hi jerry,
> You want to suggest a wording that would make the
> rule explicit?
yes, and it would be exactly the wording used for the current rule. :)
ah, i dont care about this that much... but it might be off putting for a
novice to discover that there are these 'secret' rules. rides or no rides
i will drive the same.
-james
----- Original Message -----
From: Jerry Mouton <jerry@moutons.org>
To: James Creasy <black94pgt@pacbell.net>
Cc: Bay_Area_Autocross_List <ba-autox@autox.team.net>
Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2001 11:07 AM
Subject: Re: SFR rule
> James,
>
> You want to suggest a wording that would make the
> rule explicit? We spent many hour haggling this
> back and forth, and many on the SC were at that
> time, probably are still today opposed to allowing
> passengers. It's not unanimously supported.
>
> Before we added this, there was no Supp rule allowing
> passengers, even though it was policy. The fact that
> National rules prohibit it caused us to add it.
>
> At this point, there has not been much abuse,
> if it ain't broke, don't fix it.
>
> Yes, probably lots of unwritten rules, as everywhere else in life.
> In 30 years at IBM I never saw a written rule requiring blue suits
> and ties (so I wore a beard, T shirts and jeans ; -). but everyone
> else seemed to wear them.
>
> It's probably not going to be abuse for a novice to ride along
> as much as they can -- if their competitors complain, they will
> be told to ride along, too.
>
> Jerry
>
> Jerry Mouton mailto:jerry@moutons.org Laissez les bons temps
> rouler!
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "James Creasy" <black94pgt@pacbell.net>
> To: "Jerry Mouton" <jerry@moutons.org>
> Cc: "Bay_Area_Autocross_List" <ba-autox@autox.team.net>
> Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2001 10:30 AM
> Subject: Re: SFR rule
>
>
> > it seems really weird to have a rule that specifically states something
is
> > legal, but also have this whispered undercurrent that you cant follow
the
> > clearly written rule. what other unwritten rules are there? maybe we
> > should write them down somewhere so people can know what they are.
> >
> > i was even advised by a veteran autocrosser to make use of that rule-
> > specifically to gain an advantage.
> >
> > -james
> > OSP #74
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Jerry Mouton <jerry@moutons.org>
> > To: James Creasy <black94pgt@pacbell.net>
> > Cc: Bay_Area_Autocross_List <ba-autox@autox.team.net>
> > Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2001 9:19 AM
> > Subject: Re: SFR rule
> >
> >
> > > James,
> > >
> > > You're thinking steady state.
> > >
> > > At one time there was no rule, and this time may come again
> > > with abuse.
> > >
> > > The rule is at http://www.sfrscca.org/solo2/Results/2001/supps.html,
> > > number 15.
> > >
> > > It's not protestable, but it is withdrawable.
> > > If my competitors believe I am abusing the rule, I will be talked to.
> > > If there is continued abuse, this rule will disappear, quickly. Trust
> me.
> > >
> > > So if you are riding to get a jump on your competitors, start riding
to
> > > instruct new drivers or you risk killing this benefit for all of us.
> > >
> > > Jerry
> > >
> > > Jerry Mouton mailto:jerry@moutons.org Laissez les bons temps
> > > rouler!
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "James Creasy" <black94pgt@pacbell.net>
> > > To: "Jerry Mouton" <jerry@moutons.org>; "Anthony Tabacco"
> > > <atabacco@california.com>
> > > Cc: "Bay_Area_Autocross_List" <ba-autox@autox.team.net>
> > > Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2001 9:02 AM
> > > Subject: Re: SFR rule
> > >
> > >
> > > > >The passenger rule is controversial,
> > > >
> > > > either its a rule or it is not. what is the written text of the
rule?
> > > >
> > > > unless it is a officially protestable offense, i dont see how
> irritating
> > > > your competitors has anything to do with it. (although it might
make
> > them
> > > > drive faster..., hehe)
> > > >
> > > > -james
> > > > OSP #74
> > > >
> > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > From: Jerry Mouton <jerry@moutons.org>
> > > > To: Anthony Tabacco <atabacco@california.com>
> > > > Cc: Bay_Area_Autocross_List <ba-autox@autox.team.net>
> > > > Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2001 7:37 AM
> > > > Subject: Re: SFR rule
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > Tony,
> > > > >
> > > > > Not exactly not good form to ride along, but not good form
> > > > > to abuse the system so that your competitors begin to feel that
> > > > > you are getting a big advantage by doing so "excessively".
> > > > >
> > > > > Obviously this determination depends on both how often I ride
> > > > > along before my run, whether I ride with a newbie or my good
> > > > > buddy in the same run group, whether I ride several times before
my
> > > > > run, and exactly who my competitors are -- whether they rat me
out.
> > > > >
> > > > > The passenger rule is controversial, and there have been a few
> > instances
> > > > > where people have been warned about abuse.
> > > > >
> > > > > Obviously there will be no complaints against me, because I am
> > > > > running out of the trophies. The purpose for the rule was to
> increase
> > > > > the fun available at the autocrosses, getting novices better
sooner,
> > > > > getting to ride along in other
> > > > > cool cars, etc. But if you are hot in the competition, you don't
> use
> > > > > this to get an advantage on your competitors.
> > > > >
> > > > > Jerry.
> > > > >
> > > > > Jerry Mouton mailto:jerry@moutons.org Laissez les bons
> temps
> > > > > rouler!
> > > > >
> > > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > From: "Anthony Tabacco" <atabacco@california.com>
> > > > > To: "Jerry Mouton" <jerry@moutons.org>
> > > > > Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2001 7:21 AM
> > > > > Subject: Re: SFR rule
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > > Jerry, I didn't know it was not considered good form to ride
along
> > > > before
> > > > > > your run group. Learn something every day.
> > > > > > Tony
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