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Re: wood frame question

To: "Vandergraaf, Chuck" <vandergraaft@aecl.ca>
Subject: Re: wood frame question
From: toad <toad@storm.ca>
Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 22:13:52 -0400
Vandergraaf, Chuck wrote:
> 
> Rudy, et al.,
> 
> In addition to Bob's excellent advice, I would suggest that, before screwing
> the screws into the wood, you run the threads over some wax, either a candle
> or paraffin canning wax.  This puts a very thin layer of wax on the surface
> of the threads and greatly reduces friction.  I speak from experience
> (although the idea didn't originate with me).  I have no proof, but I would
> think that there is enough friction to soften the wax sufficiently to coat
> the threads sufficiently and also provides a barrier between the wood and
> the metal.
> 
> You may also check out what Lee Valley Tools has available in the way of
> screws.  Lee Valley Tools is one of those rare companies that exist for the
> benefit of the craftsman and gardener, not to maximize profits to the owner.
> At one time they carried Spax screws, but I have not seen them in this
> year's catalog.  These have a serrated edge at the threads and are said to
> reduce friction.  The Lee Valley catalog states that "... they can be driven
> into solid birch or maple without pre-drilling." (not that I would advise
> this, but it does make a point).
> 
> >From another Lee Valley catalog, I quote the following: "The effect of high
> humidity, salt water or chemically treated timber on fasteners can be
> significant.  For maximum durability and unstained surfaces, either with
> exterior projects or in boatbuilding, the use of copper, brass, stainless
> steel or silicon bronze is recommended.  For areas where the rain is acidic,
> or if the wood has been treated with arsenates (such as on sidings or
> decks), stainless steel is best.  Our stainless steel are nickel/chromium.
> The #304 and #305 stainless steel provide adequate protection in most
> outdoor applications.  The #316 stainless steel provides the best resistance
> to seawater [or, probably, road salt, my comment] as it has more nickel and
> 2% to 3% molybdenum.  Silicon bronze contains no iron, so will not leave
> rust marks.  Our silicon bronze nails have annular ring threads to maximize
> holding power and resistance to withdrawal."  (1998/99 catalog, p. 113)
> 
> You can check this company out at http://www.leevalley.com
> 
> I have no connection with them, but I can't resist shopping in one of their
> stores.
> 
> Chuck Vandergraaf
> '52 +4
> Pinawa, MB
> > ----------
> > From:         Bob Nogueira[SMTP:nogera@prodigy.net]
> > Reply To:     Bob Nogueira
> > Sent:         Tuesday, October 12, 1999 6:36 PM
> > To:   re3@ix.netcom.com; aMORGANS@autox.team.net
> > Subject:      Re: wood frame question
> >
> > -- [ From: Bob Nogueira * EMC.Ver #3.1a ] --
> >
> > Rudy
> > Some will say stainless steel but SS is not as strong as mild steel .
> > Brass
> > is too soft for the hard ash wood. You will end up breaking the screw  off
> > in the hole or will have to drill a hole so oversized to keep from
> > breaking
> > the screw it won't hold . I used plated mild steel     with the
> > justification that if the screw got wet enough to rust it really wasn't
> > going to matter because the wood would be rotted and the sheet metal long
> > gone by that time .
> > The factory glued all the vertical joints but not the horizontal joints (
> > I
> > may have that backwards ) .I glued all my joints and have not seen any
> > problem as a result.
> >  Now get out there and screw around with that Morgan !!!
> > Bob Nogueira
> > -------- REPLY, Original message follows --------
> >
> > > Date: Tuesday, 12-Oct-99 09:04 AM
> > >
> > > From: re3@ix.netcom.com        \ Internet:    (re3@ix.netcom.com)
> > > To:   MORGANS                  \ Internet:    (morgans@autox.team.net)
> > >
> > > Subject: wood frame question
> > >
> > > I have a 1967 plus 4, 4 seater, and am in the midst of a ground up
> > restoration.
> > > I am doing the
> > > frame at this time and have a few questions:
> > > 1. What type of screws should I be using? At this point I am using
> > silicon
> > > bronze screws but
> > > wonder if I should us stainless steel instead?
> > >
> > > 2. Does anyone glue the frame together or is glue a bad idea?
> > >
> > > 3. I need a picture of how the rear braces to the left and right of the
> > spare
> > > fit in place. They  were gone on my car and I have purchased them new
> > from
> > the
> > > factory but do not know their exact  location.
> > >
> > > That's it for today,
> > > Thank you,
> > > Rudy
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> > -------- REPLY, End of original message --------
> >
> >
> >
> >


Brethren
I totally subscribe to Chucks suggestions.  I am just about finished
building  a new wooden tub for the daughters '57 Plus 4 and have
finished a wooden tub for Angus my '33 Super  Sport and have used Lee
Valley Tools screws with great success also I too for one use wax on my
screws.  However until final assembly I do not use the screw length that
I intend to use. I use a shorter screw so that the wood does not become
over extended.  There are other tricks but ,,,

Toad
'57 Plus 4
'59 Plus 4
and Angus my 33 Super Sport.

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