332"
class="ydpe091f580yahoo_quoted">
<div style="font-family:'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial,
sans-serif;font-size:13px;color:#26282a;">
<div> On Tuesday, June 18, 2019, 9:02:31 AM EDT, Mike Deweerd
via Fot <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
href="mailto:fot@autox.team.net";><fot@autox.team.net></a> wrote: </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>
<div dir="ltr">Amici <br>
</div>
<div dir="ltr">What is the preferred gearbox for the TR4 non
overdrive and where is the best source for getting such<br>
</div>
<div dir="ltr">Iâ??m looking at the pros and cons of the
straight cut gear set vs the close ratio gear set (Iâ??m
assuming the close ratio is still helical gears) <br>
</div>
<div dir="ltr">Please chime in with preferences and opinions
<br>
</div>
<div dir="ltr">Cheers <br>
</div>
<div dir="ltr">Mike Deweerd #77<br>
</div>
<div dir="ltr"><br>
</div>
<div dir="ltr"><br>
</div>
<div dir="ltr"><br>
</div>
<div dir="ltr">Sent from my iPhone<br>
</div>
<div dir="ltr">_______________________________________________<br>
</div>
<div dir="ltr"><a href="mailto:fot@autox.team.net";
rel="nofollow" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">fot@autox.team.net</a><br>
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<fieldset class="mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset>
<pre class="moz-quote-pre"
wrap="">_______________________________________________
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