Dave Dalghren:
Dave:
I've really no time to reply but just a couple of points ok?
1. I'm not racing at present; I'm an "adult student" in college, so you
must have my comments mistaken for someone elses....
2. I do have EFI... on my regular driver; a Thunderbird, and I am still
amazed at how well it works -at 165,ooo miles even!
3. what I meant about NASCAR stepping in was about the coruption of money
upon motorsport. How they conveniently change their rules mid year , mid
week or anytime it pleases them -all in the name of "close competition"
What is NASCAR today? A place where no sane person goes to race because the
costs have escalated to the point that only corporate pawns can race -you
know, just like American politics. NASCAR today? A corporation based upon
and focused upon that holiest of holys; GREED. Soaking thousands and
thousands of misguided "Race fans" who contribute millions of dollars each
year to this unabashed commerce of T shirt and "souvenier" sales. "Free
Enterprise"
-Hell really good race souveniers are free: they're called "tear offs"
and you can get'em at the Sprint Car RACES. -Where the rules are very few
and extremely consistant from year to year. Run what ya brung an' bring
enough!
4. Bonneville is the one last place where an "amatuer" can still go,
compete, and have a good time with at least a chance of success. Iwas
simply advocating continuation of that tradition. Not "whining" nor
complaining....OK?
best regards, Doug in NY 1:30pm edt 12/3
>From: dahlgren <dahlgren@uconect.net>
>Reply-To: dahlgren <dahlgren@uconect.net>
>To: "Land-speed@autox.team.net" <Land-speed@autox.team.net>
>Subject: Re: Electronics vs. old way
>Date: Wed, 01 Dec 1999 16:39:58 -0500
>
>Joe it only costs a couple of thousand to do the EFI thing on the
>cheap...Use the pump off the hilborn deal only need 45 to 70 psi.. An
>inexpensive but suitable system is only 1200 injectors about 500... fuel
>pressure regulator 150 and used laptop 250..So it is not a money deal
>did you run roller cams when they came out? Would you run a PSI
>blower....Maybe you just don't want to read the manual...When you
>started racing and had some new ideas that were different and faster did
>the guys with the other stuff wish you had not done what you did because
>they would have to step up? Some of the old salts might want to face the
>facts that they want it the way it was because they like it that way not
>because of the money.. geez look at the money in some of these neat old
>cars. Some have more in paint that I can even imagine. What about that
>Hi-tech flatty that everyone thought was so cool a few weeks ago? No
>bucks there right? I see sponsor names all over these cars for that
>matter.. Now the guys with the EFI are the people that they/you were 30
>years ago when they had all the great new ideas.. I am sure you have a
>zillion more good ideas of how to go fast that you have not brought to
>the table yet and raced.. But please don't knock the EFI over money.
>Have you priced a new constant flow system lately? Better have 4 to 6k
>in your pocket for everything... The EFI saves money and engines every
>time . Lift a couple of good cylinder heads 8-10k need a set of pistons
>600 and if unlucky a new block 2-6k prepped.... If you hate Hi Tech why
>not say so, it sure does not slow the cars down one bit. What's boring
>about a doorslamer Mustang running in the 7's ?????????????
>
>
>Let me end by quoting you.. You said it all and did not realize it I
>think. Hint: Read in the parentheses..
>
>" Every time a Good race
> team actually finds an advantage (which is after all THE objective in
> racing....)NASCAR, due to some "corporate" coddling, interveines..."
>
>Who is 'NASCAR' now ? Another hint? I think we all know.
>
>Regards,
> Dave Dahlgren
>
>
>
>joe boogie wrote:
> >
> > Friends, Members, and SCTA, ECTA, &USFRA officials:
> >
> > ...Kvach is absolutely right about all the "unfairness" of new tech
>vs.
> > old tech...
> >
> > Exactly why I, (a pretty serious dragracer from the "old daze")
>don't
> > even bother to go to the drags anymore. There is NOTHING there anymore
>in
> > common with the way we raced. It's ruin't.
> > Who in their right mind wants to sit all day watching
> > computer/electronically controlled cars run against a breakout index???
>As
> > exciting as watchin' paint dry. -or for that matter, sit in a hot car
>in
> > the lanes the whole day thru waiting to make a couple of passes where
>some
> > computer nerd in the other lane "out chipped" ya? Usta be it was Man &
> > machine against Man & machine. Now it's all about electronics. Bah Hum
> > bug. Gawd I'd rather go to the lake... (-or "THE LAKES"!)
> >
> > For what it's worth, heres my two cents worth;
> >
> > If the SCTA, USFRA, and ECTA don't pay attention to, and STOP
> > electronic "rule stretching" by the "New Tech" boys NOW, LSR as we know
>it
> > will cease to exist because only the filthy rich will be able to race.
