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Re: Chassis stiffness (revisited...)

To: "Bricklin" <bricklin@autox.team.net>, <pmartin@isgtec.com>
Subject: Re: Chassis stiffness (revisited...)
From: "Greg Monfort" <wingracer@email.msn.com>
Date: Sun, 23 Nov 1997 02:45:09 -0500


>
>This thread has been pretty specific to my car and my resto/mod project,
>but I've been keeping it public so that we can all learn something... I
>hope it isn't boring anyone yet. ;)


I've been bored with this subject since I helped design and build a 'A'
Production Corvette 13 yrs ago, but what the hell....... :^))

>Thanks a bunch for the info - I was under the impression that poly bushings
>were like 1/4 of the way between rubber bushings and heim joints (towards
>the rubber end of the scale).

The one's we just installed appeared to be the same hardness we installed on
the 'vette in '85. Hard as a hockey puck straight from the freezer. If they
make some that are only slightly harder than stock, go for it.


>Tell me how this sounds then:
> 1) Go with the larger, stiffer wheels and tires.
> 2) Replace the old rubber bushings with new (rubber) ones.
> 3) Stiffen the frame as much as I practically can with bracing, gusseting,
>etc.

Sounds good to me.

>
>Do you think I'd gain anything significant with the extra width in the
>rear?

Yes, if you use softer rubber. Just keep offset to the inside so you
actually narrow the track slightly helping turn in.

>Sounds like a good idea.  Getting the original steering box rebuilt would
>probably make sense too, eh?  Maybe a pre-serpentine Mustang pump would go
>in there OK, but would it work with the steering box?

Wouldn't hurt. Don't know.

>
>Is a stiffer rear bar reducing understeer by: helping front traction,
>hurting rear traction, or both?

It moves the polar moment of inertia forward (pivot point changes) slightly,
improving front/rear weight distribution.

  Since I'm having a new chassis fabricated,
>it might not be too expensive to have the upper A-arms etc moved slightly
>inboard to increase the bite on the front tires.  How much camber are we
>talking about here?  like 1/8" or 1/4" (from vertical) measured at the top
>of the wheel?

I'm afraid it's not that simple. Is your frame shop qualified to design
front end geometry? If so, tell them what you want the car to do, then hope,
assuming of course they don't want too much extra.


>Well, Ford sells crate motors that they call "street" engines with ported
>GT-40 heads, 9.8:1 compression (or so), a warm cam, etc that they say they
>dyno at 380.  It seems to me that shooting for 350 or so should be
>reasonable with the mods I have in mind (TFS aluminum Twisted Wedge heads,
>10:1-ish compression, moderate roller cam, EFI conversion & headers).

I was basing it on stock heads. The only GT-40 heads I know about only fit
Cleveland mills and Cleveland's won't fit in a Bricklin as far as I know. I
don't keep up anymore; these TFS wedge heads which I assume are for the
Windsor, have to be somewhat larger and I'm not sure you'll be able to get
an exhaust system to fit.

>
>I have no doubt that a Brick can't put 350 hp to the pavement at 0-40 mph,
>but I expect that it would be hooked up and pull pretty hard at 60 and
>above, wouldn't it?

Even with the mods you're contemplating, I doubt it. That's why they added
IRS to the 'vette so long ago. If they make really soft compound tires in
the size you need, probably, but they'll be shot in 5000 MI.

>
>Yes, I don't want to sound like I think I can (or should) make the Brick
>into something it's not.  I'm trying to get a feel for what mods have the
>biggest payoff, which make sense for the SV-1 and which don't (both
>technically and financially).  Basically, I want to gather as much info as
>I can before the chassis starts construction.  I have certain mods in mind
>and if they're reasonable and provide a worthwhile benefit, then I don't
>want to leave them undone.

That seems a bit different than your original stated  goals. :^))

>
>If, at the end of the day, all I'm going to get out of the project is a car
>that looks like sex on wheels, lights the tires in the first 3 gears (I
>think a 5-speed is a must - anyone done this conversion?) and would rather
>get sideways than turn in tightly and obediently, then I guess that's OK.
>;)

You're on the right path now. You can improve the car in every measurable
way without destroying it's character with the frame stiffening, wheels,
etc. discussed. It will ride a bit rougher, but will feel more 'all of a
piece'. It will always be tail happy, especially with more power, but
shouldn't 'snap' like a stocker does, unless of course you're a real
leadfoot like me. :^)) I forget who did it, but someone put a nitrous kit on
their Bricklin; lit it off at 50 mph and spun the tires all the way to 100
mph at which point the rear end hooked up and snapped him sideways. He
removed it.

GM









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