> >
> > LSR is what it is because there is "room" for those many who enjoy
> > racing with what many in other forms of "Motorsport" would laugh at, and
> > call "Obsolete" -if not downright antique! How many other types of
>racin'
> > have 40yr. old COMPETITIVE Racecars ?
> >
> > I won't even watch NASCAR or NHRA because of what they have
>become.
> > I'm not that old, but I remember when "Stock Car" MEANT STOCK, CAR.
> > period. Richard Petty used to build one from a car taken off a dealers
> > showroonm floor...Remember? I remember; I still have my 1964 NASCAR
> > Mechanic's membership pin to prove it...
> > NASCAR today is a corporate farce; a charade. Every time a Good
>race
> > team actually finds an advantage (which is after all THE objective in
> > racing....)NASCAR, due to some "corporate" coddling, interveines....
>"It's
> > Entertainment" is what they say; and that's very TRUE. They have
>succeeded
> > in taking the SPORT out of the equation. It no longer is a sport. When
>they
> > threw away SPORT, they also threw away fairness.
> > The"OUTLAWS" are rapidly following suit as well, and are well on
>the
> > way to becoming a place where RACERS cannot afford to race.
> >
> > Any time you want to screw up a sport, just add MONEY -from any
>source;
> > Purses, "sponsors", "corporate" or out of pocket. That's what makes LSR
>so
> > special boys; there ain't no money; so (hopefully) there ain't no
> > corruption.
> >
> > "GREED" ain't good. Not in sport. Not anywhere. As far as I'm
> > concerned ....Friends, Good times, and good clean Racin' fun IS.
> >
> > ....Ok, I'll jump down off my soap box now.
> >
> > Really DO "have a nice day"!
> > -Doug Anderson Bainbridge, NY 1:55pm edt 12/1/99
> >
> > >From: Beth Butters <bbutters@dmi.net>
> > >Reply-To: Beth Butters <bbutters@dmi.net>
> > >To: "'Carl Dreher'" <focusrsh@arn.net>
> > >CC: "land-speed@autox.team.net" <land-speed@autox.team.net>
> > >Subject: RE: Electronics vs. old way
> > >Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 20:44:40 -0800
> > >
> > >----------
> > >From: Carl Dreher[SMTP:focusrsh@arn.net]
> > >Sent: Friday, November 12, 1999 7:48 PM
> > >Cc: land-speed@autox.team.net
> > >Subject: Re: Electronics vs. old way
> > >
> > > I've been wandering if the day isn't coming when the
>supercharged
> > >classes are going to be dominated by the electronics managed
>tubocharged
> > >motors and us guys who just don't want to go their are racing amongst
> > >ourselves. I watch cars like Krugels CBG/Alt put the record where
>AA
> > >cars dream of going. It would appear that if you have the money and
>the
> > >inkling to use electronics to manage a tubo'd motor it is possible to
>pull
> > >hundreds more HP than you can with mechanical means. I guess I
>wander if
> > >one day the records will be split between electronics managed motors
>and
> > >non. Kind of give us our own XO classes, maybe NE class (no
>electronics)
> > >or will we just kind of disappear from the scene?? I admit I'm stuck
>in
> > >the 60s but I like old cars and the way they were made to run back then
>and
> > >besides I will also feel great if I can get my Hilborn to work
>properly.
> > >Anybody else feel the same way? I know that either way you do it, It is
>a
> > >great challenge with sat!
> > >isfying results and electronics is here and now and the future, I
>just
> > >feel its two different ball games, maybe its okay if we go the way of
> > >Vintage racing someday. I've been crewing on Bob Ragsdales 53 stude
> > >CBG/alt for the last few years which he has really worked to get the
>record
> > >in the class. In l996 we qualified on an open record just in front of
> > >David Parks tubocarged early Camaro, we broke and he set the record
>at
> > >225, fought on for a couple of years and along comes Krugals awesome
>car
> > >which puts the record where no Studebaker is likely to ever go. So its
>to
> > >D class last year and along comes John Rain who sets the record at
> > >something like 247, about dreamable max for Bobs car with its now near
> > >state of the art dialed in injected, intercooled 671 supercharged chev
> > >with electronic surveillance. So off to another class hopping some
>super
> > >sleek tubo'd car doesn't get to the line before he has a chance. I
>hate
> > >to see cars like this disappear like the flathea!
> > >ds and GMC six cars almost did. Keep an eye on the situation in
> > >of us can get suggestion forms at the timing stand and take action to
>keep
> > >this style of doing things alive. Regards Kvach in N.Idaho
> > >
> > >
>
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